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dholbachgood morning08:35
lpotterSleep_Walker: there is an app in ubuntu store called SensorStatus. it has some detailed info on the gps08:57
Sleep_Walkerlpotter: thanks, I already found that one08:57
=== john-mca` is now known as john-mcaleely
Sleep_Walkerproblem is that it seems that GPS is not always working08:58
Sleep_WalkerI brought it up be enabling it and rebooting phone08:58
tvossSleep_Walker, why do you think the gps is not working?08:59
tvossmpt, o/08:59
Sleep_Walkerbecause I can't see any dot on map for really long time, I can't see any data in Sensor Status09:00
Sleep_Walkerreally long time means ~1 hour09:01
tvossSleep_Walker, are you indoors?09:01
tvossSleep_Walker, which device and image are you using?09:01
tvossmpt, is ` an apostrophe?09:01
Sleep_WalkerAquaris E4.5, OTA-8, 20151118.209:02
lpottertvoss: is agps supported?09:02
Sleep_WalkerI'm not sure which numbers are relevant here09:02
tvosslpotter, sure, depends on the image and device, though09:02
tvossSleep_Walker, do you have an active data connection? is wifi enabled?09:03
Sleep_Walkerphone was behind the window09:03
tvossSleep_Walker, are you happy to shell into the phone?09:03
Sleep_Walkerabsolutely :)09:03
tvossSleep_Walker, mind running  sudo ubuntu-location-serviced-cli --bus system --test and pastebinning the output?09:04
mpttvoss, no, that’s a backtick. A typographical apostrophe ’ is U+201909:04
* tvoss searches keyboard09:05
=== psivaa-afk is now known as psivaa
=== davmor2_ is now known as davmor2
mpttvoss, with the “English (Macintosh)” layout it’s Option + Shift + ]. Not so easy in non-Mac layouts, unfortunately.09:06
tvossSleep_Walker, please note that the test may take some time as it tries to get a gps fix three times from cold start (without aiding data)09:07
tvossmpt, correct?09:08
Sleep_WalkerI'm preparing WiFi connection to do the test through SSH09:09
tvossSleep_Walker, didn't you have one before?09:09
Sleep_Walkermy test was yesterday in the evening09:09
Sleep_Walker<unimportant>and at that time I was on different network </unimportant>09:10
tvossSleep_Walker, ah okay09:10
Sleep_Walkerbtw. is there something like xdotool for Mir?09:13
Sleep_WalkerI miss such tool very much09:13
tvossSleep_Walker, nope, on purpose :) That being said, you can certainly come up with your own input method to support the use case09:14
tvossSleep_Walker, on purpose as it leverages a testing api in X. We would rather encourage developers to plug into the input method channels for such use-cases09:15
Sleep_WalkerI'm still too far from ubuntu sdk and ubuntu touch api so any solution already made could save me time :/09:16
tvossSleep_Walker, nothing available, yet09:20
* mcphail is giving up on OTA8 and trying rc-proposed09:22
tvossmcphail, which issue(s) are you facing?09:23
mcphailtvoss: awful battery life09:23
tvossmcphail, do you use tweakgeek?09:23
mcphailtvoss: I did, but I've tried without tweakgeeking anything09:24
tvossmcphail, okay, do you use the music app routinely?09:24
mcphailis tweakgeek a problem?09:25
mcphailtvoss: not every day. Didn't use it yesterday but still had rapid discharge09:25
tvossmcphail, okay, did you file a bug?09:26
mcphailtvoss: I filed a bug against the most frequent finding in my syslog (clock app) in case that was the cause of the battery drain09:26
tvossmcphail, got link?09:26
ubot5Ubuntu bug 1519543 in Ubuntu Clock App "Syslog full of spam from alarm settings - is this draining battery?" [Undecided,New]09:27
mpttvoss, yes, that’s the one09:29
tvossmpt, :) shift+alt gr+N09:29
tvossmpt, mp is updtaed09:30
tvossupdated, even09:30
tvossSleep_Walker, any update from the test?09:32
=== Guest74213 is now known as pixel_
=== mariogrip_ is now known as mariogrip
Sleep_Walkersorry, I was out09:47
Sleep_Walkerlet me check09:47
Sleep_Walkertvoss: ^^09:49
Sleep_Walkertest looks good, it would make sense to tell me which data would be interesting in case of GPS failure so I will collect it next time the problem re-appears09:50
tvossSleep_Walker, you want to hand me the output of 'sudo dmesg', 'sudo /system/bin/logcat', all /var/log/ubuntu-location* files, and which app you used for testing09:51
Sleep_WalkerOK, I'll prepare script for such case, thanks09:51
Sleep_Walkerand btw. - I'd love to use Activity Tracker but when I switch the phone off, it stops logging - is there something I could do about that?09:52
bee_keeperHi - anyone here using the telgram app?  I'm able to search and add bots using web interface but not the app - am i missing something?09:52
=== JoseeAntonioR is now known as jose
tvossSleep_Walker, the behavior is intentional, we are evaluating if/how we can support such use cases without causing excessive battery drain10:00
davmor2bee_keeper: might not be implemented yet, they went for basic compatibility with the old app, now they can add new features to it with relative ease with the new back end10:00
davmor2bee_keeper: you might want to double check though on #ubuntu-telegram10:01
Sleep_Walkertvoss: I understand your point, but I somehow miss the freedom of choice in that10:01
tvossSleep_Walker, sure, I can see that point, too. But: integrating both is an art, without impacting the UX for the non-tech-savvy user10:01
Sleep_Walkertvoss: there should be switch - Give me full control [on/off] ;)10:02
mpthmm, upower -d is not very grep-friendly10:02
tvossSleep_Walker, sure, what means full control, though ;)10:02
tvossSleep_Walker, so yeah, under investigation, takes time10:03
bee_keeperdavmor2: ok, thanks10:03
Sleep_Walkertvoss: thanks for caring about that10:03
mptSleep_Walker, see bug 151432910:03
ubot5bug 1514329 in location-service (Ubuntu) "Applications should be able to setup and subscribe to geo fence events" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/151432910:03
tvossmpt, that's not exactly the same :)10:03
tvossmpt, it enables another class of use cases, though10:04
mpttvoss, not necessarily, but “wake me up for a moment when I hit the fence” would be10:04
mptAnd I doubt geofences would be that useful otherwise10:04
tvossmpt, well, activity tracker really is about ongoing monitoring of certain aspects of the system. you could "abuse" geofences to implement that monitoring, but I'm not a fan of that idea :)10:05
Sleep_Walkermpt: thanks10:05
Sleep_WalkerI added myself as affected user10:06
mpttvoss, according to the store description it’s about monitoring your activity, not the system’s10:07
tvossSleep_Walker, you are not really affected by that specific bug, but feel free10:07
tvossmpt, sure, that involve's monitoring the system's location for example10:08
mptI don’t think a geofence is an abusive way to track the system’s location :-P10:08
tvossmpt, seriously, you are confusing two concepts here10:09
pixel_Saviq, done http://i.imgur.com/kvNKMvO.jpg but now the fake browser's controls are under the top bar, i can't minimize it.10:21
Saviqmzanetti, bug #1438465 ↑?10:22
ubot5bug 1438465 in unity8 (Ubuntu) "A window dragged under the panel can't be dragged out again" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/143846510:22
JamesTaitGood morning all; happy Monday, and happy Computer Security Day! 😃10:23
pixel_Saviq, i also get a lot of binding loop detected when i resize the unity8's window file:///home/pixel/unity8a/trunk/qml/Stages/SurfaceContainer.qml:54:5: QML MirSurfaceItem: Binding loop detected for property "surfaceWidth"10:23
Saviqpixel_, isn't it maximized, though? if you click on it?10:23
mzanettiSaviq, hmm... not sure10:23
mzanettithere have been lots of changes lately...10:24
mzanetti yeah... indeed10:24
mzanettiso far no issue on the screenshot10:24
Saviqpixel_, ah, browser is fullscreen is all10:24
pixel_Saviq, if i click on it http://i.imgur.com/lLAFuA4.png10:25
pixel_yep, the fake browser is fullscreen10:27
Saviqpixel_, you can drag the launcher in, long-press on the browser icon to get "Close"10:27
Saviqmzanetti, we should have window controls in panel for fullscreen apps, fwiw ↑10:27
mzanettiSaviq, no10:27
mzanettiSaviq, fullscreen on a desktop is fullscreen10:27
mzanettipress F11 on firefox10:28
Saviqmzanetti, yes, but you can pull the panel n10:28
Saviqmzanetti, I'm not saying it should be always on screen10:28
Saviqbut when you pull it down10:28
mzanettipull it down?10:28
Saviqmzanetti, when fullscreen, you can still go top-edge-swipe for the panel10:28
Saviqmzanetti, we might enable top-edge-push with mouse, too, TBD10:29
mzanettiah, with touch10:29
mzanettiSaviq, at least firefox on X11 uses top edge stuff on its own10:29
Saviqmzanetti, yeah, we want it to stop, because it's hell inconsistent everywhere10:29
Saviqmzanetti, that's what I prototyped and showed off back in Dallas10:30
Saviqaanyway, before we get there10:30
Saviqsince you can get the panel, it'd be nice for the window controls to be there :)10:30
ogra_hmm, is it my eayes or did the panel color just chane by a small nuance with todays rc-proposed upgrade ?10:40
mzanettiogra_, it did change10:40
pixel_ogra_,  and the orange line is gone10:40
ogra_it so minimal that i thought its my brain or so :)10:40
ogra_oh, yeah, thats sad, i liked it10:41
pixel_ogra, you can add it back :D (1 line of qml)10:41
ogra_nah, i'm not *that* attached to it :)10:42
tvossmardy, I'm tempted to drop http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~phablet-team/location-service/15.04/view/head:/src/location_service/com/ubuntu/location/time_based_update_policy.cpp from the default engine configuration11:06
tvossmardy, rationale: I don't think the service is the right place to do the right thing for *all* applications consuming position updates11:06
tvossmardy, we could probably think about providing example code to carry out low-pass filtering on the client side, though11:07
tvossmardy, what do you think?11:07
=== vrruiz_ is now known as rvr
=== chihchun is now known as chihchun_afk
elasrofxelamy port finally booting but with no graphics11:21
elasrofxelaany idea what to do next?11:22
mardytvoss: it might need some adjustment, but I think that the server side should do that kind of filtering11:22
tvossmardy, I think we are not clever enought for that tbh, we would have to do the heavy lifting of fusing with sensor data11:23
mardytvoss: I cannot imagine the apps being more clever, TBH :-)11:23
tvossmardy, well, not right now, but I'm thinking along the lines of a full-blown navigation app11:24
mardytvoss: what problems do you see with the current code?11:25
mardytvoss: I also see some problems, but I want to see if we find the same ones :-)11:26
mardytvoss: the problem I see is that if the update is coming from the same provider which gave us the last valid update, we should never filter it out11:27
tvossmardy, that's one issue: the other is the timeout parameter, which is notoriously difficult to choose11:28
mardytvoss: so, for example, it's fine to filter out wifi-based results when they are less accurate than the GPS, but if the last update was from the GPS and now we get a more inaccurate update again from the GPS, we should not filter it11:28
tvossmardy, sure, I agree with that11:28
tvossmardy, the other bit is: we really should decrease the accuracy of the last update to age it out11:28
mardytvoss: and if we move this logic to the client, we should also extend our signals to include some info about the source of the update11:29
tvossmardy, and that is something I would like to avoid11:29
mardytvoss: yep11:29
mardytvoss: indeed, I think that if we don't get new updates from the providers, we should still continuing emitting updates to the client, reusing the last known position with decreased accuracy11:30
mardytvoss: BTW, the Qt API allows to specify an update interval; we don't have that in the platform API, do we?11:31
tvossmardy, it's hidden, but we have it11:31
mardytvoss: so, back to the original point: I think that that code needs some improvements, and might need to be moved in the session class, if we find a reason for which different apps would want it to behave differently; but I strongly feel that it should stay in the server side11:33
tvossmardy, okay, so I think a reasonable first step would be to (a.) move to session (not making it configurable right now), (b.) expose enough information to ensure that chains of updates from individual providers are always accepted and propagated11:35
mardytvoss: ok11:35
tvossmardy, (a.) would give us the opportunity to also integrate a timer that samples the reference position at the requested interval (either faster or slower than actual updates)11:35
mardytvoss: indeed, as well as obfuscating the real position to apps that shouldn't be allowed to get an accurate position (in in the future we implement such a policy)11:37
tvossmardy, yup11:37
tvossmardy, sounds good. ssweeny might take that one once he finishes the async provider stuff11:37
mardytvoss: as for (B), after thinking over your suggestion that we should decrease the accuracy of the last update as it ages, I think it might not be needed11:38
tvossmardy, well, if the provider delivers faster than expected interval, we sample at a slower pace11:39
tvossmardy, which we wouldn#t do in the "aging out" scenario11:39
mardytvoss: right11:40
tvossmardy, so I think we want a simple Sampler that is periodically invoked11:42
mardytvoss: maybe, but I wouldn't like a wake-up timer... I mean, we shouldn't cause more wake-ups than now11:44
mardytvoss: just thinking about battery :-)11:44
vitimitiI'm trying to build and run the Unity 8 shell following this tutorial over here: https://unity.ubuntu.com/getinvolved/development/unity8/ but I get an initctl error saying the unity8 process is unknown: http://paste.ubuntu.com/13573548/ Somebody knows how to fix this problem?11:45
tvossmardy, well, *if* the session is active, we have to satisfy the client requirement11:46
tvossmardy, in which case we need the sampler11:47
tvossmardy, it obviously shouldn't run if the session is not active11:47
mardytvoss: I mean, suppose that the client wants an update every second, and the GPS gives us an update every 0.97 seconds11:50
tvossmardy, in which case the GPS is running and the additional cost of just having an additional wakeup is moot :)11:50
mardytvoss: OK, s/GPS/wifi or whatever :-)11:51
tvossmardy, still :)11:51
mardytvoss: I mean, we should hand out updates when we have them11:51
tvossmardy, which is not what the client would expect11:51
tvossmardy, *if* we support the frequency flag11:51
nhainesOoh, I just flashed my Nexus 7 with ubuntu-touch/rc-proposed/ubuntu-pd.  I like it!  What is it?  :)11:52
mardytvoss: well, the client doesn't really have a say in that, it's just a preference11:52
tvossmardy, that's not what the qt api suggests, though, iirc11:52
mardytvoss: at least the Qt documentation explicitly says that updates could come at any frequency11:52
tvossokay, that's difficult to me, tbh11:53
tvosseither we support it, or not :)11:53
nhainesRegardless, the Unity 8 theme looks very nice and the window manipulation is nice.  The Browser handling touch and mouse different is perfect and I could completely imagine working with the tablet as an impromptu pocket desktop.  Which also now I think I know what -pd means.11:53
tvossin the sense that: if we support the flag we should implement it such that a developer can rely on the frequency11:53
* tvoss claps :)11:53
=== Celtor is now known as vitimiti
nhainesAnd if *that's* what it is, well, I'm sad that the legacy apps icons are only mockups.  :)  But seriously, there's plenty of polish still needed (as always with these things, that comes last) but it's a giant leap ahead of OTA-8.  Very impressive.11:55
mardytvoss: I think we should take the desired interval from all the connected the clients, and start computing updates at a frequency acceptable to all (the minimum among them, I guess)11:57
mardytvoss: the if the means that we are waking up every second, but we have one client which only cares for updates every 5 seconds, we can let that client skip some updates11:58
mardytvoss: but the main point, is that we should have only one internal timer, and not a timer for each client11:58
tvossmardy, let me think about that. I like the idea of the minimum frequency, which we could also propagate to providers (the gps chipset driver supports setting that value)11:59
tvossmardy, so how would you force propagation of updates at a later point then?12:00
tvossmardy, per session, that is12:00
mardytvoss: actually, something like internal_frequency = max(1sec, max_common_divisor([freq_client1, ..., fre_client_N]))12:00
tvossmardy, okay, so you propose to reuse the tick of the system, and update per client every frequency / internal_frequency tick12:01
mardytvoss: yes12:01
tvossmardy, where frequency is the client-specific frequency12:01
mardyyes, so for every session we store the time of the last update (to that session), and the desired frequency12:02
mardytvoss: if enough time has passed, we deliver the update, otherwise we don't12:03
tvossmardy, that still leaves us with a fuzzy statement to developers, though12:04
mardytvoss: why do you think so? we could still be quite precise with timely delivering updates12:44
tvossmardy, that depends on the setup of all clients12:44
mardytvoss: well, indeed the first update they receive could come anytime within the first second, but any later update would come at regular intervals from the first12:45
=== pixel__ is now known as pi||aw
mcphailMy car still can't see my phone via bluetooth, depite running rc-proposed as per https://lists.launchpad.net/ubuntu-phone/msg16864.html . Is there any way to debug this?12:53
davmor2mcphail: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebuggingBluetooth12:54
mcphaildavmor2: embarrassingly, I just found that link at the bottom of the link I posted ;)12:56
davmor2mcphail: yeah I thought it was in there :)12:56
=== alan_g is now known as alan_g|lunch
m0n5t3r_1does anyone have an idea what this means? (from xsession-errors):13:15
m0n5t3r_1upstart: Failed to spawn application-click (com.ubuntu.terminal_terminal_0.7.140) main process: unable to switch security profile: No such file or directory13:15
=== m0n5t3r_1 is now known as m0n5t3r
ogra_looks like you are trying to run a click app without having the right environment installed13:16
m0n5t3rit started doing this not long ago, then I flashed rc-proposed 191 an hour ago and stuff worked; then after it rebooted itself once or twice it's doing it again13:20
m0n5t3rdefine "the right environment"13:20
ogra_it is a phone app13:22
ogra_so you need a phone environment13:22
ogra_with all the lockdowns and security bits13:22
m0n5t3rthe only differences from the base thing is /etc/hosts (because no other way to block ads) and /etc/apparmor.d/tunables/global (a line allowing read from /etc/writable/hosts)13:22
m0n5t3rit is a bq aquaris phone, so I guess that counts as a phone environment13:23
ogra_you cant run click apps on a desktop witout a lot of tinkering with apparmor and friends13:23
m0n5t3rnot desktop13:23
ogra_you said .xsession-errors13:23
ogra_there is no X on phoes13:24
m0n5t3r... but there is an .xsession-errors in /home/phablet13:24
m0n5t3rI guess it's a standard thing so unity puts output there13:25
ogra_not really13:25
nhainesogra_: do you know what ubuntu-touch/rc-proposed/ubuntu-pd is?  Does it replace ubuntu-touch/rc-proposed on flo? :)  (If not, MultiROM Manager is being weird again.)13:25
ogra_no idea where it comes from or why anything would write to it13:25
ogra_nhaines, ask sil2100 ... no idea what it is13:25
nhainessil2100!  :)13:26
ogra_m0n5t3r, the actual log you are interested in is in ~/.cache/upstart somewhere13:26
sil2100nhaines: hey! ubuntu-pd is the pocket-desktop experimentation channel13:26
ogra_ignore ~/.xession-errors13:26
nhainessil2100: sounds like just the thing to take up room on my Nexus 7.  Unfortunately, Bluetooth is broken on the N7 (in OTA-8 too, not just the pd channel).  When can I expect Libertine to show?  :)13:27
sil2100nhaines: pocket-desktop is nothing more than ubuntu-touch + libertine and puritine13:27
nhainessil2100: Then Unity 8 snuck in some really nice window manipulation stuff when I wasn't looking. :)13:27
sil2100nhaines: yeah, the PD effort is being worked on actively ;)13:28
m0n5t3rogra_: nothing useful shows up in any .cache/upstart log13:29
m0n5t3rjust unity8 saying it started the terminal, and then that the terminal exited13:29
ogra_m0n5t3r, and you see that when just tapping on the terminal icon ?13:29
mcphailhow do I copy/paste from the terminal app?13:29
ogra_weird ...13:29
m0n5t3rnot only the terminal13:29
m0n5t3rnothing works apart from the browser13:30
nhainessil2100: it's a giant step up from the rc-proposed stuff.  I was quite pleasantly suprised.  If LibreOffice Writer ran and Bluetooth worked, I could really use my N7 on the go!  :)13:30
m0n5t3rI'm guessing something crashes13:30
ogra_that sounds like you broke your apparmor installation13:30
m0n5t3rgtg, back in a few hours13:30
ogra_did you install any debs, make it writable or anything like that ?13:30
ogra_out of diskspace ?13:30
m0n5t3rjust a line in apparmor.d/tunables saying "/etc/writable/hosts r"13:31
nhainessil2100: is there any way I can try out libertine using the -pd channel?13:31
ogra_you edited apparmor.d/tunables ??13:31
ogra_like ... directly ?13:31
* mpt turns off Hotspot and the phone restarts13:32
mptWell that‘s weird13:32
ogra_thats not the place to make something writable13:32
m0n5t3rmount / -o remount,rw; vi tunables, add line, save; mount / -o remount,ro; reboot13:32
ogra_yeah, that broke all your apprmor profiles13:32
nhainesmpt: that seems like an extremely dramatic way to disable hotspot access.  :)13:32
sil2100nhaines: best if you reach out bregma or kgunn regarding the usage of the ubuntu-pd channel, they're the ones working on the libertine/puritine effort13:32
m0n5t3rit's correct13:32
nhainessil2100: <313:32
sil2100They would know best regarding that ;)13:33
ogra_m0n5t3r, you would have to regenerate them somehow13:33
m0n5t3rdoesn't it do that on reboot?13:33
ogra_m0n5t3r, and hacking apparmor is not the way to make something writable13:33
m0n5t3rit is a way to make /etc/writable/hosts readable13:33
ogra_you want to edit /etc7system-image/writable-paths13:33
ogra_huh ?13:33
m0n5t3rreally gtg13:33
ogra_/etc/hosts is definitely readable13:33
ogra_else nothing would work :)13:34
ogra_(and is a link to the file in 7etc7writable)13:34
vishnudevHello guys13:34
kgunnnhaines: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1gfLy7cBHHwZXD0t74tqYpHvw60W5nc_qJoYUiU4A6mo/edit13:34
vishnudevhow to install ubuntu touch on nexus 7 2012?13:34
kgunnif you want to try13:35
vishnudevhow to install ubuntu touch on nexus 7 2012?13:35
nhainesvishnudev: it is not available for Nexus 7 2012.13:35
nhaineskgunn: fantastic!  I'll be playing with this a *lot* before Ubucon Summit and SCALE.13:36
* popey wonders why his laptop now has ofono installed13:36
popeywell, failed to install13:37
nhaineskgunn: aww, I don't have access to chinstrap.canonical.com.  :)13:38
kgunnsorry about that....13:38
ubot5Ubuntu bug 1521199 in ofono (Ubuntu) "ofono fails to install on xenail desktop" [Undecided,New]13:39
vishnudevnhaines can i build?13:40
nhainesvishnudev: no; there are no graphics drivers available for the hardware.13:40
vishnudevbut how the old builds working?13:42
nhainesAncient version of Ubuntu with a different kernel.13:42
vishnudevtill saucy ?13:42
ogra_and the point is they did not really work due to the driver13:43
ogra_which is why the device was completely dropped ... the driver issues were not fixable13:43
nhaineskgunn: any guesses as to when ubuntu-pd will include puritine?13:44
kgunnnhaines: hopefully before years end...if not, early in the new year13:46
vishnudevI am trying to isntall the old saucy in my nexus 7 201213:47
ogra_for what ?13:47
ogra_nothing will run13:47
vishnudevcan i just flash saucy-preinstalled-touch-armhf.zip and saucy-preinstalled-touch-armel+grouper.zip13:48
vishnudevI just want a device to try developing apps13:48
ogra_you surely can ... but you wont be able to install any apps and the majority oif the preinstalled ones are rater in demo state13:48
nhaineskgunn: Thanks!  I'll try to bum a puritine click off of someone later, when I'm supposed to be awake.  :)13:49
vishnudevits really bad13:50
nhainesIn the meantime, ubuntu-pd is pretty clearly in a development state, but it's a giant leap ahead of the OTA.  It's really impressive.13:50
nhainesSo good job to all involved!13:50
vishnudevI was trying to make a ubuntu touch build for nexus 613:51
vishnudevit failed and now bought a n old nexus 6 2012 in hope of installing ubuntu touch13:51
ogra_nexus 6 ?13:52
ogra_you mean 713:52
vishnudevnexus 613:52
=== alan_g|lunch is now known as alan_g
vishnudevnexus 7 201213:53
ogra_well, you should have asked here first ...13:53
ogra_then you would have been told to buy a 2013 model13:53
ogra_(which has completely different HW)13:54
vishnudevI dint get 2013 here :(13:54
dobeyvishnudev: even if you got the old ubuntu image flashed onto a grouper, it would be so unusable that you wouldn't be able to test any apps on it anyway. and you especially couldn't test any new apps which require newer frameworks14:05
dobeyyou could try the x86 emulator instead14:05
Elleomzanetti: when you get a chance could you test https://code.launchpad.net/~michael-sheldon/ubuntu-keyboard/fix-1451554/+merge/278468 (available in silo 2) and double check it fixes the mouse issues with the OSK in pocket desktop mode?14:44
mzanettiElleo, sure14:45
Elleomzanetti: great, thanks14:46
popeyawe, one for you? :) https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ofono/+bug/152119914:53
ubot5Ubuntu bug 1521199 in ofono (Ubuntu) "ofono fails to install on xenial desktop" [Undecided,New]14:53
awepopey, gee thanks15:01
awewe need to figure out why ofono is being installed by default on the desktop15:01
aweboiko, ^^15:01
popeyi added the aptitude why to it15:01
popeyit shows why it's installed15:01
ogra_is it by default or did popey just install some autopilot15:01
popeysee bug :)15:02
aweit *shouldn't* be default15:02
aweit was a telepathy-related lib in the past that caused this15:02
awe( pretty sure )15:02
ogra_ah, the indicator15:02
awethe network indicator?15:02
awepete-woods, ^^15:02
popeyindicator-network yes15:03
ogra_yeah, it is even a direct dep15:03
ogra_not a recommends or some such15:03
pete-woodsawe: network indicator is not included in the desktop15:05
pete-woodsonly on the phone15:05
pete-woodsbut it does, indeed depend on ofono15:05
awepete-woods, are you sure that's true for xenial?15:07
ubot5Ubuntu bug 1521199 in ofono (Ubuntu) "ofono fails to install on xenial desktop" [Undecided,New]15:07
pete-woodsawe: pretty sure? unless it was newly seeded for some reason15:07
pete-woodsawe: it's not even in main, so if it gets into the desktop image, then that's a problem15:07
=== bremnes_ is now known as bremnes
ogra_i assume popey has ubuntu-sdk-libs installed ... which depends on qtdeclarative5-ubuntu-push-plugin ... which depends on libconnectivity-qt1 which then depends on indicator-network15:16
popeyi do15:17
pete-woodsthat would make sense15:17
pete-woodsit's set up not to start on the desktop (in the upstart session config)15:17
ogra_well, it might be fine, t7he prob is ofono after all15:18
=== lotuspsychje_ is now known as lotuspsychje
=== Ursinha_ is now known as Ursinha
popeyjdstrand_, when I run an app on my device via ubuntu-app-launch, I get a message in dmesg which implies the app is unconfined (it should not be) - what does this mean? It's a bit scary. [Mon Nov 30 15:31:32 2015] type=1400 audit(1448897492.317:88): apparmor="STATUS" operation="profile_load" profile="unconfined" name="com.ubuntu.sudoku_sudoku_1.1.392" pid=19539 comm="apparmor_parser"15:51
tyhickspopey: that audit message is saying that an unconfined process performed an AppArmor profile load15:51
popeytyhicks, not sure I follow :)15:52
jjohansenpopey: its just logging that a profile got loaded, and the confinement information of the task that loaded the profile15:53
tyhickspopey: after the app is running, do a `ps auxZ | grep sudoku` and the first column will be the AppArmor profile that is confining the process15:54
jjohansenin this case, it is the apparmor_parser that is unconfined, not the app run via ubuntu-app-launch15:54
popeymakes sense, thanks chaps!15:57
popeytedg, is there something like ubuntu-app-launch which shows stats for startup of a specific app. Like, I launch calculator then run this thing which tells me how long it took to start up fully?16:02
popeytedg, or is that not measured?16:03
popeymaybe ubuntu-app-watch with some very verbose option?16:04
tedgpopey: It's not measured on a live system. You can enable the LTTng tracepoints and figure it out though.16:04
tedgpopey: But LTTng is blocked by apparmor by default.16:05
popeyah okay.16:05
tedgpopey: So you need to enable it and rebuild the apparmor profiles.16:05
popeyso on a clean phone - flash - enabled LTTng - rebuild apparmor profiles - install app to be tested - run app...16:05
popeyand gather data from ?16:05
=== balloons_ is now known as balloons
popey(or is this documented somewhere?)16:06
tedgpopey: http://gould.cx/ted/blog/Measuring_Upstart_App_Launch_using_LTTng16:06
tedgWow, that blog post is almost two years old.16:07
tedgThey grow up so fast16:07
popeythanks tedg16:08
jdstrand_popey: to save you some time-- adjust these: /usr/share/apparmor/easyprof/templates/ubuntu/1*/* to change this line: 'deny /{,var/}run/shm/lttng-ust-* r,' to be: '/{,var/}run/shm/lttng-ust-* r,'16:09
jdstrand_popey: then run 'sudo aa-clickhook -f'16:09
mwuDoes anybody know how to disable the smartscopes (Amazon, Weather, etc.) in Ubuntu Touch?16:12
tedgBTW, popey I think that brendand was working on something with app startup. Asked me about this recently. You guys might sync.16:13
davmor2mwu: just don't use them16:13
=== jdstrand_ is now known as jdstrand
davmor2mwu: they only search when you are on that scope16:14
mwudavmor2: No, I want to remove them completly from the applications menu16:14
davmor2mwu: they aren't scopes then, they are apps, just long press them and select uninstall16:15
popeyjdstrand, tedg thanks!16:15
mwuIt says that they are installed, but I removed them from the directory /custom/click; but they are still displayed.16:16
k1larent the scopes what make ubuntu touch ubuntu touch?16:17
popeymwu, that's not how you remove things usually.16:18
popeymwu, "sudo click unregister <click name> <version>" is one way16:18
mwucom.ubuntu.weather is hidden for user phablet16:19
popeyyup, that's it.16:20
mwuThat's the error message of the command "click unregister com.ubuntu.weather"16:20
popeythe filesystem is read-only so it's somewhat hard to really actually remove it16:20
popeyand if you did, it will probably come back in an over the air update16:20
mwupopey: You can remount it in read/write mode16:20
popeyi know :)16:20
popeywe generally don't recommend users do that16:21
popeydevelopers, sure. they break stuff all the time16:21
mwuWho creates the file remote-scopes.json?16:26
mwuThis file contains all the links to the scopes I want to remove.16:27
popeymwu, where is that file?16:46
ogra_mwu, you get that error when you use popeys command including the sudo ?16:46
popeythats not an error, that's normal16:46
popeyif you click unregister stuff that is in the ro part of the image you get a "hidden" message16:47
ogra_ah, k ... it does check for the sudo user ?16:47
popeybecause it cant remove the app (ro)16:47
popeydunno what it says without sudo, I only ever run it correctly ;)16:47
ogra_i was confused about the user name being mentioned in the error16:47
popeymwu, ahh, ./.cache/unity-scopes/remote-scopes.json ?16:49
mwu Yes16:49
mwuBut you can delete the file without anything getting broken.16:49
popeywhy delete random files?16:50
ogra_because nothing breaks :)16:51
* popey deletes ogra_ 16:51
popey\o/ nothing broke16:51
mwuBecause I want to find out, how I can remove the scopes Amazon, Ebay, Reddit, etc.16:51
* ogra_ sees the world break 16:51
popeyok, so just do as I said, "sudo click unregister foo version"16:51
mwupopey: But that doesn't remove the scope. It's still displayed as being installed and you can still start it. I would like to remove it completly16:52
davmor2popey: don't delete ogra_ it's breaks my blame script which then default all blame to you instead of ogra_16:53
davmor2ogra_: I need a backup for when you pretend to be on holiday16:54
ogra_well, half of december then16:54
popeymwu, sounds like a bug if you remove something and it doesn't get removed, I'd file a bug..16:55
davmor2mwu: out of interest why?16:55
mwudavmor2: I wan't to remove all things I don't need. I just want a thin smartphone with only email, contacts, calender, instant messaging, browser. Nothing else.16:57
davmor2mwu: but unless you use  them they sit there doing nothing, so you can use the very things you want by just putt them in the launcher and ignoring the scopes completely16:59
davmor2mwu: you can then unfavourite all the scopes you don't use and you won't see them any more17:00
jaywinknot everyone wants "amazon" glaring at them when they scroll the scopes list ;) there defo should be a way to remove any preinstalled stuff ;)17:00
jaywinkthat is a huge flaw in many android phones where preinstalled stuff can't be removed17:00
davmor2jaywink: but it is only active if you open it, and it isn't actually installed it is a remote scope17:01
jaywinkit's still there when you view the scopes list17:01
davmor2jaywink: yes but unless you click on it it does nothing17:01
jaywinkallow users to hide it sounds like a good deal to me :)17:02
davmor2jaywink: it is hidden unless you open the scopes list to switch scopes17:02
jaywinkyes, where it annoys me at least, as it does mwu17:02
jaywinkI personally use the scopes switcher quite a lot to view not often used scopes. It is quicker to have them off and use the switcher than to have them on and scroll one by one17:03
jaywinkso amazon is glaring at me quite often17:03
davmor2jaywink: then file a bug if you haven't17:04
davmor2and if there isn't one already17:04
jaywinksure, just helping mwu drive the point ;)17:05
davmor2jaywink: it isn't though, it is already hidden in the system, it isn't installed so you can't uninstall it, if you hide it and want it later you can't get it back unless there is a hidden section in the scopes manager at which point it would still be listed and have the same effect :D17:08
popeyjdstrand, click-review is crashing on this click for me... http://paste.ubuntu.com/13579250/ - http://people.canonical.com/~alan/docviewer/com.ubuntu.docviewer_0.3.latest_armhf.click any ideas?17:08
jaywinkdavmor2, why isn't it packaged and installed as normal btw anyway? seems odd to hard code some store like amazon into the operating system17:10
mwuMaybe Amazon paid something for that?17:11
davmor2mwu: nope17:12
jaywinkeven worse then ;)17:12
ogra_well, stop complaining ... file a bug instead ;)17:13
ogra_to get it fixed17:13
* jaywink tries to find the right place all the time .. unless mwu has filed it already17:13
ogra_"canonical-system-image" worst case17:14
ogra_thats the meta project17:14
jaywinkok thanks that sounds like a good place :)17:15
mwuOK, now I broke it. Need to restore factory image...17:21
jaywinkmwu, https://bugs.launchpad.net/canonical-devices-system-image/+bug/1521269 <-- if you want to add yourself as affected17:22
ubot5Ubuntu bug 1521269 in Canonical System Image "Certain built in remote scopes cannot be hidden" [Undecided,New]17:22
mwuThanks for the bug and the description.17:24
dobeyjaywink: unity-scopes-shell would probably be the best place for "unable to hide remote scopes"17:27
jaywinkdobey, ah ok, I'll try to move it if I still can17:27
dobeyand it's not "certain built-in remote scopes" it's just remote scopes17:28
dobeythey aren't built-in, they are just remote17:28
jaywinkdobey, well, built-in in the sense that the list is shipped and cannot be changed17:30
JanCand I assume they removed all (unwanted) remote scopes that weren't built-in17:30
m0n5t3r_1ogra_: all right, back home... so, first up: upstart    2073           phablet    2w      REG      179,7     1344      40738 /home/phablet/.xsession-errors17:31
m0n5t3r_1upstart writes to .xsession-errors17:31
m0n5t3r_1after I removed that line and rebooted, things started to work again17:31
m0n5t3r_1I still don't understand why, though17:32
dobeyjaywink: the list is not shipped.17:32
m0n5t3r_1also, /etc/hosts is definitely not a link to /etc/writable/hosts by default, it's a regular file, and17:33
m0n5t3r_1[ 4748.394197] type=1400 audit(1448904742.457:162): apparmor="DENIED" operation="open" profile="webbrowser-app" name="/etc/writable/hosts" pid=11314 comm="WorkerPool/1131" requested_mask="r" denied_mask="r" fsuid=32011 ouid=017:33
jaywinkdobey, where does it come from, queried from a server?17:33
m0n5t3r_1I guess I'll just copy it to /etc/hosts, it's the easiest (albeit unelegant) route17:34
=== m0n5t3r_1 is now known as m0n5t3r
jaywinkbut anyway, the point is that the user should have the choice17:34
dobeythat is your position, yes17:35
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mcphailWell, rc-proposed has been much kinder on my battery than OTA8. Wonder why OTA8 regressed for me?22:04
taiebotHi all i am missing the app text on my phone in the app scope which makes the app scope kind of weird. This is what i have http://i.imgur.com/PFhO5XI.png this is what i should have minus one less icon https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-PImDhABojoM/VlwOTTHxEhI/AAAAAAAAIIo/snSTDzvsD2c/w530-h883-p/screenshot20151130_104953972.png22:37
pmcgowantaiebot, fix in progress https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity-scope-click/+bug/151989322:39
ubot5Ubuntu bug 1519893 in unity8 (Ubuntu) "Apps header is lost after changing filters" [High,In progress]22:39
=== hasselmm1 is now known as hasselmm
dobeyi'm confused22:42
taiebotpmcgowan has also a bug reported about unity8 kind of rotating or stretching on the phone? I have experienced this twice today. I have not been able to reproduce22:42
dobeythe section title22:42
dobeythat's probably a unity8 bug22:43
dobeyoh it is22:43
dobeywhenever anyone mentions that bug, i always think the header text is missing for some reason22:44
pmcgowanyeah albert fixed it22:44
taiebotdobey there should be a glossary somewhere22:44
pmcgowantaiebot, sounds familiar, which device22:44
taiebotpmcgowan nexus 422:45
pmcgowanif I recall its somehow related to the lifecylce management kicking in22:45
taiebotpmcgowan I suppose there is a bug report for it. Thanks.22:47
pmcgowanI think there was22:47
taiebotpmcgowan there was? it s the first time i saw this behaviour and i have been testing "using" this phone extensively what i saw this morning is this http://i.imgur.com/PFhO5XI.png doing almost a 60degree rotation and after stretching halfway across the screen and come back to original position22:51
pmcgowantaiebot, is that the right image?22:52
taiebotpmcgowan did not have time to take a screenshot22:52
pmcgowanI have seen when reselecting an app from the spread that it initially paints wrong, maybe what you saw is different22:53
TimmeyIs it possible to change the mouse pointer speed?23:20

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