[09:51] <zequence> I'm putting sakrecoer_ on making changes to -default-settings, so please let him do that. It's a great opportunity for him to get some insight into that package right now
[18:40] <krytarik> OvenWerk1: Was the stripping down on the Whisker Menu favorites here intended, btw?: http://launchpadlibrarian.net/245373513/ubuntustudio-default-settings_0.56_0.57.diff.gz  It's not mentioned in the changelog anyway, as well as the "hover-switch-category=true" change.
[18:44] <zequence> krytarik: That change is not in our bzr branch, believe it or not
[18:45] <zequence> I once forgot to update our branch after doing an upload
[18:45] <zequence> Think maybe one change got through unintentionally
[18:46] <zequence> There's another change there as well
[18:46] <zequence> Nice catch. I need to go back and have a look
[18:48] <zequence> I also just updated the branch with the latest commit
[18:48] <zequence> A bit of chaos, to say the least
[21:55] <OvenWerk1> krytarik: probably those were meant. hover-switch-categories=true makes a lot more sense where the favourites generally do not have what the user wants.
[21:57] <OvenWerk1> The favourites selection is all stuff that people using a standard desktop would like, but are just in the way for people doing creation.
[22:00] <OvenWerk1> krytarik: as zequence says there may be things in there not meant to be there.
[22:01]  * OvenWerk1 still finds whisker less useful than a standard/classic menu.
[22:02] <OvenWerk1> For what its worth, my wife who has xubuntu, had me change whisker back to the applications menu because she could never find what she wanted.
[23:33] <sakrecoer> so krytarik, what the font?
[23:35] <krytarik> sakrecoer: Huh?
[23:36] <krytarik> sakrecoer: That is to say, a whole sentence would help here. :P
[23:36] <sakrecoer> i was trying to bring that on-topic back in to the right channel
[23:37] <sakrecoer> krytarik: zequence told to talk to me about meta for fonts..
[23:39] <zequence> sakrecoer: fonts-noto brings in three packages, I believe. We only need one for our desktop, but we could use at least two of them for our font meta package
[23:39] <zequence> krytarik was kindly suggesting we get rid of what we don't need by seeding only the packages we want
[23:40] <krytarik> sakrecoer: Most notably, 'fonts-noto-cjk' is 112 MB installed.
[23:41] <zequence> I already did this right in debian/control of ubuntustudio-default-settings, by making the dependency fonts-noto-hinted
[23:41] <sakrecoer> i'm getting confused hehe
[23:41] <sakrecoer> 112mb for a font family?
[23:42] <zequence> ubuntustudio-desktop and ubuntustudio-font-meta still have all three, since they all depend on fonts-noto
[23:42] <zequence> To make changes to those two packages, you do it in seeds
[23:42] <zequence> ..and then someone (me) updates ubuntustudio-meta, which is basing its dependencies on the seeds files
[23:43] <zequence> So, in short, seeds needs to be edited
[23:43] <sakrecoer> ah! hehe ok...
[23:44] <zequence> ubuntustudio-meta is the source package which then builds all of our meta packages, such as ubuntustudio-desktop and ubuntustudio-fonts-meta, just to make that clear
[23:44] <zequence> there's no binary package called ubuntustudio-meta
[23:45] <sakrecoer> ok, and these 'fonts-noto-cjk'.. if we remove them, we are not going to exclude mandarin, arab or cyrilic or something like that?
[23:46] <zequence> Don't know. But, if that is true, then Xubuntu should probably reconsider adding it again
[23:46] <zequence> or, adding it in the first place, that is
[23:48] <sakrecoer> krytarik: your link to http://packages.ubuntu.com/xenial/fonts-noto
[23:49] <sakrecoer> never mind..
[23:49] <krytarik> :D
[23:49] <sakrecoer> but looking here: http://packages.ubuntu.com/xenial/fonts-noto-cjk it says 75mb
[23:49] <krytarik> Yep, package size, not installed.
[23:50] <sakrecoer> of course..
[23:50] <sakrecoer> it is maintained by ChangZhuo Chen
[23:51] <sakrecoer> i wouldn't be surprised if it is that big due to mandarin/cantonese symbols being in there...
[23:52] <krytarik> Well, "CJK" means Chinese, Japanese, Korean.
[23:52] <krytarik> So quite a lot of stuff.
[23:53] <sakrecoer> can chinese people download anything else then kylin?
[23:53] <zequence> I'm the wrong person to ask about this kind of stuff anyway. Might be useful to discuss this with Xubuntu devs over at #xubuntu-devel
[23:54] <zequence> Or, more generally on some Ubuntu IRC channel, like #ubuntu-devel
[23:54] <flocculant> as far as I remember - Xubuntu went right off cjk or anything remotely kylin when they couldn't care less they'd screwed ibus for 14.04 and any sort of password that wasn't just letters on a US keyboard failed
[23:55] <zequence> This is also why I don't put too much effort on desktop stuff. It's a lot more than I ever want to know, tbh :P
[23:55] <sakrecoer> i feel like i'm missing some piece of information again :D
[23:55] <sakrecoer> but its probably simply to late
[23:55] <zequence> I remember the problems with iBus. We had to scrap something in order for a non US keyboard to be able to get the selected default layout in the first place
[23:56] <flocculant> yep
[23:56] <flocculant> we scrapped ibus at that point
[23:56] <zequence> sakrecoer: I would probably not worry too much about these sort of details, at least not at this stage
[23:57] <zequence> sakrecoer: Better work on the fundamentals of our flavor, and perhaps have goals of that sort for 18.04 instead
[23:57] <zequence> We are releasing in less than two months, and should not be adding too many changes at this point.
[23:59] <zequence> While I'm sure supporting non western keyboards is not just a detail for some people, it's technically beyond our range of expertise. And, I would rather have that sort of changes in the DE specific flavors, and we just copy it