[03:37] <ahoneybun> the heck is going on with this "Flames_in_Paradise" mparillo ?
[04:45] <bshah> yofel: removed patch from kubuntu_unstable as that doesn't apply anymore after mck182's change got in. you will probably want new release for xenial (tar is already redone)
[06:53] <soee> hmm, right click on desktop not working, right click in other apps seems to be a bit laggy
[06:54] <soee> krunner can't find anything so as application lanuncher
[06:55] <valorie> in wily, or xenial?
[06:55] <soee> valorie: xenial
[06:55] <valorie> ok, I've not updated that laptop yet
[06:55] <soee> :)
[06:56] <soee> Plasma 5.5 is pretty cool, except some small issues
[06:56] <soee> but i see some randomness here
[06:58] <valorie> I saw you in #plasma, helping out
[06:58] <valorie> thank you for that
[07:02] <soee> yup devs helped and we found faulty code :) and Philip removed it from Frameworks 5.18 so it looks pretty stable now
[07:03] <soee> i'm happy looking at what is done now = new plasma, new frameworks and apps are wip
[07:04] <soee> and from what i see Plasma 5.6 is scheduled on 17 March so it should get into Xenial before release in april
[07:05] <soee> so to sum it up, 16.04 schould be damn cool release :)
[07:05] <valorie> have we done enough streamlining to make that possible?
[07:05] <soee> what exactly ?
[07:06] <valorie> getting this all done has been a pretty heavy life
[07:06] <valorie> lift
[07:07] <rww> If I want to poke around the new hotness in Kubuntu and don't mind stuff breaking, where would I be looking? xenial's repositories or add a PPA on top of that?
[07:07] <rww> (and if I have bugs with your answer, do you want them tagged/filed a special way?)
[07:08] <valorie> rww: we don't have plasma 5.4.3 backported to wily yet
[07:08] <valorie> and not sure we'll get it
[07:08] <soee> valorie: it is for Wily :)
[07:08] <soee> http://kubuntu.org/news/plasma-5-4-3-and-applications-15-08-3-for-kubuntu-15-10/
[07:09] <soee> Plasma 5.5 is no backported though
[07:09] <rww> So xenial?
[07:09] <soee> rww: i'm using xenial on my laptop like few weeks already
[07:10] <valorie> soee: have you been filing bugs in launchpad for xenial?
[07:10] <valorie> I've not been
[07:10] <valorie> oops, I meant 5.5.3 sheesh
[07:10] <valorie> I honestly saw very few differences with 5.4.3
[07:10] <soee> if you want to help testing new stuff use Xenial
[07:10] <rww> Just file bugs the usual-way using ubuntu-bug?
[07:10] <soee> valorie: not yet, i was waiting for Plasma 5.5 and new Frameworks
[07:10] <valorie> rww: my travel laptop is xenial
[07:10] <valorie> haven't upgraded for a few weeks though
[07:11] <valorie> rww: i always advise that
[07:11] <soee> i usually try to find someone here who can confirm some bugs and than i'm reporting them
[07:11] <valorie> it's the best
[07:12] <soee> but there are bugs in Plasma, Applications that are not our job 
[07:12] <rww> sounds good. any mailing list in particular I should be on? kubuntu-devel?
[07:12] <soee> so then best to consult with Plasma devs
[07:13] <rww> for doing that on IRC, #kde-devel or somewhere better?
[07:13] <rww> sorry for all the questions, it's been a while
[07:13] <soee> rww: yes, on this list often some stuff to test is announced etc.
[07:13] <soee> rww: also #plasma
[07:13] <soee> plasma is for desktop environment - panel, widgets, kcms etc.
[07:14] <soee> kde-devel for applications
[07:15] <valorie> rww: I usually default to here first
[07:15] <rww> *nod*
[07:16] <valorie> those other chans second, and an ML next -- sometimes even when I get a good answer
[07:16] <valorie> everybody's on the list, and not everybody uses IRC
[08:18] <soee> i have fixed the right click
[09:10] <soee> yofel: ping me when you have 2 min
[10:32] <mparillo> ahoneybun: You talking about the bug reporter who originally reported https://bugs.launchpad.net/kubuntu-website/+bug/1532157 with two separate bugs in two separate components, who split out the second (more of a request actually) into Launchpad bug 1532372
[10:32] <mparillo> I fixed the first, and was asking for website permissions to fix the second
[11:00] <yofel> soee: ping
[11:04] <soee> yofel: i had problems with right click on desktop today. After some checks o noticed that not all Frameworks packages were updated to 5.18. Now i wonder why: yesterday i'v downgraded all to 5.17 than some packages where upgraded to 5.18 (when i was testing them). But after we wound faulty package i run upgrade with frameworks staging ppa enabled, so i thought all packages should be updates to 5.18 but they were not. Any idea why ?
[11:05] <yofel> not without knowing what exactly you told apt to do..
[11:06] <soee> :/
[11:06] <yofel> I did the same, but for me a dist-upgrade upgraded everything
[11:07]  * yofel uploads new kwallet
[11:09] <soee> again ?
[11:09] <yofel> the new tarball
[11:09] <soee> ah so mck182 fixed it ?
[11:10] <yofel> yep, and devid did a respin
[11:10] <yofel> *david
[11:10] <soee> cool
[11:15] <yofel> and let me rename discover again
[11:17] <yofel> Riddell: with https://git.reviewboard.kde.org/r/126680/ - would you also name the source plasma-discover please? We already have a 'discover' in the archive so we need to rename anyway
[11:19] <BluesKaj> Hi folks
[11:20] <yofel> hey
[11:21] <BluesKaj> hi yofel , how goes the battle ?  :-)
[11:22] <yofel> making progress, after I'm done renaming discover again I can start testing plasma 5.5 on wily
[11:22] <BluesKaj> right
[11:22] <yofel> apps OTOH, will probably take another week or so
[11:22] <yofel> (including the merges)
[11:24] <yofel> why do we have an amarok beta release in wily backports ppa o.O?
[11:24] <BluesKaj> ok yofel , good to know
[11:28] <soee> yofel: do you have machine with Xenial maybe ?
[11:28] <yofel> soee: yes?
[11:29] <soee> with 5.5.3 and 5.18 ?
[11:29] <yofel> yes
[11:30] <soee> please take a look how clipboard icon is rendered for me after reboot: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fN69H_HpSzQ
[11:30] <yofel> clivejo: I committed your amarok beta packaging to bzr, but that needs cleanup before it can be uploaded to xenial
[11:30] <soee> it was ok again when i moved back to 5.17 yesterday
[11:30] <mparillo> After upgrading to Plasma 5.5.3 on Xenial, Muon Update Manager seems to list updates available, but does nothing when I click on apply updates. Maybe I caught some things in progress. Using apt now and will report back next time updates are available.
[11:30] <soee> but after upgrading to 5.18 it happens again
[11:31] <yofel> my icon is fine here, but I have some other item that's completely invisible
[11:31] <soee> so it looks like it starts rendering - scaling up - but hangs in some moment
[11:31] <yofel> hm, could be panel size dependent then
[11:32] <soee> there are also some rendering problems when moving panel
[11:32] <soee> task manager items get strange size, loose spaces
[11:32] <soee> etc.
[11:33] <soee> so i'm sure that in 5.18 there was some other change that has influance on rendering 
[11:33] <yofel> that's upstream bugs IMO
[11:34] <soee> yup, just wanted to find someone who can confirm them
[11:40] <clivejo> I did amarok beta packaging?
[11:41] <yofel> sometime in august it looks like
[11:41] <clivejo> :/
[11:41] <clivejo> maybe just practising
[11:41] <yofel> possibly, but it ended up in the stable backports ppa, so now we kind of have to support it
[11:42] <clivejo> is amarok on alioth?
[11:42] <yofel> no
[11:42] <yofel> and I wouldn't bother moving the qt4 version 
[11:43] <yofel> or moving anything until we've decided what to do with our git stuff
[11:43] <clivejo> http://anonscm.debian.org/cgit/pkg-kde/kde-extras/amarok.git/
[11:43] <clivejo> cant use that then?
[11:43] <yofel> no
[11:43] <clivejo> :(
[11:43] <clivejo> can we convert the bzr to a git archive?
[11:44] <yofel> well, you can on LP if you want to. But if we keep our own repo then preferably migrate the history
[11:44] <yofel> there was some bzr-git-import plugin IIRC
[11:44] <clivejo> as you know Im not fan of bzr
[11:45] <yofel> I'm not particulary a fan of it either, but for simply packaging branches it does the job just fine
[11:45] <yofel> *simple
[11:45] <yofel> but as I said, feel free to migrate the repo to git
[11:45] <clivejo> so why dont we use debian got?
[11:46] <clivejo> git
[11:46] <yofel> we talked about moving our stuff away, didn't we? So for now I wouldn't use alioth for stuff where we have our own repo
[11:47] <clivejo> ok :(
[11:47] <yofel> LP can do git just fine now. So use that if you really can't work with bzr
[11:49] <yofel> amarok looks so unmaintained that I really wouldn't bother investing much time in it anyway..
[11:49] <clivejo> I have a bad memory, its hard enough learning one batch of commands, but my brain just refuses to work with certain things
[11:49] <yofel> did you never use svn?
[11:49] <clivejo> nope
[11:50] <yofel> ah ok
[11:50] <yofel> then bzr and git will feel very different indeed
[11:51] <clivejo> I learned to program in Minux while at uni.  It put me off programming and I ended up in building management 
[11:51] <clivejo> I havent really looked into programming since
[11:51] <clivejo> I have on and off days
[11:52] <clivejo> some days I can read and write code like it is second nature, other days its like some kind of alien language
[11:53] <yofel> even professionals have that, there it's called developaralysis
[11:53] <yofel> http://techcrunch.com/2014/10/18/you-too-may-be-a-victim-of-developaralysis/
[11:54] <clivejo> I prefer physical challeges now, plumbing, electrical, anything involving hands I guess
[11:55] <yofel> get yourself a raspi and start automating your house, then you get both sides :P
[11:55] <clivejo> I do :P
[11:55] <yofel> :D
[11:55] <yofel> come to think of it, our l10n stuff would benefit a lot from a git migration..
[11:55] <yofel> that uses a bazillion branches
[11:57] <clivejo> grrr my pup is possessed
[11:57] <yofel> what?!
[11:58] <clivejo> he ripped his bed apart this morning, I took him for a walk and stopped at my mothers house for breakfast.  Left him outside for 10mins and he ripped out all my motthers pot plants
[11:58] <yofel> . . .
[11:58] <clivejo> hes eating my welly at the moment
[12:00] <clivejo> while trying to sweep up the soil and clean the mess up he was trying to bite and run away with the brush
[12:03] <clivejo> I need to run into town for some supplies.  Need some flux ASAP
[12:05] <clivejo> has kwallet been fixed now?
[12:05] <bshah> aye
[12:05] <clivejo> uploaded?
[12:06] <bshah> no idea..
[12:06] <bshah> <- not a ~kubuntu-dev
[12:06] <yofel> yes
[12:06] <soee> clivejo: yofet tooked care of it
[12:06] <clivejo> is it in landing?
[12:07] <clivejo> ah yes
[12:07] <clivejo> kwallet-kf5 - 5.18.0a-0ubuntu1~ubuntu16.04~ppa1 
[12:08] <yofel> bah, my epoch hackery isn't working
[12:08] <clivejo> has anyone tested this version ?
[12:09] <clivejo> only 44mins old 
[12:10] <lordievader> Besides 16.04 are there other versions of Kubuntu that frequently require testing?
[12:11] <clivejo> lordievader: backports to wily?
[12:11] <clivejo> hi sick_rimmit, are you still sick?
[12:11] <yofel> what do you mean with frequently?
[12:12] <lordievader> Well, I can image that there are times to test something on 14.04 but not frequently anymore. Basically I am trying to figure out which installs I should have on my test box.
[12:12] <sick_rimmit> Yes :-( 
[12:12] <clivejo> yofel: with kwallet fixed is Plasma5.5 ready for wily?
[12:13] <sick_rimmit> I am improving, but it really given me a hard time
[12:13] <yofel> clivejo: not until I'm done with discover - where I'm a bit stuck right now
[12:13] <clivejo> stuck?
[12:13] <clivejo> isnt it just a rename?
[12:14]  * clivejo says "just" like he knows the process of renaming a package
[12:14] <yofel> lordievader: generally, we "support" last LTS, current stable and dev. As we're currently developing the next LTS, the last one doesn't really recieve any attention anymore
[12:15] <yofel> clivejo: there's epochs involved...
[12:15] <yofel> I would like to drop those with the rename, but I didn't really want to rename the binaries *right now*, as the app itself only gets renamed for 5.6
[12:16] <lordievader> yofel: So, it is best for testing to have 15.10 (with backports) and 16.04 installed?
[12:16] <yofel> but the libdiscover is new and should not carry an epoch, but e.g. muon-discover depends on libdiscover (= ${binary:Version}) which needs an epoch that libdiscover doesn't have
[12:16] <yofel> -> boom
[12:16] <yofel> so I might go and rename the binaries after all :/
[12:17] <yofel> and just leave the epoch on the transitional packages with loose deps
[12:17] <yofel> lordievader: yes
[12:17] <lordievader> Check, thanks :)
[12:18] <BluesKaj> I have muon on xenial by installing libmuon first then muon itself
[12:19] <yofel> talking about that..
[12:19] <BluesKaj> bbl
[12:19] <yofel> sick_rimmit: how's muon maintenance working out?
[12:23] <mparillo> I applied the updates to Xenial with Plasma 5.5.3, and after rebooting, I no longer needed to enter my WEP password, but now I have to enter my kwallet password to connect to WiFi.
[12:24] <yofel> mparillo: did you remove pam_kwallet.so from the pam config?
[12:24] <yofel> *kwallet5
[12:28] <mparillo> No, is that they way we will eventually ship 16.04?
[12:28] <ovidiu-florin> mparillo: hello
[12:29] <ovidiu-florin> can that card be closed?
[12:29] <yofel> mparillo: no, I just remembered us talking about it. But that really should work..
[12:29] <yofel> I'll test it in a bit
[12:30] <mparillo> In general, I prefer to remain pretty vanilla, (not to mention I do not know how to change my pam config), but I would be happy to test with you.
[12:30] <mparillo> ovidiu-florin: Which card, the Wikipeadia card?
[12:33] <mparillo> sudo nano /etc/pam.conf ?
[12:33] <mparillo> Mine is all comments.
[12:34] <yofel>  /etc/pam.d/sddm should have 2 lines with pam_kwallet5.so
[12:36] <mparillo> So I comment out by: # -auth   optional        pam_kwallet5.so
[12:37] <yofel> that shouldn't be commented out
[12:37] <mparillo> # -session optional       pam_kwallet5.so auto_start
[12:37] <ovidiu-florin> mparillo: yes the wikipedia card
[12:39] <mparillo> So, after editing, cat  /etc/pam.d/sddm | grep pam_kwallet5.so shows both lines as commented out
[12:40] <mparillo> ovidiu-florin: I am content with the wikipedia card being closed, assuming nobody else has any suggestions. After 16.04, I would want to update Wikipedia again, but that can be a new card if you prefer.
[12:40] <mparillo> re-booting to test the kwallet for wifi password.
[12:42] <yofel> mparillo: they should NOT be commented out
[12:44] <yofel> ok, discover building, let me try out kwallet
[12:48] <ovidiu-florin> yofel: what heppend to the Trello->IRC bot?
[12:48] <yofel> that was implemented in kubotu, whose server seems to be dead
[12:50] <yofel> mparillo: kwallet works fine for me now
[12:56] <mparillo> OK, that was way too painful
[12:57] <mparillo> I removed the comments and reverted
[12:59] <yofel> discover rework finished, my last couple commits could do with a review if someone wants to (sgclark, clivejo ?)
[12:59] <yofel> plasma 5.5 users might have to force-downgrade libdiscover
[13:01] <bshah> oopsie.. yet another version downgrade..
[13:01] <bshah> hmmm
[13:02] <yofel> sorry about that
[13:05] <yofel> ovidiu-florin: something I just realized for the packaging docs, I strongly recommend every packager to have a ~/.dput.cf with this content:
[13:05] <yofel> [DEFAULT]
[13:05] <yofel> default_host_main = ppa
[13:05] <yofel> this isn't that important for beginners, but really important for every person with primary archive upload permissions
[13:06] <yofel> and by that time, you can easily forget to add that
[13:35] <yofel> hm, kwallet-pam is missing transitional packages
[13:36] <yofel> or updating the recommends in plasma-desktop should work as well
[13:47] <clivejo> testing from landing?
[13:48] <yofel> that's what I'm doing
[13:48] <yofel> still finding stuff to fix, but slowly running out
[13:49] <sgclark> just woke up, need at least a cup of coffee lol
[13:49] <clivejo> you say that like its a bad thing!
[13:49] <yofel> well, the first part is the bad thing
[13:49] <yofel> but I think we can do a public tester call this evening
[13:50] <sgclark> sorry whats going on?
[13:50]  * clivejo cheers and does happy dance
[13:50] <yofel> sgclark: talking about plasma
[13:50]  * sgclark scrolls
[13:53] <sgclark> mm bouncer did not keep enough to be useful. I will look at the notes.
[13:54] <clivejo> sgclark: mailing list might be more helpful, basically KDE have respun a tarball for kwallet
[13:54] <sgclark> ahhh
[13:54] <yofel> sgclark: I would appreciate it if you could review my discover rename
[13:54] <yofel> the rest we pretty much took care of
[13:55] <clivejo> yofel: how do I review?
[13:55] <yofel> just look at the last 5 commits in kubuntu_xenial_archive
[13:56] <yofel> the idea was to rename to the coming 5.6 name, drop the epoch and only add the epoch for the transitional packages
[13:56] <clivejo> does the debian git branch get renamed too?
[13:56] <yofel> no, git matches the upstream source name
[13:57] <yofel> thinking about it, my changes probably screwed up the CI
[13:57] <yofel> oh well
[13:57] <clivejo> yofel:  in rules $(overridden_command) --dbg-package=muon-discover-dbg
[13:58] <sgclark> lots of broken merges I see, I can work on those today
[13:58] <clivejo> rename there too or no?
[13:58] <yofel> clivejo: that's fixed in some other commit
[13:58] <clivejo> is it?
[13:58] <clivejo> I thought I was current
[13:58] <yofel> It's fixed here and I have no diff and nothing to push..
[13:59] <clivejo> ah I see it now
[13:59] <clivejo> what does muon.postinst do?
[14:00] <yofel> nothing useful, delete
[14:00] <yofel> I forgot to do that
[14:00] <sgclark> I cant seem to find the repo 
[14:00]  * sgclark needs more coffee
[14:00] <yofel> plasma/discover.git
[14:00] <sgclark> ah
[14:00] <clivejo> http://anonscm.debian.org/cgit/pkg-kde/plasma/discover.git
[14:01] <clivejo> the language files arent installed?
[14:02] <clivejo> oh muon-exporter, what ever that is
[14:02] <yofel> I have no idea what muon-exporter is supposed to be
[14:02] <clivejo> will upstream rename too?
[14:03] <yofel> clivejo: https://git.reviewboard.kde.org/r/126680/
[14:03] <yofel> that's where I got the names from
[14:04] <clivejo> I see
[14:06] <clivejo> if you have custom wallpaper does plasma change it back to default?
[14:06] <yofel> it shouldn't
[14:06] <clivejo> only if you use the default already?
[14:07] <yofel> yep
[14:08] <clivejo> where is the updated kwallet tarball?
[14:08] <clivejo> depot?
[14:08] <yofel> yes
[14:10] <sgclark> yofel: the lintain-overrides still contain conent for muon, is that on purpose?
[14:10] <clivejo> whats the tool that scans for orphaned files?
[14:10] <yofel> sgclark: the binaries are still called muon-* for now, so I just fixed the package names in the lintian-override files
[14:10] <yofel> clivejo: orphaned files?
[14:11] <sgclark> ok
[14:11] <clivejo> files that apt may have left behind?
[14:11] <sgclark> there is a tool for that?!
[14:11] <yofel> apt never leaves stuff behind, except config files
[14:11] <clivejo> or I installed manually
[14:11] <clivejo> there was a tool for it
[14:11] <clivejo> compared the physical files to apt 
[14:11] <yofel> and if config files are left then the package is still in the dpkg DB as uninstalled/configured or so
[14:12] <yofel> there is debsums, but that's checksum checking for installed packages
[14:12] <clivejo> I had a problem with kde theme for sddm
[14:13] <clivejo> I used a tool before called fluff or lint or something like that
[14:14] <yofel>  /lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/security/libpam_kwallet5.so
[14:15] <yofel> that probably won't work if our sddm profile says "pam_kwallet5.so" which was the lib name in the old package
[14:15] <yofel> and as all other files in there are called pam_*, I wonder why kwallet is suddenly called libpam_*
[14:15] <yofel> anyway
[14:15]  * yofel out shopping, bbl
[14:16] <soee> yofel: http://pastebin.com/uJRLKugs
[14:16] <soee> are you working on discover and it causes some problems ?
[14:17] <sgclark> yofel: looks good to me. 
[14:22] <clivejo> I think I prefered the old plasma icons for shutdown/reboot etc :/
[14:23] <vishalrao> clivejo: you mean the colourful ones or the monochromatic ones?
[14:23] <clivejo> mono ones
[14:24] <clivejo> eakk
[14:24] <vishalrao> me too, the mono ones seem to be there on the default app launcher, but the ugly colourful ones on the menu launcher (this is on plasma 5.4.3 sorry, seem to be same for plasma 5.5.3 IINM)
[14:25] <clivejo> just switch the them
[14:25] <clivejo> theme
[14:25] <clivejo> I no likey!
[14:25] <vishalrao> theme to what?
[14:25] <soee> can someone test one thing: if you create new user account and login there, it will use old oxygen icons 
[14:25] <clivejo> dark breeze
[14:26] <clivejo> yuck yuck yuck
[14:28] <sgclark> I liked the old ones too, new ones dont seem to fit
[14:30] <vishalrao> soee: seem to be regular breeze icons in new account for me
[14:30] <clivejo> hmmmm
[14:30] <vishalrao> soee: oh wait, yeah, the right click menu seems to be old oxygen icons, same on buttons etc
[14:31] <clivejo> Im gonna have to look for a new theme
[14:31] <clivejo> any suggestions?
[14:31] <vishalrao> can't the breeze theme be modified to use the old mono icons (if the mono icons are still in there) ?
[14:32] <soee> iconset or desktop theme ?
[14:32] <soee> vishalrao: ok thanks for checking
[14:35] <clivejo> I like the dark breeze kickoff menu and taskbar, but the light breeze for windows and rest of system
[14:36] <sgclark> ok, I am confused, I still see alot of red, but we are ready for testing?
[14:37] <clivejo> red for what?
[14:38] <sgclark> apps
[14:38] <soee> plasma and frameworks shoudl be ready
[14:38] <soee> apps are not
[14:38] <sgclark> oh
[14:38] <sgclark> ok
[14:38] <soee> yofel: said 1 week is needed for finieh the, :)
[14:38] <clivejo> plasma 5.5.3 is ready for testing
[14:39] <sgclark> cool ok
[14:39] <clivejo> apps 15.12.0 still needs work
[14:39] <mparillo> It seems as if the muon changes (muon-discover muon-notifier muon-updater) are held back
[14:39] <sgclark> got it, I am clear now thanks
[14:39] <clivejo> ovidiu-florin: you still want to finish okular?
[14:40] <soee> mparillo: confirmed here
[14:44] <clivejo> BTW does kubuntu not brand the kickoff menu icon?
[14:44] <soee> yofel: http://paste.ubuntu.com/14447156/
[14:45] <ovidiu-florin> clivejo: yes, but I'm still kind of tired
[14:45] <ovidiu-florin> and it's hard for me to focus on reading the symbols documentation for packaging
[14:46] <ovidiu-florin> and my keyboard looks backwards
[14:47] <ovidiu-florin> if you can explain it to me in a few simple words, I might get it faster
[14:47] <sgclark> kubuntu does not brand much of anything. 
[14:48] <sgclark> ovidiu-florin: as you probably know there is nothing simple about symbols. But you can run that command in the README I pointed out yesterday for a quick start.
[14:55] <ovidiu-florin> sgclark: but I'm not sure I understand the prboblem yet
[14:56] <sgclark> ovidiu-florin: sorry I don't understand
[14:58] <yofel> soee: sudo apt install libdiscover=5.5.3a-0ubuntu1~ubuntu16.04~ppa1
[14:58] <yofel> the rest should figure itself out after that
[15:01] <yofel> mparillo: for you too: sudo apt install libdiscover=5.5.3a-0ubuntu1~ubuntu16.04~ppa1
[15:01] <yofel> BluesKaj: ^
[15:03] <BluesKaj> yofel:  but i don't want muon discover, I'll stick with plain muon, but thanks anyway :-)
[15:03] <yofel> ah right
[15:04] <yofel> hm, I really don't get why our kwallet modules are called libpam suddenly
[15:05] <ovidiu-florin> sgclark: I'm not sure I understand the symbols problem with the okular package
[15:06] <yofel> ovidiu-florin: did you kind of get the point of having symbol files yet?
[15:06] <ovidiu-florin> I understand teh point of having them
[15:07] <yofel> ok, so the problem right now with okular is that the symbol table in the packaging doesn't match with the one generated at build time from the built binary
[15:07] <soee> yofel: worked
[15:07] <ovidiu-florin> https://paste.kde.org/pvgywrux2
[15:08] <ovidiu-florin> yofel: that seems pretty obvious, that they would not match, since it's a newer version of the software. 
[15:08] <ovidiu-florin> Why are the symbol files stored in the packaging?
[15:09] <yofel> if you look into the file, you will see that every symbol has the okular version that it appeared in appended to it
[15:10] <yofel> that information is used by dpkg-shlibdeps to generate properly versioned library dependencies for packages that use libokularcore
[15:11] <yofel> it is also used to make sure that no symbols disappear between releases without upstream updating the so version of the library
[15:12] <yofel> that would be an ABI break and would cause applications to fail to run like this: akregator: symbol lookup error: /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libKF5AkonadiCore.so.5: undefined symbol: _ZTIN7Akonadi8Protocol7CommandE
[15:13] <yofel> that's why the package actually fails to build when a symbol goes missing
[15:13] <yofel> (for C++, that's not sufficient actually and you need abi-compliance-checker, but that's a different topic)
[15:14] <yofel> now okular did change the soversion from 6 to 7, and clive updated the packaging to reflect this, he just didn't get to update the symbol files
[15:14] <yofel> so you now need to update the symbol files in the packaging, remove any #MISSING# lines from them and you're done
[15:15] <ovidiu-florin> ok
[15:15] <ovidiu-florin> I understand what needs to be done
[15:16] <ovidiu-florin> but still I don't understand why it is the package's responsibility to make sure backwards compatibility is not broken?
[15:16] <yofel> because the software authors cannot be trusted
[15:17] <yofel> so this is a very basic saftey measure, as well as information for dpkg-shlibdeps to generate proper deps
[15:17] <yofel> latter was what the file was really meant for when it was introduced for C applications
[15:22] <ovidiu-florin> "<yofel> because the software authors cannot be trusted" - This seems like a very big issue to me
[15:22] <yofel> well, C++ ABI rules are so mental, that most developers don't even know all of them and end up breaking them by accident
[15:22] <yofel> and KDE CI still has no ABI check AFAIK
[15:23] <sgclark> still has no what?
[15:23] <yofel> sgclark: does build.kde.org run abi-compliance-checker yet?
[15:23] <sgclark> yet? I have heard nothing about this requirement
[15:24] <yofel> I'm pretty sure that was talked about a while ago, but ben either didn't seem interested or didn't have time as usual
[15:24] <yofel> but without kde upstream validating ABI, we have to
[15:24] <sgclark> well no one told me... it is my ci now
[15:25] <sgclark> I will add a workitem for it, now that I am aware..
[15:25] <yofel> it's not a requirement. It's just a good-to-have thing for the kde parts that guarantee a stable ABI
[15:25] <sgclark> yep, agreed, I will work on it
[15:26] <yofel> ovidiu-florin: regarding the c++ rules, enjoy the read: https://techbase.kde.org/Policies/Binary_Compatibility_Issues_With_C%2B%2B
[15:26]  * yofel -> lunch
[16:02] <yofel> wtf
[16:02] <yofel> if I compile kwallet-pam by hand I get pam_kwallet5.so
[16:04] <yofel> eeeeeeeeeeehm
[16:04] <yofel> debian/patches/fix_install_location.diff
[16:04] <yofel> -set_target_properties (${library_name} PROPERTIES PREFIX "")
[16:10]  * yofel talks to maxy..
[17:21] <clivejo> anyone using activites?
[17:27] <clivejo> On Plasma 5.5.3 I have a few activities for different tasks.  I have one for Kubuntu and I added an icon.  I want to add an icon for OSM but the select file dialogue box wont work.  Can anyone confirm?
[17:50] <acher88> Hmmm.. The file picker comes up below the preceding 2 dialogue boxes here, and so is unusable
[17:50] <clivejo> same here acher88
[17:50] <clivejo> I guess that makes it a bug
[17:52] <acher88> I can close the other 2 as well, but not the file picker.
[17:52] <acher88> Have to kill that window which nukes plasmashell as well
[17:54] <acher88> Hmm. on 2nd try it's now at least closeable. odd
[17:55] <clivejo> hummmm now I cant get logged on to bugs.kde.org
[17:56] <clivejo> fancy reporting it acher88?
[17:57] <acher88> https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=357533
[17:58] <clivejo> acher88: your on fedora?
[17:58] <clivejo> oh no, thats not you
[17:59] <acher88> Nope. Thought best to do a quick search first
[18:00] <clivejo> is my KDE ID not the same one I use for KDE Etherpad?
[18:00] <acher88> not a clue
[18:00] <clivejo> weird
[18:02] <clivejo> will you add a me too on that bug?
[18:03] <acher88> can't just this sec, and I think I'm going to have to re-register if I want to anyway
[18:04] <clivejo> hi Rick_Timmis
[18:07] <clivejo> Anyone know if and how can I setup two Quassel windows, each in a different activity and save/lock them to those activities?
[18:08] <clivejo> I want one on my Kubuntu activity and one on my OSM
[18:15] <sgclark> clivejo: no bugs.kde.org is seperate login
[18:17] <sgclark> I can change icons for activities, or am I mis understadning thee issue?
[18:19] <clivejo> I can change it, but I want a custom one
[18:19] <clivejo> not one already on the system
[18:19] <mparillo> acher88: For bugs.kde.org, you use an e-mail.
[18:20] <mparillo> It is public, so I use an ancient hotmail one, because I was afraid of spam, but I do not seem to get any.
[18:20] <clivejo> if I select "Other Icons:" and click the "Browse.." button, the window to select the file on local filesystem wont let me pick a file
[18:21] <clivejo> thankyou mparillo!!
[18:27] <acher88> Like: http://i.imgur.com/tuLbO1Z.png
[18:28] <clivejo> yup
[18:28] <mparillo> clivejo: You are welcome, but for what? Adding a me-too on the bug?
[18:29] <clivejo> to use my email to log in
[18:29] <clivejo> Ive been trying to get logged onto bugs.kde.org for about 20mins now!
[18:29] <clivejo> I was about to reset my password
[18:29] <clivejo> thats why I thanked you!
[18:30] <sgclark> ahh yes, confirmed
[18:31] <clivejo> not only does it appear behind the other windows, when you do drag it in front, it doesnt work7
[18:31] <sgclark> I marked the bug as confirmed. thanks all
[18:33] <mparillo> clivejo: My pleasure. I have lobbed plenty of bugs there (but not enough karma to allow me to mark a bug as confirmed, so thank you sgclark), so logging in with an e-mail is fresh in my mind. 
[18:33] <acher88> I shall check in Arch/Chakra
[18:34] <acher88> ditto. the same
[18:34] <acher88> not that I doubted it would be after all that....
[18:35] <clivejo> interestingly, if you add the icon via the Kickoff menu customise, it shows up to add to add it as an activities icon
[18:37] <acher88> by the way, if you switch kickoff to an application dashboard and then r-click to edit settings, I had an error on both real machine and VM
[18:38] <acher88> had to install a couple of extra kf5/qml packages to make that work
[18:38] <acher88> seemed to not get pulled in by default on the plasma install/upgrade
[18:39] <clivejo> the dropbox icon in dark breeze theme isnt very nice :/
[18:41] <acher88> qml-module-qt-labs-folderlistmodel and qml-module-qt-labs-settings 
[18:58] <sgclark> yofel: artikulate lintain errors are directly related to some changes you made. I made a note in the notepad if you would go ahead take a look when you have time.
[18:59] <clivejo> sgclark: how are pim packages coming along?
[19:00] <yofel> looking
[19:00] <sgclark> ok, but I doubt it will be done today. I plan to have some saturday to relax
[19:02] <yofel> actually clive did that, and it looks like he added some files that were in not-installed so far
[19:02] <yofel> those symlinks really shouldn't get installed
[19:02] <clivejo> what did I do?
[19:03] <yofel> look at linitian
[19:03] <clivejo> non-dev-pkg-with-shlib-symlink ?
[19:04] <yofel> all errors
[19:05] <clivejo> Im seeing 6 warnings?
[19:05] <yofel> yes, and the bold ones need fixing
[19:06] <clivejo> --> https://paste.kde.org/p8noudmfm
[19:06] <yofel> look at the status page, not the build log
[19:07] <clivejo> what status page?
[19:07] <yofel> http://qa.kubuntu.co.uk/ppa-status/applications/build_status_15.12.0_xenial.html
[19:07] <clivejo> its orange?
[19:07] <clivejo> or yellow :P
[19:07] <yofel> click at show/hide for artikulate
[19:08] <clivejo> wow, I didnt know it did that!#
[19:08] <clivejo> is that new?!?
[19:08] <yofel> that was there since script version one...
[19:09] <clivejo> ok, so what did I do wrong?
[19:09] <yofel> read up on what non-dev-pkg-with-shlib-symlink means
[19:10] <yofel> regarding package-name-doesnt-match-sonames, you simply didn't update the artikulate.lintian-errors file
[19:11] <clivejo> Shared libraries are supposed to place such symbolic links in their respective "-dev" packages, so it is a bug to include it with the main library package.  However, if this is a small package which includes the runtime and the development libraries, this is not a bug. In the latter case, please override this warning.
[19:11] <clivejo> there is no -dev package
[19:12] <yofel> right, why is that?
[19:12] <clivejo> private lib?
[19:12] <yofel> yes, no headers shipped for it
[19:12] <clivejo> so it should be in not installed?
[19:12] <yofel> yes
[19:13] <clivejo> ah
[19:15] <clivejo> so all the libs, sym links and all, go in not-installed?
[19:15] <yofel> no, only the symlinks
[19:15] <yofel> look at not-installed, they're already in there, just with the old, now broken syntax
[19:16] <yofel> if you put the libs in not-installed instead of shipping them artikulate would hardly work, would it ^^
[19:17] <clivejo> it might, by magic
[19:23] <clivejo> ok uploaded and commited
[19:33] <clivejo> yofel: does digikam provide KF5KipiConfig.cmake ?
[19:33] <sgclark> clivejo: new framework I believe
[19:34] <clivejo> sgclark: do you know what provides it?
[19:34] <clivejo> its a built dep of gwenview
[19:34] <sgclark> nope. googling..
[19:35] <yofel> kipi was libkipi in the past
[19:35] <yofel> no idea if that's ported yet
[19:35] <yofel> libkipi qt4 edition was part of apps
[19:36] <sgclark> oh libkipi and it is red
[19:36] <clivejo> oh its part of apps 15.12?
[19:36] <sgclark> yeah
[19:36] <clivejo> ah
[19:36] <sgclark> it is there and red
[19:36] <clivejo> explains a lot!
[19:47] <Riddell> clivejo: I don't think kf5kipi exists yte
[19:47] <Riddell> if gwenview or something is asking for it you can just ignore that
[19:56] <sgclark> hi Riddell!
[20:17] <Riddell> hola sgclark
[21:16] <murthy> Riddell: hi
[21:18] <murthy> Will i be given permission to post a fsf survery article link on the kubuntu channel?
[21:20] <murthy> yofel: ^
[21:30] <murthy>  valorie ?
[21:39] <valorie> go for it
[21:41] <murthy> thanks
[21:43] <claydoh> Is muon package manager broken, or is it dead?
[21:43] <claydoh> in 16.04
[21:45] <valorie> sick_rimmit: ^^^
[21:45] <valorie> how's it coming along?
[21:45]  * valorie hopes that muon is alive and well
[21:46] <valorie> and sick_rimmit too 
[21:46] <valorie> <3
[21:46] <mparillo> Did sick_rimmit volunteer to keep muon package manager going? https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/kubuntu-devel/2015-November/010137.html
[21:46] <mparillo> Ahh, valorie is sooooo fast.
[21:47]  * claydoh agrees with valorie, hopes both sick_rimmit and muon are ok
[21:48] <valorie> I'm pretty sure he would welcome patches to fix bugs.....
[22:08] <murthy> valorie: Did we get a new muon maintainer ?
[22:10] <valorie> yes, Rick Timmis
[22:10] <valorie> but whether he's taken over officially I don't know
[22:11] <valorie> and there
[22:11] <valorie> s the man in question
[22:12] <valorie> Rick_Timmis: do you need a paste of the conversation about you and muon?
[22:12] <murthy> super
[22:12] <murthy> finally muon will get some love
[22:14] <valorie> I like it so much better than synaptic, or any "software store"
[22:14] <murthy> +1
[22:19] <DarinMiller> BTW, if anyone is fighting the 16.04 daily download install bug,  unsquashfs'd the /casper/filesystem.squahfs file from 16.04 live usb.
[22:20] <DarinMiller> Replace /usr/lib/ubiquity/plugins/ubi-prepare.py with the same file from 15.10,  and mksquashfs squashfs-root filesystem.squashfs -b 1024k -comp xz -Xbcj x86 -e boot
[22:21] <DarinMiller> copy the filesystem.squahfs back to the live usb /casper directory and Bob's your uncle....
[22:24] <valorie> DarinMiller: please write to the kubuntu-devel list about that
[22:24] <valorie> sounds like a packaging issue
[22:24]  * valorie heads off to Star Wars
[22:25] <valorie> finally
[22:25] <yofel> enjoy :)
[22:26] <DarinMiller> The ubi-prepare.py a bug has been reported and triaged, but it has not landed in the daily downloads.  Someone posted here the other day that they could not install via the daily  dowload.
[22:27] <DarinMiller> Side note, the resulting install seem incomplete... debugging now.
[22:32] <DarinMiller> Nevermind.  Looks like the install did not go well.  Permissions were transferred to my username when I unsquahed.  Need to check if unsquash can preserve owership of files.
[23:42] <clivejo> is ricktimmis internet connection sick too?