[16:00] <dholbach> hey hey
[16:00] <dholbach> #startmeeting CC meeting
[16:00] <meetingology> Meeting started Thu Apr 16 16:00:51 2015 UTC.  The chair is dholbach. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
[16:00] <meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
[16:01] <dholbach> #chair elfy mhall119 cprofitt
[16:01] <meetingology> Current chairs: cprofitt dholbach elfy mhall119
[16:01] <cprofitt> hello dholbach mhall119 elfy
[16:01] <elfy> o/
[16:01] <dholbach> who else do we have here? :)
[16:02] <mhall119> isn't this supposed to be at 1700 UTC, not 1600?
[16:02] <dholbach> hum...
[16:02] <cprofitt> mhall119: I think the DST has kicked in
[16:02] <dholbach> it could be that my calendar played a trick on m
[16:02] <dholbach> e
[16:02] <dholbach> but you're right
[16:02] <dholbach> it should be in an hour
[16:02] <elfy> and yea ...
[16:02] <cprofitt> so DST has not kicked in
[16:02] <dholbach> shall we have the meeting now or reconvene?
[16:02] <elfy> I did wonder
[16:03] <elfy> cprofitt: it is 16:00 UTC here
[16:03] <mhall119> I'm fine with either now or in an hour
[16:03] <dholbach> it'd probably be only fair to do it in an hour - mhall119, elfy, cprofitt: will you all have time?
[16:03] <mhall119> yes
[16:03] <elfy> I'll still be about yes
[16:03] <cprofitt> I should, but can not make a promise since I am at work
[16:04] <dholbach> ok, cool
[16:04] <cprofitt> could get called away
[16:04] <dholbach> let's try again in 55mins then :)
[16:04] <dholbach> #endmeeting
[16:04] <meetingology> Meeting ended Thu Apr 16 16:04:10 2015 UTC.
[16:04] <meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2015/ubuntu-meeting.2015-04-16-16.00.moin.txt
[16:04] <elfy> then if there is anyone out there with a question for us - the time is still good for calendar
[17:00] <dholbach> shall we try again? :-)
[17:00] <mhall119> sure
[17:00] <elfy> \o/
[17:00] <dholbach> mhall119, elfy, cprofitt: anyone else here for the CC meeting? :)
[17:00] <dholbach> #startmeeting
[17:00] <meetingology> Meeting started Thu Apr 16 17:00:24 2015 UTC.  The chair is dholbach. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
[17:00] <meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
[17:00] <dholbach> #chair elfy mhall119
[17:00] <meetingology> Current chairs: dholbach elfy mhall119
[17:00] <dholbach> Do you have any agenda items you'd like to propose?
[17:00] <elfy> yep
[17:01] <dholbach> I'd like us to set up a schedule for the catch ups, which should be quick I assume
[17:01] <elfy> that would be the same one :D
[17:01] <elfy> and ...ish
[17:01] <elfy> new teams about
[17:01] <dholbach> and maybe do a quick review of which boards/councils have members expiring soon
[17:02] <dholbach> any other items?
[17:02] <elfy> sort out the next catch ups perhaps
[17:02] <dholbach> that sounds fair to me :)
[17:02] <dholbach> #topic Scheduling the next CC catch ups
[17:02] <dholbach> shall we note it all down on http://pad.ubuntu.com/ZQTluJERI3?
[17:02] <elfy> works for me
[17:03] <dholbach> brilliant
[17:04] <elfy> mate/edubuntu swap *shrug*
[17:04] <elfy> though once LTS gets close - we'll want to add them back perhaps
[17:04] <mhall119> instead of combining Core Apps and Phone, how about having separate check-ins with those teams working on core, desktop and phone?
[17:05] <elfy> mhall119: make the change :) makes sense
[17:06] <mhall119> do you think we can do all three in one hour's meeting?
[17:06] <elfy> mhall119: well
[17:06] <cprofitt> hello
[17:06] <dholbach> #chair cprofitt
[17:06] <meetingology> Current chairs: cprofitt dholbach elfy mhall119
[17:06] <dholbach> cprofitt, we're scheduling catch ups for the new cycle: http://pad.ubuntu.com/ZQTluJERI3
[17:07] <dholbach> mhall119, I just added a new date at the bottom - feel free to spread teams out if necessary
[17:07] <elfy> if they are *that* different - split them to different weeks - also gives people who can only drop by irregularly half a chance
[17:08] <elfy> mhall119: ^^
[17:08] <dholbach> I'm happy either way - I don't have a strong preference when to have Core Apps vs Phone people there
[17:08] <mhall119> elfy: they are different teams in Canonical, but they'll probably all have the same issues if any
[17:08] <elfy> I'd much prefer to give a team the whole half a session each
[17:08] <elfy> mhall119: that may be so, but
[17:09] <elfy> the community might have different points - and people are free to ask things here I guessed
[17:09] <cprofitt> I would prefer to give a half session to each as well.
[17:10] <elfy> makes sense
[17:10] <elfy> at the least
[17:10] <dholbach> I just added more dates
[17:10] <dholbach> we can spread out if we want
[17:10] <cprofitt> having too much time is better than not having enough for a team IMHO
[17:10] <elfy> yep
[17:10] <dholbach> and we can always wrap early if all is well and there's nothing to talk about :)
[17:11] <elfy> we can always rethink the cycle after - which IS the pre-LTS one
[17:11] <elky> Hi. i noticed yesterday that dholbach mailed the irc council about a catchup a while back but i don't think it was confirmed or anything. I'm guessing by that pad that it's not still on?
[17:11] <mhall119> elfy: my guess is that the community would be more uniform across those three than Canonical employees
[17:11] <mhall119> but that's just my guess
[17:11] <dholbach> elky, it was scheduled, but in the end I can't remember if anyone showed up
[17:11] <elfy> mhall119: that is fine - but I see no real reason to not try it
[17:11] <dholbach> elky, or one person showed up belated ... or something
[17:12] <elky> dholbach: well... you tried to schedule one for today and now
[17:12] <elky> so i showed up now :P
[17:12] <dholbach> schedule for today?
[17:12] <dholbach> IRC Council 5th March
[17:12] <elky> it was an email you sent
[17:12] <dholbach> oooooooooh!
[17:12] <elfy> elky: I guess something was lost there, however - we've got time if you want to talk to us
[17:12] <elky> trying to schedule for now
[17:13] <dholbach> sorry about that
[17:13] <dholbach> now I get it
[17:13]  * elfy always has time for some tabfail sessions :D
[17:13] <dholbach> we said: "nobody showed up, let's reschedule" and I picked a date
[17:13] <elfy> but
[17:13] <dholbach> but failed to update the agenda page
[17:13] <dholbach> ... and maybe nobody confirmed the date
[17:13] <elfy> if you want to talk to us now elky - we will :)
[17:13] <elky> elfy: dholbach: well, basically we're still regrouping. we're currently trying to find a new meeting time that will actually work.
[17:14] <dholbach> ok... shall we wrap up the scheduling discussion?
[17:14] <dholbach> then move on to IRC business? :)
[17:14] <elfy> dholbach: just put it on back burner
[17:14] <dholbach> elfy, cprofitt, mhall119: any more points on the catch up schedule? or shall I just mail it to the CC later on, so everyone can have a look at it and make final changes before we announce it?
[17:15] <elfy> elfy: I guess it's been a bit of a *time* over there, I get hints here and there
[17:15] <elfy> dholbach: how about moving back to it if we've time?
[17:15] <elky> dholbach: i understand the motivation, i just didn't want you guys to be stood up again if the topic did happen :)
[17:16] <elky> but i'm here now, so make of that what you will
[17:16] <elfy> elky: I was not talking to myself but you ^^
[17:16] <dholbach> elfy, ok... I just felt that we were close to resolving it as far as we can now and could move on if we agreed, but yeah, sure
[17:16] <elky> elfy: hehe sorry still waking up
[17:16] <elfy> really should really re-nick as hobgoblin for a while :D
[17:16] <elky> hehehe
[17:17] <dholbach> ok....
[17:17] <dholbach> #topic Catching up with the IRC Council
[17:17] <dholbach> hey elky - thanks a lot for showing up :)
[17:17] <elky> not a problem
[17:17] <dholbach> how are you doing? how's life in the IRC world? :)
[17:18] <elky> so as i said before, we're still regrouping and working out our schedule to fit in with the current members
[17:18] <dholbach> how far are the members spread out?
[17:19] <elky> one in finland, the rest of us across the US
[17:19] <elky> (i'm in the US now)
[17:19] <elfy> so again the Euro/US bias
[17:19] <dholbach> oh wow, I had no idea :)
[17:19] <elky> we have people who can't irc from work though, which complicates things a lot
[17:20] <elfy> really hard to deal with that I guess
[17:20] <elky> that's our biggest issue
[17:20] <elfy> and that for sure
[17:20] <elfy> which - the work or bias?
[17:20] <elky> we're considering moving to a weekend meeting, but we're yet to confirm a time
[17:20] <dholbach> how often are you planning to meet as the IRC Council?
[17:20] <dholbach> or how often did you meet in the past?
[17:20] <elky> elfy: the irc restriction at workplaces
[17:20] <elfy> right
[17:21] <elky> dholbach: the meeting schedule is monthly, which is why it's taking a while to get something sorted i guess
[17:21] <elfy> elky: but if the location bias could be looked at later - less of an issue?
[17:22] <elfy> elky: any reason to have monthly meets?
[17:22] <elky> elfy: i don't think location bias is one that can be fixed easily.
[17:22] <elky> elfy: as opposed to?
[17:22] <dholbach> I'm not sure if it helps, but can "day to day tasks on the IRC Council", "IRC Council meeting times" and "helping out as an IRC member/op/helper" be separated somehow?
[17:22] <dholbach> a bunch of things could maybe be discussed via mail as well
[17:23] <elfy> elky: we (FC) set up monthlies, ended up as pointless
[17:23] <elky> elfy: in that you have no meetings now?
[17:23] <elfy> we dealt with the immediate issues as and when
[17:23] <elky> that would be nice, but that wasn't the expectation put on the council in the past
[17:23] <elfy> then have now moved to quarterly
[17:23] <dholbach> elfy, I guess it depends on how approachable you as a council or board are... or how well people in your community understand they can contact you
[17:24] <dholbach> a meeting as "another opportunity" can help, but yeah, it can be pointless too :)
[17:24] <elfy> elky: well - rules are great in a workplace, but as volunteers the expectation should be that things just woirk
[17:24] <elfy> dholbach: yea for sure
[17:24] <elky> elfy: i'm glad to see this shift in attitude :)
[17:25] <elfy> elky: first shift on CC, years at forum ;)_
[17:25] <elfy> I am ALWAYS happy to talk to anyone at all
[17:25] <mhall119> sorry everyone, home-life interruption, I'm back again
[17:26] <elky> dholbach: in terms of the issues we generally deal with, generally a meeting would be awkward and unfair on someone -- like a public humiliation
[17:26] <elfy> though if it is one of those 'trolly' things, move it to official
[17:26] <elfy> elky: the same - we just would not do that (FC)
[17:27] <elfy> elky: how about the IRCC and FC actaully do that mad thing
[17:27] <elfy> talk to each other :D
[17:27] <elky> that'd be awesome indeed
[17:27] <dholbach> I guess it depends what you need to talk about
[17:27] <elfy> I am sure we could help each other in how we deal with things
[17:27] <dholbach> if you want to bring up a process improvement
[17:27] <elfy> dholbach: things like
[17:27] <dholbach> or applying as a member
[17:27] <elfy> do we NEED to meet monthyl
[17:27] <dholbach> that might be suitable for an IRC Council
[17:27] <dholbach> meeting
[17:28] <elfy> well - membership process - I bet we could learn from each other
[17:28] <dholbach> it could also help to review work items or stuff
[17:28] <elfy> but the minutae - less so
[17:28] <elky> dholbach: the stuff we're responsible for, is way too time sensitive to wait a month.,
[17:28] <elky> or even a week reallt
[17:29] <dholbach> elky, I wasn't trying to say that you should wait until the next meeting
[17:29] <elfy> more a sort of 'well how do you as a group work?  thing
[17:29] <elfy> elky: exactly - we are lucky
[17:29] <elfy> we get a day(ish)
[17:29] <dholbach> sometimes it helps to make an appointment, come together as a group and take time to discuss something
[17:29] <dholbach> (outside the day to day business)
[17:30] <elfy> dholbach: it really does not work like that - sorry ;)
[17:30] <dholbach> but I'm not trying to impose
[17:30] <mhall119> especially if you spend the previous week/month jotting down topics in an agenda
[17:30] <elky> dholbach: we haven't needed to do that in the past few months, but yes that has happened in the past.
[17:30] <dholbach> right
[17:30] <elfy> elky: I'll mail you with the FC hat
[17:30] <elky> elfy: cool
[17:31] <dholbach> and apart from meeting times... how are things going there? :)
[17:31] <elfy> heh
[17:31] <elky> relatively drama free so far this year
[17:32] <elfy> \o/
[17:32] <elky> which is a nice change of pace. last year burned a councillor or two out, so yes.
[17:32] <dholbach> do you have enough helpers in the channels?
[17:33] <Pici> Sorry I'm late, work stuff. (reads scrollback quickly)
[17:33] <elfy> hi Pici
[17:33] <elky> we seem to be ok at the moment, but i believe we have some applications to look at anyway
[17:33] <elfy> that's great
[17:36] <dholbach> cool
[17:36] <dholbach> how about people who applied as Ubuntu members through IRC contributions?
[17:36] <mhall119> elfy: is there any particular change that you think contributed to this being a drama-free year?
[17:36] <mhall119> something we can maybe roll out to other parts of the community
[17:36] <dholbach> I'm asking because we noticed in other teams that there's a lot of people who could apply, but didn't :)
[17:37] <elfy> \o/ I think that ^^ was for elky :D
[17:37] <elky> mhall119: no, last year was quite exceptional. i don't recommend having that drama so that the next year is an improvement
[17:37] <elfy> dholbach: we see the same thing
[17:37] <mhall119> elky: yes, this elfy/elky thing is killing my brain
[17:37] <elky> :D
[17:38] <elfy> :D
[17:38] <elfy> who said that !!!
[17:38] <dholbach> ouch :)
[17:38] <elky> we break brains in #xubuntu* all the timne
[17:38] <elfy> annnnnnnnd ....
[17:38] <elfy> you owe me a clean screen ...
[17:38] <elky> haha
[17:39] <cprofitt> mhall119: you can't tell the difference bewtween and elf and an alk?
[17:39] <cprofitt> elk?
[17:39] <elky> dholbach: i can't remember the last time someone applied through the ircc for membership, but it's a small team in comparison to even some loco teams
[17:40] <dholbach> right
[17:40] <mhall119> cprofitt: I don't think I've every seen either, to be honest
[17:40] <cprofitt> lol
[17:40] <Pici> We have a lot of people seeking help pass through, but a smaller community of helpers.
[17:40] <dholbach> I think we should all try to encourage folks who haven't applied yet :)
[17:40] <elfy> hah
[17:40] <cprofitt> the forums had to work at having people apply via the forums for Ubuntu membership
[17:40] <dholbach> I should add a post-it note to my laptop screen about that
[17:40] <cprofitt> do IRC folks know that it is a potential route?
[17:41] <elfy> dholbach: seriously - for sure - supporters deserve membership
[17:41] <elky> yes
[17:41] <dholbach> cprofitt, there's a process and it's documented on the wiki, but that probably doesn't answer your question :)
[17:41] <elky> they do know. most of the irc team are members as far as i know
[17:41] <mhall119> elky: how are they told about it?
[17:41] <dholbach> elky, that's good to hear :)
[17:41] <elfy> elky: we kind of did a bit more over forum side
[17:42] <elfy> I'l try and summarise the whole 'how we do it'
[17:42] <elky> elfy: at one point, the irc team required membership to be op, so i think there was a difference in the population there
[17:42] <elfy> yea
[17:42] <Pici> Usually it comes up because someone notices that they aren't a member, and then the suggestion to become one goes on and then we can initiate the process.
[17:42] <cprofitt> dholbach: the process being documented is a good start, but I know the forums had to really encourage people to get the process started.
[17:43] <dholbach> yeah
[17:43] <elfy> I think, and this might be up for debate
[17:43] <elfy> that criteria needs to at least 'look' or 'read' easier
[17:44] <elfy> many people have said to me they would 'fail'
[17:44] <elfy> their words
[17:44] <Pici> :/
[17:44] <elky> guys, i need to go of and do something else now, can we wrap this topic? or pici can take over?
[17:44] <elfy> elky: go do life stuff - thanks
[17:45] <elky> thanks guys, one less thing on the todo list :)
[17:45] <elfy> I will be in contact withe the IRCC
[17:45] <dholbach> cool
[17:45] <elfy> as FC
[17:45] <Pici> Okay :)
[17:45] <dholbach> is there anything the IRC Council could generally need help with? or anything the CC could do?
[17:45] <elfy> but yea Pici :/
[17:45] <elfy> people should not feel that way
[17:46] <Pici> dholbach: I'm not sure we need anything as of yet.  Like elky said, the drama has been very low recently.
[17:46] <dholbach> excellent - thanks a lot for all your hard work!
[17:46] <dholbach> mhall119 is going to be in touch with you quite soon again I guess :)
[17:47] <dholbach> or did you guys talk about UOS channels already? :)
[17:47] <mhall119> dholbach: I haven't, I don't know which of us was tasked with getting UOS channels setup
[17:47] <Pici> Sounds like it was you ;)
[17:47] <dholbach> I can't remember either - I guess we're going to figure it out
[17:48] <Pici> Just poke us whenever you're ready and we'll do what needs to be done
[17:48] <dholbach> <3
[17:48] <dholbach> cprofitt, elfy, mhall119: do you have any more questions for Pici and the IRC folks? :)
[17:48] <mhall119> nope, it sounds like things are going well which is an improvement from before
[17:48] <elfy> none yet
[17:48] <mhall119> so I'm quite happy
[17:48] <Pici> yay
[17:49] <elfy> I will do as I said and mail you as FC hat - with what we do and how
[17:49] <dholbach> brilliant
[17:49] <dholbach> thanks a lot Pici and elky! :)
[17:49] <Pici> np :)
[17:49] <elfy> I would love for the IRCC to say some "try this one ..."
[17:50] <dholbach> elfy, regarding the catch-up schedule... did you have anything else you wanted to talk about or shall I send it out for a sanity check of the rest of the gang as a next step?
[17:50] <elfy> anyway - thanks elky Pici
[17:51] <elfy> dholbach: send it to list, but was mostly about making sure no-shows had reason
[17:51] <elfy> and people like Mate - new - were added in
[17:52] <elfy> good to go here
[17:52] <dholbach> elfy, erm... do you mean by "no-shows had reason" checking if the teams excused themselves from the meetings?
[17:52] <mhall119> thanks elky and Pici for coming
[17:52] <dholbach> my brain is a bit slow at processing English today it seems
[17:53] <dholbach> if all's well, I'll just mail out the schedule in a bit :)
[17:53] <mhall119> dholbach: Texas accents have that affect
[17:53] <dholbach> jetlag too! :)
[17:53] <dholbach> I'd be happy to look over the expiry dates of all councils/boards again as well to help with the planning
[17:53] <dholbach> #topic Any other business
[17:54] <elfy> dholbach: yea I did :)
[17:54] <dholbach> go ahead
[17:54] <elfy> or rather - they might be LTS only
[17:55] <elfy> dholbach: I've got time tomorrow to at least try and contact edubuntu etc
[17:55] <dholbach> cool
[17:55] <elfy> unless you mean mail schedule to CC to double check
[17:56] <elfy> in which case - go ahead
[17:56] <dholbach> oh... I just sent it over for review
[17:56] <dholbach> :)
[17:57] <elfy> yep, just got it :D
[17:57] <elfy> #endmeeting
[17:57] <meetingology> Meeting ended Thu Apr 16 17:57:49 2015 UTC.
[17:57] <meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2015/ubuntu-meeting.2015-04-16-17.00.moin.txt
[17:57] <elfy> then :)
[17:58] <dholbach> excellent!
[17:58] <dholbach> thanks a lot everyone!
[17:58] <mhall119> thanks dholbach