[02:15] <tsimonq2> Hai hai hai y'aaaaaaaaaaall
[03:16]  * ahoneybun still wonders of fixing that other package...
[03:16] <ahoneybun> PS Vita software
[03:17] <ahoneybun> https://github.com/codestation/qcma
[14:03] <eylul> Hi! I had a question concerning the ubuntu-side package of calligra. would this be a good place to ask this question? 
[14:20] <BluesKaj> Hiyas all
[14:24] <tarator> Did I already mention, that Kubuntu 16.04 is unusble? Kwin/Plasma/X11 crashes regularly and setting up a second screen doesn't work. This really makes this distribution unusable for endusers! Who decided to rollout this release? This is really a shame. 16.04 is the last version of (K)ubuntu which is landing on any of my computers. This is the worst version for years! Does anyone of the developers even use it for themselves?
[14:26] <ahoneybun> tarator: we did, for quite a while
[14:26] <ahoneybun> but as any operating system we can't test every hardware setup
[14:27] <ahoneybun> also if you have NVIDIA + Intel it is even more tricky at times
[14:28] <tarator> I'm using dual screens on 4 different machines 82 laptops with second screen, 2 desktop-pc's with two screens) none of them are working properly. The settings getting lost almost every second time... I tried to activate backports on one machine, but that also doesn't help!
[14:28] <ahoneybun> eylul: I think Calligra was blacklisted from the repos for a major bug
[14:28] <ahoneybun> once that is fixed with an SRU then it will be back
[14:28] <tarator> You can't tell me, that this works on your machines with out-of-the-box installations...
[14:28] <ahoneybun> tarator: I had a decent working machine tbh
[14:32] <tarator> ahoneybun: this might be... but since Kubuntu changed to plasma 5 this distribution is unusable in my opinion. Ahhh... even when I think how often the Control-Bar disappears, I'm getting really angry!
[14:32] <ahoneybun> the move to Plasma 5 has been bumpy but I think it really is nice in 16.04 +
[14:36] <tarator> sometimes I really think I'm using a different distribution! Plasma 5 is still extremely buggy! I'm really missing the latest version of plasma 4. they have been really good. The thing is with plasma 5, that t's really hard to find out what is the root of the problems, hence it's almost impossible for a everyday-user to fix them for myself. The COntrolbar and kscreen problems though are ocurring for a way too long time now! th
[14:36] <tarator>  It's really no fun, when such crucial things are not working properly when you have to work with your computer.
[14:36] <tarator> Also the support of GTK programs is horrible. Have you ever tried to use Eclipse in KDE? 
[14:37] <ahoneybun> I have not, but there really is nothing stopping someone from using them on any desktop
[14:38] <DarinMiller> tarator: I just joined the converstaion.  Which version of kubuntu are you running?
[14:38] <tarator> 16.04
[14:38] <tarator> one with backports, three without...
[14:38] <DarinMiller> Backports installed?
[14:38] <tarator> yes. But the problems are still there on the machine with backports...
[14:39] <eylul> ahoneybun: I didn't realize that. My question was if there was any plans to switch the krita that is part of the calligra package to the current one. (Krita is about to hit 3.1, the one on calligra package is 2.9.11 I believe). (there also seems to be a krita package stuck on queue to debian experimental so quite confused on the status on things)
[14:40] <ahoneybun> eylul: well we pull most packages from debian so if it's stuck in sid then it might hit 17.04
[14:40] <ahoneybun> eylul: you are free to use the krita snap which is 3.1
[14:40] <ahoneybun> sudo snap install krita
[14:40] <tarator> However: I'm done with kubuntu. This distribution really disappointed me. On my ext computer I'm changing. This is sad somehow since I'm using Kubuntu since 2007 but the last two years have really been exhausting....
[14:41] <eylul> ahoneybun: yeah I don't know it has been stuck there for over a month at this point, and yeah I believe snap still has the nvidia bug?
[14:41] <ahoneybun> tarator: I can understand the pain about that, as we have been evolving internally
[14:41] <ahoneybun> eylul: I never hit that issue but I heard it was fixed
[14:42] <eylul> ahoneybun: the bug says it was fixed, then the fix was reverted because it broke things worse? 
[14:43] <ahoneybun> eylul: tbh I've have not been up to date about the issue, but I did not hit it on my own NVIDIA hardware
[14:43] <eylul> I don't know the bug on launchpad might be out of date. We'll need to look into that. (I am not entirely certain if we can add a snap by default to the distro. *is still new to this*)
[14:43] <ahoneybun> but your free to try it then uninstall it
[14:43] <ahoneybun> eylul: on any Ubuntu based distro you can add any snap
[14:43] <eylul> No I mean if we can add it to the distro image
[14:44] <ahoneybun> eylul: oh and spin your own image you mean?
[14:44]  * eylul should have probably mentioned she is asking this on behalf of the ubuntu studio team
[14:44]  * eylul chuckles
[14:45] <ahoneybun> oh ok that makes since then
[14:45] <eylul> :D
[14:45] <ahoneybun> eylul: you can hope into #snappy maybe for that question
[14:45] <eylul> good idea
[14:45] <ahoneybun> not sure about making them default
[14:46] <ahoneybun> I'm sure it's possible as the ubuntu core is just snaps anyway
[14:46] <eylul> no idea either, will read up on it. as for the debian packages. so I guess you are not modifying the package from ubuntu side? (we saw the calligra package at a "ubuntu" suffix on end so)
[14:47] <ahoneybun> eylul: I see krita in xenial but not yakkety
[14:47] <ahoneybun> mm
[14:47] <ahoneybun> at 2.9.7
[14:47] <eylul> yeah calligra package was removed at last second from yakkety, which meant no krita. 
[14:47] <eylul> I thought it was back through updates through
[14:48] <ahoneybun> I think it's still in the archive but just blacklisted
[14:48] <eylul> I see
[14:49] <ahoneybun> I see a bug report from a Ross about adding it back
[14:49] <eylul> *nods*
[14:49] <ahoneybun> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntustudio-meta/+bug/1633129
[14:49] <ahoneybun> says it can be added again which is weird
[14:49] <eylul> that was more a reminder
[14:50] <ahoneybun> eylul: I would think it would make more sense to just push a 3.0.1 release out as well
[14:50] <ahoneybun> but I'm not a MOTU
[14:50] <eylul> *nods* well
[14:51] <eylul> to do that krita 3.0.1 (or 3.1, or 3.0.2) needs to get into debian
[14:51] <ahoneybun> is there a bug report that is still open?
[14:51] <eylul> or if we can do it via snap - a bug report about which part?
[14:51] <ahoneybun> about it not being in yakkety
[14:52] <ahoneybun> darn mhall119 is out of the country for UbuCon...
 We have new krita building on ou ci server afaik, but as you say it needs to get into debian 1st before we can run with it
[14:52] <ahoneybun> sgclark: doing well?
[14:52] <ahoneybun> I was thinking about that acheronuk
[14:53] <ahoneybun> wow clive really did delete everything on LP
[14:53] <sgclark> ok I guess, for early on a Saturday morning
[14:53] <acheronuk> https://launchpad.net/~kubuntu-ci/+archive/ubuntu/unstable/+packages?field.name_filter=krita&field.status_filter=published&field.series_filter=
[14:54] <acheronuk> ahoneybun: yes, sadly he did
[14:54] <ahoneybun> sgclark: that's good
[14:54] <ahoneybun> acheronuk: I can understand why, the emails mostly all went to him if something broke from the PPAs
[14:54] <eylul> acheronuk ahoneybun: still new at this. what is kubuntu-ci if you don't mind me asking?
[14:55] <ahoneybun> eylul: it's a bot that builds our packages for us
[14:55] <ahoneybun> basically
[14:55] <eylul> oh
[14:55] <ahoneybun> if you hang with us cool folks you'll see it post build reports ;)
[14:55] <acheronuk> ahoneybun: yep. wasn't criticising that decision. Just wish he had copied them somewhere else beforehand
[14:56] <eylul> ah :D 
[14:56] <acheronuk> eylul: continuous integration. builds the latest KDE stuff from source with our latest development packaging
[14:57] <eylul> ah!
[14:57] <ahoneybun> eylul: seems like someone by sakrecoer was in here a few months ago about it
[14:57] <eylul> we have been trying to sort this one out for a while now
[14:57] <eylul> (sakrecoer is our current team lead in ubuntustudio)
[14:58] <acheronuk> eylul: means that when we are able to get new stuff into kubuntu/ubuntu, we are already well prepared for it
[14:58] <acheronuk> in theory, anyway
[14:58] <eylul> I see!
 eylul: Tell sakrecoer I say hai. ;)
[14:58] <ahoneybun> eylul: https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntustudio-dev/ubuntu-seeds/ubuntustudio.yakkety
[14:59] <eylul> ok. so basically right now the bottleneck is on debian end! (tsimonq2, I'll let him know :D)
[14:59] <ahoneybun> recent fix was about krita
[14:59] <ahoneybun> oh right krita was breaking the live cds
[14:59] <ahoneybun> dvds
[15:00] <eylul> ahoneybun: yes we added it, then it went out of repo. :D and it could have came back in but that was literally the day of release.. so that actually MIGHT be the reason for blacklist (at least for US side of things)
[15:00] <ahoneybun> eylul: it was causing it for every flavor I thinkk
[15:00] <eylul> yep
[15:01] <ahoneybun> first let's see if it was just blacklisted
[15:01] <ahoneybun> tsimonq2: any where to go to ask about the archive?
[15:02] <ahoneybun> acheronuk: I see that clive is still in #ubuntu-release
[15:04] <eylul> I think independently, I'll have to go to debian kde packaging team to see if there is anything we can do to get the krita 3 package through
[15:05] <acheronuk> http://packages.ubuntu.com/yakkety-updates/krita
[15:05] <eylul> unless I am mistaken?
[15:05] <acheronuk> ahoneybun: clive only bailed from kubuntu channels AFAIK
 Well if we absolutely can't get it in Debian, we need to hunt down a MOTU to upload
 Then it goes in the NEW queue
[15:06] <eylul> MOTU?
 Master Of The Universe
[15:06] <ahoneybun> well it's back in 16.10
[15:06] <ahoneybun> you can install it
[15:06] <eylul> ahoneybun: I know. 
[15:07] <eylul> tsimonq2: I assume you don't mean the debian new queue?
[15:07] <ahoneybun> so you need a way to update people to include it?
[15:07]  * eylul is still trying to learn how the package path works
[15:08] <acheronuk> update to the studio meta I would guess
 eylul: Ubuntu NEW queue. ;)
[15:09] <eylul> oh!
[15:10]  * acheronuk goes for a snooze
[15:10] <ahoneybun> night acheronuk
[15:10] <eylul> gnight acheronuk
[15:11] <acheronuk> not night. just a nap
[15:11] <acheronuk> :P
 I'm working for 6 hours today.
[15:12] <ahoneybun> acheronuk: backport-landing testing for 16.04?
 I start at 11 AM, get off of work at 5 PM
[15:13] <acheronuk> ahoneybun: I have been testing what is in the ppas ready to go in backports-landing. I am not found any showstoppers yet. so I guess we may do that in the next few days
[15:14] <ahoneybun> acheronuk: I'm setting up a VM for 16.04 atm so I can be ready
[15:14] <eylul> ahoneybun and tsimonq2 thanks for all the help (also catches up with ubuntu-release information as well) I'll go bother debian people and keep you in the loop as well as to what I learn. (I'll also continue to lurk here for a while probably :D) 
[15:14] <ahoneybun> \o/ eylul
 OK. o/ :)
[15:15] <ahoneybun> feel free to hang around
[15:15] <eylul> :)
[15:15] <acheronuk> ahoneybun: just had to backport appstream, packagekit and aptdaemnon for xenial to get plasma-discover in, which is my main doubt now about breaking other xenial stuff
[15:16] <acheronuk> ahoneybun: currently they are here: https://launchpad.net/~rikmills/+archive/ubuntu/staging1
[15:16] <ahoneybun> acheronuk: how did you get discover to work without the new Qt and kirigami?
[15:16] <acheronuk> ahoneybun: those are only optionals in plasma 5.8
[15:16] <ahoneybun> oh ?
[15:17] <ahoneybun> the new Discover set kirigami as a hard dep no?
[15:17] <ahoneybun> since it's UI is different
[15:18] <acheronuk> ahoneybun: https://launchpadlibrarian.net/293949945/buildlog_ubuntu-xenial-amd64.plasma-discover_5.8.3-1ubuntu1~ubuntu16.04~ppa2_BUILDING.txt.gz
[15:19] <ahoneybun> well then
[15:19] <ahoneybun> very nice acheronuk
[15:23] <acheronuk> we can maybe add a kirigami based build later
 maybe
 but this update will be amazing
[16:22] <tsimonq2> Off to work o/
[16:24] <acheronuk> have fun
[16:28] <acheronuk> wxl: simon was asking me about the timing for the creation of the kubuntu.org email aliases. the wiki says 48hrs, but mine took about 4 days and from a search, that does not seem untypical. so I guess if not sorted by say Tues, then ping ubuntu IS
[17:25] <[Relic]> What is the list of ppas needed to upgrade 16.10 to plasma 5.8.x; the normal "it is in backports" doesn't seem to work
 backport-landing but ATM you need the staging1 ppa from rikmills
 But still needs more testing
[17:37] <[Relic]> landing doesn't want to work (404 not found on binary-i386/packages) so guess no go on 5.8; didn't want to report a bug (with an older version 5.7.5) without knowing if it was fixed or not, and wanted to see if you could get 2 xscreens to work properly and independantly like they did up to 14.04
[17:48] <Dr_Coke> is this the development room of kubuntu?
[17:54] <acheronuk> ahoneybun: at the moment they are not in landing yet, so that won't work
[17:56] <DarinMiller> Dr_Coke: yes, this is kbuntu packagers hangout IRC
[18:03] <Dr_Coke> thanks DarinMiller
[18:04] <Dr_Coke> Do you guys develop ubuntu? or you just package ubuntu with kde? or what goes on?
[18:11] <ahoneybun> Dr_Coke: we package up KDE software for Ubuntu and ship with Ubuntu package to make Kubuntu
[18:11] <ahoneybun> basically
[18:28] <Dr_Coke> oh thanks
[18:28] <Dr_Coke> honeybun
 Np
[20:23] <ahoneybun> acheronuk: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/23502228/
[20:23] <ahoneybun> dist-upgrade after the other updates
[20:24] <ahoneybun> just posting just in case something happens
[20:24] <acheronuk> that is intended
[20:24] <ahoneybun> alright cool
[20:24] -kubuntu-ci:#kubuntu-devel- Project xenial_unstable_muon build #33: FAILURE in 6 min 55 sec: http://kci.pangea.pub/job/xenial_unstable_muon/33/
[20:33] -kubuntu-ci:#kubuntu-devel- Project xenial_unstable_muon build #34: STILL FAILING in 3 min 45 sec: http://kci.pangea.pub/job/xenial_unstable_muon/34/
[20:36] <ahoneybun> acheronuk: that went flawlessly
[20:36] <ahoneybun> amzing
[20:36] <acheronuk> \o/
[20:37] <ahoneybun> lovely
[20:38] <ahoneybun> the new login is awesome
[20:38] <ahoneybun> acheronuk: http://imgur.com/a/Gpd7t
[20:39] <ahoneybun> opps
[20:42] <ahoneybun> I mean even with the NVIDIA driver on and it worked perfectly
[20:44] <acheronuk> great. that blue login screen is a bit of a shock if you haven’t seen it before
[20:44] <ahoneybun> yea lol
[20:45] <ahoneybun> all my apps have opened with no isses and internet works
[20:45] <ahoneybun> so +1 on my end lol
[20:46] <acheronuk> :)
[20:47] <ahoneybun> wow new discover too
[20:49] <acheronuk> it still won't finf some things like VLC, but as far as I can tell that is more a problem with the the ubuntu appstream data being incomplete for some apps, rather than a fundamental discover problem
[20:51] <ahoneybun> I'mn trying to use the Now Planel
[20:51] <ahoneybun> Dock panel
[20:54] <acheronuk> that work with plasma 5.8 now?
[20:54] <ahoneybun> it should
[20:55] <ahoneybun> I installed it just don't know how to make it
[21:02] <acheronuk> confusing as there is a plasmoid AND a panel
[21:05] <ahoneybun> I don't see the panel option
[21:05] <ahoneybun> ohhh
[21:05] <ahoneybun> acheronuk: the plasmoid is for the settings
[21:10] <acheronuk> ahoneybun: you sure, because if I install the plasmoid from the store I get a freefloating plasmoid version. vs a panel which only docks at a screen edge
 02
 I don't get anything
[21:42] <acheronuk> ahoneybun: what a faff. got it working. but it clearly needs a lot more work. I couldn't use it as it is
[21:43] <valorie> acheronuk: do we have testing needing done for 16.10? if so, what
[21:44] <valorie> I'm so tempted to upgrade to zesty
[21:46] <acheronuk> valorie: currently plasma 5.8.3 and FW 5.27 are in the staging ppas for zesty. to upgrade plasma though, you need to do a little juggling with the zesty -proposed archive repo
[21:48] <valorie> maybe I should wait on zesty
[21:48] <valorie> anything to test for Yakkety?
[21:50] <acheronuk> valorie: ahoneybun just tested the potential yakkety backports of plasma and frameworks, and said it was 'flawless'
[21:51] <valorie> cool
[21:51] <valorie> so we have the new Qt ?
[21:51] <acheronuk> ppa:kubuntu-ppa/staging-frameworks and ppa:kubuntu-ppa/staging-plasma
[21:51] <valorie> I've been paying more attention to other stuff and not testing
[21:52] <valorie> excellent
[21:52] <acheronuk> valorie: New Qt is not required for plasma 5.8. the 5.6.1 in Yakkety already is good enough
[21:52] <valorie> oh good
[21:52] <acheronuk> It's just Xenial that needs new Qt
[21:52] <acheronuk> as that is stuck on 5.5
[21:54] <valorie> updating and full-upgrading now
[21:54] <valorie> thank you acheronuk!
[21:54] <valorie> and everyone else who made this possible
[22:21] <[Relic]> Any idea when plasma 5.8 would be available (as a package/backports)?
[22:22] <valorie> once we get 1. uploaded to zesty
[22:22] <valorie> 2 thoroughly tested
[22:22]  * valorie is testing now!
[22:24]  * acheronuk is testing
[22:33]  * mamarley is also testing!
[22:34] <valorie> so far so good, mamarley?
[22:35] <mamarley> Yep, no problems so far. :)
[22:39] <[Relic]> I am just hoping it finally after a couple years abscence will allow me to have 2 seperate independant screens without too much work
[22:42] <valorie> latest plasma should do that for you
[22:43] <[Relic]> 14.04 was so easy run nvidia-settings and done; have never been successful at doing that with kde5, or with anything to get that to happen
[22:44] <valorie> blame Qt 5 for being slow there
[22:46] <[Relic]> one screen over 2 monitors easy, but trying with 2 xscreens I can never seem to get seperate plasmashell (sddm, or whatever I need to pull it off) instance on each monitor
[22:47] <valorie> oh
[22:47] <valorie> two sessions at the same time?
[22:47] <valorie> I've not heard of anyone doing that, but then....
[22:47] <valorie> don't know everything
[22:48] <[Relic]> I don't know where to look to pull that off either; but that sounds correct, in 14.04 it was make 2 xscreens and 2 sessions would show up; figured that would have to be mandatory if someone used more than 2 monitors.  Just not sure if/how to pull it off on only 2 monitors
[22:49] <valorie> I would ask about that in #plasma during euro-work hours
[22:51] <[Relic]> none of the forums I have tried so far have had a decent answer and all the old stuff works on 4 but not necessarily 5.  Will try #plasma
[22:51] <valorie> session management is a tough nut to crack
[22:51] <valorie> now that sessions are more complicated
[22:52] <valorie> not sure that Wayland will help with that, but maybe it will
[22:54] <[Relic]> Thanks for the info :)
[23:37] -kubuntu-ci:#kubuntu-devel- Project xenial_unstable_blogilo build #11: STILL FAILING in 5 min 43 sec: http://kci.pangea.pub/job/xenial_unstable_blogilo/11/
[23:37] -kubuntu-ci:#kubuntu-devel- Project zesty_unstable_blogilo build #11: STILL FAILING in 5 min 52 sec: http://kci.pangea.pub/job/zesty_unstable_blogilo/11/
[23:38] -kubuntu-ci:#kubuntu-devel- Project yakkety_unstable_blogilo build #11: STILL FAILING in 6 min 21 sec: http://kci.pangea.pub/job/yakkety_unstable_blogilo/11/
[23:48] -kubuntu-ci:#kubuntu-devel- Project xenial_unstable_blogilo build #12: STILL FAILING in 5 min 42 sec: http://kci.pangea.pub/job/xenial_unstable_blogilo/12/
[23:49] -kubuntu-ci:#kubuntu-devel- Project yakkety_unstable_blogilo build #12: STILL FAILING in 6 min 50 sec: http://kci.pangea.pub/job/yakkety_unstable_blogilo/12/
[23:50] -kubuntu-ci:#kubuntu-devel- Project zesty_unstable_blogilo build #12: STILL FAILING in 7 min 29 sec: http://kci.pangea.pub/job/zesty_unstable_blogilo/12/
[23:57] <valorie> successful reboot into my new plasma session