[06:58] <flocculant> I see we've got dev wallpaper now we've nearly finished the cycle :p
[06:58] <Unit193> Yes!  I pestered about the wrong version number. :P
[06:59] <flocculant> :)
[07:00] <Unit193> ...Then I uploaded.
[07:02] <flocculant> blame Unit193 for the week week then :p
[07:20] <astraljava> I blame the whole weird universe on him.
[07:35] <Unit193> :(
[09:29]  * bluesabre rather enjoys the weird universe
[09:38] <Unit193> I'm...sorry?
[09:38] <Unit193> bluesabre: See krytarik's comment about your planking with Greybird?
[09:38] <bluesabre> cp -r ?
[09:38] <bluesabre> about to fix that
[09:40] <Unit193> \o/
[21:36] <bluesabre> evening all
[21:36] <knome> hello
[21:36] <mac-chaffee> hi
[21:37] <flocculant> hi bluesabre :)
[21:37] <bluesabre> hey knome mac-chaffee flocculant 
[21:38] <bluesabre> https://www.timeanddate.com/countdown/generic?p0=1440&iso=20160909T22&msg=Xubuntu%20community%20meeting
[21:39] <ochosi> still so many minutes to go
[21:40] <Unit193> ochosi: Another one! :'(
[21:40] <bluesabre> lol
[21:40] <ochosi> Unit193: i thought you said you needed some work..?
[21:41] <ochosi> bluesabre: are you free/bored before the upcoming meeting..?
[21:42] <bluesabre> ochosi, whats up?
[21:43] <ochosi> well just wanted to chat about how to continue with volumed-pulse, now that it's on git.xfce.org
[21:43] <bluesabre> alrighty
[21:44] <ochosi> so basically now that i have made notifyd's icon loading more robust, i think it would be ok to switch to symbolic icons
[21:44] <ochosi> oh, sry, brb
[21:45] <flocculant> :)
[21:45] <bluesabre> ochosi, yeah, that sounds sane to me
[21:46] <mac-chaffee> this will be my first meeting :)
[21:46] <mac-chaffee> how long have you all been here?
[21:46] <flocculant> for the meeting or in 'xubuntu'?
[21:46] <mac-chaffee> I mean how long have you all been developing on xubuntu?
[21:47] <bluesabre> I've been contributing since 2012
[21:47] <flocculant> well I don't develop - qa team - since ~2012 I think
[21:47] <flocculant> can't remember when unity happened - but it was then :)
[21:47] <bluesabre> most of the folks on the team have been around longer than me :)
[21:48] <mac-chaffee> cool! How did you get started bluesabre?
[21:48] <flocculant> same here :)
[21:48] <bluesabre> mac-chaffee, filed a bunch of bugs and annoyed ochosi, then he dragged me into here
[21:48] <flocculant> I blame astraljava and knome 
[21:49] <knome> i started contributing in 2008...
[21:49] <Unit193> bluesabre: Crap, am I older than you too? :3
[21:49] <bluesabre> Unit193, you were already here when I popped in
[21:49] <Unit193> Crap.
[21:49] <knome> haha.
[21:50] <flocculant> I kind of blame Unit193 for dragging me here in the first place
[21:50] <bluesabre> !team | community meeting in 10 minutes
[21:50] <Unit193> No you don't, I just saw you blame astraljava and knome.
[21:50] <knome> we've all dragged somebody here.
[21:50] <flocculant> Unit193: I blame them for qa - you I blame for xubuntu :p
[21:50] <bluesabre> :D
[21:51] <flocculant> come by #xubuntu-devel you said - like it would be a fleeting thing
[21:51] <mac-chaffee> lol
[21:52] <Unit193> "Oops"
[21:52] <flocculant> hah
[21:53] <bluesabre> "It's a trap" they whispered
[21:53] <Unit193> Well you were fleeing unity, soo.
[21:53] <flocculant> yup 
[21:53] <Unit193> Only one letter off!
[21:53] <flocculant> lol
[21:53] <knome> all that said... the 8 years *i've* had here have all been nice and i've made some good friends for life too
[21:54] <flocculant> I'd like to think the same
[21:54] <flocculant> not sure though - I think everyone hates qa ;)
[21:54] <Unit193> ...Have I paid penance yet?
[21:55] <flocculant> ask me in 6 months 4 weeks and 6 days :p
[21:57] <flocculant> akxwi-dave: skip button is apparently fixed
[21:58] <mac-chaffee> I guess I'll quickly introduce myself. I'm Mac. I'm a CSC student looking to contribute to some open source projects. Since xubuntu is my favorite flavor of linux, I thought I join you guys!
[21:58] <flocculant> nice :)
[21:58] <knome> o/
[21:58] <mac-chaffee> I'll save my dumb questions for after the meeting =)
[21:58] <Unit193> That's nice!  We love new victems, err, I mean.  Contributors!
[21:59] <Unit193> ...Also people that can't spell/type, like me.
[21:59] <mac-chaffee> oh yeah. I'd**
[21:59] <knome> to make matters worse for Unit193 and the like, we also have some grammar police around.
[21:59] <mac-chaffee> nervousness ;)
[22:00] <knome> no need to be nervous, we're all just regular geeks
[22:00] <bluesabre> oh boy oh boy oh boy
[22:00] <flocculant> bluesabre: is late now :p
[22:00] <bluesabre> #startmeeting Xubuntu community meeting
[22:00] <meetingology> Meeting started Fri Sep  9 22:00:26 2016 UTC.  The chair is bluesabre. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
[22:00] <meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
[22:00] <bluesabre> Who's around?
[22:00] <flocculant> fairly round 
[22:01] <bluesabre> #chair flocculant
[22:01] <meetingology> Current chairs: bluesabre flocculant
[22:01]  * flocculant always forgets that
[22:01] <bluesabre> !team | meeting time
[22:02] <knome> o/
[22:02] <pleia2> o/
[22:02] <flocculant> hi pleia2 :)
[22:02] <bluesabre> #chair knome
[22:02] <meetingology> Current chairs: bluesabre flocculant knome
[22:02] <bluesabre> #chair pleia2
[22:02] <meetingology> Current chairs: bluesabre flocculant knome pleia2
[22:02] <knome> loads of chairs
[22:02] <bluesabre> plenty!
[22:02] <bluesabre> :D
[22:03] <ochosi> o/
[22:03] <bluesabre> surprised so many are here
[22:03] <bluesabre> #chair ochosi
[22:03] <meetingology> Current chairs: bluesabre flocculant knome ochosi pleia2
[22:03] <ochosi> +1
[22:03] <knome> where are all the sofas?
[22:03] <flocculant> just join the chairs
[22:03] <bluesabre> I'm too cheap for that
[22:03] <bluesabre> ;)
[22:03] <bluesabre> lets get started then
[22:03] <flocculant> Unit193 was here - suddenly disappeared :p
[22:03] <bluesabre> #topic Open Action Items
[22:04] <bluesabre> ochosi to announc opening nominations for Xubuntu Council with timeline
[22:04] <bluesabre> well, that's gone and passed :D
[22:04] <ochosi> oh, i guess that is done :)
[22:04] <flocculant> \o/
[22:04] <bluesabre> last meeting was a while back :D
[22:05] <bluesabre> #topic Updates and Announcements
[22:05] <knome> #info The Xubuntu council is Sean Davis (bluesabre) - chair, Pasi Lallinaho (knome) and Simon Steinbeiß (ochosi)
[22:06] <ochosi> thanks flocculant for running the whole election thingy!
[22:06] <knome> yes, thank you
[22:06] <knome> and for the XSD part too
[22:06] <flocculant> welcome ofc
[22:06] <flocculant> The Xubuntu Council are 
[22:06] <flocculant> ...
[22:06] <knome> (reminds me nobody whined about the latest changes, should push them live)
[22:06] <flocculant> :p
[22:06] <bluesabre> thanks flocculant !
[22:06] <flocculant> knome: yea - works for me 
[22:07] <knome> nobody not referring to flocculant only :P
[22:07] <flocculant> #info UIFE this week
[22:07] <knome> was
[22:07] <flocculant> #info Doc String Freeze next week
[22:07] <ochosi> yeah, that ^ blows a little
[22:07] <ochosi> we still have some UI changes ahead
[22:07] <knome> that's fine
[22:07] <knome> i can take the paperwork
[22:07] <ochosi> i guess i'll do some minor Greybird tweaks if i get to it (mostly removing padding and fixing small things)
[22:08] <ochosi> and the wallpaper still needs to go live
[22:08] <knome> yeah, it needs to be finished and polished
[22:08] <flocculant> ochosi: like the minor issue with the installer? 
[22:08] <flocculant> cos that looks horrid :(
[22:08] <knome> on the subject of doc string freeze
[22:09] <bluesabre> #info Final Beta (which Xubuntu is participating in) on September 22nd, freeze on September 19
[22:09] <knome> we should make sure we don't have anything out-of-date on the docs
[22:09] <knome> and update the installer slideshow as well
[22:09] <flocculant> knome: I can do a run through on at least docs this weekend 
[22:09] <knome> i collected from david's mail he's not going to be around until october
[22:09] <flocculant> yea
[22:10] <knome> flocculant, great, if you find anything that needs updating, just send a mail to the devel list directly
[22:10] <ochosi> flocculant: yeah, also like that one
[22:10] <knome> i'll look at the installer slideshow and do the same
[22:10] <flocculant> knome: rather than do an mp?
[22:10] <ochosi> flocculant: although that's not really UIFe material, more a bugfix
[22:10] <knome> flocculant, well if you are up to doing the changes, then obviously MP is better :)
[22:10] <flocculant> ochosi: yea - just wanted to make sure it's in the pipeline is all :)
[22:11] <ochosi> flocculant: well pipeline is maybe a bit too strong, let's put it this way: i have it on the radar ;)
[22:11]  * flocculant hates his Physical Graffiti cover being just slightly out of whack too :p
[22:11] <knome> yakkety has the same version of slideshow as xenial, so no upload is done there yet
[22:11] <knome> #action flocculant to look at docs and make sure everything is up-to-date
[22:11] <meetingology> ACTION: flocculant to look at docs and make sure everything is up-to-date
[22:11] <flocculant> knome: ack mp - just wondered is why m/l :)
[22:11] <knome> #action knome to look at installer slideshow and make sure everyting is up-to-date
[22:11] <meetingology> ACTION: knome to look at installer slideshow and make sure everyting is up-to-date
[22:12] <knome> thing too, but who cares
[22:12] <flocculant> and yea ochosi I get that :)
[22:12] <knome> any other action items?
[22:12] <knome> oh, well
[22:12] <bluesabre> any other updates or announcements?
[22:12] <knome> #action knome updates the contributor docs and pushes changes lice
[22:12] <meetingology> ACTION: knome updates the contributor docs and pushes changes lice
[22:12] <knome> #undo
[22:12] <meetingology> Removing item from minutes: ACTION
[22:12] <knome> #action knome updates the contributor docs and pushes changes live
[22:12] <meetingology> ACTION: knome updates the contributor docs and pushes changes live
[22:12] <knome> sigh
[22:12] <flocculant> lice \o/
[22:13] <flocculant> awesome :p
[22:13] <bluesabre> lice /o\
[22:13] <flocculant> <- no kids at school finally 
[22:13] <bluesabre> :D
[22:13] <bluesabre> <- no kids yet
[22:13] <knome> i think the ups and anns are there
[22:13] <flocculant> yep
[22:13] <bluesabre> moving on
[22:13] <bluesabre> #topic Discussion
[22:14] <bluesabre> #subtopic Thunar
[22:14] <bluesabre> flocculant added this item... :)
[22:14] <flocculant> imagine that ...
[22:14] <flocculant> so then - during xenial the sentiment was basically this
[22:15] <flocculant> "xfce don't have anyone to test it - we should - and hope things get fixed"
[22:15] <flocculant> doesn't appear to be happening
[22:15] <bluesabre> indeed
[22:15] <knome> xfce has picked up new contributors lately though
[22:15] <flocculant> bluesabre: do you still feel "flocculant, yeah... thunar isn't getting better (even in y), and I'm not opposed to moving to a different file manager, but that suggestion tends to rock the boat a bit"
[22:15] <bluesabre> there are some new patches around, but we've had some negative tests within our team
[22:16] <knome> bluesabre, do you know if those patches have worked for anybody?
[22:16] <flocculant> because frankly while it might be ok to test things between LTS - we've landed that on LTS
[22:16] <bluesabre> knome, those patches have worked for the folks commenting on the bug report at least
[22:16] <flocculant> and now is when we should start thinking about tomorrow
[22:16] <flocculant> bluesabre: well I can easily enough comment there that it doesn't work for me on either 16.04 or 16.10
[22:17] <bluesabre> flocculant, I still feel that, and now might be the best time to start the discussion into the next cycle
[22:17] <flocculant> which makes the core 0
[22:17] <knome> that gives me hope... there is somebody working on patches and they are fixing some issues for some people
[22:17] <flocculant> knome: for how long do we wait doing nothing and just hoping? 
[22:17] <flocculant> 6 months? 12? the next LTS for 3 years? 
[22:18] <knome> i don't know, but the fact is that the bugs are present in 16.04
[22:18] <flocculant> perhaps us moving would make people take notice of the fact that thunar isn't very well and ignored
[22:18] <bluesabre> the problem seems to stem from the fact that Thunar does not have a single active maintainer... we get patches that fix a few things, but the overall issue seems unresolved
[22:18] <flocculant> easy enough to move around now (I assume) than in the last 6 months of the LTS to LTS cycle
[22:18] <knome> i'm not sure if that would add to the motivation to fix thunar though
[22:18] <bluesabre> it probably requires a much larger effort
[22:19] <knome> team members, opinions please?
[22:19] <ochosi> interestingly i came across a gtk3 port of thunar on github
[22:19] <ochosi> so there seems to be some activity even outside of the xfce team
[22:19] <knome> does it fix the issues we are experiencing? 
[22:19] <ochosi> the same thing happened with the terminal btw, i also managed to reel in a new contributor through contacting him about his port on github
[22:20] <ochosi> i'll try to do the same thing again here, but obviously no promises
[22:20] <ochosi> i haven't tested the port, so i can't say if it fixes the bug
[22:20] <ochosi> i'm pretty sure it's not final so it probably has other issues that we would rather avoid
[22:20] <flocculant> please don't anyone get me wrong here - I'd rather we used thunar - but we shouldn't be handing out half-fixed software if we can help it
[22:20] <knome> of course
[22:20] <ochosi> flocculant: yeah, i get that
[22:20] <knome> yep
[22:20] <ochosi> and you're right, now is the best time to discuss
[22:21] <bluesabre> My opinion is, we should start weighting other options, and if we're still having these same issues into Z, we employ those options early in the cycle and get some feedback
[22:21] <flocculant> bluesabre: sounds fair 
[22:21] <ochosi> yeah, sounds reasonable
[22:21] <flocculant> and I'll have some time for a cycle so I could come up with some roadmap type thing for options on that
[22:22] <bluesabre> okay, that sounds good to me
[22:22] <flocculant> so if someone wants to word that we can action me for it
[22:22] <knome> #action bluesabre to prepare testing of other file manager options
[22:22] <meetingology> ACTION: bluesabre to prepare testing of other file manager options
[22:23] <flocculant> I assume we could change throughout the Z cycle here? 
[22:23] <knome> #undo
[22:23] <meetingology> Removing item from minutes: ACTION
[22:23] <knome> #action bluesabre to prepare testing of other file manager options throughout the Z cycle
[22:23] <meetingology> ACTION: bluesabre to prepare testing of other file manager options throughout the Z cycle
[22:23] <flocculant> eg if foo was really pants we could change to bar? 
[22:23] <flocculant> bluesabre: I offered :p
[22:23] <bluesabre> We can (and should) move around to different options if the ones we try are a no-go
[22:24] <flocculant> k
[22:24] <bluesabre> "Hey I like this", "Hey its eats my desktop", "Hey, lets try that instead"
[22:24] <bluesabre> :D
[22:24] <flocculant> okey doke
[22:25] <bluesabre> Anything else we want to discuss about thunar?
[22:25] <flocculant> one thing
[22:25] <flocculant> I'm not at all sure what patches we actually have in thunar
[22:26] <flocculant> are there some that 'could' help we don't have - if so - could we have a completely plastered up one in a ppa somewhere? 
[22:26] <knome> so we make Unit193 write a report on where we stand with it?
[22:26] <ochosi> flocculant: yeah, an overview of that would be useful
[22:26] <ochosi> also with which patch is supposed to do what
[22:26] <bluesabre> current patch filenames
[22:26] <flocculant> knome: that's the price of being in -ooftopic I guess :p
[22:26] <bluesabre> 0001-Don-t-copy-templates-but-create-them-bug-8312.patch
[22:26] <bluesabre> 01_support-non-multiarch-modules.patch
[22:26] <bluesabre> 02_Fix-crashes-when-reloading-target-file-after-move.patch
[22:26] <bluesabre> 03_Fixing-missing-return-value-in-standard-view.patch
[22:26] <bluesabre> Check-if-a-thunar-file-is-still-valid-before-reloading.patch
[22:26] <ochosi> (if we don't have that in the names of the patches)
[22:26] <flocculant> which apparently we do :D
[22:27] <Unit193> There is one we don't have.
[22:27] <knome> so as Unit193 is not opposing, i take it as approving..
[22:27] <flocculant> bluesabre: quick - chair Unit193 :p
[22:27] <bluesabre> #chair Unit193 
[22:27] <meetingology> Current chairs: Unit193 bluesabre flocculant knome ochosi pleia2
[22:27] <flocculant> lol
[22:27] <pleia2> heh
[22:27] <knome> #action bluesabre and Unit193 to write a report of the state of Thunar (eg. which patches we carry and what they should do) and make sure all of them are in a PPA
[22:27] <meetingology> ACTION: bluesabre and Unit193 to write a report of the state of Thunar (eg. which patches we carry and what they should do) and make sure all of them are in a PPA
[22:28] <bluesabre> works for me
[22:28] <Unit193> knome: I dunno, I see patch, I try it, it seems to help, I accidentally push it to the repo and thus we get stuck with a wrong filename.
[22:28] <knome> Unit193, and next you paste a link to an image where a dog flies a helicopter?
[22:28] <Unit193> Yes!
[22:29] <bluesabre> :D
[22:29] <bluesabre> we're probably thunar'd away now
[22:29] <flocculant> bluesabre: so would you like some sort of 'this file-manager' adds this much bytes to image - or are we not to concerned about that at the moment? 
[22:30] <flocculant> I'd guess not currently
[22:30] <knome> i don't think the size is very much the problem
[22:30] <bluesabre> flocculant, not particularly worried about that
[22:30] <knome> if the file manager works and is generally lightweight, then who cares what the size is?
[22:30] <bluesabre> obviously dolphin is out ;)
[22:30] <flocculant> ha ha ha 
[22:30] <knome> unless the council approves it
[22:30] <bluesabre> the SD says something about qt
[22:31] <knome> yes
[22:31] <flocculant> and k - was just back in we need to save x KBs for a bit there
[22:31] <bluesabre> but that can be council'd away too
[22:31] <knome> the new version also says the council can overrule if it's sensible
[22:31] <ochosi> the new catch-phrase: "to council away"
[22:31] <flocculant> \o/
[22:32] <bluesabre> too many new phrases... I have to change "to flocculant" to "to akxwi-dave" soon
[22:32] <flocculant> hah
[22:33] <knome> bluesabre, you mean to a-nxvpwmlkdgnkd-dave
[22:33] <bluesabre> :)
[22:33] <flocculant> I'll change nicks - then akxwi-dave can alias flocculant to akxwi-dave :p
[22:33] <bluesabre> #subtopic Other Topics
[22:33] <flocculant> quick one here
[22:33] <bluesabre> Anything else that needs discussed (thats not in the Agenda)?
[22:34] <flocculant> depends on if knome does a meeting next week or not?
[22:34]  * flocculant waits
[22:34] <knome> i can do if people need/want
[22:34] <flocculant> well I just want to quickly run through beta
[22:34] <knome> otoh, there's many of us here today...
[22:34] <flocculant> so nothing to stop us doing that now
[22:34] <knome> let's do it now
[22:35] <bluesabre> We'll definitely want a meeting prior to the beta (Sep 22)
[22:35] <knome> bluesabre, mon 19 maybe?
[22:35] <flocculant> bluesabre: well we need the meeting prior to freeze which is Monday/Tuesday
[22:35] <knome> ok
[22:35] <knome> so let's schedule one for later next week
[22:35] <bluesabre> s/22/19/
[22:35] <bluesabre> alrighty
[22:36] <bluesabre> #topic Schedule Next Meeting
[22:36] <flocculant> could we perhaps weekend it? 
[22:36] <knome> hmmh.
[22:36] <knome> maybe, i can't promise yet
[22:36] <flocculant> mmk
[22:36] <ochosi> oh, just a small announcement from my side: i'm completely afk from sept 19 to sept 29
[22:36] <knome> nice...
[22:36] <ochosi> not that you really need me now that you can council away things
[22:36] <knome> or was it italy?
[22:36] <knome> :P
[22:37] <flocculant> well I'll be sending stuff out to testers 'soon' re beta to wake them up
[22:37] <bluesabre> 10 days to spam ochosi with greybird/elementary-xfce bugs
[22:37] <knome> #undo
[22:37] <meetingology> Removing item from minutes: TOPIC
[22:37] <knome> let's just go through the beta now, right?
[22:37] <flocculant> akxwi-dave and I will be checking release note
[22:37] <ochosi> bluesabre: yeah, time to spam me and get *nothing* fixed ;)
[22:37] <knome> we can still have the meeting next week
[22:37] <knome> but just in case
[22:37] <bluesabre> alrighty
[22:37] <bluesabre> good idea :)
[22:38] <flocculant> and I'll be doing the obligatory 'I hope people from 'team' will be testing for us ;)
[22:38] <flocculant> hopefully we'll get more people - they've had most of the cycle off 
[22:38] <flocculant> and hopefully they'll not find bugs
[22:39] <flocculant> not sure I need to say much more than that :)
[22:39] <knome> oki
[22:39] <bluesabre> :D
[22:39] <knome> poke me/pleia2 about social mediaing
[22:39]  * pleia2 nods
[22:40] <flocculant> knome: yep
[22:40] <bluesabre> I'll go through and cleanup dev blueprints this weekend, give us a more realistic idea of where dev is in the cycle
[22:40]  * flocculant notes the pleia2 nod :)
[22:40] <knome> bluesabre, fantastic
[22:41] <bluesabre> flocculant, feel free to ping me with priority bugs
[22:41] <flocculant> from memory - testing has been me/Dave and nairwolf this cycle
[22:41] <flocculant> bluesabre: yup
[22:41] <flocculant> I will ;)
[22:41] <knome> bluesabre, you mean the grasshoppers that are taking the first class flight?
[22:42] <flocculant> bluesabre: I need to dig webcam out - and see how that's fairing given that parole is working with clutter now, unless someone with a laptop can ...
[22:42] <bluesabre> knome, or the grasshoppers that are bird food
[22:42] <knome> bluesabre, how's that "priority" though? :P
[22:42] <bluesabre> flocculant, I should be able to test it
[22:42] <bluesabre> running yak and cheese at least works
[22:42] <ochosi> flocculant: oh it is? that's quite awesome news then
[22:42] <flocculant> bluesabre: obviously I missed mugshot from that sentence ... 
[22:42] <ochosi> i was afraid clutter was deemed
[22:43] <ochosi> doomed i mean
[22:43] <ochosi> weird typo
[22:43] <flocculant> ochosi: seems to be - works ok here
[22:43] <knome> deemed doomed
[22:43]  * ochosi should go to bed
[22:43] <bluesabre> flocculant, (mugshot is built on libcheese)
[22:43] <flocculant> bluesabre: mmm - ok so not clutter - not sure why I was getting that confused then 
[22:43] <bluesabre> flocculant, and cheese is built on clutter
[22:43] <bluesabre> sorry for all that :D
[22:44] <flocculant> anyway - still needs to be checked
[22:44] <knome> troll
[22:44] <flocculant> bluesabre: so what you mean is 'it could possibly work now parole does' :p
[22:44] <bluesabre> ochosi, pretty sure its still going to get shuttered
[22:44] <bluesabre> flocculant, yes, those are the words that were supposed to fldfksfjdfls
[22:44] <flocculant> :)
[22:45] <bluesabre> ochosi, what greybird updates might we expect in time for the beta (so we know what to watch for)?
[22:46] <ochosi> bluesabre: hard to say, depends on how much sleep i need in the next few days
[22:46] <flocculant> oh - quick note re release notes - gonna not report any vbox/vm issues - just some 1 liner to cover the possibility
[22:46] <ochosi> guess i have to make a list and prioritise
[22:47] <knome> flocculant, sounds fair
[22:47] <bluesabre> flocculant, yeah, I wonder if we can get vbox-related things in the ubuntu release notes and just link directly to them
[22:47] <flocculant> bluesabre: they don't really care if it's not qemu/kvm
[22:47] <bluesabre> since the desktop team agrees that they expect it to not be a good situation :)
[22:47] <ochosi> bluesabre: i would say: don't expect much, porting greybird to 3.20 sucked out quite a bit of energy and will to live from me, so i might need more breathing space before i tackle your issues
[22:48] <bluesabre> ochosi, no problemo, I might even feel inspired to investigate it myself and send you some PRs
[22:48] <ochosi> bluesabre: that'd be nice
[22:48] <flocculant> bluesabre: and I'd also like to lose <includes> because if I end up having wiki issues - the release note will be on x.wiki :|
[22:48] <bluesabre> (but expect nothing)
[22:49] <bluesabre> flocculant, sure
[22:49] <bluesabre> anything else beta-wise?
[22:50] <flocculant> I'm all done :)
[22:50] <flocculant> currewntly
[22:50] <bluesabre> (for 2 minutes)
[22:50] <bluesabre> knome, anything?
[22:50] <bluesabre> pleia2, (you're so quiet!) anything?
[22:50] <flocculant> bluesabre: bit longer - we've not built tomorrow's image yet:p
[22:51] <bluesabre> :)
[22:51] <pleia2> nope
[22:51] <bluesabre> Unit193, ochosi ?
[22:52] <ochosi> nothing from my side
[22:52] <bluesabre> Looks like we're done then.  :)
[22:53] <bluesabre> #topic Schedule Next Meeting
[22:53] <bluesabre> #info knome to schedule next meeting
[22:53] <bluesabre> actually
[22:53] <bluesabre> #action knome to schedule next meeting
[22:53] <meetingology> ACTION: knome to schedule next meeting
[22:53] <knome> nope
[22:53] <knome> i will
[22:53] <bluesabre> #endmeeting
[22:53] <meetingology> Meeting ended Fri Sep  9 22:53:33 2016 UTC.  
[22:53] <meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/xubuntu-devel/2016/xubuntu-devel.2016-09-09-22.00.moin.txt
[22:53] <bluesabre> :D
[22:53] <knome> thanks blu
[22:53] <knome> esabre
[22:53] <bluesabre> thanks everyone, glad we had a bit group today!
[22:53] <bluesabre> big too
[22:54] <flocculant> thanks bluesabre :)
[22:54] <Unit193> xfce4-terminal 0.6.92-1 uploaded to experimental.
[22:54] <bluesabre> :o
[22:54] <Unit193> bluesabre: Remember that voodoo thunar crash I was getting that nobody else was, well during the meeting I decided it was a good idea to try and poke around.  Downgraded exo to distro versions rather than the version from the GTK3 PPA, and everything is now fixed.  Also, that output from thunar certainly is related since that is also now gone as well (IA__gtk_tree_selection_set_select_function: 
[22:54] <Unit193> assertion 'func != NULL' failed)
[22:54] <flocculant> talking of that gtk3.20 stuff - safeish to try running them daily now? 
[22:54] <bluesabre> Unit193, aha, so I'll need to look into that then
[22:55] <mac-chaffee> Could someone bring me up to speed on why you're thinking of dropping thunar?
[22:55] <mac-chaffee> not being actively developed?
[22:55] <Unit193> mac-chaffee: It crashes, and corrupts files.
[22:55] <bluesabre> that basically summarizes it
[22:55] <Unit193> bluesabre: That, or maaaaaybe try a no-op rebuild against new exo?
[22:56] <mac-chaffee> has it always been doing that or is this a recent thing?
[22:56] <Unit193> Started in 16.04.
[22:56] <bluesabre> and similar things even before
[22:56] <Unit193> flocculant: Also, what do you mean by that precisely?
[22:58] <flocculant> Unit193: well precisely I've not got either of our gtk3.20 ppa's here - you said don't - or something like that
[22:59] <Unit193> Oh, xfce4-gtk3?  I have that enabled (or did, until exo hit), so it's reasonably safe considering I stage things in mine first.  The problem was if you upgraded xfconf, that's not a problem now.  (I personally have xfce4-notifyd and xfce4-terminal held back though.)
[23:00] <flocculant> ok cool I'll just go for it then I guess :p
[23:00] <flocculant> I did look at the terminal in vm iirc - worked - didn't like the green writing though :p
[23:01] <Unit193> That's actually the default in bashrc, it's only enabled there because xfce4-terminal isn't screwing with TERM anymore.
[23:01] <flocculant> bluesabre et al - when are we looking to drop these things in to the image anyway in general? z cycle? 
[23:01] <Unit193> (echo $TERM in gtk2 and gtk3 ones, xterm vs xterm-256)
[23:02] <flocculant> aah ok
[23:02] <bluesabre> meetings page updated
[23:02] <mac-chaffee> ok here's a noob question: What languages do you usually use for xubuntu development? C/C++?
[23:02] <flocculant> thanks :)
[23:02] <Unit193> mac-chaffee: bluesabre likes python, actually.  Xfce uses C though.
[23:02] <mac-chaffee> oh good python's my favorite too =)
[23:03] <knome> xubuntu as a project does not really have/produce a lot of code 
[23:03] <Unit193> Dev'ing it is nice, running it isn't as nice as C. :P
[23:04] <ochosi> mac-chaffee: the python bindings for xfce are dead though. bluesabre recently mentioned bringing them back to life
[23:04] <ochosi> so we'll see :)
[23:04] <bluesabre> flocculant, possibly in Z, I think we were considering until xfce 4.14 is ready, but some components could land sooner than later
[23:04]  * flocculant thought ochosi was snoring :p
[23:04] <ochosi> for the core components anything than C is a no-go
[23:04] <ochosi> flocculant: i should be
[23:04] <ochosi> ;)
[23:04] <flocculant> lol
[23:04] <knome> one can snore while typing
[23:04] <mac-chaffee> knome: what do you mean? what else is there to do?
[23:04] <bluesabre> flocculant, Unit193: the new notifyd works fine
[23:05] <flocculant> bluesabre: ok - I was hoping that akxwi-dave would hate me next cycle :p
[23:05] <Unit193> bluesabre: Cool, I'll push it up then. :P
[23:05] <flocculant> though he still might ;)
[23:05] <knome> mac-chaffee, xubuntu is mostly putting the pieces together and making sure the integration works
[23:05] <mac-chaffee> ah, so like a lot of testing?
[23:05] <Unit193> bluesabre: But that's just preferences that I held it back. :P
[23:06] <knome> mac-chaffee, testing too, but not only
[23:06] <knome> mac-chaffee, you might want to check this page if you didn't already: http://xubuntu.org/contribute/
[23:06] <flocculant> or http://docs.xubuntu.org/contributors/
[23:07] <bluesabre> Unit193, gtk3 is coming, there is no stopping it (just waiting years for it to land fully in xfce) ;)
[23:07] <Unit193> Indeed.
[23:07] <knome> the link flocculant posted is a bit more in the deep end..
[23:07] <mac-chaffee> I've just skimmed both of those, but I guess I'll look a little closer now, thanks =)
[23:08] <flocculant> in depth knome :)
[23:08] <knome> mmh well
[23:08] <knome> they are different, that's for sure .P
[23:08] <flocculant> well the qa stuff is I suppose :D
[23:08] <Unit193> New notifyd is in staging.
[23:08] <bluesabre> mac-chaffee, and if you're interested in development, there is #xfce-dev is well
[23:09] <ochosi> thanks Unit193 
[23:09] <ochosi> night everyone
[23:09] <bluesabre> night ochosi 
[23:09] <knome> nighty ochosi 
[23:09] <bluesabre> time to scavenge for food, bbl
[23:09] <knome> bon appetit
[23:10] <flocculant> night ochosi bluesabre 
[23:13]  * Unit193 ponders make[3]: *** No rule to make target 'themes/gtk-3.0/Bright/gtk.css', needed by 'all-am'.  Stop
[23:15] <flocculant> mac-chaffee: basically what you'll find is that we're mad - but nice - and the rest are helpful :p
[23:16] <mac-chaffee> I can vouch for the niceness, but maybe I have to hang around a little longer to experience madness ;)
[23:17] <flocculant> mac-chaffee: and in #xubuntu-offtopic we're also 
[23:28] <flocculant> not sure why people are reporting trusty issues on that damned xenial bug
[23:28] <flocculant> would be so much better if you could close the things
[23:28] <pleia2> humans are bad at bug reporting
[23:29] <flocculant> yup
[23:29] <flocculant> apport's not brilliant at dupes either :)
[23:29] <pleia2> yeah
[23:29] <flocculant> ddi think about commenting - but I've been there before ;)
[23:42] <flocculant> knome: I assume that updates to contributor docs includes ALL the xpl things? 
[23:43] <knome> flocculant, yep, everything in my branch
[23:43] <flocculant> I knew that ...
[23:43] <flocculant> I'm tired :p
[23:43] <knome> isn't that everything?
[23:43] <knome> :P
[23:43] <flocculant> yea afaik yep
[23:44] <knome> yeah, then it is
[23:44] <flocculant> unless you want to wait a few hours and I could do 'stupid flocculant' changes for doc page
[23:44] <flocculant> I could do that in a few hours time
[23:45] <knome> i'll likely do the stuff tomorrow, so yeah
[23:45] <flocculant> ok, I'll do an mp for that in the morning then
[23:45] <knome> yeah, please pull from my  branch and do the MP against that
[23:46] <flocculant> lp:~knome/xubuntu-docs/council-changes
[23:46] <knome> that
[23:46] <flocculant> k
[23:49] <flocculant> knome: where would I push that? lp:~flocculant/xubuntu-docs/council-changes-plus or something 
[23:49] <flocculant> I always end up confused ... 
[23:49] <knome> whatever under lp:~flocculant/xubuntu-docs/
[23:49] <knome> only the second part needs to match the project name
[23:50] <flocculant> oh right - never actually knew that
[23:50] <knome> now you do :)
[23:50] <flocculant> now I do :)
[23:50] <flocculant> hah
[23:51] <flocculant> I know we kind of expect people to understand stuff - but perhaps some of this could be in the cont docs
[23:52] <knome> unless it's somewhere else
[23:52] <flocculant> well it probably is if you manage to get the google fu search string right first time
[23:53] <flocculant> eg somewhere in lp docs
[23:53] <knome> yeah, it's probably very hidden
[23:53] <flocculant> I'd obviously not argue for us documenting apt
[23:54] <knome> sure, but if it's somewhere else, then maybe link there
[23:54] <flocculant> but something like this - 'person see's something obviously wrong with docs, gives up' 
[23:56] <flocculant> which I've done in the past as you know :)