=== howefield_afk is now known as howefield [13:01] pleia2: heya, i will not be able to make a catchup. [13:02] pleia2: w.r.t. to current developers there are no active developers that i know off, that have upload rights, yet would somehow fail dmb (... or at least fail to get +1 from) requirements for their upload rights. [13:03] pleia2: there has been little applications lately, but i guess it's because we were frozen. === maxb_ is now known as maxb [13:51] xnox: oh let it go will you ;) [13:51] * MooDoo must trying to stop being funny [15:01] o/ [15:01] o/ [15:02] o/ [15:02] o/ [15:03] \o [15:03] * stgraber waves [15:04] hello hello [15:04] \o [15:05] #startmeeting [15:05] Meeting started Thu Jun 4 15:05:07 2015 UTC. The chair is slangasek. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology. [15:05] Available commands: action commands idea info link nick [15:05] [TOPIC] Lightning round === meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: Lightning round [15:05] $ echo $(shuf -e barry doko stgraber jodh bdmurray slangasek caribou infinity mvo sil2100 robru cyphermox) [15:05] mvo bdmurray infinity stgraber jodh doko sil2100 barry slangasek cyphermox robru caribou [15:05] mvo not here? bdmurray [15:06] continued to work on improvements to apport-retrace to check launchpad for packages not available in archive or on ddebs.u.c [15:06] tested issue with apport-retrace and StacktraceSource being inadequate [15:06] wrote a job to backfill system image counters for systems without an alias [15:06] tested backfill system image counters for systems without an alias [15:06] investigation into error tracker oops reports for webops [15:06] checked on error tracker status because of PS4 issues [15:06] submitted RT to have errors_static_url updated [15:06] updated error tracker assets with Wily Werewolf milestones [15:06] foundations bug triage [15:06] ✔ done [15:06] - Kernel SRU wrangling [15:06] - Dealt with maas SRUs [15:06] - General SRU and AA work [15:06] - Worked on lts-vivid debian-installer upload, and other HWE bits [15:06] - Validating lts-vivid d-i on 6 architectures [15:06] - Start on reinstalling arm64 buildds with distro kernels [15:06] - Got Mir building on ppc/ppc64el [15:06] (done) [15:07] LXC, LXD and other container stuff. Working on features for LXD 0.11 to be released next Tuesday. [15:07] 3 of the 4 LXD/container talks we submitted to LinuxCon/ContainerCon were accepted, so dealing with the logistic of all that a bit. [15:07] I'm also off tomorrow, then working from Europe next week but only on Monday, Tuesday and Thursday, taking the rest of the week off. [15:08] (DONE) [15:08] * snappy [15:08] - selftests [15:08] - working on failure scenario tests [15:08] - debugging /boot/grub corruption issue. [15:08] ???? [15:10] ah, doko is off today [15:10] as is sil2100 [15:10] barry: [15:10] si: LP: #1444347; reviewed lp:~caio1982/ubuntu-system-image/remote-sis-generator-skips-metadata [15:10] Launchpad bug 1444347 in Ubuntu system image "A file with link count 2 doesn't get both links updated" [Critical,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1444347 [15:10] snappy: several discussions & gdoc reviews [15:10] debuntu: zope.interface 4.1.2-1 (investigating); python-cachecontrol 0.11.5-1; python-persistent 4.1.0-1 and 4.1.1-1; pip 7 dependencies; python-chameleon-2.22-1 (and debian bug #770136 debian bug #752293); enum34 1.0.4-1; python-pex 1.0.0-1; flufl.password 1.3-2 [15:10] Debian bug 770136 in python3-chameleon "python3-chameleon: unowned files after purge (policy 6.8, 10.8): /usr/lib/python3/dist-packages/chameleon/tests/inputs/__pycache__/*.cpython-34.pyc" [Important,Open] http://bugs.debian.org/770136 [15:10] Debian bug 752293 in src:python-chameleon "src:python-chameleon: missing license information (Python License)" [Normal,Fixed] http://bugs.debian.org/752293 [15:10] also: chasing weird python3.4 and python3.5 wily promotion failures [15:10] other: python issue 23968 (platform triplets in sys.path) [15:10] --done-- [15:11] * worked through autopilot SRU, and the issues with it being built by the train [15:11] * ongoing discussions around go, go shared library support landing upstream [15:11] * triaging new list of incoming requests for ppc64el in 15.10 [15:11] * with barry, landed fix to hardlink delta handling in s-i server [15:12] * dropped a transitional channel from the system-image server, because it was moving users from the BQ custom tarball to the community custom tarball with ill effect [15:12] * updated update-notifier to use python3 instead of python2 now that its dependencies are in place [15:12] * tracking of shim signing request to Microsoft [15:12] (done) [15:12] cyphermox: [15:12] * grub2 OsIndicationsSupported fwsetup entry fix for OVMF_1f. (bug 1456911) [15:12] * completing the localechooser merge. [15:12] * UEFI Capsule support [15:12] bug 1456911 in grub2 (Ubuntu) "Ubuntu installation/update-grub fail on specific BIOS" [Critical,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1456911 [15:12] * re-enable audit support for shadow (bug 1414817) [15:12] * update casper and system-config-kickstart for localechooser. [15:12] * debugging mark-pending-current with plars [15:12] bug 1414817 in shadow (Ubuntu) "[Ubuntu 15.04] Ubuntu should audit account modification events" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1414817 [15:12] * ubiquity update for wily and new installer bits [15:12] * merge multipath-tools (started) [15:12] (done) [15:12] * Bileto [15:12] - Implemented disk-backed session store so that more than one worker process function correctly [15:12] - Added lplib support [15:12] - Collected all 6 packages that needed to be backported to trusty in a single PPA. [15:12] - Successful local charm deployment [15:12] - New test suite with 93% coverage [15:12] - improved spreadsheet data import on first run [15:12] * cu2d [15:12] - Improved error message when user tries to build trunk against an older ubuntu series [15:12] - fixed bug in handling of manual source packages [15:12] (done) [15:13] caribou: [15:13] slangasek: didn't you get what I just pasted ? [15:13] Bugfix : [15:13] - Squid deb proxy startup race condition (Bug: 1456662) [15:13] in this channel? no [15:13] bug 1456662 in squid-deb-proxy (Ubuntu Trusty) "squid-deb-proxy fails to resolve dns entry : needs to be restarted" [Medium,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1456662 [15:14] * Completed SRU [15:14] - Ceph interference during kdump-tools execution (Bug: 1461429) [15:14] bug 1461429 in ceph (Ubuntu Trusty) "ceph-osd early start interferes with kdump-tools during kernel dump" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1461429 [15:14] * Identified udev rule as part of the OSD startup problem [15:14] - Internal wiki cleanup [15:14] (done) [15:14] cool, thanks [15:14] any questions? [15:15] barry: what are the snappy discussions you're in right now? python-related, or something else? [15:15] slangasek: mostly python related [15:15] * slangasek nods [15:15] i.e. next step in python snaps [15:17] [TOPIC] AOB === meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: AOB [15:17] you might all be interested to know that multiple architecture support in scalingstack is coming along [15:18] I understand we're able to deploy ppc64el compute nodes in the stack, even if they're not allowed to talk to the network afterwards ;) [15:18] That bit's a problem with the openstack setup in Boston in general, not ppc. [15:18] FWIW. [15:18] so that's exciting and hopefully we'll see more efficient use of our ppc64el hardware soon... as well as our new arm64 hardware coming online for use [15:18] (amd64 instances also can't talk to the world) [15:18] * slangasek nods [15:19] infinity: any new updates on that today, or is that the current state? [15:19] Nothing new from me. [15:19] also, once we have this working on scalingstack, the next step is to do the same in canonistack so that anyone can request a power or arm64 VM when they need it \o/ [15:20] nice [15:20] yay [15:20] (not in prodstack though, because none of us needs to run our production services on anything but the default architecture in prodstack :) [15:21] Bah. prodstack will be 100% POWER by the end of 2017. [15:21] ok, but you still won't get to /request/ a POWER compute node in prodstack ;) [15:21] (Dear irresponsible Linux "journalists", please take the above out of context without noting the sarcasm) [15:22] it's actually just going to be the result of linguistic drift [15:22] prodstack -> pordstack -> powrdstack [15:22] porkstack seems a more likely destination. [15:23] will our DCEs be responsible for basting it as it slowly rotates? [15:23] anyway [15:23] anything else? :) [15:23] slangasek: one turn cold side, one turn hot side. you need large pork. [15:24] nothing else for the meeting ;) [15:24] #endmeeting === meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: Ubuntu Meeting Grounds | Calendar/Scheduled meetings: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/calendar | Logs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs | Meetingology documentation: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology [15:24] Meeting ended Thu Jun 4 15:24:56 2015 UTC. [15:24] Minutes: http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2015/ubuntu-meeting.2015-06-04-15.05.moin.txt [15:24] thanks, all :) [15:25] thanks! [15:25] slangasek: thank! [15:25] thanks! === howefield is now known as howefield_afk [16:59] hello everyone [16:59] hey [16:59] o/ [16:59] CC catchup with the desktop team and DMB starting now [17:00] hey hey [17:00] dholbach: pleia2 czajkowski elfy [17:00] meeting time [17:00] yep, pinged the other folks as well [17:00] o/ [17:01] #startmeeting CC catchup with the desktop team and DMB [17:01] Meeting started Thu Jun 4 17:01:00 2015 UTC. The chair is mhall119. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology. [17:01] Available commands: action commands idea info link nick === meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: Ubuntu Meeting Grounds | Calendar/Scheduled meetings: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/calendar | Logs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs | Meetingology documentation: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology | CC catchup with the desktop team and DMB Meeting | Current topic: [17:01] #chair cprofitt dholbach pleia2 [17:01] Current chairs: cprofitt dholbach mhall119 pleia2 [17:01] hello all [17:01] #topic Catch up with the Desktop Team === meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: Ubuntu Meeting Grounds | Calendar/Scheduled meetings: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/calendar | Logs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs | Meetingology documentation: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology | CC catchup with the desktop team and DMB Meeting | Current topic: Catch up with the Desktop Team [17:01] hi sabdfl [17:01] hi willcooke and seb128, anyone else here for the desktop team? [17:01] hey seb128 and willcooke - how are things? [17:01] mhall119, dholbach - just us I think [17:01] hey there! things are good :-) [17:02] right, so it's exciting times for the desktop team isn't it? :) [17:02] loving the steady stream of news [17:02] mhall119, it's always exciting time in some ways ;-) [17:02] How was the feedback from the last release? Did you get many bug reports? [17:03] Release was solid [17:03] Really impressive considering the under-the-hood changes [17:03] how is the convergence going? What exciting things should we expect on 15.10 and 16.04? [17:03] willcooke: you mean systemd? [17:03] feedback was mostly good, we got reports, as always, but not too many [17:03] mhall119, ya [17:04] willcooke: I didn't notice any difference, so very well done to all on that [17:04] kudos to pitti and didrocks [17:04] cprofitt, 15.10 will see a Snappy based Desktop Next [17:04] ready for testing and playing [17:04] Good news is that the image is now booting :) [17:04] The only issue I have had so far is the trash launcher opening up an extra file window. More annoying than anything critical. I would agree it was a good launch. [17:04] willcooke: what is the play for making that available to people? [17:05] will it be an ISO, a disk image, a VM image? [17:06] mhall119, it'll be an "image" to start with but there is installer work currently being looked at by the Snappy team [17:06] awesome [17:06] Did you get offers of help for the brave new desktop world? Or new folks who hangout in the channel? [17:07] so everyone knows, I'll be working with will's team this cycle in my capacity on the Community Team to get more information out to users who wants to try out, test, and contribute to Unity 8 and snappy desktop [17:07] dholbach, not really no [17:07] I think it's a bit too new still [17:07] do you think there's enough contributors could do to help out? [17:07] we are likely to get more people once things get going [17:07] mhall119: just to be clear is there 'normal' desktop and 'snappy' desktop? [17:07] ok..... still a bit too bleeding edge? [17:08] cprofitt: there will be both yes [17:08] IIRC, the "snappy" desktop will only be Mir and Unity 8 [17:08] correct [17:08] But there are also interesting things going on in the "normal" desktop for U8 and Mir too... [17:08] dholbach, yeah, I guess so [17:08] cprofitt: though don't get too used to calling the previous way of doing things "normal" :) [17:08] You can run a U8 session on your desktop [17:09] willcooke: you mean the LXC packages? [17:09] and also there is work going on to allow Mir to run in a special way on top of X org, [17:09] so for example [17:09] seb128, let us know when you feel it's the right time to reach out to people - I know that many are waiting for the cool new thing - it'd be great if we could involve some of them :) [17:09] If you're developing an app with Mir, you'll be able to test it our there on your U7/Xorg desktop with out changing sessions [17:09] +1 dholbach yes, the desktop side of the house is waiting for the next cool thing. [17:10] dholbach, yeah [17:10] Not many of us have devices to help with 'touch'. [17:10] cool [17:10] willcooke: so once people have a running instance of Mir/Unity8 from whatever way they get it running, what can they do to help make the snappy desktop better for 15.10? [17:11] mhall119, besides testing and bug reports - I'd like to see folk using the new Snappy tools and starting to get a good catalogue of apps going [17:12] touch devices are rare now, but will become more widespread with win8 / win10 [17:12] has there been any discussion of installing snappy apps on a deb system? [17:13] some, but not loads yet. We need to sort out the confinement story, and X org makes that hard. [17:14] We could get a container working for that though I expect [17:15] willcooke: so far all of our snappy packaging docs have been around cloud/IoT apps, what do we have for packaging apps written with the Ubuntu SDK, and is it ready to publish on developer.u.c? [17:16] mhall119, didrocks is working on that this cycle. If he hasn't already contacted you about it, he will be soon [17:16] perfect, thanks [17:16] nice :-) [17:16] He was at the SDK sprint this week, so he's full of good ideas :) [17:17] cool, we should have a chat next week :) [17:17] willcooke: do you have a short list of apps targeted for default inclusion in snappy desktop? I know we brainstormed a big list in London [17:17] At the moment it looks like: [17:18] and is that something community folks can get involved in helping with now, or are there things blocking that work currently? [17:18] Gedit, Chromium, Libreoffice, Gimp, xchat [17:18] plus all the default apps from the phone [17:18] for the first release they will be part of the image [17:18] but we want to start moving them out in to snaps asap [17:19] good timing that the core apps folks are working on convergence features now :-) [17:19] so once the docs are there, and Xmir is in the archive for legacy apps - have at it [17:19] dholbach: almost like it was planned that way :) [17:19] dholbach, how about that! It's almost like we planned it ;) [17:19] ha [17:19] :) [17:20] right, switching gears a bit and going back to Unity 7, I saw that Wily has started syncing with Debian and getting the new Gnome stuff, what's the workload expected there and how can people help? [17:20] oh, @ default apps - plus the SDK of course [17:20] mhall119, good question, so... [17:21] we are working on ways to reduce our maintenance overhead every time we sync with upstream Gnome [17:21] because it is a fair whack of work [17:21] I saw a couple of folks helping out with merges and uploads of new versions from gnome [17:22] yeah, we've got a some really excellent help there, especially from the Ubuntu Gnome team [17:22] which version of gnome are we going to use this cycle? are we still blocked where some gnome modules can't be updated? [17:22] I was just going to ask if they were able to help [17:22] how about the MATE team? [17:22] dholbach, 3.16 [17:22] dont think we're blocked, seb128? [17:23] we are not [17:23] always good news to hear [17:23] one thing which came up in the past was how things worked with other flavours such as xubuntu and ubuntu gnome - are you aware of any current blockers for them? [17:23] mhall119, @ MATE, I think they are using a much earlier version [17:23] dholbach, no, I don't think so [17:23] Shouldnt be any blockers for xubuntu [17:24] we just updated gtk to 3.16 today [17:24] pleia2: ^^ [17:24] and we're working closely with U.Gnome [17:24] cool... I'm happy that this is largely untangled <3 [17:24] so should be smoothish sailing there [17:24] plus we've been doing this for a while now, so the guys have got a good process in place [17:25] is there anything where the desktop team could need some help with? [17:25] how are we doing w.r.t. collaboration and coordination around Qt needs for KDE and U8? [17:25] pitchforks and torches aside :) [17:26] * sabdfl updates to gtk 3.16... [17:26] Qt coordination has been good so far, everybody benefits from getting newer versions and understands that we need to do proper testing and ensure there are no regressions before updating [17:26] so there are been not many frictions so far [17:26] mhall119: I don't know about any of that [17:27] dholbach, there might be some interesting work to do with us on the Gtk Mir backend and the Chromium Mir backend [17:27] ok [17:27] we're working on it, but it's a big and interesting problem to solve [17:27] glad to hear that [17:27] seb128: I recall Kubuntu doing a lot of work to get Qt packages building and CI processes in place for Debian, are we taking advantage of that? [17:27] seb128, do you know if the KDE folks also have some regression tests in the archive? [17:28] mhall119, the more testing is done the better [17:28] so yeah, them doing extra CI/testing is welcome and useful [17:28] dholbach, unsure how much they have [17:28] ok [17:29] Mirv would probably know [17:29] seb128: I mean are we running the same tests after we import to our archives? [17:29] I guess so [17:29] and contributing fixes or additional tests back to the debian setup [17:29] mhall119, autopkg tests shipped with the package yes [17:31] alright, we're halfway through our hour, are there any other questions for the Desktop team? [17:31] I'm enjoying the new weekly meeting summary emails :) [17:31] so thanks for doing those now [17:31] I think I'm done - thanks a lot Desktop Team! :-) [17:31] thanks! [17:31] yes, thank you desktop team. [17:31] yes, it's great to see those on the mailing lists [17:32] pleia2, welcome, and I'll cc the news team too [17:32] willcooke: appreciated [17:32] #topic Catch up with the Developer Membership Board === meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: Ubuntu Meeting Grounds | Calendar/Scheduled meetings: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/calendar | Logs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs | Meetingology documentation: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology | CC catchup with the desktop team and DMB Meeting | Current topic: Catch up with the Developer Membership Board [17:32] o/ [17:32] 06:01:30 < xnox> pleia2: heya, i will not be able to make a catchup. [17:32] 06:02:40 < xnox> pleia2: w.r.t. to current developers there are no active developers that i know off, that have upload rights, yet would somehow fail dmb (... or at least fail to get +1 from) requirements for their upload rights. [17:32] 06:03:04 < xnox> pleia2: there has been little applications lately, but i guess it's because we were frozen. [17:32] ^^ got that earlier [17:33] o/ [17:33] bdmurray: Laney micahg ScottK stgraber anyone here for the CC catchup? [17:33] hey micahg [17:33] hey hey [17:33] hi mhall119 [17:33] how are yo all doing? [17:34] yep, I'm here too [17:34] dholbach: doing alright! [17:34] cyphermox: ah,sorry, I knew I forgot someone [17:34] no worries. [17:35] so how many developer applications have you had over the last cycle? [17:35] rough estimate is fine [17:35] not too many [17:35] oh my. micahg, do you know of a number? there weren't any since I got on the DMB [17:35] less than a dozen I think [17:35] probably much less... [17:36] micahg: and what areas of the project have those been coming from? [17:36] well, Xubuntu has had some interest [17:37] oh, hrm, that might have been before this last cycle [17:37] still good to know :) [17:37] I could imagine that people in smaller communities have a bit more of encouraging each other to apply for upload rights. [17:38] To some I guess it's still somewhat daunting... or just don't think of applying and always ask for sponsorship of their uploads. [17:38] a little interest from cloud team and one for Firefox as well apparently... [17:38] micahg: how about from Ubuntu Gnome or MATE flavors? [17:38] Ubuntu GNOME has at least one uploader from several cycles back, no one from MATE has applied yet [17:39] is anyone asking people who frequently ask for and get sponsorships to apply? [17:39] dholbach: do we have any metrics that will show which people we should reach out to? [17:40] the developer advisory team unfortunately had to close down because everyone was busy with other things [17:40] I've recommended Martin Wimpress to apply from the MATE team, since I've sponsored a few uploads for him [17:40] cyphermox: what was his reaction to that? [17:41] but maybe we could generally just ask on the mailing list and see who feels like they got a lot sponsored and have a (maybe private?) chat with them... [17:41] as I recall (it was before christmas), he was interested but wanted to wait to get the flavor built with official isos, I should reach out again and possibly mentor [17:41] that's a fair idea [17:42] cyphermox, I'll note it down as something we could maybe plan together :) [17:42] sure [17:42] excellent :) [17:42] dholbach: thanks for taking that work item [17:43] I'm not quite sure... was the question about quorum/voting process sufficiently cleared? [17:43] cyphermox: any other plans for this next cycle to try and boost the number of applicants? [17:44] it coming up surprised me a bit since I couldn't remember any cases of governance boards running into the issue [17:44] not sure if that's the right meeting to raise that, but the DMB hasn't reviewed Bjoern's application for libreoffice despite several requests/emails to review that again, it's blocked for over a year and not sure what's the way out [17:45] the DMB has always had a different standard for votes, most probably due to the seriousness and impact of rights being granted [17:46] could seb128's request be added to the DMB's agenda again? [17:46] boosting the number of applicants> it's not exactly something we've discussed so much, aside from how recent changes in the project may have affected people's motivation to apply. for instance, when you can get things in through the CI train, you don't think as much of applying to get upload rights [17:46] micahg, you had a different voting process for different kinds of upload rights? [17:46] seb128: IIRC, he was rejected and hasn't officially re-applied, at least that was the conclusion at our last catchup [17:46] seb128: has he officially re-applied? [17:46] mhall119, define "officially" [17:47] we emailed the DMB asking for application to be re-reviewed [17:47] the email got ignored [17:47] dholbach: no, the standard was +4 instead of just a simple majority with quorum present [17:47] seb128: whatever the DMB's process is for applications [17:47] seb128: the process is that he should reapply [17:47] seb128: I haven't seen a new application from Bjoern since I've been on the DMB, he probably should send an email to the board? [17:47] micahg, ok, then I misunderstood [17:47] that's the easiest way for it to be reconsidered [17:47] micahg, he's not interested to re-apply due to the way he was treated last time [17:47] ah :( [17:47] so I sent an email asking for his application to be re-reviewed [17:47] would have been nice to consider it/respond [17:47] seb128: so what would you like the DMB to do? [17:48] could the DMB still go and check the current state of things for his application and move on? [17:48] and give him a headsup? [17:48] mhall119, re-review his applications without asking him to do whoknowswhatisneeded [17:48] as an act of courtesy and in the interest of moving on? [17:49] seb128: I'm unclear what you're asking, and perhaps the DMB is too, areyou asking them to review his application as if he has re-applied? Or just give feedback to him on it so that he can decide to reapply or not? [17:49] mhall119, last time nobody told him clearly what needed to be worked on [17:49] or changed [17:49] so we asked for clarification/re-review his application [17:49] not sure why we just can't get those details [17:49] ok, so he needs feedback so he can fix his application before re-applying, is that the case? [17:49] yes [17:50] he's not wanting to re-apply without being told what was the issue/wrong with the previous application [17:50] seb128: I'll happily look over his application and work it out with him [17:50] micahg: cyphermox: can you guys try and get that feedback to bjorn in the next week or so? [17:50] cyphermox, thanks [17:50] thanks cyphermox [17:50] thanks a lot... I'm superhappy if we can figure this out [17:50] ah, I'll try to get that done today or tomorrow, otherwise I'm on vacation for two weeks [17:50] thanks cyphermox [17:51] cyphermox, enjoy the vac ;-) [17:51] seb128: if this is still blocked in a month, please let us know so we can followup on it, we don't want this to wait for the next round of catchups [17:51] yes, have a good time [17:51] mhall119, k [17:51] is there anything you feel the CC could help the DMB with? [17:53] sounds like not :) [17:53] well, there's one issue we wanted to bring up, with the recent brouhaha with the CC and the KC, it's resulted in at least one developer no longer working on new releases (http://scarlettgatelyclark.com/2015/kubuntu-statement-from-a-not-so-important-kubuntu-developer), who happened to have been the most active uploader for vivid (http://people.ubuntuwire.org/~stefanor/ubuntu-activity/) [17:54] developer motivation seems to be an issue [17:54] micahg, we are working with the KC on resolving this [17:54] micahg: yes, we were all very sad to see that happen, we are trying to work on mending the relationship with the KC and moving forward [17:55] the MOTU channel is hardly active anymore, it seems most of the development focus is in the flavors [17:55] micahg, that's true - but I think the decline happened much earlier than the recent developments [17:56] yes, but we do need people to look after $everything_else [17:56] dholbach: indeed, it's been happening for a while now [17:56] but I'd figure I'd highlight the recent big blow [17:56] for example: we didn't have anyone organising another "learn packaging" event or somebody who said "let's fix some bugs together - here's a list of stuff" [17:56] micahg: understood, thanks for bring that up [17:57] and I think it's understandable if people work on flavours [17:57] micahg: cyphermox: other than mending fences, do you have any recommendations or ideas for boosting motivation? [17:57] where the focus is smaller and the set of problems to work on is much more targetted [17:57] I think that might be a contributing factor as well [17:58] yes, but it also has the unfortunate side effect of siloing things sometiems [17:58] that might not be a bad thing, of some people focus on their silo, as long as there is another (smaller) group working across those silos [17:58] mhall119: well, I know that dholbach used to do a lot of activities to help spurn developer interest back in the day, I'm not sure anyones is doing that anymore [17:58] micahg: do you think some of the steam has to do with the recent focus on clound and touch? [17:59] micahg: I hope you meant spur :) [17:59] pleia2: yes, spur [17:59] pleia2: he's *very* persuasive :) [17:59] hehe [17:59] micahg: can the DMB pick up some of those activities? [18:00] or give it to one specific person in the DMB [18:00] maybe cycling it through each month? [18:00] and/or we could bring it up on the mailing list and see who would be willing to organise a small thing soon [18:00] it's something to discuss, we can add it to the agenda [18:00]