[08:05] <stickyboy> gremble: sup
[08:10] <Kilos> hi stickyboy  gremble  
[08:13] <stickyboy> Kilos: https://nairobilug.or.ke/2015/04/ramping-up-ethiopia-lug.html
[08:13] <stickyboy> Fresh off the press...
[08:19] <gremble> Hey Kilos 
[08:21] <Kilos> hmm... stickyboy  
[08:21] <Kilos> you mentioned -za but not -africa
[08:21] <Kilos> why do i battle so
[08:22] <Kilos> but well written post
[08:23] <Kilos> you with all your ways of getting info out there can do wonders for the connecting africa project
[08:23] <Kilos> im not an advertising junkie
[08:25] <Kilos> in all the lugs there are ubuntu users whether it be on personal pcs , work pcs , or servers
[08:25] <Kilos> pull them out for us man
[08:25] <stickyboy> Kilos: Just be glad I mentioned Ubuntu more than once. ;)
[08:26] <Kilos> im gonna shout at you
[08:26] <stickyboy> I'll shout back. :D
[08:26] <Kilos> and i saw one person asking for a beginners linux cd
[08:26] <stickyboy> Your agenda is different than mine. :P
[08:27] <Kilos> what better than ubuntu
[08:27] <Kilos> what is your agenda
[08:28] <Kilos> no shouting allowed on this channel so its your lucky day
[08:28] <Kilos> :D
[08:31] <Kilos> there can only be one agenda, grow linux and supply support
[08:31]  * Kilos waits for a clever comment
[08:39] <stickyboy> You guys focus on Ubuntu too much.
[08:40] <stickyboy> I don't care, but for the fact that you claim to be pushing for Linux growth. :D
[08:40] <gremble> This is the ubuntu channel stickyboy :P
[08:40] <stickyboy> All this Ubuntu, LoCo, blah blah.
[08:40] <stickyboy> gremble: Irrelevant. :D
[08:40] <Kilos> well we are ubuntu-za but we dont mind having you guys around
[08:40] <stickyboy> His agenda is Ubuntu. :)
[08:40] <stickyboy> ubuntu-africa...
[08:41] <gremble> :P
[08:41] <stickyboy> I don't care, but you shouldn't pretend to be about pushing Linux.
[08:41] <stickyboy> If you want to be Ubuntu, be Ubuntu.
[08:41] <stickyboy> But don't pretend it's some grand, common vision.
[08:41] <stickyboy> You guys are VERY deep inside Ubuntu ecosystem.
[08:41] <Kilos> nono you missing the point completely
[08:41] <stickyboy> And kinda like fanboys.
[08:42] <gremble> Not necessarily
[08:42] <stickyboy> gremble: Hrm.
[08:42] <stickyboy> "nairobilug
[08:42] <stickyboy> "
[08:42] <stickyboy> "ubuntu-africa"... "ubuntu-za"
[08:42] <gremble> There are quite a few here that don't use Ubuntu, like me :P
[08:42] <stickyboy> "ugandalug"
[08:42] <Kilos> the point is to strengthen all linux in africa but we just started from ubuntu because thats who we are
[08:42] <gremble> I'm just here because it is an active LUG
[08:42] <stickyboy> Kilos: Ok. Fine. :D
[08:42] <gremble> in South Africa
[08:42] <stickyboy> gremble: It's a LoCo. ;)
[08:42] <stickyboy> Nairobi LUG is a LUG.
[08:43] <gremble> Same shit
[08:43] <stickyboy> Sure.
[08:43] <stickyboy> But you guys gotta reign in the fanboy vibe.
[08:43] <Kilos> lol
[08:43] <stickyboy> Kilos was talking about Ubuntu like Smeagle yesterday.
[08:43] <gremble> :P
[08:43] <stickyboy> My precioussssss.
[08:43] <Kilos> hahaha
[08:43] <stickyboy> And like football fans say "We won the cup" when they're talking about Man U.
[08:43] <stickyboy> ;)
[08:44] <stickyboy> Don't get me wrong, I use Ubuntu on allllll my webserver.
[08:44] <stickyboy> But I'm typing from a Mac where I have installed GNU coreutils cuz BSD coreutils are teh suck.
[08:44] <stickyboy> That's #winning for GNU software.
[08:44] <stickyboy> And that's part of the mission.
[08:44] <stickyboy> Also, sleeping on couches.
[08:45] <gremble> I need a new computer :/
[08:45] <Kilos> lol
[08:45] <stickyboy> Kilos: Did you see my reference to that on the post?
[08:45] <Kilos> yes to here
[08:45] <stickyboy> :P
[08:45] <Kilos> and sleeping on couches is good
[08:45] <Kilos> makes you appreciate getting home to your bed
[08:46] <Kilos> the only way to dethrone ms is if we all work together worldwide
[08:47] <Kilos> not in individual groups
[08:47] <Kilos> i even tried centos
[08:47] <Kilos> eeek
[08:49] <Kilos> we need to look beyong our borders and think of pulling in the office jack and school kids etc not just die hard linux users
[08:49] <Kilos> s/beyong/beyond
[08:50] <Kilos> am i wrong?
[08:53] <Kilos> i dont mind if you use redhat or arch as long as we have one common goal
[09:02] <gremble> emacs is weird :(
[09:07] <stickyboy> Kilos: My goal isn't to dethrone Microsoft. :P
[09:07] <stickyboy> I just want to promote free, libre, open-source software.
[09:07] <Kilos> and ours?
[09:07] <stickyboy> ;)
[09:07] <Kilos> same thing and only together will it be achieved
[10:36] <Kilos> haha i can get good laughs from reading logs
[10:37] <Kilos> the interaction between pro and i is sometimes hilarious
[10:38] <Kilos> morning superfly  
[12:16] <superfly> afternoon Kilos
[12:22] <inetpro> good mornings
[12:22] <inetpro> oh and hi superfly
[12:22] <Kilos> hi fly inetpro  
[12:22] <inetpro> and eh Kilos
[12:23]  * Kilos the afterthought
[12:23] <Kilos> mn revenge is sweet
[12:23] <Kilos> nm eiyher
[12:24] <inetpro> uh
[12:24] <Kilos> euther
[12:24] <Kilos> ai!
[12:24] <Kilos> either
[12:25] <inetpro> Kilos: I said good mornings to you before I greeted the fly
[12:27] <Kilos> where
[12:28] <Kilos> time and date
[12:29] <inetpro> Kilos: 04/26 14:22:27 <inetpro> good mornings
[12:31] <Kilos> thats to all lurkers
[12:32] <superfly> Hi inetpro 
[12:33]  * inetpro thought ubuntu-za = Kilos
[12:33] <Kilos> well you didnt state ubuntu-za either
[12:34] <Kilos> mornings includes fedora/redhat/arch and other lurkers
[12:35] <Kilos> i wish monkey could come back he might enjoy the remix with openbox
[12:36] <Kilos> how are you inetpro  my friend ?
[12:36] <Kilos> that includes family
[12:37] <inetpro> all good thank you
[12:37] <Kilos> and i looked today again at the beautiful blue eyes
[12:37] <inetpro> Kilos: yourself?
[12:37] <Kilos> im fine ty sir
[12:37] <Kilos> i just struggled when peeps attack my preciouuuus
[12:38] <Kilos> 10:43] <stickyboy> My precioussssss.
[12:38] <Kilos> hehe
[12:41] <Kilos> hi spinza  
[12:42] <Kilos> superfly  why is there a yahoo login by them flickr pics
[12:42] <Kilos> is flickr a yahoo thing
[12:44] <Kilos> and here that looks like ian with the kids
[12:44] <Kilos> https://www.flickr.com/photos/who_da_fly/15582309341/in/photostream/
[13:04] <superfly> Kilos: Yes, Yahoo owns Flickr 
[13:05] <Kilos> aha ty
[13:05] <superfly> It's about the only product they have that actually makes money 
[13:05] <Kilos> lol
[13:28] <Kilos> hi melodie  
[13:29] <melodie> salut Kilos !
[13:29] <Kilos> hehe
[13:29] <melodie> how are you?
[13:29] <Kilos> im good ty and you?
[13:32] <Kilos> ive been lazy today
[13:37] <melodie> ok
[13:38] <melodie> Kilos I'm good and got up very late
[13:38] <Kilos> you also went to bed very late
[13:39] <Kilos> so much to do and so little time
[13:39] <melodie> and lots of talking too, and watching a serie before sleeping also, all takes time! :D
[13:40] <Kilos> whew
[13:40] <georgelappies> hi Kilos
[13:40] <Kilos> hi georgelappies  
[13:51] <melodie> hi georgelappies 
[13:52] <Kilos> georgelappies  meet melodie  from the south of france
[13:52] <georgelappies> hi melodie
[13:52] <melodie> where are you from georgelappies ?
[13:53] <georgelappies> I am from Secunda, about 200km east of Johannesburg
[13:54] <georgelappies> https://www.google.co.za/maps/place/Secunda/@-26.5159425,29.1984939,13z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m2!3m1!1s0x1eeb12dc232c6f9b:0xd5e8665e3c84809?hl=en
[13:55] <melodie> so South Africa as Kilos ?
[13:55] <Kilos> yes
[13:56] <Kilos> only a few others here
[13:56] <georgelappies> the town's claim to fame is the largest coal to liquid petroleum refinery in the world ;p
[13:56] <georgelappies> yeah same as Kilos
[13:57] <georgelappies> although I suspect that Kilos is from a more buzling metropolis in South Africa
[13:58] <Kilos> lol
[13:59] <melodie> georgelappies your town produces petroleum?
[13:59] <Kilos> petrol from coal melodie  
[13:59] <Kilos> and other byproducts
[14:00] <melodie> is it to be a special coal?
[14:00] <Kilos> no only lots of it
[14:00] <georgelappies> well among other things, they take coal and make all sort of stuff out of it. Mainly diesel / petrol though
[14:00] <melodie> what do you use in your kitchen to cook? electricity?
[14:01] <Kilos> they also have the refineries of all our imported crude oil i think
[14:02] <georgelappies> Sasol (the company running the factory) was the first in the world to economically execute this process: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fischer%E2%80%93Tropsch_process
[14:02] <Kilos> georgelappies  you ever get bored?
[14:02]  * superfly has been to Secunda
[14:02] <melodie> diesel, coal, petroleum, are all bringing riches to a country, and in the meantime pollute and will bring the same countries to be extremely poor when it will run out of supplies one day future
[14:02] <Kilos> yip
[14:02] <georgelappies> melodie, I use gas but in South Africa that is not the norm. The norm is to use electricity for everything
[14:03] <georgelappies> lol, never Kilos. Always something to do
[14:03] <melodie> georgelappies I am in touch with an non for profit who deals with alternative ways, they teach the making of cookers using directly the sun for instance, and other things
[14:03] <Kilos> oh ok , im looking for someone to test melodie  s remix
[14:04] <georgelappies> s remix?
[14:04] <melodie> possibly some people creating fablabs and making them cookers would create themselves a nice job
[14:04] <melodie> georgelappies yes! let me show you
[14:04] <Kilos> openbox and ubuntu
[14:04] <melodie> top post: http://linuxvillage.org/en/
[14:04] <melodie> openbox and ubuntu made especially easy to use
[14:05] <Kilos> melodie  we  are slowly adding wind power generators and so on
[14:05] <melodie> Kilos big ones or small ones?
[14:05] <Kilos> big
[14:06] <melodie> you have people with tech skills in your country, don't you?
[14:06] <Kilos> and very large solar generators
[14:06] <Kilos> we have the best
[14:06] <melodie> I have seen the use of the Stirling engine on plate shaped solar generators
[14:06] <Kilos> but silicon valley keeps stealing from us
[14:06] <melodie> of course, it was supposed to be available ! in 2011 :-(
[14:07] <superfly> because the south african government is too stupid to realise the talent in their own back yard
[14:07] <melodie> then the company having the patents closed, the patents bought by I don't know who...
[14:07] <superfly> they would rather import chinese tech than promote innovation in RSA
[14:07] <melodie> superfly same in France... all nuts and clowns in the governement
[14:07] <Kilos> lol
[14:07] <georgelappies> very true superfly
[14:08]  * superfly works for a startup that exported their tech to the UK
[14:08] <superfly> I know a little bit about this.
[14:09] <georgelappies> that is the chinese way of doing bussiness, "let us build you a bridge / dam / school 'for free' and in exchange you provide us with 10mega tons of coal every year for ten years"
[14:11] <georgelappies> governments in Africa are selling resources that do not belong to them (it belongs to the nation and future generations) at dirt cheap prices in exchange for providing China with expansion and work opportunities in Africa
[14:11] <georgelappies> anyhow, enough politics
[14:11] <georgelappies> what is everybody up to on this Sunday afternoon?
[14:12] <superfly> latest release of my open source project
[14:12] <superfly> busy writing up the release notes
[14:12] <georgelappies> what is it superfly? link please ;)
[14:12] <superfly> http://openlp.org/
[14:14] <Kilos> melodie  how well do you know gsilve
[14:14] <Kilos> gsilva
[14:16] <georgelappies> superfly, that is very cool
[14:16] <superfly> ta
[14:17] <melodie> well he is someone I have known for a few months now, perhaps more than a year even. He had once offered to take care of the com for Bento, then had to give up for he was on something else, and now he is back and has started to take parts of it in charge
[14:17] <melodie> what is it you want to know exactly?
[14:18] <Kilos> well if he could sort th e lubuntu wiki pages i was wondering if he could take on the main ubuntu pages as well
[14:18] <Kilos> slowly of course
[14:18] <Kilos> will be a strong point in his favour for membership
[14:19] <Kilos> some of our pages are years out ot date
[14:19] <melodie> Kilos well, I am not a member and I don't have many people helping on a regular basis, and on the other side, he is very busy
[14:19] <Kilos> thats what i wanted to know ty
[14:20] <melodie> I am leading a very original project and very difficult to make people understand how it can hold together
[14:20] <Kilos> everyone is just too busy
[14:20] <melodie> we all need new energies 
[14:20] <melodie> :)
[14:20] <Kilos> lol yeah
[14:20] <melodie> do you have a mailing list for ubuntu-africa ?
[14:21] <Kilos> yes on um
[14:21] <Kilos> launchpad
[14:21] <melodie> ok
[14:21] <Kilos> it should show a link in the site
[14:22] <melodie> having new people help can be a matter of showing the doings ongoing and let the people ask what they can do to help
[14:22] <melodie> or write it down
[14:22] <melodie> well thinking of...
[14:23] <melodie> Kilos perhaps do you need to define the types of job leaders in your team
[14:23] <Kilos> https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-africa
[14:24] <Kilos> no i dont think so melodie  at the moment i am still trying to get all the countries together
[14:24] <superfly> Kilos is the leader
[14:24] <superfly> the rest of us are just worker bees
[14:24] <Kilos> rofl
[14:24] <melodie> Kilos if you use a linear approach you might loose precious opportunities talking about volunteers
[14:25] <melodie> if you use a vertical approach you would not be gathering the  countries of the continent, that would not be as good either
[14:26] <Kilos> i was thinking of first of all throwing them all in a pot and giving it a good shake and then see what comes out first
[14:26] <melodie> what you could do would be use a transversal approach as you already have several countries gathered and by doing so you may have the people from other countries interested to jump into the project as seeing the opportunities and ideas beyond the gathering fact
[14:27] <Kilos> oh yes elacheche is already doing the top end
[14:27] <melodie> superfly I am going to take a look at your project, I was waiting for the page to open
[14:27] <superfly> melodie: no problem :-)
[14:27] <melodie> Kilos I mean, if you list the types of skills needed for the project, on your wiki, that could be a good thing
[14:28] <melodie> wiki care taker, comm care taker and so on
[14:28] <Kilos> oh i see what you mean
[14:28] <Kilos> well you want to join us and see what can be done?
[14:29] <Kilos> i am a mechanic and farmer
[14:29] <Kilos> not many skills needed to get sheep and cows where you want them
[14:30] <melodie> superfly is that your work only or is it part of the startup you work for?
[14:30] <Kilos> oh we have a wiki caretaker
[14:30] <Kilos> inetpro  does that
[14:30] <melodie> very good!
[14:30] <superfly> melodie: I do that in my "spare" time - my startup is different
[14:32] <melodie> then you might want to start the list on a draft, and write who takes care of what and let the empty fields for the jobs to be taken. You would need to organise a special dedicated meeting on irc for the people on #ubuntu-africa to assist to, to all talk about that together and let the ideas get out and sparkle
[14:32] <melodie> superfly what does your startup do?
[14:32] <melodie> Kilos as a mecanics, have you heard about the open source wiki for building things by yourself? 
[14:33] <melodie> eco something, does that ring a bell?
[14:33] <superfly> melodie: http://nomanini.com - we provide a platform and a POS to sell prepaid services
[14:33]  * superfly mostly works on the management platform
[14:33] <melodie> is it an open source pos ?
[14:33] <Kilos> nope
[14:33] <superfly> nope, but it's not particularly complicated either
[14:34] <Kilos> mechanics only use the inetrnet to find parts for cars
[14:34] <melodie> Kilos you have here a whole community you would want to share with all the Ubuntu African communities, and plan to open FabLabs everywhere:
[14:34] <melodie> http://opensourceecology.org/wiki/Main_Page
 nope, but it's not particularly complicated either || what is?
[14:35] <melodie> Kilos allow me to quote the main part of the opensourceecology wiki here:
[14:35] <melodie> “Open Source Ecology is accelerating the growth of the next economy - the Open Source Economy - an economy that optimizes both production and distribution - while promoting environmental regeneration and social justice. We are building the Global Village Construction Set. This is a high-performance, modular, do-it-yourself, low-cost platform - that allows for the easy fabrication of the 50 different industrial machines that it takes - to build
[14:35] <melodie>  a small, sustainable civilization with modern comforts. ”
[14:36] <melodie> this is full Open Source, Free plans and methods to create numerous things for the farmers, the growsers, the small local industry and also the people
[14:36] <melodie> in France we start to have fablabs here and there and they allow people to go, and get an object done when there is no replacement for spare parts, for instance
[14:37] <Kilos> ok
[14:37] <melodie> the 3D printers are becoming so fashionable even our governement is planning to put a copy tax on them ! :-[
[14:37] <melodie> Kilos when I visited this wiki, I found it mind blowing! 
[14:39] <Kilos> whew superfly  and inetpro  must look at that, half of it i dont understand
[14:39] <superfly> melodie: it's a electronic device that has some stock management firmware on it. it's hardly a new idea, or a something complicated to set up.
[14:39] <Kilos> i can chat on irc and answer emails
[14:41] <melodie> Kilos I don't get into the details I don't understand either, it's mechanics and plans, things out of my reach, but to put it simply what it is about:
[14:43] <melodie> you get a large place to keep machines and material, and have people come there ; you create a non for profit association and make money which is used to by hardware, pay the charges and pay some people of the association who get a salary : on the other end, are people who come build what they need, using the plans. and they have their needed material for a cost much lower than in the current market
[14:43] <melodie> to by/to buy 
[14:43] <melodie> sorry
[14:44] <Kilos> oh you mean with 3d printers
[14:44] <melodie> it's kind of a geek garage if you want to summarise
[14:44] <melodie> the 3D printers is only one kind of tool there are other tools too
[14:44] <melodie> I'll try to show you:
[14:45] <Kilos> inetpro  look man
[14:45] <melodie> a very basic need in creation of tools is a metal melting furnace:
[14:45] <melodie> http://opensourceecology.org/wiki/Induction_Furnace
[14:46] <melodie> in the section "Details" you can read what it does:
[14:46] <melodie> "The advantage of the induction furnace is a clean, energy-efficient and well-controllable melting process compared to most other means of metal melting."
[14:46] <Kilos> yes i inderstand that
[14:46] <melodie> the rest is out of my reach and concern, I have provided here the summary for this part
[14:47] <melodie> once you have melted metal from cans or whatever metal that costs nothing that can be gathered, you can poor the metal in some molds to make what you need 
[14:47] <Kilos> i understand the mechanical things well, just remember we are in power and cash crisis time in za
[14:48] <melodie> Kilos this situation is everywhere
[14:48] <melodie> the whole world 
[14:48] <Kilos> i used to make molds for car body parts when i was at nissan za
[14:48] <melodie> see? you have incredible skills
[14:48] <Kilos> jigs is the correct word
[14:48] <melodie> and you also know how to gather people :D
[14:49] <Kilos> lol
[14:49] <melodie> jigs? Instead of?
[14:49] <Kilos> molds
[14:49] <melodie> oh?
[14:49] <Kilos> actually molds is right for the molten metal
[14:49] <melodie> Kilos so now you have a new exploration field with the ecology opensource wiki, but... well it's not the end !
[14:50] <melodie> I got something else in the magic bag ! :D
[14:50] <Kilos> then the sheets you get from there go into jigs  to stamp out the parts you need
[14:50] <Kilos> nono girl you exploding my head
[14:50] <melodie> yes, that's technic, not my concern. I don't produce, I don't "make"
[14:50] <melodie> Kilos what about a video then? that can be resting? :D
[14:51] <melodie> a video about the next topic, the modern ways of using animals at work?
[14:51] <Kilos> no data for videos, your remix ate that
[14:51] <Kilos> one step at a time
[14:51] <melodie> yes the next remix will have the codecs for the sound and the video, this one doesn't
[14:52] <Kilos> i have 14.04 kubuntu that can do anything
[14:52] <Kilos> only data restrains me
[14:52] <melodie> videos on youtube don't need much to work now, without flash
[14:52] <Kilos> and my head
[14:52] <melodie> you need to install firefox
[14:52] <melodie> and in firefox add the plugin html5
[14:53] <Kilos> nono i dont like firefox
[14:53] <Kilos> i use chrome epiphany and opera browser
[14:54] <Kilos> i also dont look at youtube videos
[14:55] <melodie> there are more and more fashionable for communication
[14:55] <Kilos> but drop your link here someone will go see and tell me about it
[14:55] <melodie> people want to watch videos rather than reading texts and images in tutorials for example, or see conferences rather than going far to attend to them and many more things
[14:55] <melodie> ok
[14:58] <stickyboy> Ask me if I just bought 4 KGs of coffee in Addis.
[14:58] <Kilos> lol
[14:59] <melodie> http://hippotese.free.fr/blog/
[15:00] <Kilos> we were farming that way 200 years ago
[15:00] <Kilos> some small farmers still do
[15:01] <Kilos> the mule needs good grass and lots of it
[15:01] <Kilos> no grass here in winter
[15:03] <Kilos> and try guiding that plow for 2 hours only, never mind every day for a month
[15:03] <melodie> the people in several non for profit, present on these pages the tools which have been improved since the old times, as they are issued from a mix between improved engines traction, maths doing, and lots of testing
[15:04] <melodie> the main page is a bit messy because they don't use categories or any kind of sitemap on this blog, but it was an improvement compared to their old website:
[15:04] <melodie> http://hippotese.free.fr/
[15:05] <melodie> my bad they have categories
[15:05] <Kilos> ive been there and done those things
[15:06] <Kilos> after a day of plowing you struggle to get out of bed the next morning
[15:06] <melodie> they also have small carriages where the man is sitting while the horse pulls
[15:06] <melodie> they are expensive to buy also
[15:07] <Kilos> i used to own horses too
[15:07] <Kilos> friesian and arab
[15:07] <melodie> for the horses they have invented special parts which lowers the effort of the animal and allows it to provide up to 25% more result
[15:07] <melodie> friesian are the big black ones with curly hair?
[15:08] <Kilos> not curly hair but black yes and they are big
[15:08] <melodie> well I know it's very physical, true. I have learned horse carriage and have even a diploma
[15:08] <Kilos> good for pulling carts
[15:08] <melodie> yes, very good
[15:08] <melodie> I think they are what in French we name "frisons"
[15:09] <melodie> I didn't know the name in English
[15:09] <Kilos> maybe ill try find them
[15:09] <Kilos> there are many stud breeders in za
[15:09] <melodie> ok
[15:09] <Kilos> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Friesian_horse
[15:10] <melodie> I see in the hippotese blog there is a link to translate google on the right side, to have the blog in English: "Translate in english"
[15:10] <Kilos> beautiful animals
[15:11] <melodie> yes! https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frison_%28cheval%29
[15:11] <melodie> I got it right about the word in French
[15:12] <Kilos> nice
[15:13] <Kilos> and the arabs just want to run
[15:13] <Kilos> same as racehorses
[15:13] <Kilos> well thats where racehorses come from iirc
[15:14] <melodie> exactly
[15:14] <melodie> the arabian horses are used to improve/modify other races of horses
[15:14] <melodie> such as the fjord
[15:14] <melodie> or the merens
[15:16] <Kilos> i crossed them and the result was excellent intelligent horses for herding sheep and cattle
[15:17] <Kilos> and not scared to give a lazy bull a bitr on the bum to get him moving
[15:17] <Kilos> bite
[15:19] <melodie> oh! are you sure you haven't bread them with some shepperd dog? XD
[15:19] <melodie> nice!
[15:19] <Kilos> lol
[15:19] <melodie> so did you bread friasian with arabian? 
[15:19] <Kilos> yes
[15:19] <melodie> what kind of arabian had you exactly?
[15:19] <Kilos> haha a black mare
[15:20] <melodie> ok
[15:20] <Kilos>  and some other boerperde
[15:20] <melodie> if that's a breed
[15:20] <melodie> "boerperde" ?
[15:20] <melodie> what is perde or boerperde ?
[15:20] <Kilos> http://www.saboerperd.com/
[15:20]  * melodie is reading parts of http://opensourceecology.org/wiki/Bioplastics
[15:20] <Kilos> perd is afrikaans for horse
[15:21] <melodie> clicked on your link waiting
[15:22] <Kilos> mine is open long time
[15:22] <Kilos> fix your connection
[15:22] <melodie> they look very beautiful, especially the black with grey hair
[15:22] <melodie> it's ok I'm putting it into translate google now
[15:23] <Kilos> http://www.theequinest.com/breeds/boerperd/
[15:23] <Kilos> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boer_pony
[15:24] <Kilos> very tough horses, often used for marathons here
[15:25] <stickyboy> Kilos: Do South Africans despise Africa?
[15:25] <Kilos> no stickyboy  why
[15:26] <stickyboy> Kilos: I hear stories about people leaving SA, like Kenyans, and people say "Oh, you're going back to Africa".
[15:26] <Kilos> am i not talking to you?
[15:26] <melodie> stickyboy where are you from?
[15:26] <stickyboy> And some DJ has a shoutout on the Kenyan radio like, "Hey this is DJ blah blah from the motherland Africa -- well, South Africa -- blah blah"
[15:26] <Kilos> there are a few hundred hooligans the used xenophobia as an excuse to loot the shops
[15:27] <melodie> Kilos http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boer_pony
[15:27] <stickyboy> melodie: I'm from the USA, I live in Kenya, and I'm currently in Addis Ababa drinking the best coffee in the world. :P
[15:27] <melodie> is that the boerperd you were talking about, or is it rather what they refer to as "Cape Boerperd" ?
[15:28] <melodie> stickyboy who here cares about the xenophobes? I have asked Kilos to do a special meditation before sleeping about an idea related to a "foss country" or that kind! :D
[15:29] <stickyboy> "Outgroup hostility" happens in every country.
[15:29] <stickyboy> People get weird about money.
[15:29] <melodie> stickyboy about coffee I'll grab a cup. Well do they have organic coffee in Addis Ababa?
[15:29] <stickyboy> It has nothing to do about Africa or whatever. I hate that "we are all Africans" shit.
[15:30] <melodie> people can be or get weird about mostly anything
[15:30] <Kilos> there is a boerperd breeders organization and they often share or sell stallions to each other to improve the breed
[15:31] <melodie> superfly I have looked at the website of your company, and I don't quite see who are their clients?
[15:32] <melodie> and what is it they call "airtime" ?
[15:32] <Kilos> airtime is the cash you pay for cell phones
[15:33] <melodie> ok
[15:33] <Kilos> to keep them on the air that is
[15:33] <melodie> you mean the card ?
[15:33] <melodie> the time you will be able to spend using the phone?
[15:34] <Kilos> the money you put on the sim card
[15:34] <melodie> the connection then
[15:34] <melodie> ok
[15:34] <Kilos> yes the connection fee
[15:34] <melodie> I'll brb, have to fetch wood for the stove 
[15:34] <melodie> begins to be cold here
[15:34] <Kilos> ok
[15:59] <melodie> superfly from this video, https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=qAXHtaDafn8 is it that the device allows being paid with the the NFC feature of the phones? Or have I not understood it all?
[16:01] <superfly> melodie: is for cash based transactions. Our target market is Africa, which has a distinct lack of smart phones 
[16:04] <melodie> aha
[16:05] <melodie> I saw this client in the video with the phone in his hand, so he was probably just buying airtime for his phone?
[16:06] <melodie> superfly the part which I don't understand now, is that the shop helder obviously has a full fledged POS besides the small nomanini, so why can't he use the same POS for all the kinds of transations? 
[16:06] <melodie> what is special about nomanini in fact?
[16:07] <melodie> besides the flashy colors and the ease to use? :)
[16:07] <superfly> In short : a lot. 
[16:07] <superfly> On my phone with a baby in my arms. A bit difficult to type 
[16:08] <superfly> And the other is not a POS, it's a cash register 
[16:08] <Kilos> melodie  https://www.flickr.com/photos/who_da_fly/page1/
[16:09]  * Kilos dunno what a POS is
[16:09] <melodie> superfly 12 buttons means 12 kinds of products pre-registered in the terminal?
[16:09] <melodie> *that can be
[16:10] <superfly> Kilos: point of sale 
[16:10] <melodie> superfly over here in France the POS and cash register are all in one
[16:10] <Kilos> ty
[16:10] <superfly> melodie: Yes, but this is Africa, not France 
[16:10] <melodie> superfly so I am trying to understand how all that works
[16:11] <melodie> have you heard about lemonpos ?
[16:11] <melodie> it's a gpl'd pos
[16:12] <superfly> melodie: Sorry, I'm sick in bed at the moment. I'll be happy to answer all your questions when I'm back at my PC
[16:13] <melodie> superfly oh, sorry!
[16:13] <melodie> take good care and fast recovery!
[16:14] <superfly> melodie: in short: in Africa there is no (or bad) Internet, no smartphones, and few computers. 
[16:15] <melodie> I have helped a non for profit last september, here in South West France, prepare computers to send to Mali
[16:15] <superfly> And everything is prepaid. 
[16:15] <melodie> superfly this guy on the video holds a shop with lots of items, does he put a sticker on each item to have the price on it?
[16:16] <melodie> ok and few computers and bad connections can also mean the cybershops can be numerous
[16:16] <melodie> there is a program meant for managing cybershops, working under Linux, I did a special Bento Mkahawa last year
[16:16] <melodie> I don't know if it has been spread though
[16:17] <melodie> ok, I let you rest, we can talk later, in the next days, no hurry
[17:17] <melodie> does someone here have a machine with uefi and using Ubuntu on it? I would like to try making a Bento Edition with efi-boot packages installed in it and I have no way to test if that would work
[17:36] <Kilos> hmm...
[17:39] <Langjan> Hi Kilos and the team, are you enjoying your long weekend?
[17:40] <Kilos> hi Langjan  looks like it hey
[17:40] <Langjan> Or is it a case of no rest for the wicked? 
[17:40] <Langjan> Lmga
[17:41] <Kilos> lol
[17:41] <Kilos> werk als?
[17:41] <Langjan> Well aren't you going to ask what have I broken? 
[17:42] <Langjan> You beat me to it...
[17:42] <Kilos> ^^
[17:42] <Kilos> hahaha
[17:42] <Langjan> Skaam jou and that after inviting me to drop in and say hello
[17:42] <Langjan> Uitgevang ne
[17:43] <Kilos> lol sorry man, how are you sir
[17:43] <Langjan> Just pulling your highly-pullable leg Kilos, fine thks and you?
[17:43] <Kilos> im good ty very much
[17:44] <Kilos> happy to see all is good there, you had my head spinning the other day
[17:44] <Langjan> Great stuff, and no I have'nt broken anything. Glo dit as jy wil 
[17:44] <Kilos> i believe you
[17:44]  * inetpro \o/
[17:44] <Kilos> and the pro too
[17:44] <Kilos> haha
[17:44] <inetpro> goeienaand oom Langjan
[17:45] <Langjan> Hi daar inetpro als wel by jou?
[17:45] <inetpro> ten minste nog iemand wat die ander oom kan pla :-)
[17:45] <Langjan> Ja die ou man moet wakker gehou word
[17:46] <Kilos> hahaha
[17:47] <Langjan> Kilos help weer asb
[17:47] <Langjan> Hoe kry jy die name op irc ingetik?
[17:47] <Langjan> het weer vergeet
[17:47] <Langjan> ouderdom 
[17:47] <Langjan> probleem is nie oud nie dis die dom
[17:47] <Kilos> jy tik eerste drie letters en slaan tab
[17:48] <Langjan> ine 
[17:48] <inetpro> Langjan: so terloops hy het 'n nuwe franse meisie ontmoet... gesels lang stories met haar
[17:48]  * inetpro sukkel om op te vang
[17:48] <Langjan> werk nie
[17:48] <Kilos> ai!
[17:48] <Kilos> inetpro  
[17:48] <Langjan> ine wat is die tab
[17:48] <inetpro> lol
[17:48] <Kilos> werk hier
[17:48] <Langjan> ine
[17:48] <Kilos> tab is daai ding bo caps lock
[17:48] <inetpro> oops... sorry oom Kilos
[17:48] <Langjan> inetpro, 
[17:49] <Langjan> daashy Kilos 
[17:49] <Langjan> dankie man
[17:49] <Kilos> mooi oom jy kom reg
[17:49] <Langjan> ek sen daar staan tab
[17:49] <Langjan> sien
[17:49] <Kilos> lol
[17:49] <Langjan> Kilos, 
[17:49] <Kilos> inetpro  sal se rtfs 
[17:49] <Langjan> moi man sal nou onthou
[17:49] <Kilos> of rtfk hier
[17:50] <inetpro> Kilos: nee dit sal wees RTFK
[17:50] <inetpro> snap
[17:50] <Kilos> haha
[17:50] <Langjan> wat is dit?
[17:50] <Langjan> RTFK
[17:50] <Kilos> read the freeking keyboard
[17:50] <inetpro> Maaz: rtfs
[17:50] <Maaz> Read the Freaking Source/Spec/Screen
[17:50] <Langjan> Ek kry sooibrand van al die Ingels
[17:51] <Langjan> Hi Maaz 
[17:51] <inetpro> die ander ene is RTFM
[17:51] <inetpro> M = Manual
[17:51] <Langjan> manual
[17:51] <inetpro> of M = man page
[17:51] <Kilos> oom jan het jy n spaar pc waar jy iets kan toets
[17:52] <Kilos> dis 14.04 lyk my maar lyk soos gnome2
[17:52] <Kilos> hier is n tannie hier wat dit bewerk
[17:53] <inetpro> Kilos: hoekom nie net Ubuntu Mate nie?
[17:53] <Langjan> Wel my skootrekenaat loop op 14.04, wat wil jy toets?
[17:53] <Kilos> http://phillw.net/isos/bento-ubuntu-remix/sushi-trusty-rc4-i686-3.13.0-49-2014.04.2.iso
[17:53] <Kilos> sy probeer alle bugs regmaak voor sy dit release
[17:54] <Kilos> melodie  learn afrikaans quick
[17:54] <Kilos> langjan is 72
[17:54] <melodie> do I?
[17:54] <inetpro> Kilos: sy sit seker daar en vertaal die hele gesprek :-)
[17:55] <Langjan> Beter so as dat ek sooibrand kry
[17:55] <Langjan> Kil
[17:55] <Kilos> im trying to get him to try bento for you
[17:55] <Kilos> melodie  are you wearing out google translate
[17:56] <melodie> Kilos what is to be said about Bento is that it is aiming to be super fast and also to be a very easy basis to make it whatever you need to, ie: internet cafe (done before with mkahawa), install gnome apps, install kde apps, without any trouble and can also be used to make your own remixes that works too
[17:56] <melodie> Kilos "wearing out google translate" ? what does that mean?
[17:56] <Kilos> Langjan  ^^
[17:56] <inetpro> sorry melodie but you'll have to translate that to Afrikaans for oom Langjan
[17:56] <Langjan> Kilos, ek gaan nie nou daai iso aflaai nie my data vir die maand loop naby einde en ek het nie nou tyd of lus vir sulke toetse nie
[17:56] <Kilos> translating all the afrikaans
[17:57] <melodie> Langjan I don't know afrikaans at all
[17:57] <Kilos> ok maar spaar die lienk toppie
[17:57] <Langjan> Sounds good MEL BUT NO RIGHT NOW
[17:57] <melodie> I am French and use English to communicate to the rest of the world
[17:57] <Langjan> sorry I ht caps lock instead of tab, melodie 
[17:58] <melodie> Kilos what could become soon an issue is the efi/uefi thing, as Bento does not have the packages for it installed, but I'd like to find testers for that then will try install the packages prior to build
[17:58] <inetpro> melodie: oom Langjan is probably the most senior member of our team here
[17:58] <Langjan> Im Afrikaans and use Afrikaans. Even the Japs are learning it now
[17:58] <melodie> Langjan caps-lock day is paste ^^
[17:58] <Kilos> you need someone with new pc then melodie  
[17:58] <melodie> Langjan I'm not Jap :-(
[17:58] <Langjan> what does that mean melodie ?
[17:58] <melodie> Kilos and not afraid to do breakage too
[17:59] <Kilos> he breaks things often melodie  
[17:59] <melodie> Langjan I am new on the za and africa chans and I have not learned new languages since a long time
[17:59] <Langjan> Die boeremanier, ordentlik
[17:59] <Kilos> but thats good because then he comes here
[17:59] <Langjan> Jy lieg nou
[17:59] <Kilos> lol
[18:00] <Kilos> i love this channel
[18:00] <inetpro> oom Kilos hy gaan jou begin vloek nou
[18:00] <Kilos> nee nee hy dink altyd van die toekoms
[18:00] <Langjan> melodie,  im saying Kilos  is liar
[18:00] <Kilos> boere are clever people
[18:00] <inetpro> ai!
[18:01] <Langjan> because toonight I came in peace, not in pieces
[18:01] <Kilos> they dont burn bridges they might need to come back over
[18:01] <melodie> is afrikaans a mixture of languages? 
[18:01] <melodie> it looks like english, german and northern languages
[18:01] <Kilos> it is what developed from dutch here
[18:01] <Langjan> No, it's the youngest new language in the world
[18:01] <melodie> ^_o
[18:02] <Langjan> Kilos,  nou soek jy k.k
[18:02] <Kilos> dutch and english and some other languages too i think
[18:02] <Kilos> ol
[18:02] <Kilos> lol ook
[18:03] <Langjan> That's why the University of Japan has started an Afrikaans faculty 
[18:03] <Kilos> Langjan  dit you save that link
[18:03] <Langjan> and are working on an Afrikaans / Japanese dictionary, inter alia
[18:03] <Langjan> The iso?
[18:04] <Langjan> No but I will for future reference
[18:04] <Kilos> yes man
[18:04] <Langjan> melodie,  is it a good place for new lubuntu users to start?o
[18:04] <inetpro> Rich in idiom and emotion, Afrikaans was born 340 years ago in the homes of South Africa's white Dutch, German and French settlers. Not only is it the world's youngest national language, it is one of the smallest, with just 13 million speakers
[18:04] <Kilos> did you enjoy 10.10 Langjan  
[18:05] <melodie> Langjan wait
[18:05] <Langjan> I have a candidate but have contemplated mint for him
[18:05] <Kilos> nono man
[18:05] <Kilos> im running it and it is good
[18:05] <melodie> Langjan he can use Lubuntu, Xubuntu, or Mint, and if the machine has low resources you can try Bento
[18:05] <melodie> the Trusty version will be finished in not long I think
[18:05] <Kilos> and melodie  is very helpful with help
[18:05] <melodie> is a RC now
[18:06] <Langjan> Whaats an RC?
[18:06] <inetpro> melodie: what is the size of your ISO?
[18:06] <Kilos> 500
[18:06] <Langjan> remember I'm an old toppie, not used to this jargon
[18:07] <Langjan> RC?
[18:07] <melodie> inetpro it's 455 but a RC does not have all the needed packages yet 
[18:07] <melodie> ie : no codecs
[18:07] <melodie> release candidate, testing
[18:07]  * inetpro will probably have to test it at some point
[18:07] <inetpro> or I'll never hear the end of it from Kilos
[18:07] <melodie> rc4
[18:07] <Kilos> 469meg inetpro  
[18:08] <inetpro> don't have enough data to download but maybe at work later in the week
[18:08] <inetpro> or late at night
[18:09] <Kilos> uses openbox thing over ubuntu
[18:09] <Langjan> melodie,  I want him to migrate as effortlessly as possible, he does not have time to mess around with systems, is a serious writer and academic
[18:09] <Kilos> look squite cool too
[18:09] <Langjan> has sufficient resources
[18:10] <inetpro> Langjan: what is he using at the moment?
[18:10] <Kilos> it comes with all the office stuff as default
[18:10] <Langjan> Win, I suspect Win 7
[18:10] <Langjan> not sure
[18:10] <inetpro> hmm...
[18:11] <Kilos> i think the 10.10 interface was easiest to migrate with
[18:11] <Langjan> Perhaps I should check on all his data, resources current OS then get back
[18:11] <Kilos> only the stuff is at the bottom here
[18:12] <inetpro> Langjan: if he has proper hardware I would recommend KDE every day
[18:12] <Kilos> menu button where win start button
[18:13] <melodie> Langjan the best for him is what you know best, because you are the one in charge to help him after migration
[18:13] <melodie> this is the most important thing to know about helping new comers
[18:13] <inetpro> but I would still recommend LTS releases rather than anything else
[18:13] <Langjan> That was in my head also melodie 
[18:13] <melodie> if he can ask help on forums ? if he can ask help on chans ? if he can't can you help him as many times as he will need?
[18:14] <melodie> and if he is far can you install tiny-vnc or teamviewer and help him remotely?
[18:14] <melodie> can he learn basic administration, are you going to setup the updates to be automated? 
[18:14] <Langjan> Yes except that he is 2 hours from me so yes, teamviewer will be great 
[18:14] <Kilos> melody he can install teamviewer and you can help
[18:15] <melodie> do you need to check the frequency updates are going to be setup for him in the gui tool meant for that ?
[18:15] <inetpro> ai!
[18:15] <Kilos> i was planning that but it works good
[18:15] <melodie> Kilos sorry I don't have experience with teamviewer but I guess it should not be difficult to find instructions on the website itself
[18:16] <Langjan> melodie,  I need to acquaint myself with auto updates
[18:16] <melodie> https://www.teamviewer.com/en/download/linux.aspx
[18:16] <Kilos> teamviewer is simple
[18:16] <Kilos> you take over the other pc as admin if you know the password
[18:16] <melodie> https://www.teamviewer.com/en/help/index.aspx
[18:17] <melodie> Langjan what if you try Bento remix for yourself, and see if it could fit the need? that's to say if you get along well with it?
[18:17] <inetpro> connections are routed through TeamViewer GmbH's router network 
[18:17] <melodie> I have installed it to several end user's machines around my place and it's been fast enough to get them used to it (the precise version)
[18:18] <inetpro> and have been used to commit fraud via telephone calls
[18:18] <inetpro> Kilos: be warned ^^!!!
[18:19] <Langjan> melodie,  frankly I dont have the time or inclination to get into an unknown OS at this stage 
[18:19] <Kilos> i dont make fone calls and only allow known peeps to see my pc
[18:19] <inetpro> jaja
[18:19] <Kilos> haha
[18:19] <Kilos> only one ever viewed here was fly
[18:20] <Kilos> i may be stupid but im not a fool
[18:20]  * inetpro justsaying
[18:20] <melodie> Langjan it looks like Lubuntu has a similar feel and is lighter
[18:20] <melodie> Langjan maybe later, when the full blown will be out then? :)
[18:21] <Langjan> Kilos,  is there a difference? Lmga
[18:21] <Langjan> OK will keep in touch melodie 
[18:21] <Kilos> difference in what?
[18:21] <Kilos> oh
[18:21] <Kilos> haha
[18:21] <Langjan> dom en gek
[18:21] <Kilos> ya man
[18:22] <Kilos> the stupid oke loses one wheels nuts but the fool showed him to take one off each of the other wheels for that wheel
[18:22] <inetpro> lol
[18:23] <melodie> Langjan may I? Here is a full presentation of the Precise when it was just a rc: http://linuxvillage.org/en/2013/11/bento-ubuntu-remix-rc/
[18:26] <Langjan> Ok thks melodie  will have a look
[18:26] <Langjan> Guys I'm gonna love and leave you before I get the urge to break something
[18:26] <Kilos-> ok toppie
[18:26] <melodie> :D
[18:26] <Kilos-> stay well
[18:26] <inetpro> nag oom
[18:27] <Langjan> Thanks you also
[18:27] <inetpro> Kilos: wat het jy gebreek?
[18:27] <Kilos> melodie toppie =very old man
[18:27] <Langjan> lekker werk en dan slaap julle 
[18:27] <Kilos> i went to bento to make screenshot
[18:27] <Langjan> wies die vom?
[18:27] <Kilos> oom man kan jy nie deur typos sien nie
[18:28] <Langjan> nee 
[18:28] <Kilos> lol
[18:28] <Kilos> lekker slaap vriend
[18:28] <Langjan> dankie jy ook my pel 
[18:29] <Kilos> sien jou weer binnekort
[18:29] <melodie> Kilos thanks
[18:29] <Kilos> hopelik voor jy iets breek
[18:29] <Kilos> np melodie  
[18:29] <Kilos> we will find peeps to try
[18:29] <Kilos> it works good for me
[18:30] <Kilos> and uses same ubuntu repos so everything one needs is available i think
[18:30] <Kilos> inetpro  at wget -c
[18:31] <stickyboy> Kilos: What kind of Internet do you have at the house?
[18:31] <Kilos> 3g
[18:32] <Kilos> thats why i dont do youtube or such things
[18:32] <inetpro> stickyboy: what do you have?
[18:32] <melodie> Kilos I have done a full upgrade to Vivid on one of my installs, it didn't break anything
[18:33] <Kilos> with bento melodie  
[18:33] <stickyboy> Kilos: Yah, I was wondering if you had restrictions (I wanted you to test wget speed to ZA Ubuntu mirrors).
[18:33] <stickyboy> inetpro: At my house in Nairobi I have 10mbps cable.
[18:33] <melodie> and if we find a willing tester for uefi I will make a special version for that, only for testing (same as your's no extra packages, just the added grub-efi and such)
[18:33] <Kilos> we use kenya mirror stickyboy  
[18:33] <melodie> Kilos of course with Bento
[18:33] <stickyboy> Kilos: Whoa, really? Damn...
[18:33] <inetpro> stickyboy: wow! What do you pay for that if I may ask?
[18:33] <melodie> do-release-upgrade -d ( a few days ago just before Vivid came out)
[18:34] <Kilos> we use symmetrias mirrors
[18:34] <Kilos> i ry stick to lts melodie  
[18:34] <Kilos> try
[18:35] <Kilos> even have 12.04 running still
[18:35] <melodie> Kilos and the Precise version can work on machines with the crummy old Sis chipset (possibly the packages for graphics are fit, whereas the ones in Trusty not anymore)
[18:35] <stickyboy> inetpro: Uh... 4300 KES (~550 rand?).
[18:35] <inetpro> nice!
[18:35] <Kilos> mine has sis
[18:35] <stickyboy> Kilos: Why do you guys use Symmetria's mirrors? I'm super curious...
[18:36] <Kilos> because our main 2 arent maintained
[18:36] <melodie> Kilos I have to test ahead, because Vivid has now the packages I've been wanting in the repos for so long, so I test (and the next Openbox is also on test in that one machine)
[18:36] <Kilos> yes melodie  but one needs uncapped to play like that
[18:37] <melodie> Kilos also Bento Precise is available in several versions and can be used, if you don't need all the very latest apps (it can last until 2017)
[18:37] <melodie> Kilos what is "uncapped" ?
[18:37] <Kilos> i used to clean install each release but data costs killed me
[18:37] <Kilos> no limit
[18:37] <Kilos> i try go 2 months on 2g of  data
[18:38] <gremble> o/
[18:38] <melodie> Kilos in the coming times you would want to send me your mail address and I could post CD's or a USB stick with ISOs on it, and you can share them around
[18:38] <Kilos> hi gremble  
[18:38] <melodie> or to someone in charge who can spread them to you and to the LoCo
[18:38] <gremble> Mailing won't work
[18:38] <gremble> :x
[18:38] <melodie> gremble ?
[18:38] <melodie> how long does it take?
[18:38] <Kilos> melodie  our loco cover about 2000ks of land
[18:38] <stickyboy> Kilos: Wow, what's happening that the ZA Ubuntu mirrors aren't maintained? That's a sad state of affairs.
[18:39] <gremble> The South African Postal Service is probably dead
[18:39] <stickyboy> https://www.23andme.com/gen101/snps/ What is a SNP?
[18:39] <melodie> uh?
[18:39] <stickyboy> :P
[18:39] <Kilos> yes thats why we pointed them to andrews mirrors
[18:39] <stickyboy> I got my genome sequenced last week.
[18:39] <gremble> That's nice
[18:39] <stickyboy> melodie: Where are you living?
[18:40] <gremble> melodie: The South African postal service hasn't worked for more than a year, I think
[18:40] <melodie> stickyboy south west France
[18:40] <gremble> Mail is dead
[18:40] <melodie> Kilos do you confirm?
[18:41] <Kilos> yes i didnt get my mark signed certificate
[18:41] <melodie> when was it sent to you?
[18:41] <Kilos> about 2 months ago
[18:41] <gremble> About 10 000 students at the university of pretoria did not get their acceptance letters last year :P
[18:41] <melodie> aha
[18:41] <melodie> gremble wao !
[18:41] <stickyboy> melodie: Oh!
[18:41] <melodie> what does Canonical do for that?
[18:42] <Kilos> times are touch in za with all the strikes
[18:42] <melodie> well he is from South Africa after all!
[18:42] <Kilos> they only send one
[18:42] <melodie> aha
[18:42] <melodie> Kilos do you know when it has been sent?
[18:43] <Kilos> no melodie  i havent asked even
[18:43] <melodie> oh 2 months you said
[18:43] <Kilos> yoo sad
[18:43] <Kilos> thats when i asked for one
[18:43] <melodie> so you don't know when it was sent
[18:43] <melodie> well well
[18:43] <Kilos> no
[18:44] <melodie> I guess each country has it's own special set of issues
[18:44] <Kilos> yeah
[18:44] <melodie> we should adress them in a wordly social bugzilla 
[18:44] <melodie> and submit patches ! 
[18:44] <melodie> :D
[18:44] <Kilos> lol
[18:44] <gremble> The US does that with armed drone strikes
[18:44] <gremble> I don't think it works well
[18:45] <melodie> gremble awful
[18:45] <melodie> the result are awful on both sides I have read their pilots get nervous breakdowns
[18:46] <gremble> Yup. 
[18:46] <gremble> Killing is not nice
[18:46] <melodie> Kilos do you think private companies work better?
[18:47] <Kilos> yes here they do atm
[18:47] <inetpro> Kilos: btw, I know the fly will hit me for saying this but you might want to wait just a bit before upgrading to Kubuntu 15.04
[18:47] <Kilos> but all poloticians are crooks and liars
[18:47] <Kilos> im happy with 14.04 inetpro  
[18:48] <Kilos> i read some stuff about plasma5
[18:48] <Kilos> politicians
[18:48] <inetpro> still has a few stability issues that I haven't quite figured out yet but not very serious
[18:48] <melodie> Kilos I was wondering if creating or using a non for profit existing association could put distros isos and so one on amazon and have them sent directly for small fees, could help
[18:49] <melodie> how long would it take to be delivered from there?
[18:49] <inetpro> Kilos: oh and it only has a few widgets by default, not sure if you use those
[18:49] <Kilos> melodie  we have a very large country and if the post office probs continue we wont even be able to mail out the 16.04 official dvds
[18:50] <Kilos> hmm...
[18:50] <inetpro> melodie: you trying to change our channel to a LUG?
[18:50] <Kilos> i added some for some or other reason
[18:51] <gremble> >.<
[18:51] <inetpro> gremble: sshhh
[18:51] <gremble> In all technical definitions of the term it is one :/
[18:51] <gremble> haha
[18:52] <melodie> inetpro I am not trying anything, just exchanging ideas about how to better make the people benefit of Ubuntu and variants
[18:52] <Kilos> hehe
[18:52] <inetpro> clever girl :-)
[18:53] <melodie> Kilos ok the postal service is a big big problem. Maybe another idea coming, not sure:
[18:53] <melodie> the people all around the country have cars don't they?
[18:53] <gremble> I have one!
[18:53] <gremble> I go on holiday..I mean a trip to get the CD's in France and bring them back
[18:53] <gremble> I will need a sponsorship though
[18:54] <gremble> viva-ubuntu
[18:54] <melodie> :)
[18:54] <Kilos> lol
[18:54] <melodie> there are countries in Africa where the situation isn't that bad
[18:54] <inetpro> Kilos: he needs membership for sure
[18:54] <Kilos> who
[18:54] <inetpro> Kilos: gremble
[18:54] <Kilos> oh ya
[18:54] <gremble> :x
[18:55] <gremble> I said nothing
[18:55] <melodie> Kilos you are working on getting people in touch if each one brings his CD's and isos to install parties you will at some point have a mean to spread the distros around
[18:55] <inetpro> with bright ideas like that we can not afford to loose him
[18:55] <gremble> inetpro: whatever happened to the documentation project that was on the mailing lists?
[18:56] <Kilos> melodie  za is 2000 kilometers top to bottom
[18:56] <melodie> twice larger than France
[18:56] <Kilos> and not much less side to side
[18:56] <melodie> do people do co-coaching with their cars?
[18:56] <melodie> not the right word
[18:56] <melodie> seeking for a better one
[18:56] <melodie> co-driving?
[18:56] <gremble> France is larger than ZA
[18:56] <gremble> I do
[18:56] <gremble> Carpool 
[18:57] <melodie> the idea is there
[18:57] <melodie> Kilos what if I produce zsync files for Bento, would that help you keep it up to date?
[18:57] <Kilos> yes that will work
[18:58] <melodie> I mean you could get new isos by using zsync which would reuse your original iso to create the new one, downloading only the missing part
[18:58] <melodie> ok will do then
[18:58] <inetpro> melodie: he survives on 2GB of data for two months
[18:58] <melodie> don't remember how to do that but I'll poke the people at #phillw
[18:58] <melodie> inetpro my!
[18:59] <melodie> inetpro are you also in SA ?
[18:59] <gremble> Uhm If you are really so hard up on internet data
[18:59] <gremble> I can download new ISO's and bring them to you, Kilos 
[18:59] <inetpro> melodie: yes... and the 2GB of data costs him R150
[18:59] <melodie> inetpro R ?
[18:59] <gremble> Rand
[19:00] <gremble> it is our currency
[19:00] <melodie> I guess so
[19:00] <Kilos> i have the testing iso , surely i can just keep upgrading
[19:00] <gremble> It is worth a 14th of an euro :P
[19:00] <melodie> how long can eat a 4 persons family with R150 ?
[19:00] <melodie> that will tell me more 
[19:00] <gremble> You could feed 3 of them I think
[19:00] <gremble> for a smallish meal
[19:01] <Kilos> 1 hamburger is about R50
[19:02] <Kilos> a bucket of kentucky R200
[19:02] <melodie> well here I pay 35 euros per month for a adsl connection, with fix line phone for France and several countries in Europe and illimited calls to mobiles in France and in some countries in Europe. It's not limited in data
[19:02] <melodie> Kilos kentucky?
[19:02] <Kilos> wow no kentucky fried chicken in france
[19:02] <melodie> and with 35 euros I buy enough food for one week for 2 to 3 persons
[19:02] <gremble> That is not a bad deal in SA terms 
[19:02] <melodie> Kilos I just don't know the word
[19:03] <inetpro> a good deal that
[19:03] <gremble> KFC
[19:03] <melodie> Kilos is that what the server at
[19:03] <melodie> ok
[19:03] <melodie> I don't go to KFC places
[19:03] <Kilos> they make the best chicken
[19:03] <melodie> nope
[19:03] <gremble> Quite the culture clash here this evening
[19:03] <gremble> Glad I decided to come visit
[19:03] <gremble> :P
[19:03] <Kilos> lol
[19:03] <inetpro> Kilos: when last did you have KFC?
[19:03] <melodie> I do, when I buy organically grown up chicken!
[19:03] <melodie> :D
[19:04] <Kilos> when ian last came
[19:04] <Kilos> we never buy it
[19:04] <melodie> Kilos gremble said he can get the ISOs to you
[19:04] <melodie> do we have a deal? :D
[19:04] <Kilos> yes melodie  but i am out on a smallholding without transport
[19:05] <gremble> You're less than 10km's from me
[19:05] <gremble> :P
[19:05] <Kilos> so better he can hand them out
[19:05] <Kilos> oh thats good to know gremble  
[19:05] <Kilos> BUT FROM HERE I CANT DELIVER THEN FURTHER
[19:05] <Kilos> oops sorry
[19:06] <melodie> lol
[19:06] <gremble> Wow
[19:06] <gremble> Got so angry for a moment there :P
[19:06] <melodie> but gremble and you can organise meetings and deliver further
[19:06] <Kilos> why?
[19:06] <gremble> I thought you wanted them 
[19:06] <gremble> If you don't want them, I guess I can hand them out to whomever wants them
[19:06] <melodie> I'll just leave you guys alone with the testing from now on and will give you the message when the full blown are ready for the desktops
[19:07] <gremble> Don't leave us alone :'(
[19:07] <Kilos> oh you mean the next one gremble  
[19:07] <inetpro> superfly: KDE connect is awesome on 15.04
[19:07] <Kilos> i have the testing version
[19:07] <Kilos> the fly is sick in bed inetpro  
[19:08] <Kilos> most likely lurking on mobile
[19:08] <inetpro> Kilos: the poor dude
[19:08] <Kilos> ya he gets sick too often
[19:08] <melodie> gremble I mean I won't bother you with multiple downloads and testing
[19:09] <gremble> AH
[19:09] <gremble> Too be honest, I have no idea what is really going on here. I read that someone wants a download, and I offered to do it. I should probably have made sure what I am signing myself on for
[19:09] <gremble> :P
[19:09] <melodie> Kilos has tested the 32bits and found it works fine, connects the internet on his 3G fine, he discovered that the codecs for video and sound aren't there yet : it's good enough for me. I can poke the guys at the ubuntu-fr.org forums for more testers 
[19:10] <melodie> and see how things go from there
[19:10]  * gremble suddenly understands
[19:10] <gremble> Ok
[19:10] <gremble> I get what is going on now
[19:10] <Kilos> yay
[19:10] <melodie> gremble summary for you: http://linuxvillage.org/en and http://linuxvillage.org/en/2013/11/bento-ubuntu-remix-rc/
[19:11] <melodie> one of the fastest Ubuntu spins
[19:11] <Kilos> melodie  get them to put in bell.ogg as xchat default sound
[19:11] <melodie> and started on the Launchpad as a project too:
[19:11] <melodie> Kilos where can I find a sample for bell.ogg ?
[19:12] <Kilos> in old ubuntu cds
[19:12] <melodie> https://launchpad.net/bento-dev
[19:12] <melodie> I don't know if I still have one, I would need to check
[19:12] <melodie> how old?
[19:12] <Kilos> inetpro  tell where
[19:12] <melodie> I guess I may have kept the very first ones
[19:12] <Kilos> oh i can mail it to you melodie  
[19:13] <melodie> ok
[19:13] <gremble> Ah. you manage the bento distro, melodie?
[19:13] <melodie> https://launchpad.net/~meets
[19:13] <inetpro> melodie: you looking at making that into a full blown official derivative as well?
[19:14] <melodie> gremble I started to work on that many years ago and ported it to Ubuntu in 2012 only
[19:14] <melodie> inetpro I would like to, but I don't know yet if it is technically possible, I'm working on it (and I'm opened to tech help and suggests)
[19:14] <gremble> Ah okay. looks something like crunchbang (before it ported off ubuntu to debian)
[19:15] <gremble> It's nice. I will certainly keep this in mind
[19:15] <gremble> when talking to ubuntu-people
[19:15] <melodie> gremble crunchbang didn't use the same programs to get the dynamic menus
[19:15] <gremble> Nope
[19:15] <melodie> in this Bento is much much closer to the end users
[19:15] <gremble> Ah okay
[19:15] <melodie> the first aim was to make Openbox easy for all
[19:15] <gremble> Looks nice though
[19:15] <melodie> children, anyone
[19:16] <melodie> and this is very easy, and yet, still a work in progress as the next step will be to write a good documentation, so that the people know how to tweak it to their liking, without even having to ask how to do it
[19:16] <Kilos> melodie  didnt you go to the link i gave you for the fly
[19:17] <melodie> Kilos perhaps not, can you give it again? not sure I saw it
[19:20] <melodie> Kilos which fly?
[19:20] <Kilos> only one fly here
[19:20] <Kilos> https://www.flickr.com/photos/who_da_fly/page1/
[19:21] <Kilos> thats the baby thats always in his arms
[19:21] <melodie> I'm looking
[19:21] <melodie> who is it?
[19:22] <inetpro> melodie: that would be the openlp dude
[19:23] <inetpro> and the nomanini guy
[19:23] <melodie> Kilos https://www.flickr.com/photos/who_da_fly/16918335191/
[19:24] <melodie> I know this plant I was in vacation in south east France in a place where it grows
[19:24] <melodie> inetpro what are you talking about?
[19:24] <inetpro> ai!
[19:25] <inetpro> melodie: superfly
[19:25] <Kilos> lol
[19:25] <melodie> inetpro I am talking about Kilos's pictures :D
[19:25] <Kilos> that looks like wild fig i think
[19:26] <melodie> it's not, I think
[19:26] <inetpro> melodie: those are not Kilos' pictures
[19:26] <melodie> inetpro no?
[19:26] <melodie> what is this burning fire? accidental? 
[19:26] <inetpro> who_da_fly = superfly
[19:27] <Kilos> no they are the fly's family and home area in capetown
[19:27] <inetpro> melodie: https://www.google.com/search?q=fire+cape+town
[19:27] <Kilos> melodie  you must slow down
[19:28] <Kilos> he told you this afternoon he had a baby in his arms
[19:29] <melodie> Kilos I know but I have just understood a few things about the product his company works with
[19:29] <melodie> now I get it
[19:29] <Kilos> lol
[19:29] <gremble> I leave to do some haskell and when I come back you're sharing pictures of burning babies. 
[19:29] <gremble> reedeeculous
[19:29] <Kilos> hahaha
[19:30] <inetpro> roflol
[19:30] <Kilos> gremble  no babies burning man
[19:30] <Kilos> that was all those big fires around cape town a while ago
[19:30] <gremble> Ah okay
[19:31] <inetpro> actually make that https://www.google.com/search?q=fire+cape+town&tbm=nws
[19:31] <gremble> I can't internet on this laptop other than IRC
[19:31] <gremble> because modern browsers have gotten too big :(
[19:32] <inetpro> gremble: wow, what you running on?
[19:32] <gremble> Celeron something-something with 2gb of RAM and a 40GB HDD
[19:32] <gremble> Chrome uses it up
[19:32] <gremble> Firefox just gives it up for a bad job
[19:32] <gremble> :P
[19:32] <Kilos> melodie how well do you know that plant
[19:33] <melodie> not very well
[19:33] <Kilos> it is called wild fig here and can be used for bluebottle stings
[19:34] <Kilos> portugese man of war
[19:34] <gremble> Doesn't the wild fig grow in mountainous areas?
[19:34] <melodie> when I was a child, I was staring at it, squashing one leaf to discover the feeling and always thought it looked like green french frises
[19:34] <Kilos> it grows on the beach in natal
[19:34] <melodie> gremble in France it grows near the seaside in the south west part
[19:35] <Kilos> instant cure for bluebottle stings
[19:35] <gremble> What I find to help a lot for bluebottle stings is to not go into the ater
[19:35] <gremble> water*
[19:36] <gremble> Incidentally, that also helps for sharkbites
[19:36] <melodie> what is that bluebottle stings?
[19:36] <Kilos> lol
[19:36] <melodie> let me check the dictionnaries?
[19:36]  * inetpro goes to make his self some coffee 
[19:36] <gremble> melodie: it is like a jellyfish that floats on the surface of the water
[19:36] <gremble> a Man-o-war
[19:37] <Kilos> http://www.mydr.com.au/allergy/bluebottle-stings
[19:37] <gremble> Not the band, the collection of animals
[19:37] <melodie> http://www.mydr.com.au/allergy/bluebottle-stings
[19:37] <melodie> found the same o_o
[19:37] <melodie> horror !
[19:37] <Kilos> http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/news/nsw/forget-what-youve-learned-about-bluebottle-stings-scientists-have-the-answer/story-fni0cx12-1226782266385
[19:37] <Kilos> burns like fire
[19:38] <melodie> I have to go cooking, bbl
[19:38] <Kilos> used to be a lifesaver and beach bum secret
[19:38] <Kilos> make nice food 
[19:38] <melodie> ok
[19:38] <melodie> I will do something fast and simple
[19:39] <Kilos> fried eggs
[19:39] <stickyboy> I had a calzone.
[19:40] <Kilos> whats that
[19:43] <Kilos> sounds like steroids
[19:44] <melodie> that's a folded omelette I think or a folded pizza maybe?
[19:44] <melodie> stickyboy ?
[19:45] <gremble> Folded pizza
[19:45] <stickyboy> melodie: Indeed. :P
[19:45] <stickyboy> Pizza
[19:45] <melodie> :)
[19:51] <inetpro> melodie: you should get your Bento listed at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DerivativeTeam/Derivatives
[19:54] <melodie> inetpro I will tell gsilva
[19:54] <melodie> as soon as the Trusty edition will be finished and really ready to go
[19:56] <melodie> I don't know if the derivatives listed there are done with the launchpad build system or if some are done by hand on their local machines with tools such as customizer or ubuntu-builder
[19:56] <melodie> and I am trying to learn new things to make Bento even closer to the official ones, so... perhaps not right away
[19:57] <Kilos> just keep it light and fast
[19:58] <Kilos> and add the sound files
[20:00] <inetpro>  plenty others listed on that page, perhaps a good idea to join other teams and see how they do it
[20:01] <Kilos> i go sleep.night all. sleep tight
[20:03] <gremble> I don't think I like working with structured text
[20:04] <gremble> Good night k...oh he left. I can't tab complete
[20:04] <inetpro> gremble: why not?
[20:05] <inetpro> gremble: with structured text you mean reStructuredText?
[20:05] <gremble> Writing a simple library for handling JSON in haskell. And it is so tedious to make sure that your text represenation fits what is expected
[20:05] <gremble> haha
[20:05] <gremble> no JSON in this case
[20:06] <inetpro> ah
[20:06] <inetpro> JSON still on my To Learn list
[20:07] <gremble> Seems like a good way to send information back and forth
[20:08] <stickyboy> gremble: I really like Markdown more.
[20:08] <stickyboy> (than rst)
[20:08] <inetpro> gremble: and the problem with it is?
[20:09] <stickyboy> Oh, you didn't mean reStructuredText. hehe.
[20:10] <gremble> I've never used restructured text
[20:10] <gremble> my blog uses markdown as well
[20:10] <gremble> but I am not talking about that :P
[20:11] <inetpro> actually structured data 
[20:11] <gremble> ^
[20:11] <gremble> what I meant to say
[20:11] <gremble> But didnt
[20:11] <gremble> because dumb
[20:12] <inetpro> thought that could a broad subject all on it's own
[20:12] <gremble> Well, structured data is nice. Adding structure to text is less so
[20:12] <inetpro> though*
[20:12] <inetpro> gremble: I tend to agree on that
[20:12] <inetpro> makes things very bulky
[20:13] <gremble> Look at any programming language :P
[20:14] <stickyboy> JSON is analogous to XML. :P
[20:14] <stickyboy> For web services
[20:15] <gremble> Fuck XML xD
[20:15] <inetpro> uh
[20:15] <stickyboy> gremble: Exactly. ;P
[20:15]  * stickyboy is compiling neovim.
[20:15] <gremble> I hate working with XML so much 
[20:15] <gremble> :(
[20:21] <inetpro> gremble: so what would you use in stead?
[20:24] <gremble> An excuse
[20:24] <gremble> and do something else
[20:24] <gremble> XML is good what it does
[20:24] <gremble> that is why we use
[20:24] <gremble> it
[20:24] <gremble> That doesn't mean that it is nice to work with :P
[20:25] <inetpro> hmm... 
[20:25]  * inetpro was hoping that he found another magic bullet
[20:26] <gremble> Sorry :P
[20:37] <gremble> Do you know what I find utterly fascinating about haskell? I can define a function called <>
[20:38] <gremble> something like (<>) :: String -> String -> String
[20:38] <gremble> So it takes two strings as input and returns a string
[20:38] <gremble> amazing
[20:55] <inetpro> yikes!
[21:03] <superfly> then you get python where you  can put a literal string in the middle of nowhere, and Python says, "hey, cool!"
[21:08] <gremble> Scripting languages are weird
[21:11] <superfly> I haven't used Ruby, but from my experience Python is in a world of its own. it is one of the truly object-orentated programming languages. Java and C#, by comparison, are actually class-orientated
[21:12] <superfly> hrm, JavaScript is similar to Python in that regard
[21:13] <gremble> Isn't an object an instatiation of a class or structure?
[21:17] <gremble> stickyboy: how is neovim so far?
[21:22] <superfly> gremble: not necessarily. in Python, a class is actually an object
[21:24] <gremble> Using c++, we were taught that a class is a class up until you create it at runtime, then it is an object that you manipulate
[21:24] <gremble> Same goes for a struct
[21:27] <gremble> Not having massive amounts of classes to contain all the aspects of your code is really weird for me still.
[21:28] <gremble> OO-anonymous
 and add the sound files  || I'll publish a post to announce the next additions to the test iso, and you will hence be able to install just the needed packages, so you won't need to re-download the whole iso to update your computer
[21:33] <melodie> and of course I'll always work on providing it as light as possible on resource
[21:34] <gremble> Pushbullet is such a cool addon D:
 Not having massive amounts of classes to contain all the aspects of your code is really weird for me still.  || what if you compared to music, which actually uses only 8 notes? (7 really)
[21:38] <melodie> (just a thought, I don't code myself)
[21:38] <inetpro> melodie: he's sleeping and not online
[21:39] <inetpro> any more
[21:39] <superfly> gremble: I had to re-learn OO when I started using Python
[21:39] <melodie> inetpro ok, then he will read later 
[21:39] <gremble> melodie: He won't :P It doesn't stay
[21:39] <melodie> gremble what about the logs? (see the topic)
[21:39] <inetpro> melodie: use the bot to give him a message
[21:40] <melodie> how do I do that?
[21:40] <superfly> gremble: or rather, I had to unlearn class-orientated programming and learn real OO
[21:40] <inetpro> Maaz: tell melodie this is how you do it
[21:40] <Maaz> inetpro: Sure, I'll tell melodie on freenode
[21:41] <inetpro> melodie: you got that?
[21:41] <melodie> nope
[21:41] <Maaz> melodie: By the way, inetpro on freenode told me "tell melodie this is how you do it" 1 minute and 8 seconds ago
[21:41] <gremble> superfly: now I'm trying to learn class-orientated programming to learn strictly typed functional programming :P
[21:41] <inetpro> now you did :-)
[21:41] <gremble> I quite enjoy it
[21:42] <melodie> inetpro is there a specific command?
[21:42] <inetpro> melodie: Maaz: tell Kilos message
[21:43] <melodie> or just /msg someone "the message" ?
[21:43] <melodie> with a / ?
[21:43] <inetpro> no
[21:43] <inetpro> just start with Maaz
[21:44] <melodie> Maaz tell gremble "<gremble> Not having massive amounts of classes to contain all the aspects of your code is really weird for me still.  || what if you compared to music, which actually uses only 8 notes? (7 really)"
[21:44] <Maaz> melodie: Okay, I'll tell gremble on freenode
[21:44] <melodie> inetpro seems simple! ^^
[21:44] <gremble> it is
[21:44] <Maaz> gremble: By the way, melodie on freenode told me "tell gremble "<gremble> Not having massive amounts of classes to contain all the aspects of your code is really weird for me still.  || what if you compared to music, which actually uses only 8 notes? (7 really)"" 15 seconds ago
[21:44] <superfly> night all (again), I must go back to bed
[21:44] <gremble> cheers superfly 
[21:44] <inetpro> good night superfly
[21:44] <melodie> night superfly 
[21:45] <melodie> gremble inetpro had said you were sleeping
[21:45] <gremble> Kilos is sleeping
[21:45] <inetpro> ai! 
[21:45] <gremble> I'm here still
[21:45] <melodie> :)
[21:45] <melodie> gremble so what about music?
[21:45] <gremble> I am certainly thinking about sleeping, but I also have shit to learn
[21:45] <melodie> 8 notes
[21:45] <melodie> ^^
[21:45] <gremble> Music only has 8 notes, but the sounds are different
[21:46] <gremble> 7*
[21:46] <melodie> technically yes 7
[21:46] <gremble> so say A and A are the same note, they resonate the same, but they still sound different
[21:46] <melodie> but 8 for the "gamme"
[21:46] <gremble> You can tell the difference between a low A and a high A
[21:47] <melodie> you can tell, hear, but can you define it? 
[21:47] <gremble> And then you also have combinations that are important. Like a 4, 5 sound fine, but a 2 and a 7 sounds bad
[21:47] <gremble> Yes, I can define it by the resonant frequency
[21:48] <gremble> Middle C has a frequency of 261.626 Hz whereas the next C is 523.251Hz
[21:48] <gremble> Next higher*
[21:49] <melodie> gremble and aren't you amazed that such a small number of notes are allowing to produce infinite number of pieces of music?
[21:49] <gremble> I don't think the musical sample space is infinite. 
[21:49] <gremble> It is probably countable infinite
[21:49] <gremble> countably*
[21:50] <gremble> And that is still not just 8 notes
[21:50] <gremble> Because you have the half-tones in there as well
[21:51] <gremble> And a piano will be able to make more music than say a bass guitar
[21:52] <gremble> (I'm being contrary for no good reason though, music is fantastic none the less, and I do get the point that you are getting at; that with a finite set, a practically infinite set of combinations can be produced)
[21:56] <inetpro> wb hibana
[21:56] <hibana> inetpro: thanks
[21:57]  * hibana goes sleeping again
[21:57] <hibana> good night
[21:57] <inetpro> uh
[22:00] <inetpro> fp
[22:02] <gremble> Don't swear. There are ladies in the room
[22:02] <gremble> I think
[22:02] <gremble> fuck
[22:05] <inetpro> gremble: please don't use it
[22:12] <gremble> :P
[22:12] <gremble> Yes yes. I will behave
[22:19] <inetpro> lol
[22:19] <inetpro> thank you 
[22:19] <gremble> I'll try to, at least
[22:21] <gremble> Writing code that I don't entirely understand and it compiles at the first go
[22:21] <gremble> I don't know
[22:21] <gremble> I just don't know
[22:26] <inetpro> gremble: talk to a rubber duck
[22:26] <inetpro> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rubber_duck_debugging
[22:27] <Trixar_za> It's the talking cure for coding. If you explain it to a third party, you tend to see the problem more clearly.
[22:28] <gremble> That is probably not a bad idea
[22:28] <inetpro> of course you're always welcome to talk to us here :-)
[22:28] <gremble> That is how I study math.. like a lunatic
[22:28] <kulelu88> as long as you aren't coding Java. then GTFO
[22:28] <gremble> kulelu88: I think you just stole my heart
[22:29] <gremble> <3
[22:29] <kulelu88> <3 <3 <3 bromance codemance 
[22:29] <gremble> Its haskell doe
[22:30] <gremble> I have a function called (</>) and (<>) without the () :D
[22:30] <gremble> functions*
[22:33] <kulelu88> show ta code: 
[22:37] <gremble> paste.hskll.org/get/2529
[22:42] <gremble> kulelu88: ^
[22:46] <kulelu88> is that code :O
[22:46] <gremble> It's both pretty and ugly at the same time :P
[22:47] <kulelu88> what does the :: do?
[22:47] <gremble> <function name> :: <type> -> <type>
[22:48] <gremble> so it is like if you have void foo(bar, quux); in c
[22:48] <gremble> where foo is <function name> and bar and quux are types. In this case void is the last one 
[22:49] <kulelu88> I started seeing that when I saw your declarations of string
[22:49] <gremble> that is the purpose of :: then. Splitting the name and types
[22:49] <kulelu88> why are you declaring things that look like internal types?
[22:49] <kulelu88> double, text, string, char
[22:50] <gremble> Im turning them into Doc's
[22:50] <kulelu88> don't you need overloading for that?
[22:50] <gremble> Nope
[22:50] <gremble> I made a tree data structure called Doc 
[22:51] <gremble> that can hold a bunch of different things
[22:51] <kulelu88> are you doing this for fun?
[22:51] <gremble> Yes
[22:51] <gremble> I am learning haskell
[22:51] <kulelu88> yikes. 
[22:51] <kulelu88> I couldn't "enjoy" learning these kinds of things
[22:51] <kulelu88> or I could
[22:51] <gremble> Why not?
[22:51] <kulelu88> or I don't know
[22:51] <gremble> :P
[22:52] <gremble> I like it because it is very math-like
[22:52] <kulelu88> my utility isn't very high when I code for fun
[22:52] <gremble> Mine isn't very high if I have to code for business
[22:52] <gremble> :P
[22:53] <kulelu88> I'd code if I have a distinct goal
[22:53] <kulelu88> build an app, build a script, build a container
[22:53] <gremble> I can't do much of that yet :P
[22:53] <gremble> Hopefully by the end of the year I will have something cool
[22:53] <kulelu88> containers are easy. 
[22:53] <gremble> I can do containers in C++
[22:53] <kulelu88> and if you can learn this kind of coding, building crud-stuff will be a breeze for you
[22:54] <kulelu88> by "build", I mean: sudo docker run :D
[22:54] <gremble> :P
[22:54] <kulelu88> sheesh my stomach is broken
[22:54] <gremble> From?
[22:54] <kulelu88> turkish food and beans 
[22:55] <gremble> Beans, beans, the musical fruit. The more you eat, the more you toot
[22:55] <gremble> My grandfather used to sing that to us
[22:55] <kulelu88> yeah I can't eat that Koo stuff anymore. 
[22:58] <gremble> Do you only eat fresh beans now?
[22:58] <gremble> :P
[22:58] <kulelu88> is there a difference??
[22:58] <gremble> Fresh beans come in a packet and koo beans come in a can
[22:58] <gremble> ?
[22:59] <kulelu88> aah ambiguity. I mean a difference on the impact on your stomach
[22:59] <gremble> I have no idea :P
[22:59] <gremble> You said you don't eat Koo beans, so I assumed that you had other beans
[22:59] <kulelu88> I said I can't. I didn't say I don't :D
[22:59] <gremble> Hahaha
[23:00] <kulelu88> does tuks post a list of their alumni graduating each year?
[23:00] <gremble> I have no idea
[23:00] <gremble> Not anywhere where I have come across it
[23:01] <gremble> Their site had a vulnerability that listed all of the alumni they've ever produced along with their email addresses, cellphone numbers and degrees
[23:01] <gremble> But that was an accident I believe
[23:01] <kulelu88> where was the loophole? clickup?
[23:01] <gremble> No. Marketing department
[23:02] <kulelu88> could easily be done through linkedin (well not as easy as a GET request)
[23:03] <gremble> I only recently got LinkdIN to stop sending me emails
[23:03] <gremble> I am staying so far away from them
[23:03] <gremble> D:
[23:03] <kulelu88> I need to get them to stop phishing info from my email address
[23:04] <kulelu88> shitty tool that hasn't helped me once in life
[23:04] <gremble> That is the worst kind of social network
[23:07] <kulelu88> hows the student life?
[23:07] <gremble> Busy. Fairly sure I am going to fail differential equations. Other than that, I am hanging on haha
[23:08] <gremble> And I need to get a job. This private tutoring is leaving me more frustrated and broke than anything else
[23:08] <kulelu88> wtw 300?
[23:08] <gremble> :P
[23:08] <gremble> wtw 286
[23:09] <kulelu88> standard or fnb will have a gig for you. soulless good-paying work
[23:09] <gremble> in second year?
[23:09] <kulelu88> oh you're still there next year, ja. internship then :D
[23:10] <gremble> Hmm. I will go have a look
[23:10] <gremble> Soulless good-paying work is better than nothing
[23:12] <gremble> There is a job at the university for a Senior Technical assistant, that basically uploads stuff to a CMS and "liasons" between Graduates and Staff, but they want a BSc degree and 3 years of experience in IT administration to consider an applicant for the position
[23:14] <kulelu88> that's basically their way of promoting how important their degrees + exp mean. Find the main guy there and convince him to put in a good word. 
[23:15] <kulelu88> finding work was so kak that I don't even work in the field I studied
[23:15] <gremble> What field did you study and where do you work now?
[23:15] <gremble> well, what field of work are you in now?
[23:16] <kulelu88> commerce > IT
[23:16] <gremble> :P
[23:16] <kulelu88> TMS I had linux going for me
[23:16] <gremble> Learning Linux whas probably one of the best investements that I've ever made in myself haha
[23:17] <kulelu88> yeah, it should be second nature to open the CLI and go "sudo ..."
[23:17] <gremble> At the CSIR they lit up when I told them I knew linux, more so than when I said I can code in C/C++ and do mathematics
[23:17] <kulelu88> They wouldn't even consider me cause of the mandate of hiring BSc
[23:18] <gremble> It would be nice to get something there once I am done
[23:19] <gremble> (although I would prefer to do something abroad for a bit)
[23:19] <kulelu88> yeah, seems like a right of passage from some okes to go live in london/australia for a few years
[23:19] <gremble> Germany as free university for even foreigners
[23:19] <gremble> ;P
[23:19] <kulelu88> my idea of greener pastures is Ballito right now
[23:20] <gremble> Haha
[23:20] <gremble> To each their own :P
[23:20] <kulelu88> for now... 
[23:20] <kulelu88> winter here is too kak
[23:21] <kulelu88> how do you mentally encourage yourself to code more and watch less series?
[23:21] <gremble> I don't like watching series, so it is not that difficult
[23:22] <kulelu88> none of them? shit, I'm watching too many
[23:22] <gremble> Sometimes I'll put Dr. Who on while I code, but that is rarely
[23:22] <gremble> Coding is my meditation so I do that when I have other work to do, but I don't want to
[23:23] <kulelu88> I need that power
[23:23] <kulelu88> teach me sensei
[23:24] <gremble> Haha. It's not that hard to fathom. Those guys that go to the gym for three or four hours a day don't just go to jack off. They have clearly set goals. Weekly, monthly, etc
[23:25] <gremble> So when you take on a project such as learning a new programming language, it is important to have a set goal to reach for
[23:25] <kulelu88> I guess the isolation bothers me. I enjoy pair-coding a lot
[23:25] <gremble> I would like to make a rogue-like in haskell by the end of the year
[23:25] <gremble> I pair coded once. We had to go outside to have a fist fight
[23:26] <kulelu88> must've been an engineer
[23:26] <gremble> Can't remember
[23:26] <gremble> He kept using improper god-conditions for his state machine
[23:27] <gremble> resulting in really shitty cascading if-statements
[23:28] <gremble> If you like pair-programming though, you should take a look at Koding
[23:28] <melodie> http://ubuntu-manual.org/downloads
[23:29] <melodie> for all who need a full documentation as a downloadable manual
[23:29] <melodie> 2 versions, one for printing and one for the screen : with clickable links in it, very handy
[23:29] <gremble> That is quite nice
[23:29] <gremble> Thanks melodie 
[23:30] <kulelu88> melodie!!!
[23:30] <melodie> welcome
[23:30] <kulelu88> we should be welcoming you! bonjour
[23:30] <melodie> I put them links and manuals in Bento 12.04, in a "Goodies" directory, and will do for Bento Trusty when ready too
[23:30] <kulelu88> I don't see any part of Koding where I can pair-program
[23:30] <melodie> salut kulelu88 
[23:31] <kulelu88> melodie: correct me if I am wrong, but you are a gurllll?
[23:31] <gremble> We used to pair program with Koding. If I recall correctly you can invite other people into your VM
[23:31] <kulelu88> oh yes, that's how.
[23:31] <melodie> kulelu88 you are right, a girl I am
[23:32] <kulelu88> gurll on the interwebz *cry-face
[23:33] <gremble> Sometimes I wonder if you are still stuck in the 1972 internet :P
[23:33] <kulelu88> hey hey! I am just reliving the days of the guys who had the chance to say such things
[23:34] <gremble> Meh. This VM takes too long to spin up
[23:34] <gremble> But ya, Koding allows for collaboration
[23:34] <kulelu88> virtualbox?
[23:35] <gremble> Do you have a coding account kulelu88 ?
[23:35] <kulelu88> a Koding account? no
[23:36] <gremble> Oh. Okay. Well, you can open your VM settings there and then share it with someone that has an account
[23:36] <gremble> and voila
[23:36] <gremble> Pair programming
[23:36] <kulelu88> does it have chat support?
[23:36] <gremble> as long as it is python, Ruby and some other things
[23:36] <gremble> Yes I believe so
[23:36] <kulelu88> python <3
[23:36] <melodie> kulelu88 this sayd, guys are allowed to help here! :D
[23:36] <gremble> But I think using a microphone and skype/teamspeak would probably be better
[23:37] <melodie> we have cats to whip
[23:37] <kulelu88> melodie: do you code also?
[23:37] <melodie> https://launchpad.net/bento-dev
[23:37] <melodie> kulelu88 didn't have time to learn, though I tried to start several times
[23:38] <melodie> I just put up a shell script, it would be the first one :p
[23:38] <melodie> to put the "receiv key" command line in it
[23:39] <melodie> kulelu88 putting pieces together, http://linuxvillage.org/en/2015/04/sushi-trusty-in-test/
[23:39] <melodie> it uses less ram
[23:39] <melodie> it's easy for end users
[23:39] <kulelu88> I'm trying to understand how you guys are building a distro without coding. Must be difficult
[23:39] <melodie> it's openbox without a desktop manager
[23:39] <melodie> kulelu88 of course it is difficult
[23:40] <gremble> Distro's are mostly built with shell scripting, not coding so much
[23:40] <melodie> I often read code though and I start to understand some parts in it
[23:40] <melodie> also some people help me with this project when I meet with critical needs
[23:41] <melodie> what helps me most is that I know the system well enough
[23:41] <melodie> and key commands too
[23:41] <kulelu88> I never knew it was possible to build a distro without having some programming knowledge. that's awesome
[23:41] <gremble> I think I am going to do the sleep thing
[23:42] <melodie> kulelu88 it's difficult, but I first had to learn many things
[23:42] <gremble> I will probably see you guys tomorrow, unless I can talk myself into doing linear algebra
[23:42] <melodie> gremble good night!
[23:42] <kulelu88> yes, homework gremble 
[23:42] <melodie> kulelu88 and I'm not building a distro
[23:43] <melodie> I am using pieces from a distro and add some specific configuration 
[23:43] <kulelu88> aah sorry
[23:43] <melodie> also have been plotting these last 2 years to get the main components get into Debian so that it could be in Ubuntu after
[23:43] <melodie> and continuing :)
[23:44] <melodie> you can have a look here http://linuxvillage.org/en/downloads/
[23:45] <melodie> kulelu88 what about you? which programming languages?
[23:46] <kulelu88> melodie: Python, C, PHP, JS
[23:46] <kulelu88> not proficient in any
[23:46] <melodie> which one would you like to be best at?
[23:48] <kulelu88> Python
[23:48] <kulelu88> very easy to understand
[23:48] <melodie> and how good are you with shell script? 
[23:48] <kulelu88> not too bad. I can understand shell scripts
[23:48] <melodie> I have been to a "coding 4 oclock" with kids
[23:48] <melodie> we did "codecombat.com"
[23:48] <melodie> ld
[23:49] <melodie> :D
[23:49] <kulelu88> your kids?
[23:49] <melodie> http://codecombat.com
[23:49] <melodie> my teen son along with kids going there
[23:49] <kulelu88> oh that's cool
[23:50] <kulelu88> never seen this before
[23:50] <melodie> then you might also like http://app-inventor.mit.edu and http://scratch.mit.edu 
[23:51] <melodie> appinventor.mit.edu
[23:51] <melodie> my bad
[23:54] <melodie> kulelu88 are you playing with Code Combat now? :D
[23:54] <kulelu88> no :D I am busy at work :P
[23:55] <melodie> kulelu88 which timezone?
[23:55] <kulelu88> +2
[23:56] <melodie> so you work nightly
[23:56] <melodie> it's 1:56 am here too
[23:56] <kulelu88> I have flexi-time
[23:57] <melodie> what do you do? 
[23:57] <kulelu88> I work in IT
[23:57] <melodie> why would I have bet? 
[23:57] <melodie> what IT do you do? :)
[23:57] <kulelu88> no idea :D
[23:57] <melodie> monitoring networks? 
[23:57] <melodie> XD
[23:57] <kulelu88> analyst
[23:57] <melodie> no idea??
[23:58] <melodie> oh ok
[23:58] <kulelu88> no idea = for your question :D :D
[23:58] <kulelu88> "why would I have bet?"
[23:58] <Trixar_za> Sounds like most Analysts I know
[23:58] <melodie> Trixar_za tell me more :D
[23:59] <kulelu88> hey Trixar_za you parking there quietly doing NLP on us :D
[23:59] <melodie> Trixar_za what is an analyst doing ?