/srv/irclogs.ubuntu.com/2016/08/28/#ubuntustudio-devel.txt

sakrecoeri am up for that autumna ! excellent motivation!09:19
sakrecoerthe font manager issue is bothering me a lot.. its a small yet almost crucial piece in the graphics workflow...09:19
sakrecoeri'm willing the call the workflow broken without it. at least any graphic work with typography09:20
sakrecoerof course its still possible to work wthout it, but it gets annoying without it if there are +1000 fontd in the system, and i think we have +120009:22
autumnasakrecoer: I agree. well you can package that and I can try to see if I can get krita to work, although I should probably make sure I can build krita first. 09:36
* sakrecoer looks at the mountain of knowledge he has to ingurgitate09:57
sakrecoeri will try my best.. font-manager will require an SRU... 09:57
autumnaSRU?09:58
sakrecoerstable release upgrade09:58
sakrecoerso that it reaches 16.04 users too..09:58
autumnaah09:58
sakrecoernobody has the patience to wait for the fonts to load..09:59
autumnayeah well, I also thought the thing crashed that first time09:59
sakrecoerit works, but not as it should. that id a lot faster09:59
autumna*nods*10:00
autumnaI'll need a bit of time to fix my setup before I can do the packaging. what is the deadline to get krita into yakkety?10:00
autumnaor is that even possible?10:00
sakrecoeryesterday? .. we will need some exception and a sponsor..10:10
sakrecoermore like 2 weeks ago tbh.. but i think it is doable  10:10
autumna*is nervous*10:11
sakrecoermaybe you should join #kubuntu-devel and look if you can team up efforts10:11
autumnasure10:11
sakrecoernot sure how it would be best done tbh..10:12
autumnawe'll figure it out while doing it? right now what I am going to do first, is to re-read this manual, and figure what I need to put into my VM to build krita10:15
autumnathen figure out if I CAN build krita10:15
autumnaonce that happens10:15
autumnathen I can ask for help10:15
sakrecoersounds like a fair plan :)10:16
autumnawhat is the issue with the non-free things through? do you know?10:16
autumnaI saw the IRC chat between you and zequence and others but I am a bit lost. 10:16
sakrecoersomething with the new qt.. not too clear either..10:17
sakrecoerif i got it right, something with new qt don't conply with debian policy..10:17
sakrecoer*comply..10:17
sakrecoerbut yeah, as usual, information about such things, when comming from me, needs doublechecking :/10:18
autumnaok maybe I should begin by joining kubuntu-devel10:19
sakrecoerbe considerate, i know you will, but i know they are kindof stressed atm...10:20
sakrecoerso, just saying :)10:20
autumnawhen I am not considerate? :D but thanks for the heads up10:21
sakrecoerwell.. 'stresed' is a big word, but they hada game stopper during betaq..10:21
sakrecoerbeta1*10:22
autumnaoh no10:22
OvenWerksautumna: there is qt and there is qt... Our repos already do have qt 5.5, but maybe krita got acidently built against the non-free version.13:54
OvenWerksIt would seem to me that should not be that hard to fix, but it may be that the free and non-free versions of qt have different numbers.13:55
OvenWerksautumna: there is qt and there is qt... Our repos already do have  qt 5.5, but maybe krita got acidently built against the non-free  version.13:57
autumnahi (fyi ovenwerks if you just said before the last line I probably missed it, IRC setup hiccup)13:57
sakrecoer15:53 < OvenWerks> autumna: there is qt and there is qt... Our repos already  do have qt 5.5, but maybe krita got acidently built  against the non-free version.13:58
sakrecoer15:55 < OvenWerks> It would seem to me that should not be that hard to fix,  but it may be that the free and non-free versions of qt  have different numbers.13:58
autumnaah13:58
autumnathanks OvenWerks (and thanks sakrecoer)13:59
autumnabrb14:07
sakrecoerOvenWerks, is it an option to package something in ubuntustudio, while waiting for it to get to debian? i understand it is what we will do with numix, but would it work for apps like font-manager or krita?14:14
OvenWerkssakrecoer: what might be an option is to see if the package in 16.04 would just work in 16.10 and repackage that.14:22
OvenWerksqt4 has not gone away.14:22
* autumna tries to catch up to the conversation14:23
OvenWerksin other words use krita 2.9.714:24
autumnaOvenWerks if that works, it would be a good backup14:25
sakrecoerOvenWerks: that could be an option.. for fontmanager it isn't: the version in ubuntu and debian are years old..14:25
autumnawhile we sort this problem out14:25
OvenWerksthat may not work if some of the other kde bits have advanced too far. I don't know the whole dependancy chain.14:25
sakrecoerwell... old is not the problem.. its pretty broken..14:26
OvenWerkssakrecoer: I was talking about krita in this case.14:26
OvenWerksfontmanager is different.14:26
sakrecoeryeah.. sorry.. my bad for mentioning both i my question14:27
OvenWerksfontmanager may be suffering bitrot.14:27
sakrecoerOvenWerks: the one in debain and ubuntu is, but it is actively developed upstream14:28
OvenWerksso it needs someone in debian to do something.14:28
sakrecoerOvenWerks: so packaging it for ubuntu is not an option? that means it will be ready for 17.04, right?14:30
sakrecoerOvenWerks: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/font-manager/+bug/157953614:31
ubottuLaunchpad bug 1579536 in font-manager (Ubuntu) ""Querying installed files" process on start-up takes abnormally long (~20minutes)" [Medium,Confirmed]14:31
OvenWerksfont manager bangs one of my core to 100% while loading. It is not taking 20 mins... we have 0.5.714:31
sakrecoerOvenWerks: you trying it on 16.10?14:31
OvenWerksit only took 2 or 3 minutes to load here14:31
OvenWerks04.14:31
sakrecoercurrent fontmanager from devs personal ppa is 0.7.2 14:31
sakrecoerOvenWerks: really? with all fonts installed?14:32
OvenWerkssakrecoer: whatever Studio comes with.14:32
sakrecoerok...14:32
sakrecoerright14:32
sakrecoerOvenWerks: its not the first time you load the fonts right?14:33
sakrecoerthe second time it works better, but try install a new font and see what happens14:33
OvenWerksI don't recall having run it before since install.14:34
sakrecoeri think you checked when i reppoerted the bug, but i might be not recal correctly..14:34
sakrecoerand maybe you have resintalled since then :)14:35
OvenWerksBut really, the repo should be kept up with the devs site.14:35
sakrecoeryou mean the debian repo?14:35
OvenWerksHas a bug been added to debian's packge to upgrade?14:35
OvenWerkssakrecoer: have you tried the newer fontmanager from the ppa? does it solve the problem?14:37
sakrecoerOvenWerks: yes14:37
sakrecoerit solves the problem14:37
OvenWerksThen the bug for debian to upgrade should include that info.14:37
sakrecoeri mean this ppa: https://launchpad.net/font-manager14:38
sakrecoerand it adds features!14:38
sakrecoerfor example it reads the super weird mac font format..14:38
sakrecoerand it enables those files for use with all software.14:38
OvenWerksAt this point we get into politics :)14:39
sakrecoerreally?14:39
sakrecoerits not the only new feature though14:39
OvenWerksbut we need to ask if we can take the source package from that ppa and use it in the ubuntu repo till debian gets thgeir act together14:40
sakrecoerok, who do we ask?14:40
OvenWerksperhaps run it through lintian to see if there are any debian probalems with policy and repackage for debian too if no one else will.14:41
OvenWerksautumna: font manager may be a good place to start with packaging seeing as someone already has done most of the work.14:41
autumnaOvenWerks: I was planning to let sakrecoer do that14:42
OvenWerks:)14:42
autumnasince I already have a package in mind that is easier, if krita turns out of to be problematic14:42
OvenWerkscool14:42
autumna(godot, is supposed to be VERY easy to build)14:42
autumna(and has very few dependencies which probably means less problem with policy)14:42
autumnaOvenWerks I did miss a good portion of what you were saying earlier. was the leaving the old version of krita a backup solution? or were you suggesting that we might not be able to get 3.0 in?14:44
OvenWerksautumna: I was saying put the old version in if we can.14:45
autumnaI see14:45
autumnawell I assumed that old version was breaking the iso which started all this but.. *shrugs* 14:46
OvenWerksthe problem I see is that it requires calligra-libs = 2.9.714:47
OvenWerkswhich means exact14:47
OvenWerksbut then it was those libs that were the problem? so backing off on those might be a good idea too.14:48
OvenWerksNext question, there are no other applications that do what krita does?14:51
autumnaOvenWerks not really no 14:51
OvenWerksWell all of my thoughts are from someone who's understanding of packaging is close to nil.14:52
autumnaMyPaint is great lightweight software but it is for sketching, not finished work. Krita has tons of features that it doesn't has, such as effect layers, 32bit images etc (actually I would almost say krita is better in some image tasks at the moment than even gimp is)14:52
autumnaOvenWerks it still is helpful14:53
autumnabut yeah basically missing krita, is a bit like audio-meta missing ardour, for graphics :D14:56
sakrecoerkrita is the ony picture software we have that supports cmyk..14:58
sakrecoer..and missing font-manager is like missing qjackctl :D14:58
OvenWerkscinepaint seems to be dying14:58
sakrecoer(almost)14:58
autumnaheh15:00
autumnaOvenWerks: I think gimp is supposed to get features that cinepaint brings, if i understand correctly15:00
OvenWerksso they are both crtical then. Who is the person who packaged the last font manager in debian? are they still around/interested?15:00
OvenWerksautumna: I thought cinepaint came into being because gimp didn't want that.15:01
OvenWerksbut maybe as 4k monitors get cheap (and memory) that has changed.15:02
autumnaOvenWerks: I know they intend to support 32bit images on next version15:02
autumnaI mean I THINK they do if I understood the roadmap on the wiki correctly15:03
OvenWerksdoes gimp support a stream of images in a directory (individual video frames) the way cinepaint does?15:04
autumnadefine support?15:05
autumnaas in support modifying them in batch?15:05
OvenWerks:) I can't really, I just remember it being mentioned as one of the differences from one to the other.15:06
autumnagimp doesn't allow batch editing by default, but there is a plugin that does it quite well. (which requires building unfortunately) 15:07
OvenWerksremember, I am not a graphics video person... I just remember stuff I read once.15:07
autumna;)15:12
autumnasorry just curiosity15:13
autumnaOvenWerks I remember somebody linking a list of all packages in ubuntustudio. do you remember where it was?15:13
autumnanevermind just found it15:15
OvenWerksno, I don't. I do see a file in the same directory as the download.15:16
OvenWerkshttp://cdimage.ubuntu.com/ubuntustudio/dvd/current/yakkety-dvd-amd64.manifest15:16
OvenWerksThere are a lot of k5 things in there.15:19
OvenWerksI wonder if the old krita might be kept alive by making it a snap package?15:20
* OvenWerks still misses GCDMaster15:20
sakrecoerOvenWerks: there is a snap version, but snap breaks for people using nvidia... so krita via snaps + nvidia drivers = broken15:21
OvenWerkssakrecoer: and someone doing graphics/video is more likely to have a graphics card nicer than thge MB intel ;)15:22
sakrecoeryes15:23
OvenWerksSomeone who is Audio will probably use the MB intel on purpose just because it breaks the least things.15:23
sakrecoerand we would have to investigate into how to ship snaps with the iso...15:23
sakrecoeri was about to say, someone doing Audio will probably want to have soundcard, to have enough in an out puts... but what do i know?15:24
OvenWerkssakrecoer: these days, some one doing audio with a small buget will probably want to buy a new USB card...15:25
autumnaI think they fixed the snap issue for one version of nvidia driver 340 but yeah the bug persists overall. 15:25
sakrecoeri mean, someone doing graphics for fun and editing holliday video in opoesnhot is also more likely to use MB... for someone with a higher ambition will look into equipment15:25
sakrecoerOvenWerks: yeah, i guess so :)15:26
OvenWerksMB USB do not do low latency audio well. http://crimeandtheforcesofevil.com/blog/2016/07/25/so-hey-usb-chipsets-totally-matter/15:28
sakrecoeri'm desperatly looking for the tool to get debian sources wiht ubuntu..15:32
OvenWerksThis is what people found with firewire audio too... except in that case a bad chipset just didn't work at all. I think as part of a system scan for audio... the USB chipset should be looked at as well as what the USB port the AI is plugged into has sharing with it. (irq, other usb clients, etc)15:32
sakrecoerdebcheckout, but if it is i canät find the right url15:33
* sakrecoer is trying to use lintian15:33
* OvenWerks has to go.15:34
OvenWerksbye now.15:35
sakrecoero/15:35
autumnabye ovenwerks15:36
autumnasakrecoer: I have one suggestion. write down everything as you figure out how to do15:36
* autumna is regretting not doing that last time zequence explained things15:36
autumnahttps://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntustudio-meta/+bug/161617515:39
ubottuLaunchpad bug 1616175 in ubuntustudio-meta (Ubuntu) "Ubuntu Studio Live CD build failing due to dependency loop" [Undecided,New]15:39
autumnaok looking at this ross suggests blacklisting kactivities. did we try that? 15:39
sakrecoeri donät know..15:41
autumnazequence: re the krita issue did we try blacklisting kactivities and see if we can get krita in that way as ross suggests? apologies if I am rehashing tried solutions. trying to figure out where the situation is. (I see that currently krita is off the metas - I think)15:44
autumna(sakrecoer I think ross' suggestion was after zequence's changes to the meta, but yeah)15:45
sakrecoerOvenWerks: i found this, so i guess the debian maintainer has moved on. https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=79681718:27
ubottuDebian bug 796817 in font-manager "font-manager: version 0.7.2 is available" [Important,Open]18:27
sakrecoer(filed last year aömost exacly18:27
sakrecoeri'm reaching out to the maintainer Alessio18:28
sakrecoernothing to lose from a friendly reminder. at worst he'll tell me to get lost or never answer..18:29
sakrecoergreetings eylul! :)18:41
eylulhi sakrecoer :) 18:42
flocculantsakrecoer: do I read stuff about font-manager correct - eg issue is it hanging? 18:52
flocculantcos debian 814433 18:52
ubottuDebian bug 814433 in font-manager "font-manager: If fonts-noto-cjk is installed, hangs on startup" [Important,Open] http://bugs.debian.org/81443318:52
flocculantwandering off again 18:53
sakrecoerflocculant: yeah, i saw that. was poked by Gunnar who wrote this: http://askubuntu.com/a/81535419:04
sakrecoerdoesn't change the fact that it is a very old version of a software that has seen lots of improvement19:05
sakrecoerflocculant: in fact, the latest version has no problem with noto-cjk19:05
sakrecoerbut yeah, its' not hanging, just looks like it did for ~20 minutes. which will lead many to just assume it is broken19:07
sakrecoerflocculant: but thank you anyways :) i'm still not very skilled so i appreciate you making sure i understand things allright19:08
sakrecoerflocculant: oh i didn't read you correct. :D19:15
sakrecoerbut yes, it faints hanging when fonts-noto-cjk is installed.19:15
sakrecoerlong enough to make everyone think it hung19:16
flocculantright19:16
sakrecoerthis is solved in the current version, so it would be nice to have that packaged, instead of asking people to remove cjk or install from ppa19:17
flocculant:)19:17
OvenWerkssakrecoer: I think the debian maitainer for font-manager may be just too busy, I have seen that name in too many places. I am sure debian would be happy for someone to take over. Or even do a repackage to current.23:47
OvenWerksHey all. Ardour 5.3 is out... 5.3 is what 5.1 should have been.23:52
OvenWerkssakrecoer: looking at this page: https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/pkgreport.cgi?maint=alessio%40debian.org23:54
OvenWerksfont-manager is classed as: "Outstanding bugs -- Serious (policy violations or makes package unfit for release); Unclassified (4 bugs)"23:55
OvenWerksSo not lack of maintainer. shows as: font-manager: FTBFS: /usr/bin/ld: cannot find -lfreetype-lfreetype-lglib-2.0 and: font-manager: FTBFS: src/lib/fm-pyfontutils.c:28:22: fatal error: ft2build.h: No such file or directory23:57
OvenWerkshttps://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=80566323:57
ubottuDebian bug 805663 in src:font-manager "font-manager: FTBFS: /usr/bin/ld: cannot find -lfreetype-lfreetype-lglib-2.0" [Serious,Open]23:57
OvenWerkshttps://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=83046923:59
ubottuDebian bug 830469 in src:font-manager "font-manager: FTBFS: src/lib/fm-pyfontutils.c:28:22: fatal error: ft2build.h: No such file or directory" [Serious,Open]23:59

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