[04:38] <captine> morning all
[05:31] <magespawn> good morning
[05:43] <Jacques_Stry> Morning
[06:54] <Kilos> hi magespawn  Jacques_Stry  ThatGraemeGuy  inetpro  and others i have missed
[06:55] <ThatGraemeGuy> 'lo
[06:58]  * Jacques_Stry waves
[07:09] <Kilos> im really becoming good at pointing peeps to other peeps
[07:10] <Kilos> im sorry for the extra work load Jacques_Stry  , but you are doing a great job
[07:10] <Jacques_Stry> haha no problem
[07:13] <Kilos> at last the project is taking off, poor william was getting despondent i think
[07:14] <Jacques_Stry> Well, working with volunteers - things can time a while sometimes but as long as stuff keeps moving
[07:15] <Kilos> the early mails were all about advice but noone did anything
[07:16] <Kilos> once again , my team to the rescue
[07:18] <Kilos> now the big work comes, geting teachers to learn irc and get involved, doing everything via emails takes forever
[07:19] <Jacques_Stry> Yip, but at least we have a base to work on now
[07:20] <Kilos> yeah ,well done
[07:30] <Squirm> Morning
[07:30] <Kilos> hi Squirm  
[07:39] <Kilos> Jacques_Stry  idea
[07:39] <Kilos> maybe we can bypass the teacher prob
[07:40] <Kilos> and you are the man i think with connection to the education peeps who lay out curriculums
[07:40] <Kilos> maybe the books are all on online already and just need downloading
[07:42] <Kilos> julle moet die dink werk doen man , my kop is seer vandag
[07:59] <inetpro> good mornings everyone
[08:00] <Kilos> ohi my inetpro  well done sir
[08:00] <inetpro> uh?
[08:01] <Kilos> and the stupid act may fool others
[08:01] <Kilos> i know better
[08:01] <magespawn> hi inetpro 
[08:01] <Kilos> i wont give you work if you greet me magespawn  
[08:04] <magespawn> i did earlier
[08:04] <Kilos> lemme check
[08:06] <Kilos> before i greeted must be, ok forgiveness is forthcoming
[08:06] <magespawn> cool beans
[08:06] <Kilos> hehe
[08:09] <Jacques_Stry> Morning inetpro, magespawn 
[08:10] <Jacques_Stry> kilos: Problem is even if we get the books - still have to be translated
[08:11] <Kilos> oh my was that the aim
[08:11] <Jacques_Stry> They can't accept anything if not available in all the language of teaching
[08:12] <Kilos> oh my
[08:13] <magespawn> hi Jacques_Stry 
[08:15] <Kilos> magespawn  we hit 49 for a while last night
[08:15] <Kilos> 1 more
[08:40] <gremble> o/
[08:41] <CuttingEdge> greetings
[08:42] <Kilos> morning gremble  CuttingEdge  
[08:44] <gremble> I think my internet has been throttled >.>
[08:44] <gremble> Good morning Kilos 
[08:52] <magespawn> Kilos: i see
[09:03]  * Kilos needs some help please https://pypi.python.org/pypi/cElementTree
[09:04] <Kilos> then went to here http://effbot.org/downloads#celementtree
[09:04] <Kilos> have no idea what or how to download the right one for 14.04
[09:05] <Jacques_Stry> Honestly I still struggle as well if the install file isn't a *.deb
[09:06] <Kilos> yay its not only me
[09:06] <Jacques_Stry> You will probably have to go for the .tar.gz
[09:06] <gremble> No stop
[09:06] <Jacques_Stry> :)
[09:06] <gremble> It is a python package
[09:06]  * Kilos stops
[09:07] <gremble> So you can download and install it with pip
[09:07] <Kilos> command please
[09:07] <gremble> Give me a second
[09:07] <Kilos> pip install ?
[09:07] <gremble> pip install cElementTree
[09:07] <Kilos> ty
[09:08] <gremble> Why are you installing a fast implementation of the elementtree API?
[09:08] <Kilos> ibid needs it
[09:08] <Kilos> No distributions at all found for cElementTree
[09:09] <Kilos> ill need to somehow point pip to that link
[09:09] <gremble> no. It works for my
[09:09] <gremble> me*
[09:09] <gremble> pip install celementtree
[09:09] <gremble> Sec
[09:10] <Kilos> it cant be in the main packages 
[09:10] <gremble> No. It's not
[09:10] <gremble> Then you want to download the tar.gz package
[09:15] <Kilos> for that effbot thing?
[09:15] <Kilos> oi why are things so difficult
[09:17] <gremble> Because you're trying to play with orphaned packages
[09:17] <gremble> :P
[09:18] <Kilos> i dont even know how to make a crying smiley
[09:19] <gremble> If it's crying, how can it be a smiley?
[09:19] <gremble> I hate slow internet so much
[09:19] <Kilos> on the second link there is a whole list of celemetree files
[09:19] <Kilos> emoticons then
[09:20] <Kilos> daai goeters
[09:20] <Squirm> It's almost weekend
[09:20] <Kilos> does one just get the top one?
[09:21] <gremble> Squirm: you are ever the optimist
[09:21] <gremble> :P
[09:21] <Kilos> oi and the fly told me never install from source
[09:21] <Squirm> gremble: well, after tomorrow is the weekend
[09:21] <Kilos> because i break things
[09:23] <gremble> Probably good adive
[09:23] <gremble> advice*
[09:23] <Kilos> lol
[09:24] <Kilos> nm mrfixit will sort me tonight
[09:31] <Kilos> :')
[09:31] <Kilos> oi
[09:33] <Kilos> :'(
[09:33] <Kilos> hehe
[09:33] <Kilos> methinks thats the sad smiley
[10:17] <pieter2627> hi all
[10:18] <Kilos> hi pieter2627  hoe gaan dit daar?
[10:18] <pieter2627> Goed, en self met oom?
[10:18] <Kilos> goed dankie
[10:19] <Kilos> jy het gisteraand se meeting gemis
[10:19] <Kilos> sies man
[10:20] <pieter2627> ja sorry, sien dit veroggend toe ek emails kyk - het vergeet
[10:20] <Kilos> ai!
[10:20] <Kilos> lekker meeting gehad, die vlieg het die stoel bestuur
[10:21] <Kilos> hy vat nie nonsens van kabouters nie
[10:21] <pieter2627> stoel bestuur?
[10:21] <Kilos> chair
[10:21] <Kilos> daai ding
[10:22] <Kilos> meeting chair person
[10:22] <pieter2627> ah, wou nou net vra waarn toe die stoel gery het 
[10:23] <Kilos> lol
[10:24] <pieter2627> sal maar die log gaan lees
[10:24] <Kilos> mooi
[10:35] <CuttingEdge> sent an email to mirrors@ubuntu.com about adding the Neology mirror to the za.* DNS mirror pools
[10:37] <Kilos> cool
[10:37] <Kilos> isnt it in there already
[10:38] <CuttingEdge> naaaa, its not a 'country' mirror but a 'private' one
[10:38] <Kilos> when you open update manager and choose other and tisk the arrow next to za neology shows
[12:07] <magespawn> back again
[12:10] <Kilos> wb magespawn  
[12:10] <Kilos> both of you
[12:10] <Kilos> if you were both at the meet we would have hit 50
[12:38]  * Kilos needs to restart
[13:15] <Squirm> fyi - http://www.linux.com/news/software/applications/825994-kubuntu-1504-plasma-53-review
[14:29] <Kilos> hmm...
[15:53] <Kilos> me wonders how the fly family is fairing
[15:54] <Kilos> right sounding word maybe spelling is wrong
[15:54] <Kilos> faring
[15:54] <Kilos> Maaz  define fairing
[15:54] <Maaz> Kilos: Fairing \Fair"ing\, n. A present; originally, one given or purchased at a fair. --Gay. [1913 Webster]  {Fairing box}, a box receiving savings or small sums of money. --Hannah More. [1913 Webster]
[15:55] <Kilos> Maaz  define fsring
[15:55] <Maaz> Kilos: I don't know about fsring. Maybe you meant Fring, Faring, Firing or firing?
[15:55] <Kilos> ai!
[15:55] <Kilos> Maaz  define faring
[15:55] <Maaz> Kilos: Fare \Fare\ (f[^a]r), v. i. [imp. & p. p. {Fared}; p. pr. & vb. n. {Faring}.] [AS. faran to travel, fare; akin to OS., Goth., & OHG. faran to travel, go, D. varen, G. fahren, OFries., Icel., & Sw. fara, Dan. fare, Gr. ????? a way through, ??????? a ferry, strait, ???????? to convey, ?????????? to go, march, ????? beyond, on the other side, ????? to pass
[15:55] <Maaz> through, L. peritus experienced, portus port, Skr. par to bring over. [root]78. Cf. {Chaffer}…
[16:01] <Kilos> in other words hoe gaan dit met hulle
[16:23] <Kilos> wb magespawn  
[16:23] <magespawn> ty Kilos 
[16:41] <magespawn> so whats up tonight?
[16:43] <Kilos> i really dont know magespawn  been very quiet here
[16:43] <magespawn> so i see
[16:43] <magespawn> wiliiamk was on late last night, talking about the document project again
[16:43] <Kilos> aw i missed it
[16:44] <magespawn> was late or early depending on how you look at things
[16:44] <Kilos> but glad he is learning to use irc for quick answers
[16:45] <Kilos> so strange such old buntu peeps that dont use irc
[16:45] <magespawn> they have set up a test server for the book software they want to use to make the manuals here http://52.10.81.81/
[16:45] <Kilos> oh yes i know about that
[16:46] <Kilos> we just gotta watch wwk and jacques for info
[16:53] <Kilos> hi Tonberry  
[16:53] <Kilos> hi kulelu88  
[16:53] <kulelu88> sup Kilos 
[16:53] <Kilos> you missed last nights meeting, shame on you
[16:54] <Kilos> we were one short to make 50 nicks here
[16:54] <Kilos> then i can retire
[16:54] <kulelu88> I was asleep
[16:54] <kulelu88> I think
[17:07] <pieter2627> Kilos: it's faring
[17:08] <Kilos> ty pieter2627  
[17:08]  * pieter2627 is a bit brain fried - just read last night's log
[17:09] <Kilos> lol
[17:09] <Kilos> pieter2627  after the meeting was too much for me i cant keep up when things fly like that
[17:10] <magespawn> right go to go work a bit, back later
[17:10] <pieter2627> yea, those two conversations were also almost parallel
[17:10] <Kilos> yeah i give up with that
[17:10] <Kilos> i like things like now Q+A after each other
[17:11] <pieter2627> gremble mentioned that he is good at proofreading - has he check the grammar on africa's site?
[17:12] <pieter2627> yip, this is better - i also don't pay too much attention to names so get confused at times
[17:12] <Kilos> lol he has seen the site, i think if he found something wrong he would have said so
[17:13] <pieter2627> ok, i'm then just gonna do a last check before proposing those merges
[17:13]  * pieter2627 have to install nikola first... but wanna try something
[17:14] <Kilos> ok
[17:22] <Squirm> Good evening
[17:23] <Kilos> hi Squirm  
[17:43] <inetpro> good evening
[17:43] <inetpro> oh and hullo uncle Kilos
[17:44] <Kilos> lol hello inetpro  
[17:44] <Kilos> i wont say anything
[17:44] <inetpro> why?
[17:45] <Kilos> well
[17:45] <inetpro> something wrong with hullo?
[17:45] <Kilos> normally you read scro;; backs all over
[17:45] <Kilos> scroll
[17:45] <Kilos> and find whas wrong where
[17:45] <Kilos> whats
[17:46] <inetpro> hmm.... lemme check
[17:46] <Kilos> lol
[17:46] <Kilos> you know im sure to make the membership application next thursday at midnight
[17:46] <Kilos> i might even give you a +1
[17:47] <inetpro> uh
[17:47] <inetpro> did I miss something?
[17:48] <Kilos> hmm...
[18:02] <kulelu88> I can help you install nikola in docker
[18:03] <Kilos> wb pieter2627  
[18:03] <pieter2627> kulelu88: awesome, that is exactly what i'm trying to do
[18:03] <kulelu88> pastee.org your dockerfile and I will clean it for you pieter2627 
[18:04]  * pieter2627 didn't realise i got disconnected
[18:04] <pieter2627> kulelu88: have not created one yet, just started (run) an python:2.7 to test
[18:05] <kulelu88> don't download that 900MB version of theirs
[18:05] <kulelu88> the first world doesn't think of africa when they write their 1GB software for testing
[18:06] <Kilos> wow
[18:06] <pieter2627> haha, already did
[18:06] <kulelu88> unless you live in cape town, which is trying to be first world
[18:06] <pieter2627> lol
[18:07] <kulelu88> with your wine and cheese and hipsters 
[18:07] <kulelu88> and startups
[18:07] <pieter2627> do you suggest installing python in a debian image?
[18:07] <kulelu88> pieter2627: I went with an ubuntu install. my image + python = 350ishMB
[18:08] <pieter2627> ok (debian is about 100Mb smaller that ubuntu)
[18:09] <kulelu88> i'm just used to the ubuntu way now, so I stuck with it
[18:09] <pieter2627> me too
[18:09] <pieter2627> just explorer debian - aren't they same anyway
[18:10] <kulelu88> you'd get flamed for saying that in murican channels
[18:10]  * pieter2627 is clearly wrong then
[18:11] <pieter2627> did you install python 2.7 or 3.[3-4]?
[18:11] <kulelu88> 2.7
[18:12] <pieter2627> will try that then
[18:12] <kulelu88> check which version superfly and them used for the site
[18:13] <Kilos> 3.4 i think
[18:13] <pieter2627> we talked about it the other day, but forgot
[18:13] <Kilos> inetpro  which python did we use for the sites please
[18:13] <kulelu88> python --version
[18:13] <kulelu88> sudo python --version
[18:14] <pieter2627> Kilos: ^^
[18:14] <kulelu88> sudo rm -rf /
[18:14] <Kilos> 2.7.6
[18:14] <pieter2627> just NOT that last one
[18:15] <kulelu88> possible that they may have used a venv. go into the directory where nikola is installed and check version there
[18:16] <Kilos> rm: it is dangerous to operate recursively on ‘/’
[18:16] <Kilos> rm: use --no-preserve-root to override this failsafe
[18:16] <Kilos> lol
[18:16] <Kilos> missed not 
[18:17] <pieter2627> see Kilos is clever
[18:17] <Kilos> i coulda sworn we used 3.4
[18:17] <Kilos> everything else is 2.7 but something rings a bell about 3.4
[18:18] <kulelu88> Guidos desire
[18:18] <Kilos> inetpro  ping man
[18:19] <Kilos> he is buried in python bot land
[18:20] <inetpro> huh?
[18:20] <kulelu88> or watching pron
[18:20] <Kilos> we used python 3.4 on the site didnt we
[18:21] <inetpro> Kilos: how must I remember that?
[18:21] <Kilos> ya nikola wanted it
[18:21] <Kilos> pieter2627  wants to know
[18:21] <inetpro> I have documentation for the purpose to remind me
[18:21] <Kilos> rtfs
[18:22] <Kilos> read the freaking stuff
[18:22] <Kilos> and give us the answer
[18:22] <inetpro> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~inetpro/ubuntu-africa/build-instructions/view/head:/pages/build-instructions.rst
[18:23] <Kilos> pieter2627  rtfs
[18:23] <kulelu88> rtfd? 
[18:23] <Kilos> hi gremble  
[18:23]  * pieter2627 reading
[18:24] <gremble> Hey Kilos 
[18:24] <Kilos> read the freaking dialogue
[18:24] <pieter2627> documentation
[18:24] <Kilos> oh ya that
[18:29] <Kilos> evening superfly  
[18:30] <superfly> hi Kilos
[18:31] <superfly> pieter2627, Kilos: it doesn't matter. Nikola runs on both
[18:31] <Kilos> ah ty
[18:31] <pieter2627> superfly: ty
[18:33] <kulelu88> won't there be conflicts cause of the custom work. or is that just the template design?
[18:33] <inetpro> hi superfly
[18:33] <superfly> hi inetpro
[18:42] <Kilos> superfly  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/aptitude/+bug/831768
[18:43] <Kilos> will those fixes make aptitude safe to use
[19:49] <Kilos> hi smile  
[19:50] <smile> Hi :)
[19:50] <smile> Another crash with unknown cause
[19:51] <Kilos> ai!
[19:51] <smile> Long live Windows
[19:51] <Kilos> lol
[19:51] <smile> :-P
[19:52] <smile> I will swap disks with another pc to see if the problem occurs with other hardware :)
[19:53] <Kilos> good luck lad.
[19:53] <smile> Thanks
[19:54] <smile> How s your day :-P
[19:58] <Kilos> same old different day
[19:59] <smile> You will have to explain that. ;-)
[19:59] <Kilos> same old daily routine but on another day
[20:00] <smile> Whats your routine
[20:02] <Kilos> wake up
[20:02] <Kilos> gbreathe
[20:02] <Kilos> breathe
[20:02] <Kilos> eat
[20:02] <Kilos> look after sheep and poultry
[20:02] <Kilos> water plants
[20:02] <Kilos> play on pc
[20:02] <Kilos> sleep
[20:03] <smile> You only eat once?
[20:03] <Kilos> lunch and supper
[20:03] <Kilos> and when waking pc goes on first
[20:04] <Kilos> read  mail then rest of the day starts
[20:04] <Kilos> and now im ready for bed again
[20:06] <smile> :-) good night!
[20:06] <Kilos> lol now now
[20:11] <smile> Not now?
[20:11] <smile> :-P
[20:12] <Kilos> 5 mins more
[20:13] <smile> Thats not a magic number
[20:13] <Kilos> oh
[20:13] <Kilos> 2 then
[20:14] <smile> You should always go sleep on a rounded number
[20:14] <smile> :-D
[20:14] <Kilos> ya sleep at 10pm
[20:14] <smile> You are late.
[20:14] <Kilos> but gotta get ready first man
[20:14] <smile> :-P
[20:15] <Kilos> oh ya
[20:15] <Kilos> good night all. sleep tight. tomorrow is another day
[20:15] <smile> Not sure about that
[20:16] <smile> We can only hope
[20:16] <smile> Good night :)
[20:16] <Kilos> the sun will definitely be up
[20:16] <smile> Nature can not be predicted
[20:16] <smile> :-P
[20:48] <superfly> Finally got Quasseldroid working on my G2
[20:49] <smile> LG SUCKS
[20:49] <smile> :-P
[20:55] <gremble> smile so eloquently surmised the problem with induction :P
[20:55] <gremble> Especially scientific induction
[20:57] <smile> :-O and that means?
[20:58] <gremble> If you see 9999 9999 white swans and decide that all swans are white, you do not necessarily have a truth, since observing one black swan will negate your theorum that all swans are white
[20:59] <Trixar_za> Hypothesis
[20:59] <gremble> Hypothesis, theorum. Semantics. 
[20:59] <Trixar_za> No, Theories are proven by experimentation.
[21:00] <Trixar_za> So not semantics
[21:00] <gremble> No. I don't do experiments to prove theorums. I construct proofs
[21:00] <gremble> Hypotheses are also tested by experiment
[21:01] <smile> :)
[21:01] <Trixar_za> No, they are tested by experimentation. That's their definition. They're the guesses to what you're observing. Experimentation proves it, which turns it into a theory
[21:01] <Trixar_za> That's why it's the theory of evolution, not the hypotheses of evolution :|
[21:02] <gremble> How will you test the fundamental theorum of calculus by experimentation?
[21:02] <Trixar_za> You can tell I've had this argument with creationalists
[21:02] <gremble> I can tell that you should read Karl Popper :P
[21:03] <Trixar_za> Math is pure science. You can't fake it. It will always work out that way. That's proof. Experimentation is just another form of proving your observation and explaination of it correct.
[21:03] <smile> The bible is real. The bible itself, not its contents. :-P
[21:04] <Trixar_za> No, some of what is in the bible happened. But if you think it's historically accurate, then you've missed the point of it.
[21:04] <gremble> You can fake it though. Russell gave us the set of all sets paradox, Godel has shown us that anything more expressive than Peano Arithmetic has paradoxes. So even "pure" formal systems come with flaws
[21:04] <gremble> So to think something derived from there is flawless is naive
[21:04] <Trixar_za> paradoxes aren't flaws
[21:04] <gremble> Of course they are
[21:05] <Trixar_za> Only if you believe self-contradiction isn't logical.
[21:05] <gremble> en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Principle_of_explosion
[21:06] <gremble> If you can prove something is true and its negation is true, you can prove anything
[21:06] <gremble> Contradiction* not negation
[21:07] <Trixar_za> Makes sense to me. But you're wrong about it proving anything. I hate using the term because of that blasted book, but most things have various 'shades of gray' to it and not just two extremes.
[21:08] <Trixar_za> Well, using it to prove everything that is
[21:09] <gremble> By proving anything I mean propositions that can only have true or false outcomes. Anything more complex than that is not the realm of logic
[21:09] <smile> Slaapwel :)
[21:09] <gremble> equality etc
[21:09] <gremble> good night smile 
[21:09] <smile> Interesting :-)
[21:09] <Trixar_za> Then you have a very shallow view of logic and reality :P
[21:10] <gremble> I highly doubt that 
[21:12] <gremble> Logic != Reason
[21:12] <gremble> and your reality is not something that exists outside of our man-made universe
[21:14] <gremble> Does anyone here know why there are Riots in Baltimore?
[21:16] <Trixar_za> We have our own riots and stuff, so we don't really care? Oo
[21:43] <superfly> I find it interesting, Trixar_za that you say evolution is a theory, but in reality you can't run an experiment on it...
[21:44] <gremble> See "working hypothesis" :P
[21:44] <gremble> But I will go do Category Theory in silence and not argue over the internet xD
[21:46] <superfly> And I must go to bed.
[21:46] <superfly> Night
[21:46] <gremble> Cheers
[21:47] <Trixar_za> You can. With short-lived organisms and plants.
[21:49] <superfly> Right. You keep on believing that.
[21:50] <Trixar_za> That's how they did it for the last few decades with the first experimetation of genetics being done with wheat.
[21:50] <Trixar_za> By a monk no less
[21:51] <gremble> That was not evolution. That was an experiment on hereditary traits
[21:51] <gremble> Fuck. I keep getting sucked in
[21:51] <gremble> Haha
[21:55] <Trixar_za> Actually, I have a simpler solution.
[21:55] <gremble> Go for it
[21:56] <Trixar_za> I'm done and I'll /ignore gremble - problem solved and I won't keep getting sucked into his whatever this is
[21:56] <gremble> That, is actually an excellent solution
[21:56] <gremble> :P
[21:57] <Trixar_za> I've already had to leave one channel because of somebody that liked to contradictory and loved turning people against me. I'm not going to go through that again.
[21:57] <Trixar_za> be*
[21:57] <gremble> Oh. I am in no means or way trying to be malicious
[21:57] <gremble> I apologise if that is the tone that came across
[21:58] <gremble> And I most certainly don't want to turn anyone against anyone