[06:58] I see we've got dev wallpaper now we've nearly finished the cycle :p [06:58] Yes! I pestered about the wrong version number. :P [06:59] :) [07:00] ...Then I uploaded. [07:02] blame Unit193 for the week week then :p [07:20] I blame the whole weird universe on him. [07:35] :( [09:29] * bluesabre rather enjoys the weird universe [09:38] I'm...sorry? [09:38] bluesabre: See krytarik's comment about your planking with Greybird? [09:38] cp -r ? [09:38] about to fix that [09:40] \o/ [21:36] evening all [21:36] hello [21:36] hi [21:37] hi bluesabre :) [21:37] hey knome mac-chaffee flocculant [21:38] https://www.timeanddate.com/countdown/generic?p0=1440&iso=20160909T22&msg=Xubuntu%20community%20meeting [21:39] still so many minutes to go [21:40] ochosi: Another one! :'( [21:40] lol [21:40] Unit193: i thought you said you needed some work..? [21:41] bluesabre: are you free/bored before the upcoming meeting..? [21:42] ochosi, whats up? [21:43] well just wanted to chat about how to continue with volumed-pulse, now that it's on git.xfce.org [21:43] alrighty [21:44] so basically now that i have made notifyd's icon loading more robust, i think it would be ok to switch to symbolic icons [21:44] oh, sry, brb [21:45] :) [21:45] ochosi, yeah, that sounds sane to me [21:46] this will be my first meeting :) [21:46] how long have you all been here? [21:46] for the meeting or in 'xubuntu'? [21:46] I mean how long have you all been developing on xubuntu? [21:47] I've been contributing since 2012 [21:47] well I don't develop - qa team - since ~2012 I think [21:47] can't remember when unity happened - but it was then :) [21:47] most of the folks on the team have been around longer than me :) [21:48] cool! How did you get started bluesabre? [21:48] same here :) [21:48] mac-chaffee, filed a bunch of bugs and annoyed ochosi, then he dragged me into here [21:48] I blame astraljava and knome [21:49] i started contributing in 2008... [21:49] bluesabre: Crap, am I older than you too? :3 [21:49] Unit193, you were already here when I popped in [21:49] Crap. [21:49] haha. [21:50] I kind of blame Unit193 for dragging me here in the first place [21:50] !team | community meeting in 10 minutes [21:50] community meeting in 10 minutes: akxwi-dave, bluesabre, dkessel, flocculant, jjfrv8, knome, krytarik, micahg, Noskcaj, ochosi, pleia2, slickymaster and Unit193 [21:50] No you don't, I just saw you blame astraljava and knome. [21:50] we've all dragged somebody here. [21:50] Unit193: I blame them for qa - you I blame for xubuntu :p [21:50] :D [21:51] come by #xubuntu-devel you said - like it would be a fleeting thing [21:51] lol [21:52] "Oops" [21:52] hah [21:53] "It's a trap" they whispered [21:53] Well you were fleeing unity, soo. [21:53] yup [21:53] Only one letter off! [21:53] lol [21:53] all that said... the 8 years *i've* had here have all been nice and i've made some good friends for life too [21:54] I'd like to think the same [21:54] not sure though - I think everyone hates qa ;) [21:54] ...Have I paid penance yet? [21:55] ask me in 6 months 4 weeks and 6 days :p [21:57] akxwi-dave: skip button is apparently fixed [21:58] I guess I'll quickly introduce myself. I'm Mac. I'm a CSC student looking to contribute to some open source projects. Since xubuntu is my favorite flavor of linux, I thought I join you guys! [21:58] nice :) [21:58] o/ [21:58] I'll save my dumb questions for after the meeting =) [21:58] That's nice! We love new victems, err, I mean. Contributors! [21:59] ...Also people that can't spell/type, like me. [21:59] oh yeah. I'd** [21:59] to make matters worse for Unit193 and the like, we also have some grammar police around. [21:59] nervousness ;) [22:00] no need to be nervous, we're all just regular geeks [22:00] oh boy oh boy oh boy [22:00] bluesabre: is late now :p [22:00] #startmeeting Xubuntu community meeting [22:00] Meeting started Fri Sep 9 22:00:26 2016 UTC. The chair is bluesabre. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology. [22:00] Available commands: action commands idea info link nick [22:00] Who's around? [22:00] fairly round [22:01] #chair flocculant [22:01] Current chairs: bluesabre flocculant [22:01] * flocculant always forgets that [22:01] !team | meeting time [22:01] meeting time: akxwi-dave, bluesabre, dkessel, flocculant, jjfrv8, knome, krytarik, micahg, Noskcaj, ochosi, pleia2, slickymaster and Unit193 [22:02] o/ [22:02] o/ [22:02] hi pleia2 :) [22:02] #chair knome [22:02] Current chairs: bluesabre flocculant knome [22:02] #chair pleia2 [22:02] Current chairs: bluesabre flocculant knome pleia2 [22:02] loads of chairs [22:02] plenty! [22:02] :D [22:03] o/ [22:03] surprised so many are here [22:03] #chair ochosi [22:03] Current chairs: bluesabre flocculant knome ochosi pleia2 [22:03] +1 [22:03] where are all the sofas? [22:03] just join the chairs [22:03] I'm too cheap for that [22:03] ;) [22:03] lets get started then [22:03] Unit193 was here - suddenly disappeared :p [22:03] #topic Open Action Items [22:04] ochosi to announc opening nominations for Xubuntu Council with timeline [22:04] well, that's gone and passed :D [22:04] oh, i guess that is done :) [22:04] \o/ [22:04] last meeting was a while back :D [22:05] #topic Updates and Announcements [22:05] #info The Xubuntu council is Sean Davis (bluesabre) - chair, Pasi Lallinaho (knome) and Simon Steinbeiß (ochosi) [22:06] thanks flocculant for running the whole election thingy! [22:06] yes, thank you [22:06] and for the XSD part too [22:06] welcome ofc [22:06] The Xubuntu Council are [22:06] ... [22:06] (reminds me nobody whined about the latest changes, should push them live) [22:06] :p [22:06] thanks flocculant ! [22:06] knome: yea - works for me [22:07] nobody not referring to flocculant only :P [22:07] #info UIFE this week [22:07] was [22:07] #info Doc String Freeze next week [22:07] yeah, that ^ blows a little [22:07] we still have some UI changes ahead [22:07] that's fine [22:07] i can take the paperwork [22:07] i guess i'll do some minor Greybird tweaks if i get to it (mostly removing padding and fixing small things) [22:08] and the wallpaper still needs to go live [22:08] yeah, it needs to be finished and polished [22:08] ochosi: like the minor issue with the installer? [22:08] cos that looks horrid :( [22:08] on the subject of doc string freeze [22:09] #info Final Beta (which Xubuntu is participating in) on September 22nd, freeze on September 19 [22:09] we should make sure we don't have anything out-of-date on the docs [22:09] and update the installer slideshow as well [22:09] knome: I can do a run through on at least docs this weekend [22:09] i collected from david's mail he's not going to be around until october [22:09] yea [22:10] flocculant, great, if you find anything that needs updating, just send a mail to the devel list directly [22:10] flocculant: yeah, also like that one [22:10] i'll look at the installer slideshow and do the same [22:10] knome: rather than do an mp? [22:10] flocculant: although that's not really UIFe material, more a bugfix [22:10] flocculant, well if you are up to doing the changes, then obviously MP is better :) [22:10] ochosi: yea - just wanted to make sure it's in the pipeline is all :) [22:11] flocculant: well pipeline is maybe a bit too strong, let's put it this way: i have it on the radar ;) [22:11] * flocculant hates his Physical Graffiti cover being just slightly out of whack too :p [22:11] yakkety has the same version of slideshow as xenial, so no upload is done there yet [22:11] #action flocculant to look at docs and make sure everything is up-to-date [22:11] ACTION: flocculant to look at docs and make sure everything is up-to-date [22:11] knome: ack mp - just wondered is why m/l :) [22:11] #action knome to look at installer slideshow and make sure everyting is up-to-date [22:11] ACTION: knome to look at installer slideshow and make sure everyting is up-to-date [22:12] thing too, but who cares [22:12] and yea ochosi I get that :) [22:12] any other action items? [22:12] oh, well [22:12] any other updates or announcements? [22:12] #action knome updates the contributor docs and pushes changes lice [22:12] ACTION: knome updates the contributor docs and pushes changes lice [22:12] #undo [22:12] Removing item from minutes: ACTION [22:12] #action knome updates the contributor docs and pushes changes live [22:12] ACTION: knome updates the contributor docs and pushes changes live [22:12] sigh [22:12] lice \o/ [22:13] awesome :p [22:13] lice /o\ [22:13] <- no kids at school finally [22:13] :D [22:13] <- no kids yet [22:13] i think the ups and anns are there [22:13] yep [22:13] moving on [22:13] #topic Discussion [22:14] #subtopic Thunar [22:14] flocculant added this item... :) [22:14] imagine that ... [22:14] so then - during xenial the sentiment was basically this [22:15] "xfce don't have anyone to test it - we should - and hope things get fixed" [22:15] doesn't appear to be happening [22:15] indeed [22:15] xfce has picked up new contributors lately though [22:15] bluesabre: do you still feel "flocculant, yeah... thunar isn't getting better (even in y), and I'm not opposed to moving to a different file manager, but that suggestion tends to rock the boat a bit" [22:15] there are some new patches around, but we've had some negative tests within our team [22:16] bluesabre, do you know if those patches have worked for anybody? [22:16] because frankly while it might be ok to test things between LTS - we've landed that on LTS [22:16] knome, those patches have worked for the folks commenting on the bug report at least [22:16] and now is when we should start thinking about tomorrow [22:16] bluesabre: well I can easily enough comment there that it doesn't work for me on either 16.04 or 16.10 [22:17] flocculant, I still feel that, and now might be the best time to start the discussion into the next cycle [22:17] which makes the core 0 [22:17] that gives me hope... there is somebody working on patches and they are fixing some issues for some people [22:17] knome: for how long do we wait doing nothing and just hoping? [22:17] 6 months? 12? the next LTS for 3 years? [22:18] i don't know, but the fact is that the bugs are present in 16.04 [22:18] perhaps us moving would make people take notice of the fact that thunar isn't very well and ignored [22:18] the problem seems to stem from the fact that Thunar does not have a single active maintainer... we get patches that fix a few things, but the overall issue seems unresolved [22:18] easy enough to move around now (I assume) than in the last 6 months of the LTS to LTS cycle [22:18] i'm not sure if that would add to the motivation to fix thunar though [22:18] it probably requires a much larger effort [22:19] team members, opinions please? [22:19] interestingly i came across a gtk3 port of thunar on github [22:19] so there seems to be some activity even outside of the xfce team [22:19] does it fix the issues we are experiencing? [22:19] the same thing happened with the terminal btw, i also managed to reel in a new contributor through contacting him about his port on github [22:20] i'll try to do the same thing again here, but obviously no promises [22:20] i haven't tested the port, so i can't say if it fixes the bug [22:20] i'm pretty sure it's not final so it probably has other issues that we would rather avoid [22:20] please don't anyone get me wrong here - I'd rather we used thunar - but we shouldn't be handing out half-fixed software if we can help it [22:20] of course [22:20] flocculant: yeah, i get that [22:20] yep [22:20] and you're right, now is the best time to discuss [22:21] My opinion is, we should start weighting other options, and if we're still having these same issues into Z, we employ those options early in the cycle and get some feedback [22:21] bluesabre: sounds fair [22:21] yeah, sounds reasonable [22:21] and I'll have some time for a cycle so I could come up with some roadmap type thing for options on that [22:22] okay, that sounds good to me [22:22] so if someone wants to word that we can action me for it [22:22] #action bluesabre to prepare testing of other file manager options [22:22] ACTION: bluesabre to prepare testing of other file manager options [22:23] I assume we could change throughout the Z cycle here? [22:23] #undo [22:23] Removing item from minutes: ACTION [22:23] #action bluesabre to prepare testing of other file manager options throughout the Z cycle [22:23] ACTION: bluesabre to prepare testing of other file manager options throughout the Z cycle [22:23] eg if foo was really pants we could change to bar? [22:23] bluesabre: I offered :p [22:23] We can (and should) move around to different options if the ones we try are a no-go [22:24] k [22:24] "Hey I like this", "Hey its eats my desktop", "Hey, lets try that instead" [22:24] :D [22:24] okey doke [22:25] Anything else we want to discuss about thunar? [22:25] one thing [22:25] I'm not at all sure what patches we actually have in thunar [22:26] are there some that 'could' help we don't have - if so - could we have a completely plastered up one in a ppa somewhere? [22:26] so we make Unit193 write a report on where we stand with it? [22:26] flocculant: yeah, an overview of that would be useful [22:26] also with which patch is supposed to do what [22:26] current patch filenames [22:26] knome: that's the price of being in -ooftopic I guess :p [22:26] 0001-Don-t-copy-templates-but-create-them-bug-8312.patch [22:26] 01_support-non-multiarch-modules.patch [22:26] 02_Fix-crashes-when-reloading-target-file-after-move.patch [22:26] 03_Fixing-missing-return-value-in-standard-view.patch [22:26] Check-if-a-thunar-file-is-still-valid-before-reloading.patch [22:26] (if we don't have that in the names of the patches) [22:26] which apparently we do :D [22:27] There is one we don't have. [22:27] so as Unit193 is not opposing, i take it as approving.. [22:27] bluesabre: quick - chair Unit193 :p [22:27] #chair Unit193 [22:27] Current chairs: Unit193 bluesabre flocculant knome ochosi pleia2 [22:27] lol [22:27] heh [22:27] #action bluesabre and Unit193 to write a report of the state of Thunar (eg. which patches we carry and what they should do) and make sure all of them are in a PPA [22:27] ACTION: bluesabre and Unit193 to write a report of the state of Thunar (eg. which patches we carry and what they should do) and make sure all of them are in a PPA [22:28] works for me [22:28] knome: I dunno, I see patch, I try it, it seems to help, I accidentally push it to the repo and thus we get stuck with a wrong filename. [22:28] Unit193, and next you paste a link to an image where a dog flies a helicopter? [22:28] Yes! [22:29] :D [22:29] we're probably thunar'd away now [22:29] bluesabre: so would you like some sort of 'this file-manager' adds this much bytes to image - or are we not to concerned about that at the moment? [22:30] I'd guess not currently [22:30] i don't think the size is very much the problem [22:30] flocculant, not particularly worried about that [22:30] if the file manager works and is generally lightweight, then who cares what the size is? [22:30] obviously dolphin is out ;) [22:30] ha ha ha [22:30] unless the council approves it [22:30] the SD says something about qt [22:31] yes [22:31] and k - was just back in we need to save x KBs for a bit there [22:31] but that can be council'd away too [22:31] the new version also says the council can overrule if it's sensible [22:31] the new catch-phrase: "to council away" [22:31] \o/ [22:32] too many new phrases... I have to change "to flocculant" to "to akxwi-dave" soon [22:32] hah [22:33] bluesabre, you mean to a-nxvpwmlkdgnkd-dave [22:33] :) [22:33] I'll change nicks - then akxwi-dave can alias flocculant to akxwi-dave :p [22:33] #subtopic Other Topics [22:33] quick one here [22:33] Anything else that needs discussed (thats not in the Agenda)? [22:34] depends on if knome does a meeting next week or not? [22:34] * flocculant waits [22:34] i can do if people need/want [22:34] well I just want to quickly run through beta [22:34] otoh, there's many of us here today... [22:34] so nothing to stop us doing that now [22:34] let's do it now [22:35] We'll definitely want a meeting prior to the beta (Sep 22) [22:35] bluesabre, mon 19 maybe? [22:35] bluesabre: well we need the meeting prior to freeze which is Monday/Tuesday [22:35] ok [22:35] so let's schedule one for later next week [22:35] s/22/19/ [22:35] alrighty [22:36] #topic Schedule Next Meeting [22:36] could we perhaps weekend it? [22:36] hmmh. [22:36] maybe, i can't promise yet [22:36] mmk [22:36] oh, just a small announcement from my side: i'm completely afk from sept 19 to sept 29 [22:36] nice... [22:36] not that you really need me now that you can council away things [22:36] or was it italy? [22:36] :P [22:37] well I'll be sending stuff out to testers 'soon' re beta to wake them up [22:37] 10 days to spam ochosi with greybird/elementary-xfce bugs [22:37] #undo [22:37] Removing item from minutes: TOPIC [22:37] let's just go through the beta now, right? [22:37] akxwi-dave and I will be checking release note [22:37] bluesabre: yeah, time to spam me and get *nothing* fixed ;) [22:37] we can still have the meeting next week [22:37] but just in case [22:37] alrighty [22:37] good idea :) [22:38] and I'll be doing the obligatory 'I hope people from 'team' will be testing for us ;) [22:38] hopefully we'll get more people - they've had most of the cycle off [22:38] and hopefully they'll not find bugs [22:39] not sure I need to say much more than that :) [22:39] oki [22:39] :D [22:39] poke me/pleia2 about social mediaing [22:39] * pleia2 nods [22:40] knome: yep [22:40] I'll go through and cleanup dev blueprints this weekend, give us a more realistic idea of where dev is in the cycle [22:40] * flocculant notes the pleia2 nod :) [22:40] bluesabre, fantastic [22:41] flocculant, feel free to ping me with priority bugs [22:41] from memory - testing has been me/Dave and nairwolf this cycle [22:41] bluesabre: yup [22:41] I will ;) [22:41] bluesabre, you mean the grasshoppers that are taking the first class flight? [22:42] bluesabre: I need to dig webcam out - and see how that's fairing given that parole is working with clutter now, unless someone with a laptop can ... [22:42] knome, or the grasshoppers that are bird food [22:42] bluesabre, how's that "priority" though? :P [22:42] flocculant, I should be able to test it [22:42] running yak and cheese at least works [22:42] flocculant: oh it is? that's quite awesome news then [22:42] bluesabre: obviously I missed mugshot from that sentence ... [22:42] i was afraid clutter was deemed [22:43] doomed i mean [22:43] weird typo [22:43] ochosi: seems to be - works ok here [22:43] deemed doomed [22:43] * ochosi should go to bed [22:43] flocculant, (mugshot is built on libcheese) [22:43] bluesabre: mmm - ok so not clutter - not sure why I was getting that confused then [22:43] flocculant, and cheese is built on clutter [22:43] sorry for all that :D [22:44] anyway - still needs to be checked [22:44] troll [22:44] bluesabre: so what you mean is 'it could possibly work now parole does' :p [22:44] ochosi, pretty sure its still going to get shuttered [22:44] flocculant, yes, those are the words that were supposed to fldfksfjdfls [22:44] :) [22:45] ochosi, what greybird updates might we expect in time for the beta (so we know what to watch for)? [22:46] bluesabre: hard to say, depends on how much sleep i need in the next few days [22:46] oh - quick note re release notes - gonna not report any vbox/vm issues - just some 1 liner to cover the possibility [22:46] guess i have to make a list and prioritise [22:47] flocculant, sounds fair [22:47] flocculant, yeah, I wonder if we can get vbox-related things in the ubuntu release notes and just link directly to them [22:47] bluesabre: they don't really care if it's not qemu/kvm [22:47] since the desktop team agrees that they expect it to not be a good situation :) [22:47] bluesabre: i would say: don't expect much, porting greybird to 3.20 sucked out quite a bit of energy and will to live from me, so i might need more breathing space before i tackle your issues [22:48] ochosi, no problemo, I might even feel inspired to investigate it myself and send you some PRs [22:48] bluesabre: that'd be nice [22:48] bluesabre: and I'd also like to lose because if I end up having wiki issues - the release note will be on x.wiki :| [22:48] (but expect nothing) [22:49] flocculant, sure [22:49] anything else beta-wise? [22:50] I'm all done :) [22:50] currewntly [22:50] (for 2 minutes) [22:50] knome, anything? [22:50] pleia2, (you're so quiet!) anything? [22:50] bluesabre: bit longer - we've not built tomorrow's image yet:p [22:51] :) [22:51] nope [22:51] Unit193, ochosi ? [22:52] nothing from my side [22:52] Looks like we're done then. :) [22:53] #topic Schedule Next Meeting [22:53] #info knome to schedule next meeting [22:53] actually [22:53] #action knome to schedule next meeting [22:53]