ahoneybunLocutusOfBorg: could we get a LP request on this: https://launchpadlibrarian.net/276000721/trojita_0.7.0+git20160728-0ubuntu1~ubuntu16.04~ppa1.dsc00:45
ahoneybuntsimonq2 of Lubuntu might want it as well00:46
=== juliank_ is now known as juliank
jbichaahoneybun: I think it would be best if you filed a needs-packaging bug for that since it's not in Debian or Ubuntu01:58
ahoneybunit's packaged01:58
ahoneybunit's in that ppa01:58
jbicharight, but it needs to go through the new queue01:58
jbichaand it's often faster to get it in Ubuntu if you can find someone (like the Debian Qt team) to sponsor it into Debian first02:01
ahoneybunthis sponsor thing is hold hundreds of uploads we have02:11
jbichaif your packages were in sync with Debian, then a lot of the work would get done through autosync02:21
jbichaI've considered syncing qt/kde stuff but then I see that you're trying to maintain the packages in git which I don't have write access to02:21
jbichabut many times there aren't any real differences in the Kubuntu packages02:22
ahoneybunjbicha: we have to get sponsored to upload new versions to the archive02:22
ahoneybunfor this there are02:22
ahoneybunwe need to upload them to get Plasma 5.7.2 out02:23
ahoneybunQt 5.6.1 is needed for 5.702:23
ahoneybunwe need a MOTU to come into #kubuntu-devel02:23
ahoneybunwe have no one to upload atm02:23
tsimonq2ahoneybun: how so?03:17
ahoneybunthe trojita email client03:17
* tsimonq2 checks if it's in the LXQt metapackage03:17
tsimonq2ahoneybun: that's our plan in the blueprints but the blueprint is marked as blocked and it's not in the metapackage, I'll ask Julien, but otherwise \o/03:21
ahoneybuntsimonq2: clive has it built for xenial and yakkety in his ppa03:22
tsimonq2ahoneybun: great :)03:37
tsimonq2ahoneybun: is it not in the Ubuntu archive? :O03:37
ahoneybunnope guess not03:37
Mirvpitti: morning. could I get all-proposed for https://requests.ci-train.ubuntu.com/static/britney/ticket-1712/landing-070-yakkety/excuses.html and https://requests.ci-train.ubuntu.com/static/britney/ticket-1715/landing-080-yakkety/excuses.html , and restart of seemingly stuck "Test in progress" tests at https://requests.ci-train.ubuntu.com/static/britney/ticket-1715/landing-080-xenial/excuses.html ?05:17
cpaelzergood morning05:30
Mirv@pilot in05:35
=== udevbot changed the topic of #ubuntu-devel to: Xenial (16.04.1) Released! | Archive: open | Devel of Ubuntu (not support or app devel) | build failures: http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/ftbfs/ | #ubuntu for support and discussion of precise-xenial | #ubuntu-app-devel for app development on Ubuntu http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment | See #ubuntu-bugs for http://bit.ly/lv8soi | Patch Pilots: Mirv, mterry
pittiGood morning05:50
tsimonq2o/ pitti, how are you? :)05:50
pittiI'm great, thanks! last two days before summer vacation :)05:50
tsimonq2pitti: less than a month until the end of summer vacation and my first day of high school05:52
pittithat's still lots of of time to do stuff!05:54
tsimonq2it is! :)05:54
pittiMirv: done05:57
pittiMirv: btw, when that happens while I'm away, please ask L_aney, i_nfinity, s_eb128, d_idrocks, or s_langasek to run something like "retry-autopkgtest-regressions -s yakkety --ci-train-silo 080 --ci-train-ticket 1715 --all-proposed" on snakefruit05:59
pittior --state RUNNING05:59
tsimonq2pitti: you acutally pinged Steve, he gets pinged on his last name too I think :P06:02
pittiwell, I tried to be quiet :)06:03
Mirvpitti: noted and much appreciated!06:15
Mirvtedg: hi! could you take care of the click upload asked for in bug #1496292 so that we could unblock many things in yakkety? tsimonq2 / LXQt folks would appreciate among else :)06:35
ubottubug 1496292 in packagekit (Ubuntu) "Needs to be ported to packagekit 1" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/149629206:35
tsimonq2yeah, lubutnu-qt-desktop can't be installed without it06:37
acheronuknor can plasma-discover06:42
tsimonq2so the Kubuntu folks might appreciate it too :)06:42
=== davmor2_ is now known as davmor2
cpaelzerntp has issues exporting their code history https://github.com/ntp-project/ntp/issues/1508:07
cpaelzervia its archive I can only get full releases, where patches are obviously mangled together08:07
cpaelzerthe next "best" (not) option is to check their bitkeeper08:07
cpaelzerbut for obvious reasons I have none, and I even fail to get one setup for my personal account if I would08:08
cpaelzerso if one still has a dusty but working bk setup please ping me as I'm trying to get a fix referred from a ntp bug for an SUR08:08
Unit193Can't just look http://bk1.ntp.org/ntp-stable/?DATE=-6M..&PAGE=changes ?08:20
cpaelzerThat will do, thanks Unit19308:23
cpaelzerI was looking for alternatives already - that is one that works - Thanks!08:24
LocutusOfBorgdo anybody have any update about qt5 migration?09:15
cpaelzermdeslaur: I come by ntp for a functional SRU anyway atm - there are quite a few CVEs reported - I wanted to discuss if I should include some in your opinion09:21
cpaelzermdeslaur: sorry to bother you but according to the changelog you were the last to add CVE fixes to the package09:22
cpaelzermdeslaur: looking at http://support.ntp.org/bin/view/Main/SecurityNotice#Recent_Vulnerabilities CVE-2016-4957 is high, CVE-2015-5300 is only medium but seems very easy to backport09:25
ubottuntpd in NTP before 4.2.8p8 allows remote attackers to cause a denial of service (daemon crash) via a crypto-NAK packet.  NOTE: this vulnerability exists because of an incorrect fix for CVE-2016-1547. (http://cve.mitre.org/cgi-bin/cvename.cgi?name=CVE-2016-4957)09:25
ubottu** RESERVED ** This candidate has been reserved by an organization or individual that will use it when announcing a new security problem.  When the candidate has been publicized, the details for this candidate will be provided. (http://cve.mitre.org/cgi-bin/cvename.cgi?name=CVE-2015-5300)09:25
cpaelzermdeslaur: there are several more at medium, but well that is why I ask you or other security Team members to let me know09:25
LocutusOfBorgI think #ubuntu-hardened is the best place to discuss ntp CVEs :)09:28
cpaelzerwill do so on top, thanks LocutusOfBorg09:29
LocutusOfBorgprobably all security Ubuntu folks follow here too, but hardened is better because of low messages numbers09:29
cpaelzeryeah I agree, I can leave the message "out there" as long as I test my SRU09:32
cpaelzerpitti: filed the nplan bugs and notified a few IBMers that I really want to pass that spec (it is more their than my job after all) :-)10:03
cpaelzerpitti: thanks for the feedback10:03
andyrockseb128: https://code.launchpad.net/~azzar1/nautilus/higidpi-desktop-view-margins/+merge/30162110:57
andyrocki also proposed a fix upstream10:57
LocutusOfBorgpitti, hi, do you have two seconds to look at runit package?11:13
LocutusOfBorgshould we drop the upstart integration?11:13
LocutusOfBorgto merge the current debian package I should have to create a new runit-upstart package, and maybe it is time to stop that?11:14
Laneyandyrock: I can push those upstream if you want11:14
Son_Gokuwhat problem does netplan solve that wicked doesn't already solve?11:18
Odd_BlokeSon_Goku: My understand of netplan is that it's declarative config that's used to configure existing networking things; I wouldn't expect there to be a daemon running.11:25
Odd_BlokeSon_Goku: But I don't know a great deal about netplan. :)11:25
Son_Gokuwicked works pretty similarly to netplan in that it essentially obsoletes old style configuration11:26
Son_Gokubut wicked's configuration can be validated, since it's XML11:26
Son_Gokubut critically, because configuration is offered via D-Bus, you can have an arbitrary input mechanism for it11:27
Son_Gokuthe daemon is completely optional11:28
Son_Gokualternatively, NetworkManager itself is an alternative mechanism to old-style networking11:30
Son_Gokuthough I wonder if the reason this is such a problem is because Debian-based distributions' /etc/network/interfaces isn't well-supported in NM11:31
Son_GokuNetworkManager can read /etc/sysconfig/network-scripts/ifcfg-* files (which are INI style declarative files) or its own keyfile format11:32
Son_Gokuin Fedora, for example, NetworkManager is preconfigured through ifcfg scripts11:32
Son_Gokuerr, ifcfg-* files11:33
Son_GokuI guess my question is, what problem is netplan trying to solve?11:34
Son_Gokuthat no other solution hasn't already done11:34
xnoxpitti, see Son_Goku ^ above to discuss netplan vs wicked11:38
Son_Gokumaybe I'm just used to how things work in Fedora and Mageia, but it seems weird that centralized configuration is a problem11:40
Son_Gokuadmittedly, in Fedora, we use NetworkManager everywhere (even on Server) since recent versions of NetworkManager have become quite lightweight11:41
Son_Gokuand it supports a large variety of use cases11:42
Son_Gokuthe SUSE guys opted to create wicked to solve their problems, and I think that partially has to do with YaST11:43
xnoxi think many years ago we did try wicked and connman for the netbook remix project, but that was literarly years ago.11:44
xnoxon ubuntu side we have our own legacies to deal with =) there is ifupdown, there is networkd, there is networkmanager, and debian is trying for ifupdown2 (non starter for us, as it's in python), and then there is a lot of cloud/container configs.11:44
Son_Gokuxnox, I think you're thinking of wicd11:46
Son_Gokuwhich I do recall you using for Ubuntu Netbook11:46
xnoxSon_Goku, probably.11:46
xnoxnever mind then =)11:46
xnoxin general i think we want to go with networkd in most cases, but it's config is crap. And whenever one wants WiFi or 3G/LTE or even hotplug usb one is better off with networkmanager.11:46
Son_GokuI'm surprised no one wrote a networkd config backend for NM yet11:46
Son_Gokuthat would allow you to seamlessly use both11:46
xnoxand then there is a bunch of mid-higher level things to expose too, w.r.t. system containers networking (e.g. lxd / openvz size) and nested networking (juju namespaces)11:47
Son_Gokuthe latest NetworkManager releases have been focused on dealing with those problems specifically11:47
Son_Gokuhell, with NM 1.2, I was able to migrate to using NetworkManager to maintain my container networking11:48
xnoxbut networkmanager is well, crap =) -> not official stance, but just my personal opinion. But it is the best we have for Wifi & 3G/LTE.11:48
Son_Gokuwhat's wrong with NM?11:48
Son_GokuI know people have bitched about NetworkManager in the past, but the latest releases have been pretty solid11:50
xnoxdhcp / dns, i've been on weird networks where it did not do the right thing, and one ends up shooting oneself in the foot. I'm sure if i used nmcli and/or dbus api to the spawned dhcp daemon I would know what to do. Also it is quite a bit heavy, I had partially booting systems where nm wouldn't start leaving me without network.11:56
xnoxthese days I find iproute2 an excellent network configuration manager =)))))11:56
xnoxwith iproute2 i could finally start to comprehend a little bit as to what is going on =)11:57
xnoxbut i am just a basic user. not a sysadmin at all.11:57
infinitySon_Goku: Personally, any time anyone tells me that a config file in XML is a *good* thing, I run away.  And that's coming from someone who finds ISC config files readable.11:58
Son_GokuI didn't say it's good for humans11:58
Son_Gokuand even I don't manipulate the XML by hand myself11:58
infinityThen you'd immediately stop the conversation for most old Debian hacks.11:59
infinity"run a thing to spit out a config" isn't our style. :P11:59
infinity(Same reason people like me also hate virt-manager)11:59
xnoxi have seen libxml segfault in a stable release =)11:59
seb128Laney, if you want to handle nautilus please do11:59
infinitySon_Goku: Anyhow, the real answer to your question is that nplan probably doesn't solve a problem that hasn't been solved, it just solves it differently.  Yay, diversity.12:00
infinityAnd my experiences with networking on Fedora/RH have never been pleasant on complex setups...12:00
Son_Gokuoddly enough, I've had the opposite experience12:01
infinityThat's how anecdotes go. ;)12:01
Son_Gokucomplex networking using the ifcfg* files has been considerably easier than network/interfaces :)12:01
infinityifcfg looks easier on the surface, but it seems amazingly racey or something, cause I have machines that seem to want to only have a network on 2/3 boots, etc.12:01
infinityBut that's backend implentation, of course, not the syntax's fault.12:02
infinityAs for syntax, meh.  We happen to have a man at the helm who loves yaml.12:02
infinityWhich I'm sure you noticed at the snappy sprint. :P12:03
Son_Gokuyeah, I did :)12:03
infinitySon_Goku: I'm somewhat biased, because I happened to be part of the hallway conversation that became the spec for nplan, but I do like the concept of "this only handles config, and hands off to backends", since placing all your eggs in a networkd or networkmanager basket is just asking for more work down the road to make $daemon support your use-case.12:06
Son_Gokuwell, that's part of the reason why I like the ifcfg-* scripts12:07
Son_Gokuerr files12:07
Son_Gokubecause they are supported by multiple network management tools12:07
infinityYup, but the odds of them ever showing up in a Debian derivative are slim.12:08
infinityIf pitti can sell Debian on nplan, then we're back to a "half the world does it this way, and the other half another way" thing, and that's not awful.12:08
Son_Gokudoesn't take much for them to show up12:08
infinity(Oddly, that's one of the reasons I wished Debian would have gone with upstart, just to keep competition alive and upstreams on their toes :P)12:08
infinityBut Debian developers seems blissfully unaware that they (or their derivatives) run on more than half the Linux machines in the world and they have a lot more power than they think.12:09
infinitySon_Goku: By "show up", I meant in the default install, of course.  Debian ships all sorts of options, because that's the sort of place they are.12:09
Son_Gokuwell, at least in NetworkManager, it's a configure argument away to support the ifcfg-* files12:10
infinityI guess I have to amend that "more than half the Linux machines" with "(not counting Android)" these days.12:10
Son_Gokuas NM itself supports multiple config backends12:10
Son_GokuI don't really see a reason why configuration needs to be done differently everywhere :/12:11
infinityOddly, Android may have finally given us all a reason to call classic distros "GNU/Linux" and RMS wins.12:11
Son_Gokuespecially for something as critical as networking12:11
infinityIf we assume the "GNU" means glibc. :P12:11
infinitySon_Goku: I never saw why it needed to be different everywhere either, but I could never talk RedHat into the beauty of interfaces(5).12:12
infinitySon_Goku: And, at the end of the day, that's the attitude we have to contend with that leads to NIH in distros (and it's sometimes a good thing, sometimes not).  Broadly, the RHish and Debianish camps have their own ways to do lots of things, and when someone says "we should all do it the same way", they're really saying "we should all do it the way I prefer".12:13
infinitySon_Goku: Which doesn't sell well.12:13
infinitySon_Goku: It's the duck army and the bunny army.12:13
* Son_Goku shrugs12:13
=== _salem is now known as salem_
Son_Gokuinfinity, I gave up quite a long time ago on persuading people on things like this12:20
Son_Gokunowadays, I just ask about it, present technical counterpoints, and hope for the best12:21
* infinity nods.12:21
infinityMostly, I just sit here and grumble about having to learn a new thing after 15+ years, but hopefully I'll survive the turmoil.12:23
xnoxinfinity, https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-MV7R08WGNZY/UTIAf39b-3I/AAAAAAAANJo/uLxr73--TRA/w497-h373/gb.gif -> duck/bunny armies playing ingress12:33
xnoxSon_Goku, infinity: it does sound like we are still in this situation https://xkcd.com/927/12:34
xnoxcaption needs updating with usb-C and thunderbolt12:34
xnoxinfinity, sbuild regular resolver fails to resolve libicu-dev (> 57) when building with experimental enabled (as created with $ mk-sbuild experimental) --build-dep-resolver=aptitude "fixes" this and correctly pulls in libicu from experimental. I recall you have previously said that one doesn't really need aptitude resolver, is there a way to selectively pull build-deps from experimental, when needed, with sbuild using apt resolver? or do i need to12:48
xnoxfiddle with pinning?12:48
* xnox believes mk-sbuild should have done the right thing for experimental distro to work with apt resolver12:50
infinityxnox: You'd need to pin experimental to 500, but then it won't be selective.12:51
xnoxIn http://aerostitch.github.io/linux_and_unix/debian/sbuild_with_experimental_distribution.html12:52
infinityxnox: ie: this is what our buildds do for backports:12:52
infinity$ cat etc/apt/preferences.d/backports12:52
infinityPackage: *12:52
infinityPin: release a=*-backports12:52
infinityPin-Priority: 50012:52
xnoxit is pinned: 900 -> unstable; 800 -> experimental. I wonder if it makes the build-deps selective or not.12:52
* xnox ponders if i want selective experimental, or all-in-one / all-you-can eat deal12:52
Mirvpitti: is it that if I rerun https://requests.ci-train.ubuntu.com/static/britney/ticket-1712/landing-070-yakkety/excuses.html it's again without proposed? could you rerun them all again with proposed? earlier today there was some gtk related breakage in proposed.12:53
pittiMirv: oh, is that gtk3 uninstallability fixed now?12:53
Mirvpitti: yes it'd look like that to me, Laney's upload fixed it. among else my https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/uim/1:1.8.6+gh20160630.0.c408e95-1build1 now built.12:54
pittiMirv: yes, the retry links don't use all-proposed12:54
pittiMirv: retried12:55
Mirvok thank you again12:55
pittino problem; /me retries the apport build as well12:55
LocutusOfBorgsomething is broken in yakkety, but I can't figure out what12:56
LocutusOfBorgdh: error: 'hardening' flag found but 'hardening-wrapper' not installed: No such file or directory12:56
LocutusOfBorgisn't picked up by debhelper?12:56
infinityLocutusOfBorg: That's from dpkg, actually.  And not exactly new.13:02
infinityPotentially code we should rip out at some point, though.13:03
LocutusOfBorgbut is a bug in dpkg or not?13:03
infinityLocutusOfBorg: It might be a bug, it's not new in yakkety.13:03
infinityIt comes from when we supported hardening options and Debian didn't.  I should tear that all out, I think.13:04
infinityRight after 14.04.5 flies.13:04
infinityOr maybe while.13:04
LocutusOfBorgBTW anybody will merge dpkg?13:06
LocutusOfBorgI can provide a debdiff if I have somebody looking at it :)13:06
infinityLocutusOfBorg: I merge it.13:07
=== Mirv changed the topic of #ubuntu-devel to: Xenial (16.04.1) Released! | Archive: open | Devel of Ubuntu (not support or app devel) | build failures: http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/ftbfs/ | #ubuntu for support and discussion of precise-xenial | #ubuntu-app-devel for app development on Ubuntu http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment | See #ubuntu-bugs for http://bit.ly/lv8soi | Patch Pilots: Mirv
MirvI hope mterry won't mind me ending his 5-day patch pilot13:08
infinityLocutusOfBorg: I prefer to let it cook in Debian, unless there's a killer feature we need.13:08
Mirv@pilot out13:45
=== udevbot changed the topic of #ubuntu-devel to: Xenial (16.04.1) Released! | Archive: open | Devel of Ubuntu (not support or app devel) | build failures: http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/ftbfs/ | #ubuntu for support and discussion of precise-xenial | #ubuntu-app-devel for app development on Ubuntu http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment | See #ubuntu-bugs for http://bit.ly/lv8soi | Patch Pilots:
* dholbach hugs Mirv 13:53
mhall119Mirv: ping13:56
Mirvmhall119: eodish pong13:56
* Mirv hugs the pilot hugger13:57
mhall119Mirv: tomorrow then, or when you have time, can you provide some help to #kubuntu-devel in getting packages udpated/added to the archives for 16.10?13:57
mhall119they've been really struggling since the Ubuntu Developers on that team left13:57
Mirvmhall119: I've uploaded around 120 packages from them, I think they're mostly happy and I'm waiting mostly for them to assess the autopkgtest situation so that they can advice release team..13:58
Mirvmhall119: the whole KDE Frameworks 5.24 and Plasma 5.7 is in yakkety-proposed now13:58
mhall119Mirv: ah, thank you so much, I hasn't skimmed the scrollback13:58
Mirvno problem14:00
ubottubdmurray, BenC, cyphermox, infinity, micahg, rbasak, sil2100: DMB ping.15:01
* Snow-Man wonders where he can buy CDs of those Dave Matthews Band cover band from.15:13
ottoWhen will the dmb meeting begin?15:21
rbasakotto: it's in #ubuntu-meeting. It's already going. We went past you in the agenda, but we can go round again for you if you can join now please?15:22
Saviqpitti, hey, can you please restart all of unity8 tests in https://requests.ci-train.ubuntu.com/static/britney/ticket-1575/landing-073-yakkety/excuses.html with all-proposed, Qt's not migrated still15:41
=== salem_ is now known as _salem
=== _salem is now known as salem_
pittiSaviq: done16:07
Saviqpitti, thank you16:11
seb128cjwatson, hey, unsure if you are still around but I tried to build a snap on launchpad (https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/+snap/ghex-udt/+build/2261) and the build is failing on "git.gnome.org: Name or service not known", am I doing something wrong?17:47
dobeyis building snaps allowed to access the internet?17:54
dannfjgrimm: i can test that it doesn't crash on arm64, but not sure if that's sufficient to call it "verified". i'll test & leave a comment though.18:02
kyrofadobey, indeed, but only on snapcraft's pull step18:18
kyrofaseb128, could that be the issue?18:18
seb128kyrofa, dunno, my snapcraft.yaml is normal I think?18:19
seb128  ghex:18:19
seb128    plugin: autotools18:19
seb128    source: git://git.gnome.org/ghex18:19
kyrofaseb128, ah, I wonder if the proxy isn't letting git:// through18:20
kyrofaseb128, indeed, the yaml looks fine. But that doesn't mean the build system isn't doing something like that (e.g. mysql will download boost when building)18:21
kyrofaseb128, but no, the log looks good18:21
kyrofaseb128, does git.gnome.org support cloning over http, perhaps? Might try that18:22
=== jhenke_ is now known as jhenke
seb128kyrofa, yeah, I'm going to try that, thanks for the suggestion19:24
kyrofaSure thing19:24
=== Beret- is now known as Beret
jgrimmthanks dannf21:50
=== salem_ is now known as _salem
=== msbrown is now known as msbrown-afk

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