=== JanC is now known as Guest71745
=== JanC_ is now known as JanC
[04:39] <lotuspsychje> good morning to all
[04:49] <lotuspsychje> http://news.softpedia.com/news/zfs-for-linux-0-6-5-7-released-with-support-for-linux-kernel-4-6-and-4-5-504053.shtml
[06:08] <brushdemon> alright
[06:08] <brushdemon> and here we are
[06:09] <lotuspsychje> you can use the channel here for conversations
[06:09] <brushdemon> Thanks
[06:10] <brushdemon> I was thinking about getting one of the new ubuntu based tablets
[06:10] <lotuspsychje> M10?
[06:10] <brushdemon> errrr, well I got heaps of emails about it since I signed up for the pre-order for it
[06:11] <brushdemon> I got destroyed by bills when the pre-order window was open though ;~;
[06:11] <lotuspsychje> i would wait until unity8 comes out
[06:11] <brushdemon> oh, why's that?
[06:11] <brushdemon> wayland?
[06:11] <brushdemon> wait
[06:11] <brushdemon> I haven't kept in the loop for a while, is Ubuntu going with wayland or mir for unity8?
[06:11] <lotuspsychje> well then you would be able to install ubuntu-desktop + unity8 on windows based tablets also
[06:12] <lotuspsychje> brushdemon: unity8 will come, but canonical will leave the choice to users
[06:12] <lotuspsychje> if they prefer unity7 or 8
[06:13] <brushdemon> It's so menial but simply giving users the choice to move the bar from the left hand side of the screen to the bottom would probably make unity a little more popular
[06:13] <brushdemon> that's in my opinion though
[06:13] <lotuspsychje> unity is already very popular
[06:13] <brushdemon> and it's the one complaint I have heard about unity time and time again
[06:13] <lotuspsychje> but also all the ubuntu flavors
[06:14] <brushdemon> yeah, ofc
[06:14] <baizon> brushdemon: http://www.webupd8.org/2016/03/ubuntu-1604-xenial-xerus-gets-option-to.html
[06:14] <brushdemon> FUCK YES
[06:15] <brushdemon> My whole past year has been messed up and I've missed out on so much news
[06:15] <brushdemon> unity-dev team, I salute you
[06:15] <lotuspsychje> and also snap packages coming our way
[06:15] <lotuspsychje> ive installed telegram with snap yesterday
[06:15] <lotuspsychje> on 16.04
[06:15] <brushdemon> oh, I remember hearing about discussion of them in 2014
[06:16] <brushdemon> they're actually a thing now?
[06:16] <brushdemon> well
[06:16] <lotuspsychje> yep
[06:16] <brushdemon> you just said you used one :x
[06:16] <brushdemon> wow, I've lived under a rock for a year
[06:16] <brushdemon> like.... I don't even know how
[06:16] <lotuspsychje> snap find
[06:16] <lotuspsychje> in terminal
[06:17] <brushdemon> lemme upgrade first haha :p
[06:17] <lotuspsychje> then sudo snap install your-snap-package
[06:17] <brushdemon> so the user tool is pretty much like using apt?
[06:18] <lotuspsychje> snap packages also showing in ubuntu-software
[06:20] <brushdemon> very nice
[06:20] <brushdemon> so what packages are supported by the new format?
[06:21] <brushdemon> I'm going to guess all of ubuntu-core by now at least
[06:21] <lotuspsychje> the ones newly created
[06:21] <ducasse> morning all
[06:21] <lotuspsychje> hey ducasse
[06:21] <brushdemon> ah, so it'll be a slow process to move everything over to it?
[06:21] <brushdemon> heya ducasse
[06:21] <lotuspsychje> brushdemon: its not meant to move all things over, classic .debs will continue to exist
[06:22] <lotuspsychje> brushdemon: snap brings more possibilities
[06:22] <lotuspsychje> and no dependecie nightmares anymore
[06:22] <brushdemon> YES!
[06:22] <lotuspsychje> we had telegram-desktop for ubuntu-desktop aleady
[06:23] <brushdemon> is there a good article/blog/anything that highlights snap that you'd recommend?
[06:23] <lotuspsychje> but inside a package still
[06:23] <ducasse> i hope snap gets an option like apt show for more info on a snap, the descriptions are really brief.
[06:23] <lotuspsychje> ducasse: snap find from terminal
[06:23] <lotuspsychje> ducasse: sudo snap install your-snap
[06:24] <lotuspsychje> and shows snap in ubuntu-software also
[06:24] <ducasse> lotuspsychje: yes, but those descriptions are very short afaict
[06:24] <brushdemon> I think adding a longer description would be a trivial thing really
[06:24] <lotuspsychje> like manpages?
[06:24] <ducasse> oooohh, better manpages too, yes!
[06:25] <lotuspsychje> well i also think snap packages are good to run from tablets that will run unity8 etc
[06:25] <brushdemon> haha, upgrading a vm atm to 16.04 and it's funny once it gets to dovecot and postfix
[06:25] <lotuspsychje> so now a user could install the nmap snap package on his tablet
[06:25] <brushdemon> the number of times it flashes, "Would you like to merge your config files"
[06:25] <brushdemon> NOPE
[06:25] <brushdemon> I'm good thankyou apt
[06:26] <ducasse> absolutely, snap looks wonderful for tablets etc.
[06:26] <brushdemon> ^ this
[06:27] <lotuspsychje> but also on desktop, for specific stuff
[06:27] <ducasse> lotuspsychje: sure, but i still love you, apt;)
[06:27] <lotuspsychje> yeah
[06:28] <lotuspsychje> im just wondering who checks the new incomming snaps for security?
[06:28] <lotuspsychje> can a malicious user suggest a dark snap easy or not?
[06:29] <ducasse> hmm. i hope they are vetted.
[06:30] <lotuspsychje> telegram/about looks neat
[06:31] <brushdemon> ahh, now I see what snaps are
[06:31] <lotuspsychje> GNU GPL 3
[06:32] <lotuspsychje> brushdemon: its a bit like a ubuntu-touch app sort of
[06:32] <brushdemon> yuh, it's nicely self-contained
[06:32] <brushdemon> It makes me think of chroots
[06:34] <ducasse> what is the 'x11-apps' snap?
[06:34] <lotuspsychje> not sure
[06:34] <lotuspsychje> didnt test
[06:35] <lotuspsychje> bbl breakfast here
[06:35] <lotuspsychje> have a nice one
[06:44] <brushdemon> well
[06:44] <brushdemon> that's one vm upgraded
[06:45] <brushdemon> oh wow, great work with the apt documentation
[06:45] <brushdemon> this is actually awesome!
[06:47] <ducasse> i upgraded a vm all the way from 14.10 to 16.04 the other day, took less than an hour and went perfectly :)
[06:55] <brushdemon> hehe, I did that a while back
[06:55] <brushdemon> well from 13.10 up to 15.04
[06:55] <brushdemon> no issues either
[06:56] <brushdemon> well... actually there is always an issue with mysql but you just read the notes on it
[06:56] <brushdemon> it's not super hard to work out
[07:28] <de-facto> haha they released ZFS for linux on Friday, 13th of May? seriously?
[07:43] <ducasse> if you're talking about ZoL 0.6.5.7, it was released May 12th.
[11:12] <BluesKaj> Hiyas all
[11:51] <pauljw> Hi everyone
[11:54] <BluesKaj> Hi pauljw, how goes it today ?
[11:55] <pauljw> hey BluesKaj, so far so good, still getting the sleep out of my eyes.  :)  how about you?
[11:59] <BluesKaj> same, allergies I had as a child have sprung up again ...watery itchy eyes etc....drops help tho
[12:02] <pauljw> oh, allergies are a bear, good that drops help out.  i take claritan(sp?) and that helps me some.  seems this part of the country everyone has allergies.  always damp, everything grows.  :)
[12:06] <DJones> Afternoon all
[12:10] <pauljw> hi DJones
[12:12] <BluesKaj> hey DJones
[12:18] <DJones> Hi pauljw BluesKaj
[13:21] <lotuspsychje> good afternoon to all
[13:23] <pauljw> hey lotuspsychje
[13:23] <lotuspsychje> hey pauljw
[13:25] <DArqueBishop> Howdy lotuspsychje.
[13:25] <lotuspsychje> hi there DArqueBishop
[13:46] <lotuspsychje> OerHeks: those 16.04 help wiki's are pretty nice made
[13:47] <OerHeks> just found them
[13:47] <OerHeks> i cannot test BT issues, as i am on 15.10
[13:47] <lotuspsychje> and i dont have BT
[13:48] <OerHeks> i do, apple magic trackpad and a bt keyboard somewhere ..
=== not_phunyguy is now known as phunyguy
[14:26] <EriC^^> sup
[14:26] <lotuspsychje> EriC^^: you see triple 9 yet mate?
[14:26] <EriC^^> nope
[14:26] <lotuspsychje> gotta see!
[14:26] <EriC^^> first time i hear about it
[14:26] <lotuspsychje> best movie so far
[14:27] <EriC^^> nice
[14:27] <lotuspsychje> bit like HEAT
[14:27] <EriC^^> watching trailer now
[14:27] <EriC^^> kate winslet hmm
[14:28] <lotuspsychje> http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1712261/
[14:29] <lotuspsychje> 120min big suspense :p
[14:30] <pauljw> hey EriC^^
[14:31] <EriC^^> hi pauljw :)
[14:31] <EriC^^> lotuspsychje: black guy is the bad guy right
[14:31] <lotuspsychje> i cant tell you nothing :p
[14:31] <EriC^^> hehe
[14:32] <lotuspsychje> i can only say its a movie where its hard to say who's good and not
[14:40] <lotuspsychje> wb
[14:40] <EriC^^> thanks
[14:41] <EriC^^> damn torrents are quick
[14:41] <EriC^^> almost 1mb d/l
[14:41] <lotuspsychje> EriC^^: shhh :p
[14:41] <lotuspsychje> EriC^^: your going to the theaters to watch this evening?
[14:41] <EriC^^> lol
[14:41] <EriC^^> no
[14:41] <lotuspsychje> lol
[14:41] <EriC^^> i'm d/ling it right now
[14:42] <lotuspsychje> http://www.cio.com/article/3070434/linux/linux-cant-keep-you-safe-if-you-dont-update-it.html
[14:42] <OerHeks> ohhh never new that!
[14:42] <lotuspsychje> :p
[14:44] <lotuspsychje> sudo apt-get drop updates
[14:47] <lotuspsychje> OerHeks: the ammount keeps rising...http://fossforce.com/2016/05/italian-military-goes-libreoffice-hbo-abuses-dmca/
[14:47] <lotuspsychje> OerHeks: did they buy you that building perhaps?
[14:48] <EriC^^> damn ps4 games are HUGE
[14:49]  * lotuspsychje sends popcorn & soda to EriC^^ with ubuntuDr0ne
[14:49] <EriC^^> fallout4 18gb
[14:49] <lotuspsychje> oO
[14:49] <EriC^^> imagine how much work is put into that game O.o
[14:49] <lotuspsychje> its crazy, if you think of the detailed graphics and levels
[14:49] <EriC^^> yeah
[14:50] <lotuspsychje> game devs are earning more then you and me togheter
[14:50] <EriC^^> yeah games are like $60-$80
[14:50] <OerHeks> oh i seeded 15x that size by now
[14:50] <lotuspsychje> :p
[14:51] <lotuspsychje> bluray's even more crazy
[14:51] <lotuspsychje> 80-100gig per dvd
[14:51] <EriC^^> wow
[14:52] <lotuspsychje> imagine the time you need to rip one with handbrake lol
[14:57] <EriC^^> we should make those shirts
[14:57] <EriC^^> fuck the computer store
[14:57] <EriC^^> lol
[14:57] <EriC^^> we'll be richhhhhhh
[14:57] <EriC^^> :p
[14:57] <lotuspsychje> lol
[14:57] <OerHeks> noo, leave the stores alone.. all i can do now is ordering online, i hate that
[14:58] <OerHeks> i want to feel the package before buying
[14:58] <EriC^^> that's what she said
[14:58] <OerHeks> if the package feels solid, it gains my trust
[14:58] <EriC^^> xD
[14:58] <lotuspsychje> http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/61BP42vjKZL._UX385_.jpg
[14:58] <OerHeks> and if the salesperson smells nice, i will come back
[14:58] <baizon> nice t-shirt :D
[14:59] <baizon> i got one old lenovo with windows that im trying to sell :D
[14:59] <lotuspsychje> http://www.icu-it.nl/wp-content/uploads/2015/09/LinuxTshirt3.jpg
[14:59] <lotuspsychje> lol
[15:00] <lotuspsychje> one to go out @ night
[15:00] <OerHeks> baizon, "almost free door-stopper: .. "
[15:00] <baizon> damn this shirt is even better
[15:01] <EriC^^> gasp?
[15:01] <EriC^^> wth
[15:01] <EriC^^> !find gasp
[15:01] <ubot5> Found: python-gasp, W:, W:, W:, W:, W:, W:, W:, W:, W: (and 12 others) http://packages.ubuntu.com/search?keywords=gasp&searchon=names&suite=xenial&section=all
[15:02] <baizon> hmm, no gasp command for me
[15:02] <lotuspsychje> http://i.imgur.com/5RAM3Rm.png
[15:02] <lotuspsychje> lol
[15:02] <baizon> ok... gasp - a preprocessor for assembly programs
[15:04] <lotuspsychje> hi BluesKaj
[15:04] <EriC^^> they should have used fsck in it
[15:04] <EriC^^> must have thought it was too inappropriate or something
[15:05] <EriC^^> stay calm and root boxes
[15:05] <EriC^^> we should get into the shirt business lotuspsychje
[15:06] <OerHeks> http://imgur.com/gallery/g2wOPn9
[15:06] <lotuspsychje> BluesKaj: you are the 53's user, you have won this tshirt today: http://g01.a.alicdn.com/kf/HTB1VUEKIpXXXXccXXXXq6xXFXXXJ/2015-Summer-Style-100-Cotton-T-font-b-Shirt-b-font-Man-OZF-UBUNTU-font-b.jpg
[15:07] <BluesKaj> hey lotuspsychje, EriC^^, OerHeks
[15:07] <lotuspsychje> OerHeks: lol
[15:07] <EriC^^> hey lotuspsychje
[15:07] <EriC^^> i mean
[15:07] <EriC^^> hey BluesKaj
[15:07] <EriC^^> :p
[15:07] <baizon> no need to piss on windows, it sucks anyway, no need to bother :D
[15:07] <lotuspsychje> lol
[15:08] <baizon> windows will die anyway
[15:08] <lotuspsychje> of course not, we have ubuwin now!
[15:08] <OerHeks> hi BluesKaj
[15:08] <baizon> with such M$ CEOs :)
[15:08] <lotuspsychje> baizon: and they stopped free updates on w10 now...sweet!
[15:09] <lotuspsychje> its the year of the paying and privacy corrupting desktop :p
[15:10] <OerHeks> everybody gets a free copy of win10, but not this ol' witch .. should i start a lawsuit?
[15:10] <lotuspsychje> OerHeks: you need to buy a prvious one first :p
[15:11] <pauljw> hi BluesKaj
[15:12] <baizon> 3 friends of mine had an automatic 7 -> 10 upgrade
[15:12] <baizon> all failed and their system is now broken
[15:12] <lotuspsychje> wow
[15:12] <EriC^^> ok movie time
[15:12] <lotuspsychje> EriC^^: enjoy mate :p
[15:12] <baizon> they got a nice "do you want to upgrade to 10?", they all clicked "no, thank you"
[15:13] <baizon> and all got 10 after reboot :D
[15:13] <lotuspsychje> lol
[15:13] <lotuspsychje> only good news for ubuntu such scenario's
[15:14] <baizon> i personally dont care, havent used windows for a year now. I dont even know how windows 8 and 10 works
[15:14] <BluesKaj> lotuspsychje:  too bad about the shirt, ...not exactly slim anymore :-)
[15:14] <lotuspsychje> we have seen some users really mentioning this in main, they tired of their techniques
[15:14] <lotuspsychje> baizon: xp and 7 were ok...all the rest is a big nightmare
[15:15] <baizon> the best short clip i saw last time with windows 10... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eP31lluUDWU
[15:15] <lotuspsychje> lets c
[15:17] <lotuspsychje> lol
[15:17] <lotuspsychje> blue screen of death updates
[15:18] <baizon> heheh
[15:20] <de-facto> lotuspsychje apropos telegram, Signal from OpenWhisperSystems has a chrome app which syncs almost in realtime with the android app: https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/signal-private-messenger/bikioccmkafdpakkkcpdbppfkghcmihk
[15:20] <lotuspsychje> lets c
[15:21] <lotuspsychje> de-facto: looks coll, does that work on chromium aswell
[15:21] <lotuspsychje> tinoco: welcome
[15:22] <de-facto> lotuspsychje yes im using it on chromium-browser from xenial repo
[15:22] <lotuspsychje> great
[15:23] <de-facto> just does not work if you default to incognito mode (cost me some time figuring that one out)
[15:23] <lotuspsychje> ive tested that telegram snap package yesterday from xenial==>bq ubuntu phone
[15:23] <lotuspsychje> working like a charm here
[15:23] <de-facto> nice, how do they provide that snap? is it a closed binary?
[15:24] <lotuspsychje> de-facto: snap find from terminal
[15:24] <lotuspsychje> de-facto: its based on snappy core right
[15:24] <lotuspsychje> de-facto: works sort of like ubuntu-touch apps
[15:25] <lotuspsychje> de-facto: and they show in ubuntu-software aswell
[15:25] <lotuspsychje> sudo snap install your-snap-package
[15:26] <de-facto> actually that snappy apps will open a lot of possibilities for commercial apps to land on ubuntu, which is pretty nice on one side, but open source ones are even nicer :)
[15:26] <lotuspsychje> yep
[15:26] <lotuspsychje> de-facto: and also for tablets on unity8 etc
[15:27] <de-facto> yup this could be big :P
[15:27] <lotuspsychje> the only thing im wondering is , who test this for security
[15:28] <lotuspsychje> can a malicious app creator add snaps easy or not?
[15:28] <de-facto> thats a very good question
[15:28] <lotuspsychje> we dont wanna endup like android store apps
[15:30] <lotuspsychje> hmm perhaps ubuntu isolating it already somehow
[15:30] <lotuspsychje> after your first install there is a /snap
[15:32] <de-facto> dont those run in some kind of lxc/lxd env?
[15:33] <lotuspsychje> https://insights.ubuntu.com/2016/05/04/security-confinement-in-ubuntu-core/
[15:33] <de-facto> if so i guess the black market prices for such 0days just raised :P
[15:35] <de-facto> ooh well and the "good" old X11 :-/
[15:35] <lotuspsychje> :p
[15:36] <lotuspsychje> we will also follow all this evolution and see hwo it goes
[15:36] <lotuspsychje> so even if mark lets us choose between unity7 and unity8, snap packages can be installed on both worlds
[15:37] <de-facto> didnt the fedora guys had some efforts on X11 isolation with selinux? there also is quobes OS which seems to emplay XEN for isolating X apps
[15:37] <lotuspsychje> could be, i didnt came across an article on that yet
[15:39] <de-facto> Joanna Rutkowska explained some of it on her site http://invisiblethingslab.com/itl/Resources.html
[15:39] <lotuspsychje> lemme read
[15:39] <de-facto> she and her team are behind quobes os
[15:40] <OerHeks> great person indeed, she explained the intel flaws to me.
[15:40] <lotuspsychje> think snappy team did a great job
[15:41] <lotuspsychje> all the devices it can be installed on or developed
[15:43] <lotuspsychje> bbl guys souper + movies
[15:43] <lotuspsychje> have a nice saturday
[15:43] <OerHeks> :-)
[15:44] <OerHeks> i am waiting for my mom, she brings the dogs overhere, as she has difficulties walking now.
[15:44] <de-facto> if you google her name and x11 security things like this show up http://theinvisiblethings.blogspot.de/2011/04/linux-security-circus-on-gui-isolation.html
[18:17] <OerHeks> No, thank you, i already have a Rolls Royce
[18:17] <OerHeks> oops, wrong car
[21:39] <OerHeks> heh, if an 64 bit iso can do a 32 bit install, after boot you could end up with 128 bits
[21:54] <Bashing-om> and you still get to keep the parts ?
[21:55] <OerHeks> Sure, only the floppy says -1