/srv/irclogs.ubuntu.com/2016/05/31/#ubuntu-uk.txt

=== ZoiaGuyver is now known as Switches
mapppshi;]04:23
knightwisemorning peeps07:04
=== Guest40713 is now known as MooDoo
MooDoomorning all07:42
diploMorning all07:43
davmor2Morning all07:58
foobarryso wet08:24
zmoylan-piwarm and sticky... http://wttr.in/dublin08:41
JamesTaitGood morning all!  Happy Mon^WTuesday, and happy Macaroon Day! 😃08:50
brobostigonmorning boys and girls.08:50
SuperMattToday is a good day for listening to Genesis08:51
foobarrytry this instead https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-PkdLMIz-Ys08:52
* brobostigon agrees with SuperMatt 08:52
* zmoylan-pi prepares to hunt macaroons today... http://chocolatewarehouse.ie/products/caffreys-products/caffreys-macaroon-bars-56-pack/08:53
davmor2JamesTait: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=08eKINR5TKA got you covered thanks to the late great victoria wood09:07
=== layke is now known as Guest12397
DJonesHas anybody tried freedompop for mobile sim cards? Just been looking at their plans, 200 minutes, 200 texts and 200Mb of data per month for £0.00, thinking about ordering one formy wifes spare phone10:52
zmoylan-pican't go wrong at those prices :-)10:53
DJonesEven £6.99 for unlimited talk, texts and 2,250Mb of data per month is a decent price10:54
SuperMattI'm on giffgaff and with my new commute being mostly above ground, I'm paying for the unlimited bundle10:59
popeyreminds me, need to get a second 3 card for wifey, for when we are out of the country11:00
popeythe whole 3 unlimited internet in other countries is soooo nice11:00
* brobostigon agrees.11:00
sebThreeM10whitehi11:18
MooDoohello11:21
zmoylan-pio/11:21
sebThreeM10whiteMooDoo: zmoylan-pi hi11:23
sebThreeM10whitepopey: ping11:23
popeypong11:24
davmor2sebThreeM10white: classic comedy nick like it ;)11:25
davmor2sebThreeM10white: I wonder if I can guess what device you are on..........Samsung Galaxy Tab right?11:25
davmor2sebThreeM10white: on a serious note how are you finding it?11:26
sebThreeM10whitepopey: saw your pro 5 youtube videos last night ;d.  seems you got the k480 keyboard like me, but which bluteooth mouse and speakers?  I bought a cheap toner mouse hoping that would work with the m10, but nope11:26
sebThreeM10whitedavmor2:  how is it a classic comedy nick I don't understand?11:26
popeysebThreeM10white: the mouse is linked in the video11:27
davmor2sebThreeM10white: sebthree instead of sebsebseb :)11:27
MooDoosebThreeM10white: ignore davmor2 he's old and cranky ;)11:27
sebThreeM10whitedavmor2: uhmm  IRC, checking, emails, and llistening to music,  I don't need a big clunky lap top for that,  especially with this bluetooth keyboard and well y o2g over usb mouse that I like even11:27
sebThreeM10whitedavmor2: the three is really in there, since it was too long with the three seb's11:28
popeyone character longer11:28
davmor2then it would of been even funnier with M10whit :D11:29
sebThreeM10whiteplus I want to have the white in full as white, and  yes saying white, not hd :D as in the cheaper of the two :d he heh.  main difference you acstauly see is one is white and hte other is black I guess :d.  well I'll tell you when I see a FHD one if that's really true or not h eh11:29
popeynot entirely convinced other irc users need to know the colour of your computing device :)11:29
davmor2popey: I assume sebThreeM10white goal was to keep the m10white bit in :)11:29
sebThreeM10whitepopey: maybe not, but  for now name why not ;d.  plus my password is set up on my computer for the real name, and I don't know what it is11:30
davmor2sebThreeM10white: I think sebsebsebM10 would be enough :)11:30
popeyTranslate11:30
popeywhite11:30
popeybah11:30
MooDootype you're password in so you can see it, in IRC when you type in passwords we all see them as ******** ;) lol11:30
popeyhunter2!11:31
foobarrybees.gif11:31
sebThreeM10whitedavmor2 maybe but there's a difference between the two devices and probably enough of one to justify this :d,  plus  I don't have the one that most of the fan boys etc have11:31
MooDoopopey: now that was quick11:31
popey /join #ubuntu-fanboys11:31
sebThreeM10whitepopey: he h is there really a channel?11:31
davmor2sebThreeM10white: yeap but you are the only one that will care about it :)11:31
sebThreeM10whitedavmor2: to be honest I would rather have white tech in genral now, black is so boring and common and standard11:32
* sebThreeM10white feels he has enough black tech as it is already :d11:32
MooDoodavmor2: got myself a new server that I'm going to play about with Maas I think see what happens11:32
davmor2MooDoo: woohoo! let me know I haven't played with that :)11:33
sebThreeM10whiteplus why not say that got one, nice devices,  they are still speccal really not so common etc11:33
* popey hugs his white bq e4.511:34
* sebThreeM10white hopes BQ puts the BQ EF HD back in stock, but if not ah well Meizu phones are better11:34
sebThreeM10whitepopey:  h e h, and oh it was white for that?  yes the insiders got a differnet colour?11:34
popeythe white one I have was a pre-release android one11:35
popeyblack one is ubuntu edition11:35
sebThreeM10whitepopey: for the  MX 4 some got black or was that well linuuxvoice11:35
popeydunno11:35
popeymine is silver11:36
sebThreeM10whitedavmor2: I  haven't run the hack script yet to run more stuff in Xmir VLC and Inkscape and what not, something I want to do, but that hack script wont be needed at all soon it  seems for more programs :D11:36
sebThreeM10whitepopey: do you notice on the m10 that if you,  go off  say firefox and you got music on, you don't hear it anymore11:36
popeythat's not surprising11:37
popeybut not tried that11:37
sebThreeM10whitepopey: and also at times that the sound gets adjusted on things and becomes really loud,  that's on both  native browser and  firefox?11:37
sebThreeM10whitepopey: also yes Flash sucks, but anyway we could actsaully have it? I mean some sites still use it stil such as BBC News11:37
davmor2sebThreeM10white: there is no flash, and as for ff and music are you using the device in desktop mode or tablet mode?11:40
sebThreeM10whitedavmor2: I think in both modes the music thing will happen.  at the moment a bluetooth keyboard being used, but no mouse11:40
sebThreeM10whiteas I put  I think happens with libre.fm to same kind of thing and with the native brwoser11:41
sebThreeM10whitemusic being libre.fm11:41
sebThreeM10whitemaybe a bug,  I mean should be able to minimise or whatever go off to another program/app  right whilst having that still on I was thinking11:41
davmor2sebThreeM10white: no in desktop mode the app isn't in the background so in theory should continue to play, if you drop down the cog indicator you can flip it to desktop mode11:42
davmor2hence asking which mode you were in :)11:43
sebThreeM10whitedavmor2: ok nice thanks :) that seemd to solve it,  putting it into desktop mode11:44
sebThreeM10whiteI then minimzed and yep it's ok11:44
sebThreeM10whitein tablet mode why does it get effectd though? since other apps could have sound to/11:44
sebThreeM10white?11:44
davmor2sebThreeM10white: because libertine isn't using media-hub which is the service that plays audio in the background so once the app in the background it kills the audio.11:45
sebThreeM10whitepopey: you should make more apps really for touch I think seriosly :), I love stallboard by the way :)11:46
sebThreeM10whiteDavmor2 oh ok that explains it?  oh and so you got a tablet or phone?  maybe a dev?11:47
sebThreeM10whiteno question for the first bit question mark none11:47
sebThreeM10whitedavmor2: think I seen you a few times in touch channel as well maybe not, hence my question11:48
davmor2sebThreeM10white: I'm in QA at canonical my job is breaking the devices :)11:48
sebThreeM10whitedavmor2: oh didn't reolise you worked for Canonical11:49
popeyhah11:50
popeysebThreeM10white: maybe, what apps are you missing?11:50
sebThreeM10whitepopey: not just me in general, but I was thinking there should be more fun native apps in general at least :)11:51
sebThreeM10whiteby they somethin basic like stallboard or something more complex11:51
* sebThreeM10white wonders what happended to that Fireworks app that someone made by the way11:52
sebThreeM10whitedavmor2: do Canonical give you FREE Ubuntu devices to test/break and use then :d ?11:52
davmor2sebThreeM10white: no canonical own devices they send me to break and test on :)11:53
sebThreeM10whitedavmor2: well borrowing them from Canonical is similar to being given in that context I guess.  is popey on the wrong team he h for that, so he has to buy them him self or usually? :d11:54
popeyI have some from Canonical and I choose to buy my own too11:56
davmor2sebThreeM10white: no not really, he's just a magpie he sees shiny and has to have it ;)11:56
popeythat too :)11:56
davmor2popey: :D11:57
sebThreeM10whitepopey: which ones did Canonical give you? why buy own as well :D ?11:58
popeylots of reasons11:59
popeyI wanted a newer / faster device11:59
popeyIt's a waste of money for lots of people in canonical to get devices12:00
sebThreeM10whiteso uhmm I read somethine earluer about steam os  being dead or not really, may become big in a few years,  new platforms take time etc article yeah yeah.  and I was thinking hmm that could read as  Ubuntu touch even.   maybe in a few years it will be well a bit like desktop ubuntu now at least when it comes to the amount of users? what anyone think12:00
sebThreeM10white?12:00
popeybetter for developers and qa people to have them12:00
zmoylan-pibut not a slimmer device... guess all those marketing departments are wrong... :-P12:00
sebThreeM10whitepopey: developers, qa, and early adopters yes12:01
sebThreeM10whitetrue if not going to use it enough,  then it's probably a waste of money realy, if you mean like that12:01
popeyyes12:02
sebThreeM10whitehe eh, in a few years maybe,  when it comes to market share and quite a lot of users,  1. Iphone/Android 2.  Iphone/Android  3.  Ubuntu   possible reality or a Canonical etc dream?12:05
davmor2sebThreeM10white: 1. Android 2. Iphone 3. everyone else12:07
zmoylan-piwell windows phone seems intent on shooting off both feet every time they do something new, firefox phone was killed before it took it's first steps by mozilla12:08
sebThreeM10whitedavmor2: here's one you may be able to help me with Canonical devices etc  QA :d12:09
zmoylan-pisamsung still has tizen but seems to be going nowhere with it.  there are now 3 nokias, ms nokia, nokia-nokia and hmd-nokia12:10
sebThreeM10whiteDave: so I lost the files view etc normal top Firefox menu, don't know why, tried to bring back.  just now as I thought my bluetooth keyboare was going wrong or something, coudn't seem to type.  I pressed something not sure what,  d?  I guess some sort of keyboard combo by mistak to bring it up? but then it went  again12:10
sebThreeM10whitedavmor2:  ^^^612:10
sebThreeM10whitezymoyian-pi what's hmd nokia?  tizen yeah well can buY the r3 phone on Amazon from India, or the r1 and r3 on ebaby from India,  but yeah needs to target more than just india or marketshare wise it isn't going to go anywhere much.   I also think Firefox as a phone OS began  in the wrong direction only really targetting Africa12:13
zmoylan-pisebThreeM10white: ms sold the dumbphone nokia off to a bunch of ex nokia employees who will sell under hmd brand so that's hmd nokia http://www.cio-today.com/article/index.php?story_id=102003A95OVU12:15
sebThreeM10whiteif Mozilla  had at least targetted Europe for example fro the begining to, it may have been a differerent story12:15
zmoylan-pithey eventually intend to flog an android variant12:15
sebThreeM10whiteoh the dumb phone thing yeah I read something about that the other day12:15
zmoylan-pii still use a dumbphone nokia as none of the current crop of smartphones gives me what i want... battery life12:16
sebThreeM10whiteseems the dumb phone is just a basic os12:16
sebThreeM10whitebasic phone with a basic os12:16
sebThreeM10whiteand WIndos phones seem a bit eh really,  unless an expensive one that can do contium, but then need a sepreate device for cnonitum to uh12:17
zmoylan-piit runs java apps which allows a lot.  my nokia asha 302 does wifi, web, email, irc, mp3s, fm radio, ebook, games, camera...12:17
popeyzmoylan-pi: Samsung have said all new wearables will be Tizen, not Android Wear12:18
zmoylan-piprobably as they have more control they can make it use less power12:18
popeyTizen seems bigger in non-phone devices like cars and watches12:18
sebThreeM10whitebut the watches are meant to go with a phone really or appranatly12:18
sebThreeM10whiteplus no UBuntu watch any time soon it seems12:18
popeywe dont need a watch12:18
sebThreeM10whitethat's what mark said in his  q and a video12:18
sebThreeM10whitedon't need a watch why?12:19
popeywe have enough to do12:19
sebThreeM10whitesuch as? h eh h, jokingly. yes let's see  xmir :d libertine :D  keeping desktop ubuntu inteersing enough to, unity, etc etc12:19
sebThreeM10whiteyeah  in a waythat's good these smart watches  haven't taken off I think12:20
sebThreeM10whiteyet another device someone could spy on you with h e h12:21
popeyhttps://www.kickstarter.com/projects/597507018/pebble-2-time-2-and-core-an-entirely-new-3g-ultra is impressive12:21
popey~10x their target12:21
sebThreeM10whiteoh quite cheap by the looks of it to12:22
sebThreeM10whitehave you backe that?12:22
sebThreeM10whiteor cheap untill customs and  shipping maybe12:22
popeyyes12:22
sebThreeM10whiteseems getting the nex dock sent here is going to cost about the same as what I actually bought it for12:23
sebThreeM10whiteapparnantly it's like 71 dollars as an example to send from Singapore to USA,  so probably about the same for UK,  plus customs I guess12:23
popeyouch12:23
sebThreeM10whitebut it is a 14 inch lap top like thing12:24
sebThreeM10whitewith the battery etc12:24
zmoylan-1idonate an ubuntuphone or two to pebble watch people and hope they write a client for ubuntu phone...12:24
sebThreeM10whitethe battery aprpanly means can only be shipped with certain ones to,  but it came up as like fed ex and dhl anyway I think, so that's fine and standard12:24
popeyzmoylan-pi: there already is one12:24
zmoylan-1ineat12:24
sebThreeM10whitea client for UBuntu and peble watch?12:24
popeyyes12:25
popeyRockWork12:25
zmoylan-1ithen there is a smart watch for ubuntu phone12:25
popey:)12:25
sebThreeM10whitepopey: right I am putting  something I might still fund even lower down on my list it seems, since not the best time to spend like 225 pounds on  something like that, it's in the indiego go demand stage I can probably still buy at the end of next month for example12:26
sebThreeM10whitestill a bit on the fence about that one though12:26
sebThreeM10whitesince the ssd card  seems like it's not so big really, once doing things12:26
sebThreeM10whitepopey: I saw something on indiegogo the other week simlar to the chip  to I think, but I am getting that soon12:27
popeyoh, reminds me, arduboy ships soon12:27
sebThreeM10whiteyes mine is aparnatly coming12:27
sebThreeM10whiteI didn't check update my address, but I hadn't changed since putting in on kickstarter anyway, so should be fine12:28
=== zmoylan-1i is now known as zmoylan-pi
sebThreeM10whitenexdock and chip want me to confirm my address before shipping anything12:28
sebThreeM10whiteand gpd xd 128gb limited edition12:28
sebThreeM10whitethe gpd win is the one I am hmm to,  seems a bit to pricey for what would actsaully get really.  plus there isn't much space to dual boot with Linux anyway sdd space12:29
sebThreeM10whiteand there's the for even more money, the open pandora update the whatever it was called12:29
sebThreeM10whitepopey:  would you import something from India? or would you think hmm?  I mean like the tIzen R3 phone for example12:30
sebThreeM10whitevery very very very low on the things I may want to buy that are tech mind list,  but  yes might be something having one of those12:32
sebThreeM10whiteI mean as someone who likes playing around with differnet oses :)12:32
popeysebThreeM10white: sure, why not12:33
popeyhere you go, on the subject of tizen and apps.. top 20 apps in the tizen store in April 2016  http://imgur.com/OHlThlQ12:35
popey#1 unsurprisingly whatsapp12:35
zmoylan-pi20billion well spent by facebook12:36
popeythis is the #2 app http://www.downloadtizenapps.com/2016/04/bus-race-3d-for-tizen-phone-realistic-bus-racing-simulation.html12:36
zmoylan-pii do worry for opera browser now that a chinese company has bought it12:36
SuperMattjust switch to vivaldi12:37
zmoylan-pivivaldi won't run on my nokia phone :-)12:37
popeythat shareit app icon looks familiar :)12:38
sebThreeM10whitezmoylan-pi: oh I haven't seen that, what's happended to  Opera who bought it? got a link?12:42
sebThreeM10whitepopey: which Pebel perk did you do and not do and why?12:42
zmoylan-pihttps://www.techinasia.com/chinese-tech-companies-bought-opera12:43
popeysebThreeM10white: the new pebble 2 because it has a better screen, smaller bezel etc12:48
popeyand i really like my pebble12:48
zmoylan-pii keep looking at pebbles in shops but it would be a little sad to have a watch with a better processor than my phone :-) i'd have to sync with an old tablet so only under wifi coverage notifications12:49
* brobostigon hugs his pebble.12:49
brobostigonalthough my partner forces me to wear my g watch when we go out, as she thinks it looks smarter.12:51
zmoylan-piyou could wear the pebble on your ankle and check it when she's not looking... :-P12:51
brobostigonhehe :D12:52
sebThreeM10whitepopey: oh you already got a pebele. and what's the point of them really,  seems it's for seeing progress in the gym or from running and that's about it really these smart watches, going by that kick starter page12:53
popeyI have a pebble time, yes12:54
sebThreeM10whitewhat do you ise ti for?12:54
sebThreeM10whiteuse12:54
sebThreeM10whitewhat do you use it for?12:54
* brobostigon uses it as a watch, it tells the time dont you know.12:55
sebThreeM10whitebrobostigon: well sure an expensive  watch, to tell time, but what else, and I was asking popey12:55
brobostigonsebThreeM10white: notifications are handy, so i dont mis calls etc, when i am away from my phone doing jobs etc. and also a nice programming challange, building apps watchfaces etc.12:56
sebThreeM10whitehmm12:56
sebThreeM10whitewhy should I maybe have a smart watch seriously?12:57
popeythat's only something you can answer :)12:57
brobostigon:)12:57
* sebThreeM10white saw someone with the Tizen Samsung S2 or whatever and yeah12:57
sebThreeM10whitesaw whatever at FOSDEM to12:57
sebThreeM10whitetizezen ones12:57
sebThreeM10whitebut wha's wrong with well a standard old styled digital watch :d ?12:58
brobostigoni got my pebble, because my previous mechanical watch died, and it seemed a good replacement with additional benefits.12:58
zmoylan-pi1) if you want to cut down on the amount of times you check your phone in polite company as notifications are on your wrist 2) health monitor facilities 3) pure unadulterated geekiness12:58
* sebThreeM10white doesn't really use watches anymore since smart phones12:58
* sebThreeM10white 12:59
* sebThreeM10white was never particuarly good at running hmm12:59
* sebThreeM10white should maybe go to the gym again, but got quite skinny because of certain reasons13:00
popeyi rarely wore a watch before I got a pebble13:00
sebThreeM10whitein other words I am not so sure the health app would be used much if at all really13:00
brobostigonits no substitude in my mind, taking your phone out all the time just to check the time has several disadvantages, takes longer to check the time, is not perticularly polite and causes uneccesery extra drain on your phone battery when not needed.13:01
brobostigonie, more screen on time.13:01
sebThreeM10whitewell peble hmm  something to think about I guess13:01
zmoylan-pialso increases risk of dropping it as we often put them in pockets not optimally placed when sitting13:01
sebThreeM10whiteand popey said there is an app already for UBuntgu touch? for it?13:02
brobostigonyep.13:02
brobostigonto both.13:02
sebThreeM10whiteannoying thing with kickstarer and indiego is to you pay the money pretty much there and then13:03
sebThreeM10whitewhen you fund it13:03
zmoylan-pibetter that way so you will only risk money that you won't miss13:03
sebThreeM10whitezmoylan-pi:  yeah but still need to have the money at the time in the first place13:04
sebThreeM10whitezmoylan-pi: unless I guess maybe putting the bill on a credit card instead of a debit card?13:04
sebThreeM10whitezmoylan-pi: money that won't miss... but you may do a bit, once someone goes off with it instead, and you get nothing, that already happended to me with one13:07
sebThreeM10whiteso I am more careful now when it comes to crowd funding13:07
MyrttiI can't live without my watch, and upgrade from a Casio LA670WEA to a Moto360v2 was welcome upgrade for me13:23
diddledanoh, awesome! dnsmasq is removed from yakkety!13:24
diddledan\o/13:24
diddledanetc/resolve.conf will have the correct nameservers again13:24
diddledanref: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel/2016-May/039350.html13:25
=== czajkowski is now known as LauraFautley
zmoylan-pian end of an era... no more cz tab13:34
diddledan:-o13:34
diddledannooooooo13:34
* diddledan rocks gently in the corner as the world changes around him13:35
sebThreeM10whitepopey: brobostigon looks like could even get all three on there for a reasonable price, but why are they crowd funding if they are already established company?13:35
popeyask them13:35
* zmoylan-pi breaks out the chocolate hobnobs and coaxs diddledan out of the corner...13:35
diddledannobnobs!13:36
sebThreeM10whitepopey: brobostigon if the 337 was pounds that would  be a bit uh, but 230 pounds seems reasonable for all three13:36
diddledanmy precious13:37
brobostigonlol.13:37
LauraFautleyAloha :)13:37
diddledanallo LauraFautley13:37
* brobostigon watches diddledan turn.13:37
sebThreeM10whiteLauraFautley: hi13:37
sebThreeM10whitepopey: I just tried to search for a pebble app in the ubuntu store, didn't  get that far, you sure there is  one? :d13:38
sebThreeM10whiteon the tablet I searched13:38
sebThreeM10whitepopey: brobostigon that peble offer seems like quite a good one, when comparing the price to what the Samsung Gear S2 with Tizen would sell for13:43
sebThreeM10whiteso get three for the price of one of those basically13:44
sebThreeM10whitethree pebles for the price of one s2 basically13:44
brobostigonsebThreeM10white: you dont need to highlight me for every question, i will answer if i can.13:44
sebThreeM10whitealtough there would be some vat and customs as well I guess13:48
=== hamitron_ is now known as hamitron
brobostigonimport tax, and vat, yes.13:49
sebThreeM10whitewhich would be rougly how much13:49
sebThreeM10white30 pounds?13:49
brobostigonvat is 20%, as a watch is jewellery.13:50
sebThreeM10whitehmm so quite high?13:50
brobostigonhaving to pay 205 extra depending on amound can make a big differenc.13:51
brobostigon20%13:51
popeysebThreeM10white: it's called rockwork, and it's in the open store, not the default one13:51
sebThreeM10whitewell 337 is the peble all three perk for  example.  and one watch would come first, then the next later, and then the last later13:52
sebThreeM10white337 dollars that is13:52
sebThreeM10whitepopey: oh ok that explaisn why I coudn't find, why not in the default store13:52
sebThreeM10whitebut don't have to worry about vat and customs untill something actsaully comes I guess anyway :d13:53
sebThreeM10whitehow is the peble better than the  tizen s2?  or isn't it really or both about the same?13:54
brobostigonthats for you to decide, dpending on many different factors, which fits and works better for you.13:55
brobostigonresearch, :)13:56
sebThreeM10whitehmm right13:58
=== LauraFautley is now known as czajkowski
=== phablet is now known as sebthreeM10HD
sebthreeM10HDhi16:20
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tt 16:20
=== tt is now known as sebthreeM10HD
sebthreeM10HDbetter nick?16:21
sebthreeM10HDoh the..16:21
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=== sebthreeBQM10HD is now known as SebthreeBQM10HD
SebthreeBQM10HDok16:23
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SwitchesEvening18:19
daftykinso/18:20
daftykinshappy end of May!18:20
Switcheslol yeah18:20
zmoylan-piroll on june, kids off school, traffic eases up18:22
Switcheslol guess that's one way to see it18:23
SwitchesI came to a big revelation today..18:24
daftykinsooh?18:25
zmoylan-piwhen the sun shines it's very warm? :-)18:25
SwitchesI hate ubuntu for being such a great distro.. Every time I find something I think I can switch to I begin to miss ppas/snaps/forums/easy driver installs and everything just working without fuss xD18:25
daftykinshaha18:25
SwitchesWas trying Devuan, Calculate Linux, FreeBSD they all are great but each on just misses the mark with something or other..18:27
SebthreeBQM10HDzmoylan-pi, yes half term18:28
SwitchesWas hoping to move away from systemd, but tbh I would rather trust Ubuntu and Canonical to keep it in line within Ubuntu than any of the ones without it >.>18:28
SebthreeBQM10HDSwitches, SystemD is fine :d18:29
SebthreeBQM10HDSwitches, so what what it uses for boot up and such if it works :)18:29
Switchessystemd is a "virus" even the creator calls it an "operating system as a virus" :p18:29
SebthreeBQM10HDSwitches, got a link for that?18:30
SebthreeBQM10HDSwitches, and I seen him do a talk and he didn't call it that :)18:30
SebthreeBQM10HDthat was like two years or so ago now18:30
SebthreeBQM10HDor about18:30
Switchesyeah gimme a sec its on poeterings blog18:30
SebthreeBQM10HDit's a bit like Unity18:30
SebthreeBQM10HDand18:30
SebthreeBQM10HDother distros in that context let me explain :d18:30
SebthreeBQM10HDfor other distros it's like Uh Unity!18:30
SebthreeBQM10HDall other distros :d18:31
SebthreeBQM10HDok maybe not the best comparion thing but if you get me, it makes sense :d18:31
Switcheshttp://0pointer.de/blog/projects/systemd.html on there somewhere18:31
SebthreeBQM10HDeven the Ubuntu based distros don't just want to use Unity as well! most or all of them18:31
SwitchesWell I find unity fine tbh but then thats me18:32
SebthreeBQM10HDSwitches, SystemD is no big deal :)  I used one of the very first distros to go SystemD just well fine with SystemD and that distro was Mageia :)18:32
SebthreeBQM10HDSwitches, I quite like Unity 818:32
SwitchesHey I got a strong dislike for a big "money making" firm being behind anything :p18:33
SebthreeBQM10HDSwitches, I woudn't have more than one Ubuntu device if I didn't like Unity  8 I guess :d18:33
SebthreeBQM10HDor woudn't just have18:33
SebthreeBQM10HDSwitches, right but I Have already thought about that, there used to be Xandros and Lindows/Linspire trying to make  money like Canonical has but only from the desktop for those two18:33
SebthreeBQM10HDthere used to be Mandrake/Mandriva trying to make money like that to18:33
SebthreeBQM10HDthose all died out18:34
SebthreeBQM10HDI guess there just has to be one, that's commerical and really popular, and that's now Ubuntu and has been for quite a lot of years already18:34
SebthreeBQM10HDoh and Canonical is finally doing some proper inovating as well really!  yes Unity 8 Mir, Ubuntu tablets phones, that kind of stuff18:34
zmoylan-pia few days too late for international towel day... an electronic monk \o/ http://boingboing.net/2016/05/31/meet-the-robot-buddhist-monk.html18:34
daftykinsniiiice18:35
SebthreeBQM10HDSwitches, I remember when Ubuntu was uh, since they patched GNOME 2, and changed the theme to something that I thought was horrible in 10.04,  and to be honest at that time, it seemd that's about all Canonical really did18:35
SebthreeBQM10HDoh yeah and the year before they had made Ubuntu Sofware Centre, and I think Ubuntu One as well18:36
SwitchesI been with ubuntu since the start, I've seen the projects they have done, Upstart, Launchpad, Bazaar among them, Upstart was great and was even in Fedora until RedHat decided it wanted its own systemd to be the "flag bearer" and thats what worries me18:37
SebthreeBQM10HDand around that time a nice netbook remix interface, but  it seemed that Canonical didn't really do much back then,  trying to invoate change the Linux desktop etc and properly, from the other ones,  but now years later can see the direction of where things  have been heading, and are wel heading now.  yes shows nicely that with Ubuntu Phones nad tablet,s unity 8 etc18:37
* daftykins emits some expletives regarding netbooks18:37
SebthreeBQM10HDSwitches, the start so 14.10 ?18:37
SebthreeBQM10HDdaftykins, what was that?18:38
Switchesrofl18:38
Switchestry Warty Warthog was my first ubuntu :D18:38
SebthreeBQM10HDSwitches, I Typed wrong number by mistake18:38
daftykinsback in the brown days, or was that pre brown?18:38
Switchesit's 4.07 was the very first18:38
Switches(i think)18:38
SebthreeBQM10HDSwitches, I meant  04.10 ????  whatever the number is for warty18:38
SebthreeBQM10HD!warty18:38
lubotu3Ubuntu 4.10 (Warty Warthog) was the first release of Ubuntu. End Of Life: April 30, 2006. See !eol for more details.18:38
SwitchesOhh it was brown...18:38
SebthreeBQM10HDok 4.10 yeah that's it18:39
SwitchesWell I was actually testing it when it went up on the blueyonder servers back then :p18:39
SebthreeBQM10HDSwitches, I started with 5.04  BUT Ubuntu wasn't my first distro FEdora Core 2 and 4 were, but offline useage I coudn't get wireless to work18:39
daftykinsblueyonder, now there's a name that rings a bell o018:39
Switches:p18:39
SebthreeBQM10HDthen Ubuntu seemed fine for years18:40
daftykinsi find it amazing to think of the hours i spent in front of a computer that was offline, now18:40
SebthreeBQM10HD,but then18:40
SwitchesDebian and Slackware were my first "Linux"s18:40
SebthreeBQM10HDthey started doing some things in 2009 that I Didn't like so much to GNOME no big deal, but when 10.04 came out I was like uh!  I was quite a bit younger then to so :d18:40
SebthreeBQM10HD10.04 I didn't like even after changing some stuff etc back18:40
SebthreeBQM10HDdidn't just leave UBuntu though, but started going in a diffenret direction around then18:41
SebthreeBQM10HDwhen Unity  7 got made well was ok ish sure for what it was, but I Preferd GNOME 3 GNOME Shell :)18:41
SwitchesTbh Gnome made changes (3.0)and did that aswell and still are :p18:41
SebthreeBQM10HDeven my old test version developers test versison that I had from repos in Mandriva 2010 series18:41
SebthreeBQM10HDthat went on top of GNOME 218:41
SebthreeBQM10HDstill got that on my old net book :d18:42
SebthreeBQM10HDold ish18:42
SwitchesWell even Unity uses gnome libraries18:42
SebthreeBQM10HDSwitches, Unitty 7 yeah18:42
SebthreeBQM10HD8 is diffenret though18:42
SebthreeBQM10HDdifferent18:42
SwitchesYeah I know, I been testing it out a bit18:43
SebthreeBQM10HDSwitches, on the desktop?18:43
user2635Hi all :)18:43
SwitchesYep18:43
SebthreeBQM10HDuser2635, yeah18:43
SebthreeBQM10HDhi18:43
SebthreeBQM10HDjust hi for you yeah was for Switches18:43
user2635i'm havin' a go at switching to linux18:43
user2635i'm using ubuntu now18:43
SwitchesIt was a little broken last time I checked :p but you can def see the direction they are going18:43
SebthreeBQM10HDSwitches, I installed from the repos into upgraded 15.10 to 16.04  and it worked sure, but then I did stuff with the ppa after that etc and things went wrong :d18:43
SebthreeBQM10HDSwitches, it works rather nicely on the Ubuntu Phones and tablets :)18:44
SebthreeBQM10HDSwitches, 16.10 should be interesting for that, since Unity 8 with libertine I guess as well by default :d18:44
SebthreeBQM10HDI mean as a default opioton form the screen18:45
SwitchesWell Unity 8 isn't the default desktop but libertine does seem bloody interesting I will admit18:45
SebthreeBQM10HDSwitches, also Ubuntu Touch won't have a version based on 16.10 it seems, but one on 16.04 probably, so I guess the focus will be mostly the desktop for 16.10 then18:45
SebthreeBQM10HDSwitches, using libertine right now on my tablet :d18:46
SebthreeBQM10HDor uh purtine even which is the like tablet demo of some apps  pre installed for the tablet with liberitne18:46
SebthreeBQM10HDSwitches, Unity  8 runs well Ubuntu phone/table store apps,  or  other things via libertine that's the idea18:47
SebthreeBQM10HDSwitches, libertine for xmir18:48
SwitchesDamn kids!18:50
SebthreeBQM10HDSwitches, oh?18:50
SwitchesYeah I know mate, it sounds like its going to be fun X11 apps in a kind of container for unity 818:50
SebthreeBQM10HDSwitches, yep fun :d18:51
SwitchesDaughter asking me to go downstairs and then says she doesn't want anything18:51
SebthreeBQM10HDSwitches, find out what works or not etc18:51
SebthreeBQM10HDor how well it works or not etc18:51
SebthreeBQM10HDSwitches, I could run more stuff on this tablet if I Had done the hack not treid yet, but something is coming in a over the air update soon I think so hack won't be needed then18:51
SebthreeBQM10HDswithces how old is she?18:51
SwitchesWell looking at it from the outside, I think Canonical got a little bit of experience with "container" like apps, being they are the biggest in the cloud so far :p18:52
Switches1718:52
SebthreeBQM10HDyeah they got on some cloud things true18:52
SebthreeBQM10HDSwitches, Ubuntu is not liked by many18:54
SebthreeBQM10HDSwitches, also a lot of this "inovation" is really happening since they are commerical and trying to set things up, so they can make some actsaul future money18:54
SebthreeBQM10HDprofit18:54
SebthreeBQM10HDSwitches, I can't see how most distros would even try and target the phone and tablet, too much work etc18:55
SebthreeBQM10HDfor little gain18:55
SebthreeBQM10HDbut not in Canoica's case if it works out enough, profit profit profit18:55
SwitchesWell that's not really how I see it, being that not one of the competitors as it were have a "desktop" focused version like ubuntu does :p18:56
SebthreeBQM10HDSwitches, what do you mean by that exactly?18:56
SebthreeBQM10HDmost other distros use upsteram project so GNOME KDE etc, and do branding changes and what not, but they are dfiently desktop focused most other distros :).  Fedora, Open Suse, Mageia, PC Linux OS, etc etc, thousands of them18:57
SwitchesRedHat doesn't have a "desktop" version anymore, openSUSE hasn't got a desktop version the rest are pretty niche18:57
SwitchesThey are not focused on the general "desktop" user and never have been, if they were they would be a little more like how the kernel works and stop breaking stuff :p18:57
SebthreeBQM10HDSwitches, Redhat has a desktop version what are you on about it's called Fedora. there's also Red hat enterpise LInux for work station desktops,  you know what there's  cent os as well for desktops.  SUSE has a desktop version it's called OpenSuse18:58
SebthreeBQM10HDSwitches, I disagree enterigly18:58
SwitchesFedora has a Workstation and a Server, not a desktop version18:58
SebthreeBQM10HDSwitches, Mageia, Fedora, Open SUse, most distros are difneitn yfocussed at desktop users18:58
SebthreeBQM10HDSwitches, so if a distro is llow down on distrowatch you think it's niche he h?18:59
SebthreeBQM10HDI mean in the top 1018:59
SebthreeBQM10HDbut low down18:59
SebthreeBQM10HDSwitches, also Fedora's workstation version is the desktop PC and lap tops versibion19:00
SwitchesThey are not aimed at desktop users, they are aimed at Devs.. that's why they never made an inroads on desktops, the same reason they fell behind on Canonical in the Cloud19:00
SebthreeBQM10HDSwitches, that is not true at all of say Mageia :)19:00
SebthreeBQM10HDSwitches, that's one of hte distros that keeps the old Mandriva/Mandrake living on and that's definetly focussed at normal users anyone who wants to run it and for destkops :)19:01
SwitchesFedora's Workstation is not for a desktop if it was you wouldn't need Copr or the Fedora Tweak tool19:01
SebthreeBQM10HDbefore Ubuntu19:01
SebthreeBQM10HDthere was a time when Mandrake the old name for Mandriva was the like most popular desktop distro as well19:01
SebthreeBQM10HDSwitches, Fedora is for desktop pcs but it's generally aimed at sioghtly more expereinced users19:02
SwitchesMandrake had one good thing Dracut and even that wasn't all theirs it was partly suse19:02
SebthreeBQM10HDSwitches, the control centre in Mageia,  PC Linux OS, and anything linked to the old Mandriva/Mandrake is difnetlty for the desktop :)19:02
SwitchesHow can you say its for desktops... It's rules are to strict for any desktop user19:02
SebthreeBQM10HDSwitches, Mageia is dfienetly for the desktops :)19:03
SwitchesNo its not19:03
SebthreeBQM10HDnot on the council for that anymore, but  I am going to be in the meeting for that now :)19:03
SebthreeBQM10HDSwitches, yes it is and I know as someone who got invovled with that distro :)19:03
Switchesany distro that uses RPM and has to change it to URPM is not a "Desktop" focused distro19:03
SebthreeBQM10HDit's still RPM,  just the commands aren't yast19:03
SebthreeBQM10HDit's urpmi from the old Mandriva days19:04
SebthreeBQM10HDso Mageia itself has never changed any of that19:04
SwitchesMageia is a community driven project..19:04
SwitchesI don't see that as a "Desktop" focused distro, its a community distro which Ive seen hundreds come and go over the years19:05
SebthreeBQM10HDSwitches, a community driven project mostly aimed at people who want to run it on normal PC's and lap tops yes19:05
SebthreeBQM10HDSwitches, a community driven project mostly aimed at people who want to run it on normal PC's and lap tops yes19:06
SwitchesWell each to their own I guess19:07
SebthreeBQM10HDSwitches, most desktop LInux distros use GNOME, KDE,  and things like that, Mate these days even Cinnamon as optoins etc,  upstream projects19:07
SwitchesCinnamon is not an upstream project... its a fork19:08
SebthreeBQM10HDSwitches, but since Ubuntu has a commercial company behind it and a community, they can become upstrema for there own thing Unity19:08
SebthreeBQM10HDand be differnet form all the other distros19:08
user2635Anyone use KeePass? I don't know if I can ask here..19:08
SebthreeBQM10HDwho won't just use Unity19:08
daftykins"if you can ask" ? what19:08
SebthreeBQM10HDSwitches, forks  then become upstream projectd to19:08
user2635its more of a 'transitioning from windows' question19:08
SebthreeBQM10HDSwitches, can take an already existing program and make a new one, and then be a upstream of the new project19:09
SwitchesNo they don't a fork is a fork.. no matter how you split it19:09
SebthreeBQM10HDSwitches, upstream usually means that some other project wants to use your project though19:09
user2635in Keepass you can use the global hotkeys and I normally use lock workspace19:09
user2635but in Ubuntu, I can't do that19:09
SebthreeBQM10HDSwitches, a fork is something living on or living on in a diffent way19:09
Switches...19:09
SebthreeBQM10HDSwitches, most distros have forked off some other distro that already existed as well, or got based on it19:10
SwitchesCinnamon is a fork of Gnome3 it makes no changes apart from shell..19:10
SebthreeBQM10HDSwitches, Linux Mint is a fork of Ubuntu really19:10
SebthreeBQM10HDPC LInux OS was a fork of Mandrake back in 2003 but now is  quite diffenret from   when it forked19:10
SebthreeBQM10HDMate is a fork of GNOME 2, but is now it's own project Mate, and so anything that uses Mate will use the upstream Mate19:11
SebthreeBQM10HDupstream being where a program comes from in this context19:11
SebthreeBQM10HDbe that an orignally made program, or a fork of some program that already existed19:11
* daftykins yawns19:11
SwitchesOk you see it that way..19:11
SebthreeBQM10HDif you base a distro on a fork ,  you could say your upstream is the forked distro19:14
SebthreeBQM10HDif it takes loads of things from it19:14
SebthreeBQM10HDUbuntu is also a fork of Debian in that context then19:14
SebthreeBQM10HDSwitches, UBuntu is a fork!19:15
SwitchesIf you think that I suggest you go and look what a "fork" and "derivative" is19:15
daftykins:)19:16
user2635For the KeePass users, I'm coming from Windows and I used to use the easy CTRL-ALT-K to unlock workspace. How do I turn this on for linux?19:20
SwitchesHmm closest Ubuntu has to that is probably its screenlock, although I don't use it, so can't really help much more than that.19:24
SwitchesI know it had some shortcut for it, should be in system settings/keyboard I would guess19:25
user2635screenlock? is that a password manager?19:26
user2635i'm confused19:26
user2635alternatively, what password managers do you guys use on linux19:27
SwitchesWell we have seahorse which is a password mananger, if you go to dash and type passwords it will find it19:28
SwitchesIcon is a set of keys. Not sure if that's what you're looking for though.. I never really use "password" managers other than for "gpg" stuff tbh (Thunderbird Enigmail as an example)19:30
SwitchesAlso if it helps there may be a download on http://keepass.info/19:31
hazrpgHey all \o19:31
Switchesheya19:32
hazrpgJust wondering, but is anyone else having trouble with nvidia drivers on Ubuntu 16.04? I get a blank screen after the splash whenever I run `prime-select nvidia`19:33
hazrpgRunning on intel works fine, but once I switch to nvidia it breaks.19:33
daftykinscheck you've got no mixed version components?19:34
daftykinsdpkg -l | grep nvidia*19:34
daftykinser no *19:34
hazrpgdaftykins: I don't think I have: paste.ubuntu.com/1687418819:35
hazrpgoh wait, nvidia-settings has `ubuntu1` and the rest have `ubuntu2` at the end...19:37
hazrpgJust thought I'd mention, I tripple boot - so I have ubuntu twice (one for testing the latest version)... the second one (that I use for testing) I managed to solve the issue there, but I can't replicate the same solution on my main install - the only difference is that I upgrade the main one from 14.04 to 16.04, and the other one was from 15.10 to 16.04.19:40
hazrpgupgraded*19:40
hazrpgI mounted the second install and tried diffing `/etc/X11/xorg.conf` between the two and they are idential19:41
hazrpgI was wondering if anyone knew any other files I could possibly try diffing19:41
user2635Switches, seahorse??19:42
user2635!info seahorse19:42
lubotu3seahorse (source: seahorse): GNOME front end for GnuPG. In component main, is optional. Version 3.18.0-2ubuntu1 (xenial), package size 414 kB, installed size 2116 kB19:42
user2635oh right.. this is more for emails and signing off.. not a password manager19:43
SwitchesYeah, I did find a http://keepass.info/ site that may help, was just looking it has a download for Ubuntu and Deb19:43
Switchesfound*19:43
user2635actually i already use KeePass19:44
user2635it was just a specific question for those who used it19:44
SwitchesAhh sorry19:45
user2635but i've solved it for now :)19:45
SwitchesGreat!19:45
user2635there's a lot for me to learn still to get used to linux19:46
user2635i've learned that I have to think of everything in packages now..19:46
user2635even drivers and stuff like that19:46
SwitchesYou'll never stop learning :), it's one of the great things about Linux in general :)19:46
user2635i'm not even technical19:46
user2635so its a bit harder for me19:46
user2635I know how to use basic commands like cd ls sudo apt-get but I don't know how useful it will be for me19:46
SwitchesJust take you're time, if you get stuck ask in #ubuntu (patience needed) or post on the forums.19:47
user2635I only use it in tutorials, not like I have actually used it by myself (with no browser window open)19:47
hazrpguser2635: We were all in your possition once, trust me it gets easier... and the more you learn, the less likely you are to go back!19:47
user2635Switches, agreed, doesn't always work as I'm impatient! :)19:47
Switcheslol19:47
user2635hazrpg, I still dual boot in case. besides windows is still the platform for gaming19:47
user2635but I'm trying to be more secure through linux as a primary os19:48
Switcheswell sometimes the forums are faster tbh, but just remember "There are no stupid questions, only stupid answers" it really is true in Linux19:48
user2635is there anything you guys wished you learned earlier?19:49
user2635pertaining to day-to-day pc usage through linux19:49
SwitchesHmm for me would probably have been vi/vim, never got the hang of them to their full extent19:49
user2635ohhh19:50
user2635i only know nano..19:50
SwitchesSame pretty much nano/pico are my main ones xD19:50
hazrpguser2635: I use to think that too, don't get me wrong I triple boot (Windows being one of them), but I honestly can't remember the last time I used Windows. I did a full blown switch back in 2010 (literally no Windows at all!), and since I've learned that there is more you can do in Linux with a bit of patience - even gaming! I only triple booted over the last year or so because a client handed me a file19:51
hazrpg that could only be opened with a windows app that I couldn't get to work through Wine - haven't used it since.19:51
user2635hazrpg, you're crazy, I don't know if I can get that crazy yet19:52
user2635hazrpg, there are lots of stories like yours though, I'm aware19:52
user2635main thing i'm worried about is opening word docs19:52
hazrpgHaha, I have Word running through wine ;)19:53
user2635the compatibility is not 100% so there can be format differences through libreoffice19:53
SwitchesWell I switched from Windows while I was actually still and OEM for Microsoft.. I've not actually used Windows at home for the past 15 years or so lol19:53
user2635hazrpg, I see, thats on my to do list to work out later on19:53
daftykinsnow now, it may be getting better but you can't game *MORE* in Linux :P19:53
hazrpgIts rare that LibreOffice won't open them without problems, but in those situations... wine works well with Word :)19:53
hazrpgdaftykins: For everything else, I have my PS4 ;)19:54
SwitchesI don't know daftykins, there are certain "genres" that seem to be around a lot more for Linux than Windows, small little childrens games imo are better on Linux than anywhere else (like the teaching ones)19:54
user2635I've got to say, i don't know any nontechs using linux (even the techies I know don't use linux!)19:55
Switcheslol19:55
user2635so its pretty hard to meet someone to learn from other than irc19:55
SwitchesWell techies can be a weird breed :p19:55
hazrpgdaftykins: Although, don't get me wrong, I can't play StarCraft 2 on my PS4... but that works in Wine no problem (although I should point out, that paying for CrossOver helped sooooooooooooo much when I started getting lazy)19:55
daftykinscan't say i touch small children games!19:55
zmoylan-pii don't know any technical people _NOT_ using linux19:55
user2635zmoylan-pi, good for you!19:55
daftykinsi count if you are referring to desktop OS :P19:56
SwitchesI used to have quite a bit to do with them when I was teaching IT, but outside of that I don't use them at home :p19:56
hazrpgSwitches: part of me wonders if that's because die-hard linux nerds are also programmers that have kids though ;)19:56
zmoylan-pimost techs i know use linux for desktop os19:56
Switcheshazrpg: That's sometimes the case :D19:56
Switcheszmoylan-pi: Is a secret MS fan mind, He has it installed on a small box in the basement :p19:57
user2635I'm not a programmer, not clever enough19:57
zmoylan-piwhere i can administer punishment beatings that it deserves...19:57
Switcheslol19:57
user2635It might be an alternate career otherwise19:57
Switchesuser2635: You can pick up a lot using Linux, even parts of coding.19:58
hazrpguser2635: Programming isn't really that hard - getting the skills needed for a career just takes practice. :)19:58
hazrpgI'm going to sound old here, but I remember when computers came with manuals that thought you to programme using the build-in (or provided) programming language19:59
hazrpgtaught* not thought19:59
user2635hazrpg, You do sound old. LOL19:59
Switcheslol BBC Micro times then :p19:59
user2635Switches, hazrpg thanks guys19:59
* zmoylan-pi loved the zx spectrum manual. taught you everything19:59
hazrpgXD - I'm not that old! :P19:59
user2635Where is everyone based?19:59
user2635I'm b'ham19:59
hazrpgStill haven't hit 30 yet19:59
* hamitron has concluded linux is bad for productivity... entertaining IRC channels are too distracting20:00
zmoylan-pidublin, ireland o/20:00
SwitchesNo worries :D20:00
SwitchesAhh you're still a young'un then hazrpg20:00
SwitchesBristol here20:00
user2635zmoylan-pi, coolios20:00
user2635hamitron, IRC is very distracting!20:00
user2635I'll tell you all though, if there's one thing I love, its tab completion.20:01
hazrpguser2635: to your earlier comment, it depends on the circles you follow... I once didn't know anyone that didn't use Linux at all, now all the people I know do. You tend to find you influence people, if you become knowledgable in something - especially when you can give them a good reason to switch ;)20:01
hazrpguser2635: Cumbria20:01
SwitchesWell we even have the one and only popey! here the voice of Mycroft ofc it's distracting lol20:01
user2635hazrpg, I didn't even know about Cumbria.. until now20:02
user2635lol20:02
hazrpgzmoylan-pi: Didn't personally have a ZX, but I did see the manual, amazing! I had a Sharp MZ-700 handed down from my dad.20:02
popeyheh20:03
SwitchesFor some people Windows is what they need (even for it's problems) for anyone who has any interest in IT, Linux is a great place to start20:03
hazrpgzmoylan-pi: My friends were rocking ZX's and C64's... I had the ancient MZ-700 :/ - still fun though :)20:03
user2635Switches, yeah.. i'm interested, Linux is a great place to start and yet I have no idea where exactly to start.. lol20:03
Switcheshazrpg: rofl the MZ-700 was a good system, but was a bit of a brick..20:04
hazrpgSwitches: young, yes, but lets be honest - every day still feels like a school day20:04
SwitchesWell you're already using it user2635, so you have started :)20:04
zmoylan-piyou can tell real linux users when they fire up their windows systems that hasn't been updated in 6 months and it takes forever to do updates... :-)20:04
user2635So what DEs are you guys using?20:04
user2635yeah i agree windows is so dam slow20:04
user2635I'm Unity, since i'm a beginner20:05
SwitchesFor me it's Ubuntu Unity, also use Gnome and KDE when I have to20:05
user2635I know about i3, which is very hardcore20:05
Switchesi3 is a terminal junkies wonderland20:05
zmoylan-pii use xfce on xubuntu as i don't like unity20:05
hazrpgzmoylan-pi: XD I dread opening mine for that reason along!20:06
user2635tbh, I like whatever DE allows me to press super, search a program to start it20:06
user2635I believe in xfce you can press alt f220:06
Switches:)20:06
* hazrpg opens windows, shutdown... please wait while we install updates before you can continue with your shutdown...20:06
user2635zmoylan-pi, is that right?20:06
daftykinshazrpg: that's only if you don't know how to run Windows.20:07
SwitchesA lot of the DE have that ability now user2635, there isn't a great difference between any of them at the base, its more aesthetic20:07
hazrpgSwitches: MZ-700 was a brick! Still have it, tried for years to get my hands on the printer upgrade... still haven't found one! I just had the tape drive, and some classic games.20:07
Switches:D20:07
user2635Switches, I see, I think Unity is still better for email integration and playing music. Feels more like a notification tray to me like windows20:07
zmoylan-pinever tried it. i just have a bunch of shortcuts i can start a few keystokes20:07
SwitchesClassic tech ftw20:07
Switchesuser2635: Yeah, Unity is a little weird to get used to for certain things, but once you get used to it, it becomes a real joy20:08
SwitchesLike the ability to hold the "Windows" key and bring up shortcuts or open the programs in the Launcher on the left by just hitting the number20:09
hazrpgdaftykins: heh, it was an over exaggerating.20:09
user2635Switches, thats very important for me.. I like learning shortcuts20:09
daftykinsjust annoys me the stuff Linux folk say :P20:10
Switcheslol20:10
SwitchesThe worst "Linux Folk" are the actual ones that know about it :p20:10
hazrpgdaftykins: I can understand that. :P20:11
SwitchesWe tend to get very strong and passionate opinions...20:11
hazrpgI can indeed agree to that!20:11
zmoylan-pias long as everyone agrees vim is best we all get along :-P20:11
Switcheslol20:11
hazrpglol20:12
Switchesemacs!20:12
user2635I can see myself getting irc addicted20:12
user2635its going to make me antisocial20:12
user2635i better keep it to only asking questions lol20:12
daftykinsdepends if said passionate nature is enlightened enough to accept that nothing is without fault20:12
hazrpguser2635: or... VERY social ;) (just not irl social :P)20:12
zmoylan-piwell irc is the anti social media...20:12
Switcheshmm zmoylan-pi I think you're right20:13
SwitchesIRC is actually the anti everything media20:13
hazrpgThen why are you all here! :o20:14
SwitchesThat was even more true when Quakenet used to be a "big" thing cause of Gamespy :p20:14
SwitchesBecause were all anti-social20:14
user2635Gamespy, haven't heard that word in ages20:15
SwitchesThey think sticking all the "anti social" elements in on place called IRC was a good idea...20:15
hazrpgIs it bad that I remember Quakenet? My friends thought I was some weird kind of computer wizard just because I knew how to play quake with people at any time of the day - and they couldn't even get local multi-play to work >_<20:16
user2635I used to go on AA (America's Army)20:16
Switcheslol20:16
SwitchesAA was a damn good game20:16
SwitchesPlayed it for years20:16
SwitchesI used to play a lot of quake..20:16
user2635I cheated at one point20:16
user2635what was the specific term for it20:17
user2635seeing through stuff20:17
user2635to see enemies20:17
SwitchesWallhacking20:17
hazrpgSwitches: I think most people did - at our school, quake was installed on all the computers by the teacher!20:17
user2635yeah.. that, I feel bad for appearing like I had super reflexes20:17
user2635lol20:17
Switcheshazrpg: My kind of teacher :D20:17
user2635I never went on quake, i think i'm one of the younger ones here20:17
hazrpgSwitches: She was a legend!20:18
Switchesquake was a bit of a phenomenon tbh, it was the spark that started the online FPS pretty much20:18
hazrpgI felt bad for the kids who didn't learn because of it though... I think I was the only one that passed her IT lessons with high marks.20:19
Switcheshehe, yeah playing quake can have an adverse effect on learning anything20:19
hazrpgIndeed it can!20:20
SwitchesApart from learning how to "Rocket Jump" to reach the quad damage...20:20
hazrpgThat was super important though!20:20
user2635Part of my backup failed on dejadup, it said that it couldn't backup /home/user/.cache/dconf20:20
user2635what is stored there anyway?20:20
user2635is it to worry about?20:21
hazrpguser2635: Generally speaking, anything that's cached doesn't really need to be backed up.20:21
user2635hazrpg, thanks20:21
SwitchesNothing to worry about I don't think.. just watch for sparks and flames and you'll be fine! :p20:22
SwitchesBeing honest though I don't know why its trying to back up a .cache folder anyways, those are normally not monitored20:23
hazrpguser2635: cached stuff only just speeds up operations - and dconf, in some ways, is kinda like the registery in windows (regedit)... but has much less stuff then in Windows.20:24
SwitchesIf it fails on it again, open up the "backup" program and on the ignore folders part just add it to that20:25
hazrpggeneral rule, if its cache it will be rebuilt if they aren't there20:26
user2635ok I'll put it in ignore now20:26
hazrpgit just takes longer if the cache isn't there the very first time something is opened20:26
user2635good! added20:27
hazrpg(btw, that's a cool trick if something isn't working properly - sometimes clearing the cache helps!)20:27
hazrpgbah, still can't work out why nvidia isn't working right :/20:28
SwitchesWhat's it doing?20:28
daftykinslogs? :>20:29
daftykinshybrid is a mess on Linux20:29
hazrpgSwitches: blank screen after the splash20:29
Switchesohh it's a prime?20:29
hazrpgyup, laptop too... and I can't disable secure boot20:29
user2635hazrpg, you mean just doing a rm -r .cache? :)20:29
daftykinssee if you can SSH in if it's really running but blank?20:30
hazrpguser2635: only if you want to truly be distructive! :P I meant more at an application level rm -r .cache/some-app20:30
user2635hazrpg, ohhh ok20:31
hazrpgdaftykins: using it right now! I'm on irssi20:31
daftykinsoh20:31
hazrpguser2635: clearing out .cache won't really cause any harm - just take longer to load anything after the fact20:31
Switcheshazrpg: You took a look at http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=2263209?20:31
SwitchesThere's a guy at the bottom that seems to have a "workaround" for some of it20:32
hazrpgSwitches: Not sure, I'll check on my tablet. I mainly tried the stuff on askubuntu.com20:34
SwitchesWell seems to be the last post, so I'm guessing it has solved it for some people.20:35
user2635What difficulties did you guys have transitioning to linux?20:36
SwitchesI didn't really have any tbh, but then my background was with Unix and Sun Solaris systems so it wasn't as huge a jump as it is now from Windows20:37
hazrpgSwitches: The second workaround won't work because I don't have that indicator installed (use to, but it caused more problems than it was worth). I'm going to try the first to see if that works, but from what I can tell prime-select is working, nvidia just doesn't seem to be "showing" anything even though I can hear the Ubuntu noise at boot... but I'll give it a go :)20:38
SwitchesOnly real issue I had was being able to do some things without a terminal :p20:38
Switcheshazrpg: Hope it works!20:39
hazrpgSwitches: file changed, fingers crossed!20:39
user2635ok i'm gonna call it goodnight20:42
Switchesnight mate20:42
user2635it was great meeting you all hazrpg Switches20:42
user2635zmoylan-pi,20:42
SwitchesSame :)20:42
user2635thank you for all your guys help20:42
SwitchesNo worries, anytime20:42
zmoylan-pio/20:42
hazrpgSwitches: *sigh* didn't work20:47
Switches:(20:48
hazrpghmmm one thing i didnt consider is screen brightness!21:07
hazrpggoing to see if that fixes it when i get back... currently picking up my wife from work21:09
hazrpgI'm going to be annoyed with myself if thats the reason its blank when using nvidia over intel21:10
hazrpg...maybe not21:22
diddledanm0023:30
zmoylan-pi*bark* *bark*23:32
diddledanbaaa23:33
diddledanomg, welsh!23:33
daftykinshere's a blast from the past https://www.dropbox.com/sh/w7z0xa2pkrfwvg1/AACCM4flIZ0qHpjxxZnAXNMCa?dl=023:40
daftykinsthing still works!23:40
diddledanerhmagherd23:43
daftykinsoptical media O_O23:44
diddledanoptics?! :-o23:44
diddledannobody uses those23:44
daftykinsi was gonna FTP the game on, but i couldn't read the ISO so it had to get burnt23:44
diddledan\o/23:44
SwitchesClever gits! http://phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=Wine-Staging-1.9.1123:46
SwitchesAnd wtf.. there are rumors on there that the AMD announcement is going to have a R480 at $199..23:47
daftykins*nod* not R480 though, RX 48023:48
daftykinsthe live event is at 3am allegedly23:48
SwitchesStill Polaris for that cheap is kind of a big deal23:48
SwitchesYeah hopefully they got some details on the GPUs aswell as the APU23:49
daftykinsonly fussed about the graphics cards myself :) itching for an upgrade, mines so ancient23:52
SwitchesWell same here, but tbh the new APU has me a little interested for a HTPC/NAS build23:55
daftykinso023:58
daftykinsstorage in the same place as playback ;_;23:58
SwitchesWell kind of, I have 4 other systems in the house and loads of tablets and phones xD23:59

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