[05:13] jolly good morning all [08:07] good morning === ubuntiste-msakni is now known as elacheche [09:36] does the copyright on a website cover the html/css/js or other code? php? [09:37] magespawn: Good question. [09:37] I think each file is supposed to have a copyright in its header technically. [09:37] Because of the obvious ambiguity. [09:39] yes, so if you are a developer could you develope a website for somebody else and retain copyright on the code, and leave the content copyright with the site owner or a third party? [09:40] any ip lawyers in the house? [09:40] speak to a lawyer for legal advice [09:42] thatgraemeguy: they usually charge for any advice, which is to be expected, just thought i would ask the question, see if anyone had experience or thoughts [09:42] magespawn: Well, even if it's not a website, you are supposed to have copyright headers at the top of your source files. [09:42] main.c etc... [09:42] see i'd disagree, because copyright doesn't need to be declared [09:43] thatgraemeguy: Have you read the GPL? :) [09:43] and that's exactly why legal advice should never be sought on a random gathering of random people :) [09:43] so any programming should have the copyright licence notice, GPL or other, included? [09:43] thatgraemeguy: Sure, we're not lawyers, but it's useful to have a discussion, surely. [09:43] ok, enjoy [09:43] magespawn: Hold on a minute, we're not giving you the absolute truth here. [09:44] First, read the license. [09:44] I have read the GPLv2 license. [09:44] I successfully shamed a Kenyan hardware company to release their source code. [09:44] so you should obey the rules of the licence you use [09:44] https://mjanja.ch/2015/05/brck-in-violation-of-the-gpl/ [09:44] i remember stickyboy [09:44] is it useful to have a discussion when not a single one of the discussion participants is a domain expert? [09:45] thatgraemeguy: I don't work in absolutes. [09:45] Even a panel of experts can have an idiot. [09:45] We're just discussing. Relax. :) [09:45] What are we here for? To talk about the weather? [09:45] maybe some have experience, that was the main point of asking [09:45] nice and sunny here, thanks [09:45] magespawn: My first advice is to read the licese you're applying. [09:46] I don't need to be a lawyer to tell you that. [09:46] if a group of diesel mechanics are discussing medical issues, it'd be rather daft for any of them to base a future decision on the results of the discussion [09:46] right stickyboy [09:47] GPLv2 license text has a section that says "How to Apply These Terms to Your New Programs". [09:47] That's a good starting point for the GPL. [09:47] of course thatgraemeguy, but it might give them a point of reference when they do go to speak to a professional [09:47] I don't know what license you're going to use. [09:47] We don't even know if the GPL is enforceable in court. [09:47] -_- [09:47] thanks stickyboy, i had not thought about it, until recently [09:48] stickyboy: that is a good point, this is when we need a lawyer [09:48] or at least an ip expert [09:49] Well yesterday the IP expert at our research institute concluded that it is impossible to have CC-BY-SA and allow commercial use of a work. She thinks "Share Alike" limits commercial use. [09:49] Yet Creative Commons' own website states the opposite. [09:49] So an IP expert isn't an absolute litmus test. [09:50] IP "expert" let me say. ;) [09:50] as always [09:50] But this was our top legal officer. [09:50] some of these issues are only resloved through the courts, and sometimes no even conclusively then [09:51] s/no/not [09:53] I prefer to give my stuff away. [09:53] Or license it so that I don't have to be a policeman. [09:53] stickyboy: i can see how that might work, in that most commercial work is not allowed to be shared, so you might have to specify which part is CC-BY-SA, so that people can share that part only [09:54] magespawn: Regarding the CC-BY-SA, we were talking about publications from our publicly-funded research institute. What is a derivative work of a publication? [09:54] i think with code it would be hard to enforce for 'small' sections of code, rather than whole programs. [09:55] stickyboy: sometimes the people providing the funding would expect ownership [09:55] For example, taking some text about some breakthrough in Cassava diseases, translating it into Xhosa, putting it in a book, and selling it. [09:55] In this instance, CC-BY-SA doesn't mean "Give the book away for $0" [09:56] It means "you should allow people to make photo copies of it, to write blog posts containing excerpts of the text, etc" [09:56] And I argued that, as a publicly-funded institute, this is part of our mandate. [09:57] yes, and if they want to reprint and sell their version they can do so with out paying licence fees, but by passing along the same conditions [10:02] Yes. [10:02] I hope that I managed to convince the IP people. [10:03] I was copied in rather late in their discussion, and it seems they had already decided on their limiting view. [10:03] they might be motivated by the people paying the bills [10:10] magespawn: People paying the bills are literally tax payers. [10:10] Like I said, we're publicly funded. :) [10:10] US gov, Canadian gov, Swedish, UK, Australia, etc. [10:11] Then Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation, who has a strict policy on open access: http://www.gatesfoundation.org/How-We-Work/General-Information/Open-Access-Policy [10:11] Sadly they recommend CC-BY only. [11:23] Yo! [11:23] Why here is no pics from ZA for the wikilovesafrica competition!! → https://twitter.com/MounirTouzri1/status/658393034615365633 ??!!!! [11:24] there* [13:41] auf wieder sehn [15:34] Kilos, Why there is no pics from ZA for the wikilovesafrica competition!! → https://twitter.com/MounirTouzri1/status/658393034615365633 ??!!!! [15:35] oh [15:36] inetpro superfly Cryterion and aother clever peeps ^^ [15:37] wow elacheche so many pics there already [15:37] you trying to win [15:38] what is the prize [15:40] no idea Kilos :D I'm not a photographer :p :D [15:40] lol [15:41] :) [18:34] evening all [18:34] long time [19:08] night all.sleep tight [19:32] superfly [19:32] how you doing [19:34] hey captine [19:34] fine, but busy [19:34] how are you? [19:44] busy [19:44] very busy [19:44] been a tough 6 months [19:51] gotto run [19:51] cheers all [20:20] moo [20:27] baa