[08:36] <snele> yofel: discover updater is fixed! 
[08:36] <snele> yay!
[08:36] <snele> and thank you for backporting the fix :)
[08:40] <soee> :D
[09:25] <lordievader> Good morning.
[09:32] <vip> moin
[09:32] <lordievader> Hey vip 
[09:39] <acheron88> clivejo: muon. just done a quick build reverting https://quickgit.kde.org/?p=muon.git&a=commit&h=a437d39e43112a3e61ebafadd4e3a06b9bd91437
[09:39] <acheron88> seem to be much better
[09:41] <acheron88> had not the noticed that the other day. frazzled brain I think
[11:20] <clivejo> acheron88: does reverting that commit solve the crashing issue?
[11:25] <acheron88> clivejo: seems to. not sure if it adversely affects/breaks any other feature, but a brief test doesn't show anything too obvious
[11:27] <acheron88> can install, check for updates, install etc OK without crash when reverted
[11:35] <acheron88> may reintroduce the bug it was a fix for? although seems a more minor issue
[11:37]  * sick_rimmit waves and smiles
[11:37] <sick_rimmit> Hello friends
[11:37] <soee> o/
[11:38] <BluesKaj> Hiyas all
[11:38] <sick_rimmit> I have been very pleased with the Telegram integration, it has helped me stay more in touch with what is happening here
[11:38] <soee> hiho BluesKaj
[11:38] <sick_rimmit> o/
[11:38] <BluesKaj> hey soee, sick_rimmit
[11:39] <sick_rimmit> Going to install Beta 2 on a spare partition shortly so I can do some testing
[11:40] <clivejo> hi rick
[11:40] <clivejo> do you have commit access to muon?
[11:40] <clivejo> acheron88 thinks its this commit is causing it to crash - https://quickgit.kde.org/?p=muon.git&a=commitdiff&h=a437d39e43112a3e61ebafadd4e3a06b9bd91437
[11:41] <sick_rimmit> I don't believe so, I am supposed to doing maintenance on the Muon Package Manager
[11:41] <sick_rimmit> Not Software Centre
[11:41] <clivejo> the software centre is called plasma-discover now?
[11:42] <sick_rimmit> OK cool, there so many names for stuff, I just get them mixed up, it's a short term memory thing with me
[11:42] <acheron88> yes, reverting that commit fixes the crashes
[11:43] <clivejo> acheron88: Ill revert and package it :)
[11:43] <sick_rimmit> I might even do some work on it, once I can get it to actually build 
[11:43] <acheron88> obviously undoes the work to fix the bug it was to fix
[11:43] <sick_rimmit> lol I am a bit rubbish :-)
[11:45] <acheron88> clivejo: could be a minor change to that commit could fix both probs (original bug and new crash), but I'm not familiar enough with the backends there to do more than semi-random guessing
[11:46] <mparillo> sick_rimmit: When you install, could you report if you took the Beta-2 image, or just grabbed the daily ISO, and about this: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubiquity/+bug/1561051
[11:53] <clivejo> yeah probably, im not even sure what that is trying to do
[11:55] <clivejo> is there any way to contact the person who commited that?  might be just a mistake
[11:55] <clivejo> in logical or something
[11:58] <clivejo> logic even
[11:59] <clivejo> acheron88: https://launchpad.net/~clivejo/+archive/ubuntu/xenial/+build/9402634
[11:59] <clivejo> no crashes on package reload :)
[12:00] <snele> sick_rimmit: thank you for working on muon package manager. I really miss it in 16.04
[12:00] <clivejo> Im gonna try upgrading my system with it
[12:01] <clivejo> snele: wanna test it?
[12:01] <snele> clivejo: sure but how to reproduce the crash? here discover is not crashing :)
[12:02] <clivejo> discover is now a separate product
[12:02] <clivejo> this is muon package manager
[12:02] <snele> clivejo: I cannot install muon on xenial
[12:03] <clivejo> well thanks to acheron88, it looks like the crash is caused by a commit made on the 3 march
[12:03] <snele> clivejo: muon : Depends: libmuon (= 4:5.4.3-0ubuntu1) but it is not going to be installed
[12:03] <clivejo> snele: are you 386 or amd64?
[12:04] <snele> clivejo: amd64, new clean install from 3 days ago, all 3 staging ppas added
[12:04] <clivejo> theres a package in my PPA
[12:04] <clivejo> https://launchpad.net/~clivejo/+archive/ubuntu/xenial/+build/9402634/+files/muon_5.5.0+gitreverta437d39e43112a3e61ebafadd4e3a06b9bd91437-0ubuntu1~ubuntu16.04~ppa1_amd64.deb
[12:06] <acheron88> clivejo: quick google gives a gmail address for commiter
[12:06] <clivejo> fancy getting in touch with him?
[12:08] <acheron88> http://permalink.gmane.org/gmane.comp.kde.devel.bugs/1636335
[12:08] <acheron88> ^^^ not related to this bug
[12:08] <clivejo> he seems to have made contributions to it before
[12:08] <snele> clivejo: thank you for the muon package. it installs and works :) bye bye synaptic 
[12:09] <snele> clivejo: how to reproduce the crash? 
[12:09] <acheron88> yes, the commit was approved here: https://git.reviewboard.kde.org/r/127107/
[12:09] <clivejo> snele: the crash seems to be fixed by reverting a commit to the source code
[12:10] <clivejo> but it probably reopened another bug somewhere else that the dev was trying to fix
[12:10] <snele> clivejo: your package works fine
[12:10] <clivejo> on first use, maybe
[12:10] <acheron88> just about to try. got sidetracked finding that email
[12:10] <clivejo> not convinced yet!
[12:11] <snele> clivejo: will it be available in main repo? muon that is. i really miss it and i hate synaptic
[12:11] <clivejo> snele: its non-maintained upstream
[12:12] <clivejo> so unless someone steps in to maintain it and keep it updated, it will probably die off :(
[12:12] <clivejo> but I think its worth getting in contact with Carlo Vanini
[12:13] <clivejo> he seems to have an indepth knowledge of its workings
[12:13] <snele> sick_rimmit: please maintain it :)
[12:14] <acheron88> clivejo: you should prob email him, as you can more easily action/build/put something in a ppa if he sorts it 
[12:15] <clivejo> maybe Rick should?
[12:28] <clivejo> ok, I sent a message to him
[12:34] <clivejo> well upgrade went fine :)
[12:48] <sick_rimmit> snele: I will try :-)
[12:50] <snele> sick_rimmit: thank you :) it needs official maintainer to be included in 16.04 repo
[12:50] <sick_rimmit> Oh, well I don't mind being the official maintainer, I might not actually be able to get it to build..
[12:51] <sick_rimmit> But lets not let a small thing like that get in the way
[12:51] <sick_rimmit> lol
 It builds fine :p
[13:38] <BluesKaj> clivejo, just curious, why are you guys using telegram ?
[13:44] <ricktimmis> Hi folks, here we go Kubuntu beta2 installed on the metal of my laptop
 Cause I'm not at my computer at the moment
[13:44] <ricktimmis> All went smoothly accept for 2 things
 It allows me to see what's going on while I'm on the go
[13:45] <ricktimmis> The Install icon on the desktop from the live boot, was very small, you could not see that it said Kubuntu Installer.
 Yea same here
[13:45] <ricktimmis> This would not be good for new people.
[13:46] <ricktimmis> When I went to restart the machine just hung, Black screen with Mouse pointer..
[13:46] <ricktimmis> It sat there forever, and would not let me Alt+F to jump to another tty
[13:46] <ricktimmis> In the end I had to power cycle it..
[13:47] <ricktimmis> anyone else get that ?
[13:47] <BluesKaj> there are mobile irc clients 
[13:48] <BluesKaj> Andchat for one., if you have an android phone
[13:48] <sgclark> BluesKaj: using both allows us to traget a larger group of users. Not everyone likes irc
 They aren't very nice to use
[13:48] <sgclark> target*
[13:49] <ricktimmis> Yes, I am really delighted with the Telegram integrations, lets me stay intouch here all the time
 Telegram is easy to use and works good on intermittent mobile networks
[13:49] <BluesKaj> clivejo, yeah, but I thought your generation was skilled at typing on those dinky screens :-)
 Irc can't seem to keep a connection
 It also buffers/caches the conversation
[13:53] <BluesKaj> I tried Andchat , it seemed to work ok, but that was with a wifi connection, I don't do data on my phone.
 I've used irc clients but no good
[13:54] <sgclark> telegram all started one akademy when irc port was blocked, and it stuck
[13:54] <sgclark> it is great for shoddy internet
 My connection jumps from cell to cell. Also use cell in two different countries
[13:55] <sgclark> we can use both, seems to me its is working
[13:55] <BluesKaj> clivejo, i don't like typing on a phone, the virtual KB is waaay too small for these fingers
 I don't like typing on it either. Much prefer my keyboard. But its handy. I can join in the conversation
 Plus can share media with other people on telegram
 Screen shots etc
[13:58] <sgclark> most importantly .. stickers!!!
 And turkey heads!
 Telegram has a desktop client too
[15:51] <clivejo> acheron88: ping
[15:52] <acheron88> yep
[15:52] <clivejo> got a reply from the dev
[15:53] <clivejo> https://quickgit.kde.org/?p=libqapt.git
[15:53] <clivejo> he added the signals in this commit
[15:54] <clivejo> the two are supposed to work together
[15:54] <acheron88> hmmm... I thought I looked at that the other day and saw no update
[15:56] <acheron88> you think of getting that into a ppa so people can have fixed muon then?
[15:56] <acheron88> thinking
[15:56] <clivejo> not sure
[15:57] <clivejo> do you think people would want it?
[15:59] <acheron88> I'm ambivalent, as I use synaptic and command line to manage packages mostly
[15:59] <clivejo> I use command line 
[16:00] <acheron88> some people might though. some people on this channel have said they would like it, but that's not quite typical userbase
[16:00] <clivejo> !info libqapt xenial
[16:01] <acheron88> ahhh. lookign at FF history, I checked debian upstream version of libQApt, as I assumed it was theirs to maintain rather than on the KDE git
[16:01] <clivejo> !info libqapt-dev xenial
[16:02] <acheron88> didn't think it would be on kde git
[16:09] <clivejo> acheron88: do you still have the newer version?
[16:12] <clivejo> wonder if lastest git snapshot of qapt would fix it
[16:12] <clivejo> https://launchpad.net/~kubuntu-ci/+archive/ubuntu/unstable/+build/9353609
[16:13] <acheron88> nice one. was just about to build that!
[16:17] <acheron88> this is your ppa package before reverting, yes? https://launchpad.net/~clivejo/+archive/ubuntu/xenial/+build/9396713
[16:17] <soee> a lot of people wanted muon in xenial :)
[16:17] <clivejo> yeah, I deleted the latest one from my PPA
[16:17] <soee> mentioned here on #kubuntu channel or G+ community
[16:18] <clivejo> from the dev "I'm working on Muon just since the split from Discover, and it's nice to see there is interest in it! I'm also trying to make up my mind whether I should take the effort of
[16:18] <clivejo> porting it to a declarative (i.e. QML) interface or not. Maybe you can give advice on that decision."
[16:18] <soee> i think Discover will be like SOftwere Center in Ubuntu - nobody uses it :)
[16:19] <soee> people prefere to use muon/synaptic
[16:19] <clivejo> Id like to reply back and tell him the Kubuntu community would behind it.
[16:19] <clivejo> would be
[16:21] <acheron88> Discover is hideous. 
 Amen Clive! /me goes off to vote
[16:22] <acheron88> clivejo: KCI qApt packages and your deb seems to not crash so far
[16:23] <clivejo> acheron88: yeah, but if I packaged qapt git and the latest git or Muon I think would be a better solution 
[16:23] <clivejo> and if I could get that into Xenial, might encourage the dev to keep working on Muon
[16:24] <clivejo> valorie: your thoughts?
[16:24] <acheron88> yes, don't disagree. was just lazily testing with the KCI packages to save building qapt myself
[16:25] <clivejo> does using the KCI unstable branch of qapt crash Muon?
[16:26] <acheron88> have checked for updates twice and installed 2 packages, separately, and no crash so far at least
[16:26] <clivejo> I wonder if uninstallable libmuon is room enough to open a FFE?
 @Sick_Rimmit you around?
[16:42] <snele> clivejo: I think you (kubuntu guys) shoud at least make muon available in ppa for xenial
[16:42] <snele> if it wont be available in repo
[16:43] <snele> btw thank you for muon package from your ppa. works great
[17:08] <sick_rimmit> \o/
[17:08]  * sick_rimmit Woo Hoo
 ?
[17:09] <sick_rimmit> Muon package manager builds and rund from Kdevelop
[17:09]  * sick_rimmit jumps up and down grinning
 check your email
[17:09] <sick_rimmit> That's pulling from Master branch..
[17:09] <sick_rimmit> So now I can start to do some maintenance on it
[17:12] <ahoneybun> sick_rimmit, you can move the widgets
[17:13] <sick_rimmit> ahoneybun:  Hmm press and hold on the top of plasmoid widget ? is that new behaviour, I don't do that in 15.10 I just hover and the settings, and sizing panel pops out
[17:13] <ahoneybun> yea in Plasma 5.5 I think
 @Sick_Rimmit are you in front of the computer?
[17:21] <sick_rimmit> Yes, trying to get myself sorted as maintainer of Muon Package Manager
 get on hangouts then
 @Sick_Rimmit 
 What's happening on Hangouts
 show your desktop fuction?
 so I can show you the widget thing?
[17:24] <sick_rimmit> Ah I'm working on 15.10 now
 but I have 16.04
[17:24] <sick_rimmit> I installed 16.04 on a different partition, just so I could do some QA testing
 right but I could show you my desktop
[18:03] <sick_rimmit> ahoneybun: probably skip HO right now, as we'll be having dinner shortly
 Oh k
[18:57] <mparillo> I created a VM to try to duplicate https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubiquity/+bug/1561051 But so far all is good (it is copying files). Is it a silent error?
[19:21] <mparillo> The Beta-2 image seemed to install just fine in a VM. I even did not experience the bug where it would not shut down cleanly. (I used to have to force power-off my VM).
[20:29] <valorie> clivejo: my thoughts -- I want muon, absolutely
[20:29] <valorie> synaptic sucks by comparison (as does Discover, IMO)
[20:29] <clivejo> do you think we could get it into Xenial?
[20:32] <snele> discover is great *applications* manager. But for me it has no use. i need "package" manager when i don't want/cannot use apt
[20:34] <snele> clivejo: muon from your ppa works great. no crashes. thank you again for packaging it
[20:35] <snele> synaptic just sucks compared to muon imho
[20:53] <valorie> clivejo: I would consult with yofel by email perhaps
[20:53] <clivejo> hes offline for a few days
[20:54] <clivejo> probably mid week
[20:54] <valorie> if we have an upstream maintainer and it builds, etc. then you could file an FFE or whatever it is
[20:54] <valorie> oh, not even email?
[20:54] <valorie> lucky him!
[20:54] <clivejo> I dont want to disturb him
[20:54] <valorie> ok
[20:54] <soee_> [22:33] <yofel> FYI: I'm on a trip until Wednesday and won't be online much
[20:54] <valorie> you could as sgclark too
[20:55] <clivejo> I emailed Carlo Vanini who seems to be interested in maintaining it
[20:55] <valorie> ask
[20:55] <valorie> cool, that would be awesome
[20:55] <valorie> I would love to see it back in the archive
[20:55] <valorie> even if it doesn't make it onto the ISO
[20:56] <valorie> we may need to do some pruning for the ISO
[20:58] <clivejo> "Anyway, thanks for your mail. I'm working on Muon just since the split from Discover, and it's nice to see there is interest in it! I'm also trying to make up my mind whether I should take the effort of porting it to a declarative (i.e. QML) interface or not. Maybe you can give advice on that decision."
[20:58] <valorie> are you going to work with him on it?
[20:58] <valorie> how about @sick_rimmit ?
[20:58] <clivejo> I have no clue about programming
[20:59] <clivejo> I havent coded since uni!
[20:59] <valorie> me either, so perhaps share his email with kub-dev list?
[21:00] <valorie> I've debugged BASIC for my husband and sons, and typed in a program in Assembler that worked
[21:00] <valorie> that sentence right above is my entire coding experience
[21:00] <valorie> except the sort of coding that is writing English sentences
[21:05] <snele> translations are broken
[21:06] <snele> or at least setting them up
[21:06] <snele> i am trying to change from english to german without luck
[21:06] <clivejo> Ive emailed him back to ask him if he minds me posting his details and previous emails on the devel list
[21:06] <valorie> thanks clivejo
[21:06] <snele> plasma seems translated but not the apps
[21:07] <valorie> I'm running backups on this machine right now, then going to upgrade it to xenial
[21:12] <clivejo> !info kde-l10n-de xenial
[21:13] <clivejo> snele have you kde-l10n-de installed?
[21:15] <snele> clivejo: yes i have it installed
[21:15] <sgclark> valorie: I could what?
[21:15] <snele> clivejo: but my locales conf was kinda broken right after clean install
[21:16] <snele> i am trying to reconfigure it atm...
[21:16] <clivejo> snele: would you mind testing something for me?
[21:17] <valorie> sgclark: clive and I were discussing Muon
[21:17] <valorie> imo it won't be on the ISO, but it should be in the archive
[21:17] <valorie> seems it will be maintained again ::fingers crossed::
[21:18] <snele> clivejo: sure
[21:18] <clivejo> sgclark: I been in contact with a dev who is working on Muon Package Manager.  He made a change in the KDE master which on currently Xenial systems crashes the program on package reload
[21:18] <valorie> sgclark: btw have been following #kde-sysadmin -- fantastic work! you rock
[21:19] <clivejo> basically, it needs an updated libqapt
[21:19] <sgclark> thanks :) keeping me busy lol
[21:19] <valorie> sounds like you made the leap to lightspeed though
[21:19] <sgclark> we are like way past freeze no?
[21:19] <clivejo> yes
[21:19] <valorie> sure but it is a bugfix
[21:19] <clivejo> but muon is badly broken
[21:20] <valorie> not a whole new app
[21:20] <clivejo> its trying to pull in libmuon
[21:20] <valorie> clivejo: oh, I thought it was fixed?
[21:20] <clivejo> valorie: the currently muon is badly broken
[21:20] <clivejo> in xenial archive
[21:20] <clivejo> but it could be fixed
[21:20] <valorie> got it
[21:21] <clivejo> we can either use an older git version which works, or update libqapt and muon
[21:21] <clivejo> I prefer the second solution
[21:22] <sgclark> where are we on the bugfix releases, we alowd to upload? sounds like they are needed, with that mail rick sent
[21:23] <clivejo> do you guys know Carlo Vanini ?
[21:23] <sgclark> and sorry I really don't know the muin answer, never used, have not touched those deps packages
[21:23] <sgclark> muon
[21:24] <sgclark> clivejo: no idea, name is not ringing bells, but I meet many new faces at akademy each year.
[21:24] <sgclark> speaking of which we need to get clivejo to akademy
[21:24] <valorie> I've not met him in person or online, actually
[21:24] <valorie> sgclark: I know, right?
[21:25] <sgclark> lol
[21:25] <valorie> we'll have to hire someone to take care of his farm and puppy
[21:25] <clivejo> more the pup!
[21:25] <clivejo> hes been a nightmare today
[21:25] <sgclark> aw bring the pup!
[21:25] <valorie> we'll fly to Ireland and pick him up, make him go
[21:25] <clivejo> no way!
[21:26] <sgclark> I so want to go to Ireland, I have family there
[21:26] <clivejo> he cant sit still for 5 mins without finding something to chew and break
[21:26] <sgclark> lol
[21:26] <valorie> sgclark: me too, although my McBees left a long, long time ago
[21:27] <valorie> and I have no clue where they came from
[21:27] <clivejo> snele: can you install libqapt and muon from my xenial PPA
[21:27] <valorie> or how they got from Ireland to Kentucky
[21:28] <clivejo> probably a boat :P
[21:28] <clivejo> its a long swim
[21:28] <snele> clivejo: sure. and then test muon?
[21:29] <clivejo> yes please
[21:29] <clivejo> this version is how the dev intended
[21:30] <valorie> clivejo: smartass!
[21:30] <clivejo> :P
[21:32] <clivejo> sgclark: Im thinking of opening a FFE for muon, what do you think?
[21:36] <sgclark> if you want to track and deal with it sure, I am tied up with kde stuff :(
[21:38] <clivejo> snele: is it working for you?
[21:40] <snele> clivejo: added your ppa, updated, everything seems to be fine
[21:40] <snele> what was the crash before?
[21:40] <clivejo> reloading/refreshing the package list
[21:40] <snele> clivejo: works fine here
[21:40] <snele> no crashes
[21:50] <soee_> :)
[21:56] <clivejo> soee_: you mind testing too?
[22:02] <soee_> what ppa ?
[22:03] <clivejo> sudo add-apt-repository ppa:clivejo/xenial
[22:09] <acheron88> clivejo: seems good using both muon/qapt from your ppa now
[22:09] <clivejo> acheron88: :)
[22:09] <clivejo> Fancy adding your thoughts on Bug #1562406
[22:10] <clivejo> and anyone else for that matter
[22:12] <clivejo> sgclark: can I upload these to misc-staging ?
[22:12] <valorie> I'll try in a bit, when my backup is done
[22:13] <sgclark> clivejo: yeah
[22:13] <clivejo> Ill need a debdiff for the FFE
[22:14] <clivejo> seems the best way to get one
[22:14] <clivejo> well easiest
[22:16] <soee_> uhm it died when i pressed to refresh list
[22:16] <soee_> *check for updates
[22:17] <soee_> http://paste.ubuntu.com/15514806/
[22:18] <acheron88> that's the same bug, or at least same output, as previously
[22:19] <acheron88> you have qapt versions? 3.0.1+git20160315-0ubuntu1~ubuntu16.04~ppa1
[22:20] <acheron88> and muon? 4:5.5.0+git20160326-0ubuntu1~ubuntu16.04~ppa1)
[22:22] <soee_> http://paste.ubuntu.com/15514852/
[22:24] <clivejo> soee_: what version is libqapt3 at?
[22:25] <clivejo> dpkg -s libqapt3
[22:27] <acheron88> I have http://paste.ubuntu.com/15514878/
[22:28] <clivejo> muon deps on libqapt3-runtime
[22:28] <clivejo> but I think it might need something else
[22:28] <clivejo> for run time
[22:36] <clivejo> thats weird
[22:36] <clivejo> what is libqapt-runtime for if it doesnt pull in libqapt3
[22:38] <acheron88> dbus and polkit integration by the looks of it from the file list?
[22:39] <acheron88> muon won't even start without libqapt3 here "/usr/bin/muon: error while loading shared libraries: libQApt.so.3"
[22:39] <clivejo> yeah it needs it
[22:39] <acheron88> so presume soee must have that
[22:39] <clivejo> but it didnt get upgraded on his system
[22:40] <clivejo> I added a dep on libqapt3-runtime (>= 3.0.1+git20160315) to muon
[22:41] <clivejo> I thought that would auto upgrade libqapt3
[22:41] <acheron88> odd, if it wan't just missed off the bottom of soee's paste
[22:43] <acheron88> will try on laptop to add the ppa, as that is xenial as well
[22:53] <acheron88> all upgraded, and muon installed, and not crashing on laptop as well
[22:56] <clivejo> wish could do some tests with soee