[02:25] <difol> hi all
[02:25] <difol> I have issue with my ubuntu
[02:25] <difol> root@human:~# ubuntu-device-flash --channel=devel --bootstrap
[02:25] <difol> DEPRECATED: Implicit 'touch' subcommand assumed
[02:25] <difol> 2015/06/17 10:21:59 Expecting the device to be in the bootloader... waiting
[02:25] <difol> 2015/06/17 10:21:59 Device is |mako|
[02:25] <difol> 2015/06/17 10:22:01 Flashing version 2 from devel channel and server https://system-image.ubuntu.com to device mako
[02:25] <difol> 2015/06/17 10:22:01 mkdir /root/.cache: permission denied
[02:26] <difol> anyone can help?
[02:28] <RAOF> difol: Why are you doing that as root?
[02:29] <difol> yes root
[02:30] <difol> why? cannot running on root?
[02:31] <RAOF> It's not necessary to run that command as root, and that might be a cause of your problem.
[02:31] <difol> I'll try.. thank you so much now is running
[04:25] <mowgli> I have some porting questions
[04:45] <ArchNET> hi
[04:46] <ArchNET> help me
[04:48] <ArchNET> im trying to configure windows server 2012 / dns server and active directory
[05:57] <fooloop> morning everyone :)
[05:57] <Sleep_Walker> morning
[05:57] <Sleep_Walker> fooloop: were you able to setup your WPA Enterprise already?
[05:58] <fooloop> no, sorry, just have a new job and also have to sort out stuff for my graduate programme, working > 40hrs a week as a result. :/
[05:59] <Sleep_Walker> heh, OK
[05:59] <fooloop> I have not even had time to do anything except some brief looking through the shell and the layout
[05:59] <fooloop> :/
[05:59] <Sleep_Walker> well, it is possible to create manually configuration
[06:00] <fooloop> using networkmnager or wpa_config?
[06:00] <Sleep_Walker> it took some time to find correct for maintly due to nonsensical messages of NetworkManager
[06:01] <Sleep_Walker> NM's configuration
[06:01] <fooloop> As long as no customers turn up I will be looking through docs :)
[06:01] <Sleep_Walker> grab your config on desktop and start with that :)
[06:01] <Sleep_Walker> and good luck
[06:01] <fooloop> :)
[06:01] <fooloop> thank you
[06:01] <Sleep_Walker> important message is that it _is_ possible :b
[06:02] <fooloop> :)
[06:03] <fooloop> I am just going to have to rtfm first, before I pretend to know what I am talking about haha
[06:20] <Sleep_Walker> just to be sure about CVE-2015-1328 - overlayfs is not used, right?
[06:20] <Sleep_Walker> I can't see it anywhere, kernel is old (but there still could be some backports)
[06:30] <lotuspsychje> popey: http://news.softpedia.com/news/Ubuntu-Touch-OTA-4-Update-Causes-Problems-Canonical-Apologizes-for-Issues-and-Promises-Fixes-484533.shtml
[06:57]  * svij got his MX4 Ubuntu Edition \o/ https://plus.google.com/u/0/+SujeevanVijayakumaran/posts/bubZ6KggMFX
[06:58] <lotuspsychje> svij: wow nice!!
[06:58] <DonkeyHotei> svij: are you in china?
[06:58] <lotuspsychje> svij: where did you bought it from??
[06:59] <svij> I'm one of those insiders and got it from Canonical
[06:59] <svij> and no, I'm in Germany.
[07:00] <lotuspsychje> svij: great!!
[07:01] <lotuspsychje> svij: hows the overall speed?
[07:03] <svij> lotuspsychje: definitly faster than the bq, most importantly the app launches are faster
[07:04] <lotuspsychje> svij: does the scopes lag on start?
[07:06] <lotuspsychje> svij: on my nexus when i start, a few second 'scopes' loading show with little lag
[07:09] <svij> lotuspsychje: doesn't seem to be too slow (or as slow as on the bq), but I didn't setup any online account
[07:10] <lotuspsychje> svij: ok keep us up to date :p
[07:11] <dholbach> good morning
[07:11] <lotuspsychje> dholbach: hello mate
[07:11] <lotuspsychje> dholbach: * svij got his MX4 Ubuntu Edition \o/ https://plus.google.com/u/0/+SujeevanVijayakumaran/posts/bubZ6KggMFX
[07:16] <dholbach> hey lotuspsychje
[07:16] <dholbach> svij, that's awesome! :-D
[07:18] <svij> hey dholbach and yes, definitely
[07:18] <dholbach> :-D
[07:19] <svij> went down to the other floor at work to get bananas and found my phone… I should often get bananas *and* a new phone. :P
[07:19] <dholbach> haha
[07:21] <popey> svij: blimey, that was quick
[07:23] <svij> popey: yeah, I didn't expected it THAT early.
[07:43] <svij> the screen of the MX4 is great
[07:43] <popey> yeah
[07:43] <popey> it's a quick phone too
[07:44] <SturmFlut> Got mine too! This courier service Canonical is using is incredible
[07:44] <svij> and the camera seems to be great too.
[07:44]  * svij waits for the next "its-compiling!11" (https://xkcd.com/303/) to set up the phone properly.
[07:45] <svij> SturmFlut: +1
[07:49] <SturmFlut> https://plus.google.com/102486542947898431342/posts/9GD5Guddo4g
[07:50] <SturmFlut> I need better lighting, the pictures aren't great
[07:50] <lotuspsychje> SturmFlut: nice unboxing pics
[07:50] <lotuspsychje> SturmFlut: you should be the first making an onboxing movie on youtube :p
[07:51] <svij> SturmFlut: yeah, same here. And I didn't bring my DSLR, didn't expect that it would come today.
[07:51] <SturmFlut> lotuspsychje: I *really* suck at videos. There will be a nice unboxing article instead
[07:51] <lotuspsychje> the best surprise
[07:51] <svij> unboxing videos are boring
[07:51] <svij> but I'll make a "hands on/first impression" video probably
[07:57] <justCarakas> Hello
[07:58] <justCarakas> can anybody help me, I have a nexus 4 bbut I am still on r19 and it keeps saying my software is up to date
[07:59] <seb128> justCarakas, what channel are you on?
[08:00] <justCarakas> ow
[08:00] <justCarakas> thx
[08:00] <justCarakas> I tought I was on stable
[08:00] <justCarakas> but I am aparently on Ubuntu Utopic Unicorn (development branch)
[08:00] <justCarakas> seb128: anyway I can switch to stable without loosing my data ?
[08:01] <seb128> justCarakas, that's not a channel
[08:02] <justCarakas> that is what I get with ubuntu build description
[08:02] <justCarakas> where can I find the channel ,
[08:02] <popey> adb shell system-image-cli --info
[08:04] <justCarakas> it says stable
[08:04] <justCarakas> popey:  ^
[08:04] <popey> whats the full output?
[08:04] <popey> maybe pastebin it?
[08:07] <justCarakas> hmm anyway I can past it somewhere from my phone ? if I wanne past on a text arya I only get copy
[08:07] <popey> what's the full line for channel?
[08:08] <justCarakas> channel: stable
[08:08] <justCarakas> alias: ubuntu-touch/ubuntu-rtm/14.09
[08:08] <justCarakas> version version 19
[08:09] <justCarakas> version ubuntu 20150508
[08:09] <justCarakas> version devise 20150116
[08:09] <justCarakas> version custom: mako-1.1
[08:09] <popey> k
[08:09] <popey> thats it.
[08:09] <popey> http://paste.ubuntu.com/11729339/ is the list of channels for mako
[08:09] <popey> maybe you want ubuntu-touch/devel/ubuntu ?
[08:10] <seb128> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Channels
[08:10] <seb128> has descriptions of the channels
[08:10] <seb128> you probably want ubuntu-touch/stable/ubuntu?
[08:11] <justCarakas> can I switch without loosing all my data ?
[08:11] <justCarakas> and apps ?
[08:12] <justCarakas> popey: I use it as my everyday phone, so would it be too "dangerous" to use devel ?
[08:13] <popey> you can switch, yes
[08:18] <popey> dunno how reliable it is as I dont have that device running that channel
[08:18] <SturmFlut> I don't have the guts to take the screen protection off that MX4 :/
[08:18] <justCarakas> so if I want to play it safe ubuntu-touch/stable/ubuntu is the best option
[08:22] <davmor2> justCarakas: if you want the latest stuff and more reliable to boot you might be better off with rc-proposed
[08:23] <justCarakas> davmor2 is there a command I can execute on my phone in the terminal app to switch
[08:25] <davmor2> justCarakas: yes :)  Next you'll be wanting to know what it is won't you :)  sudo system-image-cli --switch <channel you want>  eg  ubuntu-touch/stable/bq-aquaris.en to get back to stable
[08:28] <justCarakas> hehe thx :)
[08:36] <SturmFlut> The pre-order phase for the Aquaris E5 is over!
[08:43] <nhaines> popey: what channel would you suggest for flo if I basically want ubuntu-touch/rc-proposed ?
[08:47] <lotuspsychje> nhaines: im running flow on devel-proposed real smooth
[08:48] <nhaines> lotuspsychje: that's wily though.  I want to test the shell rotation bits.
[08:48] <lotuspsychje> nhaines: recent update got my nexus7 in landscape mode also, (if thats what you mean)
[08:50] <nhaines> lotuspsychje: what update?  Because r225 doesn't have it.
[08:51] <lotuspsychje> lemme check holdon
[08:51] <popey> yeah, i wouldn't use wily
[08:52] <lotuspsychje> nhaines: im on r226 15.10 nexus7 devel-proposed
[08:53] <nhaines> popey: I'd rather not, although MultiROM Manager doesn't give me a different option.  I'm trying to switch to a different channel.  Any suggestions?
[08:53] <lotuspsychje> updating to r227
[08:54] <popey> right, anything but wily / 15.10
[08:54] <nhaines> So ubuntu-touch/rc-proposed/ubuntu-developer looks good but it doesn't want to switch over.  Something about an error.
[08:56] <popey> ubuntu-touch/devel/ubuntu is 15.04, right?
[08:57] <nhaines> Not anymore, I believe.  Let me check.
[08:58] <nhaines> channel: ubuntu-touch/devel-proposed/ubuntu
[08:59] <nhaines> lsb_release -a gives wily.
[08:59] <popey> yeah, thats proposed though
[08:59] <JamesTait> Good morning all; happy Eat Your Vegetables Day!
[09:00] <nhaines> Well, I can only install devel or devel-proposed.  Right now it's -proposed.  devel only have r1 and r2.
[09:00] <davmor2> popey: devel is 15.10
[09:00] <lotuspsychje> someone said last time devel-proposed was best channel for n7 last time
[09:00] <davmor2> popey: rc is 15.04
[09:01] <popey> ah
[09:03] <nhaines> Well at least the rotatey bits are in.  But it's not much use if I can't file bugs against.
[09:11] <popey> nhaines: why can't you file bugs?
[09:12] <nhaines> popey: against wily?
[09:12] <Walex> SturmFlut: "I don't have the guts to take the screen protection off that MX4 :/" you may want then a case made of transparent lead titanate to protect it :-)
[09:12] <nhaines> Walex: obviously it shuold be transparent aluminum.  :)
[09:13] <Walex> nhaines: not tough enough :-)
[09:13] <SturmFlut> Walex, nhaines: I shall only accept a case made of Unobtainium
[09:13] <Walex> nhaines: lead titanate is actually transparent
[09:13] <nhaines> SturmFlut: don't miss the flash sale.  :)
[09:13] <Walex> I added "transparent" because it is not quite obvious that an alloy of lead and titanium is transparent.
[09:14]  * Walex not sure it is an alloy, it may be a chemical compound
[09:14]  * Walex oops
[09:18] <ultimatetux> Any idea why after doing `~/project-rootstock-ng/rootstock-touch-install wily-preinstalled-touch-armhf.tar.gz system.img` I still see my Ubuntu Touch version as 15.04r2 ?!!!!
[09:18] <ogra_> nhaines, why do you run wily ? the same rorartion bits landed in vivid too
[09:19] <ogra_> nobody should *use* wily ... (except for developers to verify their packages)
[09:20] <lotuspsychje> ogra_: so, what would be the best channel for nexus7 flo then?
[09:20] <ogra_> rc-proposed or rc ...
[09:20] <nhaines> ogra_: because devel-proposed got switched out to wiki from under me.  :)
[09:21] <SturmFlut> The display of the MX4 appears so gigantic, even though it's just 0.4" larger than the Nexus 5
[09:21] <lotuspsychje> ogra_: you sure rc-proposed got tablet support also right?
[09:21] <ogra_> SturmFlut, yeah, the display and the camera are the lovely bits ;)
[09:21] <lotuspsychje> ogra_: last thing someone said devel-proposed was best image
[09:21] <nhaines> Anyway, my only two options are devel/ubuntu and devel-proposed/ubuntu.  So that's not fun.  And I can't seem to switch to a different channel either.
[09:22] <ogra_> lotuspsychje, i see flo at http://system-image.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-touch/rc-proposed/ubuntu/
[09:22] <popey> nhaines: yes, i see non reason not to file bugs against wily that exist in wily
[09:22] <ogra_> yeah, you can indeed file bugs
[09:22] <lotuspsychje> ogra_: ok ill test it soon tnx!
[09:23] <ogra_> nhaines, i dont understand ... we have images for all devices in the community channels in rc and rc-proposed
[09:24] <nhaines> I'm rebooting back into wily and I'll turn on developer mode and paste some error messages.
[09:25] <ogra_> nhaines, when i say dont use wily i mean that it doesnt get any QA, it can break any time underneath you and will only see fixes after the fact ... (nobody tests these images *before* they go out) ... if you file bugs against wily someone with a vivid device can confirm them
[09:25] <nhaines> ogra_: I'd rather just use vivid-proposed.  :)
[09:25] <ogra_> well, then switch to the rc-proposed channel
[09:25] <ogra_> (or make Tassadar switch his server if he doesnt offer that yet)
[09:26]  * nhaines sighs.  :)
[09:27] <mr-test> hi
[09:28] <popey> hello
[09:29] <nhaines> ogra_: should I in theory be able to run system-image-cli and switch from devel-proposed to rc-proposed?
[09:30] <mr-test> how can one disable the search suggestions in the ubuntu touch browser?
[09:30] <ogra_> nhaines, yes
[09:30] <ogra_> (with the --switch option obviously ;) )
[09:32] <nhaines> ogra_: sudo system-image-cli --switch ubuntu-touch/rc-proposed/ubuntu gives:
[09:32] <nhaines> Exception occurred during update; see log file for details
[09:32] <ogra_> ouch
[09:33] <ogra_> reboot (to make sure the dbus backend service is gone) and run it with -vvv again to capture errors
[09:34] <nhaines> ogra_: this makes me sad because I'm typing everything in on the onscreen keyboard because I can't set a passcode and turn on developer mode.  :P  But I shall find my OTG cable while it is rebooting.
[09:35] <ogra_> oh, why cant you set a passcode ?
[09:36] <popey> bug, has been mentioned previously
[09:36] <ogra_> ah
[09:36] <nhaines> ogra_: technically I can, but entry is broken in wily.
[09:36]  * ogra_ missed that 
[09:36] <ogra_> (or forgot ...)
[09:36] <nhaines> At the very least, wily does look very PC-like on my tablet, and that's exciting.  :)
[09:37] <nhaines> Also I can select text in the Terminal app with the mouse, which is exciting.
[09:38] <nhaines> And if I had a mouse pointer it'd even be useful.  ;)
[09:38] <nhaines> ogra_: where does the -vvv go in the system-image-cli command, please?
[09:40] <nhaines> Putting it first.  That seemed to work.
[09:41] <ogra_> yeah, i dont think it cares :)
[09:42] <SturmFlut> ogra_: The MX4 camera is actually very good. It's not as good as my DSLR, but it seems to be good enough for all those occasions when I am too lazy to haul all the "real" equipment around
[09:42] <lotuspsychje> ogra_: is this the one? ubuntu-touch/rc/ubuntu-developer
[09:42] <nhaines> ogra_: http://i.imgur.com/crNXrVz.png
[09:46] <popey> nhaines: you can seleect text in terminal with your finger too :)
[09:47] <ogra_> the sensor is just awesome (the lens could indeed be better)
[09:47] <ogra_> thats the channel with extra developer tools
[09:47] <ogra_> ubuntu is the "normal" community channel
[09:47] <nhaines> popey: you mean like a peasant?  :)
[09:47] <lotuspsychje> ogra_: so rc-proposed for flo then
[09:48] <SturmFlut> ogra_: https://plus.google.com/102486542947898431342/posts/YNq5sV2RMFR
[09:48] <ogra_> nhaines, it looks like confinement gets in your way here ...
[09:48] <nhaines> ogra_: oh, that's sneaky!
[09:48] <ogra_> the terminal isnt fully unconfined ...
[09:49] <nhaines> SturmFlut: that's quite a lovely difference!  Even resolution aside.
[09:49] <ogra_> and it seems system-image tries to download into the application dir
[09:49] <asad> hi
[09:49] <Guest95092>  just installed ubuntu 14.04 on my dell 7348 notebook that also has a touchpad
[09:49] <Guest95092> and a touchscreen
[09:50] <ogra_> nhaines, android-gadget-service enable ssh; ssh localhost ... then run s-i-c again
[09:50] <Guest95092> and the touchpad is not working
[09:50] <Guest95092> please help?
[09:50] <ogra_> that gets you an unconfined shell
[09:50] <nhaines> ogra_: <3
[09:50] <ogra_> Guest95092, you want #ubuntu ... thish channel is for phones :)
[09:50] <ogra_> *this
[09:50] <SturmFlut> nhaines: The resolution is about the same, 24 vs 20.7 megapixels. I have the feelling that the MX4 could do even better if the compression level was tuned a bit better
[09:51] <SturmFlut> nhaines: (and I used the JPEG output from the DSLR, the RAW image is even better)
[09:52] <lotuspsychje> ogra_: 2015/06/17 11:51:51 Flashing version 162 from ubuntu-touch/rc-proposed/ubuntu channel and server https://system-image.ubuntu.com to device flo
[09:52] <lotuspsychje> running
[09:52] <ogra_> cool
[09:53] <faenil> ogra_: can you elaborate more on this? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-ux/+bug/1465331/comments/1
[09:53] <faenil> I could not understand what you mean there
[09:53] <SturmFlut> Would it be possible to give the Ubuntu phone a RAW mode? Does the system even get access to the raw sensor data?
[09:53] <nhaines> ogra_: hmm, I think I got the same error.  :(
[09:54] <ogra_> with the same weird terminal app path at the top ?
[09:55] <nhaines> ogra_: I'm not seeing anything out of the ordinary.  Which line in the image has the weird path?
[09:58] <nhaines> Is it the "running state machine" message?
[09:58] <ogra_> nhaines, the first five lines show a very weird download path in your shot
[09:59] <ogra_> something with "terminal app" in it
[10:00] <ogra_>   /com/canonical/applications...
[10:00] <nhaines> That's the same.
[10:01] <nhaines> Hrm.  Now I try again and "ssh localhost" prints "Permission denied (publickey)."
[10:02] <lotuspsychje> ogra_: rc-proposed 15.04 r162 up n running, all smoooth tnx alot!
[10:05] <nhaines> Okay, fixed.
[10:05] <nhaines> Even though /com/canonical etc didn't go away.  :)
[10:05] <nhaines> No crashing now though.
[10:07] <nhaines> http://i.imgur.com/e6rtpQw.png
[10:07] <SturmFlut> Yay, the first time I see a "4G" symbol on an Ubuntu phone!
[10:08] <ogra_> lotuspsychje, awesome !
[10:08] <ogra_> SturmFlut, you'll get used to it :)
[10:08] <ogra_> nhaines, that looks good
[10:12] <nhaines> ogra_: now the long wait!  But I expect things to go well from here on out.  Thanks so much for the patient help.  :)
[10:12] <popey> SturmFlut: :)
[10:20] <joaojotta> Hello guys
[10:21] <ultimatetux> rootstock-touch-install is stuck at `unpacking rootfs tarball to system-image ...` for ages now
[10:21] <ultimatetux> how long should it normally take?
[10:21] <joaojotta> Any one know where I can get a better model than the BQ Aquaris 4.5 in Europe?
[10:22] <joaojotta> Can't be bigger than 4.5 inch. I find 4 inch big enough already.
[10:22] <ultimatetux> ogra_, any idea? :)
[10:24] <ogra_> ultimatetux, i havent used that tool in ... hmm ... probably 2 years ... but iirc it can take 15-20min
[10:24] <ultimatetux> ogra_, hmmm... what do you usually do?
[10:24] <ultimatetux> ogra_, I mean to populate the device with the system.img and the ubuntu base!
[10:25] <ogra_> it unpacks a 2GB image ...
[10:25] <ogra_> then dumps the system.img in the right place
[10:25] <nhaines> ogra_: well, the upgrade is working... now to just hope it's overwriting the correct files.  :)
[10:25] <ogra_> nhaines, it will, no worries :)
[10:27] <ultimatetux> ogra_, no, I mean what do *you* usually do to populate the system :)
[10:28] <ogra_> me ? i use ubuntu-device-flash until OTA works on a new device :)
[10:28] <ogra_> and from then on i only OTA
[10:29] <nhaines> ogra_: Android booted just fine, and rebooting into Ubuntu, that's now showing 15.04 (r162) so that booted just fine too.  :D
[10:29] <ogra_> nhaines, awesome !
[10:30] <nhaines> Shell rotation is still working nicely.  Now if only there was more fun convergence stuff to play with!  :)
[10:30] <nhaines> But this will do quite well.
[10:31] <ultimatetux> ogra_, ah I used that when installing from 3rd party repos however it can't install from a local image, no?!
[10:31] <ogra_> you need to turn your system.img into a device tarball ... just grab one from the system-image server to inspect the structure and build your own
[10:32] <ultimatetux> ogra_, hmmm
[10:32] <ultimatetux> ogra_, will do that now
[10:32] <ultimatetux> ogra_, though no documentation right?! as usual :D
[10:33] <ogra_> yeah
[10:33] <ogra_> well, there surely is some but i dont know where ::)
[10:34] <nhaines> Now I just have to see if I can convince Tassadar to update his channels for the N5.  :)
[10:34] <nhaines> Also N7.
[10:35] <ogra_> yeah, you should ... defsaulting to wily isnt such a good idea
[10:53] <dropp> Hi, can someone tell me where the PopupUtils.close() function is documented? Thanks!
[10:53] <ogra_> dropp, try #ubuntu-app-devel there are more app people :)
[10:54] <dropp> ok thanks!
[10:57] <brobostigon> question, do the webapps keep running in the background after being opened?
[10:59] <ogra_> no
[10:59] <ogra_> no app keeps running, as soon as they get out of focus they are stopped
[11:00] <ogra_> (there are sevices that apps can use that keep running ... i.e. media-hub for playing music even if the app is stopped )
[11:00] <brobostigon> thats helpful, so i could create a service that does the backgorund job?
[11:01] <brobostigon> and then just a gui frontend.
[11:01] <ogra_> no, you need to use a service the system provides
[11:01] <ogra_> your app cant ship them
[11:01] <brobostigon> ok,
[11:01] <ogra_> it can only interface with them
[11:02] <brobostigon> i see.
[11:02] <mr-test> ogra_: and if there's no system service providing what one needs?
[11:02] <ogra_> (for security and battery usage reasons)
[11:03] <DonkeyHotei> mr-test: then the app cannot run on the phone
[11:03] <ogra_> mr-test, then you file a bug asking for the service ... or implement it in a proper way and offer it for inclusion (and that proper way would have to be discussed with the system architects)
[11:04] <DonkeyHotei> this is why for example a native irc client is not possible
[11:04] <mr-test> ogra_: not good imho.. this might bloat utouch because you need a service for everything. also makes coding harder. :/
[11:05] <mr-test> and it may take quite some time (if ever) until all necessary services are included
[11:05] <ogra_> DonkeyHotei, not true ... someone just needs to develop a telepathy IRC backend ... nobody did yet
[11:06] <ogra_> mr-test, sure, it takes longer ... but its not different to i.e. IOS
[11:06] <DonkeyHotei> there is an irc backend for telepathy on the desktop
[11:06] <mr-test> sacrificing app compatibilty for battery life is not the best move imho :/
[11:07]  * brobostigon did just find telepathy-gabble on ubuntu touch with apt-cache.
[11:07] <mr-test> ogra_: yep it also sucks in ios imho
[11:07] <ogra_> DonkeyHotei, right, make it work on the phone, implement the necessary QML bits so apps can make use of it via the SDK and it should work
[11:07] <DonkeyHotei> i always thought that was one of the biggest problems with ios
[11:07] <ogra_> mr-test, if you want to maintain the security and battery usage level we have, there is not much you can do to work around this
[11:08] <mr-test> even firefox os runs apps in background(some at least) and it doesn't drain battery so quickly
[11:08] <ogra_> ah, that is why it took off so successfully :P
[11:08] <mr-test> ogra_: let the user decide what he wants. popup and ask if he wants an app to allow running in background
[11:08] <brobostigon> it depends on the design of those things as well,
[11:09] <ogra_> mr-test, dont discuss with me :) i'm just the messenger, i didnt design that setup ... if you want to discuss it, try the mailing list
[11:09] <mr-test> ogra_: the lack of apps made fxos "unsuccessful" imho, not the background apps imho
[11:09] <brobostigon> on android, facebook is a great example. it sucks battery like a fish sucks water, its horrendous.
[11:09] <ogra_> lol
[11:09] <ogra_> right, the lack of apps ... not that fact that its performing close to unusable
[11:09] <mr-test> brobostigon: as i said: let the user decide
[11:10] <brobostigon> mr-test: however it could also be much better designed, to behave better as well.
[11:10] <ogra_> well, once the phoone moved to snappy you might be able to work a bit more flexible with shipping framework snaps and the like
[11:10] <mr-test> ogra_: it performs ok imho, apps launch almost instantly, only the animations are laggy
[11:10] <ogra_> i doubt for the current phone the design will be changed much anymore
[11:11] <ogra_> (since that will be replaced)
[11:11] <mr-test> ogra_: "current phone)
[11:11] <mr-test> ?
[11:11] <ogra_> mr-test, well, i had the alcatel one in my hands and it was definitely not usable as daily driver
[11:11] <mr-test> the e4.5 you mean?
[11:11] <ogra_> mr-test, the current software
[11:12] <mr-test> ogra_: dualcore cpu? ram?
[11:12] <ogra_> ?
[11:12] <mr-test> ogra_: what specs had that alcatel phone? and what fxos version?
[11:12] <ogra_> dunno, it was their first phone
[11:12] <DonkeyHotei> i thought the zte was the first
[11:12] <mr-test> ogra_: by replaced, you mean wily + snappy apps?
[11:12] <ogra_> scrolling through their app store was a slideshow
[11:13] <ogra_> DonkeyHotei, hmm, i thought it was from alcatel ... i might be wrong
[11:13] <mr-test> ogra_: try a better phone with dualcore cpu and 512mb ram. runs very good imho
[11:13] <ogra_> but it was fatser HW than they actually had targeted
[11:13] <ogra_> *faster
[11:14] <ogra_> mr-test, their target HW was feature üphones for $50 or some such ... that hing was even way beyond that
[11:14] <ogra_> anyway ... this is not #firefoxos
[11:14] <ogra_> and i havent used any recent version ...
[11:15] <DonkeyHotei> what does sailfish do?
[11:15] <mr-test> ogra_: give the emulator a try then. it's a simple firefox plugin if you want to test at reasonable speed/version
[11:15] <ogra_> (but i was massively disappointed back then, i had an andrid G1 iin my hands about 6 months before that went on sale and it was awesome compared to that)
[11:15] <svij> for those who are interested in the camera of the meizu MX4. I've made some photos → https://plus.google.com/+SujeevanVijayakumaran/posts/EZZhHASSQwm
[11:15] <ogra_> DonkeyHotei, live fine in its niche :)
[11:16] <ogra_> sailfsh has found its audience and it is apparently enough to keep them running ... they are not aiming for mass market as i understand it
[11:16] <mr-test> ogra_: i think fxos doesn't run as well on such lowend devices as mozilla targeted. with enough ram/cpu it runs quite nice imho
[11:16] <DonkeyHotei> i tried sailfish on the n5 and absolutely could not figure out how to answer a call
[11:16] <ogra_> haha
[11:17] <ogra_> yeah, i find the UX also very confusing ...
[11:17] <brobostigon> swipe downwards, :)
[11:17] <ogra_> but it is fast and snappy beyond that ... and a pretty stable system
[11:17]  * brobostigon likes sailfish as well.
[11:17] <DonkeyHotei> i swiped downwards and it declined the call. three times.
[11:17] <brobostigon> and i happen to like its ux.
[11:17] <brobostigon> odd.
[11:18] <mr-test> ogra_: anyway, about that replacing of current software. what do you mean by that? -> wily+snappy apps instead of deb?
[11:18]  * ogra_ lies ubuntus UX more ... but i'm a wee bit biased :) 
[11:18] <ogra_> mr-test, a snappy base instead of what we have now ...
[11:18] <ogra_> and yes, no more debs but snaps
[11:19] <DonkeyHotei> then there is tizen, which is preloaded on a phone sold in india
[11:19] <ogra_> (and no more click packages either ... they will be turned into snaps)
[11:19] <ogra_> DonkeyHotei, and is as old as me :P
[11:20] <mr-test> ogra_: and the stopping of apps might be changed there?
[11:20] <justCarakas> davmor2 I just tried the command to switch channels but it doesn't seem to do anything
[11:20] <ogra_> (well, not really, but tizen is close to  ten years old already (under different names) .... was about time they finally release *something*)
[11:20] <DonkeyHotei> you're 60ish iirc
[11:20] <ogra_> justCarakas, no, but the ability to install frameworks might be added
[11:20] <davmor2> justCarakas: you just need to let it run, it doesn't display anything currently
[11:20] <ogra_> DonkeyHotei, lol ...
[11:23] <justCarakas> ok
[11:24] <ogra_> justCarakas, you should have used -v ... then it has output
[11:24] <mr-test> ogra_: will the complete current ubuntu repositories be available as snappy apps?
[11:24] <ogra_> mr-test, i doubt that
[11:25] <ogra_> but yoou will be able to rolll your project into a snap with a tool that makes use of the binary debs
[11:25] <mr-test> ogra_: is it possible to create a snappy app from deb packages(without recompliing)?
[11:25] <mr-test> ah alright :)
[11:25] <ogra_> snaps are bundles of projects, not single apps usually
[11:25] <justCarakas> davmor2: orga_ can it hurt that I had entered the command again because I tought it hadn't done anything ?
[11:25] <justCarakas> or will it just restart
[11:25] <ogra_> so you can just translate deb to snap (that wouldnt make any sense then)
[11:25] <mr-test> ogra_: can i install an xorg app as a snappy app on utouch then?
[11:26] <ogra_> justCarakas, it should just restart
[11:26] <mr-test> and run via xmir
[11:26] <ogra_> yes
[11:26] <ogra_> if there is a snap for it in the store ...
[11:26] <ogra_> (else you would have to snap it up yourself first)
[11:26] <mr-test> ogra_: named?
[11:26] <davmor2> justCarakas: I think it just starts from scratch
[11:26] <ogra_> ?
[11:27] <mr-test> ogra_: what snap is in the store already?
[11:27] <mr-test> ah sry misread
[11:28] <ogra_> the focus for current snappy is still headless ... so there are no snaps for GUI apps yet
[11:28] <ogra_> once there are desktop and phone images based on snappy that will change quickly i guess
[11:29] <justCarakas> davmor2: I restarted it with -v to be sure it was doing something, and it gives an error AssertionError: Missing destination files: ['/var/lib/system-image/keyring.tar.gz', '/var/lib/system-image/keyring.tar.gz.asc']
[11:30] <davmor2> justCarakas: no idea on that
[11:30] <ogra_> justCarakas, if you stopped it you dont stop the backend dbus service, just the user frontend ...
[11:30] <ogra_> it needs 10-15min to time out
[11:31]  * ogra_ usually just reboots to make sure the backend is gone)
[11:31] <justCarakas> okey
[11:31] <justCarakas> was already rebooting :p
[11:31] <SturmFlut> I already love the "Home" button on the MX4
[11:32] <svij> SturmFlut: me too
[11:32] <lotuspsychje> yeah yeah makes us jaleous!!
[11:32]  * ogra_ hates it with passion
[11:33] <justCarakas> is there a benefit to choose ubuntu-touch/stable/bq-aquaris.en over ubuntu-touch/stable/ubuntu
[11:33] <justCarakas>  ? would I then get the faster gps fix and stuff ?
[11:33] <justCarakas> i have a mako btw
[11:33] <svij> ogra_: why?
[11:33] <SturmFlut> ogra_: Why, it doesn't waste any space, and pressing it is much faster than swiping completely from the left
[11:34] <ogra_> svij, it gets in my way it sits in an awkward place ... using the phone in landscape makes me often unconditionally press it etc etc
[11:34] <ogra_> imho it should have been disabled completely ... only keeping the LED functional
[11:35] <ogra_> SturmFlut, yes, pressing iit if you actually like to go to the home scope is fine ... i rarely use the home scope at all though ...
[11:35] <ogra_> and i tend to unconditionally trigger it when holding the phone ...
[11:35] <SturmFlut> ogra_: Ah, yeah, I can understand that
[11:36] <ogra_> so in the middle of the article i read it suddenly jumps to the home screen
[11:36] <ogra_> our UX is designed for buttonless devices ... i wish we had kept it that way ...
[11:36] <SturmFlut> ogra_: being able to change the function of such hardware buttons might be a good wishlist bug
[11:37] <ogra_> haha
[11:37] <ogra_> yeah
[11:37] <ogra_> (if it was only that easy to change)
[11:37] <ogra_> iirc you need to hack the kernel for this ... or at least something in the device targball
[11:38] <justCarakas> orga_ I restarted the phone and still get the same error
[11:38]  * ogra_ looks forward to the MX4 using a proper resolution so it doesnt look like a kids toy with palm sized buttons 
[11:39] <davmor2> I likes the big buttons they fit my thumb perfectly :P
[11:39] <SturmFlut> ogra_: Hm, but at some point the hardware button press is passed to Unity8, which will then switch to the Home Scope. Surely this last step can be changed without too much hassle?
[11:40] <ogra_> it is just a kbd event ... "Super_L" i think
[11:40] <davmor2> SturmFlut: no it's like a upstart job it say on key press do this
[11:41] <ogra_> so yeah, you most likely can hack unity8 to do something else
[11:41] <justCarakas> davmor2: but cant you make upstart then call a function that checks what action it should do ?
[11:41] <ogra_> davmor2, i think it is actually unity ...
[11:41] <davmor2> oh nice in that case
[11:42] <SturmFlut> ogra_: Yeah, the larger screen is nice for the keyboard, I often miss the intended button on the E4.5, but the rest of the UI looks too large. And the out-of-box experience for german users is broken, on the first scope you ever get to see there is a string that's too long for its button ;)
[11:42] <ogra_> yeah
[11:42] <davmor2> SturmFlut: no you just use too longer a words :)
[11:43] <SturmFlut> davmor2: True, but the wording in this case is much less than optimal too ;)
[11:44] <davmor2> SturmFlut: if lang=="German"; nanofont
[11:45] <ogra_> if lang=="German"; force_landscape()
[11:45] <ogra_> ;)
[11:45] <SturmFlut> if lang=="Finnish"; crash
[11:45] <ogra_> "error: out of vowels"
[11:46] <svij> haha
[11:46] <SturmFlut> I once bought a picnic blanket in Sweden, it had the product name printed in different languages
[11:46] <SturmFlut> And in ever language, things looked right
[11:47] <justCarakas> orga_ davmor2 is there a way to skip the gpg blacklist stuff when switching channels ?
[11:47] <SturmFlut> Except for finnish, that was like "hjdfsayyyjkfjlkyyyyjfjlkdjkyyyy"
[11:47] <SturmFlut> Probably even more "y" than I just used
[11:47] <popey> I do like the SailfishOS update names.
[11:47] <popey> Äijänpäivänjärvi for example
[11:47] <popey> Looks like line noise.
[11:48] <SturmFlut> Or a baudrate mismatch
[11:48] <jgdx> ei saa peittää
[11:48] <popey> or dead pixels
[11:48]  * popey hugs Stskeeps :)
[11:48] <SturmFlut> or what a Samsung SSD returns when you read a sector
[11:49] <popey> hah
[11:49] <popey> also, meow
[11:49] <ogra_> moo ?
[11:50] <Stskeeps> popey: i can't even speak the update names.. crazy update names :)
[11:50] <SturmFlut> popey: I challenge your "meow" with whatever you write down the noise a chinchilla makes
[11:51] <ogra_> Stskeeps, you dont get finnish courses at jolla ?
[11:51] <Stskeeps> ogra_: no, and i wouldn't accept one if they did.. polish was bad enough
[11:52] <ogra_> polish is only bad when writing it i think :)
[11:52] <svij> I really like the codenames of grml releases → https://grml.org/changelogs/
[11:52] <svij> "Schluchtenscheisser" "Knecht Rootrecht"… :)
[11:52] <SturmFlut> svij: "Knecht Rootrecht" is a great one
[11:52] <SturmFlut> "Santa's little administrator"
[11:54] <DonkeyHotei> i'd think what germans would want to know in polish is how to order food
[11:55] <DonkeyHotei> i.e. german food and polish food are pretty similar
[11:55] <ogra_> DonkeyHotei, you mean if i order beer there is no free sausage with it in poland ?
[11:55] <ogra_> *g*
[11:59] <justCarakas> is there a way to skip the gpg stuff with system-image-cli —switch ?
[12:29] <nik90> anyone from norway who can confirm that 24-hour time is written as 14.30 instead of 14:30?
[12:30] <diwic> nik90, doing a quick search on nsb.no shows timetables with 14:30
[12:30] <diwic> nik90, dates show as 17.06.2015 and times as 15:25
[12:31] <nik90> diwic: ah thnx. hmm why does qt.locale() show a dots separator...my day only gets weirder
[12:33] <jgdx> nik90, :)
[12:33] <SturmFlut> I'm a bit confused, is arale r1 equal to OTA-4?
[12:37] <jgdx> nik90, from the 70s, Norway has been using a dot. As of 2014, a colon : is allowed.
[12:38] <ogra_> SturmFlut, no, prior to OTA4 still
[12:38] <jgdx> nik90, I think it should follow NS-ISO 8601 and use :
[12:38] <nik90> jgdx: ah I am relieved..unfortunately what format the clock app uses is up to Qt.locale()..i cannot hard code it..and we seem to have discrepancy in the format shown between clock-app and the welcome-screen
[12:39] <svij> SturmFlut: your question just got answered in the new mail ;)
[12:41] <SturmFlut> svij: Oh, so I got a 32 GB device, but all the actual consumer versions will be 16 GB ones? Better not say that out too loud...
[12:41] <svij> SturmFlut: :D
[12:42] <ogra_> yeah, like in a püublic channel or something
[12:42] <ogra_> :)
[12:42] <SturmFlut> ogra_: Luckily the guys over at Softpedia don't know how to use IRC
[12:42] <svij> SturmFlut: but we can say in a month "our storage was updated via an OTA update"
[12:43] <SturmFlut> svij: Mhm, wireless flash!
[12:43] <svij> YAY :D
[12:43] <popey> SturmFlut: they do :) They join during our Q&A :)
[12:43] <SturmFlut> popey: Because you put an IRC client thingy on the website
[12:43] <popey> true
[12:44] <ogra_> so its all your fault !
[12:44] <SturmFlut> ogra_: http://blamepopey.com/
[12:44] <ogra_> yep
[12:46]  * nik90 waits to see what happens at the end of popey_exploit-0.3-alpha ;)
[12:47] <popey> hah
[12:52] <SturmFlut> Any reason why the MX4 officially has a 20.7 MP camera, but the files created on my phone are only around 14.7 MP
[12:52] <mcphail> So how are the lucky few enjoying the Meizu? Is the difference in spec noticeable compared to the bq experience?
[12:52] <svij> mcphail: yes
[12:52] <ogra_> SturmFlut, did you select HQ in the camera app ?
[12:53] <mcphail> svij: generally smoother, fewer spinny things?
[12:53] <SturmFlut> ogra_: Yes
[12:54] <svij> mcphail: yes, atleast for the first impression
[12:54] <SturmFlut> ogra_: It's always 2880 x 5120 pixels
[12:54]  * ogra_ must admit he never checked
[12:54] <mcphail> svij: that's encouraging. Was wondering if a high-spec phone could preload/precache all the core apps to get rid of the spinnies altogether
[12:55] <cedian_linux> have some issues with the camera here are the pastes: 1: http://paste.ubuntu.com/11730339/ 2: http://paste.ubuntu.com/11730349/ 3: http://paste.ubuntu.com/11730355/
[12:55] <SturmFlut> mcphail: It feels much slicker and faster, but some things still take their time and sometimes the UI even stutters
[12:56] <ogra_> svij, really, you find it faster than the aquaris ?
[12:56]  * ogra_ finds quite the opposite
[12:56] <svij> ogra_: yes
[12:56] <svij> i rarely used the bq, because it was kind of too slow for me
[12:56] <svij> SturmFlut: +1
[12:56] <ogra_> oh ?
[12:57] <svij> atleast starting apps on the bq is _damn_ slow
[12:57]  * ogra_ hasnt used a phone that felt faster than the bq yet .... none of my android phones can cope 
[12:57] <ogra_> oh, yeah, i never close them :)
[12:57] <svij> compared to my android 5.0 nexus 4
[12:57] <mcphail> SturmFlut: was wondering about that. It seems to be the qmlscene loading which slows down the bq. Otherwise it is very slick despite being a low-end device
[12:57] <SturmFlut> ogra_: I think it already feels faster than the E4.5 because the MX4 wakes up instantly on a power button press and doesn't wake up a second later :P
[12:57] <ogra_> i mean the UI speed and responsiveness
[12:58] <ogra_> scrolling is slower on the MX ... if you have many apps installed the app scope takes a break when scrolling down ...
[12:58] <svij> i didn't like using the OSK on the bq, thats better on the meizu (probably because of that bigger screen)
[12:58] <SturmFlut> ogra_: At least in my impression the MX4 is better
[12:58] <ogra_> the driver is not as good as the bq one and the higher resolution asks for a price :)
[12:58] <ogra_> thats good
[12:58] <jgdx> nik90, sorry, didn't see your reply before now. What's your suggestion?
[12:59] <jgdx> nik90, why the disparancy?
[12:59]  * svij might find a few glitches when he uses it a few days/weeks more
[12:59] <SturmFlut> ogra_: Yeah, but the app scope has lots of issues on the bq too, I don't think it's the fault of the phone hardware alone
[12:59] <ogra_> perhaps it is just my pre-production device having issues
[12:59] <cedian_linux> ogra_ Ihave some issues with the camera here are the pastes: 1: http://paste.ubuntu.com/11730339/ 2: http://paste.ubuntu.com/11730349/ 3: http://paste.ubuntu.com/11730355/
[12:59] <cedian_linux> (I have)
[12:59] <ogra_> cedian_linux, i have no clue about cameras, sorry
[12:59] <cedian_linux> ok
[12:59] <ogra_> (specifically not about the HAL layer)
[12:59] <cedian_linux> ok
[13:00] <nik90> jgdx: I don't have a suggestion..I need to check with charles (i-dt developer) what format he uses to display time in the indicator and the welcome-scene.
[13:00] <cedian_linux> ogra_ it adds some null values
[13:01] <nik90> jgdx: I didn't hard code anything in the clock app and don't want to do so either..I am using standard Qt.locale() functions here
[13:01] <jgdx> nik90, but if Clock app does the right thing®, shouldn't we just mark indicator-datetime as affected and clock app as invalid?
[13:01] <nik90> jgdx: yeah let me check with charles before doing that.
[13:01] <jgdx> and later, if the damned Norwegians want : in their clocks we let them change it via a setting
[13:02] <jgdx> nik90, okay, wfm
[13:04] <nik90> haha..ok
[13:20] <seb128> kenvandine, jgdx, hey, we got qa to validate the first u-s-s stack of backports, up to you for the next silo ;-)
[13:22] <jgdx> seb128, great stuff :) Ken started building that yesterday in silo3
[13:22] <seb128> nice
[13:24] <julianwi_> hi, I'm trying to port ubuntu touch touch to my x86 phone. I get following error in the last_kmsg: /sbin/adbd: error while loading shared libraries: libgio-2.0.so.0: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory
[13:30] <jgdx> abeato, hi, do you have a minute?
[13:30] <abeato> jgdx, sure
[13:30] <jgdx> abeato, I'm sitting here looking at monitor ofono
[13:31] <jgdx> abeato, and when I change a call forwarding setting, say voiceBusy to "1234", monitor ofono tells me that VoiceBusy changed.
[13:32] <jgdx> abeato, but when I set VoiceUnconditional to "1234", monitor-ofono tells me VoiceUnconditional changed, but also that "Busy" changed.
[13:32] <jgdx> why the inconsistency?
[13:32] <abeato> jgdx, unconditional forwarding overrides other call forwarding options
[13:33] <jgdx> abeato, yeah, but why VoiceBusy vs Busy ?
[13:33] <abeato> jgdx, oh, I see what you mean... if that happens it is definitely a bug
[13:33] <jgdx> seems like it's the same setting, with two different names
[13:34]  * abeato checking ofono docs
[13:35] <abeato> jgdx, I think those signals come from different interfaces
[13:36] <mardy> Elleo: I think I have a bug for you, do you have a minute?
[13:36] <abeato> jgdx, you have the property org.ofono.CallForwarding.VoiceBusy
[13:38] <jgdx> abeato, and…? :P What interface reports Busy?
[13:38] <ogra_> julianwi_, uh, you would need an initrd that is built for x86
[13:38] <Elleo> mardy: sure, what's up?
[13:38] <abeato> jgdx, and supplementaryservices-api.txt describes an argument to some function in org.ofono.SupplementaryServices
[13:38] <mardy> Elleo: I just want to know if it has already been filed
[13:39] <mardy> Elleo: so, I have my OSK set to write in Italian
[13:39] <abeato> jgdx, mind doing a pastebin of the monitor-ofono output?
[13:39] <julianwi_> ogra_, my initrd files are all i386 binarys
[13:39] <mardy> Elleo: I write "Princ", then I choose "Principe" from the suggestions
[13:39] <mardy> Elleo: then I type "s", and the suggestions show "principessa"; I pick that suggestion
[13:40] <mardy> Elleo: but on the input field, the result is "Principeprincipessa"
[13:40] <mardy> Elleo: is this a known bug?
[13:40] <jgdx> abeato, added to comment.
[13:40] <jgdx> s/comment/ofono issue
[13:41] <ogra_> julianwi_, though that error only tells that it cant start adbd, there must be a real error somewhere in your logs
[13:41] <ogra_> starting adbd is only the last step wehn an error occured
[13:41] <Elleo> mardy: don't think so; does it not insert a space after the word when you select "Principe"? (so the 's' should start a new word)
[13:41] <ogra_> (and also does not actually work anymore anyway witrh recent adbd)
[13:42] <abeato> jgdx, I do not see the VoiceBusy property change event in the log
[13:42] <mardy> Elleo: no, it doesn't (I turned auto punctuation off)
[13:42] <jgdx> abeato, actually, I think that's the bug
[13:42] <julianwi_> ogra_, the real error is: Kernel panic - not syncing: Attempted to kill init!
[13:42] <jgdx> abeato, the lack of that property change
[13:42] <ogra_> julianwi_, no, thats fallout too
[13:42] <Elleo> mardy: ah, that'll probably be what makes the difference then
[13:43] <ogra_> julianwi_, pastebin the whole last_kmsg somewhere
[13:43] <abeato> jgdx, ok, thanks for the bug, I'll take a look
[13:43] <jgdx> abeato, I'm confusing the matter with bringing in props from supplementaryservices
[13:43] <Elleo> mardy: hmm, maybe no; jus ttried switching autopunctuation off and it still works correctly for me
[13:43] <Elleo> mardy: autopunctuation should just handle double space for fullstops
[13:43] <mardy> Elleo: must be autocorrection, then
[13:44] <mardy> Elleo: yes, it's autocorrection
[13:44] <abeato> jgdx, anyway I would prefer the bug in LP
[13:44] <Elleo> mardy: ah, okay
[13:44] <Elleo> mardy: yeah, could you file a bug for that? I think we should probably add spaces when the user selects a word from the word-ribbon regardless of whether auto-correction is on or not
[13:44] <mardy> Elleo: in English: type "T", pick the suggestion "the", type "r", pick the suggestion "there", and you'll get thethere
[13:45] <mardy> Elleo: no please! :-)
[13:45] <mardy> Elleo: I use a lot of commas :-)
[13:45] <jgdx> abeato, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ofono/+bug/1466095
[13:45] <julianwi_> ogra_, I think the problem is that the bootloader adds console=null to my cmdline
[13:45] <mardy> Elleo: and this concatenation of suggestions can be very useful for some languages
[13:45] <jgdx> s/is/are
[13:46] <abeato> jgdx, nice, thx
[13:46] <Elleo> mardy: looks like we already have a bug for it here actually: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-keyboard/+bug/1384953 perhaps you could comment on that with the against doing it that way?
[13:46] <ogra_> julianwi_, oh, yeah, you need a proper tty there ... tty0 is a good one
[13:46] <Elleo> mardy: I'd say for commas we should probably change that to work like other punctuation so it automatically removes any preceeding space
[13:46] <anpok_> Elleo, mardy: but inserting spaces or not isnt really relevant to the prblem
[13:47] <julianwi_> ogra_, ok I will try to rebuild my kernel with CONFIG_CMDLINE_OVERWRITE=y
[13:47] <anpok_> Elleo, mardy: even with a space when you go back.. it often makes a suggestion based on the already typed letters (which is great) but then does not replace the whole word - just appends..
[13:47] <ogra_> just make sure to have the neccessary options in your kernel cmdline option then ;)
[13:47] <mardy> Elleo: anpok_ is right: even if you insert a space, then I can go back and remove it, and continue typin
[13:48] <anpok_> Elleo: I would say that is essential not just useful..
[13:48] <Elleo> if you backspace into a word it'll put it back into pre-edit
[13:48] <Elleo> so the whole word will get replaced
[13:48] <anpok_> but it appends the whole suggestion..
[13:48] <Elleo> anpok_: can you show me the steps to do that?
[13:49] <mardy> Elleo: ah, you are right
[13:49] <Elleo> anpok_: for me it works correctly if you delete a space
[13:49] <julianwi_> ogra_, which options are neccesary?
[13:49] <ogra_> julianwi_, well, depends on your HW ... but you shoudl see the currently used cmdline in your boot log
[13:50] <faenil> dandrader|bank: ping
[13:52] <anpok_> Elleo: hm with english.. just th (select suggestion the) go back one space type r pick suggestion there -> ththere
[13:52] <anpok_> or rather thethere
[13:52] <anpok_> also works if you remove more from the word
[13:54] <Elleo> anpok_: ah, I see what you mean; you've moving the cursor, not deleting backwards
[13:54] <cedian_linux> ththere
[13:55] <cedian_linux> nothing :P, I'm on my laptop
[13:55] <Elleo> anpok_: yeah, we shouldn't be providing suggestions when you're in a word in the middle of a sentence, I suspect its trimming the last space when checking that
[13:55] <anpok_> not moving .. sorry deleting
[13:55] <Elleo> might be able to do a special case that still allows for suggestions when at the end of a word
[13:56] <Elleo> anpok_: do you mean you are deleting? because I was able to reproduce it by moving the cursor, but not by deleting
[13:56] <Elleo> anpok_: when deleting it puts the whole word back into preedit for me (so the whole word gets replaced)
[13:56] <anpok_> not for me
[13:56] <Elleo> anpok_: any chance you could make a quick video of what you're doing so I can see?
[14:08] <m4nuuu_> Evening all, anyone elss running UT on the aquaris e4.5?
[14:09] <faenil> ogra_: hey :) how can I trigger this from debuild? http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~unity-team/unity8/trunk/view/head:/CMakeLists.txt#L127
[14:09] <faenil> I want to skip the tests and build the deb
[14:09] <faenil> but -e NO_TESTS is not helping, probably because that's a cmake option and not an envvar
[14:11] <anpok_> Elleo: uploading ...
[14:11] <Elleo> anpok_: thanks
[14:16] <m4nuuu_> is
[14:16] <m4nuuu_> is
[14:16] <anpok_> Elleo: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-keyboard/+bug/1466105
[14:17] <m4nuuu_> Is it possible to install android on the aquaris e4.5 ubuntu edition, or dual booting if possible?
[14:19] <Elleo> anpok_: could you add what settings you have enabled to the bug?
[14:20] <Elleo> anpok_: and what channel you're on? that should be adding the word back into pre-edit with what you're doing, so I'm guessing there's some combination of enabled/disabled features that causes that not to happen
[14:24] <ogra_> faenil, ask some unity8 developer ?
[14:25] <faenil> ogra_: fair point, I've tried prodding mzanetti :)
[14:25] <ogra_> m4nuuu_, you can flash android, but there is no dusl boot
[14:25] <ogra_> *dual
[14:25] <faenil> but this is a more generic question :)
[14:26] <mzanetti> faenil, usually one would use "cmake -DNO_TESTS"
[14:26] <faenil> mzanetti: yeah, from cmake :) but from debuild?
[14:26] <mzanetti> maybe "debuid -e -DNO_TESTS" or something
[14:26] <mzanetti> just a gues
[14:26] <faenil> nope
[14:26] <mzanetti> dunno... edit debian/rules :D
[14:27] <faenil> yeah well there are many ways I can do it :D
[14:27] <faenil> just wanted to know the proper way
[14:27] <faenil> there must be a way to add a cmake option from debuild
[14:27] <mzanetti> yeah... quite sure there is, but don't know it.
[14:28] <faenil> :)
[14:28] <m4nuuu_> Ogra: So its possible to replace ubuntu with android? And if so this is easily reversible?
[14:29] <anpok_> Elleo: done
[14:30] <K1773R> what is the current plan to support VPN?
[14:33] <ogra_> m4nuuu_, no, idea, i have never done it, but i think with some windows flash tool you can flash the device back and forth
[14:34] <m4nuuu_> OK cool, I'll see what the deal is :) thanks
[14:35] <Elleo> anpok_: thanks, have you had this problem for a long time or has it only just started?
[14:36] <Elleo> anpok_: those settings don't look much different to what I have
[14:36] <Elleo> anpok_: will have a poke around as soon as my device has finished running some autopilot tests and see if I can figure out a way to reproduce it
[14:36] <cedian_linux> on my laptop the screen didn't want to start :(
[14:36] <cedian_linux> But I resolved it
[14:38] <ogra_> K1773R, VPN support is in the image bu there is no UI
[14:38] <ogra_> you can set up some vpn with the keys and files in /home/phablet and manually firs it up though
[14:38] <ogra_> *fire
[14:38] <ogra_> (openvpn)
[14:43] <anpok_> Elleo: not sure.. but it isnt something that happened just recently
[14:44] <dandrader> faenil, pong
[14:44] <Elleo> anpok_: okay, thanks; I'll see what I can do to reproduce it
[14:44] <faenil> dandrader: hey :) I saw you committed the NO_TESTS config to Unity8's cmake
[14:44] <faenil> so I was wondering if you knew how to to enable that from debuild
[14:45] <faenil> i.e. without hacking around and disabling lines manually
[14:50] <dandrader> faenil, I don't know, sorry. I don't use debuild. Maybe some DEB_BUILD_OPTIONS tag would be needed
[14:50] <faenil> dandrader: alright, thanks anyway ;)
[14:51] <anpok_> Elleo: hum it works fine on the rtm images
[14:54] <Elleo> anpok_: interesting; I'm testing with wily and rc-proposed and not seeing it in either of those
[14:54] <Elleo> anpok_: although actually on rc-proposed I have a trunk build of keyboard running currently
[14:54] <Elleo> my wily image is a bit out of date though, will just try flashing the latest one
[14:59] <K1773R> ogra_: openvpn isnt installed, i have to build it myself
[14:59] <ogra_> what ?
[15:00] <ogra_> phablet@ubuntu-phablet:~$ dpkg -l |grep openvpn
[15:00] <ogra_> ii  openvpn                                              2.3.2-9ubuntu4                                    armhf        virtual private network daemon
[15:00] <ogra_> definitely installed
[15:00] <K1773R> not for me, just flashed the current stable on mako
[15:06] <dobey> it's installed in wily at least
[15:09] <ArchNET> NICK
[15:09] <ogra_> dobey, dont use wily :P
[15:09] <ogra_> dobey, it is in vivid since months (i seeded it)
[15:10] <ogra_> and nobody should use pre-vivid images anymore anyway :)
[15:10] <ogra_> K1773R, the stable channel is very old anbd outdated ... there should be an update to it this week though
[15:11] <ArchNET> ?
[15:11] <ogra_> (well, the stable community channel that is, the official release channels are all updated already)
[15:15] <K1773R> ogra_: i used ubuntu-touch/stable/ubuntu
[15:16] <ogra_> right, thats the community channel
[15:16] <ogra_> the upgrade is in testing this week and will land there eventually ...
[15:16] <ArchNET> \msg nickserv register
[15:17] <dobey> ogra_: i have wily on my mako to test the things i'm landing into wily :)
[15:17] <ogra_> the stable/bq-aquaris.en and stable/meizu.en channels are updated since monday
[15:17] <ogra_> dobey, crazy !
[15:17] <K1773R> ogra_: which one should i pick then?
[15:17] <dobey> ogra_: i only use that device for devel/testing work, not as an actual phone. so eh, doesn't much matter what i run on it, as long as it boots :)
[15:17] <ogra_> K1773R, what device ?
[15:17] <K1773R> mako
[15:18] <ogra_> stable/bq-aquaris.en should be good then ... or just wait a few days for the upgrade in the ubuntu channel
[15:18] <dobey> or use rc-proposed if you want slightly less tested stuff
[15:19] <ogra_> living on the edge :)
[15:19] <dobey> a softish edge
[15:19] <dobey> more like a foam noodle
[15:19] <anpok_> hum hm i use devel-proposed as a daily phone and to do testing
[15:20] <dobey> now that is living on the edge
[15:20] <ogra_> living on the foam noodle then
[15:20] <ogra_> i can live with that description :)
[15:21] <K1773R> ok, will wait
[15:21] <ogra_> anpok_, well, devel-proposed is totally un-QAed ... gets all the crack and will eventually break if we start snappy work
[15:21] <K1773R> its fine, i compiled openvpn myself ;)
[15:23] <ogra_> K1773R, any reason to not just use am existing deb ?
[15:23] <K1773R> ogra_: yes, broke my phone twice with chaning fings on the r/o filesystems
[15:23] <K1773R> s/fings/things/, wtf
[15:24] <ogra_> well, making it rw to install a single deb that wasnt installed before and then making it ro again wont do any harm
[15:24] <K1773R> ok, then something else did ^^ good to know
[15:24] <K1773R> last time there was no package openvpn, thats why i built it myself
[15:25] <ogra_> it really depends what you do with the rw state :) usually small and single packages that are not installed already wont do any harm
[15:25] <ogra_> oh, because you were using the RTM release, yeah
[15:25] <ogra_> that doesnt have anything in the archive except for whats on the image
[15:26] <K1773R> it was fine with the last 2-3 updates, but this time it broke :S
[15:26] <ogra_> (thats all fixed with the current upgrade)
[15:30] <ArchNET> terminal on ubuntu  phone
[15:41] <charles> jgdx, nik90: what is the date formatting issue you two were talking about earlier?
[15:41] <charles> the indicator's format is coded to match https://wiki.ubuntu.com/TimeAndDate#Presenting_times
[15:45] <nik90> charles: in the norwegian locale, clock app shows time as 21.30 while indicator-datetime shows it as 21:30.
[15:45] <nik90> charles: for clock app I'm using Qt.locale(), so we're wondering what format is used by indicator-datetime..if it was hard coded or not..
[15:45]  * nik90 reads the link
[15:46] <charles> ok. I don't think the link's germane for that
[15:46] <charles> nik90, is there a ticket open for this already?
[15:46] <nik90> charles: yes, one sec
[15:47] <charles> I'm doing triage on a couple of other datetime questions today & will add this to my TODO
[15:47] <nik90> chhttps://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-clock-app/+bug/1466002
[15:47] <charles> nik90, thanks
[15:48] <nik90> yw
[16:09] <seb128> ogra_, in your reply to this email you are assuming that the issue is a bluez one/that bluez5 resolves that problem, which is unsure, seems like they are mentioning pulse routing issues
[16:10] <ogra_> seb128, oh, yeah that too ... i just wanted to point out the complexity of the task though ... since i find the accusation that we ignore the problem rather rude
[16:10] <ogra_> feel free to point them to pulse :)
[16:12] <seb128> ogra_, well, we ignore the problem it's true
[16:12] <seb128> like we didn't assign anyone to look at what the issue is and work on resolving it
[16:12] <ogra_> we ahvent ignored it in the phonedations team
[16:13] <seb128> then there should be a bug with the status...
[16:13] <ogra_> right, its a lack of manpower ..
[16:13] <seb128> yeah, I don't say we could do better
[16:13] <seb128> but we basically didn't work much on it by lack of resources/priority
[16:13] <seb128> so he can challenge that the bug priority should be bumped
[16:13] <ogra_> (and an issue that our BT specialis suddenly left the team and went to maintain the installer :P )
[16:13] <seb128> which is pat&co decision
[16:14] <ogra_> yeah
[16:15] <ogra_> but its simply not like we say on a developer level "screw it, we dont care" ... that is what the mail implied
[16:15] <seb128> right, it's just that he didn't get ranked as a top priority on our current list
[16:16] <ogra_> yeah
[16:16]  * seb128 is going to reply
[16:16] <ogra_> thanks :)
[16:27] <dednick> larsu: ping
[16:29] <dednick> larsu: attaching a source to a mainloop. during an iteration, what is the order the sources are polled in? by the source priority?
[16:49] <cedian_linux> Hi all
[17:01] <cedian_linux> I'm removing Gentoo external and will install Ubuntu on there, my internal HDD starts failing
[17:11] <colbyf> just sent an email to Enpass to ask if they would create there app for ubuntu phone
[17:12] <colbyf> fingers crossed, good password manager and you can sync it with your ownCloud and other clouds
[17:12] <colbyf> I also work in BT so pushing the app developes in there to make apps for the UK phone
[17:14] <seb128> who is looking at unity-scopes nowadays? is https://errors.ubuntu.com/problem/82f3407ea224db29041027eca65d23d17eb2027e a known issue?
[17:14] <seb128> it's ranked high on e.u.c device issues
[17:15] <seb128> smartscopesproxy error
[17:22] <sergiusens_> alecu: ^
[17:26] <dobey> hmm
[17:33] <brobostigon> is there a method for working out battery drain?
[17:33] <brobostigon> and the causes?
[17:38] <studio_> hi
[17:41] <brobostigon> hi studio_
[17:41] <dobey> seb128: is there a bug report against unity-scopes-api for that one?
[17:41] <studio_> popey, i have a question about the adapter in the video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JvDbi5h5RF4, is it an normal mhl adapter or displaylink?
[17:41] <seb128> dobey, unsure, the e.u.c entry is not linked to one at least
[17:44] <chrisccoulson> hi mandel. It's probably EOD for you, but just on the off-chance that you're still around - I have a question about the download manager and I've been told you're the person to ask :)
[17:46] <dobey> seb128: can you get one filed for it? i think everyone who looks after that bit is gone for the day (either in eu or au)
[17:46] <seb128> dobey, k
[17:47] <dobey> seb128: thanks
[17:47] <seb128> yw!
[17:52] <chrisccoulson> hey seb128, how are you?
[17:52] <studio_> popey, are you still there?
[17:53] <seb128> chrisccoulson, hey, good! how are you?
[17:53] <chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, not bad :)
[17:56] <ogra_> brobostigon, try to catch cking tomorrow, there are a bunch of measuring tools he has on the image ... and i think SturmFlut also wrote something about monitoring power drain if i'm not wrong
[17:56] <studio_> @mhall119, sorry haven't seen, that you are also online. what adapter are you using?
[17:57] <brobostigon> ogra_: ok, thank you.
[18:07] <studio_> come on guys, what usb-adaper is it on 8:17 to clone the display?
[18:16] <studio_> nobody knows, or nobody wants to tell?
[18:17] <dobey> studio_: acquire a modicum of patience, please
[18:19] <mhall119> studio_: it's a very specifoc slimport model
[18:20] <mhall119> not all slimport adapters work with the nexus 4 it seems
[18:20] <studio_> mhall119, is it mhl?
[18:20] <mhall119> studio_: I'll have to find the Amazon link, will ping you with it layer
[18:23] <mhall119> studio_: no, it's pre-mhl I think
[18:24] <cwayne1> http://www.amazon.com/SlimPort%C2%AE-SP1002-Connect-connector-Supports/dp/B009UZBLSG
[18:26] <studio_> mhall119, what is the different between "slimport" and mhl? payment for license? if yes, will that adapter work on the bq E4.5/E5?
[18:33] <dobey> studio_: https://lmddgtfy.net/?q=slimport%20vs%20mhl
[18:35]  * ogra_ would have used http://www.googlefight.com/index.php?word1=slimport&word2=mhl 
[18:35] <ogra_> :P
[18:37] <dobey> heh
[18:38] <studio_> sorry, but i do not unterstand the video. it is not an official ubuntu phone
[18:40] <dobey> …
[18:41] <studio_> i think ubuntu touch needs more time. it is nice to see, what is "possible", but on the "official" ubuntu touch devices it is "now" not working.
[18:42] <grepo> hello, I am new to ubuntu touch, may I consult bug reporting process here?
[18:42] <ogra_> you mean the feature that is announced for april 2016 is not working today ? thats indeed shocking
[18:42] <ogra_> grepo, sure
[18:42] <dobey> studio_: stop expecting a product that has been announced to be released a year from now, on something that was released 6 months ago
[18:43] <grepo> orga_: I am experienced Fedora user and feel lucky about Red Hat Bugzilla
[18:43] <studio_> ogra_, yes maybe on 16.04, but not in the moment
[18:44] <grepo> orga_: I was trying to file a bug report over launchpad for ubuntu touch, but the bug gets no maintainer for a long time
[18:44] <grepo> orga_: How can I push the process forward?
[18:45] <ogra_> grepo, there is https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Avengers showing a bit of the package relations ... and for generic bugs you can use https://bugs.launchpad.net/canonical-devices-system-image/+filebug
[18:45] <grepo> orga_: I did that with the result above...
[18:45] <ogra_> the latter list  is reviewed by the phone product team regulary
[18:46] <ogra_> grepo, got a bug number ?
[18:46] <ogra_> studio_, who said when that it would be available "in the moment" ?
[18:47] <studio_> ogra_, why canoncial make a different between "phone" and other touch devices with gsm/3g/lte-support?
[18:47] <ogra_> it is a feature for 16.04 ... (which, as i think you have been told 1000 times now or more ... yet you come back to complain about it for your own fun apprantly)
[18:47] <grepo> orga_: OK, I opened a filed bug now and added canonical system image as a affected project, does it help
[18:47] <grepo> ??
[18:48] <ogra_> grepo, whats the bug number ... i can find someone to push it forward
[18:48] <grepo> the number is 1462090
[18:48] <ogra_> bug 1462090
[18:48] <grepo> yes
[18:48] <ogra_> bfiller, ^^ ?
[18:50] <grepo> orga_: I have the phone for two month not able to place a call to slovakian fixed lines because of i18n formatting
[18:50] <studio_> ogra_, who said that? the blueprint. as i remember correct it said something about xmir on mir
[18:50] <ogra_> grepo, right, i think bfiller's team is responsible for that part of the system ... i pinged him above and he will take care of getting it to the right developer
[18:51] <ogra_> studio_, no idea what you talk about, sorry
[18:51] <grepo> orga_, ok thanks
[18:51] <studio_> ogra_, you asked, what is working in the moment, aren't you?
[18:52] <bfiller> renatu: can you take a quick look at this bug grepo is reporting please? https://launchpad.net/bugs/1462090
[18:53] <ogra_> studio_, no, i know what is working atm
[18:53] <bfiller> renatu: maybe tiago knows it better
[18:55] <bfiller> grepo: we'll get it fixed for the next ota and can get you the fix before that if you're willing to make your phone rw
[18:56] <grepo> what is the frequency of ota?
[18:56] <ogra_> grepo, about monthly
[18:56] <ogra_> last OTA went actually out on monday
[18:56] <ogra_> (you should have recieved it)
[18:57] <grepo> when putting rw, what is the way of patching? apt-get update?
[18:57] <studio_> ogra_, ok, nice, but "maybe" you could answer my last question to you?
[18:57] <ogra_> studio_, what was that last question ?
[18:57] <studio_> ogra_, about the "phone"
[18:58] <ogra_> all your question here are "about the phone"
[18:58] <bfiller> grepo: apt-get update from a ppa or copy deb to phone and dpkg -i to install it
[18:58] <studio_> ogra_, why canoncial make a different between "phone" and other touch devices with gsm/3g/lte-support?
[18:58]  * ogra_ would do the latter ... as it is the least intrusive 
[18:58] <ogra_> and then make the phone readonly again
[18:59] <ogra_> studio_, does canonical do that ? i dont think so
[18:59] <grepo> bfiller, ok no problem, i can remount / rw and update if it will not affect future ota updates....
[18:59] <ogra_> dont use apt then
[18:59] <bfiller> grepo: yeah, what ogra_ says is the best
[19:00] <ogra_> if it is only a single package make it rw, wget the package, dpkg -i ... make it ro
[19:00] <grepo> ok
[19:00] <ogra_> apt will first need to update package caches etc etc ... the changes it does are a lot more
[19:01] <bfiller> grepo: so to be clear, you are entering the number in the dialer app and it is incorrectly formatting it by adding "/"?
[19:01] <studio_> there is no "phone". the is a handelt pc with gsm/lte or what ever support, same is with an "tablet-pc" or "netbook", isn't it?
[19:01] <ogra_> who says that ?
[19:01] <studio_> me
[19:02] <ogra_> fine then
[19:03] <grepo> bfiller: the / on the display is not a problem, but it should be removed when placing a call, I suggested regular expression change in a source code file in bug report
[19:03] <studio_> ogra_, what is a PDA?
[19:03] <bfiller> grepo: ok
[19:03] <bfiller> saw that
[19:03] <ogra_> studio_, something from the 90s that collects dust on my shelf
[19:04] <studio_> ogra_, what is a phone?
[19:04] <davmor2> studio_: a thing you make phone calls on
[19:04] <studio_> :)
[19:05] <grepo> biffler, I am not 100% sure I identified problem correcly but 99% the problem is the regular expression removing prettyprinting of the numbers
[19:05] <bfiller> grepo: even if we strip the slash before placing the call, does it make sense to have / on the display?
[19:06] <davmor2> studio_: how are you communicating on irc you are a studio
[19:06] <studio_> davmor2, so for what is an ubuntu phone? just for making phone calls?
[19:06] <grepo> bfiller: I don't mind the / on the screen it separates operator part of the number from the party number, but it it is not there i do not mind it either. Both solutions are OK for me.
[19:07] <ogra_> studio_, it is a smartphone ... similar to an android or IOS or sailfish device
[19:07] <bfiller> grepo: is / common for slovakian numbers?
[19:08] <grepo> bfiller: yes they are often printed like this. The number before / identifies the locality of the fixed line.
[19:08] <bfiller> grepo: ok thanks
[19:08] <Sleep_Walker> grepo: you still use it?
[19:09] <grepo> sleep_walker: use what?
[19:09] <renatu> bfiller, let me take a look to see if it is related with number formating
[19:09] <Sleep_Walker> I haven't seen '/' as separator in Czech republic for really long time
[19:09] <ogra_> we have that in germany too ... but nobody would have the idea to type it in i guess
[19:10] <bfiller> renatu: sounds like the / needs to be removed before placing the call but it is correct to have it on the display
[19:10] <davmor2> studio_: depends on your user case, My mom would use only sms basically combined with a bit of phoning, because that is all she uses her android phone for, Then there are power users that very rarely use the phone or messaging tools on the device.  But the thing that differentiates a a phone from a table and pc, is it fits in your pocket and can make phone calls via the phone networks and sms via the phone networ
[19:10] <davmor2> ks
[19:10] <studio_> ogra_, a smartphone is just PR. "smart" phones have been old phones which became "smart" with some addons. bat they are still PDAs or handheld PCs ...
[19:10] <ogra_> studio_, whatever you say ...
[19:11] <grepo> sleep_walker: czech republic removed locality identification few year ago. You can move your number to another locality. I think it is not possible here in Slovakia. You should ask for non-goegraphical number if you want to move between locality.
[19:11] <Sleep_Walker> grepo: thanks for explanation, I had no idea
[19:12] <studio_> ogra_, would you say, that an mt6595 with phone support is just a "phone"?
[19:12] <ogra_> studio_, no, i would say that a cpu has nothig to do with the use case of the software
[19:12] <studio_> ok
[19:13] <ogra_> and you wont get nowhere going on with this ... it is extremely tiring
[19:13] <ogra_> (but you are being told that every time anyway, i know you wont listen to anyone in here as usual)
[19:14] <grepo> bfiller: could you, please, put the URL from where could be the dpkg downloaded from to the bug report after it is avalilable? Thanks.
[19:16] <bfiller> grepo: will do
[19:16] <grepo> bfiller: thank you very much
[19:16] <bfiller> grepo: sorry about the bug, thanks for reporting it
[19:17] <bfiller> I didn't notice it earlier
[19:18] <studio_> thanks guy for answering my questions for today, have to leave. wish you a nice evening. thanks again.
[19:18] <grepo> bfiller: it is normal for the software to contain bugs. I was just frustrated for not taking care of it. I was not aware of the correct process. So is adding to cannonical system image correct way to get care of it? Or should I always use the url posted above by orga_?
[19:21] <bfiller> grepo: adding canonical system image and the affected project (in this case telephony-service) is the correct way, the bugs get triaged fairly often but sometimes it takes a while
[19:21] <bfiller> grepo: so best to file the bug and ping one of us on irc if it's something critical
[19:22] <grepo> OK. I will do it like this. Thank you once more. Bye
[19:54] <grepo> I have one more question, does anybody observe same bahaviour? When I disable wifi, battery drains faster than when it is enabled on bq aquaris... or does it only seem to me?
[19:54]  * ogra_ never disables wifi ... 
[19:54] <ice9> I'm trying to initiate the repo but I get this error https://gist.github.com/anonymous/95255793b01a8d52379e
[19:54] <ogra_> on idle my phone lasts about 5-6 days (if i dont touch it at all) ...
[19:55] <ogra_> average usage gets me 2-3 days ... heavy usage a bit more than one day
[19:56] <grepo> orga_: when the phone was new, i had one sim installed, wifi on, and the phone on the table without moving I got 8 days and 7 nights.
[19:56] <grepo> orga_: now with two sims installed and wifi off 3 days and two nights.\
[19:56] <ogra_> yeah, thats normal
[19:56] <ogra_> i did use two sims for a while and didnt notice a difference ...
[19:57] <ogra_> so it may actually be the turned off wifi
[19:58] <grepo> orga_: it is very strange, I would expect the battery to last longer with wifi off...
[19:58] <ogra_> well, there is surely some bug ...
[19:59] <ogra_> like the notification service polling more or some such
[20:00] <grepo> ogra_: yeah, I think so. But if nobody else is observing it maybe it is not true and it is only seeming to me...
[20:01] <ogra_> to observe it you need to turn off wifi ... not sure how common that is
[20:01] <ogra_> i definitely never turn it off
[20:01] <ogra_> you could try writing to the mailing list and see if others have the same experience
[20:02] <grepo> ok. will try.
[20:04] <taiebot> Is anyone on OTA 4 ? just want to check if bug on willy is present on older revision. Open contact-app => select a contact => click on the little messaging icon => (Opens the messaging app )try to send a sms from there ( it should work but it fails)
[20:06] <SturmFlut> grepo: The standby time of my E4.5 is so long that I usually forget when I last had to charge it, so if my phone showed this bevior too, I wouldn't have noticed. But there are people out there who seem to have the equipment to actually measure such things, see bug 1460945
[20:06] <grepo> taiebot: how can I check OTA version? I have the one from monday... probably not what you want...
[20:07] <taiebot> grepo could you try?
[20:08] <grepo> SturmFlut: I was running top on terminal not seeing any high cpu usage. It should be something hidden. Polling frequently, but not using CPU hard.
[20:12] <ogra_> grepo, monday was the OTA4 :)
[20:12] <grepo> taiebot: sure i can, i am going to, but how to check for ota version?
[20:12] <ogra_> (i think you see it as 23 in your system-settings)
[20:13] <ogra_> ah, no, 24 actually
[20:14] <grepo> taiebot: the message was successfully sent.
[20:15] <grepo> taiebot: but i have chosen contact from Favorites. I do not know if that matters?
[20:15] <matv1> etmyth
[20:15] <matv1> etm
[20:16] <taiebot> grepo: mm weird mine when i do this it opens the messaging app on a different thread than the original contact thread and from their i cannot send any messages
[20:16] <grepo> ogra: you mean OS Ubuntu15.04(r23)??? This is what I see...
[20:17] <ogra_> yeah
[20:17] <ogra_> http://system-image.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-touch/rc/bq-aquaris.en/krillin/ shows a 24 ...
[20:19] <grepo> really weird. why do i see r23?
[20:19] <taiebot> ogra_ can you confirm it works on 24  Open contact-app => select a contact => click on the little messaging icon => (Opens the messaging app )try to send a sms from there ( it should work but it fails)
[20:19] <SturmFlut> ogra_: You are looking at the "rc" channel
[20:20] <ogra_> SturmFlut, oops :P
[20:20] <SturmFlut> ogra_, grepo: OTA-4 equals "r23" on the stable channel
[20:20] <ogra_> thats what you get when never using the stable channel :P
[20:20] <SturmFlut> taiebot, grepo: Most people should be on OTA-4 by now, sadly I don't have a SIM in my bq at the moment
[20:20] <grepo> ok, understand...
[20:20]  * SturmFlut has too many phones and not enough SIMs
[20:24] <matv1> hmm cached search suggestions in scopes are placed outside of the shell. Seen it before but thought that was fixed. Has it regressed since OTA4?
[20:24] <taiebot> sturmflut is your Sim on your new phone ? (saw the google + post)
[20:25] <SturmFlut> taiebot: Yep
[20:25] <taiebot> me is jealous ;-)
[20:25] <svij> same for me ;)
[20:26] <taiebot> just wished it had a SD card
[20:26] <taiebot> Sturmflut: How app startup compares ?
[20:27] <SturmFlut> taiebot: Yeah, the lack of an SD card while having just 12 GB of available storage is a problem for me. I upgraded my bq to 72 GB
[20:27] <ogra_> SturmFlut, there is resize code that will land in one of the next OTAs that will at least expand to the full disk for you
[20:28] <SturmFlut> taiebot: It starts crazy fast. 20 seconds from power-on to lockscreen
[20:28] <SturmFlut> ogra_: Pssst, we got a special version ;)
[20:29] <ogra_> yeah :) thats why i said "full disk" ;)
[20:29] <svij> ogra_: I always wanted a storage upgrade through an OTA update… you should that with the RAM too :P
[20:29] <taiebot> sturmflut i meant the apps like calculator, browser, etc. Sometimes i get a little bit frustrated with waiting
[20:29] <ogra_> svij, well, we'll see ... i work on snappy now you will have to wait til the phone switches to it
[20:29] <svij> ogra_: :)
[20:30] <ogra_> taiebot, just dont close them :)
[20:30] <svij> taiebot: it's a bit better on the mx4 compared to the bq
[20:30] <SturmFlut> ogra_: Ah, you mean the whole 17 GB? ;)
[20:31] <ogra_> SturmFlut, 16 ... yeah :)
[20:31] <SturmFlut> taiebot: The browser on the MX4 starts in about half the time the bq needs
[20:31] <taiebot> ogra_ yeah i might have OCD for running apps cannot let them in the dash needs to swipe them away.
[20:32] <ogra_> haha
[20:33] <taiebot> ogra_ always wondered if some should not be hidden in the background like ,messaging, contact, browser,  to give the device a speedier feel.
[20:34] <SturmFlut> taiebot: Same for the Music app, starts about twice as fast than the bq
[20:34] <ahayzen> SturmFlut, really? how fast?
[20:34] <SturmFlut> taiebot: And the MX4 has 2 GB of RAM, so it doesn't have to kill apps all the time
[20:34] <ogra_> taiebot, heh, bfiller brought that up a few times for the dialer app :)
[20:34] <ahayzen> its around 2.7-3.2s on mako when i last checked
[20:36] <taiebot> Sturmflut: i only have a nexus 4 here and like ahayzen i would say most apps start in 3-4sec when they have been cached. Calculator can take up to 6 sec
[20:37] <ArchNET> NickServ VERIFY REGISTER ArchNET xqpoojqexlth
[20:37] <SturmFlut> ahayzen: I just did a cheap test with a stopwatch, on the bq it's exactly 5 seconds until the app starts to show actual content, on the MX4 it's about 2.7 to 3
[20:37] <SturmFlut> ArchNET: ...you might want to do that right
[20:38] <ArchNET> why
[20:38] <SturmFlut> ArchNET: Because we just saw your password
[20:38] <ahayzen> SturmFlut, copy this script on your device http://people.ubuntu.com/~ahayzen/measure.py and run $ ./measure.py /home/phablet/.cache/upstart/unity8.log ApplicationManager::onProcessStarting "MirSurfaceItem::updateMirSurfaceFocus true"
[20:38] <ahayzen> SturmFlut, and it'll tell you how long it takes for the app to start
[20:38] <SturmFlut> ahayzen: Ooooh!
[20:39] <ahayzen> ...or at least gives you a measurable value :-)
[20:39] <SturmFlut> I'll just enable Developer Mode for the first time
[20:39] <taiebot> ahayzen: are you developping for the music app?
[20:39] <SturmFlut> So exciting
[20:39] <ahayzen> just remember the first time you start an app it has to build the cache, so measure with the second/third start
[20:39] <ahayzen> taiebot, yeah ;-)
[20:39] <SturmFlut> ahayzen: Yeah, I measured after a couple of starts
[20:39] <taiebot> ahayzen can i make a feature request?
[20:40] <ahayzen> taiebot, maybe? hehe
[20:41] <ahayzen> taiebot, ... is it an Eq .. or convergence?
[20:42] <taiebot> Ahayzen. There should be some kind of animation to show that music is playing like a fake music spectrum on the bottom bar would be lovely https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=music+spectrum+images&client=ubuntu&hs=IV1&channel=fs&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ei=b9uBVfC4AuHd7gbSo4HIDw&ved=0CCEQsAQ&biw=1280&bih=682
[20:42] <ahayzen> taiebot, interesting, across all pages? or just when the toolbar is shown (non now playing page)?
[20:43] <ArchNET> I want to install penman on Ubuntu phone
[20:43] <ArchNET> zenmap
[20:43] <ArchNET> or nmap
[20:44] <ahayzen> ArchNET, this may interest you https://uappexplorer.com/app/netscan.mzanetti
[20:44] <ArchNET> tank you
[20:45] <ahayzen> taiebot, its probably best you report a bug against the music-app in lp, and i'll mark it as wishlist and i suppose we would need design input
[20:46] <SturmFlut> taiebot: Okay, so according to your script the Music app starts in about 4100ms on the bq and 1800ms on the MX4
[20:46] <ahayzen> SturmFlut, interest, is this with a completely empty queue?
[20:46] <ahayzen> *interesting
[20:46] <taiebot> ahayzen well the black bar that you click on to show now playing at the bottom could be a music spectrum analyser or a fake one. It would be just moving to show that music is playing. I found myself more than ones with wondering if i had launch the music and did not realised the sound was muted.
[20:47] <SturmFlut> ahayzen: No, different music files on both devices. I would have to synchronize both for a very fair comparison
[20:47] <ahayzen> SturmFlut, it doesn't really matter about how many music files are on the device, just if any were in the play queue
[20:48] <ahayzen> taiebot, yeah the only visual element we have is the seekbar moving *very* slowly across the bottom :-)
[20:48] <mzanetti> rpadovani, I've fixed the issues
[20:48] <SturmFlut> ahayzen: I think the queues should be empty
[20:48] <ahayzen> SturmFlut, if they are then yeah its a pretty good test :-)
[20:49] <ahayzen> sounds about the right times tbh
[20:50] <matv1> I cannot even find a bugreport for that. surely I am not the only one seeing that on the bq?
[20:51] <taiebot> ahayzen https://gitlab.com/nitroxis/pasa/
[20:51] <taiebot> :)
[20:52] <ahayzen> taiebot, hehe unfortunately we don't have access that low :-/ we just tell media-hub what to play
[20:52] <matv1> ..assuming that that would be a Unity bug.
[20:54] <taiebot> matv1: is it for search suggestion in scopes. if you report it i confirm it
[20:55] <matv1> yes thats right. It appears above the searchbox. which is outside of visible area
[20:56] <matv1> taiebot I am guessing report it against Unity right?
[20:57] <taiebot> matv1: unity8
[20:57] <matv1> taiebot yup will do.
[20:59] <ArchNET> I have a problem on mi phone
[21:00] <ArchNET> sudo passwd
[21:00] <dobey> !ask | ArchNET
[21:00] <dobey> ArchNET: the password is whatever you set it to. the pin/password for the lock screen
[21:01] <ArchNET> ies but , I cant change the password
[21:01] <ogra_> you can ... via system-settings
[21:01] <dobey> yes you can, in the system settings
[21:02] <dobey> ArchNET: if you are trying to use sudo to use apt though, i'd not recommend it. you should create a chroot on your phone and install any cli tools in there instead, and use them from within the chroot
[21:02] <ArchNET> it say authentification token manipulation error
[21:02] <ogra_> ArchNET, if you use system-settings to change it ?
[21:03] <dobey> you can't use the passwd command to change the root password. there is no root password
[21:03] <ogra_> and the password database is locked down
[21:03] <dobey> exactly
[21:03] <dobey> see https://askubuntu.com/questions/620740/recommended-way-to-install-regularcli-deb-packages-on-ubuntu-phone/623311#623311 for making a chroot
[21:08] <matv1> taiebot https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity8/+bug/1466228
[21:12] <taiebot> matv1 confirmed and i placed a screenshot too
[21:12] <matv1> taiebot ah cheers!
[21:15] <matv1> taiebot hang-on, now I see that its not actually the same thing. In Mako the hint covers the searchbox, I see in your screenshot
[21:16] <matv1> in Krillin the search hint just is not visible
[21:16] <matv1> I will add a screenshot as well to show the difference
[21:17] <taiebot> matv1: yeah i think the bug should be called the position of the search box is not fixed. sometime the little arrow is above the search box.
[21:17] <matv1> taiebot agreed. I will update in a minute :)
[21:18] <taiebot> matv1 i did find this search box at different place on my screen http://uppix.com/f-screenshot2015065581e434001931da.png
[21:20] <matv1> taiebot haha I never saw that one before. what channel/release is that on?
[21:20] <taiebot> matv1 its quite easy to trigger when you have done more than 3 searches.
[21:21] <taiebot> matv1 i am on willy (the bleeding edge)
[21:22] <matv1> taiebot I see.
[21:24] <matv1> oh yeah I can do that too on BQ stable, i just found out. I can actualy swipe the sugestions list to a different place on the screen so that it looks like your screenshot
[21:25] <taiebot> matv1: so far it has been not very bleeding :) kudos to the developpers as UT is becoming more and more stable. back in the days you could end up with a non-working phones.
[21:25] <matv1> taiebot totaly agreed! all in all its looking pretty neat
[21:26] <matv1> I started out on the galaxy nexus back in october 2013 :D
[21:26] <matv1> i recently came across an ols screenshot
[21:26] <matv1> looks totaly different now
[21:27] <matv1> background of homescope was purple for starters
[21:27] <taiebot> has been my primary phone since oct 2013 was kind of edgy at that time.  ;-)
[21:28] <matv1> taiebot wow respect :D not even most canonical peeps went that deep in that early
[21:29] <matv1> taiebot it actualy makes me happy to be reporting minor things like that search sugestions thingy :)
[21:29] <taiebot> Lol well i do not receive that many call use my phone as a webbrowser mainly. Has soon as i got 3g working that was it. My girlfriend did not like it because i was missing sms and calls :-D
[21:30] <matv1> taiebot lol :) same here
[21:31] <taiebot> Anyway bed time.
[21:33] <ArchNET> Ubuntu phone must be changed completly
[21:34] <genii> Feel free to do so
[21:34] <ArchNET> Yes
[21:36] <mcphail> matv1: can you post the screenshot? Would be interested to see how things have changed
[21:36] <ArchNET> the operaring system must be changed , the graphic interface sucks.  unity dock aswell ,
[21:37] <ArchNET> I like Ubuntu
[21:37] <matv1> mcphail you mean the one frm back in 2013?
[21:37] <mcphail> yep - if you still have it
[21:37] <ogra_> ArchNET, you dont sound like you do
[21:37] <matv1> haha hang on a minute, I should do
[21:37] <mcphail> :)
[21:38] <ArchNET> but Ubuntu phone phablet it's sucks sorry for the comment
[21:40] <matv1> found it :) wasnt even a screenshot propper. just a selfie, just after initial flash :)
[21:40] <matv1> http://uppix.com/f-image0015581e8de001931df.jpg
[21:40] <matv1> you couldnt even do screenshots back then
[21:41] <mcphail> looks like firefoxOS!
[21:41] <matv1> mcphail haha don't say that
[21:42] <mcphail> That is a real moment in history. Thanks for sharing!
[21:42] <matv1> you also have to realise that they started out with a lot of placeholders. i.e. thumbs that didnt do anything
[21:42] <mcphail> that is called "ambition"
[21:43] <matv1> mcphail no problem I am sure there are many others who have the same kind of shots :)
[21:43] <matv1> absolutely true! I am still amazed every day
[21:43] <mcphail> I love this kind of stuff. Wish I had been along for the ride
[21:44] <matv1> the ride is still pretty early days :)
[21:44] <mcphail> fun, isn't it?
[21:45] <matv1> yup. my next biggie would be standing next to someone on the street using one of these
[21:45] <matv1> that would just blow me away
[21:46] <mcphail> It is a shame the bq looks so much like an Iphone. No-one notices when you use it
[21:47] <mcphail> I'm hoping for a bright and shiny device in Ubuntu-orange or purple. That would get heads turning
[21:48] <matv1> mcphail, they will notice for sure when you run a full desktop off your phone at the end of this year
[21:48] <matv1> mphail that would actualy be a great idea
[21:48] <matv1> those colors
[21:49]  * mcphail shouldn't be relied upon for fashion advice
[21:50] <matv1> mcphail :)
[23:07] <nik90> balloons: ping
[23:08] <nik90> balloons: When you see this msg can you re-run jenkins on https://code.launchpad.net/~nik90/ubuntu-clock-app/migrate-to-15.04-framework/+merge/260336
[23:09] <nik90> balloons: looking at the fail log, it seems it failed for 2 reason, the first being no internet connection and the second being a random segmentation fault of clock app.
[23:09] <nik90> balloons: Are the jenkins vivid machines connected to the web? I know we talked about mocking online search but never got to it in utopic. But seemingly it is failing now on vivid due to that reason.
[23:19] <mariogrip> ahoneybun: Hey, I saw that you registered on the forum, but you're not activated. did you get the activate email? I'm asking because some people didn't got the activate email, but i thought i fixed that issue.