=== stuart is now known as Guest56296
=== salem_ is now known as _salem
=== chihchun_afk is now known as chihchun
=== ecloud_wfh is now known as ecloud
swalladgeMy M10 won't output to HDMI... Any ideas?09:29
swalladgeTested with two different cables, a computer monitor, and a tv09:30
faenilSebthreeBQM10HD: hey, do you need anything?10:07
SebthreeBQM10HDfaenil, THAT10:12
SebthreeBQM10HDwas yestetday10:12
SebthreeBQM10HDbut converg10:12
faenilSebthreeBQM10HD: I know...but I didn't see the msg yesterday ;)10:12
SebthreeBQM10HDe is looking betteer now going by videos and maybe I will buy a Microsoft display adapter soon10:13
SebthreeBQM10HDfaenil, what is a good bluetooh mouse to get?10:14
SebthreeBQM10HDthe ones I have seen all have looked a bit uh, I bough a cheap one even that didn' seem to work10:14
bitanarchyDo I need twrp to install ubuntu touch on an android meizu pro 5?10:14
faenilSebthreeBQM10HD: mmm I don't know, we have a few standard bluetooth mice10:14
SebthreeBQM10HDfaenil, we as in?10:15
faenilSebthreeBQM10HD: Design Team at Canonical. I am an engineer in that team10:15
faenil(I know, it sounds weird :D )10:15
SebthreeBQM10HDbitanarchy, what's twrp?10:15
bitanarchyit's a boot recovery image10:16
SebthreeBQM10HDfaenil, oh your actsaully from the design team interesting10:16
faenilSebthreeBQM10HD: yeah, but I'm not a designer :)10:16
bitanarchysomething like clockworkmod10:16
SebthreeBQM10HDfaenil, enginner in a desing eam though, what does that mean ?10:16
faenilbitanarchy: http://askubuntu.com/questions/767323/how-to-install-ubuntu-on-meizu-pro-5-that-was-originally-with-android10:16
SebthreeBQM10HDfaenil, I should get a mouse that works with hte m10.  I bought a cheap toner one from Amazon  but that didn't seem to work10:17
faenilSebthreeBQM10HD: I do prototypes for designers to test their ideas. Plus I work on the UI Toolkti10:17
SebthreeBQM10HDyou see diffent mouses in different videos etc to10:17
SebthreeBQM10HDwant a cheap one that works really10:17
SebthreeBQM10HDLogitech can be expensive10:17
SebthreeBQM10HDit's a mouse!10:17
faenilSebthreeBQM10HD: I could tell you the one I have here, I think it's just a standard bt mouse, nothing fancy10:17
SebthreeBQM10HDthis k480 is nice :). I seen three Logitech ones, but the look he colours I don't seem to like much10:18
SebthreeBQM10HDwhich mouse is that?10:18
* SebthreeBQM10HD is thinking of doing another order on Amazon soon ( I don't have Prime), for the wirees display adapter, and another blue tooth mouse that hopefulliy works this time another trackpad, and even the white colour of the k480 as well I got the black10:19
SebthreeBQM10HDthat's a nice keyboard dock thing with a stand for sure10:19
faenilSebthreeBQM10HD: http://ijetech.com/0884/10:20
SebthreeBQM10HDlinks don't work on Ubuntu touch yet, but soon it seems I Mean in Libertine10:20
faenilSebthreeBQM10HD: and Logitech K480 as keyboards10:20
SebthreeBQM10HDis that where you bought from as well, or just a page about it10:20
faeniljust a pge10:20
faenildon't know where it was bought from10:20
SebthreeBQM10HDfaenil, yep I got the black k480 as well and been using :),  going to buy the white one as well10:21
faenilbut I have never had a non-working mouse honestly10:21
faenilthe ones I tried all worked10:21
faenil(I haven't tried that many)10:21
SebthreeBQM10HDwell thata TONER ONE hmm10:21
SebthreeBQM10HDI think more for Windows or something10:21
SebthreeBQM10HDfaenil, in other news I wanted to organise an event for Linux Presentation Day in October really10:22
faeniloh cool :)10:23
SebthreeBQM10HDwhich would mean only about three months to acusally organise10:23
SebthreeBQM10HDif can get a venue10:23
SebthreeBQM10HDfaenil, we had one with my LUG in 2014, but it idnd't quite get the peope they wanted, got someone else who would be interested now in organisng/helping,  unforunatly still no reply from the venue I wanted hmm10:23
SebthreeBQM10HDno venue, no event10:23
SebthreeBQM10HDfaenil, ideally I wanted to be abl eto go to my LUG on Saturday and be like, oh you kinow that idea popped up last week on the list, but I already got a venue if going to do it10:24
faenilheh :)10:24
SebthreeBQM10HDthere will be certain  people there who would be reluctant to doing anything when it comes to another event who helped out last time, or one guy in particular I am thinking10:25
SebthreeBQM10HDespeically with much less time as well to orgnaise something10:25
SebthreeBQM10HDfaenil, but yah can then do some Desktop LInux stuff, but also mobile even :D10:26
SebthreeBQM10HDshow like Ubuntu convergence :D10:26
SebthreeBQM10HDand things like that10:26
faenilyeah, that would be nice10:26
SebthreeBQM10HDand have Creative COMMONS stuff in there to :)10:26
SebthreeBQM10HDfaenil, I want something a bit bigger than last time to, but yes venue hmm10:27
SebthreeBQM10HDplus there's currently no sponsership or funding to actsually rent something as well!10:27
SebthreeBQM10HDthat would be difficult to try and ge I expect as well10:27
SebthreeBQM10HDfaenil, if you look at http://linux-presentation-day nice idea and all, but I don't think they help at all with funding for these events,  they can mybe help find a venue though10:28
bitanarchyIs ubuntu-device-flash only available on ununtu?10:28
bitanarchy* ubuntu10:28
SebthreeBQM10HDfaenil, menions maybe just having like a smalll event with a few computers even it seems, but still got to have some where to go to even that, and someone a bit more proper i gusss than just a pub10:28
faenilbitanarchy: I think so, at the moment. You could try building the source though, or maybe just running the binary on your distro is enough, as long as you have the deps. Not sure though10:29
SebthreeBQM10HDfor even that, and somewher a bit more proper correcting10:29
faenilbitanarchy: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~phablet-team/goget-ubuntu-touch/trunk/files10:30
faenilSebthreeBQM10HD: yeah...no idea10:30
SebthreeBQM10HDfaenil, so what do you do in the design team, but not as a designer? have you done any events as well in general ?10:31
faenilSebthreeBQM10HD: as I said above, I do prototypes for designers, so that they can see how their designs look like. Plus I work on the Ubuntu UI Toolkit, the UI components that you use to develop applications10:31
SebthreeBQM10HDwhat kind of prototypes ?10:32
SebthreeBQM10HDwhat you mean by that really?10:32
faenillike, say they want to add a feature to...I don't know, scopes10:32
bregmahey SebthreeBQM10HD you can always consider https://community.ubuntu.com/help-information/funding/10:32
faenila new view that shows new stuff10:32
SebthreeBQM10HDbregma, you mean with Ubuntu/Canonical helping to fund an event ?10:33
bregmawell, it's the Ubuntu Community, but yeah10:33
faenilthen I implement that as quickly as possible, a prototype, a rough version to give them an idea of how it actually would be10:33
bregmathere's a process, and no guarantee10:33
SebthreeBQM10HDbregma, I was actually vaguelly thinking maybe Ubuntu/Canonical could help fund a bit or something10:33
SebthreeBQM10HDbregma, it woudn't have to be all Ubuntu though ?10:34
faenilthen it goes through to the engineering teams owning that project to be refined and rewritten/completed10:34
SebthreeBQM10HDbregma, could still have some other distros in there to for example ?10:34
bregmaSebthreeBQM10HD, I don't know, apply and see, nothing to lose at any rate10:34
SebthreeBQM10HDI would be trying to get a load of 16.04 Dvd'S THOUGH10:35
SebthreeBQM10HDfor free10:35
SebthreeBQM10HDbregma, last time I applied  for stuff, and jono sent me a load of stuf for free :)10:35
SebthreeBQM10HDor got ir arranged I MEAN10:35
davmor2SebthreeBQM10HD: talk to popey or mhall119 they should be able to point you in the general direction of anything community related10:35
SebthreeBQM10HDDVD's, pens, usb rings10:36
SebthreeBQM10HDI mean key rings10:36
SebthreeBQM10HDdavmor2, yeah indeed10:36
popeygo through the community donations process10:37
SebthreeBQM10HDthe link bregma gave ?10:37
davmor2see knew they'd know10:37
popeythink so10:37
popeyam mbile atm10:37
popeyand on holiday10:37
bregmaif you highlight their names three times they appear in you mirror10:38
SebthreeBQM10HDbregma, davmor2 bregma faenil ok thanks10:38
SebthreeBQM10HDbregma,  h eh10:38
* popey doesnt like mirrors10:38
SebthreeBQM10HDand you say that just as I uhmm10:38
SebthreeBQM10HDdid that high light hting of all names :D10:38
SebthreeBQM10HDjust before I10:38
popeydavmor2: do you know unav status? i submitted for qa10:38
popeywhile i am here10:38
davmor2popey: haven't a clue I'm on desktop for 16.04.110:39
popeyjibel: ? ^10:39
SebthreeBQM10HDoh isn't o;en source great, for events as well, can get people from else whre to help in certain ways :)10:39
davmor2popey: looking at it, it is second in the queue so should be done today or tomorrow10:40
SebthreeBQM10HDand for the software itself, Ubuntu touch or smething else, amazing really how it's made, people from differnet places getting together etc10:40
SebthreeBQM10HDthanks Internet :D10:40
popeydavmor2: thanks10:45
SebthreeBQM10HDpopey, for the Wireless Display adaptar, is it just the standard Microsoft v2 one? yeah I guess so, thinking of buying that quite soon since convergence looks like will be quite interesting with the tablet etc10:50
davmor2SebthreeBQM10HD: if you can get v1 that is the one that most people are working with so it is more stable10:56
SebthreeBQM10HDdavmor2, oh10:57
SebthreeBQM10HDdavmor2, more stable how so?10:57
SebthreeBQM10HDand Amazon seemed to have both versions10:57
* SebthreeBQM10HD will buy from Amazon again some things, even though doesn't have prime10:58
davmor2SebthreeBQM10HD: more people using it so more people testing it and reporting bugs against it etc10:58
SebthreeBQM10HDI see yeah, and indeed newer isn't always better10:58
SebthreeBQM10HDor depending on for what going to do10:58
* SebthreeBQM10HD might buy both versions, but probably only really need one :D10:59
SebthreeBQM10HDwith ota 12 expected next week in the stable11:00
SebthreeBQM10HDand after seeing a video or two as well,  I guess it's basically time to buy11:00
SebthreeBQM10HDdavmor2, the thing itself, you just connect it to the back of a tv or monitor? but it needs a hdmi port ?11:01
davmor2the MS dongle uses a usb and hdmi port on the tv/monitor11:01
bregmaSebthreeBQM10HD, you plug it in to the TV's HDMI port and it gets powered off the TV's USB port11:02
bregmaI was surprised to discover my TV had a USB port11:02
SebthreeBQM10HDhmmm not  sure if our newer samsung tv has a usb port, I think it might11:02
bregmaevidently it's a power-only port for just this purpose11:02
SebthreeBQM10HDwith a monitor though that would need a usb port as well the monitor ?11:02
davmor2SebthreeBQM10HD: most do11:02
SebthreeBQM10HDrather old tv's won't have usb ports though11:03
davmor2SebthreeBQM10HD: the dongle always need usb for power and hdim for display11:03
davmor2SebthreeBQM10HD: most flat panels with 1080p displays will have usb and hdmi11:04
SebthreeBQM10HDdavmor2, bregma as dev's of  Ubuntu touch, but personally :D,  even if not quite ready properly for say general public type pople, do you think things like convergence for example and I guess libertine things even and things like that, would all be interesting to show as part of an event in October? an event that's meant to get people intersted in Linux and Creative Commons even. hopfully I can organise a11:04
SebthreeBQM10HDnd have such an event hmm11:04
davmor2it's always a fun demo11:06
=== chihchun is now known as chihchun_afk
SebthreeBQM10HDdavmor2, yeah that's what I am thinking, things really have changed since 2014, I have more interesgting tech now :D11:06
* SebthreeBQM10HD waits for nex dock that will be good at an event as well11:07
SebthreeBQM10HDdavmor2, have you got the ms adapater "?11:10
davmor2SebthreeBQM10HD: I do11:10
SebthreeBQM10HDand a device for thaI gues then11:10
SebthreeBQM10HDwell of course you got devices or would think so, your a dev :D11:10
t-askHi, I have some issues with my Ubuntu Phone. I can't playback most of imported videos, even if codecs seem to be installed. And if the file is on the external SD card the mediaplayer seem to copy the file to the local drive.11:11
davmor2I'm not a dev, I'm QA I test the stuff before it kills kittens ;)11:11
SebthreeBQM10HDdavmor2, yeah QA11:12
SebthreeBQM10HDbregma, h eh wasn't it devmor2 who has to mainly accept a lot of your code for libertine etc, before it gets in there?11:12
t-askI can't even playback camaera recorded videos (2GB), too. How can I fix those issues?11:13
davmor2t-ask: works fine here11:13
davmor2t-ask: hmm wonder if there is a size limit most of mine are smaller than 2Gb11:13
t-askIf I donwload Youtube videos with youtube-dl eg., copy them over, Mediaplayer or Galery doesn't start it11:13
t-askEven if thumbs of the viedos ar shown, really strange11:14
davmor2t-ask: yeah that is most like in the wrong format11:14
t-askis mp4 not mp4?11:14
davmor2t-ask: hmm mp4 should be fine it's what mine are11:15
t-askAnd why does the medaiplayer seem to copy the file over to local drive, before playback... I guess here, because it take minutes before a workking video works11:15
davmor2t-ask: what version of touch are you on?11:16
davmor2t-ask: I think that was a bug that got fixed11:16
t-askauto-download for updates seem not to work for apps11:17
t-askI had to check for updates right now11:18
t-askWifi is on and option is checked too11:18
t-askBut my main issue is vidoe playback and memory consumprion11:18
t-asklatest update: 01/06/201611:19
davmor2t-ask: yeah ota-12 I think will address some of your issues that should be out soon11:20
t-askThat would be really nice.11:21
t-askOpening videos is just ab bit odd. Really slow that way and I don't understand why Gallery is even provided as alternative playback option.11:22
* SebthreeBQM10HD waits for clickable links in libertine stuff in uh11:22
SebthreeBQM10HDthe on screen keyboard working will be nice :)11:22
t-askWould be nice of opening a mp4 eg just opens the mediaplayer whichout asking for other options11:22
t-askOTA release cycle is 6 weeks or?11:23
SebthreeBQM10HDt-ask, yes every six weeks or so, sometimes delayed a bit so11:24
t-asksure, ok, then I hope this will be fixed then. I really enjoy that phone11:24
SebthreeBQM10HDt-ask, for example ota 12 was going to be released yeserday, but i think afer already being pushed back a bit anyway11:25
SebthreeBQM10HDwhich phone?11:25
t-askWill it be possible to speed up the loading time of the phone, system settings, too?11:25
t-askQG Aquaris 4.5 I think (the small one)11:25
SebthreeBQM10HDoh the first phone11:25
SebthreeBQM10HDbq 4.511:25
SebthreeBQM10HDI got one but it stays on a old version now11:26
SebthreeBQM10HDor for now as in a long time11:26
SebthreeBQM10HDsine I got he mx 4  and tablet as well so11:26
t-askyou don't have OTA-11 then?11:26
SebthreeBQM10HDt-ask, it's stil a verion fro some time lst year before July on the 4.5, since I thought I had lost that phone, turned up earlier this yaer in this room so :d11:27
t-askSebthreeBQM10HD: maybe you could test playback of big videos got via youtube-dl from youtube (on SD)11:27
SebthreeBQM10HDt-ask, I bought the Meizu MX 4 last year as well, so that became my phone :)11:27
SebthreeBQM10HDt-ask, nah the version on my 4.5 is just to old to help you with that, since it's still a version based on Ubuntu 14.1011:27
SebthreeBQM10HDpluss i have no big videos on there11:28
t-askhehe, it was more to confirm my issues,.. but if those issues will be fixed with OTA-12 I will be happe11:28
SebthreeBQM10HDt-ask, got a big video on my mx 4 though, which meaning to take off haven't yet,  not updated that phone since like decmeber 2015, no october or os even, didn't want to llose data maybe so. yeah I need to sort that out11:28
SebthreeBQM10HDt-ask, my tablet is reasoanbly up to date  though. ota 10, meaning to update to 0ta 11 this week, and then i'll do 12 very soon next week :)11:29
SebthreeBQM10HDor if I got  the wireless display adapater before then I Guess or whatever :D11:29
t-askOK, then I will just wait for OTA1211:29
SebthreeBQM10HDt-ask, yes it's impressive stuff11:30
SebthreeBQM10HDand it improves eveyry six weeks or so11:30
SebthreeBQM10HDwell in dev in that time, but then the imporements come as stable updates every six weeks or so :)11:30
SebthreeBQM10HDnew featurse get added in here and there as well etc proper ones11:30
SebthreeBQM10HDt-ask, have you seen the wireless convergnece videos?11:31
t-askThen I have other questions regarding the tablet. I want to buy it if I could run Thunderbird in Desktop mode. Is this possible and/or where can I check which Ubuntu packages I can install with the tablet11:31
SebthreeBQM10HDt-ask, and no the 4.5  won't be able to do that11:31
SebthreeBQM10HDt-ask, there's no thunderbird by default on the tablet,  however there's all the native programs, and then the demo of Libertine stuff, so Firefox, Gimp, Gedit,  Libre Office11:32
SebthreeBQM10HDt-ask, there is a like way to hack it or kind of thing to add in other programs such as Thunderbird, however the native email client dekko is actsaully rather good on Ubuntu touch anyway so :)11:32
SebthreeBQM10HDin the future it will be much easier to install and more offically other ARM based programs so THunderbird, vlc, and what not, but that won't be for at least another few months or so I expect11:33
SebthreeBQM10HDt-ask, I thought I wanted Thunderbird on the tablet myself, but been using this dekko for about three months now, and yes it's good :)11:34
t-askThe thing is, the person I want to buy the tablet for, works with Gnome desktop and LOffice, Thunderbird and UTox chat quite often. So I had the idea to help that person making the current workplace mobile with the tablet11:34
SebthreeBQM10HDt-ask, you can add in more programs, but to like edit the libertine container etc, to do that at the moment11:34
t-askyou can encrypt emails, with the build in one too?11:34
SebthreeBQM10HDno don't think dekko has encryption11:35
SebthreeBQM10HDony or passwords sure, but not emails them selves11:35
SebthreeBQM10HDt-ask, just buy one, or for yourself anyway at first, trust me it's a nice device the tablet :)11:35
SebthreeBQM10HDworth the buy11:35
SebthreeBQM10HDif you like the 4.511:35
t-askso the apps are runnning in LXC containers?11:35
SebthreeBQM10HDwell that's a much nicer device11:35
SebthreeBQM10HDt-ask, yeah bregma for example can tell you lots more about that if he's around11:36
SebthreeBQM10HDt-ask, in fact the tablet is so nice that11:36
t-askno need, I just need to know if I could run that tablet like a "normal" ubuntu distro11:37
SebthreeBQM10HDt-ask, as planned I bought the cheaper tablet first the cheaper version of the two,  partly since the price differnet when buying as well etc, and money what had and not had, but ys going to buy the full hd one as well later on in the year that's the plan11:37
SebthreeBQM10HDvery nice device :)11:37
SebthreeBQM10HDmore so with a logitech k480 bluetooh keyboard with it's stand thing for hte tablet, connected to it for example :)11:38
SebthreeBQM10HDt-ask, can you use the tablet like an Ubuntu desktop, well sure and that's where things are heading in certain was11:38
SebthreeBQM10HDso convergence and also this libertine thing for example11:38
t-askI need remote access to that tablet then and I want to run Thunderbird + Syncthing11:38
t-askif that is currently "too hacky" I better wait11:39
t-askThat person is not around. I have to do all staps remotely and I doubt. that this person is able to "hack" into anything11:40
t-askSo, my plan was to buy it, then install syncthing, thunderbird and maybe utox, then send it to that person. Then remotely apt-get update the tablet if needed11:41
SebthreeBQM10HDt-ask, however tablets have battires and mine ran out11:41
SebthreeBQM10HDbut back now11:42
SebthreeBQM10HDt-ask, it does have a good battery  life11:42
t-askyou disconnected?11:42
t-askas I wrote something about my plan11:42
SebthreeBQM10HDt-ask, you can probaly remote connect using ssh via the termial and things like that, sure,  but davmor2 etc can probably help you better with details11:42
SebthreeBQM10HDI don't know much about that one11:42
SebthreeBQM10HDI got stuf to do11:43
SebthreeBQM10HDt-ask, nearly kept it off, but  nah wanted to come back and say the above :d. you are in the right channel though :)11:43
SebthreeBQM10HDt-ask, maybe there's another question I can help with quick though11:43
t-askok, so I assume. I better wait with my plan buying it for now11:43
SebthreeBQM10HDt-ask, no in many ways it is like an Ubuntu desktop just a little differnet11:44
t-askDoes it sync automatically a home directory on another linux desktop system?11:44
t-askliek syncthing does11:44
bregmat-ask, Thunderbird runs OK under Libertine on the tablet, I don't know about the other software you mentioned11:46
SebthreeBQM10HDt-ask, there's a terminal app that you can install from the app store, and with that, you  should be able to do most of the things or kind of things you can do on a normal ubuntu desktop in the terminal,  from using ssh and what not11:47
bregmaI use ssh to do most work on the tablet except touching the screen (because I have a really good wired keyboard on my workstation), so it's definitely a supported way of remotely supporting someone11:47
t-askhttps://syncthing.net/ is a really convenient sync tool to sync folders between several devices.. runs so well, I would recommend having this on the tablet by default11:48
t-askI synced five devices, even with windows for months now. It is really perfect11:49
t-askI ish, Syncthing would run in my phone too11:49
* SebthreeBQM10HD goes away11:49
SebthreeBQM10HDt-ask, good luck  and trust me buy the tablet you'll find it nice and not regret it :)11:50
SebthreeBQM10HDfor yourself that is11:50
SebthreeBQM10HDand possibly your friend to yes11:50
t-askanyways. Thunderbird with encryption + Syncthing and any Tox cleint would be nice to have for the tablet. Then I could recommendh the tablet to several friends, even the windows guys11:50
t-askI assume, then I have nothing to maintainance anymore. As I tested Syncthing with desktop and notebook devices before. If the Tablet then just syncs itself with the person's desktop - perfect11:53
bregmat-ask, syncthing is not available for Ubuntu Touch (it's available in Ubuntu "yakkety yak", which will become 16.10)11:53
bregmabut if you package it as a click, you can upload it to the store and it will be available on the tablet11:54
t-askbregma: I think, I can't because I'm not a dev11:54
bregmawell, that can be fixed ;)11:55
bregmaor maybe you can bribe someone11:55
t-askWell, life doesn't allow me any oth those, currently11:56
bregmalooking at it, there's no technical reason it wouldn't run on the tablet, someone just has to package it up11:56
t-askwould it then run on the phone, too?11:57
bregmait's all the same software11:57
t-askI remeber asking the syncthing devs some weeks ago, but none of them had a Ubuntu Phone11:57
bregmaphone, tablet, desktop....  that's convergence11:57
t-askThe beauty with syncthing is, painless and no file conflicts anymore. Syncthing does it al itself. That's why it would be perfect for syncing certain folders around desktop, notebooks, tablets and phone.11:59
t-askanyways, I would need a better introduction to do packaging myself in person. It is for me too difficult to learn all this by reading just a howto. I have too many questions around that, I assume. But finding a dev around my place, who would spend time helping me learning that stuff is almost zero :(12:03
t-askMaybe there is an option to lend a ubuntu phone to devs who are able to repackage their software?!12:04
=== chihchun_afk is now known as chihchun
swalladgeSyncthing already works fine on ubunt touch12:33
swalladgeWouldn't be any good as an 'app' at the moment though, because they lose network connection as soon as you switch apps12:33
t-askThat means it wouldn't be possible to install a syncthing daemon via app installment12:35
t-askIs there any good read on how to iinstall syncthing on the tablet then?12:35
t-askI mean, I'm familiar with the 'old' apt-get process, but is it the same for click packages?12:36
dobeyno it's not the same, and installing packages with apt on the phone into the root partition is strongly discouraged12:38
swalladget-ask: https://swalladge.id.au/posts/2016-07-11-syncthing-ubuntu-touch.html <-- i actually wrote a short tutorial on how to install it12:40
swalladgeand yeah, using apt-get to install things system wide ends badly with ubuntu-touch...12:41
swalladgeanything installed in writable places (such as your home directory) works fine though12:42
swalladge(i'm not that familiar with click or snappy packages either...)12:42
dobeywell, you could install it as a click package through the open store i guess, and have the daemon bits work as expected; but then you're installing unsigned packages which don't conform entirely to the security model of ubuntu, too12:45
dobey(also, i really dislike that it's called the "open" store, mzanetti :)12:46
matv1dobey what would you call it?12:47
t-askswalladge: that looks interesting. Can I try this with my Aquarius 4.5, too?12:47
dobeymatv1: i don't know. alternate. sidecart. something more clever, and which doesn't imply the main store is somehow "closed"12:47
swalladgedon't see why not - it's the same system :) As long as you download syncthing for the correct arch12:48
swalladge(arm64 or 32)12:48
t-askdobey: sure, I would prefer installing an official app. Even better, becasue then I can give other persons just the advice installing the syncthing app and they are fine12:48
mzanettidobey, do you :)12:48
dobeymzanetti: yes, calling it "open" implies the main store is somehow not at all open.12:49
mzanettidobey, is that wrong?12:49
mzanettithat seems quite matching to me12:49
mzanettidobey, it's an app store where apps are rejected at canonical's liking, where there is no link between binary and code...12:50
mzanettiit's still great we have it, but open is totally not the word for it12:51
t-askcould call it staging-store ;)12:51
dobeymzanetti: i think that's an incorrect statement12:51
dobeyt-ask: no, we have staging already :)12:52
dobeythis isn't for staging/testing. it's for side loading apps from a different server which do not conform to Ubuntu's phone/tablet security policies12:52
t-askis it camparable to f-droid ?12:53
=== _salem is now known as salem_
matv1dobey an app not being able to background proces, has nothing to do with security12:55
swalladge^ hopefully background process support will be added - i mean you currently can't even be notified of new emails without opening the email app for example12:56
swalladge*added soon, that is12:57
matv1but maybe we shouldnt get into all that one again ;)12:57
dobeymatv1: yes it does12:58
mzanettino :)12:58
matv1omg here we go again :D me and my big mouth12:59
dobeypretty sure DoS is a security concern :)12:59
matv1the internet is a security concern13:00
mzanettiin any case, t-ask, swalladge, I'd welcome a syncthing app in openstore13:03
swalladgemzanetti: openstore?13:03
mzanettithere's the owncloud sync one already which does pretty much the same, could be used as a template13:03
mzanettiswalladge, https://open.uappexplorer.com/13:03
matv1dobey lets let people look up the relevant threads on the mailing list for the positions in this discussion ok ;)13:05
t-askmzanetti: I would like to seee it as an official app, as it is working really nice and everyone I recomemnd buying an Ubuntu Touch device would be able to install it themselfs.13:05
dobeymatv1: don't need to.13:06
dobeyt-ask: we would all like to see a great many things as official apps :)13:06
t-askmzanetti: I don't know of owncloud sync. I assume it is not easy to install on Windows or android. not sure.13:06
matv1dobey i know you dont. I was saying others interested may feel so inclined13:07
swalladgemzanetti: oh that looks pretty neat :) kind of looks like an f-droid for ubuntu13:07
t-askdobey: a well working and secure file-sync would be something essential. While I defnitely know what you mean with your remark13:07
mzanettit-ask, not really sure how windows or android matter in this discussion13:10
dobeymzanetti: presumably because one would want to sync them as well13:10
swalladgeis it possible to program for ubuntu touch on another linux system (other than ubuntu)?13:10
mzanettioh, sure, there are clients for all of them13:10
dobeyswalladge: sure13:11
swalladgehow about archlinux? I've found a couple of relevant bits on the aur, but can't work out how to get the sdk installed13:11
dobeyinstall the sdk snap13:12
dobeyor use an ubuntu vm or chroot to install/run the sdk13:12
mzanettiyou don't really need the sdk anyways, but the further you go away from the official guidance, the more you are expected to be able to solve things yourself13:12
mzanettiyeah, if you're not a total linux expert, I'd really recommend an ubuntu VM13:13
dobeyor yeah, just don't use the sdk13:13
swalladgeah ok13:13
* dobey uses emacs/shell13:13
swalladgei'd still need the libraries and stuff to create clicks, etc. though right?13:13
mzanettihere's a howto I wrote before the SDK existed: http://notyetthere.org/on-manually-creating-click-packages/13:13
mzanettiyou need "click", yes13:14
mzanettiI can't find click in aur.archlinux.org13:14
dobeyswalladge: you just need the click tool to create clicks, and the click-reviewers-tool or whatever it's called, to ensure your click passes the validation13:14
mzanettihowever, worst case, you could copy the compiled binaries to a ubuntu phone, and package it up on the phone, as click is installed there13:15
dobeyyou need all the runtime stuff of course, if you want to run the thing on your PC13:15
swalladgeaha nice thanks :D13:15
swalladgeis there a snap for click?13:15
dobeythere is work on a snap for the sdk which should include everything needed to develop apps13:16
t-askmaybe docker image?13:20
mterry ogra_, pitti: (sorry for duplicate notice maybe, I'm having IRC problems): I'm noticing that Touch images don't support ACLs?  Like, udev devices don't let you setfacl them, and the ext4 mounts don't have the usual default mount option of 'acl' -- do you know why / where that's normally determined?13:22
mterry I'm most interested in udev, but will take any pointers13:22
ogra_mterry, hmm, not sure, but dont you need kernel support for that ?13:23
mterryogra_, probably -- are the Touch kernels that old?  I didn't think ACL was a new thing13:23
pittimterry: right, I suppose no ACL support on the fs you are trying to use it on, with that kernel13:24
ogra_the kernels are old and their config is derived from an original android config ... so it could well be that ACL support is missing if android didnt originally use it13:24
mterryogra_, pitti: Ah right...  the kernel could support it, but we don't turn it on when building13:24
ogra_the filesystems should just be ext413:25
pittimterry: you said udev, so I suppose you want/need those on /dev, i. e. devtmpfs?13:25
ogra_(either as loop mounted img files or as real ext4 partitions)13:25
mterryogra_, yeah.  I could remount the filesystems with acl flag maybe, but it's missing from the default mount options (set presumably when the filesystem is created -- normal desktop filesystems have default flags for acl, but Touch doesn't)13:25
mterrypitti, right13:25
pittimterry: try something like "sudo setfacl -m u:www-data:w /dev/zero" and see if that fails?13:25
mterrypitti, it does13:26
ogra_that would be something you need to fix in the initrd13:26
mterrypitti, operation not supported13:26
pittidevtmpfs without acl, yay13:26
ogra_we generate fstab during boot in the initrd13:26
ogra_so any generic  mount options need to go into that code13:26
mterryogra_, ok.  I may leave that alone for now (I'm more worried about no acl in devtmpfs), but when / if I need acl for ext4 too, that's where I'll start.  Thanks  :)13:27
=== chihchun is now known as chihchun_afk
ogra_initramfs-tools-ubuntu-touch is the package that carries the code13:27
mterrypitti, I assume devtmpfs is all in-kernel? And that ACL support is not super configurable (i.e. if the kernel had it, it would turn it on)13:27
mterryogra_, ah cool, another package I'll squirrel away in my notes  :)13:28
pittimterry: yes, /dev has been populated by the kernel (devtmpfs) for many years13:28
pittiI don't see a CONFIG_*_ACL for it13:28
pittioh, could be CONFIG_TMPFS_POSIX_ACL=y13:29
pittias devtmpfs is a "magic" tmpfs13:29
ogra_i guess the kernel team would know the exact option you need13:29
pittimterry: there's a high chance that this is off?13:29
pittior even CONFIG_FS_POSIX_ACL=y13:29
mterrypitti, yeah doc for that flag indicates it affects /dev13:29
ogra_in general i think we should just copy all ACL options from the generic kernel though13:29
ogra_to have similar behaviour in the end13:30
mterrypitti, ogra_: Agreed.  OK.  I'll go talk to kernel folks then13:30
* mterry looks up who manages the touch kernel13:30
pittido we even have this option to change the config?13:30
ogra_we build the kernel, so indeed we have the ability :)13:31
pittiI thought on many devices we'd use the kernel as-is13:31
pitti(from android)13:31
ogra_(we also patch apparmor in)13:31
ogra_not as is ...13:31
ogra_it is pretty ubuntuized13:31
ogra_but options are missing if nobody uses a feature and complains13:31
ogra_(i guess nobody has simply played with ACLs on the phones yet, so it went unnoticed)13:32
mterryogra_, I think early configs may have just given phablet user whatever groups/permissions they wanted.  Early configs didn't even use logind as I recall, so its auto-ACLs wouldn't have even helped.  So no one noticed until I want to use a lightdm user  :)13:34
t-askis the Aquarius M 4.5 32bit?13:35
ogra_t-ask, yes13:35
t-askI tried uname -a but no success .)13:35
Ota12When will i be released ?13:36
ogra_Ota12, nobody told you that you were delayed by a week ?13:37
ogra_poor thing13:37
ogra_t-ask, uname -a should spit our armv7l or some such13:38
Ota12Ouch no one told me ;(13:38
* ogra_ thinks all OTAs should better subscribe to the mailing list then ... and read sil2100's landing team emails regulary13:38
dobeywell uname -a prints out a lot. uname -m would print armv7l13:39
ogra_but -a spits that out alongside too13:39
Ota12ogra_: thanks! Now i know i will be sitting waiting for another week.13:39
t-askogra_: it does arm7, while that didn't tell my the arch. nevermind, just didn't find the string I was searhcing for :)13:39
dobeyogra_: i wasn't stating that for *your* benefit ;)13:39
ogra_you never state things for my benefit ... so mean13:40
s`is there any equivalent app to iOS Wallet?14:26
dobeys`: you mean apple pay?14:36
=== dandrader is now known as dandrader|afk
=== yakaar1 is now known as yakaar
=== dandrader|afk is now known as dandrader
mimecargood evening17:38
mimecarI'll start programming for Ubuntu touch and have some doubts. Can I ask them in the channel or is there a more specific channel?17:49
k1lstart here mimecar17:50
k1lif its more specific for another channel people can direct you17:50
mimecarIs it easier to start with a scope and then move to a native application or does not matter?17:51
k1li dont know about that. but iirc there is a beginners development guide somewhere on the website for the scope and the native apps.18:01
mimecarI am checking ubuntu developer portal18:02
mimecarthere are some broken links on scope tutorials18:04
mimecarit is strange, links are working now18:05
mimecarserver was not redirecting the link18:06
dobeyi wouldn't say it's easier to start with a scope18:12
dobey#ubuntu-app-devel would be the "specific channel" for app devel questions though18:12
mimecaryou can not access user data if network connection is used on scopes18:13
mimecari am going to check that channel, thanks dobey18:13
dobeyyou can't access user data from scopes18:15
dobeywell, you can't access user data for other apps18:15
dobeyif you have an app and a scope in the same package, they can share data18:15
mimecarthen I should use content hubs, should not?18:16
dobeylikewise, apps don't have direct access to the data of other apps, either18:16
dobeyno, you wouldn't really use content-hub in a scope. you can use it in app, to get data from other apps which allow sharing their data via content-hub18:16
mimecarthen scope or apps should get their data by themselves18:17
JanChm, my phone forgot my U1 login today or yesterday?18:37
mimecarJanC, can you login with your account again?18:39
JanCyeah, could log in again, just strange that it would forget18:41
dobeyit didn't "forget" it18:41
JanCso what happened then?18:42
dobeyi don't know exactly, because i don't know what you were doing that triggered it. but due to the way the accounts system works, if the server replies that it thinks the token is invalid, then we have to delete it and rquire reauthentication, in order to provide the designed UI interaction in various places18:44
JanCI did nothing, I guess; just checked for updates today & it asked for email & password again, while that still worked fine somewhere 1-2 days ago...18:50
JanCnothing unusual, I mean18:50
dobeysure, i don't mean it's that you were doing something unusual, just that there are several things which use the u1 account, and stating exactly what happened is difficult without knowing what you were doing at the time18:52
JanCcould a network issue trigger this somehow?18:53
Paddy_NIHas anyone here been able to get the bq Flash tool to work on Ubuntu?18:54
dobeyPaddy_NI: you mean the mtk tool?18:54
Paddy_NIIt never worked for me on 15.10 and it is still not working on 16.04.18:55
Paddy_NIYes the MTK tool18:55
dobeyi used it once a long time ago, but that was likely when i was on 14.0418:55
dobeywhat's the issue?18:55
Paddy_NIIt does appear to detect the phone18:55
Paddy_NIDoes not18:55
dobeyoh no idea. maybe try different usb cables/ports18:56
Paddy_NIDid all that18:56
Paddy_NIWas the first thing I did18:56
mimecardo the phone appears on log then you connnect it to the computer? (with the phone turned off)18:57
Paddy_NImimecar, Not that I am aware of, which log file should I check?18:58
Paddy_NIIs there any way I can actively monitor that file whilst I plug the device in?18:59
Paddy_NIWill there be any undesirable consequences if I remove "modemmanager"?19:05
Paddy_NII wonder if this is why http://www.mibqyyo.com/en-articles/2015/09/16/ubuntu-android-installation-process-for-bq-aquaris-e4-5-and-e5/#/vanilla/discussion/embed/?vanilla_discussion_id=019:05
Paddy_NImimecar, How do I check?19:06
mimecarmodem manager for 14.04 and 14.1019:06
mimecari'm checking how can you read the log on your version of ubuntu19:06
Paddy_NIYeah I read that19:06
Paddy_NISo far as I can see "modemmanager" is still present and I am unaware if the compatibility issue has been resolved19:07
dobeydo you have a modem to manage?19:08
Paddy_NIJust using this ThinkPad19:09
Paddy_NIWifi and occasional ethernet19:09
mimecarPaddy_NI, can you check if this command works for you?19:09
dobeyshould be ok to purge modemmanager19:09
mimecartail -f /var/log/message19:09
Paddy_NIdobey, Cool19:09
Paddy_NImimecar, About to try it, shall I run that first then plug in the phone?19:10
Paddy_NIIt is switched off as you mentioned19:10
Paddy_NImimecar, tail: cannot open '/var/log/message' for reading: No such file or directory19:10
Paddy_NItail: cannot open '/var/log/message' for reading: No such file or directory19:11
dobeyit should be syslog not messages19:11
mimecarthen Ubuntu should use another file19:11
dobeyor just plug the phone in and run "dmseg|tail -10"19:11
mimecartest it...19:12
dobeymimecar: "/var/log/message" is wrong on any version of linux. it used to be "/var/log/messages" but now it's /var/log/syslog, for the system log19:12
Paddy_NIIt appears to be detected19:12
mimecardobey, do you get the same content on syslog?19:12
dobeymimecar: "messages" is just what an older syslog used. rsyslog uses /var/log/syslog19:13
mimecardobey, are you  using a bq device? idVendor does not match19:16
mimecarPaddy_NI, the last sentence is  for you19:16
Paddy_NImimecar, Yes it's a bq E4.519:17
Paddy_NIThat explains why it always says that "krillin" has not been found when trying to use ubuntu device flash19:17
mimecarcan you switch on your phone and use lsusb ?19:17
mimecarcheck if idVendor is 2a4719:18
Paddy_NImimecar, just a sec19:18
Paddy_NImimecar, Oddly I get this "Bus 001 Device 007: ID 2a47:201d"19:19
Paddy_NIEverything else has extra information listed alongside it19:19
Paddy_NINot that though19:19
mimecarthat's the correct idVendor19:20
Paddy_NImimecar, Like so http://paste.ubuntu.com/20346626/19:20
Paddy_NImimecar, I originally used the MTK tool on a windows system to flash the official Android version on to the bq e4.519:21
Paddy_NIMonths ago and it worked beautifully, however ever since I have not been able to switch it back to Ubuntu Touch19:21
mimecarDid you used Firmware upgrade  / Download options on SPFlash  Tool?19:22
Paddy_NImimecar, Yes as the other options would have resulted in the imei needing fixing19:23
Paddy_NII did thorough research before I flashed19:23
Paddy_NII actually contacted bq and received very exacting information19:23
Paddy_NIHowever when contacted about putting Ubuntu back on they become incredibly vague19:23
Paddy_NIIt's basically just a canned response19:24
Paddy_NIYou and a few others on this channel have been most helpful19:24
Paddy_NIAs always19:24
mimecarcan you flash ubuntu firmware with windows?19:24
Paddy_NImimecar, Windows fails to get the stupid vcom driver19:24
dobeymaybe, if you run the bash on ubuntu on windows 10 thing19:25
dobeybut generally, no19:25
mimecarthen, you installed drivers on windows, flashed Android19:25
mimecarand you can not flash again ubuntu on the same computer, is that correct?19:25
Paddy_NImimecar, Yes on an old since gone installation of windows 719:25
Paddy_NII removed it months ago19:26
Paddy_NII decided a VM was better19:26
dobeywell, flashing ubuntu would probably be fine; but it requires different partitioning on the phone, which is what the mtk tool is required when going from android to ubuntu on the bq devices19:26
Paddy_NIdobey, Exactly19:26
Paddy_NII just wish that the tool would detect the phone19:27
Paddy_NII wonder if the modemmanager was the problem19:27
Paddy_NII also googled "usb 1-1.1: New USB device found, idVendor=0e8d, idProduct=2000"19:27
mimecarI don't think the problem is with modem manager19:27
Paddy_NIA number of interesting results show up19:27
Paddy_NImimecar, Ok19:27
mimecarSPFlash Tool should work on windows19:27
Paddy_NIYes it SHOULD!19:28
Paddy_NII wonder if I need a bare metal install of windows19:28
mimecardo a new device appears on windows when you connect the phone turned off?19:28
Paddy_NII set the usb filters in vbox correctly yet it does not get detected whilst switched off19:29
dobeyit shoudl work on ubuntu too19:29
Paddy_NIIt does not detect it when switched off in windows19:29
Paddy_NIThe device manager does not even blink19:29
mimecarPaddy_NI, can you check it on a native windows installation?19:29
Paddy_NImimecar, hmm... That might be a problem19:30
mimecarit should work on ubuntu as dobey said19:30
Paddy_NIBeing the operative word19:30
mimecari think there's some problem with idVendor with the phone switched off19:30
Paddy_NIYes me too19:30
mimecarthen, system can not detect your phone19:31
dobeyPaddy_NI: are you running the windows spflash tool in a vm, or the linux version natively?19:31
Paddy_NIdobey, I have tried both19:31
Paddy_NII shall return to this19:31
Paddy_NIYou are both awesome19:31
dobeyi think your phone needs to be at the bootlaoder screen to use the tool19:31
dobeynot off, and not in the OS19:32
Paddy_NIPerhaps, although I have tried so many variations19:32
Paddy_NIThe hidden recovery menu, fastboot, bootloader, off, on19:32
Paddy_NII even wore a tinfoil hat once or twice19:32
mimecarif you can not flash ubuntu again19:32
mimecarwould be posible sent the phone to bq?19:33
Paddy_NII may have to create a shrine to popey and start praying19:33
Paddy_NImimecar, That might be problematic given that it was a gift from a developer friend of mine19:33
Paddy_NIHe gets this stull all the time19:33
Paddy_NIHe does not use anything other than a windows toolchain now so just gave me this boxed unopened at the time19:34
Paddy_NII might ask him to send it back actually19:34
Paddy_NI*stuff not *stull19:35
Paddy_NII am curious as to what stull is though19:35
mimecarif you can not use ubuntu neither windows virtualized19:35
mimecaryou should look for a native windows19:35
Paddy_NII will perhaps install windows on an old box and see if it still misbehaves19:36
Paddy_NIFIngers crossed19:36
Paddy_NIThanks for the help any way guys, I do appreciate it19:36
Paddy_NILater, bye :-)19:36
mimecarbye Paddy_NI19:37
deobshi all! does the samsung galaxy mega works with ubuntu19:50
deobstouch ?19:50
dobey!devices | deobs19:51
ubot5deobs: You can find the full list of devices, official images, community images, and works in progress at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Devices19:51
hellslingerhey guys, I'm wondering how I can install things like gcc on my m10?20:06
philippHi, I have a problem with my MX4. It does not connect to my wifi anymore. Can anyone help?20:09
dobeyhellslinger: https://askubuntu.com/questions/620740/recommended-way-to-install-regularcli-deb-packages-on-ubuntu-phone/623311#62331120:11
=== JanC is now known as Guest9881
=== JanC_ is now known as JanC
swalladgephilipp, can you still see your wifi network listed?22:11
swalladgeI'm having a problem with my M10 - it wont output to hdmi. doesnt even seem to noticewhen i plug it in22:17
pmcgowanswalladge, is this a setup that worked before22:24
swalladgeno, first time i've tried it22:24
pmcgowanare you using some sort of adapter and does it need separate power?22:25
swalladgedirect microHDMI-HDMI cable - tried with two different cables and a tv and a computer monitor22:27
pmcgowanthere are some reported issues with certain monitors22:28
ubot5Launchpad bug 1574635 in Mir "Sometimes, the HDMI in Samsung and other monitors/TV is not working when connected to the M10" [Undecided,Expired]22:28
ubot5Launchpad bug 1576039 in Canonical System Image "frieza fails to negotiate with some hdmi monitors" [Medium,Incomplete]22:28
pmcgowanswalladge, hmm you tried multiple monitors22:29
swalladgeyes - two22:31
swalladgethanks i'll check out. those bug reports22:31
pmcgowanswalladge, good and add your logs if it looks similar22:31

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