[12:00] <linuxpt2> Hello.
[12:02] <linuxpt2> I spoke to another contrib late last night, user K----- they said to pop by here and speak to sakrecoer
[12:02] <linuxpt2> I just wondered what kind of things this project needs help with the most?
[12:57] <linuxpt2> If anyone can answer my question feel free to reply - I will be away for a few hours but will check this window when I return, many thanks.
[15:09] <linuxpt2> I am back now
[15:16] <eylul> hi linuxpt2, sakrecoer might be around a little later. out of curiosity what was your question?
[15:17] <linuxpt2> i posted it earlier here, let me copy paste it...
[15:17] <linuxpt2> 13:00] <linuxpt2> Hello. [13:02] <linuxpt2> I spoke to another contrib late last night, user K----- they said to pop by here and speak to sakrecoer [13:02] <linuxpt2> I just wondered what kind of things this project needs help with the most? [13:57] <linuxpt2> If anyone can answer my question feel free to reply - I will be away for a few hours but will check this window when I return, many thanks.
[15:19] <linuxpt2> It was krytarik and we have just spoke again here via PM, he did advise me that the mailing list and contrib web pages would be worth reading so I will do that very soon
[15:19] <linuxpt2> and also, he mentioned testing is needed and said the mailing list may provide more of an idea etc
[15:26] <eylul> oh yeah sounds like krytarik covered most of it :)
[15:27] <linuxpt2> Good to know, thanks. I'm just about to see if I can check the mailing list now.
[15:27] <eylul> but yeah I would suggest stay around, in IRC and mailing list. We are a bit in a post release lull but I expect things will pick back up soon! :)
[15:27] <eylul> *nods*
[15:28] <linuxpt2> Yeah I will remain in this irc room for the rest of the day just in case
[15:30] <eylul> linuxpt2, how familiar are you with IRC btw? 
[15:30] <linuxpt2> I have used it not too much over the years to be honest, but I can get by ... just about!
[15:32] <linuxpt2> What made you ask?
[15:32] <eylul> linuxpt2: ok, well one thing is if you tag somebody, like I do like this. it will highlight it for the user, useful if they are alt-tabbed. :)
[15:33] <linuxpt2> Ah, thanks!
[15:33] <linuxpt2> I didn't want to harrass anyone directly initially haha
[15:34] <eylul> :D I do forget too, but yeah it is especially useful if the person is not there, but reading the backlog. (a lot of us are using server side logging solutions to keep a backlog) :)
[15:34] <eylul> nah, it is perfectly fine to tag somebody if you are trying to address them. 
[15:34] <linuxpt2> Well, this is my first time here so I respect ettiquette
[15:35] <eylul> :) 
[15:35] <linuxpt2> I didnt want to shout people as an unknown ;o)
[15:35] <eylul> that's understandable! but just letting you know it is ok. 
[15:36] <linuxpt2> Thanks, I will read the ML first but may do it later just in case sakrecoer hasnt appeared or I still have a query
[15:36] <eylul> *nods*
[15:57] <sakrecoer> greetings linuxpt2 ! welcome :)
[15:58] <sakrecoer> hi all!
[15:59] <linuxpt2> Hi there
[15:59]  * eylul silently sits in the room and listens in
[16:00] <linuxpt2> I am just going to check out the mailing lists but generally wanted to ask what kind of things does the project need the most help with - eylul and krytarik mentioned testing is a big thing
[16:01] <sakrecoer> thats great linuxpt2 ! the mailing list is a good starting point. it is sometimes slower than irc, but it has more eyes and allows for backlog in a different way
[16:02] <sakrecoer> linuxpt2: what would you be comfortable with doing? like, are you into code or do you prefer things like PR?
[16:04] <linuxpt2> honestly it has been years since i coded and I am aiming to relearn going forward but I think it would be the non coding tasks that would be best for me to tackle
[16:04] <sakrecoer> linuxpt2: the team is small and we take any help available. at the same time, packagers is what is hardest to find it seems..
[16:04] <sakrecoer> linuxpt2: cool!
[16:04] <linuxpt2> If i can literally do it, i am happy to tackle it
[16:05] <linuxpt2> the only reason i wouldnt try is if i knew it was beyond me
[16:05] <linuxpt2> i did just type a bit about myself in pm to rylul - shall i just copy past that to you in pm so you have an idea?
[16:05] <linuxpt2> eylul i meant
[16:06] <sakrecoer> linuxpt2: you can learn a lot here! i'm not very technical, but i've come a long way with a litle help from the team.. long way for me anyway :)
[16:07] <sakrecoer> linuxpt2: sure, if you are comfortable with i. ( the channel is logged) i am interested anyways :)
[16:07] <sakrecoer> with *it
[16:07] <linuxpt2> howmuch can you paste in 1 go?
[16:08] <sakrecoer> ah, right... 
[16:08] <sakrecoer> you could put it in pastebin and link maybe?
[16:08] <sakrecoer> linuxpt2: ^
[16:26] <linuxpt2> back
[16:26] <sakrecoer> maybe to begin with, you could help with documentation?
[16:26] <linuxpt2> i will now wipe that onlinenotepad but you can save it before i do if you want
[16:26] <sakrecoer> that is something that isn't tied to a hardcoded deadline..
[16:27] <sakrecoer> and it can be a fun way to explore the various applications we distribute
[16:27] <sakrecoer> for me, you can wipe it linuxpt2 
[16:27] <linuxpt2> i was thnking the project docs myself as i noticed a user gave it 4/10 mentioning how outdated some areas were - is it fair to say that docs are the least liked tassk that needs the most help hen?
[16:29] <sakrecoer> yes, most of what we have is very old..
[16:29] <sakrecoer> i don't know what the deal is with docs...
[16:29] <sakrecoer> i've done very little, i wouldn't say its boring, but its hard to finish somehow...
[16:30] <linuxpt2> haha docs are boring!
[16:30] <linuxpt2> but often people underestimate the value of them
[16:30] <linuxpt2> users always need good supporting info
[16:31] <linuxpt2> i would be happy to work on documentation
[16:31] <linuxpt2> and it would be a likely good fit ofr my condition
[16:31] <sakrecoer> it depends how you do it... i think the main issue is what you underline: its porly rewarded, because people only reflect about the work behind it when they can't gind docs. and generaly that reflexion is limited to: huh! no doc wtf?
[16:32] <linuxpt2> i appreciate products and projects with good docs
[16:32] <sakrecoer> s/gind/find
[16:32] <linuxpt2> my biggest gripe when i first started using linux (ubuntu) about 10 years ago ...was the docs
[16:33] <linuxpt2> often you find coding wizards are never able to quite convey usage of what they make to just normal users
[16:33] <sakrecoer> i,ve been thinking about this quite a lot recently in fact. if we could announce new pieces of docs better, we could gather feedback on it as well..
[16:33] <linuxpt2> it is hard as when you spend all that time making it, you are often slightly blinded to seom things average users would not quite understand - eg as you are dealing with it yourself all the time so get used to it
[16:34] <sakrecoer> yes, that is where more feedback would be usefull
[16:34] <sakrecoer> and also it would make it more rewarding for those writing it.
[16:35] <linuxpt2> ther are some great projects and great products which i use, love and respect the work that went into them a lot...but having said that some of my fave pieces of software are actaully let down by docs that just dont quite convey how to easily use said, great software.
[16:35] <sakrecoer> linuxpt2: have you got a launchpad account?
[16:35] <linuxpt2> and for most power users etc docs not being easy to follow isnt too bad 
[16:36] <linuxpt2> but for the non power users eg the 90% of ppl - those unclear docs can be the barrier between the software getting widely used and the software being given up on by normal users
[16:36] <linuxpt2> no i dont have a launch pad account yet i will make one soon
[16:37] <sakrecoer> how about picking a piece of software you enjoy, that is distributed in Studio, and begin on some wiki page?
[16:38] <sakrecoer> wiki page for it.. you could begin typing ut localy or however you want, and then once you have an account on launchpad we'll give you access to efit the wiki, linuxpt2 ?
[16:40] <linuxpt2> sure - i will sorting out an install of studio this weekend but can you suggest a software that would be needing a wiki the most ?
[16:40] <sakrecoer> it would be nice to introduce yourself on the ububtustudio-devel mailing list. doesn't need to be detailed cv, just say hello so those who aren't here also can rejoice from you reaching out to help!?
[16:41] <linuxpt2> eg can you direct me to one that needs help the most?
[16:41] <linuxpt2> or do they all equally need wiki help equally generally speaking?
[16:42] <linuxpt2> i will intro myself on there shortly after this convo
[16:42] <sakrecoer> jack and pulse are quite a mistery to many, but another one that would be valuable is how to pull in ububtustudio into another ubuntu flavour and have everything work..
[16:42] <sakrecoer> both these have pages, but they are old..
[16:42] <linuxpt2> cool i am dumping all this into a notepad file locally so i can form a plan
[16:43] <sakrecoer> generaly, any softeÃ¤ware _you_ enjoy and understand diserves your take on its operation being documented.
[16:44] <sakrecoer> you can also look the irc log of this channel, hold on i'l grab it for you
[16:44] <linuxpt2> sounds like a plan - would these areas suit you guys for hel even if my effort is a bit hit and miss initially ? eg contributing in bits and ieces?
[16:44] <linuxpt2> pieces
[16:45] <linuxpt2> for help i meant
[16:45] <sakrecoer> yes :) and you can't really miss. worst case scenario, someone corrects you and you learn something.
[16:46] <linuxpt2> yeah sure ... i've never had much room for an ego and prefer to just always keep learning
[16:46] <linuxpt2> so always happy to be corrected 
[16:46] <linuxpt2> and used to it in tech
[16:47] <sakrecoer> best cawe scenario, you learn something from researching to write the docs, then every one learns something, then everyone is happy and gratefull!
[16:47] <linuxpt2> thanks for taking the time now to answer my query etc
[16:47] <linuxpt2> true
[16:48] <sakrecoer> :) thank _you_ for engaging with us!
[16:48] <linuxpt2> i will leave myself in here but will go quiet now - need to see what the mailing list is all about etc and to get a laucnhpad account and do the ML intro etc
[16:48] <linuxpt2> no problem
[16:49] <linuxpt2> i felt quilty reading the project was in need of contribs
[16:49] <linuxpt2> as i always thought ubuntu studio was a great project back when i first found it
[16:49] <linuxpt2> guilty even
[16:50] <linuxpt2> and i want to get back into tech etc and it seems like a great way by helping out on Ubuntu Studio
[16:50] <sakrecoer> don't be affraid to poke arround; you'll come a long way with a lil patience and regard for the humans behind the irc handle
[16:51] <linuxpt2> indeed
[16:52] <sakrecoer> linuxpt2: me personaly, i don't believe stupid questions exist: there are only unanswered questions
[16:52] <sakrecoer> good to have you arround! i look forward to read your work!
[16:52] <linuxpt2> haha while i agree, this will make you wonder.... http://slash7.com/2006/12/22/vampires/
[16:53] <linuxpt2> no problem and thanks for having me - i look forward to having no typos haha
[16:54] <sakrecoer> haha! thats why i say 'UNanswered' question. 
[16:55] <sakrecoer> answered questions comming back isn't stupid, it cease existing after the 3rd time :D
[16:59]  * sakrecoer moves fingers mysteriously in front of his eyes to illustrate how to make help-vampire magicalky disapear
[17:00] <sakrecoer> this said, i'm very goid at forgetting answers sometime, lol
[17:04] <eylul> if something keeps getting asked, it probably means we should document it on wiki somewhere :P
[17:05] <eylul> but yeah I am cautious about such articles, on one hand, I get what they are referring to, on other hand through... 
[17:05] <eylul> I'd rather have people ask too many questions than too few, and feel silently confused, which in my experience, happens much more often in teams
[17:05] <eylul> than the other end
[17:05] <sakrecoer> yes lol, far better than moving fingers mytsteriously in front of eyes!! hahs
[17:06] <sakrecoer> (documenting the answer that is)
[17:06] <eylul> :D
[17:07] <sakrecoer> eylul: and you are so right. not daring to ask is the worst feeling ..
[17:07] <sakrecoer> one of tge worst anyway
[17:07] <eylul> :)
[17:08] <eylul> I know I don't like it. 
[17:08] <eylul> and the problem is it keeps people from joining the group
[17:11] <sakrecoer> in that sense articles like that probably can have a hard effect on people with high anticipative timidity..
[17:11] <eylul> *nods*
[17:12] <eylul> that's my concern. calling names, are highly unlikely to stop actual people who does this behavior from doing it (not googling being the root of the problem)
[17:12] <eylul> and much more likely to further intimidate people who are already hesitant, who ARE likely to read it
[17:13]  * sakrecoer nods
[17:14] <sakrecoer> i'm for dinner.. been on full throttle since 8am... so i might get into powersave modecafter that.
[17:14] <sakrecoer> *off
[17:15] <eylul> bon apetit
[17:15] <eylul> :)
[17:15] <eylul> and *hug*
[17:15]  * sakrecoer is euther becoming an old fart or just in pace readaption mode
[17:15] <eylul> its the new job thing
[17:16] <sakrecoer> ye.. :| ... its ok, cause its fun though.... :)
[17:16] <sakrecoer> bye now!
[17:16]  * sakrecoer hugs everyonr
[17:17] <eylul> (also one thing to note is that article refers to users with excessive questions, not so much new volunteers, from what I can tell)
[18:53] <linuxpt2> testing...
[19:31] <sakrecoer> any news about the status with RT? The ticket is awfully quiet, but perhaps krytarik and eylul have heard something from knome?
[19:32] <eylul> we'll probably nag it next week. I am not sure where we ended up. 
[19:35] <krytarik> sakrecoer: Nope, not any more that is or isn't on the ticket.
[19:36] <sakrecoer> i will bump it again then...
[19:36] <sakrecoer> about time..