[02:04] <darkxst> I notice some packages syncing that require gtk+ 3.20 (which is not going to ready soon) can these be blocked somehow?
[02:07] <darkxst> infinity, ^
[02:22] <infinity> darkxst: Erm, not easily.
[02:23] <infinity> darkxst: Why is ours going to take significantly longer than Debian's?  The Mir patch can't be that bad to forward-port.
[02:24] <infinity> Debian's had 3.20 in experimental since March, you'd think we would have been paying attention...
[02:24] <darkxst> infinity, its the CSS Nodes changes, so Unity themes will need a lot of work
[02:24] <Ukikie> Themes and even some applications.
[02:25] <darkxst> larsu typically did the themes work, but he has left -desktop team
[02:25] <infinity> darkxst: What's synced that's breaking?
[02:26] <infinity> Things like gspell seem harmless, since it didn't exist before.
[02:26] <darkxst> nothing breaking, will just be stuck in proposed
[02:26] <infinity> Sure, that's not the end of the world unless it ends up blocking people working on something specific.
[02:26] <infinity> And if it does, we can work around it.
[02:27] <infinity> But we should try to migrate ASAP anyway, especially if the new GTK changes lots of things, so we get testing.
[02:28] <infinity> cjwatson: Dang, wish I'd paid closer attention to uninst on release day.  That node-bones uninst on two arches turns out to be a long string of node packages that are all broken and need removing/demoting (doing now in yakkety).
[02:36] <darkxst> infinity, ok, so just deal with the packages individually if we need to upload bugfixes?
[02:37] <infinity> darkxst: Pretty much.  I can't block "everything with N versioned build-dep" and blacklisting all gtk packages is also silly, so...
[02:37] <infinity> darkxst: If we really need to fix something in an older version, we can remove the newer one, pop the older one in proposed, wait for it to migrate, and reinstate the new one.
[02:38] <infinity> darkxst: But I really do hope we just move to the new gtk instead.
[02:38] <darkxst> infinity, ok, thought there might be a way to do that, but thats fine
[02:38] <darkxst> I can't see it coming "soon"...
[02:38] <darkxst> gtk+ that is
[02:39] <infinity> I'll see if I can put some pressure on Will to make it a priority. :P
[02:39] <darkxst> Will is trying to find someone to work on the theme
[02:39] <infinity> Ahh, joy.
[02:40] <infinity> Well, who needs themes anyway?  I remember when GTK applications were grey and square.
[02:40] <darkxst> there is no one left on the desktop team, that really is familiar with themes
[02:40] <darkxst> right, lets just go back to the 90's everything was so simple then :)
[02:40] <infinity> No one in the community he could throw some money at either?
[02:41] <darkxst> I suggested one person to him
[06:06] <tsimonq2> infinity: got thrown a W: lxqt-metapackage source: newer-standards-version 3.9.8 (current is 3.9.7)
[06:06] <tsimonq2> infinity: https://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/upgrading-checklist.html shows 3.9.8 as current
[06:06] <tsimonq2> infinity: what's up with that?
[06:11] <infinity> tsimonq2: The lintian changelog can probably answer your question without you asking me.
[06:12] <infinity> tsimonq2: http://metadata.ftp-master.debian.org/changelogs/main/l/lintian/unstable_changelog
[06:16] <tsimonq2> infinity: I see, but it needs to be synced to Yakkety, seems to be a recent upload so I'll be patient, just thought I'd ask :)
[06:16] <infinity> tsimonq2: It's in -proposed.
[06:16] <infinity> tsimonq2: Things are a bit backed up now with the autopkgtest queue, that's all.
[06:17] <tsimonq2> infinity: which is why I kinda guessed it's too recent yet
[06:17] <tsimonq2> infinity: I see :)
[06:17] <tsimonq2> infinity: sorry for my impatience :P
[07:55] <cjwatson> infinity: node-bones> ah, ok.  thanks for chasing that.
[07:56] <infinity> cjwatson: I've been bored, I knocked out a few.
[07:56] <infinity> Should probably sleep.
[07:58] <infinity> cjwatson: I'm tempted to blacklist 32-bit-only software on the basis that who effin' cares.
[07:58] <infinity> cjwatson: That would take out a chunk of the amd64 list.
[09:03] <LocutusOfBorg> good morning, lets try again: I want libpng removed from ubuntu, but you already know that, remaining issues are: faumachine broken in debian too, can't fix, k3d is a boost issue I couldn't understand, openmsx a boost/gcc issue, scantailor is now fixed, virtualbox has some fPIE issues I can't know how to fix, warzone2100 is broken in Debian too, xcftools has some utf8 issues I'm pinging the upstream developer to look at them
[09:03] <LocutusOfBorg> what are the next steps?
[09:04] <LocutusOfBorg> BTW for xcftools I guess some export UTF8 on test/dotest are already enough, but I can't test because I have no s390x machine
[09:25] <ginggs> LocutusOfBorg: openmsx uploaded, there was a fix on github that wasn't there yesterday
[09:28] <LocutusOfBorg> oh gosh, I looked at openmsx two days ago, and I also tried to build the latest git snaphost :)
[09:31] <flocculant> darkxst: given that Ali has blogged testing for you on yakkety - I've added yakkety to the tracker for you - you had nothing to test
[09:46] <flocculant> sgclark: not sure who else is kubuntuish tbh - but you've no builds on the isotracker either
[09:48] <lordievader> flocculant: Yofel is Kubuntu ;)
[09:48] <flocculant> lordievader: thanks - yofel ^^
[09:49] <flocculant> :)
[10:23] <darkxst> flocculant, ok, thanks.
[16:42] <sgclark> flocculant: hi, I am a newb, what do you mean by builds on isotracker, Am I suppose to do something? Not sure I would have perms. yofel has been away.
[17:13] <infinity> flocculant: What do you mean kubuntu has no builds on the tracker?  They've been there since day 1.
[17:14] <infinity> flocculant: If you mean no testcases, yeah, that seems a bit borked.
[17:14] <infinity> .. for everyone.
[17:14] <infinity> Who deleted all the testcases? :P
[17:14] <infinity> stgraber: ^
[17:15] <infinity> stgraber: Do they not carry over between series' or did someone oops?
[17:30] <flocculant> infinity: that I guess
[17:31] <flocculant> anyway I did for some flavours - deffo borked for ubuntu
[17:32] <flocculant> tbh  - it always took a poke to get them on the tracker - never automatic
[17:34] <infinity> Irksome.
[17:46] <sgclark> sorry to be a pain, is this something I am suppose to be doing? ( still learning here )
[17:48] <flocculant> sgclark: on the isotracker - flavours have test instances for their iso
[17:49] <flocculant> sgclark: you 'kubuntu' have none currently :)
[17:49] <sgclark> gosh we sure don't
[17:50] <sgclark> but I am clueless on how to remedy that
[17:50] <flocculant> infinity: well perhaps this is one of those 'if flavours' things - no different than the milestone issue
[17:50] <flocculant> sgclark: I haz help for you :)
[17:50] <sgclark> flocculant: yay ty
[17:51] <infinity> flocculant: IMO, it should be fixed at the source, creating a new series should copy the old one en toto.  But since we can't hop in a time machine and do that, thanks for helping people out.
[17:51]  * flocculant does wish there was some manual for it though ;)
[17:51]  * sgclark wants a time machine
[17:51] <flocculant> infinity: the score is - 'help people' 1 - be stupid 0
[17:52] <flocculant> sgclark: anyway - I assume you are in the kubuntu 'release team' ?
[17:52] <flocculant> assuming so - /query flocculant and we'll sort it out for you :)
[17:52] <sgclark> flocculant: I am suppose to be assistant to yofel. But yofel has been very busy
[17:53] <flocculant> ack - such is life :)
[17:53] <sgclark> yep
[17:53] <flocculant> infinity: there are so many ubuntu ones - I've not even thought about those ...
[17:53] <sgclark> so I am just trying to learn as I go and be helpful while I have a smidge of time
[17:54] <infinity> flocculant: Meh, Ubuntu's not your problem.  I'll get it sorted if you don't.  But thanks for helping fellow flavours.
[17:54] <flocculant> yup - /query me and I'll point you in the right direction :)
[17:55] <infinity> flocculant: And not sure if sgclark has the right tracker perms.
[17:55] <flocculant> infinity: always happy to point out there are no directions once I've helped :D
[17:55] <sgclark> I probably don't
[17:55] <flocculant> infinity: sgclark just has to be in kubuntu release team afaik
[17:55] <sgclark> perms has been one of my biggest blockers
[17:55] <flocculant> if not I can do
[17:55] <sgclark> I am not official release no
[17:56] <flocculant> ...
[17:56] <flocculant> okey doke
[17:56]  * flocculant puts kettle on
[17:56] <sgclark> sorry to dissapoint lol
[17:57] <flocculant> infinity: I'll make yak kubuntu = xenial kubuntu then
[17:57] <infinity> flocculant: WFM.
[17:58] <infinity> I'm not actually sure which LP team maps to "kubuntu release" in the tracker.
[17:58] <infinity> And I can't see the guts to find out.
[17:58] <infinity> So, meh.
[17:59] <flocculant> infinity: well https://launchpad.net/~xubuntu-release works for us/me and the perms work
[18:00] <flocculant> also I'm in ubuntu-qa-website-devel personally so can fix stuff for flavours
[18:00] <infinity> flocculant: Yeah, but there is no ~kubuntu-release. ;)
[18:00] <sgclark> well our reelease team for years was just Jonathan.
[18:00] <sgclark> that is no more
[18:01] <infinity> Only stgraber and a few others can see what the tracker actually means by "kubuntu release", it's a black box to me.
[18:01] <infinity> *shrug*
[18:01] <sgclark> so yofel and I stepped up, but we both still need to get ubuntu-core motu etc
[18:01] <sgclark> time being issue of course
[18:02] <sgclark> anyway the whole experience has been an eye opener!
[18:03] <flocculant> infinity: ok - have perms - will sort them out :)
[18:03] <infinity> sgclark: core-dev and motu aren't really necessary for flavour people, so long as you have packeset rights to most/all of what you need.
[18:04] <sgclark> hmm I have had to have everything sponsered it seems
[18:04] <flocculant> infinity: afaik - I could add kubuntu peeps
[18:04] <flocculant> but
[18:04] <infinity> sgclark: But the loss of Riddell and ScottK as "general experienced and privileged Ubuntu people" (release team, SRU, archive admin, etc) is something I need to backfill for.  Not kubuntu's responsibility, though, just sucks.
[18:05] <sgclark> yes it does
[18:05] <sgclark> I am trying to become one of those. but I have still much to learn
[18:05] <flocculant> *this* is just about 'no docs' though
[18:05] <sgclark> I had no idea.
[18:06] <sgclark> someday I will get there, they have many years experience above me lol
[18:07] <infinity> flocculant: Yeah, the tracker is pretty much just documented in stgraber's head, and the random experience of people banging their own heads on it.
[18:09] <flocculant> infinity: I have that headache ...
[18:10] <flocculant> stgraber: ok - I have added your 32/64 bit builds copied from xenial - anymore - get people in to your release team and I'll talk to you and explain what you need to do at some point :)
[18:11] <infinity> s/stgraber/sgclark/ :P
[18:11] <flocculant> infinity: I *think* that Nick waited for me to whine then had a script :)
[18:11] <flocculant> oh yea ... sgclark :)
[18:11] <infinity> flocculant: Yeah, pretty sure when I whine to stgraber about things like this, he just mangles the SQL DB on the backend.
[18:12] <flocculant> infinity: it seemed it was always me that did the whine :p
[18:12] <flocculant> anyway - sending a mail to list(s)
[18:13] <sgclark> ok "get people in youor release team" can you expand on that? me and yofel are release team, him being of higher power.
[18:13] <infinity> I'll be seeing stgraber later tonight, I'll be sure to annoy him.
[18:13] <flocculant> infinity: not touched 'upgrade'
[18:13] <infinity> sgclark: Don't worry about what that means until we know what your "release team" is.
[18:13] <sgclark> and thank yoou for your help, truly
[18:13] <sgclark> ok
[18:13] <infinity> sgclark: As in, the tracker thinks you have one, but I don't know what it is. :P
[18:14] <sgclark> got it
[18:14] <flocculant> sgclark: I will elaborarate
[18:14] <infinity> flocculant: See above.
[18:14] <sgclark> I will carry on learning and doing as I can
[18:14] <sgclark> thanks for all the help, I do appreciate it
[18:18] <stgraber> infinity: tracker permissions is a bit weird because Drupal. Basically you have roles, like "kubuntu release" which are assigned to products. Those "roles" are applied automatically through OpenID, you can get the mapping list from the Launchpad openid plugin configuration page (that would be role to LP team mapping)
[18:19] <infinity> stgraber: Yeah, that last bit sounds like a thing I can't see. :)
[18:20] <infinity> stgraber: Hence why I don't know what maps to "kubuntu release".
[18:22] <flocculant> stgraber: you fiddling? can't get to admin pages ...
[18:22] <stgraber> flocculant: nope
[18:22] <flocculant> or is just a normal 'buntu thing :(
[18:22] <stgraber> infinity: yeah, IIRC only folks in ~ubuntu-qa-website-devel have full admin access. I'm happy to add you to it if that's useful.
[18:22] <flocculant> magic as soon as I moan ...
[18:22] <flocculant> stgraber: I think it would be useful :D
[18:23] <stgraber> flocculant: well, he may not want to have such access so he can instead keep having me do the changes :)
[18:24] <knome> flocculant, i'm on the admin team too fwiw...
[18:25] <infinity> stgraber: Yeah, I have zero urge to be special, I'd rather whine about buggy manual procedure until you make it not manual. :P
[18:25] <infinity> stgraber: (ie: new series not having testcases, derp)
[18:26] <stgraber> infinity: I thought we made it so testcases can be changed not to be tied to a series, only using the per-series bit for old LTS releases
[18:26] <stgraber> anyway, boarding now, see you in a bit
[18:26] <infinity> stgraber: I get there late (like, midnightish), but see you soon.
[18:31] <flocculant> knome: ack that
[18:31] <flocculant> stgraber: yea - but don't I don't know who in -release has those perms so ...
[18:31] <flocculant> I know you do :)
[18:32] <flocculant> I do as well - not something I would hand out like sweets for sure
[18:32] <flocculant> but as far as I know - as long as foo is in their release team they can add products
[18:32] <flocculant> sent mail to -release/qa re that
[18:33] <flocculant> I can and did - deal with my stuff and some flavours - some others - Lubuntu/Kylin added their own it seems
[18:34] <flocculant> bit *shrug* - really only care about Xubuntu - but seemed churlish to not mention it :D
[18:35] <flocculant> infinity: I have mail in mod queue re tracker on -release if you could do something with that :)
[18:36] <flocculant> oh meh - same on -quality
[18:36] <flocculant> mailman loves images :p
[18:36] <knome> flocculant, actually i handled lubuntu :P
[18:37] <flocculant> jibel: could you approve the -quality modded message from me please :p
[18:37] <flocculant> or hggdh if you are first ;)
[18:37] <flocculant> knome: cheers :)
[18:41] <flocculant> sgclark: so basically - kubuntu release team needs to be on LP - then you'll get access to the right things on the tracker(s)
[18:42] <infinity> flocculant: I'm sure there's a mapping there, we'll figure out what it is.
[18:42] <flocculant> infinity: :D
[18:44] <flocculant> infinity: I just know I have 2, 1 from xubuntu release - which allows me to do whatever with the xubuntu bit, 2 - ubuntu-qa-website-devel which allows me to do stuff for anyone - hence dealing with gnome and kubuntu
[18:44] <hggdh> flocculant: approved
[18:44] <flocculant> knome has the same -website approval
[18:44]  * infinity puts on pants and goes to catch some airplanes.
[18:44] <flocculant> good call there infinity ...
[18:44] <flocculant> or arrest
[18:44] <flocculant> :p
[18:44] <flocculant> hggdh: thanks :)
[18:44] <hggdh> yw
[18:47] <flocculant> stgraber: while I know this sounds a bit like 'well jfdi then' there's nothing that I know of written down about this - especially from a flavour pov
[18:47]  * flocculant did mention it a few times to balloons :D
[22:52] <flocculant> infinity: help ... I want to change the time that xubuntu images build - and I'm pretty sure that I need to do the mp in ubuntu-cdimage/etc/crontab
[22:53] <flocculant> I've just seen so many different branches of it - I am completely confused where to pull and push from :(
[22:53]  * flocculant does a sad 
[22:59] <cjwatson> flocculant: lp:ubuntu-cdimage is the master branch
[23:09] <flocculant> cjwatson: thanks :)
[23:10] <flocculant> cjwatson: sorry here - so I rarely venture into Lp to push things - how do I push to there lp:~flocculant/ubuntu-cdimage/somename ?
[23:11] <cjwatson> flocculant: https://help.launchpad.net/Code/UploadingABranch
[23:12] <cjwatson> or you can just tell me what change you want, but you may want the practice
[23:12] <cjwatson> (UploadingABranch> then https://help.launchpad.net/Code/Review)
[23:13] <flocculant> cjwatson: well I manage ok with the manual test branch - not come across one that doesn't say bzr push foo - but basically I (xubuntu) are looking to get our builds building earlier
[23:14] <cjwatson> "not come across one that doesn't say bzr push foo" - sorry I have no idea what you mean
[23:14] <flocculant> looked at all the times in /etc/crontab there - hoping for 1am for the daily
[23:15] <flocculant> cjwatson: like bzr push lp:~flocculant/ubuntu-manual-tests/ubuntu-manual-tests
[23:15] <cjwatson> flocculant: the Launchpad page for a branch only shows that if you can push to the branch
[23:15] <flocculant> aak okey doke
[23:15] <cjwatson> https://git.launchpad.net/launchpad/tree/lib/lp/code/templates/branch-management.pt for gory details
[23:17] <flocculant> cjwatson: happy to look  - but in the meantime would there be a reason for the xubuntu build to not be moved?
[23:17] <cjwatson> no particular reason I know of
[23:18] <flocculant> we're trying to sort out some way to let our testers know our build is at least working - manual testing is our best current option
[23:18] <flocculant> cjwatson: ok thanks for your help - I'll get the mp there as soon as I can and then wait on you all :)
[23:19] <flocculant> cjwatson: wasn't expecting you to be up tbh - getting on in the UK :)
[23:19] <cjwatson> I put it at about that time in 2006 when Xubuntu was created, probably arbitrarily
[23:19] <cjwatson> I'm going to bed soon enough
[23:20] <flocculant> cjwatson: yup - pretty much the same - south coast UK
[23:20] <flocculant> thanks for the help :)
[23:35] <flocculant> for better or worst ... https://code.launchpad.net/~flocculant/ubuntu-cdimage/x-build-time/+merge/293489