[00:11] <bazhang> has toba been an issue interfering/giving bad advice
[00:15] <genii> I haven't noticed them before now. Seems like mostly noise at the moment and nothing serious
[00:18] <bazhang> dylan seems to think compiling with lubuntu will fix his wifi issues
[00:19] <bazhang> he supposedly fresh installed xubuntu just a few hours earlier, now suddenly its lubuntu
[00:19] <genii> I came in somewhere midpoint and decided not to go anywhere near it after a minute or so
[00:19] <bazhang> he wants to compile kernel modules for broadcom 43xx
[00:20] <genii> Yeah, good luck with that
[00:20] <bazhang> crossposting multiple channels, lots of 2 minute ask n helloooo?
[00:26] <bazhang> he cannot use an ethernet because its lubuntu or something
[00:27] <bazhang> I sincerely wonder how he ever got any ubuntu on there\
[00:27] <Unit193> genii: I have been paying no attention to that, hopefully you and wxl have it covered (both have OPs there.)
[00:27] <Unit193> And, ethernet of course works just like it does in Ubuntu.
[00:28] <genii> Unit193: wxl seems to be taking care of it
[00:42] <bazhang> Unit193, he's been told that multiple times
[00:43] <bazhang> and as always plods forward without listening to any advice
[02:15] <Unit193> < llldino> Dylan____, Mint is very similar to Ubuntu, just don't tell anyone you're using it :D
[02:17] <genii> Mint has become to #ubuntu what Ubuntu was to #debian
[02:18] <bazhang> yep
[02:18] <Unit193> So lets hope in a few years Mint actually becomes useful to upstream Ubuntu/Debian.
[02:19] <bazhang> the threats used to always be 'Im going back to windows'
[02:23] <genii> wah is <reply> Go back to Windows or OSX or any other operating system of your choosing if you like. But please refrain from announcing it as an ultimatum to receiving assistance with your Ubuntu.
[02:24] <bazhang> hah
[02:24] <bazhang> just bring back 'don't work' and 'enter'
[02:25] <Unit193> And !language.
[02:25] <bazhang> the original one, yeah
[02:33] <genii> Sometimes I think all the humour has been drained out of the factoids
[02:41] <bazhang> the jussi-era was when that happened
[02:41] <bazhang> there used to be factoids for the regulars in -ot
[02:42] <bazhang> amaranth really got riled by the changes in his
[02:42]  * genii sips and contemplates
[02:42] <bazhang> wobbylwu makes no(n)sense!
[02:43] <bazhang> `seeker had a really mean one, that jussi liked to keep fixing back
[02:44] <genii> Wow, I couldn't remember how long I'd been on Freenode, nickserv info tells me that Dec 14 2016 will be 10 years
[02:45] <genii> Jussi is actually the one that convinced me to try being an op for #kubuntu
[02:45] <genii> I think 2008-ish
[02:46] <bazhang> the days of jucato
[02:46] <genii> Heh yes
[03:45] <rww> Myrtti: I was clearing out email the other day. Turns out the largest email in my inbox was large because it was Flannel emailing me the automatix .deb files
[03:46] <rww> i think i got bored one day and wanted to try to run them in modernbuntu? idk
[06:23] <Flannel> No, I think we were comparing automatix with ultimate edition or something?
[06:23] <Flannel> Maybe that was a different time.
[06:47] <gav> Are any ops active at the moment? There is a racist troll in #ubuntu-offtopic
[06:49] <gav> Thanks!
[17:21] <cartwright> mmm
[17:21] <cartwright> I'll bbl
[17:22] <Pici> k
 How much envirnonment has Ubuntu?
[17:36] <genii> ...
[17:36] <bazhang> he meant flavours
[17:37] <genii> Ah
[17:37] <bazhang> desktop environments I guess
[19:00] <phunyguy> @mark #ubuntu-offtopic phteven This is stevendale... with yet a new nick and nickserv account... has been talked to again.
[19:08] <ilhami> k1l_, dude
[19:11] <rww> he's afk 5 hours
[19:11] <ilhami> rww, can you let me in the Ubuntu Touch channel? I have some questions about it..
[19:12] <rww> nope, I don't have access there. op list is at /msg chanserv access #ubuntu-touch list
[19:13] <ilhami> thanks :)
[19:13] <rww> looks like popey's only idle about 6 minutes, would be one option
[19:13] <ilhami> will try popey.
[19:14] <popey> hm?
[19:14] <ilhami> can you unban me? k1l_ unbanned me only because I was unbanned in #ubuntu .. I didn't do anything wrong in #ubuntu-touch
[19:14] <ilhami> I want to help with the development of apps etc.
[19:15] <ilhami> It looks very promising. Just saw a video on youtube. :P I liked it
[19:15] <popey> @login
[19:15] <popey> @btlogin
[19:16] <popey> You have collected a fair number of bans over the last year
[19:16] <ilhami> popey, not in #ubuntu-touch
[19:16] <ilhami> in #ubuntu yes.
[19:16] <ilhami> he only banned me in #ubuntu-touch because he banned me in #ubuntu
[19:16] <ilhami> I want to help with the development dude.. I have questions.
[19:17] <popey> App development actually happens in #ubuntu-app-devel
[19:17] <ilhami> oh well :P I also want to be able to discuss other stuff about Ubuntu Touch since it looks promising.. if I had known I would have bought Ubuntu Phone over Windows phone
[19:18] <popey> Why were you previously banned?
[19:18] <ilhami> Windows Phone is so bad!.. Windows 10 Mobile doesn't look that good at all.
[19:18] <ilhami> Because I was a bit annoying (according to him)
[19:18] <ilhami> (according to him) I was disrespectful to an OP.
[19:19] <ilhami> in #ubuntu
[19:19] <ilhami> we are talking about two different channels.
[19:33] <ilhami> bazhang_, why are you in here with two nicks?
[19:35] <rww> connection issues probably
[19:35] <Unit193> rww: Netsplit, actually.
[19:36] <rww> true
[19:36] <rww> figured it wasn't because only him, but... IdleOne- so yes
[19:37] <ilhami> anyway.. I am in #ubuntu-app-devel so please don't ban me in there... I am leaving this channel. bye
[20:35] <an3k> excellent. I hope I can submit a complaint about a rude and slightly false-advise giving op of #ubuntu
[20:35] <ikonia> an3k: I've forwarded you to this channel, as you're not helping people,
[20:35] <ikonia> if you can calm down and try to actually work with the people asking for help, I'm sure it will be fine
[20:36] <an3k> ikonia I WAS HELPING HIM
[20:36] <ikonia> he seemed pretty lost
[20:36] <an3k> but you just overtook the whole talk
[20:36] <ikonia> trying to run 3 VM's and other such things, when all he wanted was a media server
[20:36] <ikonia> and then you start saying people are giving him false information
[20:36] <an3k> Yeah and you advise him owncloud which is NOT a media server
[20:36] <an3k> you gave him false information
[20:36] <ikonia> which to be honest - isn't case, it comes across as you just didn't like it so wanted to bad mouth him
[20:36] <ikonia> no I didn't
[20:37] <ikonia> if you can give me an example of this false informaiton as I asked earlier, that would be great
[20:37] <an3k> yeah, useing md1 as a backup for md0 ... stupid as hell because that's not a backup
[20:37] <ikonia> no-one said that
[20:38] <an3k> oh, you did :)
[20:38] <ikonia> no, I didn't
[20:38] <an3k> [21:28:38] <an3k> >>>>>>>> [21:26:30] <ikonia> jc: if you created a mirrored pair with the 2x1TB disks you would have a good starting point and a fair bit of space, once you add the additoinal disks, again as a mirrored pair you can either grow that space, or use it for backup space, or variations between the 2 sets of mirrors <<<<<<<<<
[20:38] <ikonia> and using different raid array meta devices is a reasonable disk for a home server, which is what he's running, wiht some core config file backs
[20:38] <ikonia> yes, if you read you'll see I'm giving him a range of options
[20:39] <ikonia> he can go anywhere between option a - f
[20:39] <an3k> what the fuck is this -> you can either grow that space, or use it for backup space,
[20:39] <ikonia> finding a ground that suits his needs
[20:39] <ikonia> an option
[20:39] <ikonia> and please don't swear
[20:39] <an3k> sorry thats pure bu**sh**
[20:39] <ikonia> in what way ?
[20:40] <an3k> to be very honest I rather would do all the search and configuring all myself than getting support from you. Instead of a short "do this or that" you cause a HUGE channel spamming talk and kind of force the user to use what you advise.
[20:40] <ikonia> that wasn't what I asked
[20:40] <ikonia> I asked in what way is my comment "bull shit"
[20:40] <an3k> he wanted to run windows or for example DS audio and instead of just accepting that ...
[20:41] <ikonia> he didn't want to run windows
[20:41] <ikonia> he wanted an audio service - and thought windows was the only way due to a guide
[20:41] <ikonia> in the same way he wanted to run a NAS vm to share his disk, because he didn't realise ubuntu could manage and share his disk
[20:41] <an3k> [21:11:53] <jc> So I'd like it to store all my pictures, films and music and have them available to the house. I'd also like to play about with Linux. It also needs to have windows available. Finally I would like Xpenology as I utilise the remote apps on my iphone.
[20:41] <ikonia> thats why I took the time to talk to him and find out his real needs
[20:41] <ikonia> yes, follow the rest of the conersation
[20:41] <ikonia> conversation
[20:42] <an3k> oh god, do you even know what you're writing?
[20:42] <an3k> [21:41:06] <ikonia> he didn't want to run windows
[20:42] <an3k> [21:11:53] <jc> So I'd like it to store all my pictures, films and music and have them available to the house. I'd also like to play about with Linux. It also needs to have windows available. Finally I would like Xpenology as I utilise the remote apps on my iphone.
[20:42] <ikonia> follow the rest of the conversation,
[20:42] <ikonia> where I ask multiple times why he wants windows and he was following a guide that suggested a windows install for media serving
[20:43] <an3k> ok so how does he gets DS audio now?
[20:43] <ikonia> you're welcome to disagree with my advice, there are loads of ways to do things, you're not welcome to disagree with the attitude you did
[20:43] <ikonia> through media services, such as plex as you suggested
[20:43] <an3k> what is DS audio?
[20:43] <ikonia> the san app streamer thing
[20:44] <an3k> did he said so or do you think he meant that?
[20:44] <ikonia> he said he wanted it due to the iphone app
[20:44] <ikonia> which when you speak to him, he wanted the ability to use "an app" not "I want that specific app"
[20:44] <ikonia> re-read the conversation and you'll see he was just a bit lost, had an idea of what he wanted but was locked into a guide
[20:45] <ikonia> hence why he's left seeming pretty happy about things
[20:45] <ikonia> (well he's not left the channel, he's left to look into a setup)
[20:46] <an3k> ikonia: Why did you just overtook the whole conversation while he already got help instead of helping the others who didn't already got help?
[20:46] <ikonia> and to be honest if any of what you are saying is correct, it's just miss-understanding rather than false informaiton
[20:47] <ikonia> because the convesation was getting nowhere, he was lost and trying to setup 3 VM's with different OS's including a VM for NAS OS on physical disk just to get a media server
[20:47] <ikonia> and I didn't "take over" he responded to me once we started talking about his real needs
[20:47] <an3k> he wasn't lost and he was not going to install 3 VMs.
[20:47] <an3k> oh, yeah.
[20:47] <ikonia> sorry if you don't feel that
[20:47] <ikonia> either way, it's not a problem that you disagree, you're welcome to that,
[20:47] <an3k> I was in a conversation with him and tried to figured out what he wanted but then you just jumped in and ripped the whole convo to you
[20:47] <ikonia> the problem is how you express that
[20:49] <an3k> ikonia: the problem is that a convo gets very unclear when one guy just shouts OFFTOPIC as soon as you're not 100% ontopic or when everybody wants to give a little advise which ends up in 5 people talking about the same topic
[20:49] <ikonia> no-one shouted offtopic
[20:49] <an3k> ähm
[20:49] <ikonia> again re-read the conversation and we very much went outside the generic ubuntu OS discussion to get an idea of what he wanted
[20:50] <ikonia> becuase it was clear what he was trying to do was use ubuntu to get his job done
[20:50] <an3k> [20:58:23] <daftykins> why such a hodge-podge setup on a single host?
[20:50] <an3k> [20:58:53] * Brunost_ is now known as brunost
[20:50] <an3k> [20:58:59] <jc> Ha! Well that's a very good question. I'd been reading about ESXi and wanted to tinker.
[20:50] <an3k> [20:59:37] <jc> I wanted windows access. Linus and I'm keen to run Xpenology. I did also look at Openmediavault
[20:50] <an3k> [20:59:42] <an3k> I could help you with ESXi. I had that running :)
[20:50] <an3k> [20:59:42] <jc> linux
[20:50] <an3k> [21:00:04] <daftykins> jc: this is all bordering on chat, vmware is not on topic here - you can take chat to #ubuntu-offtopic
[20:50] <an3k> [21:00:19] <daftykins> only support queries relating to the use of *buntu are relevant in this channel
[20:50] <ikonia> I wasn't in the conversation at that time, and as you can see we pulled it back into how to use ubuntu to do your needs
[20:50] <an3k> yeah but that's not the point
[20:50] <ikonia> which is very much on topic
[20:51] <an3k> the point is that someone should tell daftykins to wait a bit longer before shouting offtoiuc
[20:51] <ikonia> thats fine, we can talk to him about that
[20:51] <ikonia> your point seems to be changing to be honest, you've come in here angry and you're looking for a point
[20:51] <an3k> in here? sure
[20:51] <an3k> in #ubuntu not
[20:51] <ikonia> first it was me, then it was false advice, then it was I took over, then it was someone shouted offtopic, then it was someone shouted offtopic too quick
[20:52] <ikonia> but I'm happy to talk to daftykins to cool him off on the offtopic triffer
[20:52] <ikonia> so thats fair
[20:53] <an3k> ikonia: everything was fine until you took over the convo while there was absolutely no need for it.
[20:53] <ikonia> it really didn't look fine
[20:53] <an3k> And insteadof checking "Does he already gets help? Is the help he gets good? etc" you just overtook the convo
[20:53] <ikonia> and if you look at the lines you've pasted above, it looks less fine than when I started taling to him
[20:53] <ikonia> he didn't appear to be getting help, so I pushed to find his real needs,
[20:54] <ikonia> nothing more, and he responded
[20:54] <an3k> for sure he responded, he's obviously well educated
[20:54] <ikonia> the only reason you're in this channel is your attitude and smart mouth comments
[20:54] <an3k> and you don't know if the good help or not because - as you already said - you don't know what was written before you joined
[20:54] <ikonia> if you had focussed on calmly helping and disucssing your disagreement in advice, there would be no problem
[20:55] <ikonia> the lines I saw where not good and the user looked lost, so I asked him to clarify his needs,
[20:55] <an3k> exactly but you didn't even gave me a chance to ask him what he really wants.
[20:55] <ikonia> he responded with good info, if a bit unsure of how he wanted his goals and seems happy with his options now
[20:55] <ikonia> an3k: you kept saying it didn't matter
[20:55] <ikonia> and telling me not to ask what he wants
[20:55] <ikonia> so it seems to suggest you really didn't want to know
[20:56] <an3k> the only reason I was in #ubuntu was for giving help / getting some help because #ubuntu-server is kind of dead
[20:56] <ikonia> thats great
[20:56] <ikonia> and it's valued
[20:59] <ikonia> an3k: ok ? all good now ?
[21:00] <an3k> is there nothing like a Professional Support Contract?
[21:00] <ikonia> sorry what ?
[21:00] <ikonia> in what context ? and where ?
[21:01] <an3k> I want professional support. I have some issues but don't get any support
[21:02] <ikonia> you can pay some companies for professional support
[21:02] <ikonia> or you can take your chances with community support
[21:05] <Jordan_U> an3k: http://www.canonical.com/services
[21:08] <ikonia> an3k: everything ok now ? if I remove the ban forward i #ubuntu, can you rejoin and keep a cooler head please ?
[21:08] <an3k> thanks Jordan_U
[21:08] <ikonia> if there are any problems you're free to re-join this channel (#ubuntu-ops) to voice them
[21:08] <an3k> ikonia: no need, I won't come back
[21:08] <ikonia> that way it doesn't look bad to the channel
[21:08] <ikonia> oh, ok
[21:08] <ikonia> I guess we're done then,
[21:08] <an3k> yep
[21:08] <ikonia> please /part the channel,
[21:15] <Myrtti> nicomachus: did you need help with something, or did you just come to watch the show?
[21:15] <nicomachus> sorry, observing. I was curious.
[21:15] <Myrtti> !logs
[21:57] <ikonia> hello again an3k
[21:57] <ikonia> I think you may have #ubuntu and #ubuntu-server on your autojoin
[21:59] <Jordan_U> ikonia: Should we just change the ban forward to a straight ban?
[22:00] <ikonia> perhaps
[22:00] <ikonia> unless he's changed his mind
[22:01] <an3k> well I'm back for talking but just listening
[22:01] <ikonia> sorry, what does that mena ?
[22:01] <ikonia> mena
[22:01] <ikonia> mean
[22:02] <Myrtti> an3k: you might want to check the topic
[22:02] <an3k> Myrtti: of what channel?
[22:02] <Myrtti> this channel
[22:02] <Myrtti> did you need help with something, still?
[22:03] <an3k> ikonia: that means that I'll not write anything into #ubuntu or the other channels unless someone asks me directly.
[22:04] <ikonia> well, you're not in #ubuntu, due to the ban forward here,
[22:04] <ikonia> so probably best you just leave
[22:04] <an3k> yeah I know that but you said something like "[22:08:16] <ikonia> an3k: everything ok now ? if I remove the ban forward i #ubuntu, can you rejoin and keep a cooler head please ?"
[22:05] <ikonia> yes, you then stated you wouldn't be back
[22:06] <an3k> yes, for seeking help or randomly providing help, except someone asks me directly. This implies that I won't go on rage again (or however you want to name it).
[22:07] <ikonia> personally - I'm not happy with how you behave in the channel, more so how you behaved in this channel, so I'd rather you stay out, you burnt your chance with me for a while, one of the other operators may feel different though
[22:08] <an3k> so you completely changed your mind within the last hour?
[22:08] <ikonia> no, after you rage quit and said you wouldn't be back
[22:09] <ikonia> the others may feel differnt as at this point, I don't value your attitude
[22:09] <an3k> That wasn't a rage quit. I just didn't wanted to waste any more time. And by that I don't mean my help attempt to jc or our talk was a waste but I didn't got help for various server issues and I have to finish that server so ...
[22:10] <ikonia> "I won't be back"
[22:11] <ikonia> probably best I back out as I'm not a fan of your comments
[22:11] <ikonia> leave it to one of the others to see how they feel
[22:11] <an3k> the comments I made after joining the channel ~14 minutes before?
[22:11] <ikonia> all of it
[22:12] <Jordan_U> an3k: So, to be completely clear, you *do* now want access to #ubuntu and #ubuntu-server, correct?
[22:13] <an3k> Jordan_U: it's only #ubuntu
[22:13] <an3k> I'm not banned on any other channel
[22:13] <an3k> the problem with #ubuntu-server is there's nearly no help
[22:15] <Jordan_U> an3k: OK, getting unbanned from #ubuntu is pretty simple, you just have to agree to follow the channel's guidelines (and we have to have reason from your comments and history to actually believe that you will). So please start by reading the channel guidelines...
[22:15] <Jordan_U> !guidelines | an3k
[22:18] <an3k> Pretty much the same as the old channels had 15 years back in time :) So yes, I do agree
[22:18] <an3k> However I do have one questions regarding the guidelines.
[22:19] <Jordan_U> an3k: And that is?
[22:20] <an3k> Do everybody has to follow these guidelines or are there exceptions? Asking for a friend ;)
[22:21] <Jordan_U> an3k: Everyone must follow these guidelines.
[22:22] <an3k> ok, thank you. I'd then let calm down the situation and would like to talk about the issue tomorrow around the same time if that is ok.
[22:24] <Jordan_U> an3k: That sounds like a great idea. I'm not sure I'll be around tomorrow but I'm sure someone will.
[22:29] <Jordan_U> an3k: Please part #ubuntu-ops until you're ready to talk again tomorrow.