[08:04] <sakrecoer> eylul, zequence: while i have no problem with the grey and the blue being redefined, i'd like to remind you it would be the third time you look them over now :)
[08:06] <sakrecoer> doesn't mean it is not worth a 3rd try though obviously
[08:15] <sakrecoer> eylul: i was bored, so i did this: http://sakrecoer.com/ubuntustudio/websitebackgrounds-license/
[08:15] <sakrecoer> the license of the images are included.
[08:15] <sakrecoer> now, feel free to just disregard those, and go with your own flow :)
[08:16] <sakrecoer> i'm still working on the graphics one... not sure i will have it done in time tbh
[08:17] <eylul> thanks sakrecoer
[08:19] <sakrecoer> would perhaps be nice with the mandelbulb vibe of geirdal, but i don't have any such images rendered out atm
[08:19] <eylul> actually I wouldn't be against dropping that
[08:19] <eylul> and making the image less busy 
[08:20] <eylul> I was going to go with a piano and earphones photo for audio but this looks good :D
[08:20] <eylul> sakrecoer: are these your modified renders?
[08:20] <eylul> as in did you modify these renders on blender?
[08:21] <sakrecoer> yes, i replaced logos and moved camera arround, fideled with render compositing..
[08:21] <sakrecoer> but eylul, please, if you do have time: try those photos!
[08:21] <sakrecoer> :)
[08:21] <eylul> I will!
[08:21] <eylul> I as going to suggest if we go with your renders
[08:22] <eylul> maybe make the texts/labels that are white, closer to the color of the background of whatever they are sitting on
[08:22] <sakrecoer> eylul: as in less contrast?
[08:22] <sakrecoer> why not :)
[08:22] <eylul> yes
[08:23] <eylul> lets try that ok meanwhile let me dig my camera out
[08:25] <sakrecoer> i might as well tell you all now: my family is taking me on a trip from friday-sunday this week for my birfday. so i wont be much arround..
[08:25] <sakrecoer> reading the list though, of course.
[08:25] <eylul> oh! well 1) have a fun trip! 2) lets try to get website progressing somewhat before then then. :D
[08:26] <sakrecoer> yes :)
[08:28]  * eylul is walking around the room taking pictures
[08:30]  * sakrecoer imagine eylul has 8 arms :D
[08:30] <sakrecoer> hehe... i'm doing this wrong: topic in OT, OT in topic
[08:32] <eylul> hah we all fail at that
[08:32] <eylul> if anybody has a proper videocam, and can snap a picture of it let us know? otherwise we'll go with either sakrecoer's or my solutions *chuckles*
[08:34] <sakrecoer> eylul: "it" being...? stuff related to Audio, Video and Graphics i presume :p?
[08:35] <sakrecoer> chamois: yes, this is a good place to ask question about developement :)
[08:35] <eylul> video specifically
[08:36] <eylul> I think both of our photos covers graphics and audio work flows enough. 
[08:36] <sakrecoer> oh.. i thought the camera was for video.. :D
[08:38] <sakrecoer> maybe this one works better for video: http://sakrecoer.com/ubuntustudio/websitebackgrounds-license/video2.png
[08:38] <eylul> it is!
[08:38] <sakrecoer> less obvious that it is a DSLR.. although, i reckon most homevideos are shot with DSLR now adays..
[08:38] <sakrecoer> eylul: it is what is what? :D
[08:39] <eylul> the camera picture of yours, for video
[08:39] <eylul> but I figured a more proper videocam could be better, IF somebody has one
[08:39]  * eylul uses her cellphone to do most things these days
[08:39] <sakrecoer> ah! :) i understand what you mean. But we yet have to figure something or graphics.
[08:39] <sakrecoer> *For graphics
[08:40] <sakrecoer> it isn't exaclty covered...
[08:40] <sakrecoer> i have a modeled a pencil in blender..
[08:40] <chamois> Do you have any suggestion for the features to show in the video?
[08:40] <sakrecoer> (for graphics) but i have quite some fiddleing to do before i can render it
[08:41] <sakrecoer> chamois: yes, it should cover our mainworkflows: Audio, Video and Grapphics
[08:41] <sakrecoer> those "are" the features: with ubuntu studio, you should be set up to produce media in those 3 workflows
[08:42] <sakrecoer> of couse, it would be interesting to find a way to emphasise FOSS dimension
[08:43] <sakrecoer> chamois: this is the static version of the feature tour: http://www.ubuntustudio.zequence.net/
[08:43] <sakrecoer> if you scroll down..
[08:43] <sakrecoer> (maybe a button that links to an anchor on the page would be good, eylul ? ) its easy to miss that the page goes way down)
[08:48] <sakrecoer> eylul: nevermind that for now, i will put those details properly in reply to your excellent email :)
[08:50] <eylul> I have graphics covered I think
[08:50] <eylul> images incoming in a few minutes
[08:52] <chamois> "FOSS"?
[08:55] <sakrecoer> chamois: Free Open Source Software
[08:56] <chamois> ok thanks
[08:57] <sakrecoer> ryl guys o/
[08:57] <eylul> bye sakrecoer
[15:07] <eylul> sakrecoer: http://ubuntustudio.azbulutlu.org/websiteImages/ 
[15:28] <zequence> sakrecoer: Start by using the built-in function for apt: sudo apt-get build-dep fontmanager
[15:29] <zequence> Oh, was an old comment. I seem to have scrolled all the windows
[17:31] <sakrecoer> zequence: :) it happens to me too sometimes !
[17:33] <sakrecoer> eylul: i love it! the composition is great! my favourite is the graphics one. My only concern is that i see lots of finger fat and dirt on the tablet (and on the lens of your mobile)
[17:33] <eylul> hahah
[17:33] <eylul> I can probably redo the graphics one
[17:34] <sakrecoer> eylul: if it isn't too much hustle, i'd like that a lot! just wipe the tablet clean and you are there
[17:34] <eylul> how do you see that there is dirt on the lens of my mobile, one has to ask? 
[17:35] <eylul> the tablet I get, that's my intuos which hasn't been used in ages ;D
[17:35] <sakrecoer> it gets "milky".. there is like form of... ghost/fog glare.
[17:36] <eylul> that is not actually the lens issue
[17:36] <eylul> the image in question was.. over exposed a bit. did you check the tinted versions btw? because that's ultimately what we will use in background
[17:37] <sakrecoer> well, try to clean it, and you will see a lot of difference... its a hard task because they get very greasy from the hand and dusty from the pocket/bag
[17:37] <sakrecoer> sorry i missed the tinted ones
[17:38] <sakrecoer> yeah! works much better
[17:38] <eylul> *nods*
[17:38] <sakrecoer> in that light the dirt actualy give it character
[17:38] <sakrecoer> like it is actualy being used
[17:38] <eylul> heheh
[17:38] <krytarik> zequence: Just changed the default theme to Numix Blue, as well as merged -lightdm-theme into -default-settings along the way - can you please reupload these two?
[17:38] <eylul> yup
[17:39] <sakrecoer> i think, your audio background, tinted, works better than mine. graphics is cool! but i prefer the video with my image and your tint.
[17:40] <sakrecoer> krytarik: \o/ <3
[17:40] <eylul> yeah my video image didn't work at ALL with tint, so I didn't even bother uploading it, its there to complete the set, that's all. ;D I don't know I am torn between my audio one and yours
[17:41] <sakrecoer> if you could just try clean the tablet for the graphics one a litle bit.. hehe... or fake it :p
[17:41] <sakrecoer> is just... the glossyness of the tablet, could be.... sharper/cleaner
[17:42] <sakrecoer> eylul: if i have to be honnest to myself, i think your audio and my audio are equal, but yours says more "computer music"
[17:42] <eylul> I wonder if yours might work if you rendered it from another angle and removed the text on shiny area
[17:42] <eylul> I am thinking purely from a "this will be a background" aesthethic
[17:43] <eylul> and re graphics, I'll retake the picture tomorrow
[17:43] <sakrecoer> i can try that :)
[17:44] <eylul> but yeah agreed, with video I think your thing is the best we have currently, unless somebody has a brilliant idea. 
[17:44] <eylul> (or actually actual dedicated video gear they can photograph)
[17:52] <zequence> krytarik: We need to have ubuntustudio-lightdm-theme dropped from the archive then
[17:53] <krytarik> zequence: Not yet, it's a transition.
[17:53] <zequence> krytarik: Well, we have two packages that add the same file, don't we?
[17:55] <zequence> I can of course upload -lightdm-theme as well, to make sure that doesn't happen
[17:57] <zequence> But, not sure that's going to work perfectly as things are now. binary form  of -lightdm-theme seems to be an empty package right now, correct?
[17:58] <krytarik> Yes - that's how transitioning a package works.
[17:58] <zequence> krytarik: Why are you removing lightd-theme, as a package, btw?
[17:59] <zequence> Right, it depend on -default-settings. Now, I see. But, still. Why is the theming not separate anymore?
[18:01] <zequence> Not an immensly big deal, but what if someone wants to install just the the theming?
[18:02] <krytarik> ...What if one just wants to grab the Xfwm theme?
[18:03] <zequence> Well, if you want to clean things up, why not make sure theming is separate then?
[18:05] <zequence> (if something is not installable by itself, I mean - which I don't know if that is true=
[18:13] <zequence> Besides, why would -lightdm-theme want to bring in -default-settings? Again, probably less then 10 people who will be bothered by that, but still
[18:20] <sakrecoer> zequence, krytarik: i'd rather not split the themeing up into many packages. the plan is to get numix blue into debian as soon as possible anyway, so those who want just that, can either use the source or wait just a little more.
[18:22] <zequence> sakrecoer: numix blue is already in our own archive, just not set as default for Ubuntu Studio. But, now there was another change. Our lightdm theme was merged into our -default-settings. -lightdm-theme remains as a transitional package which now depends on -default-settings (none of that uploaded yet)
[18:23] <zequence> There's no sense in making a theme pull in ubuntustudio-default-settings
[18:23] <zequence> It's not the kind of change that will blow up peoples computers, but I need to know why this would be reasonable before I upload
[18:26] <sakrecoer> zequence: we set light-dm in -default-settings, don't we?
[18:28] <zequence> sakrecoer: Not the lightdm look. Only the ubuntustudio session, which is a separate thing
[18:28] <DalekSec> zequence: ...From what I see the lightdm package contained one config file, so not really a theme at all, just some config which is why it'd make perfect sense to have it in -settings, and since there is no theme in the package calling it '-lightdm-theme' is a misnomer.
[18:30] <zequence> DalekSec: The binary package ubuntustudio-lightdm-theme would pull in the theming needed, and set that for lightdm
[18:31] <DalekSec> So, having basically a metapackage for a lightdm theme?  Seems a bit much.
[18:31] <DalekSec> (I presume you know about lightdm-gtk-greeter-settings)
[18:33] <zequence> DalekSec: Yes, but making a theme pull in our -default-settings makes no sense
[18:33] <zequence> If one want to merge the lightd theme with -settings - fine. But, then remove the original package all togethjer
[18:33] <zequence> Making it transitional makes no sense
[18:34] <zequence> We have things like grub configs, swappiness changes, etc
[18:34] <zequence> That doesn't seem to relate with theming
[18:35] <zequence> So, I would recommend waiting with such a change until next cycle, when we are not post FF
[18:35] <zequence> It doesn't improve anything. Rather the opposite
[18:37] <zequence> And, how does that work, anyway? When an old package is removed, but a new one will install the same file? Does that conflict somehow?
[18:37] <zequence> ..between upgrades, that is
[18:38] <sakrecoer> i'm confused... is it -settings that pull in lightdm or light-dm that pulls in settings?
[18:40] <DalekSec> zequence: I just don't really see how it degrades anything, though yeah past FF isn't the ideal time.  Package a is installed while package b isn't, package a depends on package b while package b sets breaks/replaces on the older version of package a that contained the file(s).  Standard transition, no?
[18:41] <zequence> DalekSec: -lightdm-theme is an installable package, by itself. It's a package that provides lightdm-theming. Now, it provides -default-settings
[18:42] <zequence> I think it depends on what you mean by degrade
[18:42]  * DalekSec shrugs.
[18:42] <zequence> It changes from being a theming package to being a ubuntustudio-default-settings package with all sorts of settings that are not in any way related to lightdm
[18:43] <zequence> Now, I picture only a handful people may be in that situation. But, for me, that doesn't matter. It's matter of logic and sense.
[18:44] <zequence> So, again, what is the reason to this change? What is the improvement? If someone can tell me that in a way that makes sense, I can make the upload.
[18:46] <zequence> Otherwise, I would rather the lightdm-theme merge was reverted, and I can upload the part which makes the new theme default
[18:51] <krytarik> zequence: #6 here - https://wiki.debian.org/PackageTransition
[18:52] <zequence> krytarik: Yes, but this is not about package transition. You are transitioning a theme into something else
[18:53] <zequence> This reminds me of file renaming
[19:05] <sakrecoer> i see 2 in favour and 1 against.
[19:06] <zequence> sakrecoer: It's not vote. I do the uploads, and if I feel a change is bad, and you can't convince me with a single argument why it is good, then you're out of luck
[19:06] <zequence> You can always try with someone else
[19:06] <zequence> I'm not the only one with upload rights in the Ubuntu community, after all
[19:07] <zequence> What I would like to see is the argument. There has been none, so far.
[19:07] <zequence> The majority is quite often not right, which I'm sure you are all aware of.
[19:08] <zequence> Anyway, I'll be in touch
[19:16] <sakrecoer> zequence: isn't DalekSec argument valid to you? i'm not putting up a vote, i'm just trying to understand and seeing 2 in favour and one against
[19:17] <sakrecoer> zequence: but sure, it's your choice to decide what to do with your upload powers
[19:25] <zequence> sakrecoer: I don't see a definitive argument for. More of a "why not", but not "this is why"
[19:26] <zequence> OvenWerks: Didn't you often propagate for a separate settings for audio configs?
[19:26] <zequence> This is also something that could be separated, in fact.
[19:26] <zequence> The whole thing is a soup.
[19:27] <zequence> sakrecoer: Also, I already gave my reason for why not plenty of times.
[19:27] <OvenWerks> zequence: My main argument for a new theme would be:
[19:28] <OvenWerks> 1) big enough "handles" that they are actually grabable without fiddling
[19:29] <OvenWerks> 2) title bar very oviously shows which window has focus.
[19:29] <zequence> OvenWerks: Right, but we were talking about a merge between -lightdm-theme and -defailt-settings, where a transitional package of -lightdm-theme would depend on -default-settings
[19:29] <OvenWerks> In my opinion greybird does not do these things.
[19:29] <zequence> The new theme is already in
[19:29] <OvenWerks> Ah
[19:30] <zequence> And, the changes to -default-settings where that theme is made default are already in
[19:30] <zequence> But, there's an additional change
[19:30] <OvenWerks> I don't see any reason to merge
[19:30] <OvenWerks> having separate packages allows easier changes.
[19:31] <zequence> And, beyond that, if you make -lightdm-theme a transitional package, suddenly depending on -default-settings, you make a theme package bring in ubuntustudio-default-settings for no apparent reason
[19:32] <OvenWerks> If the theme is unique to Studio, it should be ubuntustudio-theme.
[19:32] <OvenWerks> zequence: right.
[19:33] <krytarik> zequence: For the reason that the user who supposedly only has the LightDM theming installed, keeps it.
[19:34] <OvenWerks> krytarik: ??
[19:34] <OvenWerks> then -desktop should depend on it.
[19:35] <zequence> krytarik: Keeps it, and gets something else that they may not have bargained for.
[19:36] <zequence> See, this is why we communicate. To make sure things go right
[19:37] <OvenWerks> zequence: is there a reason to not set cpu governor to Performance or at least add that to -controls?
[19:37] <zequence> OvenWerks: I would not mind adding that to -controls, but I haven't had the motivation or time for that yet.
[19:38] <OvenWerks> :) understood.
[19:39] <zequence> Can someone please just tell me why this merge is so damn important, that it overshadows everything else on this planet, and no one is willing to back down a single bit.
[19:39]  * OvenWerks is not very good at python...
[19:39] <zequence> It's getting ridiculous.
[19:40] <zequence> Either you want the package to be right. Or, you want to be right. It's no the same thing
[19:40] <zequence> You know "==" and "!="
[19:40] <zequence> ..as related to the package
[19:41] <zequence> Actually...
[19:41] <OvenWerks> separate packages allows one of them to be rcomends
[19:42] <OvenWerks> That makes it easier to replace one with another
[19:42] <zequence> I'm totally through with this bullshit. So, get yourself another uploader.
[19:43] <zequence> I'm not not doing another one for Studio again. In fact, I'm leaving the whole scene
[19:43] <zequence> It's too bad I wasnt' able to do that earlier, but I had to do this thankless shit because no one else was able to
[19:44] <zequence> So, please, be able, from now, ok?
[19:44] <zequence> My whole project lead period was because no one else was willing to do it, pretty much
[19:44] <zequence> 3 fucking years
[19:45] <zequence> OvenWerks: I'll probably pop into ardour now and then. For the rest of you, see you when I see you
[19:56] <sakrecoer> what happened? i was on the phone.. am i not seeing someones chats?
[19:59] <eylul> no clue I just walked into this as well
[22:42] <zequence> I've dropped out of all the teams. I made sakrecoer the owner of the core LP team, so he now controls all of launchpad stuff as far as Ubuntu Studio goes. It's up to you guys now. Don't spend your time renaming files...