=== ian is now known as ian-weisser
[08:14] <davidcalle> Morning o/
[08:19] <dholbach> good morning
[08:32] <davidcalle> Hey dholbach o/ How was the weekend?
[08:33] <popey> morning
[08:33] <MooDoo> morning
[08:42] <dholbach> hey davidcalle
[08:43] <dholbach> it was great - very relaxing - how was yours?
[08:43] <popey> I'll be afk most of the week I think
[08:43]  * dholbach hugs popey 
[08:44]  * davidcalle hugs popey as well, nothing serious I hope?
[08:46] <davidcalle> dholbach: fine, caught conjunctivitis from the kids, but I went to a cool petting farm yesterday with them yesterday, so let's say it equals out :D
[08:48] <dholbach> bah... that sucks :-/
[08:48] <dholbach> hope you'll be better soon again
[08:48] <popey> No, I'll be at https://www.embedded-world.de/
[08:48] <popey> so no Q&A or team meeting for me this week
[08:49] <popey> but I'll be on telegram (and will get pings on irc)
[08:50] <davidcalle> popey: well, that can be qualified as "serious"
[08:52] <davidcalle> dholbach: thanks, I'm quite fine :)
[08:52] <dholbach> ok :)
[08:54] <svij> morning!
[08:54] <svij> dpm (or anyone else): can you tell me why ubucon.org is down and where/who hosts it?
[08:54] <dpm> morning svij
[08:56] <popey> hah
[08:56] <dpm> svij, it's hosted from a shared box marcoceppi set up for us at amazon IIRC
[08:57]  * dholbach relocates to the office, brb
[08:57] <popey> o/
[08:58] <svij> dpm: isn't he hat MWC? Can you talk to him or what should we do?
[09:01] <dpm> svij, I'm not at MWC this week, but I'll send him an e-mail. Logging into the site, it seems juju is not even returning the output of juju status :/
[09:02] <svij> oh ok :-/
[09:02] <svij> what I wanted to say is, if he is at MWC, he probably won't have much time
[09:02] <svij> brb ~30min
[09:08] <czajkowski> aloha
[09:09] <dpm> morning czajkowski
[09:14] <czajkowski> ello hows everyone ?
[09:20] <davidcalle> czajkowski: great, you?
[09:22] <czajkowski> davidcalle: not bad looking at my crazy work inbox and wondering where to start
[09:22] <czajkowski> but each morning I have a 9:30am stand up with the team so will decide my day after that
[09:22] <czajkowski> davidcalle: you?
[09:22] <davidcalle> czajkowski: when in doubt, delete email :)
[09:22] <czajkowski> davidcalle: lol I wish!
[09:22] <svij> dpm: thanks for handling the communication… need to delegate the work on the website later then. :)
[09:22] <MooDoo> I was ok until davmor2 made me look at lxc
[09:23] <czajkowski> davidcalle: I  like to get to inbox 0 by friday and I *try* never to let my work mail box go over 10 mails not answered so it keeps it in check
[09:24] <davidcalle> czajkowski: fine, had a great weekend with the kids (petting farm!), drowning in coffe since two hours, a prety good monday ahead :)
[09:25] <czajkowski> excellent
[09:25] <czajkowski> we added new hens to our collection at the weekend
[09:25] <davidcalle> czajkowski: I have a *lot* of Thunderbird filters to sort my email in ~20 folders. 90% I just "Mark as read" :)
[09:25] <czajkowski> fresh eggs daily ftw :)
[09:25] <davidcalle> That's nice :)
[09:26] <czajkowski> aye if not a little noisy atm due to old hens V new hens settling down
[09:27] <davidcalle> But... chicken fights are illegal!
[09:29] <czajkowski> well yes
[09:29] <davidcalle> :)
[09:29] <czajkowski> but there is a natural pecking order to establish
[09:29] <czajkowski> old and new
[09:30] <czajkowski> so in the old group of 3 we knew who was top hen
[09:30] <czajkowski> and in the new 3 you can kinda see one top hen but all 6 together needs to restablish the new hen pecking order
[09:33] <davidcalle> Same happening at home between the 20 month old and the 7 month old :p
[09:34] <czajkowski> 20 month and 7 month
[09:34] <czajkowski> wow
[09:54] <popey> o/ see you all soon
[09:55] <davidcalle> popey: have fun!
[14:31] <dpm> dholbach, omw
[14:31] <dpm> dholbach, ah, forget it, got the times wrong
[14:32] <dpm> will be omw in 30 mins :)
[14:32] <dholbach> haha
[14:32]  * dholbach hugs dpm
[14:35] <dpm> :)
[15:24] <pleia2> so, "tracking" also doesn't send me emails when new replies are made on discourse, looks like really the only way to tune is to turn on emails for everything, and turn off specific categories I don't want emails for
[15:25] <pleia2> which, ultimately, is why this site continues to be pretty unusable for me
[15:25] <knome> o hai pleia2
[15:25] <belkinsa> pleia2, what version is the Discourse on?
[15:25] <pleia2> no idea
[15:26] <belkinsa> Okay.
[15:27] <pleia2> maybe a newer version is better :)
[15:29] <belkinsa> It is, Mozilla uses Discourse and it's the updated one and that feature works.
[15:30] <pleia2> you can subscribe to email alerts for specific categories?
[15:30] <belkinsa> I think so.
[17:10] <dholbach> all right my friends - I call it a day, see you tomorrow!
[17:15] <balloons> pleia2, perhaps filing an issue / inquiring on https://github.com/discourse/discourse?
[17:16] <pleia2> balloons: I'm just giving feedback, don't really have the time to invest in this seriously
[17:16] <pleia2> jcastro had asked why it wasn't working for me as an email gateway thing
[17:17] <balloons> pleia2, sure, i suppose the message is for anyone wondering about features.
[17:17] <balloons> For my part it's sad it wasn't adopted, but it wasn't. So it doesn't really matter if it solves all of our problems and slices bread.
[17:31] <jcastro> I don't understand the problem
[17:33] <pleia2> jcastro: maybe I'll just need to explain with words on a phone some time
[17:33] <pleia2> (not this week, sprinting)
[17:33] <jcastro> yeah I don't see the value of fixing it?
[17:33] <pleia2> oh ok
[17:33] <jcastro> I mean, why spend all this time reconfiguring it?
[17:34] <pleia2> well, people didn't know about the site, some folks seem interested now that they do
[17:34] <jcastro> fixing the email integration won't really help anything
[17:34] <jcastro> it's still not going to fix the underlying problem
[17:34] <jcastro> it'll fix it for a handful of people I guess
[17:34] <pleia2> I guess I misunderstood the intent of your initial email
[17:35] <jcastro> yeah I just don't see the point unless that fix brings in a few thousand new users in
[17:36] <knome> one thing i bumped with discourse was that even when the finnish loco was created a group and ack'd we could use finnish communication, somebody came bluntly commenting we need to talk in english
[17:36] <jcastro> why would you listen to that person?
[17:36] <jcastro> and also why would that person care?
[17:36] <knome> i wouldn't, but i wouldn't like them to clutter our threads
[17:36] <jcastro> oh, well that's a configuration value
[17:36] <knome> well, yeah.
[17:36] <knome> which isn't done
[17:37] <knome> so there you go, one more thing why i think discourse might have failed
[17:37] <jcastro> https://discourse.mozilla-community.org/ is an example
[17:38] <jcastro> they default to a category view
[17:38] <jcastro> http://discourse.ubuntu.com/categories
[17:40] <jcastro> pleia2: sorry, reading up it sounds like I'm yelling
[17:41] <jcastro> what I mean today is it wouldn't make sense to fix the email config and then take it down like a month later
[17:41] <knome> yelling or not, to me it seems like you want to tear it down regardless what kind of feedback you got from people
[17:41] <knome> so maybe you should just do that.
[17:42] <jcastro> oh, well so far no one's stepped up
[17:42] <pleia2> jcastro: if you're set in your opinion that it's not and will never be useful, I won't continue providing feedback
[17:42] <jcastro> and the people who run it see it as a failure so I suspect the session will be an open/shut case
[17:42] <knome> pleia2 just did, commenting about the email features; i just did, commenting about locos
[17:42] <pleia2> that's fine, I just thought your email was asking for feedback and discussion
[17:42] <knome> i thought the same tbh
[17:42]  * knome shrugs
[17:42] <jcastro> oh, I see what you guys are saying!
[17:42] <jcastro> ok
[17:42] <jcastro> I misunderstood
[17:45] <jcastro> was there another thread I missed?
[17:45] <jcastro> my initial mail is more of proposing a shutdown, not keeping it around?
[17:45] <pleia2> still the same thread that's been going on since your first post
[17:46] <pleia2> people providing feedback, explaining why they don't like reddit, etc
[17:46] <knome> sure. but it feels like that you've already decided the outcome regardless of people telling how discourse could be improved and how it could be useful for them
[17:46] <knome> but then you go on saying it's not worth to change the configuration now
[17:46] <knome> so why don't you just announce the closure?
[17:46] <knome> why ask for feedback?
[17:46] <pleia2> I guess I read too much into the subject "Future of Ubuntu Discourse?" (I actually did think it was a question)
[17:47] <jcastro> well someone recommend it becoming a topic of UOS
[17:47] <knome> it totally leaves the future open, it isn't clear to me either that it WILL be shut down
[17:47] <jcastro> I don't think just shutting it down abruptly is a good idea
[17:47] <pleia2> according to the thread, someone did
[17:47] <pleia2> "Marco said he'd create a session. Apparently he hasn't yet.. :
[17:47] <jcastro> well, I would assume if someone stepped up and made it a priority to work on then that might work
[17:48] <knome> but if you don't think trying to make it work is a good idea either... it doesn't seem like it's sensible to waste people's teim on "feedback"/"discussion"
[17:48] <jcastro> sort of like "hey if someone wants to fix this do the work, otherwise it goes away", just like you would for a package
[17:48] <knome> s/teim/time/
[17:48] <jcastro> knome: oh I think it could totally work
[17:48] <jcastro> no one has committed to doing such a thing is the problem
[17:48] <jcastro> of course it could all work if we spent a ton of time doing that
[17:49] <pleia2> if anyting came of this thread, the first problem is that it faded into obscurity after being launched, so lots of folks didn't know about it
[17:49] <pleia2> we don't really link to it anywhere in our community, it's hard to find
[17:49] <knome> well, there are two of us who have pointed out things that either 1) should work (email notifications) or that are 2) configuration options
[17:49] <knome> those don't sound like they take you a week to implement
[17:50] <knome> yes, and what pleia2 said; if it's not discoverable, how can people use it?
[17:50] <knome> i wouldn't say a platform has failed if it's hidden; it's not the platforms fault, it's the communications fault
[17:50] <jcastro> pleia2: I think those were all solveable problems
[17:50] <pleia2> anyway, actual work now :) I don't have a strong opinion about keeping it around and certainly can't lead anything here
[17:50] <jcastro> but the real issue is the forums people didn't want to do a software upgrade
[17:51] <jcastro> we can't really force them to upgrade
[17:51] <jcastro> so we have a half-sort-of forum that no one is using and limped around for a while
[17:51] <pleia2> ubuntuforums.org or discourse?
[17:51] <jcastro> I would argue both. :)
[17:52] <pleia2> the death of ubuntuforums.org has been greatly exaggerated
[17:52] <jcastro> I don't think "let's have both" works
[17:52] <pleia2> it is still active, and huge
[17:52] <pleia2> it's just awful ;)
[17:52] <jcastro> traffic peaked in 2k8
[17:53] <jcastro> and has been declining since
[17:53] <jcastro> but I would say it has a core group that is active
[17:54] <jcastro> but having "two forums" confuses people I guess
[17:54] <jcastro> so killing off the least popular one seems like a better idea than having 2
[17:55] <pleia2> ubuntuforums.org will likely never die fully
[17:55] <jcastro> right but this isn't about ubuntuforums
[17:55] <pleia2> discourse always seemed like a social experiment, less about support (though there is some)
[17:55] <jcastro> we _know_ people didn't use discourse
[18:00] <jcastro> anyway sorry for the confusion, I'll submit a session to UOS since Marco is on the road
[18:01] <jcastro> mhall119: in the pending queue for UOS now
[18:03] <mhall119> jcastro: ack, I'll setup tracks and track leads soon so it can be approved and scheduled
[18:03] <mhall119> hey, jcastro, want to be a track lead? :)
[18:04] <jcastro> mhall119: heh, nice try!
[18:04] <czajkowski> mhall119: then jcastro would have to use a wiki :o
[18:04] <mhall119> wait, you said Marco is on the road, want to volunteer him to be a track lead?
[18:04] <jcastro> mhall119: jgrimm or someone on that team would be the way to go
[18:05] <jcastro> our team doesn't even really work on ubuntu directly anyway
[18:05] <jcastro> make the ubuntu server team do it. :D
[18:05] <mhall119> "that team"? Are you not on that tema?
[18:05] <jcastro> nope
[18:06] <jcastro> I haven't worked on ubuntu since I was on your team
[18:06] <mhall119> jcastro: do you have time today or later in the week for a hangout to chat about juju stuff? I want to try and get back in that loop this year
[18:06] <jcastro> Yeah, after Wed.
[18:07] <mhall119> cool, I'll give you a ping sometime thursday then, thanks
[18:07] <jcastro> Marco is on the CC now though, so I suppose you could trick him to be a track lead and he wouldn't know any better
[18:07] <mhall119> jcastro: yeah, but he'd be on the community track then
[18:07] <jcastro> mhall119: I need like 2 issues fixed in xenial before we talk, that's why I need to wait
[18:07] <mhall119> ok
[18:10] <jcastro> they released over the weekend in the devel ppa and boom
[18:16] <jcastro> mhall119: are you on xenial?
[18:16] <mhall119> not yet, been waiting for idle time to make the jump (going to re-install with the 64bit image) but haven't found any idle time yet :)
[18:18] <jcastro> I got a new thinkpad this weekend so I did a clean reinstall
[20:02] <jcastro> pleia2: no new submissions for the opensourceinfra list? Was kind of hoping you'd get flooded
[20:03] <pleia2> jcastro: last one was mediawiki
[20:04] <pleia2> the linux foundation has some, and the creative commons folks as well, they've promised patches, some day :)
[20:04] <pleia2> I wish LF has more, they're a bit more paranoid than I expected about specifics, instead they tend to open source their generic puppet modules and tools
[20:05] <jcastro> doing this actually helped me find a bunch of bugs of stuff that is open but not indexed anywhere
[20:05] <pleia2> :D
=== ian__ is now known as ian-weisser