babbageclunkperrito666: review'd! (for what it's worth!)01:27
redirjam yt?06:28
jamredir: hello06:28
redirgot a minute?06:28
redirI've got an issue troubleshooting kvm in kvm on vmaas replacing uvtool for managing kvm in juju06:30
redirperrito666 thought you might have some ideas06:31
redirjam ^06:31
jamredir: give me a couple mins to get this test compiling and I'll be there06:31
redirjam were you asking for a hangout?06:47
rediryes you were06:47
redirjam https://hangouts.google.com/hangouts/_/canonical.com/jam06:47
jamredir: well, I can chat with you however you would like06:47
jambut a hangout seems easiest06:47
rogpeppebabbageclunk: pong08:28
voidspacewho os Trent Lloyd11:51
voidspace*is ?11:51
voidspaceAh, a Canonical guy11:52
voidspaceJust reading what is perhaps the best written bug report I've ever seen :-)11:52
voidspacea bug report that fully understands and explains the problem as far as I can tell11:52
voidspacea thing of beauty :-)11:52
perrito666lol, link11:55
voidspaceperrito666: https://bugs.launchpad.net/juju/+bug/163125411:58
mupBug #1631254: [2.0rc3] lxd containers do not autostart <rteam> <juju:In Progress by mfoord> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1631254>11:58
perrito666voidspace: beautiful report indeed12:05
voidspacejam: did you settle on skipping the test for now?12:14
jamvoidspace: so I have a test which has an ExpectedFailure and then skips12:15
voidspacejam: cool12:15
jamwell, it has an Assert then a skip12:15
jamI don't know if gocheck supports Expected Failure12:15
voidspacejam: ah, skip on fail12:15
voidspacejam: same effect...12:15
* jam still likes UnitTest a lot more12:16
voidspacejam: the Java one?12:16
jamvoidspace: the python one12:16
voidspacejam: the Python one still needs an enormous overhaul12:16
jamvoidspace: well, lots of stuff layered on it that Bazaar used.12:17
voidspacejam: it could be entirely rearchitected - I began that12:17
voidspacejam: right12:17
jamlifeless was really big on unit testing, so we had quite a bit of helpers12:17
jamsubunit integration, ability to run just this subset of tests, etc.12:17
voidspacejam: yep, he's prodidigious and highly intelligent12:17
voidspacejam: he had a preference for complex apis andd over-engineering IMO12:17
voidspacejam: his code was always obviously capable, but never quite to my tastes ;-)12:18
voidspacejam: what I started for unittest became nose2 - which some people still use but I fear has become abandonware12:18
voidspacejam: a lot of the APIs in that came out of discussion with lifeless though12:18
voidspacejam: I was working on a fully event based way of integrating with (customising and extending) unittest instead of via subclassing12:19
jamvoidspace: python definitely plays a lot of games around how magic vs how explici12:19
voidspacejam: it was interesting, I would have loved to have completed it - but then life happened12:19
voidspacejam: yep, constant tension12:19
voidspacejam: I love the guiding principle of "simple things should be simple, complex things should be possible"12:20
voidspacejam: so I like to design the API and UX around *the most commmon obvious beginning* way to use it12:20
voidspacejam: and then ensure that extending beyond that is possible and as intuitive (i.e. not a jarring jump) from there12:20
voidspacesimilar I guess to the principle of least surprise12:21
voidspacefrom Ruby12:21
voidspacebut they definitely jump into the magic-auto-configuration everywhere12:21
voidspacethe major change I wanted to make to what I did in unittest, on the good advice of Holger Krekel, was to have a test context where *all* the state for the current test run lived (including configuration) and then pass that context through everywhere - no global state12:22
voidspaceso I got as far as breaking everything to begin making that change12:22
voidspaceand that's where I left it...12:22
voidspacelike much in life, incomplete and broken ;-)12:23
rick_hI always tell folks "start writing the code you want to be writing to get this done, then we'll go write the stuff that makes that possible" :) (re: most common beginning"13:54
jamrick_h: do you know when sinzui is going to be around?14:05
rick_hjam: no, I don't. He's normally getting online from now through the next hour in a normal work day14:06
jamrick_h: I realized a bit late (today) that really all our stuff should probably be targeting the 2.1 branch, so I've updated the stuff I've landed so far, and the stuff I've proposed.14:06
jamrick_h: so I think all my stuff is up for review, and frobware is doing the integration with his patches as we speak14:06
jam(testing the integration on his MAAS setup.)14:06
rick_hjam: k, would it be better to ask sinzui to test tomorrow?14:06
jamrick_h: I'm pretty confident about my "restricted NIC" work, as we already landed that in develop. I'm fairly confident about the followup14:07
jamrick_h: but the dynamic bridging hasn't been tested in anger mixed with my stuff.14:07
jam(its what frobware is doing onw)14:07
rick_hjam: ok, so can we email him, cc myself/torsten a binary to test with and any notes?14:07
rick_hjam: once the bits land together14:07
jamrick_h: the big thing is it feels like I should really be around as curtis is working on it/testing it, and I don't know how to make that happen.14:08
rick_hjam: rgr, well let's try async and see if we can make it work.14:08
rick_hjam: honestly I think it's good QA to have him play, find things, note them and do it without us over his shoulder14:08
rick_hjam: at least in the efforts we've been trying to do to date. We declare what we think things should do and let them verify and find ways to break it.14:09
frobwarerick_h: I'm happy to be around later in my day; there's no point (should it happen) getting stuck/broken in the first 5 minutes.14:21
rick_hfrobware: can you kick things off with an email to sinzui then when the bits are ready please?14:45
frobwarerick_h: bits? so a branch or a juju tarball? any indication what they are expecting?14:46
rick_hfrobware: no, I think they'd start with develop, but if we have a preference we should email and indicate our preference.14:46
rick_hfrobware: be a tarball, branch, etc14:46
jamfrobware: rick_h: I'm putting together an email, just still writing it.14:47
frobwarerick_h: so the integration branch I'm using is not in develop (yet) - need more work14:47
jamfrobware: right, but its based off develop, not 2.114:47
frobwarejam, rick_h: correct14:47
jamfrobware: rick_h: I have patches for all of my stuff up for review, and a second set of patches against 2.1 up for review.14:48
jamfrobware: I told Curtis about your integration branch as the place-to-work-from for now14:48
jamI probably left off that it isn't 2.114:48
jamall the files that I've worked in are identical between 2.1 and develop, so just doing "diff + patch" works very well.14:48
jamrick_h: email sent (you are CCd)14:50
jamcatch y'all later. You can Hangout me directly if you need something urgently.14:50
frobwarejam: that's good news. I guess not much generally happng helps here.14:50
frobwarejam: ty14:50
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perrito666redir: your morning starts a lot like my afternoon17:10
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perrito666bbl relocation18:59
rediranyone know what else uses the $paths.DataDir/containers/juju-id-n/cloud-init data?20:16
babbageclunkrogpeppe: sorry, only saw this now - was going to ask you about a bug involving macaroons and websocket connections (for log streams)21:06
babbageclunkrogpeppe: I think I've sorted it out but if you're around and not busy/off to bed soon it might be worth confirming with you?21:06
babbageclunkjam: did you see my response to your comment on https://github.com/juju/juju/pull/673521:09
babbageclunkperrito666, redir: anyone know how I can construct fully-discharged macaroons for a test I'm struggling to write?22:40
perrito666babbageclunk: no clue at all22:41
redirbabbageclunk: I'd start here https://github.com/go-macaroon/macaroon/blob/v1/macaroon_test.go22:44
babbageclunkredir: ooh! I'll look at that thanks22:45
perrito666seems redir is more helpful than I22:45
rediryay things don't work on trusty22:50
babbageclunkperrito666: you've been helpful before - in my tally he's only a *tiny* bit ahead22:57
perrito666k redir babbageclunk I think Ill call it a day :)23:00
perrito666if you need me email me and ill be back23:00
babbageclunkperrito666: night!23:00
redirno standup :o perrito666 knows what I've been doing today23:01
redirhave a good night23:02
babbageclunkredir: ok - my plaintive cry above is basically my status - found the solution to the macaroon problem I had, struggling to test it.23:08
redirI can finally show some working kvm bits and no one is around to see. sigh23:10
redirgood luck with the macaroon tests23:10
redirthey sort of work the opposite of how I want them to23:11

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