| sakrecoer | on the facebook-page, in the thread inviting to contribute to the feature-definition, quite a few people are saying that they miss synaptic and gparted. | 10:28 |
|---|---|---|
| autumna | sakrecoer: were they supposed to be there? | 11:47 |
| OvenWerks | autumna, sakrecoer: they used to be there yes. We lost them due to sync with xubuntu-desktop. May I suggest a ubuntustudio-utilities meta? | 13:26 |
| autumna | OvenWerks: what I meant was was the change intentional. and I think ubuntustudio-utilities wouldn't be a bad idea | 13:27 |
| OvenWerks | Note ubuntu (and perhaps debian) would really like to get rid of synaptic.... but I have not found any GUI that replaces it. | 13:27 |
| OvenWerks | synaptic is not snap aware... | 13:28 |
| OvenWerks | The desision to sync with xubuntu was intentional. The loss of these utilities was not. But being DE agnostic has been considered more important. | 13:29 |
| autumna | no its just.. at least gparted was on livecd but not in install | 13:39 |
| autumna | ergo I wasn't sure if the package was just missing accidentally or got removed by design so to speak :D | 13:39 |
| autumna | but yeah | 13:39 |
| OvenWerks | gparted is used by the installer... so it is there as part of that and like the installer it is removed/not copied on install. | 13:40 |
| OvenWerks | gedit, gparted and synaptic were originally added by design after xubuntu stopped including them. | 13:41 |
| autumna | *listens* | 13:41 |
| OvenWerks | mousepad has come a long way since then and so gedit is probably not needed. The other two are applications I install pretty quick on my machine. | 13:42 |
| OvenWerks | In fact I install them just for testing a lot of the time. Synaptic in particular allows easy access to an application's depends and a list of installed files. | 13:44 |
| OvenWerks | This is more important to someone developing a distro than using the distro for sure though. | 13:45 |
| OvenWerks | One of the features of synaptic I consider very important is that it tells you what packages it is going to remove so it can install whatever it is you are thinking of installing. | 13:46 |
| OvenWerks | niether USC or Software do that. | 13:46 |
| autumna | OvenWerks: nah if you are a power user it does end up becoming handy too (synaptic) | 14:18 |
| autumna | I have mixed feelings about gnome software. it feels a bit clunky right now. | 14:18 |
| OvenWerks | autumna: gnome software is there so ubuntu can push commercial developers to use snap packages. | 15:20 |
| OvenWerks | Or perhaps this is at the request of these people. | 15:20 |
| OvenWerks | I think snap is diven by money interests rather than practical interests. | 15:21 |
| autumna | what is the advantage of snap for commercial developers? | 15:22 |
| OvenWerks | 1) it carries a specific version of libs with it. | 15:22 |
| OvenWerks | 2) I think there are some security things in there that help with code blobs | 15:23 |
| OvenWerks | 3) Something like synaptic will not tell the user what files are included :) | 15:23 |
| OvenWerks | perhaps others. | 15:24 |
| OvenWerks | Basically the packager has much more control and the user has less. | 15:24 |
| OvenWerks | synaptic seems to be in maintenance only... some bugs are fixed from time to time... there are 4 merge proposals waiting right now. | 15:28 |
| zequence | sakrecoer: I say we create a new meta package which is useful on all DE environments - and add synaptic and gparted to that meta | 15:28 |
| zequence | Neither of those are DE specific | 15:28 |
| OvenWerks | someone is trying to add snap packages to synaptic it seems | 15:28 |
| zequence | sakrecoer: OvenWerks: we were discussing the option of adding a new package called ubuntustudio-desktop-common, and seemingly we have two candidates for that new package | 15:34 |
| zequence | Two candidates for dependencies, that is - synaptic and gparted | 15:34 |
| OvenWerks | zequence: sounds good. Perhaps make a diff from 14.04 and 16.04 (-desktop) and see if there are any other differences that make sense. (some things are better to let go of, gedit is no longer needed) | 15:35 |
| OvenWerks | zequence: is desktop-core a part of desktop? | 15:41 |
| OvenWerks | Not so easy as I thought :P | 15:52 |
| zequence | OvenWerks: desktop-core is inherited into -desktop, so everything in -desktop-core is also in -desktop | 16:14 |
| zequence | This is done in the file STRUCTURE | 16:14 |
| zequence | OvenWerks: I'm pretty sure that most of the difference is of not matter - things that you can find on all DEs | 16:15 |
| zequence | A text editor, a browser, etc. | 16:15 |
| zequence | synaptic is no longer in any flavor, I think. gparted may be in some DEs | 16:16 |
| zequence | gparted is IMO a DE agnostic disk manager, and is probably not absolutely needed | 16:16 |
| zequence | ..since there are already disk management tools on all DEs | 16:16 |
| zequence | But, I guess you could say gparted is to disk management what synaptic is to package management - slightly more manual | 16:17 |
| zequence | ..and more advanced | 16:17 |
| zequence | OvenWerks: I didn't know about the problems with editing the menu, btw. It's too bad ours is broken by the existing tools | 16:18 |
| zequence | Wonder how much trouble it would be to fix those making them do things right | 16:19 |
| sakrecoer | zequence, OvenWerks : such a meta is a very good idea. | 16:29 |
| OvenWerks | zequence: Re: menu editors... No one is really interested in fixing things even with a merge or patch to do it for them. Even the opendesktop site says one thing in text and then the example menu layout goes against it. I put in patches for lxde, xfce, gnome, and xubuntu. The only one that was accepted was xubuntu. | 19:10 |
| OvenWerks | The truth is that DEs are moving away from menus as fast as they can and while there is still a system menu available in xfce's panel... no one wants to improve it. | 19:11 |
| OvenWerks | There are a lot of people who like the search style of application starting/finding. | 19:12 |
| * OvenWerks finds proof of dinasourism in himself ;) | 19:13 | |
| autumna | yeah but one isn't a replacement for other.. | 19:44 |
| OvenWerks | autumna: that is correct, I use the system menu. Someone using the pc for entertainment is probably not using UbuntuStudio. | 19:46 |
| autumna | well even if you are using the pc for entertainment. games, video players, other software, categorization never hurt anyone | 19:47 |
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