[00:00] ooh mini dog [00:00] election night beer here [00:02] ch4's coverage is so cringy I'm embarrassed to admit I'm enjoying it [00:02] different government bed night here :> [00:03] have they cracked out a tag cloud yet? [00:03] "here's some meaningless rubbish that keeps at least one extraneous staff member employed" [00:04] that exit poll certainly made things interesting [00:04] indeed [00:07] the change away from lib dem is severe so far [00:07] * popey returns from election-night dishwasher-empty-and-refill with election-night wine and election-night hula-hoops [00:07] living the dream [00:08] which flavour hula hoops? ... it's important [00:08] ready salted [00:08] first ones that came out of the cupboard [00:08] :D [00:09] i think McCoys reign #1 for me still [00:09] of all such savoury snacks [00:09] only saw them because I was putting away election-night chinese-take-away containers which live in the same cupboard as election-night hula-hoops [00:09] now, if we're talking about the king of snacks... [00:10] :O [00:10] Snyders Hot Buffalo Wing [00:10] i've not had chinese in a while again [00:10] http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B0087C9S9C [00:10] those bad boys [00:10] or, indeed, girls [00:11] :O that's worryingly impulse buy worthy [00:11] the jalapeno ones are good [00:11] see also http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B003SEHZF8 [00:11] yes [00:11] *Bursting with flavour* [00:12] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k4khxeru5hs [00:23] interesting, turnout dropped from 77% in 1992 to 59% in 2001 [00:30] argh... stupid spi chip won't read when the cpu is in reset [00:30] and the cpu keeps interrupting transfers [00:31] going to have to do this the hardway then === Lcawte is now known as Lcawte|Away [00:56] Currently using NFS for file shares, thinking I should switch to something else over security concerns, it only locks to IP and I want to make my share writable, have this nightmare scenario of someone visiting me one time, jumping on my WiFi, and getting cryptolockered or something :) [00:56] Suggestions of alternative file sharing solutions, or ways to make NFS better? [01:06] make a guest network [01:07] well, I want guests to have access to my network too, I have a RO share exposed so they can access stuff [01:07] and I generally want machines in the LAN to be able to talk to each other, just not be able to write to each other :) [01:09] use cifs! [01:09] finer grained access control than nfs [01:10] I just googled CIFS and I'm confused, I get lots of shit about Windows Shares? [01:10] here we go [01:10] is CIFS and SMB the same? XD [01:10] yes [01:10] ah [01:10] still better than NFS [01:10] ali1234: weird I'm sure it was you who told me to use NFS in the first place... [01:10] (this was years ago) [01:10] i doubt it [01:11] i tell people not to use NFS all the time [01:11] I see [01:11] so that's fairly unanimous then, stop using NFS and start using SMB/CIFS? any recommended docs to follow? [01:12] i would probably go with a combination of upnp for read-only media shares, and sshfs for everything else [01:12] sshfs is slow as balls though [01:12] use arcfour cipher then [01:12] or "none", then it is still authenticated [01:12] also kinda want something XBMC/Kodi supports, so SMB ticks that box too [01:13] so does upnp [01:13] uPnP can't write though :) [01:13] how often do you edit your collection of pirate tv shows? ;) [01:13] ali1234: every time I watch, Kodi updates the NFO file with watched status. [01:13] that's... stupid [01:13] that's... functional baring in mind I have multiple Kodi instances [01:14] i've always used samba with kodi [01:14] works just dandy :> [01:14] yeah samba will work [01:14] just to clear up my head, what's the distinction here between CIFS and SMB? [01:14] CIFS is like samba 2.0 [01:15] so is there a CIFS server, or is it still called Samba? [01:15] still called samba [01:16] righto, thanks :) [01:16] the "standard" they are all based on is called server message block [01:16] "samba" is just one implementation [01:17] jCIFS [01:17] being another === Lcawte|Away is now known as Lcawte [06:07] okay i finally got a clean dump [06:08] the rom has compressed sections which get uncompressed into ram by the first stage bootloader [06:08] but i don't know what arch this thing is... it's probably mips [06:08] http://paste.ubuntu.com/11021051/ sections all start with "9ZZ" [06:09] anyone recognize this compression? [06:10] "zip2006" apparently [06:11] it's not going to be complicated, the decompressor is like 300 bytes [06:25] okay, found all the strings it looks for from the modem, no sign of the strings it sends though [06:27] "Warring: SP1000 Decode code Load ERROR Please Contact sunpirit and reboot system" [07:05] Morning all [07:11] morning all [07:14] Good mornin MooDoo , diplo [07:14] * knightwise is curious if he is going to get a TV Crew or the Newspaper at his house today [07:23] knightwise: why would you? [07:28] knightwise: are you anything to do with the election? [07:36] no no :) i live in Belgium remember :) [07:37] my company is celebrating its one year anniversary and we might get showcased in a news report about 'starting entrepreneurs' [07:41] morning boys and girls. [07:43] morning brobostigon [07:43] morning knightwise [07:51] knightwise: ah of course, well fingers crossed for you [07:52] shame about the election result, i would have hoped, the british public would have got rid of the right wing nutters we have in government. [07:53] yeah well that can go to #ukpolotics can't it :p [07:53] polotics? whats that? [07:53] MooDoo: thanx :) kinda nervous about it. [07:53] typo, i'm a right wing nutter that can't type yet lol [07:54] usually when i'm in front of a camera, I have a say in whats going to happen. [07:54] i see, MooDoo [07:54] mind you, there was much worse right wing nutters, that were standing as well. [07:55] * brobostigon is generalising, that people who are right wing, are also nutters, [07:55] :D [08:08] morning [08:09] morning popey [08:09] brobostigon: i agree with you. depressing isn't it [08:09] g'day [08:09] mornin popey [08:09] very much so popey [08:09] hey brobostigon [08:09] hey bashrc_ [08:09] hi knightwise [08:12] as my dad said, do people has such short memories about the conservatives in the 80's. [08:12] have* [08:13] Morning all [08:13] morning davmor2 [08:15] brobostigon: Time to ditch first-past-the-post I reckon. [08:15] its always been time to ditch fptp [08:15] morning davmor2 [08:15] agreed. [08:15] But then the peasants would have to be listened to! [08:16] +1 on ditching fptp [08:16] make it happen davmor2 [08:16] chop chop [08:16] Can't have the proles deciding things. If they were any good at life, they'd all be rich and stuff. [08:16] * davmor2 touches the post that'll break it [08:17] Hang on, who won South Thanet? [08:18] Sorry "Thanet South" [08:18] there are counting thanet south later this morning [08:19] http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election/2015/results [08:19] Oooo, the tension is palpable [08:19] thats quite a sea of blue & yellow [08:20] maggie simpson [08:20] The swing to the SNP is a bit of a shock - why now *after* the referendum? It's too late [08:20] they will re-run it [08:21] maybe as soon as 2 years from now [08:21] "You will keep voting until you make the correct choice!" [08:21] indeed [08:21] Isn't that how the EU works? [08:21] :) [08:21] "once in a lifetime" [08:22] looks like a conservative landslide, with the libdems demolished [08:22] however I actually think they should split off, wales too [08:22] and cornwall. [08:23] kernow [08:25] before i was a no, now i'm a yes [08:25] but they don't give us englishers the vote on scotland [08:36] I think the North should split from from South; the economies are so different. [08:37] London should aslo split - different again [08:37] In fact, just keep splitting until we are our own countries..... [08:38] "And the abassador from 23 Barnacle Grove is....Ms Amber Miggins." [08:52] TwistedLucidity: no the germans tell europe what to do and they do it [08:52] davmor2: Well, they are paying for it after all.... [09:02] where's jamestait already [09:04] Good morning all; happy Friday, and happy No Socks Day! 😃 [09:05] and VE day [09:07] JamesTait: I have no socks already I must of known that or work from home [09:08] foobarry: yeah which we don't celebrate because we won........wait a minute......we don't have Saint Georges day off and the French celebrate us winning......what's wrong with this Country :D [09:10] maybe VE day could replace may day? [09:10] the 2nd monday in may might be warmer too [09:15] foobarry, maybe it's just me, but it feels like the bank holidays could be spread out better. [09:15] indeed. More bank holidays should be invented [09:15] to fill the gaps [09:16] That could work. ☺ [09:19] Nah. We need to improve worker flexibility and productivity to boost the economoy and stimulate growth. Time to axe Bank Holidays. [09:19] And weekends [09:19] hi guys, anyone know how i can get that keyboard layout detector that runs during the installer to run now? [09:20] i'm running an ubuntu vm on a mac and the keyboard is nigh unusable [09:20] all the layouts I've tried seem to be doing nothing [09:22] * awilkins plugs in an external keyboard when he has to support a Mac [09:23] The main reason I'll never buy a Mac - the special snowflake keyboard layout [09:23] Why they think moving all the programmers characters like curly braces is a good idea I'll never know [09:24] nucc1: Do you have an input switcher icon in the task bar? There was a bit of a problem with Ubuntu always using EN-us a while back, not sure if that affected layout as well. [09:24] i do have a UK keyboard plugged in. it's docked [09:24] aloha [09:24] it works fine on the mac itself, but the VM seems to be totally confused [09:24] TwistedLucidity: yes, the switcher appears to be having no effect [09:25] and to make it even more interesting, when i attempt to launch the control panel keyboard applet in ubuntu, it crashes and asks me to send a report [09:25] czajkowski: you have an x1 carbon right? [09:26] nucc1: You could try looking up how to change the input on an Ubuntu server; the same config changes/tools should work on desktop [09:26] Unless other people have a better idea? [09:28] no use. when i type: "a, ubuntu prints ä [09:28] almost like the alt gr key is stuck, but it definitely isnt. [09:32] How utterly bizzare! [09:33] sudo dpkg-reconfigure keyboard-configuration seems to be the magic [09:33] just did that and rebooted and it's more sane. I chose mac from the list of available keyboards [09:34] i chose a mac because it's got a retina screen, really that's the only reason. it's not proven to be any more reliable or stable than linux on bare hardware was for me [09:35] well, and battery life is light years ahead of everything else. [09:36] garage lost thanet south (as predicted) [09:37] 300 votes for al murray though lol [09:37] conservatives seem to be in the lead according to the Goog [09:38] well in the lead, 5 away from majority [09:38] the real al murray guy seems quite similar to nige [09:39] nucc1: Lots of good things to be said about Apple hardware. Unfortunately there's lots of bad things to be said about it and their business practices as well. [09:39] loves cricket, and the war, and drining pints [09:39] For design and attention to detail, Apple are second-to-none. No denying that. [09:39] me? [09:39] may nigelb too [09:39] maybe# [09:39] Just a shame their WiFi support is such utter garbage (IME at least) [09:40] looks like the seat was too tight to make silly votes like lib dem and al murray [09:40] and al-zebabist nation of ooog [09:41] * TwistedLucidity ponders forming a single-issue party that will bring PR into law, then immediately stand-down and hold an election [09:41] Yeah, I'd love to see magsafe connectors on regular laptops [09:42] * TwistedLucidity promises not to become power hungry..... [09:42] As long as the module was user-replaceable because I hear the contacts wear out [09:44] magsafe is dead [09:44] all hail usb3.1 type c [09:44] awilkins: Well it is replacable; buy a new Mac! [09:44] http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-32622224 [09:44] "For people to be working at night, weekends and holiday on emails is not good for the health of our country," the professor told the BBC. [09:45] another schmuck with a mic :p [09:45] I never check email when off-hours unless there was something urgent I couldn't finish and need some info. [09:45] i check because i don't have a life. [09:45] If there is a disaster, they have my number and can call [09:46] and i like the fact that i can ignore it, because i'm not at work [09:46] popey: I do [09:46] my lovely pretty X1 [09:47] But I do get swamped with email. Must be upwards of a hundred a day - most of it irrelevant garbage I don't need. [09:47] Marked "URGENT! MUST READ!"...usually from sales types where everything is urgent.... [09:47] nucc1: the best solution I've found for the keyboard layout, is to look for an ISO US layout. it's not perfect, but it's much more usable [09:48] I like the notion that Atos is trying to phase out email altogether [09:48] Other collaboration tools are definitely a better idea [09:48] (I've tried to find a better solution, but xkb is a dark dark place) [09:48] Would like to see a hybrid between a ticket tracker, a wiki, and Google Wave [09:49] "We need to ban emails [sent and received] within the same building," he said, advocating instead for face-to-face meetings and phone calls [09:49] oh, thats just silly now [09:49] I think things are slowly converging into that kind of thing [09:49] awilkins: People who send documents by email (rather than placing them into the database) and then expect you to retain it in Outlook for X years need to be shot. [09:49] foobarry: that's why i said "another schmuck with a mic". [09:49] TwistedLucidity, If I was emperor of the company I'd ban document attachments in favour of cloud documents and other collaborative editing for a month [09:49] TwistedLucidity: putting the document in a database/CMS doesn't necessarily make it easy to find. [09:50] indeed. most our documents live in lotus scariness, which is why we just mail them [09:50] the amount of allegedly technical IT people who struggle to use a wiki is unbelieveable [09:50] Also, an email is a company record and subject to retention which may cause problems (unless you suddenly change your retention policy, err, I could cite some recent hacking scandals). Face-to-face convo's are off record. [09:50] We had a document repository [09:50] my solution is to simply put things i think i'll need in an email folder called "Reference" [09:50] Literally no-one used it [09:50] even linux people i've seen strugggle [09:51] nucc1: It makes it very easy to find. But then, that's kinda my job. [09:51] our wiki only works because we've banned people from editing it. there's two of us allowed, and everyone else mails us changes [09:51] lol [09:51] where's the internal documentation though? [09:51] wiki is a godo collaborative toool for encourage people to document their own work [09:51] south tharnet in 2000 vote majority for the conservatives [09:52] Banning edits on wikis means you have the wrong culutre [09:52] I got my users to write their own manuals on their wiki! [09:52] it's mostly because wikis suck [09:52] Suck in terms of execution or concept? [09:52] A wiki is a living thing - some some use cases you need a line in the sand, which is where documents are handy [09:52] in execution. I haven't yet found one where I can trust a user to edit a table without having to go clean up after them [09:53] TwistedLucidity, Gollum wiki? (or other wiki in a VCS)? [09:53] if wikis aren't actively curated then they tend to turn into spam over time [09:54] awilkins: Hmm...not sure how that would work really. I guess one could to the auditing and e-signing in a VCS; but would be clunky. [09:54] especially anything that uses colspan or rowspan. doubly-so anything that expects the user to add the correct values for same said [09:54] Also, printing it would could be problematic I guess. [09:54] shauno: i use twiki and enforce raw edit mode [09:54] my "users" are technical though [09:54] TwistedLucidity, For a while I was trying to foster the use of pull requests as a means of editing all our collaborative works [09:55] markdown + github could be a next step though.. [09:55] TwistedLucidity, People use Markdown to write print books - don't see why printing it can't work [09:55] And haven't you heard - print is dead ;-) [09:55] most of ours are hardware-technical, not markup-technical [09:55] awilkins: I was more thinking of Contents, Intro, Chapters, Glossary, Index etc [09:56] And then watermarkig etc etc [09:56] Although that could probably be solved in other ways. [09:56] Basically - arse covering. [09:57] we just don't print stuff. printing is bad. hardcopies are out of date, and usually immesurably so [09:57] TwistedLucidity, Nothing stopping you having pages for those things, and a script that prints their links in sequence as the book [09:58] But yes, print is worse than mailing documents around [09:58] newsappers are out of date too [09:58] They're both dead [09:58] even todays freshest papers were old news [09:59] awilkins: That'd be nice, but our customers would never work that way and as part of "dog fooding" we use our own stuff, so we don't work that way [09:59] Maybe in 20 years or so they'll have moved forward. [09:59] Everything is done in Outlook - it's depressing [10:00] Outlook. Ugh [10:00] Yeah, we just had a meeting discussing collaborative work on a business prospect [10:00] The resistance would also be "A wiki is not WYSIWYG", "A wiki doe snot integrate with Excel", "I can't draw graphs", "I can't edit off-line" and so on. [10:00] We're going to stick it all in a spreadsheet [10:01] Wikis are great, we have one, but they are not a universal tool for all documentation [10:01] Although we vastly over-use Word docs; many of those would be much, much better in a good wiki (e.g. user help) [10:01] But what do I know... [10:02] ...setting up VisualStudio 2013 is an utter abhorrance... [10:02] Not tried that in years :-) [10:02] I just use SharpDevelop for all my Windows programming where possible now [10:02] Not that I do much [10:04] TwistedLucidity: visualstudio is still the best IDE out there… the IntelliJ stuff comes a close second [10:04] xcode isn't bad too. [10:04] Anjuta is just outrageously dumb [10:04] nucc1: Yeah, that's the sad thing. It really is quite good. I use Eclipse mostly and that is becoming increasing dreadful [10:06] Quite like IntelliJ; Maven support is far superior to Eclipse. [10:06] I tried eclipse recently. it seems to suffer from gimp syndrome? [10:06] need to google to remember how to do stuff? [10:07] eg it's perfectly capable, but the UI is the result of two blind guys having a foodfight [10:07] gimp single window mode is default nowadays isn't it? [10:07] still i struggle [10:07] what is wrong with the eclipse ui? [10:08] Can't say the Eclipse GUI is any worse than IntelliJ or VS; I just change the defauls to suit my taste/needs. It seems to start out...sub-optimal [10:09] I couldn't find anything I was looking for. I'll admit I didn't spent too long, it felt like Iwas getting into an argument that I didn't need to be in [10:09] intrbiz: To start, the entire "workspace" concept as a flat structure [10:09] working sets [10:09] one thing I'd like to be able to configure, is line spacing, so I can have 1.5 spacing [10:09] projects down the left, code in the middle, console at bottom, basically covers it [10:10] intrbiz: I should need to configure that - all the details are already in Maven; Eclipse should simply respect it. [10:11] As IntelliJ does. [10:11] It's not a deal-breaker, just an annoyance. [10:11] minor issue frankly [10:12] maven support could be better in a number of places [10:12] Took me a sodding age to get Maven working, having to continually re-iterate what plug-in runs in what phase is a apin [10:13] But there is one, massive failing with Eclipse; the compiler. [10:13] It needs to burn [10:13] what is wrong with the eclipse compiler? [10:13] (Or I need to find a way to separate the Eclipse output from the Maven compile) [10:13] intrbiz: It can lead to non-running code appearing to compile and get deployed onto dev servers [10:14] Due to the insertion of various bytecode shenanigans. [10:14] Just use the defaul Java compiler and be done with it [10:14] well, that's what a build server is for [10:15] Yes, it doesn't affect a nightly build; but it affects day-to-day work when you are pushing your current dev code to a server [10:15] personally only had one issue with eclipse compiler, which was being able to compile some Java 8 syntax that Oracles compiler could not [10:15] TwistedLucidity: if it's a bug in the compiler, report it [10:16] Problem is, Eclipse will spit-out a .class for non-compiling code. If you then run Maven, it thinks that .class is valid and adds it into the .jar; boom! [10:16] intrbiz: It's not a bug, it's by design! [10:16] ah, ok, well that's incremental [10:16] so, maven clean first [10:16] tl;dr: java is evil. switch to mono [10:16] When we used Ant, we had the Eclipse and Ant output separate to avoid such an issue [10:17] intrbiz: Can't, the build would take too long. Fixing this is on my ever growing list..... [10:18] I am sure some of these problems are caused by how we manage our code... [10:19] i'm looking at the code for ssldump and the darn thing seems to have two main() functions :( [10:20] main() and mainerer()? [10:20] both are main, in two different files [10:20] one is in main.c, and appears to do little other than print help, and the other is in lex.yy.c [10:24] seems like it was written on purpose to filter out dummies like myself [10:24] and probably no surprise the program is now unmaintained [10:27] can't wireshark do what you need? [10:27] i'm trying to see if i'm capable of patching ssldump to output JSON instead of the garbage it puts out currently [10:27] quite often, it helps to get the data in text [10:28] makes searching easier [10:29] so this is me trying to workout the control flow so i can see where i need to edit. shouldn't be too hard, i imagine, if the program wasn't so opaque [10:30] i just thought about it, and the hurdles I've had to jump to get here :) [10:32] i often have to deal with ssldump generated output. usually i get a pre-master-secret file which is useful for wireshark, and then the text from ssldump too, which helps for finding out which connection you should be looking at. [10:32] in wireshark, it's hard to find a specific message. [10:32] in ssldump, it's easy with grep, but then more difficult to follow a particular conversation [10:33] because the output of ssldump is a bit unpredictable and needlessly complicated, it's difficult to make an automated tool to arrange the output into conversations. [10:33] i wrote one which works reasonably well, but in order to make it fool-proof, ssldump needs to use an output format that is more amenable to scripted processing [10:34] I've had some things that the javac compiler can't parse and the Eclipse one can [10:35] 'twas annnoying because it would test fine and not build on the CI server [10:35] It was something really silly like comma placement in enums stretched over multiple lines [10:35] ssldump output is not that simple. [10:36] it uses two prefixes on each line to identify connection serial, and packet number. [10:36] so for example: "1 10 …" means connection #1, packet #10 and what follows are some metadata [10:36] the payload of "1 10" is then indented after that heading, using tabs. [10:37] relatively easy for a human to deduce. slightly complex for a program but still possible. [10:37] problem is, the output is not ordered according to connection, but rather in packet order, and we know packets have no sense of order [10:37] and in some cases, ssldump will completely forget to indent the payload === Lcawte is now known as Lcawte|Away [10:42] So Farage quit...huh...a politician who actually kept their word! [10:43] quit? [10:43] that's what he wants you to think :p === Lcawte|Away is now known as Lcawte [10:59] TwistedLucidity, he sort-of-quit... but will consider whether to stand for the leader election in September. ☺ [10:59] Quick question to confirm : does the "encrypt my disk" in Ubuntu use LUKS on LVM or LVM on LUKS (I think it's LVM on LUKS becuse a LUKS partition is being used as a physical volume in the ubuntu-vg volume group [11:05] awilkins, correct: http://askubuntu.com/questions/275921/what-algorithm-is-used-by-disk-utility-encryption [11:09] OerHeks, Ta [11:10] NOOOOOO, broke mah VM === Lcawte is now known as Lcawte|Away [11:39] do you still have the sandbox it came in? :-) [12:41] Struggling with maths in bas [12:41] h [12:41] Have a number in a shell script [12:42] Trying to calculate that number + 512 + (THAT_NUMBER %512) [12:42] Just running into lots of syntax errors [12:42] Can do it on the command line, same stuff in a script chucks an error [12:42] Arrgh [12:44] your script is using #!/bin/sh instead of /bin/bash? [12:44] Nope [12:44] Even explicitly running it as sudo bash