[01:00] <bluesabre> Unit193: huh?
[01:01] <bluesabre> dinner time, bbabl
[01:02] <Unit193> bluesabre: Dropping b-e from seed.
[01:02] <Unit193> [15:32:02] < Unit193> bluesabre: Might be a bit late now, but what about dropping build-essential off the ISO?  As a reference point, Kubuntu  doesn't seem to have it.
[02:31] <bluesabre> Unit193: not opposed to the idea
[02:32] <bluesabre> and really no reason to keep it on there onless you're compiling drivers and whatnot
[02:32] <bluesabre> in which case you'd still need kernel headers
[03:19] <bluesabre> Unit193: I'll take a look at it tomorrow, so tired
[09:32] <ochosi> bluesabre: not sure i get it - what's hard about detecting the icon theme that's in use systemwide?
[09:33] <ochosi> bluesabre: plus, if it really can't do that, we'd have to put all our icons into the hicolor icon theme (which seems to be what it's using atm)
[10:08] <bluesabre> ochosi: looking in /var/lib/apt/lists/us.archive.ubuntu.com_ubuntu_dists_xenial_main_dep11_Components-amd64.yml.gz it seems all icons use a png resource instead of icon names for gnome-software
[10:09] <bluesabre> Icon:
[10:09] <bluesabre>   cached: file-roller_file-roller.png
[10:10] <bluesabre> ochosi: but you could report a bug at https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-software and maybe robert will patch it in :)
[10:19] <flocculant> hi ochosi bluesabre :)
[10:19] <flocculant> bluesabre: re g-s > no issue from me 
[10:21] <bluesabre> flocculant: good deal
[10:27] <flocculant> akxwi-dave: thanks for replying to dev mail :)
[10:27] <flocculant> you took the words right out of my mouth ... 
[10:28] <flocculant> bluesabre: re upgrades - that's moving on now - that lovely davmor2 chap is driving people there :)
[10:28] <davmor2> flocculant: it's what I do :)
[10:28] <bluesabre> flocculant: oh great,  good to hear
[10:28] <bluesabre> davmor2: you rock
[10:29] <akxwi-dave> flocculant, wanted to try and get him before anyone else.. :-)
[10:29] <flocculant> davmor2 does indeed rock
[10:29] <flocculant> akxwi-dave: yea :p
[10:33] <akxwi-dave> my machines are sat patiently waiting for the upgrade tests..  :-)
[10:35] <flocculant> I think that by the time we get to the 21st March then the release team will be really twitchy if all the upgrade tests including Ubuntu get critically failed 
[11:15] <bluesabre> Unit193: would that be in debian-cd/tasks/forcd1 ?
[11:17] <bluesabre> ochosi: the icons it is using are in /var/lib/app-info/icons/
[11:21] <bluesabre> micahg: can you take another look at the packageset? there's no more reason for shimmer-themes to be in the kubuntu packageset, but it certainly seems to be stuck there now
[12:35] <ochosi> bluesabre: oh, meh
[12:36] <ochosi> bluesabre: so what can i/we do about that then?
[12:36] <bluesabre> ochosi: nothing outside of filing a bug I'd imagine
[12:36] <knome> i haven't seen micahg active in weeks, should we ask somebody else?
[12:37] <bluesabre> knome: I had Laney re-run the script last week and it didn't fix it, but I'll probably send another mail to the DMB list
[12:37] <knome> yeah
[12:37] <bluesabre> I'll try to get that out this morning
[12:37] <bluesabre> or start trolling them for per-package access on a need basis
[12:38] <bluesabre> or work on obtaining motu
[12:38] <knome> ;)
[12:38] <bluesabre> hats++
[12:38] <knome> i vote for all of them
[12:40] <bluesabre> it'd be nice to get more devs, I wouldn't mind stepping back a bit and taking more of a mentor/code-review role
[12:41] <knome> bluesabre, there's one for you ^ :P
[12:43] <slickymasterWork> bluesabre, ping-a-long
[12:45] <bluesabre> slickymasterWork: what's up?
[12:45] <slickymasterWork> I'm assuming you're familiar with gnome software UI, right?
[12:45] <bluesabre> hey slickymasterWork
[12:45] <bluesabre> a bit
[12:45] <slickymasterWork> do you know how they name the icon in the top left of the UI that provides you access to the software & updates UI
[12:45] <slickymasterWork> ?
[12:46] <flocculant> bluesabre: don't say flocculant is ... 
[12:46] <slickymasterWork> flocculant, the same goes for you :P
[12:46] <bluesabre> slickymasterWork: probably "gnome-software"
[12:46] <flocculant> slickymasterWork: it's gnome
[12:46] <flocculant> so obviously 'icon in the top left' :p
[12:47] <slickymasterWork> thing is it doesn't have any labels, or tooltips
[12:47] <flocculant> slickymasterWork: why not just call it the menu bitton ...
[12:47] <slickymasterWork> that doesn't serve to go in -docs
[12:47] <bluesabre> slickymasterWork: that's the app menu
[12:47] <slickymasterWork> hmm, ok, app menu works for me
[12:47] <slickymasterWork> thanks, both
[12:48] <bluesabre> in gtk3, applications that would show a menu in the gnome-shell panel show it there in other DEs
[12:48] <flocculant> not sure I helped :D
[12:48] <bluesabre> (when not patched out in Ubuntu)
[12:49] <slickymasterWork> GS isn't showing any menu, just the button bluesabre 
[12:49] <bluesabre> slickymasterWork: pretty sure you'd see the same in menulibre or gnome-calculator
[12:50]  * bluesabre shrugs
[12:50] <slickymasterWork> calculator doesn't either
[12:50] <bluesabre> well, in the future if you see that, that's what it is :D
[12:51] <flocculant> I'd say that app menu is probably as useful as anything else 
[12:51] <flocculant> slickymasterWork: what do you mean it doesn't show a menu? 
[12:51] <bluesabre> usually it is for application-wide functionality, whereas menus with a cog to the right of the toolbar would be window/instance-specific
[12:52] <bluesabre> or so it is specced
[12:52] <bluesabre> :D
[12:54] <qwebirc916920> not tradional File-Edit-View-Etc menu
[12:56] <bluesabre> slickymasterWork: yeah, that would be a menubar, which gnome is pushing away with a really big sharp stick
[12:56] <bluesabre> in that case, File, Edit, View, Etc are all menus
[12:56] <slickymasterWork> exactly
[12:58] <bluesabre> there's pros and cons for menubars... pro: all functionality available, con: developers are often horrible at determining what a good context/menu name is so you have to look through the whole menu to find what you want anyway
[12:58] <bluesabre> File, Edit, View - all standard, but usually used incorrectly :D
[13:01] <ochosi> bluesabre: hmright, i see. i thought you said i should draw some icons :p
[13:02] <bluesabre> ochosi: only if you want to draw an icon for gnome-software
[13:02] <bluesabre> or symlink existing, etc
[13:04] <ochosi> hmm, for now i'm not sure
[13:04] <ochosi> i mean i can
[13:05] <bluesabre> it's fine either way, really :)
[13:05] <ochosi> just not sure it's really needed
[13:05] <ochosi> yup :)
[13:05] <ochosi> btw, did you take a peek at the greybird issue?
[13:06] <ochosi> it's really odd, i'm starting to suspect it's a bug in the toolkit
[13:17] <bluesabre> ochosi: not had a chance to look yet
[13:25] <ochosi> ok, no worries
[13:25] <ochosi> lemme know when you do
[13:35] <bluesabre> ochosi: should get a chance tonight, will let you know
[13:45] <ochosi> cool
[13:46] <knome> ochosi, you know what we should do?
[13:46] <knome> ochosi, draw a xenial...
[13:54] <flocculant> how can you draw an adjective :(
[13:56] <knome> oh
[13:56] <knome> xerus
[13:56]  * knome facepalms
[13:57] <knome> i'll even draw you a rounded circle
[14:11] <flocculant> ha ha ha 
[14:18] <sorine1|o> I'm glad to see new people on the user list giving their opinions
[14:21] <knome> sorine1|o, on what exactly?
[14:23] <knome> do you mean the *developer* list?
[14:23] <sorine1|o> knome, Pontus Falk, also Majay Jozef giving his opinion
[14:23] <sorine1|o> yes
[14:50] <flocculant> knome: nice response :)
[14:50] <knome> thanks
[14:51] <ochosi> knome: yeah, we should do that
[14:51] <ochosi> maybe sometime in the next few days/evenings/nights
[14:51] <knome> do you have ideas for the tail?
[14:51] <knome> i've figured out the body i think
[14:51] <knome> ochosi, ui freeze is thursday fwiw
[15:00] <ochosi> knome: yeah, maybe late late tonight
[15:00] <knome> sigh ;)
[15:01] <knome> flocculant, PING
[15:04] <micahg> knome: sorry, last time I tried, I had a python error
[15:04] <micahg> and I have not had time to dig into it
[15:05] <pavlushka>  Hi, I am a general Ubuntu user, I wanna volunteer testing Xubuntu
[15:05] <pavlushka> knome, hi
[15:06] <knome> pavlushka, hello
[15:07] <knome> pavlushka, have you read this page already? http://xubuntu.org/contribute/qa
[15:07] <knome> pavlushka, it gives you an overview of the testing we are doing
[15:07] <pavlushka> knome, So, tell me, I've noticed it in the Ubuntu community page.
[15:08] <pavlushka> knome, for which release, 14.04 or 15.10?
[15:08] <knome> pavlushka, we are testing 16.04 currently
[15:08] <knome> pavlushka, this page has the *general* information, not the specifics
[15:09] <knome> pavlushka, i just want to make sure you understand the general stuff first before i dig much deeper
[15:09] <pavlushka> knome, I've read the http://docs.xubuntu.org/contributors/qa-team.html#qa-team-basics
[15:09] <knome> pavlushka, okay
[15:10] <pavlushka> knome, try me
[15:10] <knome> pavlushka, so is there something specific you are interested in?
[15:10] <knome> iso testing? package testing?
[15:11] <pavlushka> I can help you with OS stability testing & bug reporting.
[15:11] <pavlushka> knome, Ya, sure
[15:12] <knome> flocculant, are you around?
[15:12] <knome> pavlushka, so as you know, the ISO testing goes on at http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/
[15:12] <knome> do you have any specific questions about the trackers?
[15:13] <pavlushka> knome, sorry?
[15:13] <knome> pavlushka, do you have any questions?
[15:14] <pavlushka> knome, the trackers?
[15:15] <knome> http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/ is the QA ISO testing tracker
[15:16] <pavlushka> knome, its loading slow, so I am waiting.
[15:16] <knome> okay, let me know when you've got it loaded
[15:18] <pavlushka> knome, okey dokey
[15:19] <knome> pavlushka, you can find information on using the trackers here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Testing/QATracker (linked from the front page on the tracker if you ever need to revisit)
[15:19] <knome> have you looked at that?
[15:21] <flocculant> knome: what? 
[15:21] <knome> flocculant, a new tester excited to get going
[15:21] <knome> flocculant, you're probably better at explaining stuff he needs to know than me while i'm drawing a rounded circle
[15:21] <flocculant> \o/ 
[15:21] <flocculant> ha 
[15:21] <pavlushka> knome, what I got is, if I am connected to net while booting ISO and installation and everything after that, the bug will be auto reported, I just have to say yes.
[15:22] <flocculant> pavlushka: hi there :)
[15:22] <knome> pavlushka, that's one part of it, but we have our own processes for testing stuff... our qa (quality assurance) lead flocculant can tell you more about the current testing in progress
[15:23] <flocculant> pavlushka: you're better checking out http://docs.xubuntu.org/contributors/qa-testing.html and http://docs.xubuntu.org/contributors/qa-bugs.html
[15:23] <flocculant> than the first one - that's more what the QA Team does before testing gets going properly
[15:24] <flocculant> pavlushka: I'm kind of right in the middle of something in r/l atm
[15:25] <flocculant> but basically - boot the image - check that works, if you can do so - install it (virtual machine is sufficient) check that works
[15:26] <flocculant> knome: I think I will re-order those pages and rename that basics one - it's really a QA Team page not for testers
[15:27] <pavlushka> flocculant, Ya I can do that and I'll be connected to the net while doing it.
[15:28] <knome> flocculant, mhm
[15:28] <flocculant> pavlushka: cool - when you get as far as looking at the tracker (if you're not sure) and looking at bugs  I should be here by then
[15:28] <knome> ^ the tracker pretty much tells you what you need to do
[15:29] <pavlushka> Ya, i think so.
[15:34] <akxwi-dave> pavlushka, Heres another little article that my be useful..  http://princessleia.com/journal/2016/03/xubuntu-16-04-iso-testing-tips/
[15:39] <pavlushka> akxwi-dave, thanks.
[15:52] <flocculant> pavlushka: I'm back now if you need me
[16:07] <pavlushka> flexiondotorg, sorry, gotta go, I'll knock you if I need. see ya
[16:08]  * flexiondotorg thinks pavlushka means flocculant ;-)
[16:08]  * flocculant does too :)
[16:25] <slickymasterWork> flocculant, will review https://code.launchpad.net/~flocculant/xubuntu-docs/qachange/+merge/288421 after dinner
[19:26] <Unit193> bluesabre: lp:~xubuntu-dev/ubuntu-seeds/xubuntu.xenial
[20:19] <MagicSponge> Sup guys.
[21:48] <ochosi> micahg: hey, so about that shimmer-themes packageset issue, do you think you'll get a chance to check that one out soonish?
[22:39] <bluesabre> evening all
[22:39] <knome> hullo bluesabre 
[22:39] <ochosi> oh hey
[22:40] <bluesabre> hey knome, ochosi
[22:40] <bluesabre> and wowza, ochosi twice in a single day
[22:40] <bluesabre> what is this
[22:40] <knome> heresy
[22:41] <ochosi> bluesabre: your lucky day?
[22:42] <bluesabre> must be
[22:44] <ochosi> bluesabre: so there's really no bug against gnome-software to respect icon-themes?
[22:44] <bluesabre> ochosi: not that I saw
[22:45] <ochosi> i mean it does somehow gather the icons
[22:45] <bluesabre> i think that's with appstream
[22:45] <ochosi> or not?
[22:48] <bluesabre> ochosi: I don't know how it works, just what files its using :)
[22:48] <bluesabre> Unit193: not defined explicitly in there, what's pulling it... bcmwl-kernel-source?
[22:54] <ochosi> bluesabre: so, since i haven't been around so much (sorry for that, but the little one needs a lot of attention lately), what's new?
[22:56] <bluesabre> ochosi: not a whole lot right now, if you know about the icon theme and gnome-software, you're pretty much up to date
[22:57] <bluesabre> er
[22:57] <bluesabre> font
[22:57] <bluesabre> not icon theme
[22:57] <bluesabre> :D
[22:57] <Unit193> krytarik: Oh right, we seed gcc and make but mugshot is what pulls in all the crap.
[22:57] <bluesabre> trying to do some fixes this week
[22:57] <bluesabre> Unit193: mugshot does?
[22:57] <knome> ahahahaha, again bluesabre's fault
[22:57] <knome> :X
[22:58] <Unit193> I forgot about that, yeah.
[22:58] <Unit193> pkg-config, dpkg-dev, build-e, etc, etc.
[22:58] <knome> bluesabre is da bomb
[22:58] <bluesabre> oh wow
[22:58] <knome> that breaks your distro
[22:58] <knome> ;)=
[22:58] <bluesabre> need to take a look at that then
[22:59] <bluesabre> doesn't seem like it should http://packages.ubuntu.com/xenial/mugshot
[23:00] <Unit193> mugshot → gstreamer1.0-tools → pkg-config → dpkg-dev → gcc/make/build-essential/fakeroot/
[23:00] <Unit193> Gotta go down the rabbit hole.
[23:01] <bluesabre> that's lame
[23:02] <bluesabre> makes me wonder if the packaging is bad for gstreamer1.0-tools then
[23:02] <bluesabre> why in the world would it depend on pkg-config
[23:02] <knome> haha
[23:02] <knome> -tools?
[23:07] <bluesabre> I might see if I can fix that dep this week
[23:08] <ochosi> yeah, and don't forget the theming bug ;)
[23:08] <bluesabre> ochosi: I'll get a package for that up tonight to hopefully be sponsored
[23:09] <ochosi> better test it first
[23:09] <ochosi> but it should be a definite improvement
[23:09] <bluesabre> I'll check it out
[23:09] <ochosi> ty
[23:09] <bluesabre> also got a few numix commits since then
[23:10] <bluesabre> https://github.com/shimmerproject/Numix/commits/master
[23:10] <bluesabre> last upload jan 17
[23:13] <bluesabre> mugshot might not even need that dep
[23:19] <Unit193> Last time you said it was needed for something or other, perhaps video.
[23:20] <ochosi> bluesabre: yeah, numix needs testing again
[23:20] <ochosi> i havent talked to stya in a while, but he handed the project over to someone
[23:20] <ochosi> he's mostly merging patches and cleaning out invalid bugrepoprts, but it's better than nothing
[23:20] <bluesabre> Unit193: well, good news is that clutter video is broken!
[23:21] <bluesabre> ochosi: alrighty, will be sure to give it some reasonable testing or just leave it out of the next upload
[23:21] <ochosi> sounds like a plan
[23:22] <bluesabre> oh nice
[23:23] <bluesabre> some recent update seems to have broken my camera
[23:23] <ochosi> things seem to get better for you all the time
[23:23] <bluesabre> indeed
[23:23] <Unit193> LTS baby!
[23:23] <bluesabre> getting harder to develop these days when nothing works
[23:24] <ochosi> challenge accepted?
[23:24] <bluesabre> :D
[23:25] <bluesabre> just means I need some time to discover new alternatives
[23:25] <ochosi> like something stable? maybe arch linux?
[23:25] <bluesabre> haha
[23:26] <knome> i recommend windows XP, it will not get stupid udpates that break the system any more!
[23:26] <ochosi> +1
[23:27] <bluesabre> figured we'd be safe with xfce
[23:27] <bluesabre> but then glib changes and breaks everything
[23:28] <bluesabre> moved to clutter since it was actively maintained, not realizing that meant guaranteed api breakages once per year
[23:28] <knome> ;)
[23:28] <bluesabre> qt looks more lovely by the day
[23:28] <bluesabre> :)
[23:28] <knome> :(
[23:36] <ochosi> bluesabre: only because you don't experience the breakage there first hand
[23:37] <bluesabre> ochosi: you're probably right
[23:44] <ochosi> btw, getting gnome-software into xubuntu by default is a great opportunity for some dog fooding and then adding appdata to more xfce components
[23:48] <ochosi> hmm, how is the wallpaper community contest coming along btw?
[23:48] <ochosi> i read some messages about the site for it falling in place
[23:48] <ochosi> but it's a bit late in the cycle already for a contest, no?
[23:49] <knome> nah
[23:49] <knome> it's not subject to UI freeze
[23:49] <bluesabre> UI freeze basically only applies to defaults
[23:49] <knome> and we can likely start the competition beginning of next week
[23:50] <knome> there are some issues reported on the site i need to investigate, but likely nothing serious
[23:50] <ochosi> can i look at the site yet?
[23:51] <bluesabre> http://contest.xubuntu.org/
[23:51] <knome> ochosi, you should also be able to log in and send your submissions as well as vote and see vote results
[23:53] <ochosi> cool
[23:57] <ochosi> submitting already works?
[23:58] <bluesabre> yup
[23:58] <bluesabre> voting too
[23:58] <ochosi> oh, several already there
[23:58] <ochosi> i submitted one too now
[23:58] <bluesabre> ochosi: fancy