[00:12] <pleia2> wrangled people from social media into submitting bugs re: the flyer \o/ https://bugs.launchpad.net/xubuntu-marketing
[00:12] <pleia2> knome: be very nice to them, they are fragile and new ;)
[00:13] <pleia2> I really like the idea of including the pronunciation of xubuntu on the flyer
[00:14] <pleia2> QR codes is a good idea too
[00:15] <knome> mhm
[00:15] <knome> got to reply them tomorrow
[03:40] <Unit193> bluesabre: d/control in xubuntu-artwork, need to update vcs-browser.
[10:27] <knome> pleia2, i was wondering late last night if we could do the flyer in docbook so we could allow translations more easily :P
[13:57] <flocculant> knome: how do we want to go about referencing external web data (specifically bits of bluesabre's bug post) 
[14:03] <knome> it's ok to simply link there
[14:03] <knome> unless you want to copy it over - then we'll likely want to use <blockquote>
[14:03] <knome> (unless it's a short quote)
[14:03] <flocculant> mmk 
[14:04] <flocculant> just want the reporting manually with PPA bits 
[14:04] <flocculant> https://smdavis.us/2015/06/18/bug-reporting-in-xubuntu/
[14:04] <knome> you could likely ask bluesabre to add an anchor to the page so you could point to that portion directly
[14:05] <knome> or you can talk with him whether it's ok to copy it as-is to the site and not specifically mention it's by him
[14:05] <flocculant> bluesabre: ^^ that all be way above my pay level :p
[14:05] <flocculant> yep 
[14:05] <flocculant> I'll do some stuff and wait for a comment tomorrow with my first cuppa :)
[14:06]  * knome sighs at web design
[14:06]  * flocculant just sighs at having to work all these things out bit by bit 
[14:06] <flocculant> though I guess they call that learning :D
[14:06] <knome> heh
[14:07] <flocculant> managed to work out nested lists  - so much easier with a pen and paper lol 
[14:07] <knome> haha
[14:07] <knome> nested lists are stupid imp
[14:07] <knome> imo
[14:08] <knome> i mean xml-level
[14:08] <knome> not that multi-level lists itself are stupid
[14:08] <flocculant> right - I understood what you meant :)
[14:08] <knome> there should be some other way to do that as <ul> inside <li>
[14:08] <flocculant> yea
[14:09] <knome> html5 kind of changes how headers are handled
 inside <article> doesn't mean "the biggest header there is on the whole page"
[14:09] <knome> so maybe something like that could be applied to lists
[14:09] <flocculant> I should have all I want to do done today - then I'll leave it for a day or so - then read it all again, then send you my finished thing to look at 
[14:09] <knome> though we don't want to restrict ourselves to any specific deepness of list items..
[14:10] <flocculant> no - though on the other hand too many and it's confusing and probably requires one to rethink what you're trying to say 
[14:10] <knome> of course
[14:10] <knome> but it would still be silly to have that kind of restrictions
[14:10] <flocculant> yea
[14:11] <flocculant> from reading real paper journal articles from degree days - anymore than 3 or 4 and it's "What?" 
[14:11] <knome> yep
[14:11] <knome> same with headers really
[14:17] <flocculant> yea 
[14:17] <flocculant> any sort of 'nesting' is ok until it takes longer to try and understand why someone has nested something 
[14:18] <knome> :)
[14:38] <flocculant> I do quite like this TODO idea in -release of a team being able to start and stop builds
[14:39] <flocculant> a milestone when *we* want one 
[15:14] <flocculant> bluesabre: some discussion went on in -dekstop re the create file and it doesn't open sensibly from about http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2015/09/29/%23ubuntu-desktop.html#t15:50 
[15:15] <knome> bluesabre, i just got a mail re: the shortcut overlay, i told the user to send mail to development list, you'll want to monitor it for a follow-up
[15:16] <flocculant> bluesabre: try http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2015/09/29/%23ubuntu-desktop.html#t14:42 
[15:16] <flocculant> silly old timezones and flocculant 
[15:26] <flocculant> knome: ok - so done my worst with this QA page
[15:27] <flocculant> title city ... 
[15:27] <flocculant> so I will leave it, then look later - then perhaps you could try and find a sensible way to deal with that :)
[15:27] <flocculant> yes you can hate me :p
[15:28] <knome> :D
[15:28] <knome> no, i won't hate you - just send it to me when you're ready and i'll process it
[15:28] <flocculant> heh 
[15:29] <flocculant> though I might try really hard to to get the contents to the top instead of half way down :D
[15:30] <knome> :D
[15:37] <flocculant> also - prior to it going live - I'll give it to https://launchpad.net/~xubuntu-qa to look at :evil: 
[15:43] <flocculant> Unit193: while I think about highlights - going to be doing some major trello revamping *soon* might be better to turn that SwissBot thing off then - likely to be highly annoying for people who look at pings
[15:44] <Unit193> Eg, you?
[15:44] <Unit193> Then, fine, can do.
[15:44] <flocculant> won't annoy me :)
[15:44] <flocculant> but there's likely to be lots happening at the same time(ish) 
[15:45] <Unit193> I personally don't ping on notices.
[15:47] <flocculant> that might be it - lost the old config here :)
[15:47] <Unit193> ~part
[15:59] <Unit193> flocculant: Ping me when you're done.
[16:00] <flocculant> Unit193: heh - not actually started yet :p 
[16:01] <flocculant> but trello stuff lately only seems to come from the QA one - so not a biggy that I can see
[16:03] <Unit193> flocculant: I'm still interested, and also hides xubuntu-[docs|default-settings|seeds|etc] :P
[16:03] <pleia2> knome: having .po files may make it easier, but there's still design work to do to reflow text on the flyer :\
[16:14] <flocculant> Unit193: yea - understood, but given that trello is going to have a whole lot of changing/adding/removing going on pre-X 
[16:15] <flocculant> you should be looking at the source not the bot if you're in QA team - if you're not in QA team - then all you need to know is the finish surely? 
[16:15] <flocculant> I don't care if the bot goes nuts - just giving warning that it's likely to :)
[16:16] <Unit193> Unloaded trello for now, keeps rss feeds.
[16:16] <flocculant> okey doke
[16:17] <Unit193> (As far as bot vs website, one reminds me of the other.)
[16:17] <flocculant> :)
[16:37] <flocculant> bluesabre: seems fix is on the way for that 
[17:49] <knome> pleia2, yep, it should be redone in scribus (at least), but scribus doesn't support .po files really, so it's not an option if we want more or less automatic translations
[17:50] <knome> pleia2, otoh, i don't think there is much to do with docbook about positioning elements to certain places, so the flow would be a bit too free..
[17:51] <Unit193> knome: We believe it's your turn to ping infinity. :D
[18:06] <pleia2> translations are hard
[18:11] <Unit193> More so when you only know Engrish.
[18:16] <knome> pleia2, yep...
[20:37] <ochosi> yeah, that was not a very sustainable kill
[20:43] <ochosi> guess i should've used sudo
[20:46] <ochosi> bluesabre: shite. seems i pushed a slightly outdated patch to xfce4-panel that still contains the old wording ("Switch between panel presets") over "Backup and restore" :(
[20:52] <slickymaster> krytarik, I'll try to see if tomorrow I can manage to have some time to have a proper look at the other stuff you mentioned in another ping of yours regarding the RU translations
[20:52] <krytarik> Ah, nice.
[20:52] <slickymaster> these last few days has been a real rollercoaster for me
[20:52] <ochosi> andrzejr_: ping
[20:53] <xdeveloper> msg NickServ VERIFY REGISTER xdeveloper ipusblusewah
[20:54] <Unit193> /
[20:54] <andrzejr_> ochosi?
[20:55] <ochosi> andrzejr_: i made a small mistake in the patch i sent you (and translators will hate me for it...)
[20:55] <andrzejr_> send a new one :-)
[20:55] <ochosi> it's not a functional problem, but instead of "Switch between panel presets" we decided to go with "Backup and restore" as label
[20:55] <ochosi> sure, can do so now
[20:56] <andrzejr_> I see, if that's all I can do it myself
[20:56] <andrzejr_> do you have git access by now?
[20:56] <ochosi> not yet, i made the mistake of migrating to a new pc and not taking all devel stuff with me
[20:56] <ochosi> because you know, .git can contain many files
[20:57] <ochosi> that was silly, i know that now
[20:57] <ochosi> but that also means i have to set up my gitolite access anew
[20:57] <ochosi> and yeah, that's all
[21:01] <ochosi> so if you can, please push that
[21:04] <andrzejr_> ochosi, the label is already "Backup and restore", it is the tooltip_text that is "Switch between panel presets"
[21:04] <ochosi> great. i should definitely sleep more
[21:04] <ochosi> spectacular double-facepalm
[21:04] <ochosi> andrzejr_: thanks for looking! (and especially thanks for *looking*)
[21:13] <knome> ohai ochosi 
[21:14] <ochosi> hey knome 
[21:20] <knome> ochosi, have you played around with scribus much?
[21:20] <ochosi> nope
[21:21] <knome> right
[21:21] <ochosi> that's for ppl who are too lazy for latex ;)
[21:21] <knome> ok, so if you know latex, why don't you set up us a latex stylesheet for the flyer ...
[21:22] <knome> otoh, latex doesn't really have (good) support for absolutely positioned stuff, or am i wrong?
[21:22] <ochosi> right, flyers
[21:22] <ochosi> yeah, i guess for flyers latex is not the right tool
[21:22] <knome> yeah
[21:22] <knome> scribus doesn't feel like that either...
[21:23] <knome> it really feels that everything there shouts to me that it's for documents
[21:23] <knome> not something that should actually look cool 
[21:23] <ochosi> yeah
[21:23] <ochosi> that's why my first assocation was latex
[21:24] <knome> pleia2, re: flyers, i was looking at doing a scribus version of them, but really, there is *still* flow issus
[21:24] <knome> *issues
[21:24] <pleia2> knome: yeah, I don't think there's any avoiding it
[21:24] <knome> pleia2, or not issues, but the thing is that we *still* want the text to be in certain places, so actually flowing it from box to box isn't really helping 
[21:25] <pleia2> I think we stick with svg and just have a pretty manual process for translations, if people want to do them at all
[21:25]  * pleia2 nods
[21:25] <knome> and inkscape has certain bonuses
[21:25] <knome> like aligning the *bottom* edge of a paragraph to a certain point
[21:25] <knome> not the text area...
[21:26] <knome> it's easy enough to feed stuff to an svg manually
[21:26] <knome> i mean, change placeholder text - or just specific elements with specific text
[21:26] <knome> of course, there is no guarantee that the text will flow nicely
[21:28] <pleia2> yeah
[21:28] <knome> one textbox can also hold different styles in inkscape
[21:29] <knome> if you maintain/update that manually, it can be a pain though
[21:29] <knome> at least if you mess it up - there is no way to get it back except either undoing or knowing what the settings were
[21:30] <ochosi> Unit193: how're your WIP workitems going for w?
[21:30] <Unit193> None that I know of?
[21:31] <ochosi> Unit193: http://tracker.xubuntu.org/#tab-details/a=unit193+sort=assignee+sortdir=asc
[21:31] <knome> ;>
[21:32] <Unit193> Meh, those are all out of my control.
[21:32] <Unit193> Nothing I can do, so done I suppose.
[21:32] <ochosi> then fix the workitems
[21:33] <ochosi> but also, if those things haven't been implemented yet, we need to either add new workitems that make more sense or add bugreports to track them or port them over to x
[21:33] <Unit193> >_<
[21:34] <ochosi> yup, school of hard knocks.
[21:36] <knome> pleia2, you know, i just figured, svg is xml, and xml2po creates pot file from xml files, and can merge po files into xml (including svg) files...
[21:36] <knome> pleia2, so we can totally have translation templates for the flyer, and even make then translatable in launchpad
[21:37] <knome> pleia2, then we can look at the po files and convert them automatically to a relatively good shape
[21:37] <knome> pleia2, and then fix manually the rest - if needed
[21:40] <bluesabre> so many pings
[21:40] <bluesabre> evening all
[21:40] <Unit193> Howdy.
[21:41] <bluesabre> flocculant, knome: by all means, use that content
[21:48] <pleia2> knome: ok
[21:49] <knome> that does require some changes to the sources
[21:50] <knome> but not too large ones
[21:53] <knome> from bug 1500655: "from a marketing point of view it may be worth pointing out that this distro is suitable for brand new users as well as experienced tinkerers"
[21:53] <knome> from the flyer: "The Xubuntu desktop covers both ends of the usability spectrum: the default settings are carefully selected to produce unified and simple experience for the novice while allowing a full range of customizations for the advanced user."
[21:53] <knome> am i missing something here?
[21:53] <knome> or tbe, are they missing something?
[21:55] <pleia2> maybe they just glanced over that bit :)
[21:57] <knome> yeah well, it's hard to take a 9-point list seriously if they just glanced over the flyer
[21:57]  * knome grins
[22:05] <pleia2> they had some good ideas
[22:05] <pleia2> I'm certainly taking it seriously
[22:06] <knome> yeah yeah, i'm just being grumpy ;)
[22:06] <pleia2> grumpyknome
[22:06] <knome> well somebody needs to be
[22:06] <knome> otherwise we end up doing whatever people ask!!
[22:07] <pleia2> :P
[22:52] <ali12341> perhaps they didn't notice the flyer has two pages?
[22:52] <ali12341> i didnt...
[22:56] <ali12341> also that sentence has a grammar error
[23:01] <knome> well i just turned my telepathy module off for the night, but maybe i'll catch that thought later.
[23:03] <ali12341> don't worry i'm making a list
[23:03] <knome> thanks.
[23:29] <ali12341> is "ubuntu" really an *ancient* african word?
[23:40] <Luyin> I believe it's current zulu, but this would be better suited in an off-topic channel ;)
[23:41] <ali12341> it's not off topic, the xubuntu flyer i'm proof reading literally claims it is ancient
[23:41] <ali12341> best i can tell it's not ancient at all
[23:42] <Luyin> well then I'd say it's wrong