[08:58] <rmx77> hello all
[08:58] <rmx77> whats goin down
[08:59] <JohnDoe_71Rus> monday sep 7 2015
[09:01] <rmx77> ok?
[12:13] <Nivalis> Hello, i install lubuntu 15.04, but i have trouble. How i send notify from command line?
[12:14] <rafaellaguna> Nivalis, for testing the notify daemon?
[12:14] <rafaellaguna> notify-send -u normal "Hello" "Testing"
[12:15] <Nivalis> hm....notify-send don't installed
[12:16] <Nivalis> but if xfce-4-notifyd-config normal work
[12:16] <Nivalis> how xfce-4-notifyd-config invoke notify?
[12:17] <rafaellaguna> theorically, yes
[12:19] <Nivalis> how i invoke notify without notify-send?
[12:20] <rafaellaguna> xfce should use that command too
[12:21] <rafaellaguna> https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Desktop_notifications
[12:21] <rafaellaguna> the command is the same for all "engines"
[12:22] <Nivalis> but i don't install notify-send and may be other daemon installed and show me notification when i run xfce4-notifyd-config
[12:22] <rafaellaguna> in XFCE and Lubuntu you can control it with "xfce4-notifyd-config"
[12:22] <rafaellaguna> yes. if you install notify-osd from Ubuntu it will replace the other one
[12:22] <Nivalis> hm....its default install of lubuntu
[12:23] <rafaellaguna> xfce uses the daemon xfce4-notified
[12:23] <rafaellaguna> check it with a task manager (lxtask)
[12:24] <Nivalis> Do you know how to send message to xfce4-notifyd?
[12:25] <rafaellaguna> that command should work "notify-send"
[12:25] <Nivalis> but its doesn't install
[12:25] <rafaellaguna> what OS do you have now?
[12:26] <Nivalis> lubuntu 15.04
[12:26] <Nivalis> lubuntu-15.04-desktop-amd64
[12:27] <rafaellaguna> ensure the package libnotify-bin is installed (it should)
[12:27] <rafaellaguna> then use notify-send -u normal "Hello" "Testing"
[12:28] <Nivalis> if i install libnotify, then i saw notify
[12:28] <Nivalis> but i don't understand how invoke notify, when i don't have this packet as installed
[12:28] <rafaellaguna> send-notify
[12:28] <rafaellaguna> all the desktop apps use that command
[12:29] <rafaellaguna> notify-send! sorry :D
[12:29] <Nivalis> do you manually install libnotify?
[12:30] <rafaellaguna> I did. but you don't have to install anything, actually. it should work out-of-the-box. then use that command and you must see that notification
[12:31] <rafaellaguna> I'm testing now, I have 15.04 as well, notify-send works
[12:31] <Nivalis> for experemints. you can remove libnotify and try run xfce4-notifyd-config and try press button show notify?
[12:32] <rafaellaguna> I can't right now, I can't modify this virtual machine :D
[12:33] <Nivalis> i remove libontify and notify showed
[12:34] <Nivalis> in config test
[12:34] <rafaellaguna> so it works?
[12:34] <Nivalis> but i can't use notify-send in command line
[12:35] <teward> it's send-notify
[12:35] <teward> not notify-send
[12:35] <rafaellaguna> O.O
[12:35] <teward> oop
[12:35] <teward> actually
[12:35] <teward> i'm tired
[12:35] <teward> notify-send
[12:35] <teward> i'm opening my 15.04 VM as well to test
[12:35] <teward> but last i checked it worked
[12:35] <rafaellaguna> yup, notify-send
[12:35] <rafaellaguna> you can send icons too
[12:35] <teward> (even Lubuntu on my RPi works.  and yes that does actually work)
[12:36] <Nivalis> withoun libnotify?
[12:36] <Nivalis> without*
[12:36] <rafaellaguna> brb, lunch time!
[12:37] <teward> Nivalis: without libnotify, a ton of things don't work iirc
[12:38] <Nivalis> hm....how can i know what daemon send notify?
[12:38] <teward> at least in Trusty, notify-send is in libnotify-bin, which libnotify4 will provide.  Checking LUbuntu shortly, the VM just came up
[12:39] <Nivalis> i remove libnotify, but if i run xfce4-notifyd-config and press button show, i can show notification
[12:39] <Nivalis> hm...default i don't have libnotify packet as installed
[12:39] <teward> notify-send exists as libnotify-bin.
[12:39] <teward> libnotify4 just installs a few things
[12:40] <teward> but check if you have libnotify-bin
[12:40] <teward> f, my lubuntu 15.04 system is gone
[12:41] <Nivalis> find libnotify-bin was failed
[12:42] <Nivalis> no such file
[12:43] <teward> it's not a file it's a package
[12:43] <teward> apt-cache policy libnotify-bin, check the "Installed" line
[12:43] <teward> (before the comma is the command)
[12:46] <Nivalis> not available
[14:18] <steffen> Hey! Do anybody here know who is maintaining the lubuntu.net website?
[14:22] <Aison> hello
[14:22] <Aison> after upgrading from trusty to utopic I've got problem with X.
[14:22] <Aison> It looks like lightdm is no longer starting X properly. After the start of lightdm I have a black screen
[14:23] <Aison> when I stop lightdm with service lightdm stop I get the console back
[14:23] <Aison> the strange thing is, when I start X with typing xinit, X works
[14:24] <Aison> but X is not working with ligthdm, very strange
[14:24] <steffen> Don't have a any ideas to solve your problem. But utopic is EOL. Perhaps you should consider installing a supported version :)
[14:25] <holstein> Aison: i think, for me.. i would want to know, if that is a system-wide config or breakage, from the upgrade, or, more something related to GPU driver..
[14:25] <Aison> yes, I upgraded to vivid before
[14:25] <Aison> and the problem still exists
[14:25] <holstein> but, yes.. since its EOL, i would fresh install to a supported version
[14:25] <Aison> but it started with upgrade to utopic
[14:25] <holstein> 14.04, or 15.04..
[14:26] <steffen> Depends on you needs. 14.04 is a solid way to go. Biggest difference between the two are probably systemd
[14:26] <Aison> holstein, GPU: VGA compatible controller: Intel Corporation Atom Processor Z36xxx/Z37xxx Series Graphics & Display (rev 0f)
[14:27] <Aison> yes, I know
[14:27] <Aison> holstein, reinstall? are we back on windows times? :P
[14:28] <steffen> Oh sorry, read as a question from Aison. Not a statement..
[14:29] <Aison> the problem must be somehow related to lightdm or how lightdm starts X
[14:29] <Aison> when I start X with xinit, a monitor is detected, when I start with lightdm, no screen is detected
[14:30] <holstein> Aison: well, you are back on an unsupported OS.. and, i find it easiest to just reinstall.. but, no, you dont have to reinstall..
[14:31] <Aison> I upgraded 14.04 -> 14.10 -> 15.04
[14:31] <holstein> Aison: so, what are you using, right now, friend? 15.04?
[14:32] <Aison> 15.04, but the problem started with 14.10
[14:32] <Aison> with 14.04 it works
[14:32] <holstein> for me, with older hardware that doesnt support linux well, if i need to use 14.04, to have support, i will.. since, its an LTS release
[14:33] <holstein> otherwise, i think the question is, is this breakage due to your upgrades? or, is it that the hardware is not supporting the more recent stack?
[14:33] <steffen> Have you tried to boot through one of the alternative options in grub?
[14:33] <holstein> i would think, that since you *are* able to start the desktop, it seems to me like its breakage from the upgrade
[14:36] <Aison> I guess now that it is some breakage from the upgrade. eg. some lightdm configfile that changed and is not upgraded correctly
[14:36] <holstein> i think that is yet to be determined.. and its not constructive to assume..
[14:37] <Aison> well, since X works with xinit, it can't be an unsupported hw issue
[14:37] <holstein> could be, something with the recent stack that is not supported well by the hardware GPU, etc..
[19:03] <mig_> question about horizontal scrolling
[19:04] <rafaellaguna> O.o
[19:04] <holstein> ive found it to be hit and miss.. depending on how well the hardware supports linux
[19:04] <mig_> i know i can use "synclient HorizTwoFingerScroll=1" to enable 2 finger horizontal scrolling, but this only lasts for one session
[19:05] <mig_> is there a way to permanently enable it?
[19:05] <holstein> mig_: oh.. if thats doing the trick, thats great.. i would just add that command to file, and autostart it at login
[19:06] <mig_> holstein, yeah, my mind just started going to that place, rubber ducking really is amazing
[19:07] <holstein> mig_: might have to "sleep" the command..
[19:10] <mig_> well, if i fail, i know where to find help :P
[19:11] <holstein> well, failing, likely worse case scenario, would be editing that file from a live iso.. but, i doubt it'll come to that.. live iso or TTY
[19:16] <ianorlin> mig_, I don't think I can help as my touchpads only do vertical scrolling
[19:19] <mig_> really? you must have an ancient computer
[19:22] <ianorlin> my laptop is nealy 6 years old but then I upgraded my desktop
[19:22] <ianorlin> which I use a mouse with
[19:22] <ianorlin> this desktop isn't old
[19:24] <mig_> yeah, desktops generally don't have mousepads
[19:25] <mig_> but this laptop i use, is 8y old, wasn't a top model at the time i bought it, and can scroll horizontally
[21:42] <cimbakahn> Why does lxle come with all those PPA's?
[21:43] <ianorlin> because the person made the iso with all those ppas and it is not offical and supported here
[21:44] <holstein> yeah.. its not an official ubuntu flavor.. so, 3rd party sources are included, cimbakahn
[21:44] <holstein> !ppa
[21:44] <cimbakahn> I was told to be leary of an OS that relies too much on PPA's.
[21:45] <holstein> cimbakahn: why?
[21:45] <holstein> cimbakahn: you should read, and understand the risk's of *all* sources.. ppa's included
[21:45] <cimbakahn> When the next upgrade come for the OS, it could cause problems, correct?
[21:46] <holstein> depends on what you consider a problem, and many other factors
[21:48] <cimbakahn> On my last OS, a PPA was keeping me from getting my updates.  I had to retstart the computer just to see the new updates.
[21:49] <cimbakahn> My solution was uninstall the program and remove the PPA.
[21:49] <holstein> right
[21:49] <holstein> and why? you were trusting a 3rd party source.. that source stopped supporting your needs..
[21:49] <cimbakahn> And my problems were fixed.
[21:50] <holstein> does that mean that, using only the ubuntu sources will have *no* breakage? of course not.. but, the sources are more supported.. and tested
[21:50] <cimbakahn> That particular PPA wasn't being maintained very well and that is why i had that problem.
[21:51] <holstein> sure, but, you are assuming that using the ubuntu sources, or other distro repos would give a different result.. why?
[21:51] <holstein> the level of support? the amount of people running them? your hardware?
[21:52] <cimbakahn> I am not assuming anything.  I am just conveying my experience.
[21:52] <holstein> cimbakahn: you are stating, the reason you had breakage was due to ppa use.. and though, that can be quite true. its an assumption to think using the main ubuntu sources will not break things..
[21:53] <holstein> anyways.. if one tool wasnt working, i say, try another one..
[21:53] <holstein> the ubuntu sources are well maintained.. and, quickly patched
[21:53] <cimbakahn> Most of the PPA's on here come from that address launchpad.net
[21:53] <holstein> cimbakahn: *all* of them..
[21:54] <cimbakahn> Yes.  The reason i had that particular problem was because of a PPA that wasn't being maintained very well.
[21:54] <holstein> cimbakahn: i understand that, friend
[21:56] <cimbakahn> What about the PPA's from this launchpad.net ?  Are they good at maintaining the PPA's?
[21:56] <holstein> cimbakahn: they are, again, *all* from launchpad, friend
[21:56] <holstein> cimbakahn: they are all 3rd party.. that service is provided for the community packages..
[21:56] <holstein> it is up to whom ever makes those ppa's to maintain them.. they dont have to.. they are 3rd party, and not supported..
[21:57] <holstein> not part of the ubuntu sources..
[21:57] <holstein> it would be just like if you and i made a piece of software, and wanted to release it for ubuntu. we could use a ppa.. and make it easy for folks to add it. then, if we get busy, we may not support it anymore..
[21:57] <holstein> no one would make us
[21:58] <cimbakahn> I see.
[21:59] <holstein> its an element of trust.. can you trust that source? for security? or for development? in the case of the ppa, you are trusting that person. in the case of the larger ubuntu repositories, you trust ubuntu dev's.. and packagers..
[22:00] <cimbakahn> Could i uninstall all of the programs that there are PPA's for and then remove the PPA's?
[22:01] <ianorlin> cimbakahn, with how many lxle has you might be easier just ot install lubuntu
[22:02] <holstein> cimbakahn: you can do what you like
[22:03] <holstein> cimbakahn: what would be the issue with that? one key problem.. patches.. so, i wouldnt
[22:03] <cimbakahn> Are you saying lubuntu has no PPA's out of the box?
[22:03] <holstein> cimbakahn: correct.. its an official flabor
[22:03] <holstein> flavor*
[22:03] <holstein> out of the box *no* official ubuntu flavor can have a PPA
[22:06] <cimbakahn> I have primarily been an Xfce fan, and was a huge fan of Linuxmint Xfce, but i seems to me Xfce desktop OS'es have been getting bulkier in the past year.
[22:07] <holstein> well, xfce is xfce
[22:07] <holstein> its not really meant, these days, to be a light DE, neccessarily. but, nothing software can make hardware faster, or better.. just make sure of resources better
[22:08] <holstein> xubuntu/xfce does a good job of walking that line.. between speed and function
[22:08] <cimbakahn> I want something lite and speedy.  Something that doesn't us too many resources.  Something that doesn't use too much realestate on my PC.
[22:08] <holstein> sure. but, the PC may not be speedy
[22:08] <holstein> if its not, you cant make it, by installing "speedy OS".. or "speedy DE"..
[22:08] <holstein> if lubuntu is not speedy feeling, then, there is likely not much else you can do with a modern OS, with access to modern packages
[22:09] <holstein> there are things that load in ram like puppy.. but, as with everything, there are compromises
[22:15] <cimbakahn> Could you please elaborate on what you just said?  "what would be the issue with that? one key problem.. patches.. so, i wouldnt"
[22:16] <holstein> cimbakahn: you add a package, from ppa.. and remove the ppa.. you have the package, and no support for it
[22:16] <holstein> so, if a patch is needed for security.. for google chrome, for example, you wont get it.. you just use the vulnerable chrome
[22:18] <cimbakahn> for an example:  If i typed  sudo apt-get purge homebank, and then i removed the PPA for it all should be fine, correct?
[22:19] <holstein> cimbakahn: fine?
[22:19] <holstein> i mean, whats wrong? you have a package from a ppa? and you want to remove it?
[22:19] <holstein> there is the purge-ppa app
[22:20] <holstein> !ppa
[22:20] <holstein> !ppa-purge
[22:20] <cimbakahn> Yes.  In other word i wouldn't damage anything, correct?
[22:20] <holstein> cimbakahn: i cant promise you  you wont damage anything.... those sources are *unsupported*. you take the risk on by using them
[22:20] <holstein> they are supported by the creators of the ppa.. you  trust them
[22:23] <cimbakahn> HAHAHA!  I don't trust anyone beside me and my cat.
[22:23] <cimbakahn> besides
[22:24] <holstein> well, only run package that you and your cat make..
[22:24] <cimbakahn> HAHAHA!  You crack me up!
[22:38] <cimbakahn> Does anyone know exactly what the 2nd button on the bottom does?  ----> http://imgur.com/nkcY64a
[22:39] <holstein> purge?
[22:39] <holstein> cimbakahn: i mean, that'll be trying to use the command i gave above.. the ppa-purge
[22:41] <cimbakahn> I know but what exactly is it purging?  The PPA?  The PPA and program?  The PPA and program and fixing those patches you mentioned?
[22:43] <holstein> cimbakahn: the source you added, friend
[22:43] <holstein> thats what those are
[22:44] <holstein> ppa's are unofficial sources.. thats a source manager you are using.. that purge will try and purge the source
[22:44] <holstein> nothing we are talking about "fixes" those patches.. the maintainer of the ppa has to patch the software they are maintaining
[22:47] <cimbakahn> In my case it would be the source that lxle added.  So it simply removes the PPA address and that is all?
[22:47] <holstein> lxle is not supported here
[22:47] <holstein> i cant tell you how to fix it.. but, if you want lubuntu,its free to try and use
[22:49] <cimbakahn> I know.  Thank you for your time.  I don't know why lxle gives out this channel as well as their own on their site.
[22:49]  * holstein shrugs
[22:49] <holstein> there are no lxle devs here, AFAIK
[22:56] <cimbakahn> http://www.lxle.net/support
[22:57] <holstein> http://www.lxle.net/support-options/ has been changed..