Kilosmorning all, ill be scarce at times , lotsa outside work07:44
Symmetriaheh 4 hours....07:47
Symmetriawell, 4 hours and 13 minutes07:47
Symmetriatill I'm standing at the altar and saying I do 07:47
inetprogood mornings08:18
inetproSymmetria: best wishes for a long and happy marriage!08:22
Symmetriathanks :)08:23
inetproand don't forget to come back here from time to time afterwards :-)08:24
inetproyou've been way too scarce lately08:25
Symmetrialol busy is all :)08:25
inetpronp sir, enjoy the wedding day08:26
* inetpro looking at Dodge power cuts with solar-powered internet http://www.fin24.com/Tech/Gadgets/Dodge-power-cuts-with-solar-powered-internet-2015022008:28
inetprojust the solution that I need 08:29
inetpronow to work out how I can get all that one step at a time08:30
inetprolooks like I could start without the solar panel and inverter08:35
Cryterioninetpro the charge controllers are not very expensive, the panels however add up as you'll want a few up them08:55
Cryterionthen use a car battery, the new type's around 80-100AH rather than a normal 7AH 08:55
CryterionAnd you'll need the inverter btw, true sine wave inverters are pricey, but the modified sine are fine for electronic equipment, just DON'T connect your fluorescent kitchen light to it08:57
Cryterionhad one start it's own braai once (not it the appropriate place) 08:58
inetpro:-) 08:58
inetprocar batteries are expensive man 08:58
inetproand not made to last for 4 hours 08:59
inetprowithout getting charged 08:59
inetproneed a deep cycle battery 09:00
Cryteriondeep cycle was the type I was looking for, most of the new car batteries are deep cycle09:01
Cryterionmost new cars run at 15V now, and you must not let a deep cycle battery drop below about 10V otherwise you damage it09:02
CryterionI have an 80AH connected directly to the 12V Sealed battery in a std UPS, allows a lot more on time than the 15mins at 650w from just the 7AH batt09:04
mazalMorning everyone09:13
inetproCryterion: at what cost? 09:19
CryterionI know it adds up! That's the unfortunate part :(09:36
Kiloseverything is one step at a time09:50
inetprolooks like costs have escalated massively as well12:43
inetproat a battery centre outlet I can get a sealed 18AH lead acid battery for R64512:44
stickyboyMan, Mac OS X font rendering is absolutely beautiful.12:45
inetprosame story, more details: http://www.htxt.co.za/2015/02/10/beat-loadshedding-on-a-budget-take-your-tech-solar-for-r1-271/13:40
* Kilos wonders who sharky1 could be16:26
Kiloshi kulelu88 16:26
Kiloswe waiting for you lug peeps16:26
kulelu88hello Kilos 16:27
kulelu88why you waiting?16:27
Kiloshave you not heard of our latest venture?16:28
Kiloswhew i cant find it now, but read last blog so long16:30
KilosMaaz  kilos.newblog16:30
Kilosi think i put a link there to ubuntutu africanteams16:30
Kilosbit busy now , will check just now16:31
kulelu88nice beard oom16:35
Kilosmy daughter had to trim it in the photo16:35
Kilosand hair 16:35
Kilosshe calls it my einstein hair16:35
Kilossee we made place for lugs16:36
Kilosonly i only know you inna lug16:37
kulelu88I'm not part of the lug 16:38
Kilosyou know some of them dont you16:38
kulelu88yeah. Just check meetup.com for the jozilug16:39
Kilosim bang to just join and ask them, lug peeps get offended easy16:43
Kilosthey normally serious peeps 16:45
kulelu88they will get offended because it is ubuntu promo16:45
kulelu88aren't you on the mailing list?16:45
Kilossee what i mean16:46
Kilosim on many mailing lists16:46
kulelu88start the discussion in the mailing list then.16:46
Kilosi dont know if you can join thier list without first joining the lug16:47
Kilosi go eat16:48
Kilosohi superfly 17:36
Kiloshi Cryterion 17:37
Kilosoh my mazal on a saterday17:37
Kiloshmm... gonna rain17:37
superflyhi Kilos17:53
inetprogood evening17:54
Kiloshi inetpro 17:54
inetproKilos: eh,... what you been up to today?17:55
Kilosi looked at you last link17:55
Kilosslept lots17:55
Kiloschatted debs some17:55
* inetpro likes the last link17:55
Kilosfirefighting seems to have worn me out like never before17:55
Kilosi supposed dragging and breaking logs didnt help17:56
inetprowe need to track down that BushPower place in Midrand17:56
inetproor find someone else who provide the 7.2Ah Lead Crystal Batteries at a reasobale price17:57
Kilosthats the trick17:57
inetproI think 7.2 Ah will be good eneough for two hours17:58
inetproenough as well17:58
Kilosbut the bigger one would be better17:58
Kilos18 better17:58
inetprobigger is too expensive17:58
inetproand won't last as long17:58
Kilosthats the prob always17:58
inetproLead Crystal has a longer lifetime17:59
Kilosdont hey make large ones17:59
kulelu88does anybody use this: http://subuser.org ??17:59
Kilosor a couple in parralel should help17:59
inetproKilos: see http://www.bettabatteries.com/ and click on performance18:00
inetprokulelu88: first time I see anything about subuser18:02
Kilosyip thats a good battery inetpro 18:03
inetproKilos: BushPower has a 70Ah one at R270018:04
Kilosthta would be ideal but sjoe lotta bucks18:05
kulelu88are these inverters? I could use 1 for my modem18:05
Kilosfor that kinda setup18:05
kulelu88solar won't help when loadshedding happens in the evening18:06
Kilosthats what the battery is for18:07
inetproKilos: but I think the 70Ah would immadiately also require a better/different more expensive charge controller18:07
inetprorequires a charging voltage of between 14.4V & 14.8V during the bulk charging phase18:09
Kilosi dont know charge controllers at all, dont they just decide when and how hard to chrge a battery18:09
Kilosits still a 12v battery right18:09
Kilosits all about money, one buys the best one can afford18:11
Kilos12v battery charger should work on any 12v battery18:12
Kilosthat one for the incubator can be used when power on18:12
Kilosto bosst its voltage just put a cap across the outputs18:12
Kilosthat will push it to 15v18:13
inetproa cap across the outputs?18:13
Kilosthen you can wait to get a solar panel18:13
inetpronever heard of that18:14
Kilossmooths and increases the voltage18:14
Kilosi didnt have one handy at the time i think18:14
kulelu88mehh, why risk electronics worth so much with a make-shift voltage-adjuster18:15
Kiloscan you read the output voltage then ill maybe remember more18:15
Kilosyou are just charging a battery kulelu88 18:15
inetprooutput voltage of?18:15
Kilosnothing to do with the equipment18:15
Kilosof the charger18:15
Kilosthere where the incubator plugs go in18:16
Kilosor were they clamps18:16
inetproah, I'll have to go look for that18:17
inetpro.me should return it to oom Kilos18:18
Kilosiirc correctly i put in a heavier transformer so it could have more guts18:18
Kilosnono i have another one sir18:18
Kilosi built one for incubator only18:18
Kilosthats why i dont remember the voltage18:19
inetprook, so how do I connect the router to the battery?18:19
Kilosi think i read he spoke about some dc-dc thing18:20
Kilosrouter uses 12v?18:20
Kilosor 9v18:20
inetproit needs to go via the charge controller18:20
Kilosso its 12v18:20
Kilosmine is 9v i think18:21
Kilosyou must check that18:21
Kilosrouter uses those 2 pin charger goodies18:21
inetproyep, the output is 12V at 1.0 A18:22
inetproprobably using much less than 1A18:22
Kilosyes i think so18:23
Kilosbut then it shouldnt be hard to sort18:23
Kilosmaybe just a current limiting resistor inline18:23
inetpro"...I measured my router, and it only draws 0.2 Amps on average, which equates to 2.4Wh,” Kurien told Fin2418:25
Kilosi see my router is 12v at 1.2 amp18:25
Kilosi can try mine direct on a battery and see if it blows but i dont think it will18:26
Kilosif i could see the circuit diagram i could maybre work out if it regulates internally18:26
Kilosdoes tobie say you need to control the input voltage18:27
inetproSteca Solsum 6.6F 6A solar regulator is only R 275.0018:27
Kilosthats my months data18:28
Kilosoh no R199 and some chips hehe18:29
inetprowell, you have something cheaper?18:29
inetprosomething that will work when we add the panel?18:29
Kilosadd what panel18:29
Kilosoh the solar18:30
Kilosno maybe his regulator is a good buy18:30
inetproyep, 50W PV panel going for R808.00 now18:31
Kilosactually needed 18:31
inetprobut maybe I should just get the 30W18:31
Kilosim waiting for ian to get spares then im gonna try that power from nothing thing18:32
Kiloswell you basically need it to charge your battery18:32
Kilosbut with the larger battery and ac charger you should be ok for a 3 hour power cut18:33
inetproBushPower Solar Eco Charger supplies the 30W panel and the regulator for R84518:33
Kilosthats only needed when power off in the day18:34
Kiloshe said he runs his gate opener from this system18:34
Kilosthose motors use quite a bit of power18:35
inetproI'm guessing he has more than one of these setups18:35
Kilosmust be ya18:35
Kilosbut the savings with solar to charge one battery you wont even notice on your electric bill18:36
inetprohmm... also true18:36
Kilosso imo its a bit much to spend unless we have days with no power at a time18:37
inetprobut I need to start somehwere man18:37
Kilosdid you look at the movie link i put here about 2 weeks back about fuelless power generator18:38
Kiloswas a long movie18:38
Kilos2.5 hours18:38
inetproand did it help you yet? Have you built your very own home made power station yet?18:39
Kilosusing caps and self wound coils ant a steup transformer i think it was you make power that can run pcs and tvs etc18:39
Kiloswhen ive built one successfully i will feedback18:39
Cryterionhttp://www.mantech.co.za/ProductInfo.aspx?Item=372M0901 15A Solar charge controller for R17018:40
Kilosif that works, after first outlay power is free18:40
Kilossigh man18:40
Kilosim waiting for ian to get components and then find time to bring them18:40
Kilosthere thats good for R17018:41
Kilos15 amp will charge a battery that it cooks18:41
Kilosway too much so safe 18:41
Cryterionyep, 50W panel is nowhere near that18:42
Kilos batteris charge lekker in few hours at about 3 amps18:42
inetproKilos: you still need connectors for output to the inverter18:42
Kilosfrom battery to controller18:43
inetprofor the next step18:43
Kilosthen from controller to inverter?18:43
inetprosee http://cdn.24.co.za/files/Cms/General/d/2961/9f4211d6375b466982d79d76b90dd6e3.png18:44
Kilosyou can connect inverters straight to battery i think18:44
Kilosoh you bypassing battery18:44
Kilosor not using one18:45
Kilosor is that right top thing supposed to be the battery18:45
inetproKilos: read the part "Controlling the charge"18:46
inetproat http://www.htxt.co.za/2015/02/10/beat-loadshedding-on-a-budget-take-your-tech-solar-for-r1-271/18:46
CryterionRemember as well, the cables from battery to inverter must be thick18:46
Cryterion1 Amp at 240V is the same as 20 Amp at 12V18:47
Kilosjumper cables18:47
Kilosthey cheap at checkers18:48
Cryterionthose will eventually burn out, depending on how much current your using18:49
KilosThe second piece of kit, the charge controller, isn’t absolutely necessary if you really know what you’re doing, but it is a good idea all the same. 18:49
inetproand the inverter adds an extra load, and will eventually drain the battery even if your gear is off18:49
Kilosi dont think it will be much power18:49
inetproso the inverter is not something I want to add soon18:49
Kilosya the inverter is the bug in the whole system18:50
CryterionBetter to have it, will prevent over charging the battery and regulates the voltage supply from the panel18:50
inetprothe laptop can run on its own battery for a long time18:50
Kilosi dont know if pro has decided on the panel yet18:50
inetproCryterion: but is that not the job of the rgulator to control the charge of the battery?18:51
Kilosi would first get a battery and voltage controller for router18:51
CryterionCharge controller and regulator are essentially the same thing18:52
CryterionIf you regulating the panel to 12V then the battery cannot overcharge above 12V18:52
Kilosactually inetpro we need to go back to the start18:52
Kiloswhat do you want to run when power off18:53
CryterionAn open circuit 12V panel reads about 19.5V, which means it will keep charging the battery trying to reach 19.5V18:53
inetproLong term goal: cut the ties from the grid18:53
inetproShort term goal: stay online when load shedding happens18:54
Kilosyou said you must start somewhere18:54
Kilosok imo shrtterm is battery and voltage controller or regulator18:54
Kilosthis for lappy and router right?18:55
inetprolappy is fine, it's the LTE router that really needs backup power18:55
Kilosyou only need an inverter for something that needs 220v18:55
Kilosfor router just battery and regulator 18:56
inetproKilos: well I need to charge from somewhere as well18:56
Kilosyou have a charger18:56
Cryterioninetpro, does your router have an external plug regulator? I.E. is there 220V or 12V going into the router?18:56
Kilosac one18:56
KilosCryterion  12v18:57
Kilosso for minimal outlay18:57
CryterionThen it only needs to be connected directly to the battery, but better via a 12V regulator18:58
Kilosregulator to feed router18:58
Kilosand cable through  wall to outside with crocodile clamps for car battery18:58
inetproCryterion: the router has a standard two prong plug charger with input of 100-240V ~ 50/60Hz, 0.5A18:58
CryterionYou could safely go Panel ---> Regulator ----> Battery ----> Router18:59
Cryteriongrrrr, then it'll need an inverter18:59
Kilosall 220 will need inverter18:59
inetprooutput = 12.0V at 1.0 A18:59
Kilosinetpro  can you get your car near window where router is19:00
Cryterionthen you can just take out the charger and feed battery direct to the router19:00
Kilospower for a router will be fine with flex19:00
Kilosto strand flex like for lights19:01
Kilosday twee draaitjies wat aan mekaar geheg is19:01
Cryterioninetpro, think of speaker wire, just the cheaper type, called twinflex19:01
Kilosvit lampe en so aan19:02
Kilossame kinda thing19:02
Kilosspeaker wirte19:02
Kilosit si on all bedside lamps19:02
Kilosdaai goed19:03
inetprook, ek verstaan19:03
Kiloscheckers has that too19:03
mazalNight everyone , sleep well19:03
Kilosnight mazal 19:03
inetpromazal: goeie nag19:03
Kilossleep tight19:03
Kilosinetpro  did you answer19:04
Kiloscan your car get near router room19:04
Kilosthen you can try before you buy19:05
inetprowhere do I get that funny connetor that goes into the router19:05
Kilosor any radio shop19:05
inetprowhat do i search for?19:05
inetproand how do I know to get the right size?19:06
Kilosyou take the old charger with and show them what plug you want19:06
Kilosthen you solder flex inside19:06
Kilosif you go to a radio or tv repair shop they will solder it for you19:07
inetproah, good idea19:07
Kilosmight even do it free19:07
Kilosmaybe even auto electricians19:08
kulelu88you old-school afrikaaner okes are solid with handywork19:08
Kiloseven gremble could do it19:09
inetproshould perhaps make it so it can plug into the cigarette lighter plug19:09
Kilosyou can do that too19:09
inetprothen build the other side to connect to the battery19:09
Kilosyou get those plugs as well19:09
Kiloslighter plud on one side and other side the router plug19:10
inetproja man, then I can use it interchangably for other purposes19:10
Kilosoic what you mean19:10
inetprobut how do I get just 1A from the car battery?19:11
Kilosso from battery to lighter female and lighter mails for other things you want to connect19:11
Cryterioninetpro, the car lighter is probably capable of about 5A, you'll only draw what the router needs19:12
Kilosthe router will only takes what it needs or you regulator will sort it19:12
Cryterionas long as your supply is higher than the demand then your fine19:12
Kiloscar battery can reach way over 50 amps if needed19:13
Kilosjust measure when starter starts turning19:14
Cryterionyeah, but the lighter plug is fused, normally about at about5A19:14
Kilosbut not fused the way he wants to do it19:15
Cryterionthen he more Amps available :)19:15
Kilosyou get inline fuse holders as well19:15
inetproso don't they sell such a fused lighter plugs with connectors to a battery?19:16
Kiloshe will have more availble than what flex can handle19:16
Kilosthe lighter plug gets wired into cars wiring so fuse is on fuse bow19:17
Kilosyou could ask a radio/tv repair shop to put a fuse holder in the flex for you19:17
Cryterioninetpro: http://www.mantech.co.za/ProductInfo.aspx?Item=72M358519:17
inetprothanks Cryterion19:18
Cryterionthey might have the other cable, just can't find it on their site, but they'll have all the bits to make one19:19
Kilossjoe you can build it for much less imo19:19
inetprothat looks exactly like one of the parts that I need19:19
Cryterionjust country wide, so should be a branch near you somewhere19:19
Cryterionthey, not just19:19
Cryterionthat's site price Kilos, I get less 20% on most stuff from them19:20
Kiloswell her must measure the length flex he needs for starters19:21
Kilosalways a bit longer than needed19:21
inetproso what is it that kills a device?19:53
inetprois the regulator / charge controller there to rgulate just the voltage?19:53
Kilosno the cureent alowed through19:54
Kiloswbb debs19:54
inetproah, obviously those things check the load of the battery and stop charging when it's full19:55
CryterionRegulators regulate the voltage, but are they themselves are limited to a current rating20:25
Cryterioninetpro: when you connect a voltage source to say a flat battery, the source voltage and battery voltage equalise to a state that is higher than that of the battery20:27
Cryterionthis voltage continues to rise towards the original source voltage, (Hence charging mode)20:28
Cryterionthe charge controller monitors this, and when that voltage reaches the right level, it disconnects the source from the battery, as battery is now full20:29
CryterionA regulator itself just regulates the voltage, I.E. if the source is above 12V, the regulator only sends out 12V 20:30
inetproCryterion: ty21:02
inetprohow do I check the polarity of a coaxial barrel connector?21:04
inetprothey say center-positive is the most common, but some systems use center-negative21:05
inetproYou do not want to get the polarity mixed up!21:05
Cryterionyeah, sometimes they in verse, normal is centre positive, best way is a multimetre21:06
Cryterionbut coaxial cable is normally for signals and not power btw21:07
inetprohmm... 21:08
Kilosyou guys getting there21:09
inetproguess I'm just referring to the common DC power connectors21:10
Cryterionok, coaxial power connector is normally + centre, often there's a small picture next to the connector (Check on your Router) that'll show you21:10
Kilosok guys, keep up the good work. see ya tommorrow21:10
Cryterionok Kilo's, goodnight21:10
Kilosnight all. sleep tight21:10
inetprogood night oom Kilos21:11
Kiloslemme know the outcome of all this tomorrow21:11
inetprohaha... 21:12
Cryterioninetpro, maybe invest in a multimetre, you can get a cheap working of the shelf one for about R60 at most hardware stores21:15
inetproCryterion: I have a small one21:15
CryterionThat's the ideal way to check21:15
inetprobut not sure how I would check polarity with it21:16
Cryterionput the dial onto 20VDC21:16
CryterionBlack probe into GND/COMM and red probe into VAC21:17
inetproah interesting21:18
inetprojust can't seem to find this thing now... will look tomorrow and see21:18
Cryterioninetpro: http://www.engineersgarage.com/tutorials/dc-voltage-current-testing21:18
inetprothanks for the link21:19

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