=== ejat_ is now known as ejat === howefield_afk is now known as howefield === popey_ is now known as popey === lool- is now known as lool === howefield is now known as howefield_afk [16:00] o/ [16:00] * slangasek waves [16:01] hola =) [16:01] o/ [16:02] #startmeeting [16:02] Meeting started Thu Jan 7 16:02:15 2016 UTC. The chair is slangasek. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology. [16:02] Available commands: action commands idea info link nick [16:02] * doko grumbles after an update to xenial and thnderbird showing an empty folder pane [16:02] [TOPIC] Lightning round === meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: Lightning round [16:03] $ echo $(shuf -e barry doko bdmurray slangasek caribou infinity sil2100 robru cyphermox pitti tdaitx xnox chiluk) [16:03] robru sil2100 xnox bdmurray pitti barry tdaitx cyphermox infinity chiluk slangasek doko caribou [16:03] i win! [16:03] Oh my [16:03] lp:cupstream2distro [16:03] * random small fixes for bugs found in production [16:03] lp:cupstream2distro/charm [16:03] * Fix key handling to use proper juju options rather than bespoke nonsense. [16:03] * define ppa-team option rather than hard-coding the two possible teams [16:03] everybody can tell us about their short week :) [16:03] * Add support for openstack creds so that jenkins artifacts can be uploaded to swift. [16:03] lp:bileto [16:03] * Hide 'Updated ...' comments by default. [16:03] * Input validation [16:03] * nagios check [16:03] lp:canonical-mojo-specs [16:03] * major overhaul of mojo spec to help prevent a repeat of the big outage just before christmas [16:04] Done? :) [16:04] grrr [16:04] 08:03:13 * nagios check [16:04] 08:03:13 lp:canonical-mojo-specs [16:04] 08:03:13 * major overhaul of mojo spec to help prevent a repeat of the big outage just before christmas [16:04] 08:03:13 (done) [16:04] No EOT marker, not sure if I can go on [16:04] - Short week, started from Monday, national holiday on Wednesday [16:04] - Landing team work, silo coordination, preparing landing e-mails [16:04] - RTM Status meetings [16:04] - Updated landing documentation [16:04] - system-image: [16:04] * Updated documentation regarding new features [16:04] - Landing Team tools: [16:04] * Add the landing-info tool to fetch train info per package version [16:05] - +1-maintenance: [16:05] * Prepared network-manager-applet 1.0.10 merge [16:05] * Looked into merging network-manager-pptp 1.0.8 - requires new ppp [16:05] * Checked merging ppp 2.4.7-1+1 and did a test build, prepare merge [16:05] - Image copies and manipulation for ubuntu-core releases [16:05] (done) [16:05] - fixing FTBFS... [16:05] (done) [16:06] mojo spec work - utilization of cassandra username and password [16:06] modified errors code / charms to properly configure static files (no more assets.u.c) [16:06] discovered /fixed issue with setting errors_secret_key on install [16:06] worked with webops to look into error retrieving ddebs from LP (librarian bug) [16:06] foundations bug triage [16:06] worked on a fix / submitted mp for apport bug LP: #1500541 [16:06] ✔ done [16:06] Launchpad bug 1500541 in apport (Ubuntu) "apport-retrace crashed with IOError in __main__: [Errno 13] Permission denied: '_usr_bin_Xorg.0.crash'" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1500541 [16:06] investigation into SRU of the fix for LP: #1439769 to Trusty [16:06] Launchpad bug 1439769 in update-manager (Ubuntu Vivid) "various linux packages being marked as manually installed, still prevents 'apt-get autoremove' from doing the right thing for kernels" [Critical,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1439769 [16:06] worked with google code in student re lp_buttontags (task completed) [16:07] (done?) [16:07] oh, apparently your paste was scrambled a bit [16:07] autopkgtest: set up armhf testing in Scalingstack, run into kernel bug, investigate (LP: #1531768) [16:07] Launchpad bug 1531768 in linux (Ubuntu) "arm64 kernel and multiple CPUs is unusably slow" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1531768 [16:07] archive: [16:07] - Untangle dozens of FTBFS and test regressions of various PHP modules, land new php5 [16:07] - help with perl migration (depended on PHP, some failing tests, some demotions, etc.), now landed at last [16:07] - merges: debhelper, ifupdown, openvpn, ruby-defaults, systemd [16:07] misc: [16:07] - test hallyn's pam-cgm with user lxc [16:07] - ifupdown: fix upgrade failure (#1531685) [16:07] - scour: package new upstream version, add py3 package and autopkgtest (as requested by doko) [16:07] - debci: fix flaky tests [16:07] EOF [16:09] * Clear up email/bug/other backlog from the holidays [16:09] * Build and retest OpenJDK 6 TLS patch (LP: #1482924) [16:09] * Looking into OpenJDK 9 build failures, using ppc64el machine for tests [16:09] Next: [16:09] - Finish up freeipmi merge (LP: #1527685) [16:09] - Continue squid3 merge [16:09] Launchpad bug 1482924 in openjdk-7 (Ubuntu) "Regressions due to USN-2696-1" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1482924 [16:09] (done) [16:09] Launchpad bug 1527685 in freeipmi (Ubuntu) "Please merge freeipmi 1.4.11-1 (main) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1527685 [16:10] cyphermox is out this week [16:10] adam is not joining, he sent the status through email [16:10] infinity sent his status by email [16:10] chiluk: [16:11] LP: #1347788 - Upstream findutils has released a new blessed stable version, not sure what the chances of getting this merged into xenial will be. [16:11] LP: #1527062 - User reported hotfix kernel resolved issue, looking into what other kernels may be affected, and backporting. [16:11] -fin- [16:11] Launchpad bug 1347788 in findutils (Ubuntu Xenial) "find crashed when current working directory is not readable and -exec or -execdir used" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1347788 [16:11] Launchpad bug 1527062 in linux-lts-wily (Ubuntu) "XFS Deadlock on 4.2+" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1527062 [16:12] * reviewed freeipmi merge sponsorship request; feedback given (LP: #1527685) [16:12] Launchpad bug 1527685 in freeipmi (Ubuntu) "Please merge freeipmi 1.4.11-1 (main) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1527685 [16:12] * looking this week at golang merge (LP: #1524165) [16:12] Launchpad bug 1524165 in golang (Ubuntu) "merge with debian" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1524165 [16:12] * Debian has also updated to golang 1.5.2, so new upstream version coming [16:12] * discussions preceding next week's CDO sprint [16:12] * discussion with robru, saviq about how to reduce the source package prep time on the train [16:12] * planning regarding juju support on s390x [16:12] (done) [16:12] * working to help get P7 hardware returned that has been replaced by P8 systems [16:13] slangasek, thanks for the freeipmi review btw =) [16:13] tdaitx: no problem! [16:13] doko: [16:13] - test rebuilds: baseline and pie finished, gcc6 ongoing [16:13] - reduced and submitted upstream/linaro issues for GCC issues, both GCC 5 and GCC 6 [16:13] - around 40 merges for main [16:13] - continue GCC 6 packaging [16:13] (done) [16:15] any questions? [16:16] [TOPIC] AOB === meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: AOB [16:17] anything else today? [16:17] Any objections for me to take care of merging different ppp-like packages? [16:17] Is there anything special to be aware about re bug 1531194? [16:17] bug 1531194 in app-install-data-partner (Ubuntu Xenial) "13.04 "raring-partner" channel included in 14.04/15.04/15.10/16.04" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1531194 [16:18] sil2100: I don't think anyone here is likely to object to that; are there specific packages you have in mind that someone here is TIL for? [16:19] bdmurray, i think it's just a bug... but would be interesting to check that e.g. software centre doesn't break (it has channels stuff too) [16:19] bdmurray: huh. is there a way to fix that which doesn't require it to be manually touched for each release? [16:19] slangasek: not particularily, I already poked on -devel and just wanted to make sure you guys have nothing against that as well ;) It's like ppp, pptpd, fso-gsmd and the like [16:21] sounds fine :) [16:22] anything else? [16:22] slangasek: I didn't think about it that much yet. [16:24] bdmurray: ok. since it has to ship a file within the package that contains the info, I don't see a good way to make it no-touch series neutral. Could do something with dpkg triggers and update it whenever base-files / distro-data updates... or we could just add it to a list of packages that need to be touched when the archive opens for the cycle [16:24] the source does seem to already auto-generate the release name, so it only needs an upload to get the right name [16:25] roger [16:26] should probably be recorded on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/NewReleaseCycleProcess [16:27] #endmeeting === meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: Ubuntu Meeting Grounds: Please leave swords by the door | Calendar/Scheduled meetings: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/calendars | Logs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs | Meetingology documentation: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology [16:27] Meeting ended Thu Jan 7 16:27:16 2016 UTC. [16:27] Minutes: http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2016/ubuntu-meeting.2016-01-07-16.02.moin.txt [16:27] thanks, all! [16:29] thanks everyone [16:30] o/ === med_` is now known as med_ === med_ is now known as med === med is now known as med_ [17:00] hey [17:00] hey :) [17:01] hello [17:01] o/ [17:01] czajkowski, hggdh, marcoceppi: around? [17:01] #startmeeting [17:01] Meeting started Thu Jan 7 17:01:42 2016 UTC. The chair is dholbach. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology. [17:01] Available commands: action commands idea info link nick [17:01] hey seb128 :) [17:01] is this for the membership meeting? [17:02] no, CC meeting [17:02] o/ [17:02] meeting up with Desktop team and later on with the DMB [17:02] #catching up with the Desktop team [17:02] #topic catching up with the Desktop team === meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: catching up with the Desktop team [17:02] seb128: how are you doing? :) [17:02] hey! [17:03] Laney should be around as well for desktop ;-) [17:03] doing well! what about you? [17:03] great, thanks :) [17:03] how are things in the desktop team? how's 16.04 shaping up? [17:03] things are looking quite nice [17:04] we are mostly done with updates/merges/features landing [17:04] some big things this cycle right [17:04] ? [17:04] hi [17:04] not big/disruptives features [17:04] though some interesting bits [17:04] seb128: is there still work going on to support Snappy app installation? [17:04] but mostly bugfixing and polish [17:04] big icons on the desktop, right? [17:04] SCNR :) [17:04] dholbach, indeed! [17:04] like them right? [17:04] mhall119, no idea, that's a question for the snappy team [17:04] errrrmm [17:05] they are the ones working on that [17:05] mvo was more specifically [17:05] seb128: oh, I thought you guys on will's team were working on that [17:05] let's say I haven't got used to them yet :) [17:05] mhall119, no [17:05] ok [17:05] dholbach, we changed the default size to be smaller, might not apply to those who upgraded/loaded a session with the old version though [17:05] aloha :) [17:05] but users upgrading now should have less "in your face" ones ;-) [17:05] hey czajkowski! [17:06] seb128: have the online-scopes changes all landed and settled? [17:06] oh ok... so I have to apply some magic somewhere to get it fixed? [17:06] mhall119, I think so [17:06] (yes, just a server-side part still needed by the online service team) [17:06] there were some server side changes pending iirc but I didn't check on those [17:06] didrocks, ^ do you know what's the status? [17:06] oh [17:06] he snapped me :p [17:06] didrocks, thanks ;-) [17:07] https://twitter.com/didrocks/status/676759237100486660 [17:07] btw ;) [17:07] is chipaca the person to ask about the server-side still? [17:07] mhall119: I guess he's part of the guys who should look at it, yeah [17:07] dholbach, just move the slider in the icon/list icon (top right corner) to small, if that's still too big then we need to do more [17:07] should be a 10 minutes change on the server, still needs to happen though :) [17:07] didrocks, I didn't know you were using twitter ;-) [17:08] \o/ remote search [17:08] seb128: started recently (but also updated on g+, as usual) [17:08] I'm not quite sure which slider, but let's take that offline, I guess :) [17:08] yeah [17:09] seb128: didrocks: Laney: who do you have in the community that is working with your team? What do you think we can do to increase that community participation? [17:09] is the desktop team involved in any unity8 bits or supporting other teams in that regard? [17:09] dholbach, not much at the moment, we are focussing on the LTS [17:09] we are there for other teams when they need us though [17:10] and still look at issues/help on some specific bits [17:10] darkxst and mitya57 and sometimes Noskcaj [17:10] probably some others [17:10] no regular contributors to Ubuntu Desktop only [17:11] but Ubuntu GNOME is doing well and share components [17:11] those guys are getting upload rights for themselves [17:11] Tim joined the desktop team [17:11] which is nice [17:11] \o/ [17:11] but it's still following the general trend [17:12] not as bad as MOTU though [17:12] general trend of declining participation? [17:12] yes [17:12] declined probably [17:12] the guys who are participating,what kind of things are they doing? [17:12] it's already a few years old thing [17:13] usually things motivated by flavour needs [17:13] updates, patches and stuff [17:14] patches to apps, gtk, something else? [17:14] and the coordination there is going well? [17:15] it's not hard to coordinate with 2-3 people [17:15] patches to applications and libraries, yeah [17:15] mitya57 learned how to work the CI train too [17:15] right... but in the past there were issues because some decision on ubuntu desktop blocked a flavour, etc [17:15] I was interested in hearing if that's been an issue recently [17:16] More because the desktop team was making breaking changes I would guess [17:16] I think we don't do so much of that any more [17:16] we updated most of the components this cycle, including the apps we blocked for some cycles like gedit [17:16] but there are still some annoying areas [17:17] or one team needing newer components than the other [17:17] like we maintain a need for some UI changes which is a drag [17:17] I'm glad to hear that the community guys are getting upload rights, are you encouraging them all to progress towards becoming Ubuntu Developers? [17:17] it's still somewhat conflicting needs but we are dealing with it ok [17:17] ok, that's good to hear [17:18] and I've just today been looking at some changes to get us off an old webkit version [17:18] <3 [17:18] I suppose that interests the flavours because we have to revert patches [17:18] the future is here :-) [17:18] but I wouldn't say there has been a lot of community energy around it really [17:18] :D [17:19] Laney: what would you like to see to improve this ? [17:19] what can we do to drive some life into it ? [17:19] UDS? :) [17:19] Laney: come to UbuCon Summit :) [17:19] ubucon! [17:19] ahh yes that is soon [17:19] mhall119: but what about EU, when do we get to have them over here in the same level? [17:20] I'm not invited though [17:20] czajkowski: one step after the other [17:20] and neither do most of the community have the oppportunity to apply for sponsorship as far as I know [17:20] czajkowski: UbuCon EU will hopefully become that [17:20] anyway I was being a bit facetious [17:20] Laney: apply for sponsorship [17:21] let's take a step at a time - that we get a big group of people together again after many years of no UDS-like event at all is a good step and something dpm and other put quite a lot of work into [17:21] I guess we're not as exciting as we might have been once? Or people moved on for whatever reasons [17:21] Laney: why do theynot have the opportunity to apply for sponsorship? [17:21] Somehow attract people back [17:22] Well, I think it is larger than that, I know we are feeling a pinch from lack of new contributors at Kubuntu [17:22] did the desktop team add tasks to the google code in this time? [17:22] yes [17:22] yeah, didrocks can probably tell you how that went [17:22] nice... how did that go? [17:22] * Laney didn't hear [17:22] didrocks and willcooke have been looking at desktop contributions [17:22] we had quite some contributions (and I'm still helping people as we speak in separate channels :)) [17:22] they seemed to be positive [17:22] * dholbach hugs didrocks [17:23] awesome [17:23] right now, we have 5 tasks that are closed (not trivial ones) [17:23] * didrocks hugs dholbach back [17:23] 3 in serious progress [17:23] some other opened, with less traction, but we'll see :) [17:23] and they're hanging out with you guys in the desktop channel already? :) [17:23] mhall119: well maybe I missed it but I didn't see an invitation to apply anywhere [17:23] dholbach: unfortunatly, they either stay on the google-ubuntu channel or use PM [17:24] (or just the web interface) [17:24] Laney: the process is different from UDS sponsorship, if you missed it that means we didn't do a very good job advertising it [17:24] dholbach: ^^ we should make a note to improve that for the next big UbuCon [17:24] makes sense [17:24] it's part of the ubuntu community donations fund [17:25] maybe bake it into ubucon.org at some point [17:25] http://community.ubuntu.com/help-information/funding/ [17:25] Laney: ^^ for future reference [17:25] I know about that fund [17:25] that's what is being used to sponsor community people to go to UbuCon Summit [17:25] but not that you could use it to apply for sponsorship to this thing [17:26] ok [17:26] it can be used to apply for travel expenses to any event where your presence will benefit Ubuntu [17:26] right, that could have been more explicit - people used the fund in the past to get to conferences [17:26] I would not like to use that for myself as an employee though, that feels strange to me [17:26] Laney: yeah, I think all the Canonical employees going are being paid for by Canonical [17:27] but it can (and should) be used by employees for community-oriented work [17:28] ok, getting back on topic since we have only a couple minutes left, what can we change or improve to get more people excited about participating in the desktop's development? [17:29] unsure, that question doesn't feel like specific to desktop [17:29] umm so I have one project that we'll want to get some help on [17:29] do we have some more smaller tasks you could hand out to new contributors? [17:29] Laney: which one? [17:29] if and when we switch to GNOME software there will be a new source for app metadata [17:29] Google Code-In sounds like it's getting some fresh faces, which is great, we should encourage them to stick around and work towards becoming Ubuntu Members and eventually Ubuntu Developers [17:29] which is different and in some ways more strict than app-install-data which softare-center uses now [17:30] some things will need fixing and we'll eventually have a website listing them [17:30] https://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-announce/2015/12/msg00004.html [17:30] do we have like a junior jobs listing anywhere? [17:31] so this metadata needs to be compiled? [17:31] probably just a file right? [17:31] xml, yaml? [17:31] we'll have a list of errors [17:31] things like "Icon not found" [17:32] *or* for things that have no metadata at all people will be able to write an appstream metadata file to provide that [17:32] and ideally supply it to the upstream [17:32] Laney: if you want help organising the initiative, you can write a mail to ubuntu-community-team@lists.u.c [17:32] so it sounds like we need an initiative like we did years ago to get larger icons and Quicklists for apps [17:32] I'm sure there's going to be a few folks who can help out organising this [17:32] I would be interested in helping with that myself. And promoting it. [17:33] <3 [17:33] https://appstream.debian.org/html/sid/main/issues/index.html [17:33] Laney: the community team can help with this, certainly. [17:33] I know that Kubunbu want to use this same data ;-) [17:33] exactly lol [17:33] great :-D [17:33] sgclark: yay [17:33] Laney: thanks for looking into that! [17:33] Laney: will we have to maintain our own set of ths metadata, or can we get the info into debian and then just import it? [17:33] mhall119: cool, I thought you would find it interesting [17:34] it is shareable [17:34] upstreams themselves should ship it really [17:34] yeah it needs to be submitted upstream [17:34] see the many blogs and posts by Richard Hughes [17:34] perfect, we'll probably need people to help getting it through Debian's processes, since they are different than Ubuntu's [17:34] fedora started this last year or even the year before [17:34] like for KDE I am adding it as a test in the CI [17:35] we may even want to insist that they go upstream [17:35] Laney: for the Unity Quicklists, we would accept patches in Ubuntu if they were accepted upstream, so we didn't have to wait for everything to flow downstream before we got them, will that be the case here too? [17:35] because one benefit might be that we stop promoting unmaintained applications [17:35] I agree [17:35] anyway, not decided yet [17:36] depending on the timing it might be acceptable to ship a delta for some time, right? [17:36] at least for the "important" apps(?) [17:36] probably [17:36] yeah, it's likely that not all apps get releases between the start of the effort and the LTS [17:37] or that the new versions don't get in Ubuntu because ff [17:37] ok [17:37] nice initiative :) [17:37] definitely for maintained things [17:37] questonable for long tail [17:37] it is a discussion to have [17:37] seb128: Laney: ok, as soon as you're ready to start planning for it, bring in the community team and we'll help with documentation and outreach, if you guys can help with the technical bits and working with upstreams [17:37] thanks a lot for your hard work on the desktop! [17:38] will do, thanks! [17:38] yes, thank you all for your continued work on the desktop and with the community [17:38] thanks :-) [17:38] thank you for your hard work! [17:39] brilliant... any more questions for our desktop heroes? [17:39] I'm good [17:39] good here. [17:39] ok cool - thanks a lot for making time everyone! [17:39] thank you for the invitation ;-) [17:39] do we have folks from the DMB here as well? :) [17:40] #topic Catching up with the DMB === meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: Catching up with the DMB [17:40] don't we have a dmb-irc-ping thing? :) [17:41] !dmb-ping [17:41] cyphermox, infinity, Laney, micahg, xnox, bdmurray, stgraber: DMB ping [17:41] :-) [17:41] ? [17:41] maybe someone else could take this half :-) [17:41] hi =) [17:41] ah, unlucky [17:41] * Laney runs [17:41] the CC is catching up with the DMB :-) [17:41] oh [17:41] how are things? [17:42] * xnox probably forgot to add the invite to my calendar. [17:42] we have some applicants, we approved some, things are going ok i guess. [17:42] well, we're glad you guys are still here :-) [17:42] i think there was more, and higher-level (motu/core) applicants lately, which is good. [17:43] yeah, I noticed some more emails on the mailing list [17:43] and not all of them were Canonical folks, which is nice to see as well [17:43] I wonder if it's because more teams like the desktop team encourage their contributors to apply? [17:44] so would you say that the process is fine-tuned and the machinery is well-oiled enough? [17:45] I think I remember that some discussions on the mailing list took a bit longer in the past - do you know if that is still the case? [17:47] i don't think much changed to be honest. if everyone is present at the meeting, it goes quickly. things deffered to mailing list, are kind of doomed to take forever =) [17:47] do you have a longer queue there right now? [17:48] are you seeing any obstacles that potential applicants are facing that might stop them from applying? [17:51] i don't think our queue is too long. [17:51] it did grow a little due to holidays, but it is reasonable. [17:51] ok, that's good to hear [17:52] that's good! [17:52] obstacles... none that i'm aware per se. [17:52] it might be a bit daunting still I could imagine [17:53] I think I'll send a mail to the devel list asking people to consider encouraging folks whose uploads they've sponsored - just as a reminder [17:53] and encouraging existing developers to write testimonials for applicants [17:53] aye I think part of the thing to do is to remmeber to encourage people [17:53] and that reaching out to people makes a big difference to encourage people to apply [17:53] yeah [17:54] is there anything else you feel the CC could help with? [17:56] or any questions you have? [17:57] hum... [17:58] any other comments? [17:58] I feel like this was probably not the best time for the DMB folks O:-) [17:59] that is my feeling as well lol [17:59]