[05:55] <hikiko> hello :)
[05:55] <hikiko> snow!
[06:56] <pitti> Good morning
[07:13] <hikiko> hi pitti
[07:13] <pitti> hey hikiko, how are you?
[07:14] <pitti> hikiko: seriously, snow in Greece?
[07:14] <hikiko> yeah :) in my city
[07:14] <hikiko> well, we have a lot of snow in greece (so many mountains) in the cities that are next to the sea it's rare :)
[07:15] <hikiko> winter :D :D :D
[07:32] <seb128> good morning desktopers
[07:32] <seb128> hey hikiko pitti
[07:33] <hikiko> hey seb128
[07:34] <seb128> it's freezing in Greece now?!
[07:34] <seb128> we are done with the warming, getting colder!
[07:34] <seb128> :p
[07:42] <hikiko> lol it's not freezing :) it's normal winter!
[07:43] <hikiko> finally :)
[07:44] <hikiko> it was very weird to have 15 and 17 degrees in november :p but anyway I have to stop the weather forecast :D
[07:49] <pitti> bonjour seb128 !
[08:00] <seb128> pitti, how are you?
[08:01] <pitti> seb128: f-f-f-f-reezing! :-)
[08:01] <pitti> seb128: nah, je vais bien, merci !
[08:01] <seb128> lol
[08:01] <seb128> it's still cold here as well but should get a bit warmer later on
[08:01] <pitti> seb128: j'ai eu du pizza et de la bière avec mon voisin hier soir, et on a vu "Star Wars V"
[08:01] <pitti> un soir d'hommes
[08:01] <seb128> like going from 0° to 7°C
[08:01] <seb128> haha
[08:02] <didrocks> some people prepare themselves for Star Wars 3.5 soon :)
[08:02] <didrocks> hey pitti, hikiko, re seb128
[08:02] <pitti> seb128: Annett was away on a christmas party with their colleagues
[08:02] <seb128> didrocks, when does it go out?
[08:02] <seb128> pitti, it's not even december yet!
[08:03] <pitti> didrocks: oui, mon voisin n'a vu jamais Star Wars -- donc nous faisons ça maintenant
[08:03] <didrocks> seb128: mid-december I think? I don't even really know :)
[08:03] <didrocks> ah, an illiterate, like I am! :)
[08:03] <didrocks> (catching up is still planned though)
[08:03] <seb128> whhhaaattttt
[08:03] <pitti> watching the old movies is a bit boring indeed, but you gotta start there of course
[08:04]  * seb128 needs to fix didrocks' culture next time we are romming
[08:04] <seb128> rooming
[08:04] <pitti> says the guy who never watched Star Trek!
[08:04] <didrocks> :)
[08:05] <seb128> one day
[08:05] <seb128> maybe
[08:05] <pitti> which clearly is the better of the two!
[08:05]  * pitti ducks and evades the gauntlet
[08:05] <seb128> I tried but speaking of nothing happening...
[08:05] <seb128> it's even more borring than the old starwars
[08:05]  * seb128 stops there before he crosses a line :p
[08:05] <pitti> yeah, we got spoiled by the modern movies with fast cuts
[08:06] <hikiko> hi didrocks
[08:06] <pitti> seb128: well, I can understand it -- the TNG stories were great, but I do appreciate that the narrative style is a bit slow for modern taste
[08:07] <seb128> right
[08:07] <seb128> damn modern world!
[08:54] <willcooke> morning all
[08:54] <willcooke> c..c..c..cold
[08:55] <chrisccoulson> hi willcooke :)
[08:55] <willcooke> how's it going chrisccoulson?
[08:55] <willcooke> I was going to ask you about you know what today, do you think it'll be done by EOY?
[08:56] <chrisccoulson> willcooke, yeah
[08:57] <willcooke> cool, thanks chrisccoulson
[09:02] <flexiondotorg> Good morning seb128 didrocks pitti willcooke chrisccoulson hikiko
[09:03] <willcooke> hey flexiondotorg
[09:03] <seb128> hey willcooke chrisccoulson flexiondotorg
[09:03] <chrisccoulson> nobody's using firefox, right? http://arstechnica.com/security/2016/11/firefox-0day-used-against-tor-users-almost-identical-to-one-fbi-used-in-2013/
[09:03] <chrisccoulson> hi everyone :)
[09:03] <seb128> how are you?
[09:03] <seb128> chrisccoulson, says the firefox maintainer? :p
[09:03] <Laney> brRRRRrrRRRrrrRRRr
[09:03] <hikiko> good morning flexiondotorg chrisccoulson willcooke Laney
[09:03] <chrisccoulson> seb128, I'm not the firefox maintainer :P
[09:03] <seb128> who is?
[09:03] <davmor2> Morning all
[09:03] <chrisccoulson> lol
[09:03] <seb128> hey Laney
[09:03] <hikiko> and davmor2 :p
[09:03] <chrisccoulson> seb128, it's you
[09:04] <flexiondotorg> Good morning Laney, davmor2
[09:04] <flexiondotorg> chrisccoulson, Have you spoken to anyone at Mozilla about snapping Firefox?
[09:04] <chrisccoulson> flexiondotorg, they're doing it
[09:04] <davmor2> morning hikiko flexiondotorg
[09:05] <flexiondotorg> chrisccoulson, Oooh. Excellent.
[09:05] <seb128> chrisccoulson, :-(
[09:07] <seb128> chrisccoulson, so we get to pick between an outdated chromium or a non-maintainer-buggy-but-uptodate firefox?
[09:07] <seb128> bah
[09:07] <seb128> way to escape the question!
[09:07] <seb128> oh, he's back
[09:07] <seb128> chrisccoulson, so we get to pick between an outdated chromium or a non-maintainer-buggy-but-uptodate firefox?
[09:09] <chrisccoulson> seb128, is firefox that bad?
[09:09] <chrisccoulson> I probably should use it again really
[09:10] <seb128> chrisccoulson, no, I'm enjoying it still, you are the one pointing the security issues and trying to escape maintainship :p
[09:11]  * pitti gives firefox a ♥ -- works fine and it's our default browser after all
[09:12] <pitti> I have occasional trouble with hangouts, but then who doesn't (most certainly it doesn't work perfectly in chromium either)
[09:13] <seb128> no it doesn't
[09:15] <chrisccoulson> seb128, oh, judgint the state of firefox from the current 0-day is probably a bit unfair - that's quite unusual, and there's a fix already ;)
[09:16] <seb128> :-)
[09:16] <ricotz> chrisccoulson, yeah fun :-)
[09:16]  * ricotz likes firefox too, of course
[09:17] <chrisccoulson> I did stay up until 3am this morning waiting for them to start builds but then got bored and went to sleep, so we'll probably end up being a few hours late with the fix
[09:17] <chrisccoulson> hi ricotz :)
[09:17] <chrisccoulson> hi pitti :)
[09:17] <pitti> hey chrisccoulson!
[09:18] <chrisccoulson> pitti, gutted to hear that you're leaving us :(
[09:18] <chrisccoulson> although, it does sound like you'll be having a lot of fun :)
[09:20] <chrisccoulson> seb128, anyway, we always have webbrowser-app if firefox and chromium suck ;)
[09:20] <pitti> heh, I hope :) I'll just try it and see if it suits me, but for sure I'm looking forward to being able to concentrate on two or three projects for a change and lose all these little maintenance tasks
[09:20] <chrisccoulson> yeah, I can imagine :)
[09:21] <seb128> be careful to not be too nice and end up in the same situation where everybody needs you!
[09:22] <pitti> yeah, I must learn how to say "no" :)
[09:25] <Laney> "<manager> man, this new hire 'pitti' refused all my tasks"
[09:25] <Laney> "* pitti drinks cocktails on the beach"
[09:25] <chrisccoulson> heh
[09:25] <pitti> ^ right, so my work day wouldn't change at all, just who pays for the cocktails!
[09:30] <willcooke> Did someone say cocktails?  I mean, it's a bit early, but ok.
[09:32] <pitti> willcooke: you didn't fully appreciate the concept of a world-wide distributed company yet!
[09:32] <seb128> willcooke, I though you said you would be at the office tomorrow, not today? :p
[09:32] <willcooke> haha!
[09:32] <chrisccoulson> I'm expecting a delivery of beer this morning. I think it's going to be a challenge to make it last the whole day
[09:34] <willcooke> chrisccoulson, do you use a subscription service?
[09:35] <chrisccoulson> willcooke, I don't, although I have been thinking about doing the beerhawk subscription
[09:37] <willcooke> chrisccoulson, I'll give you a Flavourly referal code.  You only have to buy one box and you'll get a tenner off.  Well worth it IMO
[09:47] <chrisccoulson> oh fun, I've ran out of disk space
[09:49] <willcooke> :/
[09:50] <chrisccoulson> lol, I have a single source tree that takes up nearly 200GB
[10:02] <hikiko> 200
[10:02] <hikiko> 200GB?
[10:03] <hikiko> wow.
[10:04] <chrisccoulson> hikiko, it contains a few build directories at nearly 50GB each. I should probably think about deleting some
[10:06] <hikiko> yeah but even 50GB is quite big :)
[10:06] <chrisccoulson> hikiko, don't ever get dragged in to browser stuff :)
[10:07] <hikiko> heh
[10:07] <hikiko> too late
[10:08] <hikiko> I am currently building gcc in 3 machines to have the same version same prefix and I am going to try distcc+ninja btw... I'll tell you my experience tomorrow (I am optimistic) ;p
[10:08] <hikiko> :s/prefix/suffix
[10:08] <chrisccoulson> sounds fun :)
[10:09] <chrisccoulson> I might be interested in that work ;)
[10:09] <chrisccoulson> (although, I can already build chromium fairly quickly)
[10:09] <hikiko> chrisccoulson, how?
[10:09] <hikiko> tell me the trick
[10:10] <chrisccoulson> hikiko, 64GB of RAM and one of these - http://www.samsung.com/uk/consumer/memory-storage/ssd/950-pro/MZ-V5P512BW
[10:11] <chrisccoulson> and I have a quad core xeon CPU in my laptop too
[10:15] <hikiko> lol
[10:15] <hikiko> ok
[10:16] <hikiko> I don't have such hardware:)
[10:16] <chrisccoulson> it still takes a while for a full build though. But not 9 hours :)
[10:16] <hikiko> but if I combine the RAM+cores of our 3 computers here it will be fast I hope
[10:16] <hikiko> yeah
[10:17] <hikiko> the 1st time was 9hrs
[10:17] <hikiko> and I didn't use all the cores
[10:17] <hikiko> I just followed the instructions in the manual ninja -C
[10:17] <hikiko> now I am using -j4
[10:17] <hikiko> and soon -j 16
[10:18] <hikiko> (with distcc)
[10:57] <marga> desrt, I'm having a super weird issue dconf related: after years of our /etc/dconf/db/site.d/foo settings working properly, they are suddenly not applying.  If I look in dconf-editor, it shows that the default is the wrong value (i.e. false when it should be true). I expect it's something that we changed last week or so, but I can't figure out what could cause this, any idea?
[11:01] <andyrock> morning
[11:04] <willcooke> hey andyrock
[11:05] <Trevinho> Laney: once andyrock ACKed the libappindicator change ;-), can you please check this https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/2208 ?
[11:07] <desrt> marga: huh.  nothing should have changed with this.  what does the commandline tool say?
[11:09] <marga> which tool?  If I do dconf read or dconf dump, it shows the wrong value. But I have no way of knowing where the value is coming from.
[11:10] <marga> desrt, as I said, I'm pretty sure it's our fault, I'm just at a loss as to how to debug where the problem is
[11:10] <desrt> what release are we talking about here?  an LTS?
[11:10] <desrt> or did you do a dist-upgrade?
[11:10] <marga> Trusty
[11:10] <desrt> ya.... really really no changes there :p
[11:11] <marga> Freshly installed and updated to the latest security updates.  But I'm also seeing it on a different machine running a different release. So, pretty sure it's a config change on our side. :-/
[11:11] <desrt> try: touch /etc/dconf/db/*.d; dconf update ?
[11:12] <marga> desrt, I sort of tried that (editing one of the files there), but I'll try again.
[11:12] <desrt> some text editors do unsafe file access (and as a side-effect, the timestamp on the directory doesn't get updated properly)
[11:12] <desrt> a shockingly large number do this, in fact
[11:13] <marga> I edited with vim
[11:13] <marga> I'd hope it does this right :)
[11:13] <desrt> vim does it properly, i think
[11:13] <desrt> (and even if it doesn't, the .swp files in the directory would have modified the timestamp)
[11:14] <marga> Alright, tried this, no change.
[11:14] <marga> Is there any way I could figure out where the "bad" setting is coming from?
[11:16] <desrt> do you have locks?
[11:16] <marga> I tried reading the setting as root and it was also wrong. Also tried removing the .conf/dconf/user file.
[11:17] <desrt> weird.......
[11:17] <marga> desrt, yeah, the locks actually work correctly (i.e. I can't edit the setting manually). But I've tried removing them and the default is still wrong.
[11:17] <desrt> what is the profile?
[11:17] <marga> Ah! I forgot about that part.  Let me check, maybe we screwed that
[11:18] <desrt> there were some changes in the last year or so to how profile got picked, but i don't think you'd be seeing those in trusty
[11:18]  * desrt double-checks
[11:19] <marga> So, the profile _should_ be the one called "user", that contains "user-db:user system-db:local system-db:site"
[11:19] <desrt> ya... the profile selection stuff came much later than the version in trusty
[11:20] <marga> But it might be that we managed to screw that, maybe. How do I check which profile I'm actually using?
[11:20] <desrt> strace? :)
[11:20] <desrt> is DCONF_PROFILE set to anything?
[11:20] <marga> Nope
[11:21] <desrt> so then the tool should try to open /etc/dconf/profile/user, indeed
[11:21] <marga> Ok, I'll strace
[11:21] <desrt> strace dconf read /whatever
[11:21] <desrt> just to see what gets opened
[11:21] <marga> Yes, open("/etc/dconf/profile/user", O_RDONLY) = 3
[11:22] <desrt> (like, literally "/whatever" is a good choice, since there is no value here, it will result in less strace output)
[11:22] <marga> open("/etc/dconf/db/site", O_RDONLY) = 4
[11:22] <desrt> looks good...
[11:22] <marga> Yeah...
[11:22] <desrt> and the timestamp on 'site' is reasonable?
[11:23] <desrt> it's a bit of a shame that you are working with trusty... the tool grew some features lately that would be useful here
[11:23] <marga> Nov 30 12:12 /etc/dconf/db/site (11 minutes ago)
[11:23] <marga> desrt, I have a more modern system as well.  Both are experiencing the same, that's why I blame our configs.
[11:26] <marga> So, what are those fancy new features? :)
[11:28] <desrt> sorry.
[11:28] <desrt> so the main one is that you can list locks
[11:29] <desrt> dconf list-locks / will tell you if dconf thinks that you have any paths locked
[11:29] <desrt> (ie: this could be why user values are allowed to appear over system values that you think should be locked)
[11:30] <desrt> (no output = no locks)
[11:30] <marga> Ok, I had moved one file away (the one that locked the value that I'm using to track the problem).  I see the other locks with that. I'll put my lock file back in place
[11:31] <marga> Yep, the locks work fine.  It's the values that are broken
[11:31] <marga> From what I'm seeing, it might be that only booleans are broken.
[11:32] <desrt> this is very odd.
[11:32] <marga> Indeed.
[11:32] <desrt> everything is x86 here, ya?
[11:32] <marga> amd64
[11:32] <desrt> right
[11:33] <desrt> okay, so my advice: focus on a single key that is showing the problem
[11:33] <desrt> make those separate file-db profile files, one per each layer (site, local, user)
[11:33] <desrt> and query what dconf thinks each database says, and also if it sees a lock there or not
[11:33] <marga> How can I query each db?
[11:34] <desrt> write into a file called "myprofile" one line: "file-db:/etc/dconf/db/site" (or whatever single file you want)
[11:34] <desrt> then do DCONF_PROFILE=/path/to/myprofile dconf dump /
[11:34] <marga> BTW, I can confirm that only boolean values are affected.
[11:34] <marga> ok, will do
[11:34] <desrt> this is _really_ weird
[11:34] <desrt> did you try ints?
[11:34] <marga> yeah, I changed an int value and then queried it and it showed the new value.
[11:37] <desrt> other option: email me a .tar.gz of your /etc/dconf (complete with both .d directories and the compiled db files, and the profiles)
[11:38] <marga> I found the issue.  Someone created a second file that overwrote the values with wrong values.
[11:38] <desrt> party :)
[11:38] <marga> I was checking the file that I had created, and it had the right values...
[11:38] <marga> Sigh
[11:38] <marga> Thanks for your time :)
[11:39] <desrt> just glad i don't have a bug to fix :p
[12:46] <xnox> marga, you must love dconf a lot =)
[12:46] <marga> xnox, I actually find the site.d thing pretty neat
[12:46]  * xnox learned a lot about dconf from above
[12:47] <xnox> mostly that i really don't want to touch it
[12:47] <marga> :)
[12:47] <xnox> marga, when i want to change the defaults, i upload the package into Ubuntu and dist-upgrade =)
[12:47] <marga> Ah, but then you can't lock the settings away from the hands of misguided users :)
[12:48] <marga> (we are not mean, we only lock some specific settings, like the screensaver lock)
[12:48] <xnox> =)
[13:06] <Trevinho> Laney: this is all yours now https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/2208 ;-)
[13:48] <Laney> THE BITS ARE FLOWING
[13:48] <Laney> Trevinho: ok
[14:13] <Laney> git bisect run you absolute beauty
[14:15] <pitti> Laney: well, it's more like a meticulous craftsman with a big hammer than a fairy, but de gustibus non disputandum est :)
[14:17] <Laney> de mortuis nihil nisi bonum
[14:18] <Laney> pitti: fair comment
[14:18] <Laney> my scripts are usually "git clean -fdx; make; make check"
[14:18] <Laney> hardly delicate
[14:18] <pitti> Laney: confused -- what is dead in that context?
[14:19] <pitti> Laney: heh, my usual one is a bit more elaborate: http://people.canonical.com/~pitti/scripts/systemd-bisect-run.sh.simple
[14:20] <pitti> here's to packages which can be sensibly tested with "make check" :)
[14:21] <Laney> pitti: there's a play (forgot the name) where those two phrases are confused
[14:21] <pitti> Laney: hm, curious; aside from being completely ignorant of Latin basics, it's hard to imagine how to confuse them
[14:21] <Laney> a misquoting IIRC
[14:22] <pitti> #ubuntu-desktop topics → is it Friday yet?
[14:23] <Laney> http://www.cynic.net/~cjs/degustibus.html
[14:23] <seb128> back to learn something fridays rather than troll fridays?
[14:24] <pitti> Laney: ah, thanks!
[14:24] <seb128> not enough larsu around nowadays :-/
[14:24] <Laney> pitti has rectified that one too
[14:24]  * Laney sobs
[14:25] <Laney> seb128: (fosdem)
[14:25] <seb128> right!
[14:26] <Laney> nothing like a cold and grey weekend in bruxelelelelels to regenerate yourself
[14:26] <seb128> :-)
[14:29]  * larsu waves to seb128!
[14:29] <seb128> hey larsu! wie gehts? ;-)
[14:30] <pitti> it's a larsu!
[14:30] <larsu> seb128: too dark!
[14:30] <larsu> otherwise great :) How are you?
[14:30] <pitti> "pink killer"??
[14:31] <larsu> pitti: hi! What's going on?
[14:31] <seb128> I'm good thanks, sunny here today and not night yet
[14:31] <pitti> larsu: eh? bright blue sky and sun here
[14:31] <larsu> pitti: rain and dark here :(
[14:32] <davmor2> Laney: man what did Pink do to you to deserve killing
[14:32] <davmor2> Laney: She sings okay songs if you don't like them just listen to something else ;)
[14:33] <Laney> davmor2: what happens at fosdem stays at fosdem
[16:35] <p_d> hy, After installing/downloading virtualbox completely..it gives me an error - http://imgur.com/a/MbMsf ..how to resolve it "Running VMs found"?
[18:01]  * flexiondotorg calls it a day
[18:01] <flexiondotorg> Night desktopers
[18:01] <willcooke> see ya flexiondotorg
[18:02] <seb128> night flexiondotorg
[18:03] <seb128> going to do the same here
[18:03] <seb128> have a nice evening desktopers and see you tomorrow
[18:03] <willcooke> night seb128
[18:03]  * willcooke follows
[18:03] <willcooke> London tomorrow
[18:03] <willcooke> ta ta
[18:30] <Laney> night too
[20:53] <ximion> Laney: are you *sure* that you uploaded the appstream patch? Because it is nowehere to be seen in Launchpad