=== tmpRAOF is now known as RAOF === tmpRAOF is now known as RAOF === chriadam|away is now known as chriadam === salem_ is now known as _salem === chihchun_afk is now known as chihchun === kickinz1|afk is now known as kickinz1 === James is now known as Guest19276 [05:38] Hello ? I have read https://developer.ubuntu.com/en/apps/platform/guides/push-notifications-client-guide/. Can you provide example which can run ? [05:45] hello ?? please help me ? I want demo to expand quickly, I am a beginner. [06:05] ello ? I have read https://developer.ubuntu.com/en/apps/platform/guides/push-notifications-client-guide/. Can you provide example which can run ? [06:06] hello ?? please help me ? I want demo to expand quickly, I am a beginner. [06:06] Hello ? I have read https://developer.ubuntu.com/en/apps/platform/guides/push-notifications-client-guide/. Can you provide example which can run ? [06:19] I just want my application to show a nitification in Notifications tab of Status Bar, and then my application can response the notification when user click it [06:20] Guest19276: idle in here some time, when devs are awake they might reply [06:21] OK , thanks [06:23] I will wait for devs [06:25] Guest19276: not sure if this can help but did you read this app? http://linux.softpedia.com/blog/You-Can-Now-Send-Web-Pages-to-Your-Ubuntu-Phone-from-Any-Browser-477581.shtml [07:01] my application just send notification to Notifications Tab in my device, not deliver notification between ubuntu touch devices。 [07:05] Hello everybody. [07:06] Has anyone here tried to instal ubuntu phone on xperia?? [07:28] Error: GDBus.Error:com.ubuntu.PushNotifications.Error: bad auth [07:31] good morning [07:46] dbarth_: Ping [07:47] dholbach: Good morning! [07:47] hey sturmflut-work [07:49] Good morning? My watch shows 14:48 or 2:48pm [07:51] sturmflut-work: pong [07:51] russia? [07:52] damn russians, they even have their time wrong [07:52] it's 10AM in the morning [07:54] I am Indonesian. [07:55] that's two countries wrong! [07:55] http://www.total-knowledge.com/~ilya/mips/ugt.html [07:55] :P [07:56] Oh, I am sorry. Thank you Stskeeps, by telling what was that mean. :) [08:20] @ubuntu dev team : congrate - i ve apt-get upgrade my bq phone => and it seems to help a lot on battery drain problem [08:20] apt-get upgrade? I thought that killed the OS [08:22] Does anyone here has tried to instal ubuntu phone on other device than nexus or samsung?? [08:22] not me [08:24] brunch875, yes, it will, but not immediately if you are lucky [08:24] really depends on the packages it upgrades [08:24] (not all are harmful) [08:25] :D time to gamble? [08:25] heh [08:26] is 'factory reset' affected by apt-get upgrade? [08:26] karatsu, my Bq had a really bad battery life until I discovered that media-scanner-service took constantly 50-100% of CPU so I removed my SD card [08:26] last time I factory resetted, it didn't prompt for system updates [08:28] obviously media-scanner-service crashed every time at some point and it never finished [08:29] i don t have many media on my sd card now [08:30] that's some great tip juzzlin_ [08:30] I'll hit safely remove whenever I reboot the phone [08:34] juzzlin_, did you file a bug ? [08:35] ogra_, yes...or I actually commented on some older bug, but it seems that no-one is interested [08:35] got the number ? [08:35] wait a sec [08:37] ogra_, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mediascanner2/+bug/1398614 [08:37] Ubuntu bug 1398614 in mediascanner2 (Ubuntu) "mediascanner-service-2.0 using large amounts of CPU" [High,Confirmed] [08:38] "Each time I plug my external USB hard disk the mediascanner-service process is activ and is using large amount of CPU" ??? [08:39] you should really have opened a new one :) [08:40] the SD card is quite different to an external USB disk ... we dont allow other filesystems than vfat on the SD for example ... [08:40] so i guess if you use a normal SD card, formatted with the device tool etc, that deserves a separate bug [08:40] Yeah, I will open a new one [08:41] (and USB disk could easily hang scanning due to file permissions if there is no vfat filesystem on it ) === chriadam is now known as chriadam|away [08:43] oh, and just FYI, i have a 64G SDXC card in my bq phone and am at the 4th day without charging, my battery is at 48% [08:44] you don't play much with the phone, do you? I have the display on at almost all times :D [08:44] yeah, i want to see how long it survives wiht minimal use :) [08:45] so i dont touch it to much currently (usuall i use it a lot, just not while i measure this) [08:45] http://i.imgur.com/6kKZVav.png [08:46] the obligatory screenshot :) [08:46] brunch875, my point is that my SD card doesnt cause battery drain obviously [08:47] that's a shame for me; since my case is probably the same and thus it is only me who to blame. [08:48] why would it be you to blame ? [08:48] there is surely something wrong if an SD drains the battery and mediascanner crashes in a loop ... [08:48] mardy: sturmflut-work is also here ^^ [08:48] i'm just saying thats not the normal case [08:49] I haven't checked if mine crashes like that. It's probably my fault since my device is probably behaving correctly [08:49] dbarth_, sturmflut-work: OK, let's continue here then :-) [08:49] (and I toy with it all day long) [08:50] well, your SD should cause zero battery drain ... thats the point [08:50] if it causes any, thats a bug [08:50] I'll strip the SD card for today [08:51] if I notice a massive battery gain, I'll look into it. Otherwise I'll assume it's alright. [08:51] k [09:04] Good morning all; happy Cherish An Antique Day! :-D [09:05] Old chairs, go! Wooo! [09:10] * popey cherishes ogra_ [09:11] * ogra_ shakes his cane at the kids on the lawn === vrruiz_ is now known as rvr [09:29] ogra_, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mediascanner2/+bug/1442035 [09:29] Ubuntu bug 1442035 in mediascanner2 (Ubuntu) "mediascanner-service constantly consumes 50-100% of CPU in Bq Aquarius 4.5" [Undecided,New] === kickinz1 is now known as kickinz1|afk === kickinz1|afk is now known as kickinz1 [09:40] jesus, it took me two whole hours to re-learn multiple integrals [09:57] do any have test ? http://notyetthere.org/openstore-tweakgeek-and-more/ [09:57] i guess mzanetti has tested it :) [09:59] ogra_ guessed right :D [10:00] well... not as good as davmor would :D [10:13] haha [10:25] mardy, dbarth_ : Sorry, we were off for lunch, I'll be back in half an hour and then I have time to debug everything [10:34] Yeah I find bugs in anything right mzanetti :D [10:34] yeah... [10:34] the one in m-vs-m still annoys me btw [10:34] because it's an unfixable one :( [10:36] mzanetti: you're welcome [10:38] sturmflut-work: ok; keep us posted [10:50] dbarth_, mardy: Okay, so I made sure that the network connection is working and unobstructed and collected all the logs. http://paste.ubuntu.com/10781656/ , http://paste.ubuntu.com/10781660/ and http://paste.ubuntu.com/10781663/ . [10:51] dbarth_, mardy: online-accounts-service didn't output anything to stdout and I saw the line "1392 credentials Password is empty" logged by signond [10:52] The SSL error was down to a captive WiFi portal [10:53] sturmflut-work: so you mean that the SSL error is solved; or the problem still happens? [10:53] dbarth_: The SSL error is solved, but the problem itself persists [10:53] dbarth_: OA is fine, the problem is here: file:///opt/click.ubuntu.com/com.ubuntu.developer.webapps.googleplus/0.4/webview-override.qml:21:1: module "com.canonical.Oxide" version 1.4 is not installed [10:53] ah ok [10:53] How can I take a screenshot of the device? I keep forgetting the procedure [10:54] sturmflut-work: both volume keys at the same time [10:54] sturmflut-work: phablet-screenshot [10:54] sturmflut-work: both at once! [10:55] Argh, thanks a lot. I kept trying combinations of a single volume button and the power button [11:00] mardy: Is the Oxide 1.4 module missing because this is not the most recent image? I'm still on r16 (the image the phone was shipped with) because we were looking for a possible bug in the updater [11:02] sturmflut-work: I don't know, dbarth_ should know better about oxide [11:10] seb128, hey, re https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-system-settings/+bug/1438633; where do i find regulatory info? i can try to debug the issue if somebody tells me where to look [11:10] Ubuntu bug 1438633 in ubuntu-system-settings (Ubuntu) "Updates page loads and immediately goes blank" [Undecided,Incomplete] [11:12] I've seen that also with at least the browser [11:13] Of course that might be totally irrelevant === MacSlow is now known as MacSlow|lunch [11:39] pstolowski, isn't that in Settings -> About? [11:40] dbarth_, mardy: I think I found it. krillin r16 ships with liboxideqt-qmlplugin:armhf version 1.3.5-0ubuntu0.14.10.1~rtm, while r20 seems to come with version 1.4.2-0ubuntu0.14.10.1 . [11:42] sturmflut-work: ok. Do you think that it's a but in the webapp? Maybe it should continue using oxide 1.3, it it uses the 14.10 framework [11:44] ogra_: do you have a minute for me? I have some silly questions :) [11:44] there are no silly questions ... [11:44] just ask :) [11:44] pstolowski, in the about panel [11:45] ogra_: I have a rootfs... and I would like to dump on it an other rootfs in a way that I can revert it if I want. Something like the image based update. [11:45] ogra_: what is the best way to do that? [11:47] bzoltan, the image based update isnt revertable [11:47] we actually replace files in the readonly space [11:47] bzoltan, is that on a phone or for your build env stuff ? [11:48] pstolowski, also, can you attach the USS log ? [11:48] ogra_: I tell you what i want. I want an ubuntu-core-5.04 fw ... no toolchain, no APIs, no nothing... and I want to plug in whatever I need, pack it up and call it "bzoltan's cools SDK" [11:48] ogra_: so it is a build env stuff ... [11:49] cool [11:49] ogra_: No chrooting, no apt-get, no nothing ... just simple dumps, but controlled [11:49] seb128, do i need a sim card to see it (cause i don't have one)? [11:49] pstolowski, I guess so [11:50] pstolowski, can you try to go to battery and try to open the subpanels there then? [11:50] you can grab a rootfs tarball and push it into an img file you create ... then take your other part and push that into an img file too, thenuse overlayfs to merge them (with a third img file or a tmpfs to add writability) [11:50] pstolowski, well, in fact that's not going to help much... [11:50] pstolowski, I though maybe it was failing to resolve the plugin to load, but your video shows the update panel for some seconds, so it's correctly loading it [11:51] I've no clue about that issue :-/ [11:51] bzoltan, the mounting will require sudo though ... (there are sudo-less ways but more complicated) [11:51] ogra_: sudo is not a problem [11:51] mardy: I am not sure I fully understand the problem. Let me try. The webapp manifest claims that com.ubuntu.developer.webapps.googleplus_0.4 is based on "framework": "ubuntu-sdk-14.10", but it uses Oxide 1.4, which is not part of this framework, right? [11:51] ok, well, then do two img files and a tmpfs in an overlayfs mount [11:52] ogra_: but why do need image files in this process? [11:52] seb128, battery panels look ok [11:52] pstolowski, ok, thanks for trying [11:52] bzoltan, mount needs "devices" to mount ... [11:52] mardy: So Click thinks the app will run on my phone and allows the package to be installed, but then the app fails [11:52] the img files are fake partitions [11:52] jgdx, USS? [11:52] ogra_: ahh.. I see [11:53] pstolowski, ubuntu system settings log at ~/.cache/upstart/application-legacy-ubuntu-system-settings-.log [11:53] sturmflut-work: yes, that's my understanding as well [11:53] ogra_: so itis all about tar, img files, overlayfs and tmpfs [11:53] bzoltan, so your img file actually needs a filesystem and you need to unpack the tarball into it while you have it mounted [11:54] jgdx, right. http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/10782125/ [11:54] right [11:54] ogra_: nice, thanks for your help [11:54] np [11:54] ask again if you hit any roadblocks :) [11:56] ogra_: I will :) The biggest blocker right now is to define and implement the real frameworks... the actual frameworks are too minimalistic for my taste. they just list .deb package names... no versions, no content, no API listing. So what I will do is a hierarchical framework (API definition) structure what you can extensively plug in to a core tootfs. [11:57] ogra_: I will start with the UITK and the Qt frameworks on QML level... the C++ level is a bit tricky as it is all about ABIs and not APIs [11:59] pstolowski, is that truncated? Maybe the one where you enter the updates panel got rotated? Could you enter the updates panel (recreating the symptom of the bug) and then re-upload the log? [12:00] bzoltan, make sure to coordinate that with the snappy guys ... click will go away at some point and your framework needs to work in the snap world then [12:01] jgdx, oh wow, i cannot reproduce it now.. could going to updates the other way fix it? i could reproduce it tens of times before... [12:02] pstolowski, Settings -> About -> Check… does not go blank? [12:02] jgdx, ah, ok, got it again now [12:03] cool [12:03] jgdx, http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/10782180/ [12:04] mardy, do you have any way of asserting that an account is 'ok'? [12:05] jgdx, pstolowski, those "Components/PageWrapperUtils.js:30: TypeError: Cannot read property 'createObject' of null" seems are weird [12:05] jgdx, well, accounts seems ok since opening the panel from the main settings grid works and installing clicks from the dash as well... [12:06] seb128, but can you recreate it? [12:06] jgdx: if it's about the U1 account I don't (other than checking that it exists), dobey should know better [12:06] jgdx, no, I can't :-/ [12:06] jgdx: but yes, if you can install apps from the store, then I guess it means that the account is ok === alan_g is now known as alan_g|lunch [12:06] mardy, okay, thanks. [12:07] mardy: I am a bit confused, is Oxide even officially part of the 14.10 framework? I can't find it in the QML API docs. [12:08] pstolowski, thank you. The lack of complaints regarding your u1 accounts is new, so I'm attaching it to the bug === MacSlow|lunch is now known as MacSlow [12:10] sturmflut-work: difficult question :-) Let's wait for dbarth_ [12:12] oxide is part of 14.10 yes [12:12] i don't think that the oxide warning message is the reason for the issue [12:13] ogra_: I am doing it for the snap word :) and click is not that relevant, but schroot should be sacked for good [12:13] jgdx, yw [12:13] ogra_: But who is the image/rootfs doer on the snappy side? [12:14] bzoltan, mvo [12:15] ogra_: of course :) who else [12:18] seb128, pstolowski, I can repro [12:19] jgdx, pstolowski, seb128: what's this about? [12:20] jgdx, how? [12:20] seb128, I'm adding the details to the bug now. [12:21] dobey, it's a bit unclear, but give me some time. === _salem is now known as salem_ [12:23] pstolowski, you can repro without reboot, just kill USS. FYI [12:24] mvo: we have even more reason to talk :) The snapcraft work is on the corner already. [12:24] dobey, humor me: if I start setting up a U1 account, but enter the wrong password and then terminate the process (cancel). What happens? [12:26] jgdx, ok.. i haven't had any problems reproducing it so far, it seems broken for good for me, when it worked a moment ago it was for the first time in ~20 attempts [12:26] jgdx: then you don't have an account [12:26] dobey, and no files are craeted [12:27] well no files are created in success either, but sure [12:27] dobey, any data? [12:28] yes, in the accounts and signon databases on success; but not on failure [12:28] dobey, okay. Thanks === pstolowski is now known as pstolowski|lunch [12:52] dbarth_: But apart from that, and if Oxide is part of 14.10, which exact version is part of 14.10? krillin r16 was shipped with 1.3 and r20 with 1.4, and both releases claim to conform to the 14.10 framework. So now we have a production device where a developer might decide to use Oxide 1.4 because the device and image version he uses to develop his app supports it, and at the same time there are users who lag a bit behind [12:52] and can't run the app, but Click can't detect the problem. === danilo__ is now known as danilos [13:00] sturmflut-work: the Oxide qml component itself is not part of the SDK. Ubuntu.Web is, and I don't think that's changed [13:01] sturmflut-work: if you're importing oxide directly, you're taking advantage of the fact that it's there, but it's not a supported part of the SDK === alan_g|lunch is now known as alan_g [13:20] sturmflut-work: we have code that ensures that depending on the framework used by the app, you run on either oxide or qtwebkit [13:20] sturmflut-work: but again, i don't think that's cause for that error [13:35] dobey, dbarth_ : Ah! That makes much more sense, thanks! === pstolowski|lunch is now known as pstolowski [14:13] dobey, hey [14:13] on my bq rtm 267 image, I installed a calendar app update through settings, went back to the dash, long clicked on the calendar icon to see the click store details/changelog for the new version, clicked on the open button from the detail page [14:13] that failed to start it, trying to run the old version [14:13] WARNING **: Unable to find keyfile for application 'com.ubuntu.calendar_calendar_0.4.600' [14:14] dobey, is that a click scope issue? do you know if it's known? [14:14] dobey, unsure if you are the right person to ask about that :-) [14:16] seb128: that sounds like a regression in the updates panel maybe. it's supposed to call the dbus signal to refresh the scope. sounds like it didn't get refreshed though. [14:18] dobey, but the scope page displayed the new version number with the corresponding changelog [14:18] I read the changelog before clicking open [14:19] seb128: that information comes from the store, so it will always show the latest no matter what version you have installed [14:19] k [14:19] dobey, I switched away from the settings app before the install was finished it seems [14:20] dobey, so maybe my fault, that blocked the refresh signal [14:20] yeah, that might do it :-/ [14:21] dobey, I wonder if it would make sense to force a refresh and retry if the version is not found [14:22] seb128: i think the settings plug-in needs to be fixed to run the install helper script for the scope, rather than calling the dbus method from within qt [14:23] mandel, ^ :-) [14:24] seb128, gosh.. I hate that code, dobey what do you suggest, we need to rewrite all that [14:25] dobey, I'm going to kill diego [14:25] lol [14:26] mandel, while you are rewriting it, might be nice to make it use libclick rather than the click command line ;-) [14:26] * seb128 stops there and hides [14:26] seb128, 100% agreed [14:27] seb128, I'm going to stop myself from doing it because we have a sprint and I want to do it with you guys around (will you be present)? [14:28] mandel, at the core sprint in 10 days? no, desktop is not invinted, we have our own week in London the week after that... [14:28] seb128: no [14:28] but maybe kenvandine is going to be there? [14:28] better to make it use the helper shell script that is in unity-scope-click [14:28] so stuff will work even when you switch away from system settings [14:32] dobey, thanks for the suggestion [14:55] oSoMoN, i updated that sharelink MP, hopefully that's better :) [14:56] kenvandine, thanks, I’ll take a look shortly [14:56] thx [15:02] bzoltan: heh, we will see each other in person next week, right? === alan_g is now known as alan_g|afk [15:03] mvo: It depends. if you plan to visit Helsinki :) then yes. But sadly the SDK team was not invited to the party .. [15:10] bzoltan: oh, good. would be a good time to catchup, when do you guys have the next sprint? [15:11] mvo: no idea yet.. we should have a sprint to focus on the top prioroty stories.. like scope development and snappy === kickinz1 is now known as kickinz1|afk === kickinz1|afk is now known as kickinz1 === dandrader_ is now known as dandrader === chihchun is now known as chihchun_afk [16:11] notly hy [16:27] is there a way to restart an indicator that crashes, apart from rebooting? [16:28] you can try to restart it from the terminal app i think+ [16:30] (they are just user upstart jobs, so something like: "initctl restart indicator-foobar") [16:31] ok, next time that happens I will try it this way :) [16:31] ogra_, thanks [16:32] well, thanks me once it worked, i'm not sure if the terminal-app environment has access to upstart ... adb definitely has though [16:32] (but that requires a PC indeed) === alan_g|afk is now known as alan_g [16:58] ogra_: do you have a wiki/braindump/whatever about how and/or with what tool do you usually create the img file from the rootfs/chroot? [16:59] no, thats rather complex [17:01] bzoltan, oh, you are referring to our former conversation ... [17:01] ogra_: yes [17:02] dd if=/dev/zero of=./myimage.img bs=1M count=512 [17:02] that creates a 512MB file called myimg.img [17:02] ogra_: that one I am familiar with :D [17:02] dd lives next door [17:03] mkfs.ext4 ./myimage.img [17:03] mkdir mymuntpoint ... [17:03] sudo mount -o loop ./myimage.img mymountpoint [17:03] and then you can extract your tarball under mymountpoint [17:03] clear [17:04] how to pack it back? [17:04] pack it back ? [17:04] you just unmount it [17:04] ogra_: and the myimage.img will just magically contain the changes? [17:05] * bzoltan feels ashamed [17:05] it will contain what you unpacked there [17:05] its like a partition :) [17:05] of course === alan_g is now known as alan_g|EOD [17:05] it is indeed a partition from loop device [17:05] right [17:06] ogra_: sweet, thanks [17:06] for the overlayfs stuff i fear i cant help you ... [17:06] you will have to read up about it ... === dandrader is now known as dandrader|afk [17:06] ogra_: that one I can handle ... I almost made the SDK testing with that [17:06] i know it allows to do similar stuff aufs does ... which is what i'm familiar with ... but thats deprecated [17:07] ogra_: I played with overlayfs... it is not complicated [17:07] yeah, i guess so [17:07] * bzoltan goes and start creating frameworks [17:07] * ogra_ just didnt have to touch such stuff in years [17:09] /part returning home [17:10] * brunch875 feels awkward === philippe is now known as PhilippeP === dandrader|afk is now known as dandrader === olivieer is now known as GermuinZ === GermuinZ is now known as Grarak === Grarak is now known as Olivier === Olivier is now known as olivieer [19:27] how can i install apps on ubuntu-touch via the terminal? === kickinz1 is now known as kickinz1|afk === kickinz1|afk is now known as kickinz1 [19:32] meles: http://askubuntu.com/a/603069/612 or http://askubuntu.com/a/599489/612 [19:34] popey: but i m not talking about a local deb or click package, but about stuff from the software center. [19:34] popey: http://askubuntu.com/questions/607336/terminal-command-to-install-apps-on-ubuntu-touch [19:34] meles: there is no CLI for the click app store at the moment [19:35] meles: what do you want to install? [19:36] dobey: bad news but thanks for the info. I have an issue with my GPS and BQ Support suggested to reset. But I'm not willing to do that if i have to do everything manually. [19:36] popey ^ [19:36] installng from the app store requires a u1 account, and the only way to sign in with a u1 account is via the UI [19:37] meles: we may have a fix coming for GPS issues [19:37] meles: you can re-falsh without replacing the installed apps or your current settings. there should also be an OTA update soon which might fix some of the problems you're seeing [19:39] popey, dobey: so the issue is wider spread? [19:39] others have reported some issues with GPS resolution yes [19:40] i don't know what issue you're having specifically of course :) [19:40] ok than i will just wait for a fix, since I anyway expect reseting not o help. [19:40] thanks for your patience meles [19:41] well Wifi and cell positioning works, gps doesn't [19:42] popey, dobey thanks for your help. does anyone want to answer this question. otherwise i will just comment it with your info. [19:45] popey, dobey sorry i forgot the link: http://askubuntu.com/questions/607336/terminal-command-to-install-apps-on-ubuntu-touch [19:46] you basically can't [19:46] unless you have a local copy of the click packages [19:46] answered [19:46] you could script it. [19:46] which you don't, becasue the downloaded .click is deleted immediately after it's installed [19:46] well, i wasn't assuming that [19:46] i was saying if you have a local _copy_ [19:47] (which I do) [19:47] well _you_ are special :) [19:47] hah [19:47] this simple script does wonders for me for install .click on the device. http://paste.ubuntu.com/10785276/ [19:48] I call it phablet-click-install [19:48] ;) [19:48] om26er: thanks but i was wanting stuff from the software center [19:48] om26er: /if/ you have a .click file that works yes [19:49] dobey: thanks for the answer on askubuntu [19:49] meles: why not install from the store [19:49] davmor2: he's trying to automate it [19:49] ah okay that makes more sense [19:49] davmor2: ie, "reinstall previously installed packages" feature [19:50] davmor2: well thats what i mean. [19:50] davmor2: but after a reset that wont work === kickinz1 is now known as kickinz1|afk [20:03] newbie question: does ubuntu app phone store creating separate binaries for each app? I mean, how can it achieve phone-desktop compatibilty? === kickinz1|afk is now known as kickinz1 [20:04] daixtr: depends, if it's a pure qml app (like calendar & music) then the same code runs everywhere [20:04] what's the de-facto development language for ubuntu phone apps? Is it C? [20:05] daixtr: if it's an app which contains binaries (like terminal and file manager) we can make "Fat" packages which contain binaries for multiple platforms [20:05] https://uappexplorer.com/app/com.ubuntu.developer.nskaggs.filemanager for example is a fat package [20:05] i've been doing C programming for linux.. [20:06] most of ours is qml or c++ [20:07] so this https://uappexplorer.com/ is like, the equivalent for android's google play? [20:08] kinda [20:08] it's a community maintained frontend to our store [20:09] we have an "official" one in the works, but that's not live yet [20:09] so what's the development feel... is it like the gcc/make thing? [20:09] apt-get install ubuntu-sdk and see :) [20:09] ok [20:10] popey, I didn't ask about hits but I didn't know about it. It's interesting [20:10] this* [20:10] vitimiti: que? [20:11] daixtr: http://developer.ubuntu.com/ [20:11] popey, I was saying that this you said about the app explorer and the "fat" packages was interesting [20:11] Sorry for my English [20:11] i noticed that ubuntu phone does not use the 'home' hardware button.. if i install ubuntu into my galaxy s5, will this 'home' physical button be useless? [20:12] we dont use any of the soft android buttons [20:12] vitimiti: ahh, sorry :) [20:12] daixtr: and I don't know if the galaxy s5 is a supported device [20:12] !devices [20:12] You can find the full list of devices, official images, community images, and works in progress at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Devices [20:13] ok.. anyhow,.. whatever device ... i noticed that ubuntu phone is not using any home button [20:13] correct [20:13] why? [20:13] our user interface doesn't use it [20:13] It's gestures based [20:13] i mean, but can we put it to good use? like map it to something useful? can ubuntu os do it? [20:14] we don't use it, and I don't believe there's any plan to map it to anything [20:14] in the future we may be on devices that have no soft buttons, so we shouldn't expect them [20:14] ok.. but can the OS generate events, or i can program on it..? [20:15] beuno: fyi, NOS approved and fix is in r430 [20:15] or does the OS totally ignores it like it does not exist? [20:15] the latter [20:18] are gtk/qt applications directly run on it? (sorry i'll read the docs later promise) i need to know ahead what's in front of me so i'll know [20:18] existing desktop apps won't work out of the box [20:19] we don't have X on the phone, but use Mir. [20:19] beuno: I noticed 'wget' in the store too and commented [20:19] In the future Xmir may be on the device. [20:20] thanks jdstrand [20:20] if i drop to cli terminal in ubuntu phone, does it have a multi-user.. shell.. such as i can create new users 'useradd', etc.. crontab -e.. and so on? [20:22] not really, no [20:23] it may be possible to create additional terminal users, but / is read-only, and the UI doesn't yet support multiple user scenarios [20:23] so it's not useful to do that on the phone really [20:50] dobey: how about any scheduling mechanism.. like crontab.. if i want to run a program regularly.. [20:50] daixtr, not currently available, no [20:50] its the same as a background task [20:50] i thought we supported user crontabs? [20:51] we'll need to figure out the right way to do it [20:51] popey, not AFAIK [20:51] popey: i don't think so [20:51] pretty sure ogra_ said so recently [20:51] * popey throws ogra_ under the cron bus [20:51] i'm pretty sure that part of the fs is read-only [20:51] do i have the ability to run a daemon program then? [20:52] daixtr, no, no background processes [20:52] your app is either running and on the screen [20:52] or stopped [20:52] what's the shell.. is it busybox? [20:52] or does it / can it have a bash? [20:52] daixtr, it is a phone, restricted to what apps can do so the user's phone doesn't get crippled [20:52] daixtr: what are you trying to do exactly? [20:53] nothing.. i'm just ranging... [20:53] daixtr: you can basically do whatever you want on your own phone, but it's not really supported [20:53] daixtr: but you can't do background processes and such in an app you want to build and put in the store [20:54] doing unsupported stuff on your own phone is basically a "you get to keep both pieces when it breaks" situation [20:54] it's unsupported because we can't reasonably support it :) [20:55] the phone as a consumer product is ubuntu, but it has sandboxing and other security things to prevent malicious apps from destroying your battery or shipping your data off to a server in russia and such [20:56] about the kernel.. is the inotify stripped out? [20:56] it's an older kernel, as we have to use the AOSP android kernel to have working hardware [20:57] i don't know if inotify is enabled in it or not, but i don't think an app could use it under confinement, either way [21:02] is the mode of development for ubuntu phone, a cross-compiling one? [21:04] yes [21:07] well.. i just read a seconds ago.. qml/javascript seems to be main language.. but C++ cross-compiling detail is to be announce yet when full sdk is released... [21:08] so clearly, i see here that its diverging from Android's java-based lang... i'm just curious, why this different development choice... [21:09] it's not diverging from android's java at all. it's completely unrelated [21:09] i read qml... and i see javascript... [21:09]