[01:45] <Guest48638> Hi everybody. I would like to install Ubuntu Touch on Asus Zenfone 2, could you help me?
[05:26] <danwe> Hallo There - this is my first time here - does somebody have experience with GPS Problems? I have aquaris 4.5 and for the last two days I have no GPS/location service. anyone experience this kind of a bug? many thanks
[05:27] <lotuspsychje> danwe: check our topic for existing bugs
[05:27] <lotuspsychje> danwe: if you cant find similar, we advise a new !bug
[08:59] <Smurphy> Hmmmm. If I don't get the bluetooth handsfree running in my car and my bike - I guess I'll have to revert my BQ4.5 to android :(
[10:08] <mcphail> Smurphy: I wish there was more progress on the Bluetooth issues.
[10:16] <Smurphy> yes. Me too...
[10:20] <mcphail> And bluez is so tersely documented it is hard to help out
[10:40] <hitman_> hello
[10:42] <aquiles> Hii
[10:42] <aquiles> Good morning
[10:42] <aquiles> I'm using chatter app on my ubuntu phone
[10:42] <aquiles> And works good
[10:44] <aquiles> I liked to know when we can use unity launcher on bottom ???
[10:47] <aquiles> Hii
[12:38] <sebsebseb>  
[13:25] <brunch875> Am I too optimistic to wish for steam + steam games to reach utouch?
[13:25] <brunch875> gaben seems like a coolgui. Maybe he pushes it
[13:36] <Kanba> Hi there, I recently bought a BQ Aquaris M10 Ubuntu Edition. With this I also bought a CSL Bluetooth Keyboard. I was able to connect it to the tablet. It works. But I have a german keyboard layout. Unfortunately I'm not able to put in the special (for german keyboard layout) charactes like the @ sign. Combination of the ALT key  with the CTRL key doesn't work. Any help?
[13:37] <mcphail> brunch875: would require the games to be recompiled for ARM. Not going to happen
[13:37] <brunch875> hnnng but I believe in gabenn
[13:38] <brunch875> games like half-life; it's from 1996
[13:38] <brunch875> sdl
[13:38] <mcphail> sdl isn't magic
[13:39]  * brunch875 's dreams are crushed
[13:40] <mcphail> you'll need to content yourself with baldur's gate, dosbox and (possibly) scummvm for now
[13:43] <brunch875> talking about games
[13:44] <brunch875> did any rougelikes hit the store?
[16:01] <Acou_Bass> mcphail: we have dosbox?/
[16:33] <sebsebseb> anyone here?
[16:35] <Acou_Bass> maybe
[16:40] <sebsebseb> Acou_Bass: are the converged apps
[16:40] <sebsebseb> the standard Ubuntu programs in normal Desktop Ubuntu?
[16:40] <sebsebseb> or arm versions?
[16:41] <Acou_Bass> i believe there are x86 versions of the core apps yeah
[16:41] <Acou_Bass> i could be wrong
[16:42] <sebsebseb> Acou_Bass: yeah that's what I thought
[16:42] <sebsebseb> Acou_Bass: apparnatly can run loads of stuff on Android to via someting or the other hmm.  full Debian even or pretty much, just someone saying something another channel
[16:42] <sebsebseb> people there were also a bit like Ubuntu convergence is a bit pointesls since...
[16:43] <Acou_Bass> there are apps thatll install a full debian ARM image to android and chroot into it to run applications
[16:43] <sebsebseb> Acou_Bass: yeah that's probably what he linked to
[16:43] <Acou_Bass> but ubuntu touch runs the apps right on the hardware and turns into a real desktop when plugged in
[16:43] <Acou_Bass> completely different setup hehe
[16:43] <sebsebseb> seems can then run graphical progarms on  Andorid via Debian as well
[16:43] <dobey> with basically no security
[16:44] <Acou_Bass> well, its chrooted... but thats about it
[16:44] <dobey> and afaik, that project is so far only actually built for nexus 5 on top of CM
[16:44] <sebsebseb> Acou_Bass: dobey yeah I got  linked to this:  https://wiki.debian.org/HowtoDebianInAndroid
[16:44] <Acou_Bass> there are lots of projects that are all basically the same thing
[16:44] <Acou_Bass> debian chroot in android
[16:44] <sebsebseb>  https://wiki.debian.org/HowtoDebianInAndroid
[16:44] <dobey> sebsebseb: yeah, it's just a chroot though
[16:44] <Acou_Bass> usually either using an android port of Xorg, or a VNC server for display
[16:44] <sebsebseb> dobey: seems it can run graphical progarms to though?
[16:45] <dobey> not withou an X server to display them on it can't
[16:45] <sebsebseb> ful GNOME 3 even?
[16:45] <Acou_Bass> there is an Xorg server for android, but most of the apps just VNC into it
[16:45] <Acou_Bass> its a very hacky solution
[16:45] <sebsebseb> oh
[16:45] <sebsebseb> so  Ubuntu convergence isn't pointless then :d as I thought
[16:46] <dobey> if it's on an external display, i presume it runs an X server on the HDMI connection, and not on the device itself
[16:46] <dobey> it also provides no real interaction between the two systems
[16:46] <Acou_Bass> i have no idea about how it works on external display
[16:46] <sebsebseb> also I got the like, why would you want to run desktop programs designed for mouse nad keyboard on a phone or table etc from someone else
[16:46] <Acou_Bass> ive never tried that
[16:46] <sebsebseb> why not just use a pc hting
[16:46] <sebsebseb> h e h
[16:46] <Acou_Bass> well that person doesnt understand ubuntus convergence at all
[16:46] <sebsebseb> I think we need to wait for another two or so ota updates going by my chat here the other day
[16:47] <Acou_Bass> because the apps have two seperate UIs, one for touch one for desktop and it automagically springs between them
[16:47] <sebsebseb> ,but  once that, I guess people will see the potential of Ubuntu convergence more then
[16:47] <Acou_Bass> it really is cool xD
[16:47] <sebsebseb> the apps well via xmir get the two guis the two set ups?
[16:47] <Acou_Bass> nah xmir apps arent convergence-ready for the most part, only the actual uTouch apps hehe
[16:47] <dobey> right. running legacy x11 apps is basically orthogonal to the idea of convergence
[16:48] <Acou_Bass> basically just there for exactly that
[16:48] <Acou_Bass> LEGACY support
[16:49] <Acou_Bass> :P
[16:49] <Acou_Bass> because no one will ever want to use ubuntu on desktop if all their faovurite linuxey apps dont work on it
[16:49] <sebsebseb> you mean on phone or tablet??
[16:49] <Acou_Bass> well... ubuntu touch is eventually going to be 'normal' ubuntu
[16:49] <sebsebseb> being able to run lots of standard Desktop Linux programs and properly, I see as a selling point, if it's not going to support say Andorid apps
[16:49] <Acou_Bass> so it needs legacy desktop app support
[16:50] <sebsebseb> 20 years worth ( or for the most part) worth of Desktop Linux progarms
[16:50] <sebsebseb> the native apps are still lacking
[16:50] <sebsebseb> the good ones to
[16:51] <Acou_Bass> yaeh ive found that... theres a lot of webapps and not a whole lot of real native apps in the store
[16:51] <sebsebseb> exactly which sucks really
[16:51] <sebsebseb> ,but being able to run lots of Desktop LInux programs will be good :)
[16:51] <Acou_Bass> which would be awesome, if the webapps were as awesome as they used to be back in... 12.10 was it? when they had notification intergration and everything
[16:51] <sebsebseb> web apps are generally seen as eh
[16:51] <sebsebseb> need good naive apps
[16:51] <Acou_Bass> FWIW, i run a fair few desktop linx programs on my ubuntu touch phone and they work great
[16:52] <Acou_Bass> as in, 'legacy' ones hehe
[16:52] <sebsebseb> Acou_Bass: yeah the guide way?
[16:52] <Acou_Bass> the what way?
[16:52] <sebsebseb> the purtine hak?
[16:52] <sebsebseb> hack
[16:52] <sebsebseb> oh that's only on tablet
[16:52] <Acou_Bass> puritine isnt a hack, but yes
[16:52] <Acou_Bass> XD
[16:52] <sebsebseb> there's a hack for purtine
[16:52] <sebsebseb> to get other stuff running
[16:52] <sebsebseb> but apparantly in about  a week or two it should be easier to install stuff without that
[16:52] <Acou_Bass> its not really a hack... you just use the puritine app to install more programs..
[16:52] <Acou_Bass> XD
[16:53] <sebsebseb> ok so this debain for android thing
[16:53] <sebsebseb> is uhmm
[16:53] <sebsebseb> not so great?
[16:53] <sebsebseb>  https://wiki.debian.org/HowtoDebianInAndroid
[16:53] <mcphail> Acou_Bass: popey has a build of dosbox. Don't think it is store-ready yet
[16:53] <Acou_Bass> thats awesome
[16:53] <Acou_Bass> i love dosbox
[16:53] <Acou_Bass> scummvm even more :D
[16:53] <sebsebseb> mcphail: dosbox interesting
[16:53] <sebsebseb> mcphail: I was actsaully thining about wine the other day and I guess today a bit to
[16:53] <sebsebseb> if could run Wine on the tablet :D
[16:53] <Acou_Bass> broken sword and monkey island on utouch :D
[16:54] <Acou_Bass> sebsebseb: i dont think wine has an x86 to ARM translator... so probably not
[16:54] <mcphail> scummvm is in progress
[16:54]  * sebsebseb hasn't done the purtine hack thing yet, but soon I guess
[16:54] <sebsebseb> oh actsally
[16:54] <sebsebseb> wait no now I Remember what it was
[16:54] <Acou_Bass> coooooool
[16:54] <sebsebseb> so with the default installed version of Ubuntu touch
[16:54] <Acou_Bass> i love me some scummvm
[16:54] <sebsebseb> that came with the hd tablet
[16:54] <sebsebseb> the terminal app well is just white. that's it
[16:54] <sebsebseb> doesn't work
[16:54] <sebsebseb> I should probably OTA update and yeah yeah and I will sure, but what I just put
[16:55] <sebsebseb> seems they updated it the other day the terminal app and I guess it broke that version of Ubuntu touch maybe?
[16:55] <sebsebseb> mcphail: what's scumvm ?
[16:55] <dobey> what terminal app?
[16:55] <sebsebseb> dobey: Ubuntu core developers?
[16:55] <sebsebseb> I thought I needed to install a terminal to run the guide :d
[16:55] <dobey> afaik, no retail devices include a terminal app by default
[16:56] <mcphail> sebsebseb: open source engine to run old point and click adventures
[16:56] <sebsebseb> dobey: exactly so get one from the app store, then do the guide for purtine I was thinking :d
[16:56] <Acou_Bass> scummvm is a game engine (or collection of) emulator that runs awesome old-timey point 'n click games
[16:56] <Acou_Bass> its epic
[16:56] <sebsebseb> how am I going to be able to run commands without a terminal :d ?
[16:56] <dobey> well, not sure what you are trying to do exactly
[16:56] <sebsebseb> dobey: I wanted to follow the guide for purtine so I could try out other programs
[16:57] <sebsebseb> so I installed the terminal from the app store and my above issue
[16:57] <Acou_Bass> dont you have the libertine scope/app?
[16:57] <dobey> i don't know what guide you're talking about
[16:57] <sebsebseb> Acou_Bass: oh maybe I don't know
[16:58] <sebsebseb> dobey: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1yJepibh68YaQijWO3Z3dWTtTTmzXnMmEE8eswhUXzw4/edit
[16:58] <sebsebseb> https://docs.google.com/document/d/1yJepibh68YaQijWO3Z3dWTtTTmzXnMmEE8eswhUXzw4
[16:58] <dobey> Acou_Bass: you can't create new containers or install apps in the current container, on the shipped image, because stuff is installed in the read-only space, and there are symlinks to it
[16:58] <Acou_Bass> oh, didnt know that
[16:58] <Acou_Bass> im not using the tablet, im using the -pd builds on nexus 4
[16:58] <Acou_Bass> so the container is in /home
[16:58] <sebsebseb> yes with the tablet can use an unoffial guide to hack purtine
[16:58] <dobey> sebsebseb: well, the only reason i'd think you might need a terminal is to delete the symlink and copy the one file over, but i think you can do that with the file manager app too (though also not installed by default) :)
[16:58] <sebsebseb> so it can have other stuff
[16:59] <dobey> Acou_Bass: right, because that doesn't ship with a pre-built container
[16:59] <sebsebseb> dobey: well looks like need to run some commands for the guide
[16:59] <Acou_Bass> dobey: makes sense :D i dont know much about the tablet so forgive my ignorance ;D
[17:00] <Acou_Bass> so on tablet, the puritine container is in /opt or something?
[17:00] <dobey> sebsebseb: well if terminal app is giving you issues at the moment, you could use phablet-shell over usb or ssh in if you've enabled ssh, as a workaround
[17:00] <sebsebseb> dobey: well terminal app could be having problems, since I haven't done a ota update I was thining
[17:00] <dobey> Acou_Bass: the retail image has it in /custom/ i think
[17:00] <sebsebseb> and it seems it's been recently updated as  well teh termianl app
[17:00] <Acou_Bass> ahh
[17:00] <Acou_Bass> fun
[17:00] <Acou_Bass> ;D
[17:01] <dobey> sebsebseb: no idea. i don't have any issues with terminal app on either of my nexus phones
[17:01]  * sebsebseb or I could wait a bit longer and install it in the what's coming way that was being chatted about here the other day, but want to try hack first really :d
[17:01] <sebsebseb> dobey: it coulld break depeding on the version of touch installed?
[17:01] <sebsebseb> it's not the latest version
[17:02] <sebsebseb> when I tried it on bq and meizu phones in the past that worekd but  there have been updates
[17:02] <dobey> sebsebseb: shouldn't. could be some issue with graphics on that device though perhaps
[17:02] <sebsebseb> with graphics how so?
[17:03] <sebsebseb> dobey: it is the tablet of the two with the apparantly not as good resolution or whatever it was tok, but uhmm
[17:03] <sebsebseb> seems to have been ok for everything else I done with it so far
[17:04] <dobey> sebsebseb: i mean terminal app has some funky graphics features for the funky themes. it could be something in terminal app triggering a rendering issue perhaps. but that's just speculation
[17:04] <dobey> sebsebseb: like i said, i have no idea really. i don't have an m10 myself
[17:04] <sebsebseb> oh ok
[17:04] <Acou_Bass> terminal app has themes??
[17:04] <Acou_Bass> been using this thing for like 2 months andnever once noticed :D
[17:04] <sebsebseb> dobey: well I'll do the ota  update later on I guess, and then try the  termianl app again
[17:05] <sebsebseb> dobey: however you made it sound like I may not need the terminal app actsaully to follow the earlier linked to guide anyway?
[17:05] <dobey> Acou_Bass: yes
[17:05] <dobey> sebsebseb: right, if you have developer mode enabled, you can shell in over usb, or if you also enabled ssh, you can ssh to the device over wifi
[17:05] <Acou_Bass> hmm, doesnt seem to change it for me, wanted to try the coolr etro term theme ;( XD
[17:06] <sebsebseb> dobey: nope no developer mode enabled I think at the moment
[17:07] <sebsebseb> dobey: Acou_Bass going back to earlier berifly, what's better then :d or will be and why?  Ubuntu convergence or that Debian for Android thing I linked to?
[17:08] <Acou_Bass> i reckon ubuntu by miles... purely because (unlss you run puritine apps) youre not having to faff around with weird crap like chroots and compatability layers
[17:08] <Acou_Bass> just plug your phone into a TV and boom, desktop
[17:09] <sebsebseb> Acou_Bass: sure, but I meant for running the Desktop Linux programs :D
[17:09] <dobey> a real PC :)
[17:09] <Acou_Bass> but ubuntu touch apps *are* desktop programs :p
[17:09] <sebsebseb> Acou_Bass: you know what I ment old stuff xorg
[17:09] <Acou_Bass> well eh
[17:10] <Acou_Bass> i would still say ubuntu because its still a lot less layering than the android thing
[17:10] <sebsebseb> what you mean layering?
[17:10] <sebsebseb> takes less to do it?
[17:10] <Acou_Bass> android is like... debian chroot -> chrooted xorg -> VNC -> android display server -> TV
[17:10] <Acou_Bass> i dunno
[17:11] <Acou_Bass> maybe for legacy applications, probably not much different
[17:11] <sebsebseb> Acou_Bass: you also put earlier that Ubuntu touch will be Ubuntu eventually what so we should be able to  change to other things  that aren't Unity in the future then other de's etc? :d
[17:11] <Acou_Bass> i didnt quite mean that (though i hvae no idea)
[17:11] <Acou_Bass> i meant that desktop ubuntu will eventually be running exactly the same stuff as ubuntu phone
[17:11] <Acou_Bass> so unity 8 mir 'core apps' etc
[17:11] <sebsebseb> yeah :)
[17:12] <Acou_Bass> the only difference will be arm vs. x86 and possibly whether its rootable easily? (and obviously physical size) :D
[17:12] <sebsebseb> Acou_Bass: and yeah chroot's uhmm no thanks,  just want the stuff to work, teriminal stuff editing files etc, no thanks, just want the stuff to work,  like is the aim for convergence
[17:13] <Acou_Bass> well presumably once unity 8 hits desktop, youll still need the libertine chroot to run legacy apps? unless they give us a way to do it by just apt-getting on the rootfs
[17:13] <sebsebseb> Acou_Bass: I think there's going to be a graphcal way even
[17:13] <sebsebseb> a package manager
[17:13] <sebsebseb> etc
[17:13] <sebsebseb> I had a chat here the other day
[17:13] <Acou_Bass> (or, even better, if they convert all the .debs into .clicks with automagic xmir compatability in the click)
[17:13] <Acou_Bass> XD
[17:14] <Acou_Bass> there already is a GUI for libertine containers ;D thats how i do it on my nexus 4 hehe
[17:14] <sebsebseb> Acou_Bass: that will be default in the next ota update I think or the one after
[17:14] <Acou_Bass> i just dont know if libertine will be a thing on desktop, or whether itll just all be doable with clicks
[17:15] <sebsebseb> I think the next two ota updates should provide inteesrng things going by my chat here the other day
[17:15] <Acou_Bass> i think the most interesting developments will be coming in the next few ubuntu desktop releases
[17:15] <Acou_Bass> now the LTS is out the way, they can start experimenting
[17:15] <sebsebseb> yeah
[17:16] <Acou_Bass> we already have clicks on desktop should you wish to try them... would like to see all the things converted to click packages and unity 8 become default (or at least a usable option without having to jump through PPA's)
[17:16] <dobey> there is no ubuntu touch. there is only ubuntu
[17:16] <sebsebseb> Acou_Bass: dobey why t he interest in Ubuntu touch persoanlly for you I wonder :) ?
[17:16] <sebsebseb> dobey: well Ubuntu Touch is currently based on standard Ubuntu or something like that
[17:17] <Acou_Bass> mostly because i was a hardcore nokia n900 user which was basically debian linux in a phone, and could run xorg apps with zero effort - and since losing that phone ive been pining for a real linux phone again
[17:17] <sebsebseb> Acou_Bass: uhmm right but there's the Jolla phone
[17:17] <dobey> sebsebseb: i mean, it is jsut ubuntu. it's just device-specific image builds of ubuntu, with a few things that aren't in the archive, and a tiny container to run some android bits on top of the android kernel. it is however for all intents and purposes, just "Ubuntu"
[17:17] <Acou_Bass> which cant run xorg apps at all hehe
[17:17] <sebsebseb> Acou_Bass: former Nokia people with yeah SalifshO
[17:17] <dobey> they aren't "Ubuntu Touch Phones"; they are just "Ubuntu Phones"
[17:18] <Acou_Bass> sailfishOS is even more proprietary than android is
[17:18] <Acou_Bass> and, while it is a SERIOUSLY nice phone OS, i cant in good conscience use it for that reason (not to mention that while it is linux underneath, i cant do anything linuxey on it)
[17:18] <Acou_Bass> whereas on ubuntut ouch i can use emacs, and libreoffice, and all those goodies
[17:19] <sebsebseb> Acou_Bass: right, but can't you also use emacs etc,  on that Debian for Androdi thing  like that guy was basically trying to tell me earlier in another channel hmmn ?
[17:19] <Acou_Bass> probably
[17:19] <Acou_Bass> but then id have to use android
[17:19] <Acou_Bass> which i, excuse my french, F'ing hate
[17:20] <sebsebseb> yes the Ubuntu kernel in Ubuntu touch has soe Android stuff or that stuff right
[17:20] <dobey> it's ok, android hates you too
[17:20] <sebsebseb> plus there's someting propritary I belive to even get on moible networks
[17:20] <Acou_Bass> good, i hope it does
[17:20] <Acou_Bass> well yeah
[17:20] <sebsebseb> the propritary thing may have come from Android to I don't know for networks
[17:20] <dobey> android hates everyone
[17:20] <sebsebseb> but that's side stuff
[17:20] <sebsebseb> to what I am about to ask :)
[17:20] <Acou_Bass> theres the android drivers/libhybris, and then the proprietary phone baseband blob that all phones have
[17:20] <sebsebseb> other topics even not relivent for what I am about to ask Acou_Bass
[17:20] <Acou_Bass> go on? :P
[17:21] <sebsebseb> Acou_Bass: Why don't you like Android?
[17:21] <dobey> what is the air speed velocity of an unladen swallow?
[17:21] <Acou_Bass> urgh where to start
[17:21] <Acou_Bass> its bloated as hell, the apps are like 50mb apiece just for some basic crap, its a security hole waiting to happen, its rammed full of spyware
[17:21] <dobey> android covertly ignored my privacy for one
[17:21] <sebsebseb> oh, but loads of people love Android! I mean it's apparently so amazing!
[17:22] <Acou_Bass> you need a £500 phone just to run android without lag, and even then it lags like hell after a few months of use
[17:22] <dobey> sebsebseb: i guess you should use windows and android then, since they're so amazing
[17:22] <sebsebseb> dobey: he h I being not serious don't you see :D
[17:22] <dobey> and they both have like 85-90% market share
[17:22] <sebsebseb> or just saying lilk the main stemae
[17:22] <sebsebseb> etc
[17:22] <Acou_Bass> not to mention even if you buy a £500 android phone, itll be dead after 6 months because the manufacturer is too lazy to push updates to it
[17:22] <sebsebseb> I have never been keen on Android
[17:22] <Acou_Bass> so you either have to manually flash cyannogenmod on it or stick with insecure rubbish
[17:23] <sebsebseb> something I notced very soon when installin an app or two
[17:23] <sebsebseb> was guess what?
[17:23] <dobey> Acou_Bass: eh? my nexus 5 wasn't that expensive, and it ran android fine, and still works :)
[17:23] <sebsebseb> may not be Android's fault as an OS, but since it's popularity sure
[17:23] <sebsebseb> adverts uh!
[17:23] <Acou_Bass> nexus's are a really great exception to a lot of my problems with android
[17:23] <sebsebseb> yes Nexus is meant to be stock Android
[17:23] <Acou_Bass> nexus 4's when they came out were absolute show-stoppers
[17:23] <Acou_Bass> but still
[17:23] <Acou_Bass> spyware-laden
[17:24] <sebsebseb> Acou_Bass: spyware laden how?
[17:24] <dobey> well, at least with lollipop i could make the phone respect my privacy
[17:24] <Acou_Bass> because google basically have a direct line rammed into the back
[17:24] <Acou_Bass> XD
[17:24] <dobey> but with marshmallow it's impossible
[17:24] <dasjoe> Spyware? You mean like Ubuntu's Amazon search? Here, take this: <°(((><
[17:24] <dasjoe> :)
[17:24] <Acou_Bass> not to mention all the apps dont work if you dont enable their horrendously invasive permissions
[17:24] <sebsebseb> uh 6.0 I thought apaprnatly had better privacy settings or something?
[17:25] <sebsebseb> Acou_Bass: yes I didn't like that, apps wanted access to like nearly everything, most of htem
[17:25] <sebsebseb> them
[17:25] <dobey> lol no
[17:25] <Acou_Bass> dasjoe: sure, that thing was just as bad spyware, but that was a single click to disable :P
[17:25] <dobey> 6.0 automatically uploaded all my contacts to google without my consent, as soon as i upgraded, and had no way to disable storing contacts on google
[17:25] <sebsebseb> ok so we are using UBuntu touch, since for our own personal reasons we don't like Android?
[17:25] <dobey> in 5, i could at least disable the contacts sync and store contacts locally
[17:25] <Acou_Bass> no im using ubuntu touch because its awesome :P
[17:26] <Acou_Bass> and, right now, is the best phone OS for my needs
[17:26] <sebsebseb> Acou_Bass: and you hate Android or strongly dislike
[17:26] <Acou_Bass> before ubuntu touch i ran firefoxOS
[17:26] <sebsebseb> yeah I got a Firefox phone to
[17:26] <sebsebseb> never did calls from it though or texts,
[17:26] <dobey> i'm using ubuntu because it's ubuntu and not android or ios, and hp killed webos, and well, developing it is also my job
[17:26] <sebsebseb> dobey: oh you help develop Ubuntu touch?
[17:26] <Acou_Bass> sebsebseb: difficult to say... android in its consumer-buyable form, i HATE, but the more open forms like CM, i just merely dislike
[17:27] <dobey> there is no ubuntu touch. there is sonly ubuntu. :)
[17:27] <sebsebseb> Acou_Bass: the consumer versions tend to come with some junkware sure, and why do you dislike CM?
[17:27] <sebsebseb> dobey: that's not qujite true yet  but I do see that in the future #ubuntu will be the like go to place for support with the phone and tablet to
[17:27] <Acou_Bass> mostly because its still just the same bloated mess and, a lot of the time needs the same spyware to go with it to install apps on (eg. googz play)
[17:27] <kurros> awesome https://code.launchpad.net/~andreas-pokorny/mir/fix-1580774
[17:28] <dobey> it is true. this is mostly a development channel, not a support channel
[17:28] <sebsebseb> dobey: for now yes
[17:28] <Acou_Bass> is there a seperate support channel?
[17:28] <sebsebseb> dobey: and #ubuntu is for the desktop versions that are still in support for now
[17:28] <Acou_Bass> ive beenasking in here when i need hlep... XD
[17:29] <sebsebseb> dobey: but start going on about touch lots there, and they will probably be liek go to #ubuntu-touch at the moment
[17:30] <sebsebseb> Acou_Bass: bloaed as in what, spyware? bloated can mean diffenret htings
[17:30] <Acou_Bass> as in
[17:30] <Acou_Bass> not spyware... just heavy
[17:30] <Acou_Bass> far too big in size
[17:30] <Acou_Bass> apps are gigantic for what they do
[17:30] <sebsebseb> Acou_Bass: apps come with adverstg and bad persmisoins to yeah
[17:30] <sebsebseb> and it's hard to find th decent apps
[17:30] <sebsebseb> since way too many in play really
[17:31] <Acou_Bass> even the ones that dont
[17:31] <Acou_Bass> theyre still massive
[17:31] <dobey> sebsebseb: #ubuntu is for all ubuntu
[17:31] <sebsebseb> in a way that's a sort of advantage for Ubuntu touch to some extent
[17:31] <sebsebseb> dobey: the topic doens't say touch :d
[17:31] <sebsebseb> there
[17:31] <sebsebseb> can go through the app store in not much for touch and get what is wanted
[17:31] <dobey> sebsebseb: like i said. there is no ubuntu touch. only ubuntu :)
[17:31] <sebsebseb> but most of the native apps  stuck for now
[17:31] <Acou_Bass> lets compare this
[17:31] <Acou_Bass> https://openrepos.net/content/accumulator/quickddit-0
[17:31] <Acou_Bass> reddit app for sailfishOS
[17:31] <Acou_Bass> 240kb
[17:32] <Acou_Bass> https://uappexplorer.com/app/com.ubuntu.developer.mhall119.ureadit
[17:32] <Acou_Bass> reddit app for ubuntu... 142kb
[17:32] <sebsebseb> and the andoid one massive :D ?
[17:32] <dobey> well 100kb is not a particularly comparible difference
[17:32] <Acou_Bass> https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.reddit.frontpage
[17:32] <Acou_Bass> reddit appp for android
[17:32] <sebsebseb> also uappexpolorer is the unoffial thing
[17:32] <Acou_Bass> 6.6mb?
[17:32] <Acou_Bass> XD
[17:33] <sebsebseb> Acou_Bass: yeah which isn't that much, but if you put on a lot of apps that are big
[17:33] <sebsebseb> that 16gb or so space
[17:33] <sebsebseb> can go hyeah
[17:33] <dobey> well, ureadit is a qml/js app. not a binary app
[17:33] <sebsebseb> yeah
[17:33] <Acou_Bass> thats just a small example
[17:33] <sebsebseb> and you are more likely to install lots of android apsp on android since you got play
[17:33] <dobey> reddit app on android is a compiled java app
[17:33] <Acou_Bass> ive had numerous android apps that are 50-100mb
[17:33] <dobey> text compresses much better than compiled binaries do
[17:33] <sebsebseb> Acou_Bass: have you treid Remix OS that's nice :)
[17:33] <dobey> sure
[17:34] <sebsebseb> Acou_Bass: Remix OS is a edited Android for x86
[17:34] <dobey> and there will be plenty of such apps on ubuntu too
[17:34] <Acou_Bass> dobey: the technical reasons dont matter, fact is the android app is gigantic compared to utouch app hehe
[17:34] <Acou_Bass> presumably far less though? XD because most of them will be the same QML stuff
[17:34] <dobey> Acou_Bass: https://uappexplorer.com/app/com.ubuntu.docviewer -- 65 MB
[17:34] <Acou_Bass> hehe
[17:34] <Acou_Bass> point takne
[17:34] <Acou_Bass> :P
[17:35] <dobey> i expect anyone who wants to ship proprietary apps aren't going to ship them as qml
[17:35]  * Acou_Bass looks at how big the android equivelent is
[17:35] <sebsebseb> Acou_Bass: Ubuntu touch has taken some stuff fomr Android, what you think of that?
[17:35] <Acou_Bass> stuff like what, the drivers/kernel?
[17:35] <sebsebseb> yeah
[17:35] <dobey> necessary evil
[17:35] <Acou_Bass> im indifferent... XD doesnt really bother me either way
[17:35] <Acou_Bass> drivers are drivers
[17:36] <Acou_Bass> if they werent android, theyd stil be proprietary blobs
[17:36] <sebsebseb> could have made own drivers :D ? he h
[17:36] <sebsebseb> and own kernel  that's android enoguh like h eh h
[17:36] <sebsebseb> ?
[17:36] <Acou_Bass> obviously itd be better if they werent there... bt if they werent, we probably wouldnt have any ubuntu phones
[17:36] <sebsebseb> instad of knicking things from android? h eh
[17:36] <dobey> Acou_Bass: telegramapp is 4.7MB on ubuntu
[17:36] <sebsebseb> I mean it's meant to be it's own seperate OS right :) h eh
[17:36] <dobey> where does play store show app size?
[17:37] <Acou_Bass> on that app i linked it was in the 'read more' but
[17:37] <Acou_Bass> but weirdly a lot of apps dont show it
[17:37] <dobey> sebsebseb: 'nicking things from android' is inaccurate
[17:37] <sebsebseb> dobey: I am saying a bit jokingly, but yes knicking/borrowing
[17:38] <dobey> sebsebseb: an extremely minor amount of binary bits which are required to make the hardware work
[17:38] <sebsebseb> but yes it's mostly it's own OS completly, except for those few things I guess :D
[17:38] <Acou_Bass> sailfishOS uses the same bits too
[17:38] <Acou_Bass> but also has its own proprietary layer on top too (the GUI layer if i remember correctly)
[17:38] <sebsebseb> actaully I don't know that much about that stuff,  the kernel is open source I guess sure :d
[17:39] <sebsebseb> but the drivers are not?
[17:39] <Acou_Bass> i guess depends on the drivers being used... i daresay some phones have some free drivers, but id imagine most have proprietary blobs
[17:39] <sebsebseb> propribably blobs from the manufacture to work with Android?
[17:39] <Acou_Bass> there is a version of android that is 100% free/open source (analogous to the fully-free distros) but it runs on VERY select hardware
[17:40] <sebsebseb> yeah there's a FSF one
[17:40] <Acou_Bass> yeah, the drivers and stuff
[17:40] <sebsebseb> the hardware is only really
[17:40] <sebsebseb> Apple or Android
[17:40] <dobey> fairphone i guess
[17:41] <sebsebseb> hardware that's made for Apple or Android I mean
[17:41] <dobey> or maybe some intel devices
[17:41] <dobey> or windows
[17:41] <Acou_Bass> http://www.replicant.us/supported-devices.php
[17:41] <sebsebseb> or Windows just about yeah
[17:41] <sebsebseb> hardware made for WIndows just about
[17:41] <sebsebseb> yep replicant that's the one
[17:41] <sebsebseb> a bit like how the PC is made for Windows?  or is it really, that's it's own debate
[17:42] <sebsebseb> but yes Linux and WIndows iwll run on same hardwRE
[17:42] <Acou_Bass> its not really like that... phone hardware is far more locked-down generally
[17:42] <Acou_Bass> for the most part, you can expect linux to run on any x86 PC
[17:42] <dobey> linux runs on pretty much everything
[17:42] <Acou_Bass> but you cant just plug a thumb drive into a galaxy S3 and expect ubuntu to boot
[17:42] <dobey> but higher level than the kernel stuff starts to get picky :)
[17:43] <sebsebseb> higher level
[17:43] <sebsebseb> you mean more background?
[17:43] <sebsebseb> more working with the hardwARE?
[17:43] <dobey> i mean andorid is still linux, even if you don't get a bash shell or xorg
[17:43] <sebsebseb> yep
[17:43] <dobey> your refrigerator and stereo and all kinds of devices run linux
[17:43] <dobey> even if you can't do anything with that linux
[17:44] <sebsebseb> yes Linux is eveyrwhere
[17:44] <sebsebseb> I know
[17:44] <sebsebseb> even in someones toilet maybe
[17:44] <dobey> certainly
[17:45] <dobey> especially in san francisco or japan
[17:45] <Acou_Bass> i definitely dont want Tux staring up at me when im on the john
[17:45] <Acou_Bass> suppose if anything gonna, might as well be something FOSS
[17:47] <dobey> would be nice to get rid of the android container/kernel if possible on some devices, and use the archive kernel. but freedreno doesn't support enough hardware i guess, and i doubt much of the other bits will work without the proprietary bits
[17:48] <sebsebseb> dobey: what's freedreno ?
[17:48] <dobey> an open source driver for adreno, the gpu in the snapdragon chips
[17:49] <sebsebseb> ok
[17:49] <Acou_Bass> i daresay therell one say be a fully-free build of ubuntu touch (trisquel touch) :D
[17:49] <sebsebseb> dobey: Acou_Bass and why does Android have the kernel and drivers, since the manufactures released for it years ago ?
[17:49] <Acou_Bass> no idea
[17:50] <dobey> Acou_Bass: you can make one today if you want. it just won't run on much hardware :)
[17:50] <Acou_Bass> hehe
[17:50] <Acou_Bass> maybe theyll port it to the same phoned as replicant ;D
[17:50] <dobey> sebsebseb: not sure what you mean. "android" doesn't "have" the kernel and drivers
[17:50] <sebsebseb> dobey: the thng that is taken from Android to work with Ubuntu touch
[17:50] <dobey> sebsebseb: android _is_ the kernel and drivers, as released by the manufacturer
[17:50] <sebsebseb> dobey: why was that made for Android?
[17:51] <sebsebseb> yeah drivers being for kernel
[17:51] <sebsebseb> I know that :d
[17:51] <sebsebseb> Google have a bit of an edited Linux to aparantl
[17:51] <sebsebseb> y
[17:51] <dobey> the drivers only work with the version of the kernel they were built to work with
[17:52] <sebsebseb> yep that makes sense
[17:52] <sebsebseb> so touch just uses the Androdi kernel, since  the drivers are made to work with that?
[17:52] <dobey> the device tree which contains the kernel source, the binary drivers, etc… necessary to boot a device and run the hardware is "android"
[17:53] <dobey> and each device has its own separate tree, and kernel config, etc…
[17:54] <sebsebseb> yeah still a bit of Android in there to get hardware working, but otherwise a completly seperaet OS Ubuntu touch :)
[17:54] <sebsebseb> Acou_Bass: and yes I think SalifishOS again has some of the Anroid
[17:54] <sebsebseb> as you put aerleir
[17:54] <Acou_Bass> sailfish uses libhybris
[17:54] <sebsebseb> oh?
[17:55] <dobey> s/touch//g
[17:55] <sebsebseb> dobey: what does that mean :D ?
[17:55] <dobey> it means ubuntu is just ubuntu
[17:56] <sebsebseb> thought you meant something lilke that, but I am not just saying Ubuntu
[17:56] <sebsebseb> so currently anyway
[17:56] <sebsebseb> there are enough differences between the desktop version and the phone tablet version
[17:56] <sebsebseb> plus it's called otuch the channel :d
[17:56] <sebsebseb> since currently above
[17:57] <sebsebseb> dobey: Ubuntu Touch is a bit like the old Netbook Remix in that sense I guess but even more so as bieng differnet
[17:57] <dobey> and there are differences between the cloud images, the server ISO, the snappy things, but they are all still just Ubuntu
[17:57] <dobey> there are also differences between builds of ubuntu for different phone/tablet devices
[17:58] <sebsebseb> yep
[17:58] <sebsebseb> yep purtine :D
[17:58] <Acou_Bass> dobey: can i ask a dumb question? what is the difference between 'snappy' and 'click'? is it purely a 'click' is the package, and 'snappy' is the OS it runs on top of?
[17:58] <sebsebseb> I think click is the old thing
[17:58] <sebsebseb> snappy is the new
[17:58] <dobey> Acou_Bass: no. snap packages will replace click packages on phone too at some point
[17:58] <sebsebseb> snappy to replace click
[17:59] <Acou_Bass> so clicks came along, and then snappy came along to replace them?
[17:59] <Acou_Bass> weird
[17:59] <dobey> Acou_Bass: by snappy things i meant things running snap-based images from Ubuntu Core
[17:59] <Acou_Bass> yeah
[18:00] <sebsebseb> dobey: why was Ubuntu for phones and tablets based on 15.04 and not 15.10?
[18:00] <sebsebseb> got a reason the other day
[18:00] <sebsebseb> but didn't really understand
[18:01] <sebsebseb> also really a otherwise end of life versoin of Ubuntu still runs on phones and tabelts basically h  eh
[18:01] <dobey> because we switched from 14.10 to 15.04, and then didn't switch to 15.10, because there are a lot of hard problems to solve there, and we didn't want to compound them by switching to another interim release of ubuntu as the base
[18:02] <dobey> phones/tablets are special, releases are not on the same schedule as the ISO image releases
[18:02] <sebsebseb> dobey: yes I gathered that quite a long time ago that it doens't follow the ISO scheduled
[18:02] <Stskeeps>  /g lbt
[18:03] <sebsebseb> dobey: apparnatly somethin in 15.10  wouold have broken apps, made people have to re do them?
[18:03] <dobey> sebsebseb: gcc5 broke binary compatibility in the STL, yes
[18:04] <sebsebseb> dobey: what's the STL? what do you mean STL?
[18:04] <dobey> c++ standard template library
[18:04] <sebsebseb> dobey: ok I am not a progarmmer, what's that used for really?
[18:06] <dobey> on ubuntu phone images? basically everything
[18:06] <sebsebseb> tempaltes for what?
[18:06] <sebsebseb> template usually means something that's already made as well
[18:06] <sebsebseb> for use for chaning even a bit
[18:07] <dobey> i'm not going to teach you c++ in here :)
[18:07] <sebsebseb> dobey: h a ha I didn't mean like that
[18:08] <sebsebseb> dobey: anyway yes  15.10  app breakage, and what other issues?  and since  only normally a shortly supported release,  it got skipped for the Ubuntu for phones and tablets updates?  yeah.
[18:11] <sebsebseb> dobey: I guess the next big soonish update will be based on 16.04, and then might base one on 16.10 as well with good enough reason
[18:11] <dobey> switching to 15.10 would have been a waste of time. images will be switched to 16.04 at some point
[18:12] <dobey> no, there won't be any reason to base images on 16.10
[18:12] <dobey> hopefully after the switch to 16.04 we'll stay on LTS releases only as basis for phone images
[18:12] <sebsebseb> dobey: well that's what I put might, it's to 16.04 like for the rest of the stuff I guess yeah,  well for ubuntu for phones and tablets
[18:12] <Acou_Bass> is there any reason they went to 15.04 at all, instead of just being LTS-based?
[18:12] <sebsebseb> dobey: I was thinking that to, that may only stay on  LTS releses
[18:13] <dobey> Acou_Bass: was already on 14.10
[18:13] <Acou_Bass> ahh
[18:13] <sebsebseb> dobey: Ubuntu for phones and tablets ( not calling it touch now h eh h ),  goes back even futher thought to 2013 or so doesn't it? what were those versions based on?
[18:13] <dobey> would have been nice if we'd stayed on 14.04 though
[18:13] <dobey> don't recall why exactly we did 14.10
[18:14] <sebsebseb> Acou_Bass: dobey it's interesting stuff though :d
[18:15] <dobey> 13.04, 13.10, 14.04, 14.10, and then 15.04, iirc
[18:15] <sebsebseb> yeah sounds about right
[18:15] <dobey> or maybe not 13.04; so long ago i don't recall
[18:15] <sebsebseb> there wasn't  really a ubuntu for phones and tablets in 2012
[18:15] <sebsebseb> I think
[18:15] <Acou_Bass> i think it was around then that they did that nexus 7 port using the normal unity 7
[18:16] <sebsebseb> can update LTS with ppa's or snaps or wahtever yeah
[18:16] <dobey> no, wasn't unity7 i don't think
[18:16] <Acou_Bass> there was an initial nexus 7 port that used unity 7... it wasnt very good and was more of a test i think :P
[18:16] <dobey> so yeah, 13.04 was one, because late 2012
[18:16] <sebsebseb> Acou_Bass: dobey  I wanted to play with Ubuntu touch before ever since seeing Jono's nexus on  his video stuff :d.  I didn't get a Nexus 4 my self sold out in 2012 hmm or whatever
[18:17] <sebsebseb> Acou_Bass: dobey then I bought htat bq :) 4.5
[18:17] <sebsebseb> and Meizu Pro 4 :d
[18:17] <sebsebseb> and M10 HD
[18:17] <Acou_Bass> xd
[18:17] <Acou_Bass> im just using a nexus 4
[18:17] <dobey> Acou_Bass: there were some nexus images of standard ubuntu ISO that could be installed iirc, but that was mostly separate and a test of "how do we boot ubuntu on these things?"
[18:17] <sebsebseb> I'll get a FHD at some stage I think as well a Ubuntu
[18:17] <Acou_Bass> but is my primary device aside from my desktop PC
[18:17] <sebsebseb> I know will end up with mostly the same thing
[18:17] <sebsebseb> on all those devices if keeping them up to to date
[18:17] <Acou_Bass> dobey: yeah thats what im thinking of
[18:18] <sebsebseb> 4.5 I thought I had lost found it early this year, so it's still on the old thing from over a year ago a 14.10 :d
[18:18] <Acou_Bass> i run rc -pd builds on my nexus 4
[18:18] <dobey> my laptop, workstation, server, and phone all run ubuntu
[18:18] <Acou_Bass> is pretty great
[18:18] <Acou_Bass> XD
[18:18] <sebsebseb> may keep that one on that or for now,  can look back at a old version in the future then h eh
[18:18] <sebsebseb> dobey: I moved away from DEsktop Ubuntu in 2009
[18:18] <sebsebseb> other distros etc
[18:18] <sebsebseb> wasn't happy with cerain things
[18:18] <sebsebseb> ,but
[18:18] <Acou_Bass> heh my nexus is my only ubuntu machine... arch on desktop, raspbian on the Pi (ive been meaning to try snappy on that, too lazy to migrate though) and guixSD on the laptop
[18:19] <dobey> your loss :)
[18:19] <sebsebseb> but I think this Ubuntu for phone and tablet stuff is quite interesting
[18:19] <sebsebseb> dobey: Acou_Bass  I been runing on the desttop on this lap top for a bit longer tahn I had intended 15.04 then 15.10 but this one sint' quite set up how I wanted yet
[18:19] <sebsebseb> need to re set up really
[18:19] <Acou_Bass> im really looking forward to going back to ubuntu on the desktop when all these goodies come over to the desktop
[18:19] <sebsebseb> I'll upgrade that install to 16.04 soon from 15.10
[18:19] <Acou_Bass> but im really not a fan of .debs
[18:19] <sebsebseb> got Windwos to re install on here and such really, but that's tedious
[18:19] <Acou_Bass> they bork too much
[18:19] <sebsebseb> going to re install all OS's on here, I just haven't yet
[18:19] <sebsebseb> on this lap top
[18:20] <dobey> stop installing broken debs :)
[18:20] <Acou_Bass> but but
[18:20] <sebsebseb> and  my net book works or ish still as well sort of
[18:20] <Acou_Bass> i want my new softwarez ;(
[18:20] <sebsebseb> dobey: I remember GNOME 2 getting messed up
[18:20] <sebsebseb> in 2009 and such
[18:20] <sebsebseb> then Unity came later
[18:20] <sebsebseb> Unity got a lot of flak from the Linux community
[18:20] <Acou_Bass> the whole reason i jumped ship from ubuntu on desktop was because i wanted up-to-date versions of music production stuff and PPA's were not working out well for me
[18:21] <Acou_Bass> hopefully snaps will fix that :D
[18:21] <dobey> Acou_Bass: ardour and such?
[18:21] <Acou_Bass> yeah
[18:21] <dobey> Acou_Bass: ppa:dobey/audiotools :)
[18:21] <Acou_Bass> ardour, hydrogen, lilypond
[18:21] <sebsebseb> Unity 7 also got old and boring in the destkop really for many of us :d  on the nromal cmoputer, but Unity 8 on the phone and tablet is interesting :).  when I upgrade to 16.04 this lap top of course I'll try Unity 8 like that to
[18:21] <dobey> hmm, i need to get hydrogen and i guess lilypond in there though
[18:21] <Acou_Bass> im fairly sure i tried that and it didnt work very well... or maybe it was the ubuntu studio PPA back when that was a thing
[18:21] <sebsebseb> Acou_Bass: you jumped ship to what?
[18:21] <Acou_Bass> arch
[18:21] <sebsebseb> people can say what they want, but actsaully
[18:21] <dobey> works well here ;)
[18:22] <sebsebseb> Ubuntu is the only one that properly invoates now unless we include SalifishOS or something like that to :d
[18:22] <sebsebseb> I mean Ubuntu Touch is an example of inovation
[18:22] <dobey> but there isn't a terribly large amount of stuff in it yet
[18:22] <Acou_Bass> yeah
[18:22] <sebsebseb> targetting phones nad tablets, but that was also so Canonical couold make some money maybe
[18:22] <Acou_Bass> i dont use THAT many things - mainly lilypond hehe
[18:22] <sebsebseb> also I think to target the phone and tablet, need to be big enough moneywise
[18:22] <sebsebseb> most distros simpally can't do it, to small
[18:23] <dobey> problem is finding good open source plug-ins; so many are just abandoned and unmaintained, or just not good
[18:23] <Acou_Bass> yeah this is true
[18:23] <sebsebseb> Acou_Bass: wh8ich is true?
[18:23] <Acou_Bass> i have a huge stack of .sf2's all over the place
[18:23] <Acou_Bass> some of them are ancient, some of them are godawful
[18:23] <sebsebseb> I have three of the six Ubuntu devices :d
[18:24] <sebsebseb> missing a BQ HD and  Meizu Pro  5 he h
[18:24] <dobey> yeah, and so many soundfonts just aren't redistributable
[18:24] <sebsebseb> and a Nexus 4 maybe he h
[18:24] <Acou_Bass> but my main thing is printing the sheet music, so soundfonts arent THAT important, because y'know paper doesnt have a built-in MIDI player :P
[18:25] <sebsebseb> dobey: why do you not have a commerical Ubuntu device?
[18:25] <Acou_Bass> most of my other stuff is live recorded or just done with basic FS midi stuff
[18:25] <dobey> Acou_Bass: you could hook up a dot-matrix printer to print punch-card style, and route the paper through a player piano :P
[18:25] <Acou_Bass> i say this like i even still do music stuff anymore, havent been a pro musician for nearly 10 years now
[18:25] <sebsebseb> dobey: and your name reminds me of Harry Potter by the way :d
[18:25] <Acou_Bass> XD
[18:26] <Acou_Bass> dobby
[18:26] <dobey> sebsebseb: because they're too big, too underpowered, and i'm in the US
[18:26] <dobey> no.
[18:26] <sebsebseb> there to big?
[18:26] <sebsebseb> how so?
[18:26] <Acou_Bass> :P
[18:26] <dobey> yes
[18:26] <dobey> my nexus 5 is too big even
[18:26] <sebsebseb> Acou_Bass: well similar :d
[18:26] <Acou_Bass> OH this reminds me
[18:26] <sebsebseb> apparnatly the MX 4 was quite big and yeah yeah
[18:26] <sebsebseb> ,but I bought one
[18:26] <sebsebseb> and it's a good size
[18:26] <Acou_Bass> i wanted to see if i could use my raspberry pi as a guitar amp... wonder if its powerful enough
[18:26] <dobey> iphone 4s or 5s is perfect size
[18:26] <sebsebseb> been using that as my phone for months now :)
[18:27] <Acou_Bass> im gonna go out on a limb and say probably not, but ima test it anyway
[18:27] <sebsebseb> apaprnatly the Pro 5 is a lot bigger though
[18:27] <sebsebseb> the BQ 4.5 was a good size
[18:27] <dobey> yeah pro 5 is like 5.7 or 6 inches or something ridiculous
[18:27] <sebsebseb> dobey: yes you got differnet networks,  so can have issues
[18:27] <dobey> 4.5 is too big, and underpowered, and low resolution
[18:27] <sebsebseb> 4.5 fit in my pocket fine
[18:28] <sebsebseb> I intend to buy a pro 5 eventually but there's no rush :d  may not use it as my actsual phone though much or at all really, depending on the actsual size yep :d
[18:28] <dobey> i don't like having to take my phone out of my pocket to sit down
[18:28] <Acou_Bass> nexus 4's are what... 4.7" screen? plus i have a big keyboard case stuck to the back of it
[18:29] <sebsebseb> pro 5 is kind of expensive or over kill for Ubuntu really
[18:29] <dobey> yeah, 4.7
[18:30] <sebsebseb> Acou_Bass: where are you from?
[18:31] <Acou_Bass> UK
[18:31] <sebsebseb> Acou_Bass: ok same :) where abouts?
[18:31] <Acou_Bass> the northwest hehe
[18:31] <sebsebseb> ok south west
[18:31] <sebsebseb> Acou_Bass: have you got an Ubuntu device?
[18:31] <Acou_Bass> yepp my nexus 4
[18:32] <sebsebseb> Acou_Bass: I meant a commerical one
[18:32] <sebsebseb> I guess not then
[18:32] <Acou_Bass> ahh no then
[18:34] <sebsebseb> dobey: #ubuntu doesnt' mention 15.04 in it's topic as one of the supported ones, for the phone and tablet by the way :d
[18:35] <sebsebseb> Acou_Bass: which Firefox phone did you have or got?
[18:35] <sebsebseb> and I guess you have no Jolla
[18:35] <dobey> sebsebseb: stop trying to think of the phone releases as being the same as the ISO release versions
[18:35] <Acou_Bass> my fxos phone is a ZTE open C
[18:35] <sebsebseb> dobey: I am not, but you did say earlier that #ubuntu is for all Ubuntu's :d
[18:35] <Acou_Bass> and nope no jolla, i ran sailfish on both the ZTE and the nexus
[18:35] <dobey> sebsebseb: it is for all Ubuntu
[18:36] <sebsebseb> dobey: not according to the topic :d
[18:36] <sebsebseb> of the channel
[18:36] <sebsebseb> Acou_Bass: oh right nice you have ran Salifsh as well
[18:36] <Acou_Bass> yeah
[18:36] <Acou_Bass> its a REALLY nice OS
[18:36] <dobey> sebsebseb: then the topic is wrong. #ubuntu is the general ubuntu support channel. any supported version of ubuntu is on topic. the phone builds are suported versions of ubuntu.
[18:37] <dobey> sebsebseb: just ask the phone builds are supported versions of ubuntu as per the ask ubuntu topic rules.
[18:37] <sebsebseb> Acou_Bass: yeah I haevn't upgraded to 2.0 yet not used my Jolla phone much actsually
[18:37] <sebsebseb> dobey: well only really early adopters and devs use Ubuntu for phones and tablets now anyway,  so I guess it doens't matter to much the topic :d
[18:42] <dobey> anyway, i should not be sitting here at my computer on such a nice day
[18:44] <Acou_Bass> me neither, unfortunately my wheel is out of action so cant go out for a nice summer ride
[21:52] <Guest73530> hi
[22:58] <nhaines> I am annoyed that I can't build a libertine container.
[22:58] <bregma> nhaines, on a device or on a desktop?
[23:01] <nhaines> bregma: on a device.  Nexus 7 running rc-proposed/ubuntu-pd.
[23:01] <nhaines> Failure installing matchbox during container creation http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/16449457/
[23:01] <bregma> nhaines, do you get an error?
[23:01] <nhaines> It worked on Monday, but it stopped working by Friday.
[23:03] <bregma> mmm, x11-common is having trouble in its postinst script
[23:06] <nhaines> So it seems.  :)
[23:06] <nhaines> I was digging around trying to see if I could extract the Puritine demo container from a system image for frieza, but the answer is "no".
[23:09] <embrik> Is it possible to ssh into ubuntu phone fro a windows laptop?
[23:10] <bregma> embrik, yes, you have to enable developer mode and then configure the ssh server to run on the phone, after that it's just standard ssh
[23:12] <embrik> bregma: OK - thanks - I've tried to enable developer mode on my laptop earlier but it didn't work - will try it once more
[23:12] <nhaines> embrik: you need developer mode on the phone and an SSH client on the laptop.
[23:13] <embrik> nhaines: OK - on the phone :-) I see
[23:13] <bregma> embrik, you enable developer mode on your phone through System Settings > About > Developer Mode
[23:14] <bregma> the you have to have your phone unlocked (using the passcode) to connect
[23:14] <embrik> Not able to upgrade or install in command line - var/cache/apt - locked
[23:15] <nhaines> The phone's system image is read-only.  You can never add software using apt.
[23:16] <embrik> nhaines: Ok - I didn't know
[23:16] <bregma> nhaines, looking ath the x11-common.postinst script, it does nothing unusual, are there maybe bad ownership or permissions in your $HOME (or in ~/.cache/libertine*) ?
[23:17] <bregma> nhaines, if it was working before and isn't now, my guess is something got changed on your phone because it sure doesn't look like the software changed in the archives
[23:17] <nhaines> bregma: I've flashed all daily images from the last 7 days and done random tests on earlier images.
[23:17] <nhaines> It fails at the same point (although for the earlier images it sometimes fails on other random packages earlier on.)
[23:18] <bregma> nhaines, did you wipe and reinstall (ie. delete user data) or just flash the system image
[23:18] <bregma> ?
[23:20] <nhaines> bregma: wipe and reinstall each time.
[23:20] <bregma> nhaines, also, are you using the Terminal app to create the container or are you using a remote shell?
[23:21] <nhaines> Ooh... I have been using the terminal app whereas originally I think I used a remote shell.
[23:21] <nhaines> Let me try again with a remote shell.
[23:21] <bregma> I understand there can be permission issues using the terminal app (check your syslog for apparmor messages)
[23:51] <nhaines> Hmm, now the remote shell is just randomly timing out.
[23:51]  * nhaines sighs.
[23:56] <roma_> hi everybody
[23:57] <bregma> hi roma_
[23:57] <roma_> i'll like to get ubuntu touch on my galaxy s2
[23:58] <roma_> is someone already did it?
[23:58] <roma_> need help
[23:58] <roma_> i rooted my phone
[23:59] <roma_> try to follow the wiki of ubuntu but fastboot is not supported
[23:59] <roma_> ow can i do it ? even with heimdall??