[00:00] RPI? [00:01] Rasperry PI [00:01] raspberry PI [00:02] studio_: aah. The bq phone is much more useful than the raspberry pi. For a start, the network interface actually works [00:03] studio_: secondly, it is more portable, has integrated GSM capabilities and doesn't require a monitor or keyboard [00:03] mcphail, sorry, but in the moment, my RPI's can do more than the Ubuntu-Phone :( [00:03] studio_: I suspect your use cases are simpler than mine [00:05] what kernel are you using on your UT-Device, and what do the kernel supprort? [00:05] support [00:05] if you don't need to make phone calls, then why buy a phone? [00:06] JanC, you are missing the point, it is NOT a phone! [00:06] studio_: I'm using whatever is stock. It supports a stable network connection, which is more than a raspberry pi can offer with its hacked-together USB/ethernet abomination [00:08] "stable network connection, which is more than a raspberry pi" can you explain that? [00:08] studio_: My sheevaplug, on the other hand, is a very useful device and probably allows me to do more than my phone. That is even older technology and, of course, doesn't function as a device with audio/visual capabilities [00:11] mcphail, "sorry" i do not understand you when you say "The bq phone is much more useful than the raspberry pi" :( [00:15] mcphail, do you own an RPI or RPI2? [00:16] studio_: first gen rasp pi. Son has the next gen with bigger memory. Done have an RPI2 but they suffer from the same USB/ethernet problems [00:16] *Don't [00:17] studio_: been using them since the ethernet/USB driver used to consume 25--50% of CPU time [00:17] mcphail, do you own another arm-based linux device? [00:17] studio_: yes - a sheevaplug [00:19] "sheevaplug" seems to be an old device, right? [00:20] yep, but still works brilliantly [00:23] and, of course, I have a couple of old Android phones which are ARM devices running linux [00:24] i am not talking about old arm-devices which are based on kernel 2.xx.x ... [00:25] studio_: well, then, I have probably completely lost the thread of this conversation. Getting late here. Off to bed [00:26] compare your bq E4.5 to an RaspberryPI [00:27] studio_: I have already. I'll let you read the scrollback while I go off to sleep. Good night [00:28] so, the bq E4.5 loose ... [00:30] sailfish/nemo on a rpi :P [00:33] tathhu, i think mcphail do not like to "compare" linux devices ... for exp. my receivers dvb-t2/s2 can handle more than the bq E4.5 with ubuntu touch on it ... [00:35] i think the biggest problem is "MIR" ... :( [00:40] the biggest problem with aquaris is lack of free space on root filesystem :B [00:40] Matlib, why? [00:41] before flashing I had some essential tools like gedit and wireshark + several apps [00:41] and there was only 40MB free space already [00:43] can you please show me "df -h" on your device? [00:43] 2.0G 1.7G 385M 82% / [00:43] on a completely clean phone [00:43] just reflashed [00:44] only aptitude is installed so far [00:44] no apps whatsoever [00:45] 4.5? [00:45] Matlib, what partition is using "2.0G 1.7G 385M 82% /" [00:46] yup [00:46] studio_: / [00:46] df -h [00:46] /dev/mmcblk0p6 [00:47] wtf is p6? [00:47] partition 6 on MMC block 0 [00:47] userspace? [00:49] mmcblk0 is internal memory, right? and mmcblk1 is external? [00:49] mmcblk0p28 @ jolla :P [00:49] here, yes [00:50] so, where is the problem? [00:50] ext4 is working on mmcblk1 [00:51] not supported, but working :) [00:51] i dont haveany, i got 11 gigs free [00:51] and btrfs [00:52] on aquaris? [00:52] on sd card? [00:52] yepp [00:52] 64GB [00:52] maybe 128GB, didn't tested that [00:53] works on jolla iirc :P [00:54] ubuntu for me plsz; [00:55] that's a tablet innit [00:55] Matlib, you can mount that ext4-sd-card in rc.local [00:56] i moved large part of /usr/share to /home so had another 500MB free [00:56] still, it's very tight [00:58] Matlib, do you own the "ubuntu-edition" or the "nomal" bq e4.5? [00:59] ubuntu ed [00:59] hmmm ... [01:00] got it in april and enjoyed very much until June's bunch of updates that crashed the OS [01:00] I've got Ubuntu 15 after flashing though [01:01] so you have the three buttons, but they are not visible [01:02] what channel are u using for updates? [01:02] stable? [01:02] is that the channel? [01:03] is the bq your "primary" phone? [01:03] well it had been until I had to switch to my old xperia last week [01:03] hmm ... [01:04] i'd like to tell you to "wait" for a real working UT on the UT-Devices. UT needs more time ... [01:05] it did work flawlessly [01:05] never had to reboot apart from network problems [01:06] at the end of june there was OS update and strange things started happening after that [01:06] "depending" what you need on your phone ... [01:06] most notably the display manager started crashing [01:06] unity [01:07] then there were some updates in aptitude and that crashed the phone completely [01:07] didnt boot anymore [01:07] One thing i miss is lack of wi-fi hotspot, but I found a workaround by creating ad-hoc network on my laptop [01:08] did you made your "phone" "writeable" ? [01:08] writable? [01:08] yes [01:08] what does it mean? [01:08] wait ... have to look [01:09] mount -o rw,remount / [01:09] so? [01:09] something like that ... [01:10] then you can do apt-get update, maybe aptitude update / upgrade ... [01:10] well that's how it's done [01:11] and it is not working? [01:11] it is [01:12] one thing that amazes me is all those X video drivers that surely don't work on ARM [01:12] hmm, i am missing the point, what is not working? [01:12] You really shouldn't use apt-get on the phone, for the love of god [01:12] ahh [01:12] But we've been over that so many times [01:12] you need a working XMIR !!! [01:13] how do i install gcc then [01:13] if not apt [01:13] or samba [01:13] XMIR is not working on MIR on the "phone" !!! [01:13] Matlib: You put an SD card in and create a full Ubuntu armhf chroot on it [01:14] oh [01:14] Then you can do what you want inside the chroot, without breaking your device or filling up the internal file systems [01:16] Matlib: What did you mean by "Ubuntu 15" before? [01:16] SturmFlut, did you made the research about the bq M5.5? [01:16] Originaly the phone was shipped with 14.04 I think [01:17] now it seems to use the vivid distro [01:17] which is 15? [01:17] no? [01:17] Matlib: Ah, you mean 15.04. But the important part is the image version [01:18] studio_: No, and we already know that the third device from bq will be the convergent device, a device that is not yet on the market. The M5.5 was released in May. [01:19] I basically followed these steps http://askubuntu.com/questions/602035/how-do-i-use-ubuntu-device-flash-with-the-bq-aquaris-e4-5-and-aquaris-e5 [01:19] image version was 33 I think [01:19] "how do i install gcc then", normally apt-get install build-essential should work, isn't it? [01:20] well it turns out i'm not supposed to run that [01:20] :D [01:20] "The M5.5 was released in May." never released, will be relaesed "in future" ;) [01:21] MAYBE, the M5.5 is the next UT-Device ... [01:21] studio_: The M5.5 was presented back in February in Munich, so it was already on the market before Canonical told us that the convergent device will be a completely new device that's not on the market. [01:22] SturmFlut: Also the M5.5 has a 64 Bit ARM CPU, and UT doesn't run on 64 bit ARM CPUs yet. [01:22] Is 5 any better than 4.5 when it comes to wifi and GPS receiver? [01:22] SturmFlut, have you seen the specs? i do not beleve 0.5 inches different to the M5! [01:25] studio_: I don't think it makes sense to guess which existing bq phone will be the next UT device, when we know that it will not be an existing device. Also Canonical will just tell us as soon as there is something to tell. [01:26] Let's focus on the existing official devices and make them as good as possible [01:27] "it will not be an existing device" the bq M5.5 is an "non existing device" [01:28] I'm not in the mood to discuss about definitions. The CPU alone is the best reason that it will not become an UT device in the near future. [01:28] what is the cpu form the m5.5? [01:29] from [01:30] xserver-xorg-xmir is available [01:30] studio_: Snapdragon 615 ARMv8 Octa-Core [01:30] studio_: And there is no UT for ARMv8 [01:31] Matlib, try to install, but it will not work ... SturmFlut, from where did you get the specs? [01:32] studio_: Google? http://www.areamobile.de/news/33029-bq-aquaris-m-android-smartphones-mit-potenter-hardware-zum-kleinen-preis [01:33] the M5 got a Snapdragon 615 and the M5.5 is 0.5 Inches different, that would be for bq a shot in its own knees [01:34] aha [01:35] samba crashes the phone! [01:35] needs flashing again [01:35] studio_: As said, there is no UT that can run on this CPU. [01:36] Matlib, what samba package did you installed? [01:36] samba winbind smbclient [01:36] and that xorg-xmir but that's unrelated [01:36] SturmFlut, what cpu are using the google devices? [01:37] studio_: The Nexus 4 has a Snapdragon S4 Pro [01:37] The Nexus 10 a Snapdragon 800 [01:38] >>>> FASTBOOT MODE <<<< [01:38] wahahaha [01:38] version 23 btw [01:39] SturmFlut, are you "sure", that the only different between the M5 and M5.5 are only 0.5 Inches? [01:41] studio_: No, apparently the M5.5 also has a higher resolution. The M5 has a HD display, the M5.5 FullHD. [01:42] studio_: But other news articles say different [01:42] "the M5.5 also has a higher resolution" where did you read that? the M5 got 1080p same as the M5.5 [01:43] There's no point in this discussion, I'm going to sleep. It's freaking 3:43 AM anyways. [01:44] The phone needs to be restored in service center :D [01:44] Any BQ service certers nearby? [01:44] come on, the temperature is "ok" now :) [01:49] Matlib, for what do you need a bq service center? [01:50] The phone told me that :D [01:54] What's the rationale behind the ubuntu one login [01:54] just to install the terminal app [02:15] yup that's it [02:15] installing samba makes the phone unbootable [02:20] samba should really be installed by default [02:21] by far the most convenient way to transfer files [04:01] hi! [04:01] I have a nexus 7 === LarrySteeze is now known as LarrySteeze|Away === IdleOne is now known as Guest23854 [07:44] hi [07:45] when creating an utouch app with deps in the package, do i need to use LD_LIBRARY_PATH=./ in the Exec= line in the .desktop file? [07:57] Good morning! [09:02] popey: Ping [09:30] * svij published his review of the Meizu MX4: https://svij.org/blog/2015/07/05/review-meizu-mx4-ubuntu-edition/ [09:32] svij: \o/ [09:41] how can i find out why my click app doesn't launch? [09:42] mr-tt: usually the log file in /home/phablet/.cache/upstart/ [09:42] tail -f /home/phablet/.cache/upstart/unity8.log doesn't seem to show anything useful [09:42] mr-tt: There's a separate log file for your app [09:44] SturmFlut: pong [09:45] ah ok, permission denied it says there. Probably because i used Exec=env LD_LIBRARY_PATH=./ ./app in the .desktop file [09:45] can i omit the LD_LIBRARY_PATH and it will still find its deps? [09:48] ok i need the lib path [09:48] how do i add it? [09:51] mr-tt: if you create a "lib/arm-linux-gnueabihf/" subdirectory in your project and put the libraries inside it, Unity8 will automatically add this path to the environment of your app. [09:53] SturmFlut: i'm building with click manually, how do i do it there? [09:53] mkdir foo/lib/arm-linux-gnueabihf/ ; click build foo? [09:53] in theory yes, have never used it manually [09:54] But you run "click build" in the project directory [09:54] cd foo ; mkdir lib/arm-linux-gnueabihf/ ; click build [09:57] SturmFlut: looks like it worked, thanks. but still doesn't work :/ i get 2 "this plugin does not support ..." errors [09:59] This plugin does not support propagateSizeHints() and raise() [10:02] sounds like it's a mir issue.. too bad https://bugs.launchpad.net/qtmir/+bug/1426443 [10:02] Launchpad bug 1426443 in qtmir (Ubuntu) "Add support for input method candidate windows" [Undecided,New] [10:09] o/ [10:11] jrbt: Hey [10:27] No phones for the US market :/ [10:28] And people can't even import bq or Meizu devices because of the different frequency ranges [10:31] Ähh.. [10:31] (Morning) [10:41] SturmFlut: mx4 works in the us [10:42] popey: It "works", but it doesn't do 4G. [10:43] right, and not everyone uses 4g [10:46] Right, but lots of people already do, and the rest will in the mid-term. [10:47] SturmFlut, H+ doesn't works in us? [10:48] WTH is H+ [10:49] tathhu, ? hspa? [10:49] Is that like 3,5G or what :> [10:50] Mmh seems H+ can be more powerful than 4G [10:50] http://telecomtalk.info/difference-between-g-e-3g-h-4g-symbols-we-find-out/121666/ [10:50] (idk if it is real) [10:50] http://telecomtalk.info/wp-content/uploads/2014/08/difference-between-3G-H.png * [10:50] jrbt: The MX4 supports HSPA+ in the USA, the E4.5/E5 support only 2G in the USA. So in both cases you're paying for mobile radio features that you later can't use. [10:51] HSPA+ with the MX4 will be enough, yes, but you paid for 4G. [10:51] Oh. All plan is 4G now? [10:51] it is so expensive in USA --' [10:51] jrbt: doesn't it still use same freq(s)/network/whatever? [10:51] Ping with LTE <3 [10:52] Damn, 100€ would be cool so I could go full yolo with meizu and lte :3 [10:52] http://popey.mooo.com/mirror/clicks/graph_clicks.png still climbing [10:52] jrbt: This table is slightly incorrect, 100 MBit/s is just one of the "slower" modes of LTE. Cat 3 to be exact. [10:53] popey: Yeah, filtering through all the updates for the next wishlist/status is going to be a real pain ;) [10:55] Oh ok. [10:55] Here in germany the prices for 4G are falling like apples, I get 5 GB traffic at 100 MBit/s for 15 €/$ [10:56] SturmFlut -> Free mobile 20Go 4G, sms/mms/call unlimited 15.99euros [10:56] <3 France :) [10:57] In finland I could have unlimited LTE ~50Mbit for 20€ [10:57] 20€ for 10gigs and I could use it abroad [10:57] 0w0 [10:57] tathhu: Ah, Finland. I was there last year and got a SIM for the vacation, so nice :) [10:58] SturmFlut: :3 [10:58] Is it ok to F5 threadhs to see if someone really wants to buy my jolla :o [10:58] It is. [10:59] tathhu, How is Sailfish? [11:00] Good. :P [11:00] UI is awesome and so is multitasking [11:00] Awesome as in swipes <3 [11:01] It would be awesome if the android app emulator will implemented on Ubuntu Touch :) [11:02] Tizen (Samsung) and Sailfish (Jolla) do that, why not ubuntu :) [11:02] Dudes (and dudeddes) are trying to do some kind of OSS-alien-dalvik-thinfgy :3 [11:02] For ported SFOS devices [11:03] jrbt: how successful is it for tizen and sailfish? [11:03] jrbt: No it wouldn't, and that will not happen. [11:03] jrbt: but then... jolla store is "full of" android apps [11:03] w8 [11:03] i know it's been discussed many times [11:04] There's commercial options to do this [11:04] BlackBerry had an Android layer and died. Jolla has an Android layer and can't get native apps because of it. Tizen has a (bad) Android layer and will not get native apps because of it. [11:05] http://imgur.com/i137LHf 5/5 [11:05] SturmFlut, uh good point, I don't even thought about that [11:06] sorry for my grammar --' [11:07] Uh the Sailfish app are in QML + JS right? [11:07] +s [11:10] tathhu, ok so cause of this tons of android apps Sailfish is just like a fork of android for users? [11:10] like flyme or miui even if it is not.. [11:12] How it can be android fork if it isn't android o.o [11:14] jrbt: traditionally regular users don't care what os a device runs [11:14] it's all about the experience it offers [11:17] It's always about WhatsApp in the end [11:18] Every time somebody wants Android support on Ubuntu, it's because of WhatsApp [11:20] SturmFlut: not always, you're forgetting local content [11:21] SturmFlut: netbanks, or special apps for your workplace [11:24] tathhu, that's an image ;) [11:25] SturmFlut, perso I want Android support 'cause of Pebble :P [11:26] But good point, if Ubuntu Touch support Android apps developers will become lazy :P [11:26] at same time catching up to android or ios level of api functionality is hard [11:27] I hope not for long, convergence is coming :) [11:28] I think lambda people will love to have only one device [11:29] And if there are users the giant developers company come ;) [11:30] companies* [11:30] lambda people? [11:31] yep lambda, (don't know if you say that in English), mr Michu, beginner, "normal" people [11:32] ah [11:36] The problem if Windows release that before (http://www.pcworld.com/article/2916899/windows-10-just-beat-ubuntu-to-the-smartphone-pc-convergence-punch.html) IMHO it's the end [11:38] can't you argue that in many ways iOS, iCloud and MacOS X comes pretty close already? [11:38] in how they interact [11:38] admittedly, you don't run iOS and the phone as your netbook [11:40] Yep, Apple's ecosystem do already the work (like Google in fact with his chromebook) but as you say we still have many devices. [11:40] convergence will fix that IMO. [11:43] atm: many devices, all synchronized on the "cloud" for interaction, I think in the future it will be like: one device, no synchronization just a backup of your device in the "cloud" [11:44] but will not works for gamers, developers or any type of people working on his computer [11:46] but it is just speculation, right now there are lot of things to do to beat Microsoft or Android [11:53] there on the ubuntu forums someone said the convergence for ubuntu was coming in october or something, while in that article they say in few years [12:11] It's not important if Microsoft are working on Convergence too. It's not important if they are first. Lots of companies which were the first at something no longer exist. [12:13] yes, no problem. Actually it might even help ubuntu [12:14] they market their windows convergence and people will want that convergence experience and then ppl will find out that actually ubuntu has that kind of thing too, and it is less restricting than the windows os [12:16] well, some it savvy users might stumble upon some restrictions [12:27] Hrmpf, Firefox is slow as hell again and chromium/chrome is not an option. Getting a decent browser sure has become more complicated than it should be. [12:28] And webbrowser-app has no AdBlock [14:17] hi [14:18] anyone knows if ubuntu touch must be in read-write mode to be able to play with phone leds from command line? [14:19] like using tee on some /sys/... file [14:20] BlackJohnny: Should not be necessary, the LEDs are controlled via /sys/ [14:21] the thing is I have an MX4 with ubuntu and dont understant why it is not using the led button to show when charging [14:21] and wanted to test if i can manually turn on the led [14:22] BlackJohnny: The LED does not yet work on Ubuntu, https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1461682 [14:22] Launchpad bug 1461682 in Canonical System Image "[MX4] LED does not notify for incoming notifications" [Critical,In progress] [14:23] ubot5, SturmFlut thanks, still want to hack it a little bit on my own :) [14:23] BlackJohnny: I am only a bot, please don't think I'm intelligent :) [14:23] :) [14:24] :D [14:24] ubot5: yolo [14:24] Also the LED is not used as a charge indicator on my MX4 [14:24] Probably MX4 forgot to enable it in Little Kernel [14:24] err, not MX4, Meizu [14:24] SturmFlut, so u have one too. Does it show ok the battery stats? [14:25] SturmFlut, mine does not show the percentage increasing. I think it only shows when it is 100% [14:26] SturmFlut, I had it turned off and charging to see the stats updated. But only charged it once till now [14:27] BlackJohnny: No, it doesn't. The battery level doesn't seem to go down sometimes, and at other times it will jump up if you just reboot the device. [14:29] SturmFlut, thanks for the bug page. At least I see it can work ... tee /sys/class/leds/mx-led/blink <<< 1 [16:23] * tathhu ubuntu-device-flash ~~ [16:32] * tathhu buys first app for ubuntu [16:32] Which one? [16:33] ureadit [16:48] heh [16:48] cut the rope is on landscape when nexus is potrait-mode ^^ [16:49] popey: ^^ Uh oh [16:50] popey: Does Unity rotate apps that do not specify supported orientations? [16:50] or do I understand tathhu wrong [16:50] what device, running what channel? [16:56] tathhu, SturmFlut, popey, IIRC cut the rope runs in portrait mode, but its canvas/webview is rotated by 90°, resulting in a landscape "behaviour". At least, that was true for the first version released... :-P [16:57] sverzegnassi: Yep, because there was no way to force the orientation [17:01] SturmFlut, I think tathhu was talking about that... anyway yes, IIRC unity8 forces apps to rotate, unless a preferred orientation has been specified in the .desktop file [17:03] sverzegnassi: If that is true, it will break every app that assumed that it is never going to be rotated to portrait mode, which is probably every app [17:03] So the default has to be "portrait only" if you don't specify anything in the .desktop file [17:07] ack... i've removed the latest devel-proposed from my N5, I can't check now... I only suppose that the app is loaded with the current orientation of the device, but i may be wrong [17:08] popey: nexus 7 (2013 lte), devel-proposed iirc [17:08] you don't want devel proposed, thats wily [17:08] entirely untested [17:08] AIUI :) [17:09] "woops" :D === howefield_afk is now known as howefield [17:15] oh there was rtm... [17:15] * tathhu facedesk [17:34] now ctr is on lanscape when nexus is w000 [17:55] Does anybody know what's the maximum power dissipation for the MT6595? It's not in the datasheets [18:01] hard to find, SturmFlut, ... [18:01] core voltage: 1.0V processor DVFS+SRAM voltage: 0.8~1.15V (typ. 1.0V; sleep mode 0.7V) I/O voltage: 1.8V/2.8V/3.3V Memory: 1.2V LCM interface: 1.8V [18:02] found @ http://vondroid.com/threads/mediatek-mt6595-mtk6595-out-now-hmp-4x-a17-4xa7-w-powervr-rogue-series-6200.26332/#.VZlwnXWlxBc [18:05] OerHeks: Thanks! [18:05] yw [18:07] Usually ARM specified mW/MHz, but that no longer seems to be the case [18:09] Hmm, judging from all the relative values they give related to the Cortex-A9, about one Watt per core at the highest clock rate seems reasonable [18:10] Yes, correct. [18:10] That is how i read it too. [18:11] Is one Watt of power dissipation really enough to heat up the MX4 so much? [18:15] hello [18:16] there any unoficcial apps market to publish applications? [18:16] there are [18:16] SturmFlut, 1 volt, it is not saying watt consumption [18:21] OerHeks: I consulted other sources int the meantime. A dual-core Cortex-A9 SoC at 2 GHz draws about two watts, the Cortex-A17 is supposed to draw 20% less than that, so one Watt as an upper bound at 2.5 GHz shouldn't a bad guess. [18:21] xpheres: opensource or proprietary apps? [18:22] open source [18:22] I foudn this [18:22] xpheres: Why unofficial? [18:22] https://uappexplorer.com/ [18:22] xpheres: open.uappexplorer.com it's run by mzanetti afaik [18:22] just to see if I can bring more exposure to an app I want to submit [18:22] thanks [18:22] xpheres: That's just a website that takes the data from the official app store and displays it in a more beautiful way [18:22] I know [18:23] I've been reading it [18:23] SturmFlut: yep, but open.uappexplorer is an unofficial store [18:23] What does your app do? Can't it be submitted to the official store? It will also show up on uappexplorer after a while [18:25] xpheres, good luck publishing unofficial, i wonder who is willing to take that risc. And how would you give support? [18:25] OerHeks: what risk? [18:25] OerHeks, I plan to publish it official [18:25] I will release the code as open source [18:25] anyone will be able to compile it by himself [18:26] xpheres: we like more apps :) [18:26] yes! [18:26] xpheres: so you're looking for a store that also hosts the sources? [18:26] The sources are already in git [18:26] I really just adapted a web app to ubuntu touch [18:26] it is so easy an it seems to work [18:26] xpheres: what app? :) [18:26] I already installing the emulator to test it [18:27] Please see the android version [18:27] heard the emulator is broken [18:27] xpheres: named? [18:27] https://f-droid.org/repository/browse/?fdid=com.example.root.analyticaltranslator [18:27] if you want more info just ask [18:30] anyone knows why a self-built qt5 app doesn't launch and display these errors in log?: "This plugin does not support propagateSizeHints()" and "This plugin does not support raise()" [18:31] xpheres: Why not just publish it the normal way? [18:31] (built a click package from a qt5 app by adding desktop+manifest+apparmor profile) [18:31] mr-tt: can you share the source code? [18:31] I will publish it in the official repository aswell sturm [18:31] I have a problem creating the emulator instance [18:31] could anyone help me? [18:32] I can not create the emulator from QT, I don't know why [18:32] I use this command: sudo ubuntu-emulator create myinstance --arch=i386 [18:32] I receive unknown flag arch [18:32] You can create an emulator from the Ubuntu SDK [18:33] SturmFlut: https://github.com/qxmpp-project/qxmpp/tree/master/examples/GuiClient [18:33] Sturmflut I try to create it from ubuntu sdk, the program get frozen and do nothing [18:34]