[00:29] daftykins: virtual machine in libvirt with no other OS / partitions, it's stupid :P [00:30] ah [00:30] funky [00:30] http://www.amazon.co.uk/Icy-Box-IB-254U3-Enclosure-interface/dp/B00GYLDDCG/ [00:31] i'm gonna get me one o' these to throw a lappy HDD in and make it my xbox one extra storage :> [00:31] sounds fun [00:32] daftykins: amusingly, I have piles of 3.5 inch enclosures laying about, I keep giving them away [00:33] with UASP? ;) [00:33] so you're giving homes to the homes of 3.5" devices... :-) [00:33] daftykins: dunno [00:33] seems to be a pretty newish thing [00:33] not often present [00:33] zmoylan-pi: indeed, I buy drives in enclosures because it's cheaper, then pull them out of the enclosures [00:33] I've had 5 of them now [00:33] i did just remember i have my old array of 6 x 1TB doing nothing, but the idea of slapping two in an external 2 bay RAID thing for USB 3 would be noisy [00:37] I have a 4x5TB array :) [00:40] eh i have main storage too, but i'm more thinking of what can be attached to the xbox one [00:40] since sadly you can't swap out the internal without encountering the wrath of breaking terms of service [00:41] they've just geared up to releasing a new 'elite' model like the 360 had, which comes with a 1TB SSHD =| [00:41] Azelphur: speaking of, presumably you meant you/your gf have an xbox one to pop on one of those 4K displays from earlier? [00:41] i hadn't even read anything about whether they properly upscale to it yet [00:46] daftykins: xbox 360 actually, gf is considering getting an xbox one :) [00:48] daftykins: the main appeal of it for that however is being a monitor, means lower latency for games while TVs generally have much higher latency [00:49] i think that'll be invalidated by the fact its' input lag and latency is based on being fed a 4K image [00:49] giving it a 360 will mean it'll output 1080p tops, so the inbuilt will be responsible for the upscaling [00:49] could end up... interesting :D [00:49] daftykins: surely it'd be lower for a 1080p image [00:49] hmm? [00:50] surely the latency would be lower for a 1080i (actually xbox is 1080i) image... [00:50] the xbox 360's scaler chip outputs the 1080p regardless [00:51] daftykins: yea, but the latency on the monitor is gonna be lower than that of a tv. [00:51] which is the point I'm making [00:51] i've got no data on that :D [00:52] TVs have so high latency they generally don't even list it [00:52] it's bad, some TVs (like the Seiki) is like 200ms+ [00:52] i don't think that's true across the board [00:53] HDMI has no latency so the size of the picture isn't directly related to latency [00:53] probably not but I challenge you to find a TV with its input latency listed in its spec [00:53] with all the numbers they throw around with new tvs i never hear latency mentioned [00:54] it is when the TV's built-in hardware has to scale it \o/ [00:54] yes [00:54] zmoylan-pi: newp more of a gamer thing still [00:54] thank goodness for gamers driving down the prices of new tech :-) [00:54] although if it is just doubling every pixel, that in theory could be done with no latency [00:55] but it never is since they add a tonne of image magic [00:55] in TVs yeah [00:55] \o/ magic! [00:55] not so much in monitors [00:55] woohoo! [00:55] TVs are awesome for ruining a movie's picture [00:56] speaking of magic, i must make my words disappear from your very eyes! [00:56] g'night all :D [00:56] :-o [00:56] o/ [00:56] but I just woke up! [00:56] i should make a gadget to measure display latency [00:56] i bet loads of gamers would buy it [00:57] www.displaylag.com might be of interest, heard it mentioned somewhere recently [00:57] and i bet proper ones are expensive [00:57] gamers seem to obsess over 10ms vs 5ms [00:57] i reckon i could do it on an arduino [00:57] 100ms is equivalent to "instant" in human scales [00:57] no it isn't lol [00:58] diddledan: indeed that's bad >.< [00:58] just put some static on a screen and you will see how sharp or blurred it is. [00:58] diddledan: try playing a piano on 100ms [00:58] I have, it's like being under the damned speech jammer [00:58] it's more like 25ms +/- 10ms [00:59] google have measured it - they claim that if an effect occurs within 100ms of an action then people perceive it as instantaneous [00:59] i used to play a game on a stop watch at school. start and stop as fast as possible. i could easily to 7ms but after a few hours of playing spectrum games could occasionly get down to 3ms [00:59] diddledan: for a single event, sure [01:00] example given by azelphur of playing the piano is a good one. it's ver different when you're also dealing with delayed past events while entering new ones [01:00] of course this was in the day of joystick wagglers so very fast alternate keys was important [01:00] and playing a game is more like playing the piano than "waiting for a website to do something" (which is i assume what google were testing) [01:00] * diddledan waggles his joystick [01:00] zmoylan-pi: your fault! [01:01] i blame daley thompsons decatholon [01:01] yeah webpage load was the thing google were measuring [01:02] i was actually playing a video game the other day and got hit by this. had to click comething N times, but the game was lagging and the "click" sound effect actually being delayed made it almost impossible to click the right number of times [01:03] probably loading the click from hard drive... [01:03] it needs to save to disc on every click :-p [01:03] realtime world-saves ftw [01:04] pretty much, it was a bloated minecraft world [01:04] hah [01:04] java garbage collector sucks [01:04] minecraft is terrible for efficient working [01:04] "let's never free anything until we hit the memory limit" [01:05] i should make a website to demonstrate this effect [01:05] one such example is the requirement to load an entire chunk off the server even though you can't see it all [01:05] "click the button 10 times" ... "you failed" [01:05] loaded just-in-case [01:05] they could learn about optimisation from 8bit games :-) [01:05] diddledan: chunks aren't that big though... the bigger problem is java doesn't immediately free them when minecraft unloads them [01:05] yeah those 8bit programmers were true geniuses [01:06] cartridges forced strange methods of optimisation so I read [01:06] big blocks of memory are slow to unload when memory is completely full [01:07] there's a great video on the game elite and how they squashed all the game into a tiny amount of memory that is worth watching [01:07] I never have understood delayed garbage collectors on-top of the system memory allocator [01:08] draw the screen while loading the game then throw out that code and never overwrite those sections that are the ship [01:08] I get the point of delayed garbage collection by the system but to add it on-top of another memory allocator seems.. weird [01:08] the logic is that some operating systems have really bad allocators, so you should write one that's a tiny bit better than the absolute worst, and then force everyone to use it [01:08] and that's why openssl is such a pig [01:08] and firefox too [01:09] openssl actually has a good reason, it needs to know for sure that freed memory is securely wiped [01:09] oh and also Gtk+ has one of these things in it [01:09] they took that requirement as carte blanche to reimplement everything themselves tho [01:09] just because a language is bad doesn't mean you can't get coders who can't make it run efficently. it's just they cost a lot more [01:11] it's not actually about the language... java has at least four different garbage collectors and i'm pretty sure on of them is "just directly use malloc and free" [01:11] Gtk+ also has this as a debug option [01:11] but it can cause programs to behave differently [01:11] so you can't really use them in production [01:11] true but it does seem like they picked the best way to slow down a system :-) [01:14] ah the crazy allocator is in glib of course, not Gtk+ === Lcawte is now known as Lcawte|Away [03:50] catching-up on the last few episodes of "humans" - it's a really compelling story [03:50] just starting ep6 [03:55] nearly time for morning coffee methinks [05:03] hello [05:12] morning [05:43] 1 ep of izombie then bed [05:43] gotta be up at midday [05:43] picking up apartment keys at 12;30 water person coming t 1 ugh [05:44] got loads to move too its a right hassle [05:48] only diddledan up [05:48] no zmoylan-pi lurking? [05:48] :) [05:52] they're lightweights [05:54] https://scontent.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpf1/v/t1.0-9/10296795_896313610394830_6540979153331699150_n.jpg?oh=5d77a32ea83c917bf15c9c6781219185&oe=5665A9BD [05:54] lol [05:54] how can someone who's a mum look and dress like that [05:54] just looks cheap and nasty [05:54] everytime i reactivate facebook i wonder if i should have [06:15] stupid americans - re the teenager who took a clock to school, a police person told media: "we attempted to question the juvenile about what it was and he would simply only tell us that it was a clock" <-- turns out it was a clock [06:15] lol [06:15] who reported it [06:15] who'd have thunk a teenager telling the truth [06:15] a teacher called the cops on him [06:16] he has also been suspended for three days despite being proven to not be a muslim terrorist [06:16] criminal prosecution has not been ruled out [06:16] because they saw him with a clock what like he was walking around with it? [06:17] he made it at home and took it to school to show his engineering teacher. a different teacher saw it and called the cops [06:18] ah [06:18] what a fool the teacher was [06:19] yeah but even so the authorities are prosecuting the kid even though it was a false alarm, and he also gets three days suspension from school because meh [06:20] prosecuting him fr what [06:20] must be some reason [06:20] there's a campaign site here https://www.standwithahmed.com/ [06:21] as far as I can tell they're prosecuting because cockmakers should be made examples of to deter future would-be clockakers [06:22] basically no reason whatsoever [06:22] ah is that what that hashtag meant [07:03] ooooooh! http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p030s5bx === MartijnV1S is now known as MartijnVdS [07:08] ooh [07:08] that looks good [07:21] morning all [07:22] Indeed it's a morning to you all too === Lcawte|Away is now known as Lcawte [08:02] that clock story is bringing out the worst side of americans [08:03] all the comments as usual are polarised [08:04] they have a different side? :P [08:04] teehee: https://twitter.com/WillMcAvoyACN/status/644260578156871680 [08:25] i wonder if the teacher will be prosecuted for wasting police time [08:25] hah [08:25] last I heard they're still prosecuting the kid [08:25] no all charges were dropped last i heard [08:26] the police said they did the right thing responding as they did and said it was a cool clock [08:28] I think that story shows that the "national security" mindsets turns adults into idiots who are either unwilling or unable to exercise critical judgement [08:29] i remember when some smart add phoned in a bomb scare during my schools leaving cert exams. they hoped to be able to look at a few books when the classes were evacuated. all that happened was a gardai came in and checked the classes out [08:30] *smart ass [08:33] this could have been resolved if english teachers knew more about science [08:33] or the headteacher actually spoke to the engineering teacher! [08:36] i think the teacher that he brought the clock in to show advised him to hide it which suggests he thought some of the other teachers wouldn't understand or were idiots [08:36] zmoylan-pi: Possibly both [08:36] Willful ignorance. [08:37] considering what they pay teachers can we expect any better? [08:37] pay is not related to ability [08:37] What foobarry said [08:38] pay does decide the level of applicants to a large degree [08:38] living in texas does not immediately imply you are an inbred numpty [08:38] teaching is a vocation too [08:38] and pay is static across the board largely [08:38] imply no, hint yes [08:42] my sister is a teacher [08:42] so poo to you [08:42] she's awesome! [08:42] i've had great teachers and i've had teachers who were there just to punch a clock [08:43] my brother-in-law however is a business psychologist which means he's the enemy :-p [08:43] zmoylan-pi: Puch a WHAT? [08:43] and I've got a friend teaching science that genuinely thought that microwaving water made it bad [08:43] Myrtti: oh dear [08:43] they were there just to do the hours and get a pay cheque [08:44] and a teacher can be fantastic in one area and a complete idiot in another [08:45] there was a video I saw a couple days ago which had a teenage girl from an english speaking country that isn't the UK moaning about a language barrier when talking to someone in the UK [08:45] she also moaned about how the UK being closer to the sun must be the explanation as to why something is many pounds [08:46] (pounds as in cost - the english person responded to her quizzing the cost of something and she was bemused that he replied a weight) [08:47] diddledan: "A pound of your flesh", very Shakespearian. [08:47] jpds: I bite my thumb at thee [08:47] lol [08:47] i fart in your general direction [08:47] lol [08:47] you all smell of elderberries [08:47] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cAy4zULKFDU [08:48] Myrtti: beat me [08:57] hmm, it's 10:00 and I'm already hungry [08:57] * zmoylan-pi passes diddledan the bag of peanuts [08:58] meh [08:58] covered in chocolate [08:58] meh [08:58] or dry roasted [08:58] now if they were raisens covered in chocolate..! [08:58] i'd banish you to the pits of hell for ruining good chocolate [08:58] :-) [09:03] Whats the benefit of either creating a new Volume Group or Extending an existing one with logical volumes [09:03] morning boys and girls. [09:03] I'm not sureon best practice ? [09:04] I take it that adding to an existing volume group I can extend other pv's into that VG group where as if I create a new one only new PV's can be extended [09:10] Good morning all; happy Thursday, and happy Apple Dumpling Day! 😃 [09:11] * JamesTait is stubbornly refusing to turn on the heater. [09:15] JamesTait: I'm the same! I was actually cold last night.. but stubborness won out [09:15] :) [09:18] Same here, but I'm going to grab an extra jumper! [09:18] 2 months to go for heating yet! [09:24] I've still got a window open :-p [09:25] i have windows open and fan running at night [Dublin, DUB, Ireland] Condition: Mostly Cloudy | Temp: 12C/54F/285K/513R | Humidity: 82% | Wind Speed 8mph/13kmph [09:27] I like the fresh air this time of year when I'm in bed - it reminds me of a period where I felt content despite being in the throws of deep depression (the weather reminds me of being in an adolescent psyc unit) [09:27] I'm weird, what can I say :-p [09:28] you fit right in here :-) [09:28] teehee [09:55] anyone looking for a new role https://careers.stackoverflow.com/jobs/98046/full-stack-python-javascript-engineer-for-seenitio [09:56] just found a half eaten packet of pork scratchings downstairs [09:56] BONUS [09:56] * Laney chomps [09:57] RESULT [09:57] SADDO's [09:58] before their expiry date? double bonus [09:58] :-) [09:59] still crunchy [09:59] mmmm fried fat [09:59] http://drool.popey.com/ [09:59] nothing worse than soggy pork scratchings [10:00] _nothing_ on earth [10:03] get my apartment keys in 20mins:D [10:04] squash anyone! hah [10:04] * diddledan sits on mapps [10:04] just hpe there's some unsecure wifi i can steal until my internet is connected [10:04] howsat for squish? [10:04] there's places below me with it.. two cafes the gym and mcdonalds but no way they'd reach me (10th floor) [10:05] ouch [10:05] 10 floors is a long way up [10:05] indeed [10:05] hopefully you've got a lift? [10:05] pringles can antennae? [10:05] yep [10:05] i should hope so for 1200 a month;p [10:05] zmoylan-pi: bonus is you get to eat the pringles first [10:05] mm nummy [10:06] nom nom, salt & vinegar pringles [10:06] im off a week in november and december, might go to berlin november but december cant decide where would be nice around then [10:06] JamesTait: I can't find an apple dumping song or a macdondalds apple pie volcano gif, so I'll go for this as it mentions Opples https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vrIqSlt9PXg [10:08] i haven't had a mcdonalds apple pie in decades... tempted... [10:08] sheesh nor have i [10:08] mmm [10:08] im eating out a lot..too much junk food [10:08] deep fried apple pie [10:08] ate twice at the rubbish casino the other day heh [10:10] ate at the casino... that sounds like a gamble... :-) [10:11] yea it's woeful [10:11] burger bacon and cheese [10:11] cold bacon cold cheese..yum [10:11] but after 1am it's the only place..the kebab shops close midnight..1 stand in the square but 1am closed to [10:11] *too [10:12] kebab shops that close at midnight... don't they understand that's the only time they sell kebabs?! [10:12] :) [10:15] is there no site for gibraltar that lists all the takeouts in your area and times they're open? [10:37] sorry, but I feel this hasn't been posted recently enough: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=StTqXEQ2l-Y [10:39] sees your video and raises you https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ojydNb3Lrrs [10:45] Good morning peeps :) [11:32] bigcalm: he's not big, and he's not calm :-p [11:32] Small yet perfectly formed [11:33] except that growth on your neck [11:33] oh that's your head :-p [11:41] diddledan, zmoylan-pi: I see you videos and I raise you https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tC5eMgePakk [11:47] diddledan: you're being rather rude for somebody I don't personally know. Please try not to be [11:51] sorry, I come across that way I guess [11:52] I promise I absolutely never ever mean offence with any of my utterances, even if I appear to the contrary [11:54] davmor2: dang that's trumpy! [11:54] diddledan: trumpy is this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k4ixAfJ1LuI === alan_g is now known as alan_g|lunch [12:07] sleep time [12:07] moved most my stuff in:D [12:07] back at old place to get some more sleep :) === Lcawte is now known as Lcawte|Away [12:18] when did I disappear? [12:18] apparently I just reconnected. random. [12:18] you haven't yet [12:18] i see no disconnect [12:19] yeah that'll be my local-to-znc connection that died then [12:53] bouncy bouncy czajkowski [13:01] OMG!!! http://www.gog.com/game/starship_titanic === alan_g|lunch is now known as alan_g [13:17] diddledan: did you get my trupy is this video link? [13:18] diddledan: also late addition to the Morning head songs today with Read all about it [13:20] yup I dead [13:21] did** [13:21] lol @ speelign [14:38] Long shot, but copy and paste doesn't work between X screens, does anyone have a solution better than https://dpaste.de/6sRO ? === daftykin1 is now known as daftykins [15:33] gah still tired [15:33] ;[ [15:35] * daftykins throws a funnel and a tall red bull at mapps [15:35] or just go back to bed :) [15:36] * zmoylan-pi throws box of smarties with all the best e numbers for hyper activity at mapps === Lcawte|Away is now known as Lcawte [15:54] gotta go gym morrisons etc move last bits over [15:54] morissons in gibraltar? [15:54] why do all the morons put Gibraltar as where they live when they live in La Linea, clearly a big diff [15:54] yea [15:54] la linea is known as the a hole of spain [15:55] it's like a bombs hit it--nothing like i imagined spain to be - had only been majorca not mainland spain before [15:55] some days the shelves are empty diddledan as it all comes from uk [15:55] yeesh [15:56] that's sucky [15:56] ya like they cant have deliveries on weekends [15:57] sometimes like there will be no freh meat basically..even freh juice low...umm cooked meats etc [15:59] that's basically how our local supermarket chain has been getting :P [15:59] they sold their local warehouse so now everything is at the mercy of the seas for freight [15:59] daftykins: I guess it's an island thing [15:59] :D [16:00] it's a trick question gibraltar is a penninsula... :-P [16:00] o_O [16:00] I never knew [16:02] mapps: i bet you can walk around that thing in half an hour :P [16:02] what, the morissons? [16:02] lol [16:02] morning shauno [16:03] o/ [16:16] wow that graveyard and Church is right next to the runway [16:16] in Gibraltar [16:28] getting this error in wine, "err:winediag:schan_imp_init Failed to load libgnutls, secure connections will not be available." but I've installed libgnutls >.> any ideas? [16:29] Azelphur: 64 vs 32bit? [16:29] installed all the i386 packages I could find, too [16:30] with the :i386 notation for dual-stack or the legacy method packages? [16:30] (or similar) [16:30] I forget but it might just be :386 [16:31] I just grabbed every libgnutls and libgnutls:i386 package I can find [16:31] hmm [16:31] that should do it :-/ [16:33] ldd shed any light? [16:45] wow... so QNAP NAS units appear to have a nasty bug that completely corrupts your filesystem [16:45] they used the EXT3 48 bit extents patch [16:46] \o/ [16:47] it wwrites the block number as a u32 then a u16 [16:47] :S [16:47] got your kernel compiled then? :) [16:47] u16 being the high bits [16:47] but for some reason this qnap doesn't write that u16, possibly because it is always zero [16:48] so then the high 16 bits of the block number get effectively randomized [16:48] so it didn't zero them it just left a random pointer dangling when handing off to the disk?! [16:48] exactly yes [16:48] that's nuts [16:48] and it only happens when there's more than four extents for a file [16:49] extents = what you would call fragments [16:49] so it only happens when your 1TB disk gets really full of important files [16:49] how many bay unit and what RAID config? [16:49] it only has 1 disk in it [16:49] i don't know exactly which unit, but an old one [16:50] so you're only going to hit the bug when you've got loads of data that you cannot lose [16:50] diddledan yeah :( [16:50] luckily it's an easy fix... just zero those bits [16:50] well i hope that works anyway [16:50] fingers crossed [16:51] basically ext4 didn't exist when this thing was made [16:51] i've always gone Synology but always seen those QNAPs around [16:51] i take it it's an abandoned unit support wise? [16:51] it has a 2.6.12.6 kernel with the ext3 48 bit patch set, which is like ext4 alpha version before it was even called ext4 [16:51] so they were trying to allow their units to cope with larger filesystems than default ext3 allowed? [16:52] yeah [16:52] and larger files too [16:52] sounds like the kind of thing that should've been labelled beta [16:52] i recently bought a netgear nas [16:52] seems okay [16:52] well this QNAP seemed okay for like however many years... [16:52] there's file on it from 2005 [16:53] :( === JamesTai1 is now known as JamesTait [16:58] how do the Netgears handle the OS? the lower end 2-bay Synologys, you put them on the network with the disks in then the software gets loaded from your PC onto the disks [16:58] so there's not so much built in storage for the OS portion [17:00] I know the single-drive netgears that come with the drive embedded put the OS on a linux mdraid-1 parition pair with the rest of the disk partitioned for the owner to use === alan_g is now known as alan_g|EOD [17:02] partition pair on single bay? 0o [17:02] so they RAID-mirror in two partitions on a single physical disk? [17:02] yup [17:02] that's horrible [17:08] daftykins: ldd? [17:10] my netgear came with no disks [17:10] Azelphur: don't worry, just the comment of someone who doesn't have a clue i think [17:10] so i assume there's some onboard flash storage [17:10] lol [17:10] popey: ah so it had the full web admin etc? [17:10] yes [17:10] quite natty [17:10] the synologys just have enough to accept the OS to get thrown at it once disks are in, pretty novel [17:12] daftykins: it might be PXE-style boot-up where there is ONLY enough code to fire up the network and transfer a file and run that in-memory [17:12] PXE boot-roms are usually in the order of a couple hundred KB [17:14] sounds about right [17:14] enough to grab a lease then sit and wait [17:16] the web admin thing on the netgear is quite nice [17:16] and it can pretend to be an apple time machine target [17:16] which is handy [17:18] pretty sure they all can now [17:19] seems you can even make ones that don't do it, by just mounting a disk then creating the appropriate image file [17:19] ooh that reminds me, i was checking a clients backup when i saw that it'd given up since _May_ [17:19] nice work Time Machine [17:24] did it not raise a stink when it stopped working or were those warnings ignored by user? [17:35] ;] [17:35] done most my boring chores today [17:37] wax on, wax off [17:37]