[03:59] <SeriouslyLaugh> there should be some kind of karma bot for whoever helped someone in the main support channel
[03:59] <SeriouslyLaugh> or some way for volunteers to be recognized for a successful solve
[04:00] <SeriouslyLaugh> a bot would be annoying probably
[10:42] <lordievader> Good morning.
[12:00] <pauljw> hi everyone
[12:21] <BluesKaj> Hey all
[12:30] <pauljw> :)
[12:35] <BluesKaj> 'Morning pauljw :-)
[18:04] <OerHeks> :-)
[20:15] <MonkeyDust> look who's there, motaka2
[20:20] <TJ-> look who's quickly going grey, too!
[20:31] <BluesKaj> TJ-, I have to admit I admire your patience :-P
[20:32] <TJ-> haha I'm only doing it since I'm intrigued, and it isn't the user's lack of skill, despite what it has looked like. He's genuinely hitting several corner-cases one after the other
[20:32] <TJ-> the original issue breaking 12.04 during an attempted 14.04 release-upgrade was due to the terrible connectivity from what I can tell
[20:33] <BluesKaj> he must have mucked up some kernel module
[20:33] <BluesKaj> ahh, now I recall the some the original problem
[20:36] <BluesKaj> err some of the orginal
[20:37] <TJ-> the packages got stuck in a between releases situation with many core bits being a mix, and we couldn't figure a way out of it
[20:45] <DJones> Is saying that uefi if good a blasphemy? Updated a dual boot Ubuntu/Win 8.1 machine to Ubuntu/Win 10 today, no issues, upgrade took under an hour, didn't break grub, both os's work perfectly
[20:45] <DJones> s/if/is/
[20:47] <Bashing-om> DJones: TJ- Will bless you .
[20:47] <DJones> I was expecting to have to reinstall grub
[20:49] <Bashing-om> Yeah, that has been my general expectation aslo . UEFI is a great thing. We just have to learn the hows. huh .
[20:49] <DJones> But seems like once grub is installed, it actually works well with multiboot systems, Win 10 update just modified its own boot system
[20:51] <DJones> Seems like grub 2 is actually designed to work with grub at a base level and then links to various other o/s boot systems, rather than the old grub
[20:55] <TJ-> DJones: the beauty of UEFI is that the OS boot-loader is only involved for its own OS, no others, so there is no need for the boot-strap code to be replacing each others' bits
[20:55] <DJones> TJ-: Thats good to know, I was expecting a complete mess, but was pleasantly surprised
[20:55] <TJ-> DJones: UEFI has a dedicated FAT file-system, the EFI System Partition, and each OS/bootloader installs its own bootloader files there in separate paths, then adds a menu entry to the UEFI boot manager's menu which is stored in non-voltile RAM on the mobo
[20:57] <DJones> For me, it feels as though Grub has taken over uefi and then points to the various bootloaders
[20:58] <DJones> Which I won't complain about, the bootloader should be independent of the os
[20:59] <TJ-> No, the firmware's boot menu should have entries for each OS. If GRUB adds other OSes, it'll simply ask the UEFI services to boot those
[21:00] <DJones> Right, my laptop just goes straight to Grub, without any suggestion of a firmware entry
[21:00] <TJ-> UEFI boot menu stores a 'default' entry, so that's what  is happening. If at boot-time you press the firmware's manual boot option key, you'll see the firmware's view of the boot menu entries
[21:00] <DJones> I'm not worried how it works, just pleased that it works how I'd prefer it
[21:00] <DJones> Ah right
[21:02] <BluesKaj> I regret wiping the UEFI boot partition and GPT table for dos after I eceived my lenovo laptop, but 8.1 wasn't my cuppa tea i thought I' just get rid of all MS "junk" and install W7 and Kubuntu
[21:03] <BluesKaj> at the time I saw UEFI as an obstacle Linux
[21:03] <BluesKaj> to
[21:04] <DJones> I managed to modify Win 8.1 to look like win 7
[21:05] <DJones> So wasn't bothered by its different looks for the hour a month I might have booted it up
[21:05] <BluesKaj> well , I have W10 and Kubuntu 15.10 on it now, I let W7 auto upgrade
[21:06] <BluesKaj> yeah I just keep W10 around to keep up with my MS user friends
[21:07] <DJones> Heh, a pox upon you having MS user friends
[21:07] <DJones> I only have it for preparing powerpoint/publisher files for Church
[21:07] <BluesKaj> not much I can do they're not real computer savvy types
[21:08] <BluesKaj> one drank the MS kool-ade , took the MS certification course
[21:09] <DJones> I remember the days when all my friends used MSN, now they all use Gtalk/snapchat/skype etc
[21:10] <BluesKaj> got an IT job  that paid him peanuts until he finally got a half decent paying job in th elocal pulp & paper rmill