=== IdleOne is now known as Guest23854 [12:18] Hey folks [12:22] hi BluesKaj [12:22] hey hyper_ch [12:22] slowly I get nixos to a usable state: https://github.com/sjau/nixos/blob/master/configuration.nix [12:24] and it's way too hot to fiddle any more with it now [12:26] still need to look at stuff like acpi and also setup default cron jobs and stuff [12:26] you can do that directly in the config [12:28] wonder how well it does networking, like VPN tunneling etc [12:29] * penguin42 tries to understand what it means about it's config [12:30] BluesKaj: well, I set it to use network manager [12:30] but all system wide configuration you should be able to set in the config [12:30] e.g. you could directly provide openvpn profiles and stuff [12:31] penguin42: that's my configuration.nix file for NixOS [12:31] BluesKaj: at the top I have the link to the man page options: https://nixos.org/nixos/manual/ch-options.html [12:31] it's a very huge list [12:32] and for package search, nox is nice [12:32] hyper_ch: Hmm, not that different to what you get in kickstarter etc [12:32] sorry, kickstart files [12:33] penguin42: I don't know what kickstart files are [12:33] hyper_ch: They're what you feed to RHEL/Fedora installers (I think there's a version for Ubuntu) to preconfigure a system [12:34] penguin42: well, here you setup the whole system using a configuration.nix file (or multiple ones that are included) [12:34] hyper_ch: Not as declarative though; https://academy.redhat.com/instructor/guide/instructorguide_ks.html [12:34] you start live cd, do the partitioning, do hardware detection [12:34] and then you just provide the configuration.nix and let it do all the rest [12:34] penguin42: here's a huge list of options you can set.... https://nixos.org/nixos/manual/ch-options.html [12:35] I'll try to switch over from kdm to lightdm some time... [12:36] hyper_ch: Yep, most distros have a way of doing that, although that looks a bit more organised; here's an example of an ubuntu preseed file https://sfxpt.wordpress.com/2013/06/09/get-the-debianubuntu-ready-and-customized-the-way-you-like-in-10-minutes/ [12:36] penguin42: I've used preseed file for my debian servers where I install ispconfig [12:36] https://github.com/sjau/perfectDebian [12:37] right [12:37] BluesKaj: btw, do you do a lot of work with pdfs? combining pages, exracting etc? [12:38] I like ispconfig on my servers and horde :) [12:38] hyper_ch, no , merely a home user , no servers etc [12:39] BluesKaj: well, since I submit brief electronically I have to work with pdfs a lot... so I wrote myself some action menu scripts for dolphin... just thought if you have to handle pdfs a lot you would find them useful https://github.com/sjau/pdfForts [12:39] well looking at the work involved with the NixOS install. It looks rather challenging for my knowledge base :-) [12:40] BluesKaj: well, all I did was (1) copying from other configuration.nix (2) bugging a friend who uses nixOS (3) bugging people in #nixos and (4) read manual [12:40] (in order of how much I did) [12:41] BluesKaj: all you need it a proper configuration.nix file ;) [12:41] how long until someone reminds us that this is supposed to be an ubuntu chat [12:42] channel topic doesn't say it's ubuntu+1 only [12:43] one last thing I need to test on nixos is getting my smartcard to sign pdfs.... I think I have all I need for it but haven't tested so far [12:44] btw, I reported the non-installable-wine issue as well as my install troubles.... network card not getting a connection and ssd not detected during install [12:50] besides those issues, most seems to work well.... [12:59] I don't see any advantages to a labourious installation procedure for an OS, that's why I don't have gentoo. Successfully installed Arch once but ai wasn't impressed with it at all , anticlimactic. Just because Nix usus a novel package management system doesn't mean it has any advantages over more easily installed OSs. [12:59] well, it's good to know other things also [13:00] who knows how long kubuntu will continue to exist - especially regarding the riddell situation [13:01] also I like how easy it is to re-setup and you can hardly break once it's running... [13:01] we'll see , there are other kubuntu/kde based OSs, that's why I'm exploring debian again [13:01] although, with the move to sappy (or what's that new package manager called), ubuntu will also have atomic upgrades [13:02] snappy [13:02] I was close to it [13:03] hyper_ch: If you want to seed an install for identical config every time just use a pre-seed file, that's what everyone else does! [13:08] :) [13:11] TJ-: another advantage of the atomicity is that you can have totally different profiles... want to test something out make a new rebuild... if it doesn't work... switch back [13:12] the last week I've worked with it a bit and it looks really nice [13:12] but I'm way too noob to actually use it for real this far ;) [13:15] I use LXC for that [13:17] after having used *buntu for the last 9 years almost exlusively as desktop it's time to check what else is out there ;) [13:17] good old dapper drake :( [13:34] hyper_ch: You should really be in #ubuntu-20 :D [13:40] dapper drake was really nice [14:17] wb Bluefoxicy [14:17] wb BluesKaj [14:17] don't you hate it when you type the first three letters of a nick and the tab-completion fails? [14:17] was checking my kubuntu 15.10 upgrades [14:19] too many blue ppl in here, but I have seniority, my nick's been registered since 2006 I believe :-) [14:19] only two blue people :) [14:19] btw, I had to alter my password on freenode a little while ago [14:19] I registered... probably mid 2006 with my dapper drake install [14:20] and chose a short password... well, reasonably long for the time back then [14:20] and when I wanted to have a cloak for my host the friendly staffer told my that I need to have a longer password [14:21] whois doesn't show when I registered :( [14:23] ha, nickserver info helps - [16:22] [Notice] -NickServ- Registered : Nov 16 19:12:52 2006 (8y 33w 1d ago) [14:36] Registered : May 26 22:54:58 2001 (14y 6w 0d ago) :-) [14:36] 2001... there was a movie about that year :) [14:38] An awesome movie :D [14:38] Also about 2010 ;) [14:38] they even had tablets in that movie [14:38] so way before apple ahd them ;) [14:39] damn I was wrong... not hte password was the issue with the cloak but that I didn't set an email back then [14:40] * penguin42 prefers 2010 to 2001, 2001 has too much grunting and trippy bits [14:41] * lordievader prefers the book over the film [14:41] they made a book out of the film? oO [14:43] I've seen 2010 but I can't really remember it [14:43] while I remember 2001 rather well [14:45] The book and the film 2001 were made at the same time. [14:45] There are differences though, in the book they go to Saturn, in the film only to Jupiter. [14:45] wasn't that because the director decided it would be too hard to do a good Saturn? [14:46] That I do not know. [14:46] so which moon were the other civilisation on? [14:49] What do you mean? [14:52] well, in 2010 wasn't the civilisation on Europe ? [14:52] oops [14:52] Europa! [14:52] Ah, I've only read the book of 2001. 2010 and the other one, 2030?, are still on my list. [14:53] But the monolith was on the Europ moon of Saturn in the book. [14:53] there's a third book? [14:54] Ah it was 2061: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2061:_Odyssey_Three [14:54] lordievader: But Europa is a moon of Jupiter [14:54] There is even a third: [14:54] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/3001:_The_Final_Odyssey [14:54] Am I mixing things up? [14:54] (Heck Saturn has a lot of moons - who knew of Jarnsaxa or Hyrrokkin) [14:55] I am mixing things up, it was Iapetus. [14:57] hmm, that's very deathstar [14:58] * lordievader is off [16:28] * penguin42 is surprised his new Wily install is on 3.19 [16:29] yet his 15.04 install is on 4.0.0 [16:33] you're doing it wrong [16:33] well, that is what I'm thinking [16:33] Linux subi 3.19.0-22-generic #22-Ubuntu SMP Tue Jun 16 17:15:15 UTC 2015 x86_64 x86_64 x86_64 GNU/Linux [16:35] also packages.ubuntu.com shows 3.19 for vivid/updates [16:37] hmm it's possible I installed the 4.0 fo rtesting at some point [16:39] but still, wily being still on 3.19 is a bit slow [16:40] The kernel is probably still being tested before merging [17:17] hello, I am researching for an article about click packages (in a series for new packaging formats under linux systems). Is there a place I can get the most up-to-date documentation about click packages as a start? [17:20] what are click packages? [17:21] the new packaging format of Ubuntu used on the Ubuntu Phone, that will come to the desktop, too, with 16.04 [17:21] uh, no [17:21] thats not accurate [17:22] very hot stuff, I offered a magazine to do some research and write an article about it [17:22] ok, then correct me, I need all info I can get [17:22] uh, thats your job :) [17:22] I'm not getting paid to write your article :) [17:22] well, my job is squeezing that info out of you :D [17:22] ok, in brief... [17:22] click is used on the phone/tablet right now. [17:23] * penguin42 sees xhoch3 in the guise of Michael Palin in Brazil [17:23] In the future that will be phased out in favour of snappy packages [17:23] by 16.04 there will be a build of Ubuntu which is based on snappy packages [17:23] but it doesn't replace the traditional debian based image [17:23] so by 16.04 you'll likely see multiple images, one snappy based, one deb based [17:24] so those users who are using debian based installs can carry on doing that on an LTS release [17:24] those who want to play with snappy can do that too [17:24] clear? [17:25] not quite, I think I have to read more about snappy [17:25] what I didn't know was that click will be phased out [17:25] I heard about Ubuntu Next, which is based on click (or snappy, as you say) [17:26] yeah, will take a while, but we'll transition from click to snap [17:26] is there detailed technical reference about snap? [17:27] https://developer.ubuntu.com/en/snappy/tutorials/build-snaps/ [17:27] https://developer.ubuntu.com/en/snappy/ seen that? [17:27] snappy is evolving, quickly. [17:27] https://developer.ubuntu.com/en/snappy/guides/packaging-format-apps/ [17:28] xhoch3: The overview (narrative) documentation is very poor. This may help a bit: http://askubuntu.com/questions/583076/difference-between-snappy-and-click [17:28] ok thanks, yes, I think users might be intered in how a package is build up, what are the advantages (and why), which files install where etc. etc. [17:29] maybe even a short tutorial how to package an app [17:30] but as I see, click and snap share the core ideas [17:30] they're certainly similar [17:30] snappy is an evolution on from clck [17:30] *click [17:30] * penguin42 wonders if we get crackle and pop after those [17:33] :) [17:33] It's grrrrreat [17:34] no, no, that's the other one [17:44] popey, I think I will switch to the snappy version as fast as possible, will it be as reliable as the traditional image? [17:44] fwiu, I would need to do a complete reinstall then [17:48] I don't think there is a snappy desktop image yet [17:48] I know it's being worked on by kevin gunn [17:55] thanks, I dropped him a mail