[12:44] <Rosco2> Very quiet in here today!
[12:44] <Rosco2> Are we all busy testing the Beta 2 ISO?
[12:48] <zequence> Rosco2: I only did a smoketest of the i386. Doesn't seem like anyone else is doing any testing right now
[12:49] <Rosco2> Looks OK.
[12:49] <zequence> Yep
[12:49] <Rosco2> Upgrade from Trusty failed. Just trying from Wily
[12:50] <zequence> Seems like Xubuntu, Gnome and Vanilla all have problems upgrading
[12:50] <Rosco2> Had some issues with VMs not restarting after install
[12:51] <zequence> Yes, that has been an issue for a good while now
[12:51] <zequence> VirtualBox has that. Haven't tried other VMs
[12:51] <Rosco2> Will try one more test on hard metal, then I am done
[12:52] <zequence> My main concern during my test was I got no sound
[12:52] <zequence> But, haven't tried on hardware yet
[12:54] <Rosco2> Hopefully just a formality from here. Will wait to see if the others submit results
[12:54] <Rosco2> sakrecoer promised yesterday
[12:55] <cfhowlett> I couldn't get boot on my vbox.  failed to the shell
[12:56] <Rosco2> Did you do a checksum of the image?
[12:56] <cfhowlett> yep
[12:57] <sakrecoer> i'm on it now! 
[12:57] <Rosco2> Virtual Box or other type?
[12:57] <cfhowlett> vbox
[12:58] <sakrecoer> live iso, fresh install and upgrade from 14.04
[12:58] <Rosco2> sakrecoer, excellent. The more we have the better
[12:58] <sakrecoer> wanted to do the first 2 yesterday, but it seems my family enjoys synching the casual 'break sakrecoer's nut' with tge testreleases
[12:59] <Rosco2> :-)
[12:59] <cfhowlett> well, that IS what family is for, yes??
[12:59] <sakrecoer> yes :) <3
[13:00] <Rosco2> cfhowlett, might be useful if you at least try spinning up the live session
[13:00] <cfhowlett> Rosco2, live session flew with no problem.  failed on reboot after install
[13:01] <Rosco2> Live session inside vbox?
[13:02] <cfhowlett> exactomundo
[13:02] <Rosco2> I found the same
[13:02] <flocculant> cfhowlett: that's unfortunately normal - has been for cycles and cycles
[13:03] <cfhowlett> grrr. OK then.  
[13:03] <flocculant> kvm works
[13:03] <flocculant> I think vmware does
[13:03] <Rosco2> Little bit different for me this time though
[13:03] <Rosco2> On machine eventually restarted by itself after 45 minute approx
[13:04] <Rosco2> One machine
[13:04] <flocculant> Rosco2: upgrades - it's global afaik, you won't get 14.04 to 16.04 via update-manager
[13:04] <flocculant> via iso works - as does 15.10 both methods
[13:04] <flocculant> Rosco2: hah - they get about 20 seconds to reboot or I ignore the vbox issue :p
[13:04] <Rosco2> Found same for 14.04
[13:04] <sakrecoer> hmm... the  link to the iso 's on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/XenialXerus/ReleaseNotes/Beta2/UbuntuStudio is broken
[13:05] <Rosco2> I had to have a cup of tea and annoy the family for a bit!
[13:05] <sakrecoer> oh... but... where is shte beta-2 ? http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/ubuntustudio/releases/16.04/
[13:05] <flocculant> sakrecoer: it's not been released yet :D
[13:05] <sakrecoer> ah.. :D
[13:06]  * sakrecoer slaps him self with a large bass
[13:07] <sakrecoer> maybe reading the carefully written instructions can help, maybe :D
[13:13] <flocculant> reading? 
[13:13] <flocculant> is that a thing ... 
[13:13] <flocculant> :p
[13:14] <sakrecoer> :D nono, it's just a boring alternative to pictures :D
[13:42] <sakrecoer> now i'm hospitalized like everyone else <3
[13:43] <sakrecoer> oh.. hehe wrong channel...
[13:45] <sakrecoer> (to my prides defense, context is available in #US-offtopic :p)
[14:09] <sakrecoer> when you guys say "smoke-test" what does that mean?
[14:10] <sakrecoer> adding "ubuntu" or "linux" to a google search doesn't give me any sensible result so to speak....
[14:21] <Rosco2> sakrecoer, We use the term at work for the type of test when you plug something in, turn it on, and see if smoke comes out
[14:22] <Rosco2> Here I think we just mean a quick test to see that it sort of works
[14:26] <sakrecoer> thanks Rosco2 ! :)
[14:31] <zequence> sakrecoer: In my case it means making sure booting and installing works, as well as jack with realtime is functional both in live and installed environments. I feel those things are required in order for me to make an ISO ready for release, which is something that Rosco2 does now instead of me.
[14:31] <zequence> I mean, he marks them ready for release. I still do smoketesting
[14:32] <zequence> But, as Rosco2 already explained. It is the minimal amount of testing to make sure something is functional.
[14:38] <sakrecoer> :)
[14:56] <sakrecoer> wuhu!! blueman has chilled out!
[14:57] <Rosco3> He has been bugging me for the last two days!
[14:57] <sakrecoer> i've seen the threads!! you rock Rosco3 !!!!
[14:58] <sakrecoer> kdenlive is back <3
[14:58] <sakrecoer> image magick fix didn't make it tho..
[14:59] <sakrecoer> should i repport bugs listed in the "known bugs"?
[14:59] <Rosco3> No - but I think we can remove the duplicate icon in us-menu ourselves
[14:59] <Rosco3> I mean yes to re-reporting
[14:59] <sakrecoer> ok :)
[15:00] <Rosco3> I meant no to imagemagick not making it
[15:00] <sakrecoer> if i've understood OvenWerks right, it should be possible to simply hide the icons via the desktop file.
[15:00] <Rosco3> Making the menu item work is now a much sinpler patch that will hopefully be uploaded soon
[15:00] <sakrecoer> and since it works great when started from cli...
[15:00] <sakrecoer> ah ok! wow great!
[15:02] <Rosco3> Hiding the icons in the desktop file is the right fix for others e.g. Xubuntu
[15:02] <sakrecoer> ok
[15:02] <Rosco3> But if it doesn't happen we can fix it for ourselves
[15:02] <sakrecoer> hm. for some reason i can't find the command to start imagemagick from cli anymore..
[15:02] <Rosco3> display
[15:03] <sakrecoer> \o/
[15:03] <Rosco3> strange name
[15:03] <sakrecoer> yes. was it always that name?
[15:04] <Rosco3> not sure - probably
[15:05] <sakrecoer> defo lefthand path application :D (reffering to arrow that changes orientation)
[15:06] <sakrecoer> oh wow! now blender starts jack as soon as you set it as audio engine!
[15:07] <sakrecoer> zequence: we have a dark taskbar, but bright windows, is that something we want, or something on the todo list?
[15:10] <sakrecoer> Rosco3: do you know the cli command for the "theme configuration" in the settings?
[15:11] <sakrecoer> it has no effect even after i restart xfce4-panel
[15:12] <sakrecoer> well, it has effect on the panel, just not on the whisker menu
[15:13] <zequence> sakrecoer: The theming of the desktop is not something we have been working a lot on since we went away from Gnome2. It's not our own theme.
[15:14] <zequence> sakrecoer: If you want to work at that, please do
[15:15] <zequence> sakrecoer: Maybe the whisker menu updates only between logins, or you need to remove it and add it again
[15:16] <zequence> Rosco3: You can probably mark ours ready whenever. Doesn't seem like there's anything else to be done. I'll be going out now
[15:16] <zequence> ..doesn't hurt to do more testing of course
[15:17] <zequence> (by whoever is already doing them, I mean)
[15:18] <zequence> sakrecoer: If you find any nice tweaks to the theming that works for us, we can upload those while we add a default wallpaper and stuff like that
[15:18] <sakrecoer> ok, i'll assign myself to that :) as far as i can see, it is mostely a matter of picking a different set of already available settings.
[15:18] <sakrecoer> ah! great! thanks zequence 
[15:18] <sakrecoer> i'll match it to that wallpaper you produced zequence :)
[15:19] <zequence> I will probably wait another week at least with uploading the wallpaper. Need to start working on it now though
[15:19] <sakrecoer> ok! enjoy your afternoon, zequence!
[15:19] <zequence> My idea is that the theming could use something dark, but it also needs to be easily readable and functional
[15:19] <sakrecoer> yes, dark, please :)
[15:19] <sakrecoer> hehe..
[15:19] <sakrecoer> or all-bright
[15:20] <sakrecoer> not a bit of both
[15:20] <zequence> I use dark theming on my own setup, using Gnome3. I even use Stylish with Firefox to make lots of websites darker.
[15:20] <zequence> All bright doesn't get a vote from me
[15:20] <zequence> It's not nice for multimedia production
[15:20] <sakrecoer> me neither, nor does half-half
[15:21] <zequence> Isn't that more about your sense of taste, rather than fixing the theme to be good for multimedia production, as well as adhering to Ubuntu Studio artwork tradition?
[15:21] <zequence> Traditionally, the theme was dark, but with some bright areas
[15:22] <sakrecoer> what would be mroe my sense of taste?
[15:22] <zequence> Well, you said not mixing dark and bright
[15:22] <zequence> But, why is that bad?
[15:22] <sakrecoer> because it gives an impression of an unconsolidated layout
[15:22] <OvenWerks> Has anyone tested that qjackctl can not lock up the keyboard still?
[15:22] <zequence> I'd rather have everything dark myself. But, it also needs to be functional and readable
[15:22] <sakrecoer> or rather, a layout that hasn't been reflected uppon
[15:23] <zequence> sakrecoer: I'd say that is a matter of taste
[15:23] <zequence> It really depends on the design, IMO, if that works or not
[15:23] <sakrecoer> i think the taskbar should match the windows, but sure, we can have a different color for every elelemnt, that would be more in line with a mix
[15:23] <zequence> The taskbar is not a window
[15:24] <sakrecoer> the taskbar and the windows frame
[15:24] <zequence> IMO, that is a very subjective opinion from you
[15:24] <sakrecoer> so you prefer having the mix?
[15:24] <zequence> I can't see how you can make a rule against it
[15:24] <sakrecoer> i don't think it is possible to speak about colors without being subjective
[15:24] <sakrecoer> but its possible to speak about consistency in coulour without being subjective
[15:24] <zequence> But, I do think most graphic artist would prefer something a little darker over all
[15:25] <sakrecoer> "artist owld prefer" that is your subjective opinion, which happens to line up with mine
[15:25] <zequence> The taskbar is not a window. In other words, where is the consistency problem?
[15:25] <sakrecoer> well, there is  a drak bar in the top, that isn't matching with anything
[15:25] <zequence> It's matching with itself. Cause, there's only one taskbar
[15:25] <OvenWerks> zequence: bug# 1546328 does not show fix released and at my last test was still able to lock the desktop. This would be a ISO fail for me.
[15:25] <sakrecoer> ok, but the screen isn't just a taskbar
[15:26] <zequence> There's plenty of themes that do it that way. So, I really don't understand how you can make a rule about that
[15:26] <OvenWerks> bug 1546328
[15:26] <sakrecoer> i get the feeling you are missing my point zequence 
[15:26] <zequence> OvenWerks: We will fix that bug before Final Release. That'll have to do for now, I think
[15:27] <OvenWerks> zequence: A locked desktop? will have to do?
[15:27] <OvenWerks> OK
[15:27]  * OvenWerks just woke up
[15:28] <sakrecoer> there are plenty of rainbow colored themes, they can look good according to personal taste, for sure. i'm talking about taste, i'm talking about consistency in the relationship between drak and bright elements on a screen
[15:28] <sakrecoer> i'm *not talking about taste
[15:28] <sakrecoer> anyways, back to testing
[15:29] <sakrecoer> but right now, it looks like there are 2 themes installed
[15:30] <zequence> sakrecoer: As said, there are plenty of themes that have dark taskbars, yet no dark borders on windows. You seem to dislike that, so that is a matter of taste for you
[15:30] <zequence> Gnome comes defaulted that way
[15:30] <sakrecoer> its not what i'm talking about
[15:30] <zequence> It's pretty standard, actually
[15:30] <sakrecoer> there are plenty of rainbow themes, and maybe i don't like them, but at least they are consistent
[15:31] <sakrecoer> but sure, if we want to have different colors for everything, lets vote about it!
[15:31] <zequence> That's not going to happen, I'm afraid
[15:32] <sakrecoer> then i don't get the point of everything you've written about it?
[15:32] <OvenWerks> sakrecoer: it is a bit late for that.
[15:32] <sakrecoer> i was just told it isn't..
[15:32] <zequence> Anyone can work on artwork, if they want, but I will make the final decision. Optimally we would have an artwork lead and specialized artist, but since we don't have that, I am the art lead, and everyone else is a graphic artist, if they want
[15:32] <sakrecoer> ... that is was just a matter of using existing options
[15:33] <OvenWerks> sakrecoer: there is time to tweak things, but probably not to overhaul.
[15:33] <sakrecoer> iäm talking about tweaking, no overhaul
[15:33] <zequence> OvenWerks: He would only change theming settings
[15:33] <OvenWerks> Ack! zsync says I am only at 43%
[15:34] <sakrecoer> also, i happen to be a specialized graphic-artist with a mster degree from swiss design school... but sure, you are the art-lead with final word
[15:34] <zequence> sakrecoer: As said, you may work on it, if you want. I will review and decide - not based on personal taste, but on two parameters 1)functionality 2)relevance to Ubuntu Studio style
[15:35] <sakrecoer> i'd be interested in knowing how you can decide anything related to aestetics, without including any taste factor? but that is for offtopic :)
[15:35] <zequence> I have nothing else to use except my judgement, and since I'm the lead, I'm the one who has to suffer and do it :)
[15:35] <OvenWerks> sakrecoer: from a user POV, I really like the window with focus to have a title bar that is visibly different from non-focus title bars. Perferably different colour such as grey and blue the way 14.04 is.
[15:35] <sakrecoer> but if you prefere to have it like this: yes, my taste says it is bad taste to have unmatching elements in a graphic chart
[15:36] <sakrecoer> oh, 14.04 is great yes!
[15:36] <sakrecoer> it follows our grahpic charts
[15:36] <sakrecoer> the current doesnt
[15:36] <sakrecoer> but lets drop it here, and pick it up after test :)
[15:37] <zequence> I'm not talking for the current theme. I'm talking against rules that evidently don't apply universally
[15:37] <sakrecoer> i'll propose a set of settings, and then you decide!
[15:37] <zequence> Sure, and anyone else can have their opinions too, and I will listen to them all
[15:37] <sakrecoer> i'm not talking about any universal rules, i'm talking about consistency to a graphic charts. 
[15:38] <OvenWerks> sakrecoer: the current trend is to only one full screen app at a time (part of convergence) so the colour of the title bar (if the title bar is even visible) seems to be always the same colour focus or not :P
[15:38] <zequence> Doesn't matter. Better if you make something and we can see the results
[15:38] <sakrecoer> :) perfect!
[15:39] <sakrecoer> OvenWerks: yes, i've noticed that. it's a great way of reducing missmatching porblems and also maximise screensurface. but i don't think we can have it that way with xfce..
[15:41] <OvenWerks> sakrecoer: it is not about xfce vs: anything so much as development (sw or audio or video) aften requires more than one window at less than full screen to be useful. We are not making a distro aimed at web browsing like vanilla.
[15:42] <OvenWerks> sakrecoer: we are not doing convergence, we are creating a working environment for art development.
[15:43]  * OvenWerks goes and makes breakfast for the family
[15:49] <sakrecoer> sure, i'm alligned to what you say OvenWerks. as a blender fanboy, i'm forced to live with that type of missmatch
[15:50] <sakrecoer> however, the only way to take a non-taste based decision in this case, is to take a group decision.
[15:51] <sakrecoer> and the way it looks now, looking at our color chart, goes against everything i've learned about functional design, and chart consistency
[15:51] <sakrecoer> the blue windows were a much better move, looking from the current charts persepctive
[15:52] <sakrecoer> atm we don't have a dark theme, we have a drak taskbar
[15:58] <OvenWerks> sakrecoer: I'll look when I have an ISO to play with :)
[16:00] <sakrecoer> OvenWerks: :) i understand i might appear to be slightly burning for the issue, and it's partialy true. that being said, i'll create a proposition, and will happy live with it being downvoted :)
[16:03] <OvenWerks> sakrecoer: no worries, if it looks good at all, it will just get merged.
[17:07] <Rosco2> Marked Ubuntu Studio as ready
[17:08] <Rosco2> Looks like in the release team there are problems with grub making working systems unbootable on EFI
[17:08] <Rosco2> May have respins and a delay
[17:47] <zequence> sakrecoer: There won't be a vote though. Just making that clear :)
[17:48] <zequence> Not when it comes to artwork. Doesn't work very well, since we don't really have an art department to do the voting
[17:48] <zequence> Rosco2: Oh, fun. Another smoketest required then..
[17:51] <sakrecoer> incredible! 3rd liveboot , blueman crash :(
[17:51] <sakrecoer> zequence: ok :) well, then we will have a decision based on your taste. it's fin thought. 
[17:54] <sakrecoer> 'ubuntu-bug display' for imagemagick doesn't seem to produce a imagemagick repport
[17:56] <sakrecoer> ubuntu-bug imagemagick does anyway
[18:06] <zequence> sakrecoer: ubuntu-bug can only be used with packages. Sometimes difficult to know which package is in question
[18:06] <zequence> It's always 'ubuntu-bug <packagename>'
[18:06] <sakrecoer> yeah.. i don't have any clue as how to find a lead...
[18:06] <zequence> sakrecoer: Is this about a desktop file (starter in the menu)?
[18:07] <sakrecoer> ubuntu-bug krita brought me to calligra... i hope it is just the launchpad name
[18:07] <sakrecoer> yeah, i figured afterwards that i just need to put the number of already exisitng bug in the tracker
[18:08] <sakrecoer> i did mark that imagemagick bug as "affects me" though
[18:08] <zequence> sakrecoer: Probably the binary package krita is in the calligra source package
[18:08] <zequence> ubuntu-bug might redirect the source package
[18:10] <sakrecoer> ok, lets hope it was right, i did however picked the "don't know package" option and noted in the comment the problem was in krita and that ubuntu-bug bought me there.
[18:11] <zequence> sakrecoer: If you know the file, but don't know which package it belongs to, you can use dpkg to look for which package it belongs to. Like 'dpkg -S /bin/bash'
[18:12] <zequence> But, I do think krita has its own source package though
[18:12] <sakrecoer> ok :) nice!
[18:12] <zequence> sakrecoer: Another tool, which I don't know very well is apt-file. 
[18:17] <sakrecoer> is it supposed to eb impossible to save files in a live-boot session?
[18:18] <zequence> sakrecoer: The filesystem is in RAM. You can download and change files, and all of that will be stored in RAM
[18:18] <zequence> You can add as much files as your RAM has space
[18:19] <zequence> But, you can't save in between boots. Not unless you make a special medium.
[18:24] <sakrecoer> ok.. strange thing is that i can't even write to the partition of my disk which isn't encrypted and is able to be mounted
[18:25] <sakrecoer> in apps, it doesn't show up as an entry, even after mount. in file manager, drag'n'drop, copy paste, none work
[18:28] <zequence> sakrecoer: Ok, so you are having a problem with mounting a harddrive?
[18:29] <sakrecoer> no, it omunts fine, i can open things from it. just not write
[18:29] <zequence> That could be worth adding a bug for
[18:29] <sakrecoer> s/omunts/mounts
[19:11] <sakrecoer> minesweeper? :D
[19:12] <sakrecoer> makes me shed an extra tear over audcious :D
[19:54] <sakrecoer> had to do some backup, but now i'm doing a fresh install. i'm connected to my wifi, my wifi displays in the list of install dialogue and password is correct. Yet "Download updates while installing Ubuntu Studio" is greyed out
[19:55] <sakrecoer> i'm guessing this is because, well, there are no updates since its the latest version
[19:55] <sakrecoer> if not, what is the installer called? so that i can file a bug about it..
[19:57] <flocculant> assuming that you *are* connected - that shouldn't be greyed out - ubiquity is the package to file against
[19:57] <sakrecoer> thanks flocculant! i'm writing from that computer, so i assume i *am* connected :p
[19:57] <flocculant> :)
[20:08] <sakrecoer> oh, doesn't really work as i expected.. i was thinking about installing over my dev partition.. but i can't figure how to do that in the custom installation type menu
[20:09] <sakrecoer> alongside shows my disk as being full...
[20:10] <sakrecoer> never mind that...
[20:13] <sakrecoer> strange... it want to allow me to install a third parition, but when i chose to install "along *them*" it display sda1 with different sizes from the current ones
[20:14] <sakrecoer> sda1 and sda2 that is...
[20:15] <sakrecoer> nah, this is too risky, if i kill sda1 i might as well wipe my brain too
[20:19] <sakrecoer> hmm... sda2 doesn't even show in the custom installation type..
[20:23] <sakrecoer> i'll do a full backup then... need to get my hands on a cheepass computer striclty for dev things...
[20:24] <sakrecoer> i fail at test deadline again :'(
[20:35] <sakrecoer> OvenWerks: was that you in #ubuntustudio ?
[20:46] <OvenWerks> sakrecoer: yes
[20:46] <OvenWerks> qjackctl still fails the whole ISO.
[20:47] <OvenWerks> In other news... any one noticed a new entryu in settings?
[20:48] <sakrecoer> OvenWerks: no?
[20:48] <OvenWerks> Right at the bottom of the settings manager on the right it says "XFCE Panel Switch" This is fantastic!
[20:48] <sakrecoer> right! i saw some video about it!
[20:49] <OvenWerks> knome: pass on my thanks to whoever came up with that^^^.
[20:49] <sakrecoer> ah, and there the ubuntustudio settings got lost ...
[20:49] <knome> OvenWerks --> bluesabre 
[20:49] <OvenWerks> If we were not going DE agnostic... I would be all for settings up a unique panel setup for workflows or even dual monitors.
[20:50] <OvenWerks> knome: Sounds right :) Anyway congrates.
[20:50] <knome> OvenWerks, thanks, and glad you like the stuff that gets oozed out of the xubuntu team :)
[20:51] <sakrecoer> yeah its great!
[20:51] <OvenWerks> I will certainly be playing with that on my system
[20:53] <sakrecoer> seems the one we use is "xubuntu modern"
[20:54] <knome> yes, that's the xubuntu default today
[20:56] <sakrecoer> yes, don't get me wrong about my earlier entries about the look: the look is great, i just think it doesn't quite fit what i understand is the US color chart
[20:57] <knome> i'm not getting anybody wrong :P
[20:57] <knome> US can do whatever they want, and nobody in xubuntu gets hurt really
[20:57] <knome> it's your product
[20:58] <sakrecoer> good :) i just felt an itch to express my respect for your work.
[20:58] <sakrecoer> "better safe than sorry"
[21:00] <knome> trust me, no need to apologize for changing stuff
[21:00] <sakrecoer> :)
[21:02] <knome> at least all of my contributions to FOSS are totally free to be ripped apart and modified to something else you like
[21:02] <sakrecoer> i kindof took that for granted. it was more in how i put things in the discussion with zequence 
[21:03] <sakrecoer> anyways glad to have centered the dots over the "i" :)
[21:03] <knome> well it's open source... why would you not be able to take and modify it? :)
[21:04] <sakrecoer> exactly what i'm thinking. yet, if anyone would have read me as typing "crap is ugly" well, that can hurt, and it wasn't what i ment. at all.
[21:04] <knome> ;)
[21:05] <OvenWerks> The style has changed a few times in 1604 already...
[21:06] <OvenWerks> sakrecoer: wants phasex-dark  ;)
[21:06] <sakrecoer> haha!! 
[21:06]  * OvenWerks is walking on "thin ice"
[21:07] <sakrecoer> more like NOX
[21:07] <sakrecoer> but i don't like those funky stripes in NOX
[21:07]  * sakrecoer falgging with 777% taste based opinions
[21:08] <sakrecoer> *flagging even
[21:12]  * OvenWerks switches to focus follows mouse
[21:15] <OvenWerks> Oh, this version of Ardour is pre tabs.
[21:17] <sakrecoer> OvenWerks: tabs?
[21:18] <sakrecoer> i struggöe to imagine where they would be handy
[21:18] <sakrecoer> struggle*
[21:18] <OvenWerks> I was just setting the version straight in my mind as I generally buld from git head quite often.
[21:21] <OvenWerks> This version of guitarix plugin does not mess with the colours of the plugin host \o/
[21:21] <OvenWerks> (that means I can even use it.
[21:24] <OvenWerks> sakrecoer: setting->window manager->style. Default, daloa, MurrinaBlue, Kokodi all look better to me than Greybird.
[21:26] <OvenWerks> sakrecoer: of all the above default is the closest to what we have now.
[21:26] <sakrecoer> OvenWerks: dalao is new to me, but yes, i tend to prefere compact window headers
[21:27] <sakrecoer> but i understand it can be annoying for people with pen tablets or shaking hands
[21:28] <OvenWerks> sakrecoer: Greybird the focus window and non-focus windows look pretty much the same
[21:28] <knome> i wouldn't use a computer while shaking hands
[21:28]  * knome hides
[21:28] <sakrecoer> i think we shoudl stick to ubuntustudio-blue windows however.
[21:28] <sakrecoer> haha :)
[21:28] <OvenWerks> knome: my computer has no hands...
[21:28] <knome> OvenWerks, but it has legs? woo
[21:28] <knome> :)
[21:28] <OvenWerks> infested with keyboards though.
[21:29] <sakrecoer> sadly, i think many people buy computers only to shake their hands
[21:29]  * sakrecoer hides
[21:29] <knome> >__<
[21:30] <OvenWerks> I think many wring their hands.
[21:30] <sakrecoer> true!
[21:37] <OvenWerks> sakrecoer: please if you try different themes at least start ardour to see what it looks like as it is sensitive to themes.
[21:37] <OvenWerks> qtracktor just crashed... open but idle on changing themes.
[21:38] <sakrecoer> what do you mean by sensitive?
[21:39] <OvenWerks> zequence: when you put together the background if you can see what it looks like on dual screen.
[21:39] <OvenWerks> sakrecoer: changing the theme makes some panels unreadable.
[21:40] <bluesabre> OvenWerks, knome: originally ali1234, I just added a gui and fixed some bugs on top of xfpanel-switch
[21:41] <OvenWerks> bluesabre: thanks anyway, it is a great idea, I would almost move it out of settings and put it in the favorites
[21:42] <OvenWerks> bluesabre: if you say added GUI does that mean I can do things CLI?
[21:42] <bluesabre> OvenWerks: its not directly exposed, but all of the important bits are in their own file
[21:43] <bluesabre> so many with minor tinkering
[21:43] <bluesabre> *maybe
[21:43] <OvenWerks> I'll look but the gui works just fine too.
[21:44] <sakrecoer> hmm.. still on my live-iso boot, i get this line poping up in my terminal: (process:22226): GLib-CRITICAL **: g_path_get_basename: assertion 'file_name != NULL' failed
[21:44] <sakrecoer> even tho i'm connected to a server with ssh
[21:44] <OvenWerks> I normally use two panels, main and a vertical one on the second monitor.
[21:48] <OvenWerks> zequence: I am looking at the cosmicstudio background which actually works very well spread across two displays except the logo is cut in half of course, but the words Ubuntu studio cut the u in half because ubuntu is a longer word. Using two spaces would fix that while still allowing the whole thing to be centred.
[21:49] <sakrecoer_> OvenWerks: the wallpaper zequence did looks like this on dual screen: http://sakrecoer.com/ubuntustudio/image20160219_072401141.jpg
[21:49] <sakrecoer_> almost... the picture is admitedly crap :D
[21:50] <OvenWerks> sakrecoer_: those are two different screens so it would be odd anyway. I have mine set to spanning screens.
[21:51] <sakrecoer_> haha! you poshypunk you! "different screen" minding my dumpster treasures?
[21:51] <OvenWerks> sakrecoer_: mine are cheapy $80 walmart specials.
[21:51] <sakrecoer_> ah, spanning... well, id that had to be taken in account, you couldn't place anything near the middle
[21:52] <sakrecoer_> s/id/if
[21:52] <OvenWerks> sakrecoer_: lopps off the top and bottom too.
[21:52] <sakrecoer_> idealy, a scare in mirror repetition :)
[21:52] <sakrecoer_> square...
[21:52] <sakrecoer_> my fingers and my brain are giving up for today
[21:53] <OvenWerks> sakrecoer_: we didn't have the choice of spanning last I remember.
[21:53] <sakrecoer_> do we now? i haven't investigated... that machine in the picture is not for developing
[21:53]  * OvenWerks is trying out all the new stuff he can find.
[21:54] <OvenWerks> yes we do.
[21:54] <sakrecoer_> great! also great that you hard test! :)
[21:56] <OvenWerks> sakrecoer_: I have three or four extra 20g partitions on my machine that I use for testing.
[21:57] <sakrecoer_> i wanted to do that too, but it seems the dev environment did something funky to my disk when i installed it
[21:58] <sakrecoer_> fdisk -l : Partition 2 does not start on physical sector boundary. Partition table entries are not in disk order.
[21:59] <sakrecoer_> so the installer detects the environment on sda6, but wants to put the new one on sda2
[21:59] <sakrecoer_> i'm backing up all my sda1 one atm, but the ETA is still oscilliating between 12 and 11 hours :(
[22:08] <sakrecoer_> my irssi is down.. i need a break anyway. read you later
[22:32] <OvenWerks> oK Audio and midi work, I can record tracks with Ardour (jack backend)
[22:36] <Len1> pidgin is not the greatest irc client I have ever seen
[22:37] <Len1> It is nice to have something that covers so many different protocols... but irc does not even have a channel search function.
[22:46]  * sakrecoer wonders if OTR in pidgin would work over irc
[22:46] <OvenWerks> OTR?
[22:47] <sakrecoer> its a plugin. Off The Record
[22:47] <sakrecoer> encrypts your chats basicaly
[22:49] <OvenWerks> That would be kind of rude.
[22:49] <sakrecoer> good for speaking to lover over gtalk without having google giving you adds to "buy her/him a ring" 
[22:49] <Len1> I was going to say ok in a PM I guess
[22:51] <sakrecoer> OvenWerks = Len1 ? :)
[22:52] <OvenWerks> Ja
[22:52] <sakrecoer> vad bra!
[22:52] <OvenWerks> I am trying out irc clients.
[22:52] <OvenWerks> Just found out we don't have synaptic any more :P
[22:53] <sakrecoer> OvenWerks: but we have mines! :D
[22:53] <OvenWerks> Just one more app I have to download off the top.
[22:54] <sakrecoer> so synaptic is still developed?
[22:54] <OvenWerks> Why is synaptic listed as nonfree?
[22:55] <OvenWerks> I don't know if I care. It is so useful as a distro dev...
[22:56] <sakrecoer> i liked it too in the sense i felt it was a good compromise between cli and software center
[22:56] <sakrecoer> but how is it especialy good for a distro dev?
[22:56] <OvenWerks> SC does not tell you waht it is doing
[22:58] <OvenWerks> SC does not tell you that BTW I am uninstalling a whole pile of SW because you are in stalling libjack-dev instead of libjack-jackd2-dev just as an example.
[22:59] <OvenWerks> synaptic always shows which packages are being installed/removed. It also allows you to view depends both ways as well as a list of all files installed and where they are.
[23:02] <sakrecoer> fair enough.
[23:06] <OvenWerks> sakrecoer: there have been people who have accidentally removed most of their audio SW from SC
[23:06] <sakrecoer> that is so strange when i think of it: why would installing something require removal of something else?
[23:07] <OvenWerks> sakrecoer: Synaptic also passes package options through to the user while installing. We get more trouble from badly installed jackd for this reason (jackd package asks the user should I install this realtime?)
[23:07] <sakrecoer> ok: conflicts, but shouldn't that be problematic only if conflicting sw is ran simultaneously?
[23:08] <OvenWerks> sakrecoer: installing jackd1 one removes jackd2 and all sw that relies on jackd2.
[23:08] <OvenWerks> Even though jackd1 has a replaces jackd2 in it.
[23:09] <OvenWerks> It is possible to replace jackd2 with jackd1 manually from CLI but you have to know what you are doing.
[23:10] <OvenWerks> It involves doing download only and knowing the right cli switches.
[23:10] <OvenWerks> wine uninstalls some video drivers too.
[23:12] <OvenWerks> wine also installs a ton of 32 bit libs on a 64 bit install. It also switches the location of many libs to handle dual architecture... which puts lv2 plugins in a non-standard directory so the user has to manualy tell the plugin host where to look.
[23:13] <sakrecoer> wine make me want to whine
[23:13] <OvenWerks> wine is wonderful SW. I think...
[23:13] <sakrecoer> so is XP... (not)
[23:14] <OvenWerks> I don't think there is any winos I enjoyed.
[23:14] <OvenWerks> wine allows people with expensive VST plugins to use them in linux.
[23:14] <OvenWerks> Look up avlinux.
[23:15] <sakrecoer> they and their wallet would be better off writing an email to the devs of their favourite expensive vst questioning the reasons as to why they don't produce a -deb
[23:15] <sakrecoer> i'm utterly uninterested in wine, but if you can tell me more about it in offtopic if you want :p
[23:16] <OvenWerks> I've already said all I needed
[23:18] <sakrecoer> :)
[23:18]  * OvenWerks is writing a bug that synaptic is missing
[23:19] <knome> OvenWerks, please don't write any more bugs into synaptic :P
[23:19] <OvenWerks> knome: why?
[23:19] <OvenWerks> it is a bug that we don't include it.
[23:20] <knome> oh
[23:20] <knome> i thought you were going to introduce a new bug in synaptic ;P
[23:20] <OvenWerks> knome: it is the best gui installer we have.
[23:21] <OvenWerks> Anything else I have tried is broken.
[23:21] <knome> actually i'm usually just kidding. take my comments with a load of salt and as if they were jokes :P
[23:21] <sakrecoer> what time is it where you at OvenWerks ?
[23:21] <OvenWerks> 1621
[23:22] <sakrecoer> :) 
[23:22] <OvenWerks> We are -700
[23:26] <OvenWerks> Bug #1561776
[23:41] <zequence> OvenWerks: I would much rather you took that up with Xubuntu, since we sync with them
[23:43] <zequence> It's not a bug that we are missing something that is not already in Xubuntu, so to speak
[23:43] <zequence> ..when it comes to the desktop meta
[23:43] <OvenWerks> I don't know that I should tell xubuntu what to include. I thought you were talking about an extra desktop package to make sure we have things like this.
[23:44] <knome> xubuntu will not ship synaptic
[23:44] <knome> i though studio was mostly syncing desktop settings and themes anyway, not package metas
[23:45] <OvenWerks> knome: I didn't think so, it doesn't really make sense
[23:46] <knome> yep.
[23:46] <zequence> We are syncing the Xubuntu desktop, pretty much as it is. We also have additional multimedia metas
[23:46] <knome> zequence, even applications?
[23:47] <zequence> It's a little bit late to start working on our own DE setup a month before Final Release
[23:48] <OvenWerks> If it doesn't make it, thats fine, it is not a show stopper
[23:48] <zequence> knome: You mean, if we are syncing the desktop applications? Yes, our desktop seed is pretty much identical to Xubuntus
[23:48] <knome> zequence, that sounds a bit weird, but ok :)
[23:49] <zequence> It's in line with our goal to become desktop agnostic, so not very weird at all
[23:50] <zequence> The next step is to base entirely on other DE flavors, but a ubiquity plugin is required for that, aside from smart setup basing on other flavors metas
[23:50] <OvenWerks> Ya we don't have parted anymore either
[23:50] <OvenWerks> sorry gparted
[23:50] <zequence> This is why I proposed for us to have a new package called -desktop-common, so that if we absolutely need some packages, no matter which DE we are on, we can put those there
[23:52] <zequence> Had it been so that someone was actively maintaining our desktop setup, it might have been that we had not synced with Xubuntu at all. 
[23:52] <OvenWerks> Thast the package I was talking about yes :)
[23:52] <zequence> But, since no one has been interested, this is where we are now
[23:54] <zequence> Even if we are desktop agnostic (allowing the user to install whichever DE they want), it is quite possible for us to have our own default DE setup, specific for multimedia production as one of the many choices
[23:54] <zequence> But, to have that - someone needs to put some love into that
[23:58] <zequence> And, that won't be me
[23:58] <OvenWerks> right. ok.