[04:21] <Cantide> hello~
[04:36] <Cantide> I want to donate for Kilos, but I need to use a PayPal account to do so and GoFundMe doesn't have a PayPal option. If anyone has a solution, please send me a PM. Thanks.
[04:52] <paddatrapper> Hey Cantide. If you hang around someone with the answer should wake up soon 
[06:36] <Kilos> hi all, has something happened to port 7070. 2 days i cant get in on secure connection
[06:36] <Kilos> wbb
[07:54] <superfly> Cantide: I have paypal, so if you want, you can send me the money, and then I'll donate on your behalf?
[07:55] <superfly> hi Kilos
[07:56] <superfly> Cantide: are you in SA? Cause then you can do an EFT to me instead of PayPal too
[08:15] <superfly> hi deegee
[08:53] <Kilos> hi superfly inetpro and everyone else
[08:54] <Kilos> just got out the bath, so lekker warm
[08:54] <Kilos> all ok in za land?
[08:55] <Kilos> im playing doc for some days, Debs had an AS flare up, and tara went to her grans funeral far away today. so the old peeps are along
[08:55] <superfly> Kilos: all good
[09:13] <Kilos> will try sort the secure connection thing another time
[09:13] <Kilos-> 16.04 kde is too pretty for me
[09:45] <sakhi> Hello ubuntu-za, I need to centrally manage all windows machines on the network, I would like to get the following informaiton: update status(patching), packages installed, cve status, Windows OS version installed per machine, is there a free tool I can use to achive this? Preferably open source.
[09:46] <superfly> sakhi: I haven't worked with Windows in over 10 years, I really don't know. Has Google been unfruitful?
[09:51] <sakhi> superfly: Not too fruitful on this one, last time I worked on Windows was in 2003 (MCSA-2k) let me see if I can put together something that will use snmp.
[10:09] <thatgraemeguy> sakhi: WSUS
[10:09] <thatgraemeguy> or whatever its modern equivalent is called, I've been out of that game for a fair while now
[10:10] <superfly> ah yes, that's the one I was thinking of. couldn't remember its name
[10:16] <sakhi> thatgraemeguy: thanks, not sure if WSUS is free, I will check it. The thought of managing Windows machines status through a Windows management system scares me :) RHN-Satelite(not free), Chef/Puppet or any other *nix Orchastration system would be great.
[10:16] <thatgraemeguy> its free
[10:17] <thatgraemeguy> managing a significant amount of windows infrastructure is best done using the native tools, you just aren't going to do it properly otherwise
[10:17] <sakhi> thatgraemeguy: wow Windows has free stuff too ;) the world will end.
[10:17] <sakhi> true
[10:19] <Kilos-> lol
[11:05] <Kilos> roabish2 do you ever chat to the guys here
[11:05] <Kilos> paddatrapper whats up lad
[11:43] <paddatrapper> Kilos: not much. I'm at work. Ho are you doing? 
[11:43]  * superfly wonders what "work" is for paddatrapper
[11:43] <superfly> hi magespawn
[11:43] <magespawn> hi superfly
[11:45] <magespawn> Would you like some money?
[11:46] <paddatrapper> Lol. superfly it depends on what hat I'm wearing. Currently it is radio 
[11:46] <superfly> magespawn: ah yes
[11:46] <superfly> paddatrapper: do you get paid for it?
[11:47] <paddatrapper> Nope. Student organisation... 
[11:48] <paddatrapper> superfly: I realised I'm paid for very little of what I do... 
[11:48] <superfly> paddatrapper: then it's not work, it's volunteering ;-)
[11:48] <superfly> magespawn: I sent you my bank details on Telegram
[11:49] <paddatrapper> superfly: I use work to describe most things I do that aren't me studying, doesn't yet have the negative connotation 
[11:58] <Kilos> hi magespawn 
[11:59] <Kilos> paddatrapper just keep doing things that teach you more
[12:10] <paddatrapper> Kilos: I certainly am. Friend of mine has a sysadmin job for me part time during Dec/Jan which I'm quite looking forward to. Debian/Ubuntu admin training finally 
[12:11] <Kilos> great
[12:20] <Kilos> night all. sleep tight
[13:11] <Cantide> superfly, I'm in Korea
[13:11] <superfly> Cantide: oh right, now I remember
[13:13] <Cantide> ._.
[13:13] <superfly> Cantide: I'll PM you my PayPal address
[13:34] <Cantide> thanks!!!
[13:34] <superfly> You're welcome!
[13:41] <magespawn> superfly: 
[13:41] <superfly> magespawn: 
[13:41] <magespawn> sorry got distracted by work
[13:41] <superfly> np
[13:55] <magespawn> how much again? for the ibed hosting?
[13:55] <magespawn> inid
[13:55] <magespawn> ibid
[14:09] <superfly> magespawn: R100
[14:12] <magespawn> cool beans
[14:13] <magespawn> just as well you said i took telegram off my phone
[14:23] <magespawn> okay done.
[14:30] <superfly> magespawn: thanks
[15:58] <magespawn> cheers chat later all
[19:02] <kulelu88> howzit okes? hows everyone tonight?
[19:21] <paddatrapper> Hey kulelu88. Everyone seems sleepy 
[19:21] <kulelu88> paddatrapper: yeah, nobody likes chatting here
[19:22] <paddatrapper> It's so quiet without Kilos
[19:22] <superfly> hi
[19:22]  * superfly is busy fixing stuff
[19:22] <superfly> well, writing tests, at the moment
[19:23] <kulelu88> unit tests ? :D
[19:23] <paddatrapper> Seems like people like chatting. Just it seems to be short 
[19:23] <superfly> yup
[19:23] <paddatrapper> Hey superfly
[19:23] <superfly> hi kulelu88, paddatrapper
[19:23] <paddatrapper> OpenLP? 
[19:23] <superfly> paddatrapper: yup
[19:23] <kulelu88> apparently for 1 of the testing libs you have to write OOP code to test other code
[19:24] <superfly> kulelu88: I like nose2 these days. you can either use unittest, or just plain test functions
[19:24] <superfly> a colleague likes pytest, but it's too magic for me
[19:24] <kulelu88> which lib allows the writing of tests as functions? 
[19:25] <superfly> kulelu88: technically, you don't even need a test runner or a library write and run tests... it just makes it easier
[19:26] <superfly> kulelu88: I'm using http://nose2.readthedocs.io/
[19:26] <kulelu88> I like a bit of hand-holding :D 
[19:26] <paddatrapper> OOP makes unit test building easier 
[19:26] <superfly> paddatrapper: and slower. I've been writing test functions at work and it's actually simpler and easier
[19:26] <kulelu88> paddatrapper: you write OOP code mostly? 
[19:27] <superfly> kulelu88: if you write any python it's OOP
[19:27] <superfly> whether you use classes or not is up to you
[19:27] <paddatrapper> kulelu88: yup. Started my programming journey with Java and I'm now so used to OOP that anything else just feels like scripting 
[19:28] <superfly> paddatrapper: I'll help you unlearn that nonsense that Java teaches
[19:28] <superfly> paddatrapper: Java is not true OOP, Java is more COP
[19:28] <paddatrapper> Even c/c++ I just OOP for almost everything. It just makes more sense 
[19:28] <kulelu88> My first experience with OOP was C++ and I'll never go back to it
[19:29] <superfly> kulelu88: oooo, C++ can be very pretty
[19:29] <superfly> especially if you use C++11 or C++14
[19:30] <paddatrapper> superfly: lol, it certainly is very verbose and now I wouldn't use it for anything outside of assignments and the occasional tomcat Java EE app
[19:30] <superfly> paddatrapper: no, seriously, Java dents your brain
[19:30] <superfly> it twists everything so badly that you have to unlearn what things like references are
[19:30] <kulelu88> I think most varsities still use Java in 2nd/3rd year
[19:31] <paddatrapper> I do like c++, though lately I'm having to deal with C projects which take OOP and throw it out the window 
[19:31] <kulelu88> superfly: I tried to understand how functional code is different to writing functions and gluing them together and apparently, it is very very different :D
[19:31] <kulelu88> paddatrapper: have you tried imperative Go code?
[19:32] <paddatrapper> kulelu88: yup, at least at UCT second semester of first year is Java and so is first semester of second year. Then it's c++
[19:32] <paddatrapper> kulelu88: I haven't messed around with the newer languages really 
[19:32] <kulelu88> #nim seems cool, but there's too much syntax magic going on. 
[19:33] <paddatrapper> superfly: I really enjoyed moving to c++ from Java because of things like that. No more magic hidden behind the compiler 
[19:33] <paddatrapper> kulelu88: never heard of it 
[19:34] <kulelu88> paddatrapper: http://nim-lang.org/ 
[19:37] <kulelu88> reading through nim code again, it makes a lot more sense in 2016 then it previously did
[20:00] <MaNI> don't confuse the 'function' part in functional with typical programming functions, the function there refers more to function in the mathematical sense
[20:02] <kulelu88> MaNI: do you have a nice example showing how a function will look in: Python vs. Haskell ?
[20:03] <MaNI> I've never used haskell, functional languages I've had (minor) experience with include prolog and XSLT with only the second one being business world experience (i.e. not university junk)
[20:05] <kulelu88> aah. examples are sparse on the nets
[20:07] <MaNI> it's all about not having side effects basically, and most things are then recursive as a result
[20:07] <MaNI> i.e. if you call 'foo(5)' the output will always be the same, because there are no internal side effects to change the result - while in a language like python 'foo(5)' could return something different every time
[20:09] <MaNI> examples are sparse - because generally it makes no sense for regular programming, it's most heavily used in academia 
[20:09] <MaNI> with a few rare exceptions
[20:10] <kulelu88> so recursive is critical to functional coding?
[20:10] <MaNI> pretty much
[20:12] <MaNI> e.g. see https://www.rosettacode.org/wiki/Fibonacci_sequence#Prolog for a fibonacci generator in prolog - it should remind you a lot of the actual mathematical way of showing such a dequence
[20:12] <MaNI> *sequence
[20:13] <MaNI> whereas in a language like c++ one would tend to avoid the recursion https://www.rosettacode.org/wiki/Fibonacci_sequence#C.2B.2B
[20:15] <MaNI> I tried very hard to like prolog in university, at some level it seems like a better way of thinking, but I couldn't for the life of me find any practical real world uses where c++ was not better, hehe
[20:22] <kulelu88> MaNI: as they say: functional code makes hard problems easy and easy problems hard
[20:22] <kulelu88> :P
[20:24] <MaNI> I found XSLT a bit better - but thats because it isn't pure functional, also it has a very niche purpose though I mean not general purpose
[20:24] <kulelu88> Elixir is quite nice MaNI 
[20:28] <superfly> kulelu88: RabbitMQ and Wings3D are written in Erlang, take a look at them
[20:29] <kulelu88> superfly: as most programmers/hobbyists suffer from, jumping between projects is the issue
[20:31] <superfly> kulelu88: thankfully, I have one main project.
[20:32] <superfly> but yes, I'm still interested in a few sideline projects
[20:33] <kulelu88> I'm learning about async programming currently superfly . what is your main project?
[20:34] <superfly> kulelu88: OpenLP
[20:34] <superfly> https://openlp.org/
[20:34] <kulelu88> link?
[20:34] <kulelu88> cool
[20:50] <kulelu88> you plan on adding some funding model to it? superfly looks very polished
[20:51] <superfly> kulelu88: it's been around since 2004, but it could use more polish. we're not actively seeking funding, but we have paypal and gratipay
[20:51] <kulelu88> oh it's 12 years old. thought it was new
[20:51] <superfly> and the income from gratipay covers the server costs
[20:51] <superfly> kulelu88: it's been through a few iterations, but the current one has been around since 2008
[20:52] <kulelu88> python2?
[20:52] <superfly> started 2, now on 3
[20:52] <superfly> we moved to 3 at version 2.2
[20:52] <superfly> and moved to Qt5 at 2.4
[20:54] <kulelu88> what's the stats on the project? how many churches using it?
[20:56] <superfly> I don't know precisely. We have over 3000 fans on Facebook, so I'd say we probably have easily twice that using it?
[20:56] <superfly> a lot of people will just download, install, and then move on because it works
[20:56] <superfly> it's like using PowerPoint. you don't get all excited, you just use it
[20:59] <kulelu88> the man years to build it must be quite a bit by now
[21:00] <superfly> https://www.openhub.net/p/openlp
[21:01] <superfly> kulelu88: scroll down to "In a nutshell"
[21:02] <superfly> kulelu88: https://www.openhub.net/p/openlp/estimated_cost
[21:03] <superfly> that site is not all that accurate, because it's not really tracking all the code we have, but it gives you a good idea
[21:07] <kulelu88> yeah 2 million is about a low-level guesstimate 
[21:09] <superfly> yup. I estimate my US-based salary would be about 100k per year, which ups the amount to 4 mil
[21:09] <kulelu88> what is your years experience as a python programmer?
[21:10] <superfly> about as long as OpenLP 2.x has been around, so about 8 years
[23:37] <Kilos> ai!