=== ePirat- is now known as ePirat
=== mfisch is now known as Guest41550
tewardhey, stupid question, but is there a hierarchy of bug triage such that someone else in the chain has higher priority decision over bug importance / triage for a given package than others?17:14
penguin42teward: Well there is bugsquad and bug-control and the package-maintainers for a particular package, and then there is bdmurray17:18
tewardpenguin42: so essentially, higher-to-lower is... bdmurray (ultimate final authority), package-maintainers/uploaders, bug-control, bugsquad, in that order?17:19
teward'cause i have issues with how Alberto handles triage17:19
tewardtrying to determine the hierarchy of authority for the package i have issues with how he handled the bug17:20
penguin42teward: I'm not sure what the formal way to moan is17:20
tewardwell he's caused strife before... enough evidence of that lying around17:20
penguin42I've also had issues with some peoples triaging mechanisms, but I can't say I know how to referee it17:21
penguin42teward: If you've already asked nicely and not got anywhere, I'd say ask bdmurray, as the owner of bugcontrol team17:22
tewardpenguin42: you know what the problem is?  Alberto's a hard one to find17:23
tewardi also think 'high' importance is dependent on being able to reproduce the bugs - I fail to see any evidence where Alberto went and actually did any reproduction tests17:23
tewardmeh, maybe i'm just griping for the sake of griping :/17:23
penguin42teward: I wouldn't necessary try to reproduce for a 'high' if the problem sounds grim enough17:24
tewardpenguin42: the big problem I have is systemd now - it doesn't actually output useful information17:24
tewardhttps://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/nginx/+bug/1447294 is the bug if you want to take a look17:24
ubot5Ubuntu bug 1447294 in nginx (Ubuntu Vivid) "package nginx-full 1.6.2-5ubuntu3 failed to install/upgrade: subprocess installed post-installation script returned error exit status 1" [High,Incomplete]17:24
tewardi don't have an issue with "High" but there's zero useful data from the dpkg history17:24
penguin42teward: and anyway, if it's failing for a bunch of people but as a triager you can't reproduce it, then you can't dismiss the bug just because you can't reproduce it17:24
tewardpenguin42: two people is a bunch?17:24
tewardpenguin42: i'm not dismissing the bug - i'm dismissing Alberto's actions17:25
* penguin42 looks17:25
tewardpenguin42: you can even see I asked for more information to try and deduce *what* caused dpkg to fail17:25
tewardpenguin42: also why i asked in -devel if there's a way to force apport to run certain additional commands to get information17:25
teward(if apport gave us information for nginx that actually helped debug it, that'd be one thing, but in this case, it gave us zero truly useful information)17:25
tewardi agree that "High" is valid, but the problem being that there's no debug data of use (and Alberto should know this)17:26
tewardis why i'm complaining.17:27
penguin42teward: I'd have to agree that a package like nginx failing to install/uninstall is probably a high17:27
teward*cough* [2015/04/25 13:26:52] <teward> i agree that "High" is valid, but the problem being that there's no debug data of use (and Alberto should know this)17:27
tewardpenguin42: i'm complaining that Alberto just set importance and did no additional triage work17:27
penguin42teward: Right, but the fact you don't have any debug data doesn't change the importance17:27
tewardpenguin42: at what point did i say that17:27
tewardi'm complaining that alberto could have gone a step further and actually bothered to do triage work17:27
penguin42teward: I think it's OK to set importance and not to do further triage17:28
tewardi think that's what annoys me most - i fail to see him doing anything else but setting importance and such17:28
tewardmaybe i'm biased by upload privs for it, but meh17:28
penguin42teward: While I'd agree it would be nice to do more triage, maybe he felt he doesn't know nginx well enough and it's better to leave it to those who do17:28
teward(the consideration point being, if users see an importance set they thin that means "Oh, nice, someone's actually working to test and reproduce." and gives them a false view on it.17:28
tewardpenguin42: IMO he should just stop touching server bugs, his focus seems to be GUI *shrugs*17:29
tewardmaybe i'm just having a bad week17:29
tewardalthough he gets on my radar as an irritant far too often17:29
penguin42teward: It would be worse if he was to ask irrelevant questions on the package to triage it17:30
tewardwell, then i'd be bothering bdmurray and saying he shouldn't have bug control, but that's a different story altogether17:30
penguin42teward: If he knows he doesn't know the package but sees the bug looks important it seems reasonable to triage; and then let the package owner decide otherwise17:30
* teward shrugs17:30
tewardpenguin42: what's interesting is the latest failures there are dpkg failures, either because they used nginx.org's packages, or because of a nondeterministic failue due to no debug info17:30
tewardi really wish we could tell apport what to actually get for a given package's failures17:31
teward(i'd love the systemd status for bugs :/)17:31
penguin42teward: I'm not sure of the details of apport but I think you can add stuff17:31
tewardmmm, i might suggest that to Debian, since that's their systemd script17:31
penguin42teward: A lot of package installation failures are random installation screwups, disk fulls etc - but sometimes you do get things where a package assumes things about the /etc config files for the package and fails to install/uninstall - and those are valid bugs17:32
penguin42brb - I just need to check on my sorbet17:32
tewardpenguin42: given that there's usable debug data, then yes17:32
tewardhowever in a fresh installation like was above, where none of the apt history shows nginx being installed, that adds to the complexity17:32
penguin42hmm, still sorbifying17:34
penguin42teward: Well, it could be something like a missing dependency depending what packages people chose17:35
tewardpenguin42: well they installed nginx-full, which called in the dependency for nginx-common - and that did install (see the dpkgterminalhistory)17:35
tewardbased on the info available i really wish I could force Apport to get additional data, but meh17:36
teward(systemd is giving me headaches >.<)17:36
penguin42teward: I'm fairly sure that's possible; but need to check with the apport guys17:36
tewardhere's the journal errors...17:36
tewardApr 22 14:24:32 hostname systemd[1]: Failed to start A high performance web server and a reverse proxy server.     Apr 22 14:24:32 hostname systemd[1]: nginx.service failed.17:37
teward^ nothing useful17:37
tewardjust like dpkg's output17:37
tewardi think i need to talk to the apport people17:37
penguin42teward: I'd consider journalctl -u nginx   or something like that17:37
penguin42teward: but that depends where nginx sends it's logs17:38
tewardpenguin42: /var/log/nginx/* i think is still the log dir, but a service failure... no idea.17:38
tewardthe systemd stuff is new enough that it's a headahce :P17:38
teward(back later)17:38
=== Guest41550 is now known as mfisch
=== wgrant_ is now known as wgrant
=== kees_ is now known as kees

Generated by irclog2html.py 2.7 by Marius Gedminas - find it at mg.pov.lt!