/srv/irclogs.ubuntu.com/2015/09/14/#ubuntu-discuss.txt

lotuspsychjegood morning mates05:31
TJ-Morning05:32
lotuspsychjeTJ-: hey there05:32
lotuspsychjewhat you playin with today :p05:32
TJ-Well... fixed up the cryptsetup initramfs scripts to use a key-file, filed a bunch of bugs against lightdm, and currently trying to narrow down a regression in kernel bluetooth support  for some devices (since v3.2 ... so a lot to work back over)05:42
lotuspsychjecool05:42
lotuspsychjeim testin out new enlightment :p05:42
TJ-I might take a look one of these days if I ever get chance. I'm really liking the improvements in KDE for 15.1005:44
TJ-Although I got really pissy at it requiring mysqld to be installed to support this Akonadi "search-everything-that-moves-with-thirty-plus-executables-loaded-at-session-start" mess! I kicked that lot off the PC :)05:45
lotuspsychjedidnt test 15.10 yet05:45
lotuspsychjelol05:45
TJ-And finally solve the weirdest bug I've ever come across! I have Lubuntu/LXDE and Kubuntu desktops installed. Lubuntu pulls in Abiword. When the Plasma DE loads an instance of Abiword always started, with its Parent's PID = 1 (init). Been bugging me for 3/4 weeks05:47
TJ-It turns out abiword installs a DBus service for Telepathy Collaboration. When KDE session starts it launcheds kde-telepathy which somehow causes the abiword executable be launched and loading a blank document. Very annoying!05:48
lotuspsychjeweird05:49
lotuspsychjei had some crashes on enlightment already too lol05:50
lotuspsychjeafter leftmouse opening applications05:50
TJ-Bug hunting can be fun; suffering bugs with no explanation can be very frustrating05:51
TJ-Especially if you can't easily run the process under control of the debugger05:51
lotuspsychjei find launchpad bugging bit confusing05:52
TJ-Do you? why is that?05:57
lotuspsychjeall the info gathering and protocols i dont like very much05:58
TJ-I generally use common-sense with that. I usually report bugs directly rather than using ubuntu-bug/apport-bug05:59
lotuspsychjeright06:00
lotuspsychjei like askbuntu solving better :p06:00
lotuspsychjesimple and more specific06:00
lotuspsychjebut for rough bugs, launchpad might be better06:01
lotuspsychjelol: http://news.softpedia.com/news/tutorial-for-microsoft-to-help-it-kill-linux-491638.shtml09:06
lotuspsychjeSinisterDoor: welcome14:52
lotuspsychjeemnz: welcome14:54
emnzah nice14:54
emnzthx :)14:54
lotuspsychjeemnz: ubuntu has grown big these days14:54
emnzhow do u mean most popular? u mean linux in general?14:55
lotuspsychjeso most user count worldwide is for ubuntu14:55
lotuspsychjeno ubuntu14:55
emnzmost popular linux desktop distro?14:55
emnzok14:55
lotuspsychjeno14:55
lotuspsychjemost popular Os from all14:56
emnzO.O14:56
emnzhow can that be, what about android and windows?14:56
SinisterDoorlol14:56
emnzenlighten me14:56
emnzim not up to speed these days xD14:56
lotuspsychjeemnz: we also have phones now14:56
SinisterDooryeah but they are android14:56
lotuspsychjeSinisterDoor: no, ubuntu touch phones14:57
lotuspsychje!touch14:57
ubot5Information about the Ubuntu Touch platform for Phone and Tablet is available here https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch . Support and discussion in #ubuntu-touch14:57
SinisterDoor-.-14:57
lotuspsychjei installed ubuntu touch on my nexus 7 also14:57
lotuspsychjerunning much safer then android14:57
SinisterDoormy nexus 6 doesn't support it.14:58
SinisterDoorubuntu abandoned the project14:58
lotuspsychjeread this guys14:58
lotuspsychjehttp://news.softpedia.com/news/top-five-reasons-why-ubuntu-is-the-most-used-linux-os-491064.shtml14:58
emnzwow hey15:03
emnz** awesome15:03
emnzhttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Usage_share_of_operating_systems#cite_ref-NetMarketShare_83-015:04
emnzway to go on desktop still, but wow, so impressed man, im dumping windows for sure15:05
emnzcant believe how this has taken off since I last used a linux distro15:05
lotuspsychjeemnz: yeah it improved alot15:07
emnzincredible15:07
lotuspsychjeemnz: ive installed over more then 50 boxes with 14.04 LTS all work like a charm15:08
emnzsoftware center is really legit now, had nothing but crappy free apps years ago15:08
emnzflash is solid now, not that we really need it with HTML5 anymore15:08
TJ-flash is a permanent can of worms!15:09
emnzfirefox+all addons working15:09
lotuspsychjelol15:09
emnzhaha shit, must I remove it?15:09
lotuspsychjeTJ-: with a load of holes in it15:09
emnzthis unity is fkn great15:10
carlduke2hi everyone, is there a channel for ubuntu app developers?15:10
lotuspsychjecarlduke2: #ubuntu-devel15:10
lotuspsychjecarlduke2: and #ubuntu-touch for the phones developing15:10
carlduke2isn't it for the os dev?15:10
TJ-emnz: Adobe stopped developing flash for Linux several years ago; there are some security fixes but rather like Windows it is full of exploit opportunities15:10
lotuspsychjeTJ-: +115:10
emnzdo you guys like unity? seems it doesnt get much love lol15:11
TJ-I won't touch it; terrible on decent workstations or any large screen15:12
lotuspsychjeonce you get used it unity its very intuitive for work15:12
emnzim really liking it with unity tweak tool/compiz settings manager15:12
carlduke2it's not that bad actually ..not very customizable tough ..I switched to KDE and I'll stick with it. It has an impressive collection of apps and utilities (ie KDE Connect - mind blowing)15:12
lotuspsychjeim a unity fan :p15:13
emnzyeah I set window buttons: right in unity tweak but doesnt seem to work :(15:13
lotuspsychjewith wobbly windows and eyecandy15:13
TJ-Unity is small screen device (tablet) interface shoe-horned onto a workstation desktop15:13
emnzid like to have the launcher at the top, but seems this is impossible too?15:13
emnzTJ-: lol, metro start screen for linux? xD15:14
TJ-emnz: I run 6 1920x1200 monitors ... you cannot imagine the pain Unity causes.15:14
lotuspsychjelol15:14
lotuspsychjeneo only uses 2 screens...15:15
emnzquite the power user hey sheesh haha, i got 2 x 1920x1080 only15:15
TJ-I's need an Olympic athelete just to move the mouse cursor back to the application and/or desktop launcher15:15
lotuspsychjeroflol15:15
lotuspsychjefollow the wabbit15:15
TJ-;)15:15
lotuspsychjeso 6 monitors with each 4 worskpaces lol?15:16
lotuspsychjealot of work can be done there15:16
TJ-no, I actually split them up into 4 X sessions now, to logically separate the different purposes they have15:16
lotuspsychjecool15:16
lotuspsychjeif you got a pic somewhere of your desktop layout, show us lol15:17
TJ-I have 3 in portrait mode (document references, web pages, etc), 3 in landscape (terminals, ssh sessions, coding).15:17
TJ-its around somewhere15:17
lotuspsychjevery nice15:17
lotuspsychjeim always curious about linux desktops15:17
emnzthats great man, would also like to see15:21
EriC^^ditto15:21
lotuspsychjelolz15:22
EriC^^http://www.criticalcommons.org/Members/ccManager/clips/swordfishtechno3dhackingdrama.mp4/thumbnailImage15:22
EriC^^this is lotuspsychje setup15:22
lotuspsychjehahaha15:23
emnzu guy are amateurs, mine: http://p-fst1.pixstatic.com/5069f24a74c5b64b160007e5._w.540_h.359_s.fit_.jpg15:23
emnzjk ;D15:23
lotuspsychjewahaha15:24
emnzok so what must I use instead of unity if I want a w7 style launcher?15:24
lotuspsychjelubuntu15:24
lotuspsychje!lubuntu15:24
ubot5lubuntu is Ubuntu with LXDE instead of !GNOME as desktop environment, which makes it extremely lightweight. See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu - /join #lubuntu for lubuntu support.15:24
lordievaderemnz: That is a sweet monitor wall to have :D15:24
lordievaderOr to want...15:25
EriC^^lol emnz15:25
lotuspsychjebbl dinner, someone save that atari pic from TJ- for me :p15:26
emnzhmm, XFCE looks nice, but I dont want to lose ubuntu, I'm just getting into it again, don't want to lose the software center and all the apps it comes with :/15:30
emnzI'd just like ubuntu as it is, but with a different launcher15:31
emnzis it a bad idea to install XFCE on ubuntu, always better to get a distro made around it from the start15:32
lordievaderLubuntu can use Ubuntu's Software center just fine.15:32
emnz?15:32
emnzlordievader: ok cool, but my problem is all the different apps and configuration lubuntu comes with... im a noob at this stuff, the easiness of ubuntu has been great15:35
emnzam I making stupid comments here? im sry15:39
lordievaderemnz: Not at all, but do know that the underlaying system is the same for all Ubuntu flavours.15:45
carlduke2if you need a launcher check out docky15:45
carlduke2its very cool15:45
TJ-hmmm, unexplained ecryptfs mount failure15:51
emnzlordievader: yeah I am aware of that. So Xubuntu or Lubuntu won't come with Compiz?16:02
EriC^^emnz: nope16:05
emnzthe selection of included software between regular ubuntu and lubuntu look vastly different16:05
EriC^^lubuntu uses openbox16:06
EriC^^yeah lubuntu is kind of minimal16:06
emnzwish I could just change the unity launcher to make it more like XFCE/LXDE/windows7, I think changing to another version of ubuntu with different apps will put me off16:08
EriC^^you can download the apps on lubuntu and xubuntu too16:09
emnzyeah but then I'll have to configure them all myself16:09
EriC^^nah it's the same thing16:09
emnzhmm16:13
emnzugh rain is killing my internet again :(16:21
emnzEriC^^: I typed this for you before it dc'd.... :16:21
emnzEriC^^: I'm looking at the ubuntu software center - installed apps, seems to be a lot of unity-related stuff, even things like "Keyboard (unity-control-center) - change keyboard settings" and "Network (unity-control-center) - network settings", so all those apps would be gone with xubuntu/lubuntu?16:22
emnzagain, my apologies for another stupid question lol, getting my head around desktop managers/window managers and how they all work together etc.16:23
EriC^^emnz: xubuntu and lubuntu have their own settings manager and keyboard stuff16:30
EriC^^xubuntu is more functional than ubuntu, it has more stuff out of the box and is more functional oriented16:31
EriC^^ill brb16:31
lotuspsychjehttp://www.fiercecio.com/story/mozilla-quietly-adds-advertisements-firefox/2015-09-1118:32
lotuspsychjehmmmz18:32
lotuspsychjemaybe they learned from w1018:32
lotuspsychjeioria: good evening mate18:42
iorialotuspsychje, thanx ... you too18:43
lotuspsychjeioria: the idea of this channel is, we always do support in #ubuntu but never actually speak to each other18:43
lotuspsychjeso here we are :p18:43
ioriagreat.... "human support"18:43
lotuspsychjeyeah :p18:43
OerHekshi ioria18:44
ioriaOerHeks, hallo !!!!!18:44
lotuspsychjelol18:44
OerHeksit is handy to have backtalk, but this channel is originally for 'discussion'18:44
OerHeksso this channel is hijacked :-D18:44
lotuspsychjewell mostly its quality ubuntu discussions anyway18:44
lotuspsychjeloll18:44
* lotuspsychje ==h4xxored d1scuss1on==18:45
lotuspsychjepauljw: good evening18:48
ioriapauljw, welcome18:48
lotuspsychjeioria: wich distro are you running mate?18:48
iorialotuspsychje, Ubuntu 14.04.3 LTS \n \l     but i love Lubuntu :)18:49
lotuspsychjesame here LTS18:49
pauljwhi lotuspsychje , thx18:49
lotuspsychjeive just tested new enlightment18:54
lotuspsychjepretty nice18:54
pauljw:)18:54
lotuspsychjehttp://linux.softpedia.com/blog/enlightenment-0-19-10-open-source-desktop-environment-out-now-with-10-bugfixes-491598.shtml18:55
lotuspsychjeoldskool feeling18:55
iorialotuspsychje, looks nice ...18:56
lotuspsychjeyeah18:57
lotuspsychjeEriC^^: wb eric18:57
EriC^^thx18:57
lotuspsychjeEriC^^: did TJ- show his atari link?18:57
EriC^^lol no18:57
lotuspsychje:p18:58
ioriaatari ?18:58
lotuspsychjeioria: yeah lil joke, he's got 6 monitors running on linux, we all wanted to see18:58
ioriawow18:58
lotuspsychjeyeah thats what we tought also :p18:59
lotuspsychjefunny :p http://news.softpedia.com/news/tutorial-for-microsoft-to-help-it-kill-linux-491638.shtml19:01
TJ-lotuspsychje: It's all YOUR fault!19:02
lotuspsychjeTJ-: :p19:02
* lotuspsychje hides19:02
TJ-The image is on an external drive, protected by ecryptfs. I mount it every day... today it failed!19:03
lotuspsychjeTJ-: ouch :p19:03
* daftykins wonders what he just walked in on19:03
daftykins:O19:03
TJ-I've just spent an intense debugging session with Ty Hicks on it; the ecryptfs-recover-private tool adds the key to the kernel's @us (user session) keyring. Then its 'mount' command fails, kernel reports unknown key, keyctl lists the key!19:04
lotuspsychjedaftykins: <TJ-> emnz: I run 6 1920x1200 monitors ... you cannot imagine the pain Unity causes.19:04
OerHeksis that drive readonly?19:04
TJ-Turns out... I switched from lightdm to sddm (the KDE DM) last night... and SDDM separates the keyrings, causing this!19:04
TJ-So, if you see any questions about ecryptfs failing to open, with people on ssh sessions or similar, suspect the incorrect kernel keyring being used by the session19:05
lotuspsychjei never liked keyring19:06
daftykinsTJ-: that's way too deep for me :D19:09
daftykinsi spy encryption and go "nope nope nope!"19:10
lotuspsychjebest way to hide data is on usb, under the ground19:12
lotuspsychjefar away from the fb119:12
lotuspsychje!info deluge19:18
ubot5deluge (source: deluge): bittorrent client written in Python/PyGTK. In component universe, is optional. Version 1.3.11-0ubuntu2 (vivid), package size 20 kB, installed size 108 kB19:18
TJ-lotuspsychje: got it finally :)  http://imgur.com/V6EBdJt19:23
lotuspsychjeyessss lets c :p19:24
ioriaTJ- Oh my ....19:24
lotuspsychjeholy smokin19:24
lotuspsychjethose 2 big ones left are also monitors?19:24
TJ-all 6 in the corner; 2 X portrait, 3 x landscape, 1 x portrait19:25
lotuspsychjelike tv's upside down19:25
lotuspsychjedang19:25
lotuspsychjei bet you can only dream of that EriC^^ :p19:25
TJ-the far left of the photo is the reflections from the data cabinets19:25
OerHekssmall printer on the left side :-D19:26
lotuspsychjeloool19:27
lotuspsychjeits like a plotter19:27
TJ-A3 printer/scanner inkjet on top of the 21U cabinet; A4 scanner/printer laser under the bench19:27
lotuspsychjeTJ-: and wich distro running on those screenz?19:28
TJ-It's this one I'm using now. Kubuntu19:28
ioriaTJ-  electric bill ?19:28
lotuspsychjelol19:28
TJ-All on the laptop in the middle19:29
lotuspsychjecool19:29
TJ-ioria: All runs on 12V DC19:29
ioriaTJ- wow....19:29
daftykins12V 0o19:29
lotuspsychjeTJ-: does those screens work by default on kde or xrandr config?19:29
TJ-I have the server cabinet kit on dual UPSs, via 2 x 16-outlet 0U vertical CDUs on the wall19:30
TJ-lotuspsychje: I have them custom configured since it is using 3 GPUs. If it auto-configures it has no idea of where each monitor is in the layout19:31
lotuspsychjeright19:31
pauljwTJ-: sweet!19:32
lotuspsychjefeels like swordfish :p19:34
iorialotuspsychje, the movie ?19:35
lotuspsychjeyep :p19:35
lotuspsychjewe just need the girl on her knees now for TJ-19:36
iorialotuspsychje, it's a nice movie ...19:36
lotuspsychjeyes it is :p19:36
lotuspsychjeioria: wich was your first computer ever?19:37
emnzhi guys19:38
lotuspsychjetandy calculators doesnt count :p19:38
lotuspsychjeemnz: good evening19:38
daftykinsmoar screens = super hacker </Hollywood>19:39
iorialotuspsychje, pentium3 ... it's still working ...19:39
lotuspsychjecool19:39
TJ-It's just a way to stay well organised when there's lots of different things going on. Avoids typing commands to remote systems into the wrong window by mistake, for example19:39
TJ-My first computer was ZX81... still working :)19:40
iorialotuspsychje, i got it 4 years ago ... it was in a dumpster  ^_^19:40
lotuspsychjemine was a super 2000 or something, a kind of electrical mainboard to wire points togheter and make programs19:41
lotuspsychjeafter that comodore 6419:41
TJ-the '64 came after the vic 20 didn't it?19:42
iorialotuspsychje, i know it19:42
lotuspsychjeatari==amiga 500==48619:42
lotuspsychjeTJ-: yep, never tested vic20 myself19:43
lotuspsychjebut surely looks the same with cassete deck19:43
lotuspsychje'press play on tape'19:43
TJ-I had all the popular home computers back then; writing cross-platform game engines for them19:43
lotuspsychjecool19:44
lotuspsychjeme and my brother were fooling around in basic19:44
emnzyou guys know anything about Cardapio?19:44
emnzhttp://cloud.addictivetips.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/06/Cardapio.jpg19:44
lotuspsychjewhats that?19:45
emnzan app launcher for unity, but its very outdated :(19:45
daftykinslooks like someone has glued the xfce menu beside unity19:45
lotuspsychjeah19:45
EriC^^emnz: there's a start menu for unity in the repos i think19:45
lotuspsychje!info classicmenu-indicator | emnz try this19:46
ubot5emnz try this: classicmenu-indicator (source: classicmenu-indicator): indicator showing the main menu from Gnome Classic. In component universe, is optional. Version 0.07-0ubuntu1 (vivid), package size 8 kB, installed size 105 kB19:46
lotuspsychjedaftykins: lol19:46
emnzYES!!! omg ty!!19:46
EriC^^yeah thats it ^19:46
emnzcant I make the unity button show that?19:47
lotuspsychjeemnz: no, its an indicator19:47
lotuspsychjeemnz: you can try docky also and autohide left sidebar19:47
lotuspsychje!info docky19:47
ubot5docky (source: docky): Elegant, powerful, clean dock. In component universe, is optional. Version 2.2.0-2 (vivid), package size 591 kB, installed size 3594 kB19:47
lotuspsychjeemnz: all depends what you wish for?19:48
lotuspsychjeemnz: check terminal: apt-cache show indicator for more cool indicators19:49
ioriaTJ- it was this http://www.imarshall.karoo.net/zx81/zx81pfiles.htm ?19:50
TJ-ioria: correct19:50
ioriaTJ- wow19:50
lotuspsychjeioria: never seen such a thing :p19:50
iorialotuspsychje, no, i feel little ....19:51
TJ-I ordered it whilst still at school in February 1981... Sinclair had massive orders and it wasn't delivered until June 16th, in the week after I left school and before I started work on the farm :)19:51
TJ-We had a massive 4KB RAM!19:52
lotuspsychjeloool19:52
emnzlotuspsychje: ok thanks I've just given them all a look, I'm looking mostly for a menu like XFCE, so I dont have to type every app i want to open (or click Installed - see all)19:52
TJ-and you could get a wobbly 16KB "RAM Pack" to plug on the back19:52
lotuspsychjeand what could you do with that thing?19:52
TJ-Loads! It came with a BASIC interpreter but I found that limited so switched to Z80A machine code19:52
emnzand if I can edit the menu that would be nice, like how you can edit windows 7 shortcuts in the taskbar19:52
lotuspsychjeemnz: you can create or lock icons to unity's left bard19:52
lotuspsychjebar19:53
emnzlotuspsychje: yeah I'm doing that, and I installed unity-folders19:53
TJ-There was an expander rather like today's RasPi GPIO expansion, where you could connect analog and digital inputs/ooutputs19:53
emnzlotuspsychje: but I'd still like a bigger menu that I can customize, that classicmenu indicator is awesome but I can't edit whats inside it19:53
TJ-the neat part was the 'adapters' that plugged onto the GPIO pins were just PCBs inside regular cassette tape boxes, glued shut :)19:54
daftykinsemnz: or you could just run a different DE that does this properly instead of trying to hack it onto Unity *cough*19:55
lotuspsychjewileee: good evening mate19:55
TJ-lotuspsychje: weep at what you can do in a few bytes :)  http://www.users.waitrose.com/~thunor/mmcoyzx81/downloads.html19:55
wileeeevening19:55
ioriabay bay19:55
lotuspsychjeTJ-: lol breakout19:56
emnzdaftykins: yeah I know I know lol... I've installed lubuntu and xubuntu but still much prefer ubuntu, I'll deal with unity's quirks either way, but trying to tweak it as much as I can19:57
TJ-It was more fun than the RasPi for learning to program; you were close to the metal all the time, learned to appreciate how to write code efficiently. We used to count the clock cycles of each instruction to figure out how much we could get done... saving a 'tick' in a loop could add up19:57
emnzIs there any way to add an XFCE-style menu to docky?20:01
lotuspsychjeemnz: not sure20:02
lotuspsychjeanyways off to sleep20:03
lotuspsychjenitenite guys20:03
pauljwgnit20:03
pauljwbbl20:10
lotuspsychjegood early morning23:23
Bashing-omlotuspsychje: Uh Huh , Look at the day, let us rejoice and be glad in it .23:24
lotuspsychjeinsomnia here :p23:25
Bashing-omWe keep ya company. I have been known to wake up at OH! Dark :30; and here I am .23:27
lotuspsychjelol23:27
Bashing-ombesides, what are friends for .23:28
lotuspsychje!cookie | Bashing-om nice123:28
ubot5Bashing-om nice1: Wow! You're such a great helper, you deserve a cookie!23:28
Bashing-omcookies are good .23:29
lotuspsychjefriendship too :p23:29
Bashing-omAye, the Good things !23:31
emnz3 hours sleep enough for you?23:42
emnzlol o.O23:42
emnzim going for a long sleep, thank you for the help, goodnight23:43
lotuspsychjelol23:43

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