[06:25] <mapp> morning all
[06:27]  * zmoylan-pi looks at watch... what time do you call this? :-)
[06:30] <mapp> just home from work:P
[07:19] <MooDoo> morning all
[07:38] <mapps> narcos is so good
[07:38] <mapps> almost finished e4
[08:07] <davmor2> Morning all
[08:11] <MooDoo> morning davmor2
[08:19] <davmor2> MooDoo: I got "forget you" stuck in my head this morning
[08:19] <foobarry> replaces it with "fix you"
[08:20] <MooDoo> :)
[08:20] <davmor2> foobarry: no that's the developers job I tend to "break you"
[08:25] <knightwise> hey peeps
[08:26] <davmor2> morning knightwise
[08:26] <davmor2> morning czajkowski
[08:26] <czajkowski> davmor2: howdy
[08:27] <knightwise> hey davmor2 czajkowski
[08:29]  * knightwise remembers he needs to update his ubuntu phone
[08:54] <JamesTait> Good morning all; happy Guacamole Day! 😃
[08:57] <davmor2> JamesTait: http://holysmokesbatman.com/tracks/holy-guacamole.html
[09:01] <JamesTait> davmor2, it doesn't need to be holy. Just good, fresh guacamole will do.
[09:12] <brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
[09:15] <bashrc> morning
[09:16] <MooDoo> morning brobostigon
[09:18] <brobostigon> morning MooDoo
[13:19] <selinuxium> Hi all, Having a problam with an init.d script for an acient peice of odbc layer the work system uses. If I trigger the start command outside of scritp it works fine... But if I use the service to start it... Not so... Any ideas?
[13:19] <selinuxium> http://paste.ubuntu.com/12426680/
[13:49] <davmor2> JamesTait: Hang your head in shame, Yesterday was the 20th anniversary of the initial release of hackers and you gave us happy dot day ;)
[13:50] <daftykins> :D
[13:51] <JamesTait> davmor2, yeah, but "Happy Dot Day" is a bit less verbose than "Happy 20th Anniversary of the Release of the Movie Hackers".
[13:51] <davmor2> JamesTait: Happy Movie Hackers Day
[13:52] <JamesTait> I don't hack movies.
[13:57] <daftykins> Crash & Burn
[13:57] <leecowdrey_>  IMHO must admit most films/TV programmes are not worth the "hack"
[13:59] <Azelphur> Whelp this is gonna hurt my wallet, in one hour I'm going to buy 4 4k 40" monitors.
[13:59] <Azelphur> $2,123 >.<
[13:59] <daftykins> D:
[13:59] <daftykins> i hope they're IPS for that low
[13:59] <mapps> what the hell is going on
[13:59] <Azelphur> daftykins: www.ebay.co.uk/itm/191682277542
[14:00] <Azelphur> got a deal out of him since I'm buying 4
[14:00] <popey> oooh
[14:00] <Myrtti> Mr. Robot
[14:00] <popey> + VAT
[14:00] <mapps> bray properties,agents for apartment we were in for a year sent an email saying we need to get electric and water reconnected else we get £100 admin fee 85£ harge..WE'VE MOVED OUT..who leaves eectric and water connected when they've moved
[14:00] <Azelphur> popey: yea if customs nabs me I'll probably have an extra ~£300 to pay :<
[14:00] <popey> I doubt my laptop can even drive that display :)
[14:00] <popey> let alone 2
[14:00] <mapps> so they can 'clean' ...you have to get it cutoff to get connected elsewhere
[14:00] <mapps> argh
[14:00] <Azelphur> popey: putting 3 on my main PC (GTX 980) and one for the gf to use
[14:01] <popey> you're generous :)
[14:01] <Azelphur> amusingly £350 for a 40" TV is actually a very good price, and it's all round better than any TV I'm gonna buy anyway for her use case
[14:01] <popey> 40" is huge for a desktop monitor tho
[14:01] <Azelphur> popey: well, it's going in the office and we'll hook her xbox up to it and she can watch TV on it and stuff, want her to have something to do while she's here and I'm working :)
[14:01] <popey> nice
[14:02] <popey> great for that!
[14:02] <Azelphur> Indeed, and hook my laptop up to it too (GTX 970M) I imagine it could probably just about drive some 4k gaming
[14:02] <bashrc> a 40" monitor?
[14:03] <Azelphur> bashrc: 4 of them :P
[14:03] <bashrc> that would be great for flight simulators
[14:03] <Azelphur> hehe
[14:04] <popey> yeah!
[14:08] <daftykins> doesn't really answer my questions that ebay page, ah well
[14:09] <Azelphur> daftykins: maybe https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o553bTyFElQ will?
[14:09] <Azelphur> (Tek Syndicate \o/)
[14:10] <daftykins> eh, effort :)
[14:10] <Azelphur> hehe
[14:40] <Myrtti> my XPS 13 9333 really hates the 3.19.0-29 kernel, it seems
[14:40] <Myrtti> or something that's happened in the past few days updates
[14:40] <daftykins> seen tonnes of folk have issues with -29, over in #ubuntu
[14:41] <daftykins> seems one to be avoided :>
[14:41] <popey> Azelphur: that was an interesting video, pretty amazing display for the price
[14:41] <Azelphur> popey: indeed, I'm hyped :)
[14:42] <popey> heh
[14:42] <popey> i keep looking at my desk and thinking "I wonder if I could fit one on here"
[14:42] <Myrtti> I've rebooted twice today because laptop has just died
[14:42] <Myrtti> and returning from suspend, wifi is turned off
[14:42] <Azelphur> popey: haha
[14:51] <daftykins> i just caved and watched the vid too XD
[14:51] <daftykins> i'm fortunate though, i own no equipment that'd drive that res :P
[14:52] <popey> yeah, me either
[16:20] <awilkins> Another sinkhole in the Mancunian Way
[16:20] <awilkins> I drove over that bit on Sunday
[16:28] <diddledan> awilkins: yey
[16:28] <diddledan> awilkins: bumpy bumpy
[16:29] <diddledan> is it a full-on sinkhole or more a pothole?
[16:29] <diddledan> :-p
[16:37] <awilkins> http://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/greater-manchester-news/mancunian-way-hole-more-misery-10061622
[16:37] <awilkins> That photo is the original hole though
[16:42] <diddledan> oh wow, it really is a full-on sinkhole!
[16:42] <diddledan> that's amazeballs
[16:43] <awilkins> If you look at the Google Streetview pictures, they were taken the month before it opened up
[16:43] <awilkins> You can see the cracks forming in the road
[16:50] <shauno> so google broke manchester?
[16:57] <mapps> what is going on with my internet;[
[16:58] <davmor2> mapps: wibble
[16:58] <mapps> its super bad today
[16:58] <mapps> slow and oing down loads
[17:03] <davmor2> mapps: wibble
[17:04] <davmor2> mapps: without knowing the network you are on/the issues you are having it's kinda hard to judge
[18:14] <shauno> uff.  nothing more annoying than a server that doesn't finish shutting down
[18:17] <zmoylan-pi> shutting down a windows system to run for a bus only for it to say installing updates? :-)
[18:26] <shauno> nah, ubuntu saying it's stopping kvm and then ... ?
[18:27] <zmoylan-pi> copying files on windows and it stops at 99% for eternity
[18:49] <daftykins> you'd have to be quite the idiot with Windows to not know how to control updates :)
[18:49] <zmoylan-pi> well with w10 consumer version the choice is made for you
[18:50] <daftykins> not quite, still get prompted when you want to restart
[18:50] <daftykins> so another bit of FUD spreading there Mr. zmoylan-pi :P
[18:50] <zmoylan-pi> deciding when to restart makes all the difference :-)
[18:51] <daftykins> yep invalidates your above claim
[18:51] <daftykins> but prior versions still had far greater control
[18:52] <daftykins> of course we haven't even touched on dependency hell and package messes the likes of #ubuntu get themselves into :D
[18:52] <zmoylan-pi> prior version had better controls.  but most people left if on auto and found their systems brought down w10 update even if they never planned to install it
[18:52] <daftykins> but i can be reasonable there, accepting it's mostly new users fiddling with PPAs
[18:53] <zmoylan-pi> but after managing the dll hell of windows dependency hell on linux is a picnic :-D
[18:53] <daftykins> yeah see that claim is currently wordly very dangerously online, articles try to make out like it's doing it regardless - but actually if you read through the article carefully like i did, you see that the person did still run through the wizard and sign up to get the update
[18:54] <zmoylan-pi> i didn't
[18:54] <daftykins> which again is just clickbait
[18:57] <daftykins> now here's a real concern we can all get behind...
[18:57] <daftykins> can't believe i saw mince pies in the supermarket!
[18:59] <foobarry> is it possible to copy wii dvds? my skyward sword occasionally fails to read
[19:00] <foobarry> wnat to save it before more damage occurs
[19:00] <davmor2> foobarry: if it will read you can surely just dd the /dev/sr0
[19:01] <daftykins> i thought they inverted the disc read, from outside to in?
[19:02] <daftykins> if it's already started playing up you're probably knackered
[19:03] <foobarry> there's some scratches
[19:04] <zmoylan-pi> and i've seen the selection boxes appear in supermarkets too but it is now 100 days to christmas i think
[19:04] <daftykins> :(
[19:05] <zmoylan-pi> so once halloween/guy fawkes* is over the crimbo carols will be blasted at you 24x7 *delete as applicable
[19:09] <foobarry> Wii discs are not exactly DVDs. Nintendo uses a special format that is based on the DVD specifications called RVL-006, most PC DVD drives cannot read this format.
[19:09] <foobarry> quote from interwebs
[19:09] <foobarry> n addition to this the original Wii discs usually have a BCA mark on the inner ring of each disc, e.g. a bar code. This BCA mark cannot be reproduced by a DVD writer and the Wii appears to read out this bar code. If the code is not present on the disc, the Wii won't accept the inserted media.
[19:09] <zmoylan-pi> most... so some can?
[19:10] <daftykins> well i mean you're not going to be able to copy a Wii game disc regardless without modifying your console :)
[19:19] <davmor2> foobarry: http://www.ubuntugeek.com/wii-backup-fusion-simply-to-use-backup-solution-for-your-wii-games.html you can look into this I guess
[19:23] <ali1234> willcooke: i just read your blog post and wiki page about the "big bug scrub"
[19:23] <ali1234> i think abusing the "opinion" status to mark low priority bugs is going to rub people the wrong way
[19:24] <willcooke> ali1234, where am I abusing it?
[19:25] <ali1234> "As part of the big bug clear up for 16.04 this bug is being marked as  Opinion.  While this bug is affecting you, and potentially others, we do  not consider it a priority for work and so it won't get fixed by us."
[19:25] <ali1234> you acknowledge that it is a bug which affects someone, but then mark it opinion anyway
[19:26] <willcooke> ali1234, good call, let me fix that
[19:26] <ali1234> i mean there's a whole "importance" field for that, it seems like a better fit to me
[19:32] <diddledan> evenin
[19:32] <popey> pip pip
[19:35]  * brobostigon just found a jem, metallica's black album.
[19:37] <ali1234> brobostigon: it's the trning point where they went from being good to being terrible
[19:37] <ali1234> many consider it their last good album, and many consider it the first bad one
[19:38] <brobostigon> i agree, i think its their best.
[19:38] <ali1234> it's certainly their most popular and well known
[19:38] <brobostigon> that as well.
[19:39] <brobostigon> for example. my opinion is, piper at the gates of dawn, is pink floyds best work, but by no means is it their most popular nor most well known.
[19:40] <willcooke> ali1234, fixed, or at least made more accurate
[19:41] <ali1234> willcooke: better, thanks
[19:41] <willcooke> ali1234, thanks for the feedback
[19:46] <popey> hey willcooke bug 1118648 is probably a dupe of that one you and I saw in London
[19:47]  * popey marks dupe
[19:47] <popey> of a bug I also filed :)
[19:49]  * brobostigon is also on his first week of not having any tobacco, and just using his nicotine vaporiser on orders of his gf.
[19:50] <popey> robo-fags ftw
[19:50] <brobostigon> that they are, yes.
[19:51] <diddledan> the world is craycray: http://www.standwithahmed.com/
[19:52] <daftykins> well, 'murica specially ;)
[19:54] <brobostigon> so they have odd rules in the US as to?
[20:00] <popey> existing
[20:03] <brobostigon> ah,
[20:03] <mapps> hi
[20:04] <daftykins> lo
[20:04] <mapps> gibraltar is so backwards
[20:04] <mapps>  moving out so we cutoff electric and water estate agents say they want it recomected else we get a fine
[20:04] <mapps> they want it connected for 'cleaning'
[20:05] <mapps> when you move out you ALWAYS get utilities cut off so its not in your name..no?
[20:06] <ali1234> you don't get it dosconnected, you just inform the electric company you are moving out and ask for a final bill
[20:06] <daftykins> just take values and call with final personally
[20:06] <mapps> well
[20:06] <mapps> when i moved in i had to get it 'connected'
[20:06] <mapps> and pai £60 for electric an £30 for water
[20:07] <mapps> and im moving tomorrow right and i took the previous tenants forms for disconnection and i had to pay again to be reconnected
[20:07] <mapps> thats how they do it here it seems
[20:07] <ali1234> one time i lived in a rented flat with a pre pay gas meter
[20:07] <ali1234> when we moved in the landlord gave us the card
[20:07] <ali1234> few days later the gas man came and read the meter, which it turned out had like £100 of debt on it
[20:08] <ali1234> told us to "just pay it" and we'd get a refund when the account was switched over to our name
[20:08] <ali1234> luckily i didn't believe a word of it
[20:08] <ali1234> 6 months later they switched it over, no refund
[20:08] <mapps> and the girl moved out monday..form said cutoff date 14th september (monday) my start date 17Th, i handed our forms in to disconnect our old place on 17th - and they say we were meant to leave it connected, surely this is utter garbage -- look at what i said..i had to pay to be connected when we moved in and i had to pay for the new place
[20:09] <ali1234> but luckily i had refused to put any money on the thing after we found out how much debt their was, so they only owed us like £10
[20:09] <ali1234> did have to go 6 months without gas though
[20:09] <mapps> what a pain
[20:09] <ali1234> we got a camping stove
[20:09] <mapps> people always lie and scam
[20:09] <ali1234> it was actually cheaper to buy the cans of gas than to put money on the meter
[20:09] <mapps> but seriously see the above when we moved here we paid to get elec/water connected after prev tenant moved..and again i had to pay for new apartment
[20:10] <shauno> we had an odd one when they figured out I'd been paying upstairs' electricity, and he'd been paying mine
[20:10] <mapps> so why would we leave it on when we moved?
[20:10] <mapps> ll
[20:10] <ali1234> well you're in gib so the law probably doesn't apply to them, or they think it doesn't
[20:10] <mapps> lol
[20:10] <ali1234> hence they do whatever they can get away with
[20:10] <mapps> how was that shauno
[20:10] <mapps> yep
[20:10] <ali1234> i had another landlord pull a funny trick
[20:10] <shauno> the leccy co's 'solution' was to charge me everything I should have paid in 18 months, but promised me I'd get what I paid against the wrong account back later
[20:11] <ali1234> actually now i think about it, it was the same landlord
[20:12] <ali1234> the house was advertised at a weekly rent "plus 1 month deposit"
[20:12] <ali1234> and the way he calculated the monthly deposit was to wait not, it was monthly rent plus 1 month deposit
[20:14] <ali1234> oh i don't remember what it was exactly but it boiled down to taking the monthly rent, dividing by 4 to get the weekly rent, multiplying by 52 to get yearly rent, and then dividing by 12 to get the deposit.
[20:14] <ali1234> which is of course about 8% more
[20:15] <mapps> lol
[20:15] <mapps> so many peope up to little tricks
[20:15] <ali1234> i didn't let him get away with that either
[20:15] <ali1234> he also wanted 12 months of post dated cheques
[20:15] <mapps> thing is with this case with my estate agent, if i had t pay fees to get connected when i move in, why are they shocked i got it disconnecte? AND the girl moving out got it cutoff an i got it connected and paid again?
[20:16] <mapps> so it's the normal thing ? if they made me get it connected when i moved in here..and its not like im the first person there...loads lived there before..same with new place getting that connected
[20:16] <ali1234> there is no "normal"
[20:16] <mapps> gah sick of gibraltar being so useless
[20:16] <popey> when i moved out of rented accomodation you just note the numbers on the meter and tell the company.
[20:16] <ali1234> if you were in the UK there's people you can complain to about this kind of stuff
[20:16] <popey> mind you, that was wales
[20:17] <ali1234> i always had to produce final bills to get my deposit back
[20:17] <shauno> the impression I get of most the med, is that if you're not bribing someone, you're doing it wrong.  and will continue to do it wrong, even if you follow instructions
[20:17] <ali1234> one time it took me nearly a year to get a final bill from the water company because of a dispute, which once again i did not let them get away with
[20:17] <ali1234> i think i've told that story before though so i won't bore everyone
[20:18] <mapps> yea everything is slow here
[20:18] <mapps> tediously slow
[20:18] <mapps> parcel from the uk of mine sat at the post office in 'clearing' for a week
[20:18] <mapps> absolute nonsense its obviously been scanned etc when it left the uk
[20:19] <mapps> my bank account where it's taken 5 months and still haven't got it..but they said it's all sorted now...we shall see
[20:20] <shauno> I almost feel sorry for the water company.  they would have had no idea what they were getting into, when they tried to argue technicalities with ali1234 ;)
[20:20] <daftykins> i'd be wary about putting anything in an account that good :D
[20:20] <daftykins> shauno: :D
[20:20] <daftykins> ali1234: aww i haven't heard that one i don't think :D
[20:20] <ali1234> they said they read my meter, but couldn't tell me where my meter actually was
[20:21] <zmoylan-pi> does water meter use rfid?
[20:21] <daftykins> ooh that's a sneaky one
[20:21] <ali1234> and they said i used about 10x as much water as a normal family would, when i lived alone
[20:23] <ali1234> zmoylan-pi: this was about 10 years ago, so maybe. they did claim that the meter was inside the property, in a location that didn't actually exist
[20:24] <ali1234> they were like "our records show the meter is under the stairs" when it was a flat
[20:24] <zmoylan-pi> doesn't mean there weren't stairs or remains of stairs if house had been converted to flats
[20:25] <ali1234> sure, but that's not my problem :)
[20:25] <zmoylan-pi> my brother used to run drains unblocking business.  the amount of times he found people had concreted over access points...
[20:25] <ali1234> i had the ground floor too
[20:25] <mapps> daftykins id be wary getting my wages into this jok gib bank..everyone else gets paid..im stil waiting 'oh sorry we have a backlog' lol
[20:26] <ali1234> i scoured the whole place inside and out and could not find a meter
[20:27] <zmoylan-pi> they can be in odd places that people don't think to look.  but landlord should have been able to tell you
[20:27] <daftykins> :>
[20:27] <ali1234> yeah he didn't know anything about a meter either
[20:27] <ali1234> i don't think i have ever lived in a house with a water meter
[20:28] <zmoylan-pi> then ask a neighbour.  seeing were there's are might have helped
[20:28] <zmoylan-pi> *their's
[20:28] <ali1234> the eople in the upstairs flat also claimed to not have a meter
[20:28] <daftykins> sounds like a water co trying to make a quick few bob from a lack of dispute
[20:29] <zmoylan-pi> sounds like it
[20:29] <daftykins> i've got fixed rates here based on my properties TRP value, i've heard some people that convert to meters end up paying more
[20:29] <ali1234> nah... probably just a computer snafu
[20:29] <daftykins> i pay about £105 a quarter
[20:31] <shauno> I'm meant to be getting a meter, I think.  but I've had no mail about it, and I'm not inclined to phone them and ask if they want money
[20:33] <zmoylan-pi> they try not to warn you in ireland when in case the protesters appear
[20:33] <mapps> having a meter works out better for single occpants i think?
[20:33] <ali1234> probably, when it works properly
[20:35] <shauno> well, we're transitioning from not paying charges at all, to meters.  so there really is no 'better'
[20:39] <Azelphur> Hmm, I'm trying to update Ubuntu 15.04 server edition running inside libvirt, it's hanging at "Found memtest86+ image: /memtest86.bin" during the update. Any ideas?
[20:40] <ali1234> that's the grub install script
[20:40] <ali1234> it's probably looking for a physical disk partition
[20:40] <Azelphur> indeed
[20:41] <ali1234> so just skip it
[20:41] <Azelphur> how?
[20:41] <ali1234> no idea
[20:41] <Azelphur> just kill the grub processes?
[20:41] <Azelphur> I think I'll give that a go, hopefully it'll continue the upgrade and I can always fix grub if it breaks.
[20:42] <ali1234> so i've got a question about libvirt actually
[20:42] <daftykins> server non-LTS! for shame :)
[20:42] <ali1234> i need to build and run a 2.6.12.6 kernel on a headless server which is on the other end of the internet
[20:42] <ali1234> i need to do that because i need the ext3 48 bit patch set to access a weird filesystem image which is 1TB
[20:43] <mapps> cor narcos is so good
[20:43] <mapps> 2 eps left.il have finished it tonight
[20:43] <ali1234> i don't want to install that kernel natively for obvious reasons
[20:43] <mapps> :D
[20:43] <ali1234> so what's the best way to set up a VM with that kernel when i only have ssh access?
[20:44] <Azelphur> ali1234: virt-manager is really easy, it can connect to a remote server over SSH and provides a piss-easy graphical way to control libvirt, I use it.
[20:44] <ali1234> interesting, i'll check it out
[20:44] <mapps> i recommend narcos to everyone, decent show..and i watch loads of tv;p
[20:48]  * daftykins noticed :D
[21:37] <zmoylan-pi> and some one seems to be flogging the idea of 8k tvs today
[21:42] <diddledan> \o/
[21:42] <diddledan> moar pixies!
[21:46] <zmoylan-pi> you can spot every hair sticking out of newsreaders nose
[22:07] <Azelphur> so going back to my original issue, any ideas folks? https://dpaste.de/3mky it's just hanging.
[22:07] <Azelphur> completely unusable apt :(
[22:15] <Azelphur> aha, workaround, GRUB_DISABLE_OS_PROBER=true in /etc/default/grub :)
[22:40] <daftykins> must be something it was seeing that it didn't like?