[00:12] <mup> PR snapcraft#1093 closed: python plugin: do the right thing with classic <Created by sergiusens> <Merged by kyrofa> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapcraft/pull/1093>
[00:18] <mup> PR snapcraft#1104 opened: repo: refactor into package <Created by kyrofa> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapcraft/pull/1104>
[04:27] <cokebottle> God day
[04:28] <cokebottle> good day
[04:29] <cokebottle> Please after readinng a lot of info about snappy ... i still don't understand what it is about
[04:29] <cokebottle> can anyone help me out , as i am confused i about what snappyy is about    Thankyou
[07:28] <zyga> good morning
[07:51] <mup> PR snapd#2773 opened: interfaces/mount: generate per-snap mount profile <Created by zyga> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/2773>
[07:54] <mup> PR snapd#2774 opened: interfaces/mount: add dedicated mount entry type <Created by zyga> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/2774>
[08:34] <mup> PR snapd#2775 opened: cmd: add functions to load/save fstab-like files <Created by zyga> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/2775>
[08:50] <mup> Bug #1661533 opened: show the snap app size info <Snappy:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1661533>
[09:02] <mup> PR snapd#2776 opened: cmd: use per-snap mount profile to populate the mount namespace <Created by zyga> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/2776>
[09:03] <abc_> any?
[09:12] <mup> PR snapd#2759 closed: asserts: support for correctly suggesting format 2 for snap-declaration <Created by pedronis> <Merged by pedronis> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/2759>
[09:14] <mup> PR snapd#2777 opened: cmd: fix autogen.sh on fedora <Created by zyga> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/2777>
[09:16] <mup> PR snapd#2745 closed: cmd: add sc_string_append <Created by zyga> <Merged by zyga> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/2745>
[09:32] <mup> PR snapd#2778 opened: cmd: use safer functions in sc_mount_opt2str <Created by zyga> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/2778>
[09:38] <bulldog> guys my qt5 application have font and mouse cursor issues how to solve them ?? some fonts looks odd , and mouse cursor do not follow system cursor theme , am having [deskto-qt5] already in my craft file
[09:40] <liuxg> bulldog, you need to package the needed fonts into your snap to get it working..
[09:40] <mup> PR snapd#2779 opened: tests: gruntwork backend and suite; task for sync snapd with vendor <Created by fgimenez> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/2779>
[09:41] <bulldog> liuxg, which package have ubuntu default fonts ??
[09:41] <bulldog> and what about mouse cursor
[09:43] <liuxg> bulldog, I have designed a Chinese Qt app, and I packaged the needed Chinese fonts. for example https://github.com/liu-xiao-guo/rssreader_slim/blob/master/snapcraft.yaml
[09:43] <bulldog> liuxg, my app uses qwebview so i need almost all fonts cause there are almost all languages user can browser webpage into
[09:44] <liuxg> bulldog, in that case, you probably need to package all of the needed fonts into your snap. In my example,  I packaged   - fonts-wqy-zenhei
[09:44] <liuxg>       - fcitx-frontend-qt5, and make the Chinese input method working.
[09:45] <bulldog> i dont know why snap dont want use system fonts :D
[09:45] <bulldog> snap package seems to be turning into operating system them self
[09:46] <bulldog> now they should ship kernels and other system components so that they can run on anyting
[09:46] <liuxg> bulldog, in that case, your probably can try the "classic" snap, which basically it can use the system founts.
[09:47] <bulldog> what is a classic snap ??
[09:47] <bulldog> :O
[09:47] <liuxg> bulldog, you can refer to my example at https://github.com/liu-xiao-guo/helloworld-classic/blob/master/snapcraft.yaml
[09:48] <bulldog> liuxg, my application cant play youtube videos in qwebview , and some people here were syaing thats my coding fault LOL
[09:49] <liuxg> bulldog, if I remember correctly, in the Qt SDK, there is an example for that.
[09:49] <liuxg> bulldog, you can refer more about classic on our document at https://snapcraft.io/docs/reference/confinement
[09:50] <bulldog> liuxg, also the content in qwebview is little bit weired , after packaging in snap format there are white lines around the <table> tag in the html page qwebview is loading into its webframe
[09:50] <liuxg> bulldog, ideally, we want everything packaged into the snap, but if you cannot, you may do a classic snap, which does not have strong confiment in the seense.
[09:51] <bulldog> liuxg, i have coded the application correctly to play videos , now idk why the hell eaach applications need to ship their own flash players and media codecs
[09:51] <bulldog> liuxg, i want my snap in store , will classic confinement will work ??
[09:52] <liuxg> bulldog, the idea behind Snap is that it packaged everything it needs into a single package so it does not reply on the core and other apps. a snap is a self-contained app!
[09:52] <bulldog> and i shipped with flash player , and it wont work in snap i dont know wth is wrong with that
[09:53] <bulldog> liuxg, i understand that , but they should atleast allow to use some system stuffs like flash player damn
[09:54] <liuxg> bulldog, if you package everything into a single snap, it can be installed on multiple distos and run them without the dependence on the distros. however, if you release an app in "classic", it may not work on some of the distros if the dependence is not there.
[09:54] <bulldog> now if this is possible , where can i find example of application which is playung video using flash player ??
[09:55] <bulldog> developers are saying its fault in my code , oh god , what ??? few are saying qwebkit cant use falsh player omg
[09:55] <bulldog> lmao
[09:56] <bulldog> liuxg, take windows and macos as example , they ships dependencies in packages , but they use systems codecs and flashlayer
[09:58] <bulldog> liuxg, with confinement: classic ubuntu snap store will accept my package ???
[09:58] <liuxg> bulldog, it needs to have manual review.  yeah, it can be published :)
[09:59] <bulldog> i first time come to know about confinement: classic
[10:00] <bulldog> liuxg, btw here is my application http://bit.do/ktweb
[10:00] <bulldog> i packaged with appimage , and debian format , everything works fine
[10:01] <liuxg> bulldog, thanks. it looks very cool
[10:01] <bulldog> classic confinement look like what appimage project is trying to do
[10:02] <liuxg> bulldog, if you already have the debian package, you may use "dump"plugin to install it in the snapcraft.yaml.  this is one of the example at https://github.com/liu-xiao-guo/wechat
[10:03] <bulldog> liuxg, i will try ,
[10:03] <bulldog> liuxg, with classic confinement i cant install snap  it says error: cannot perform the following tasks: - Mount snap "ktube-media-downloader" (unset) (snap "ktube-media-downloader" requires consent to use classic confinement)
[10:03] <liuxg> bulldog, sorry, this is a better example http://blog.csdn.net/ubuntutouch/article/details/53078713
[10:03] <mup> PR snapd#2780 opened: tests: increase snap-service kill-timeout <Created by fgimenez> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/2780>
[10:04] <bulldog> liuxg, am able to make snap but the problem is it wont play videos and mouse cursor and qwebview odd rendering of pages
[10:05] <liuxg> bulldog, did you try to install it with "devmode"? which removes all of the confinement.
[10:05] <bulldog> ok am trying
[10:05] <bulldog> Snapcraft returned error: cannot perform the following tasks: - Mount snap "ktube-media-downloader" (unset) (snap "ktube-media-downloader" requires consent to use classic confinement)
[10:06] <bulldog> with --devmode  flag
[10:08] <liuxg> bulldog, for that error, I do not know how to help you.. for classic app, you do not need to have the devmode option to install it.
[10:08] <bulldog> liuxg, seems like a bug https://bugs.launchpad.net/snappy/+bug/1656820
[10:08] <mup> Bug #1656820: snap try with classic confinement doesn't work <Snappy:Fix Committed> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1656820>
[10:10] <liuxg> bulldog, are you able to upgrade to snapd, I am now having 2.22. you may need to use the proposed channel
[10:11] <bulldog> am having snapd   2.21
[10:12] <bulldog> liuxg, how users will able to install this snap if they will not having snapd 2.22 ??
[10:13] <liuxg> bulldog, http://paste.ubuntu.com/23917232/
[10:13] <liuxg> bulldog, it seems that you need to use the --classic option to install it.
[10:13] <bulldog> okay let me  try
[10:14] <liuxg> bulldog, classic is supported from 2.20 onwards :)
[10:14] <bulldog> okay
[10:15] <liuxg> bulldog, sounds good. is it working now?
[10:15] <bulldog> let me chk
[10:16] <bulldog> installed
[10:16] <bulldog> trying to run
[10:17] <bulldog> liuxg, wow
[10:17] <bulldog> videos are playing now :)
[10:17] <liuxg> bulldog, what happened?
[10:17] <bulldog> and theme issues are gone
[10:17] <liuxg> bulldog, it seems great :)
[10:17] <bulldog> liuxg, can i upload it to store ??
[10:18] <liuxg> bulldog, as said before, you can upload it, however, it is up to manual review since it does not have the confiment in practice. ideally, it should have the confinementt working. that is the ultimate goal :）
[10:19] <bulldog> i mean will someone manually review it ?
[10:19] <mup> PR snapd#2765 closed: cmd: add /usr/local/* to PATH <Created by zyga> <Merged by zyga> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/2765>
[10:20] <bulldog> is the softwares app of ubuntu able to find the way to install packages with classic confinement :D ??
[10:20] <bulldog> okay i dont have to worry about it thanks alot man
[10:20] <liuxg> bulldog, it cannot be found in the stable channel, I think. you definitely have a way to get it installed.
[10:20] <liuxg> bulldog, you are most welcomee..
[10:23] <bulldog> liuxg, i have to update my GUI Snapcraft GUI tools with these updates :), so you know https://github.com/snapcraft-gui/snapcraft-gui
[10:23] <bulldog> *do
[10:25] <mup> PR snapd#2781 opened: overlord/devicemgr: fix test: setup account-key before using the key for signing <Created by pedronis> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/2781>
[11:06] <mup> PR snapd#2782 opened: timeutil: a bunch of helpers for the scheduled refreshes <Created by mvo5> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/2782>
[11:08] <mup> PR snapd#2781 closed: overlord/devicemgr: fix test: setup account-key before using the key for signing <Created by pedronis> <Merged by pedronis> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/2781>
[11:27] <xiaoji_> 请问。。snappy的包安装后，如何改变只读？允许可写 可新建目录？
[11:31] <xiaoji_> hello, excuse me?
[11:34] <mup> PR snapd#2783 opened: Add an interface for use by thumbnailer <Created by jhenstridge> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/2783>
[11:34] <xiaoji_> hello, excuse me?
[12:04] <BadCodSmell> I am confused by snappy
[12:04] <BadCodSmell> Is there a pure snappy ubuntu distro/os release?
[12:05] <BadCodSmell> Right now it just looks like another bolt on package manager
[12:06] <sergiusens> BadCodSmell: yes, Ubuntu Core is a pure snappy based system
[12:07] <sergiusens> BadCodSmell: https://www.ubuntu.com/core
[12:07] <BadCodSmell> ugh it requires an online account with ubuntu though
[12:07] <BadCodSmell> enterprise fud
[12:08] <BadCodSmell> Can I install it without that?
[12:08] <BadCodSmell> Otherwise I might as well just go windows 10 for a managed OS.
[12:10] <BadCodSmell> Ah confirmed it's some enterprise fluff
[12:10] <BadCodSmell> I don't understand though
[12:10] <BadCodSmell> it is not necessary and apparantly only bootstrapping
[12:10] <BadCodSmell> It looks like security gone mad
[12:16] <sergiusens> BadCodSmell: if windows works for you, by all means use it. I don't know how you got to "requires login" so fast though...
[12:17] <BadCodSmell> it wants some SSO rubbish just to bootstrap.
[12:17] <BadCodSmell> But I don't want that.
[12:18] <ogra_> well, it is rather IoT focused than "enterprisey" ... thats one of the ways to prevent botnets
[12:18] <BadCodSmell> It's not the linux way to deprive users
[12:18] <sergiusens> I will refrain from helping if that is the attitude for things you don't like
[12:18] <BadCodSmell> That's not ubuntus concern
[12:18] <ogra_> but as sergiusens said, if windows suits you better, go for it ... and enjoy getting hacked
[12:18] <BadCodSmell> If governments want to shutdown companies that fail to have security practices as basic as setting defaults passwords...
[12:19] <BadCodSmell> Unfortunately that's not how hacking works.
[12:19] <BadCodSmell> Since I used to be one.
[12:19]  * sergiusens feels like someone just came here to vent
[12:19] <ogra_> yeah
[12:19] <sergiusens> already knowing the answers to the questions asked even
[12:19] <BadCodSmell> Maybe I can just edit the image or something, annoying.
[12:20] <ogra_> you can just use a classic image and install snapd on it if you feel better with that
[12:20] <BadCodSmell> I would really like to see it out of the box and if it's using it for kernel, etc
[12:21] <BadCodSmell> With classic image there's the question of jumping from apt to snapd for everything.
[12:21] <ogra_> then create some random SSO account and live with it
[12:22] <BadCodSmell> There's no minimal image but meh
[12:22] <ogra_> ??
[12:22] <ogra_> i dont think there is a more minimal image than the snappy one (even way smaller than the smalles classic one)
[12:23] <ogra_> https://developer.ubuntu.com/core/get-started ... http://releases.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-core/16/ ...
[12:25] <BadCodSmell> I think my own stripped down debian is around 1GB but I guess the USB is live and stuff.
[12:26] <ogra_> ogra@localhost:~$ df -h /
[12:26] <ogra_> Filesystem      Size  Used Avail Use% Mounted on
[12:26] <ogra_> /dev/loop0       65M   65M     0 100% /
[12:27] <BadCodSmell> for core?
[12:27] <ogra_> plus
[12:27] <ogra_> ogra@localhost:~$ df -h /writable
[12:27] <ogra_> Filesystem      Size  Used Avail Use% Mounted on
[12:27] <ogra_> /dev/mmcblk0p2   29G  468M   27G   2% /writable
[12:27] <ogra_> but i have a bunch of extra packages installed
[12:27] <BadCodSmell> that's not bad
[12:28] <ogra_> right after install the writable bit is rather around 300MB
[12:29] <ogra_> you can roll back the rootfs in case something doesnt work on upgrades ... it does auto-rollback after a kernel upgrade if something goes wrong etc etc ...
[12:29] <BadCodSmell> The annoying thing with the image being almost 4GB
[12:29] <mup> PR snapd#2784 opened: image: check kernel/gadget publisher vs model brand, warn on store disconnected snaps  <Created by pedronis> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/2784>
[12:29] <BadCodSmell> I have a 4GB USB stick and everywhere jumps from KiB to KB etc without telling you
[12:29] <ogra_> the image is 300MB and gets resized to full disk size on first boot ...
[12:29] <BadCodSmell> cant tell off the bat if itll fit
[12:29] <ogra_> except for the KVM images
[12:30] <ogra_> (whihc cant easily resize because the img is actually the "physical disk"
[12:30] <ogra_> )
[12:32] <BadCodSmell> Are snaps differentially updated?
[12:33] <ogra_> you mean in deltas ?
[12:33] <BadCodSmell> basically
[12:33] <ogra_> thats currently landing ...
[12:33] <BadCodSmell> best kind is not of the package download
[12:34] <BadCodSmell> but of the files, ie you send your version and it sends fs deltas
[12:34] <BadCodSmell> or wholesale if it doesn't have
[12:34] <ogra_> well, i find the 100% reliable rollback a better feature personally :)
[12:34] <BadCodSmell> I've created some systems like that myself
[12:34] <BadCodSmell> but it's a nightmare to maintain
[12:34] <ogra_> but yeah, package delta downloads are ready to land (you can already enable them with aan env var while they arent default yet)
[12:35] <BadCodSmell> I wonder if rdiff or xdelta
[12:35] <ogra_> xdelta
[12:36] <simosx> https://bugs.launchpad.net/snappy/+bug/1661590
[12:36] <mup> Bug #1661590: When launching a snap from Ubuntu Software, it runs the first command alphabetically <Snappy:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1661590>
[12:36] <ogra_> snaps are signed, compressed squashfs'es ... i dont think rdiff works well in that context
[12:36] <BadCodSmell> should do
[12:37] <simosx> https://bugs.launchpad.net/snappy/+bug/1650689
[12:37] <mup> Bug #1650689: Channel switching (track new channel) does not work if the two channels happen to have identical snap packages <Snappy:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1650689>
[12:37] <mup> Bug #1661590 opened: When launching a snap from Ubuntu Software, it runs the first command alphabetically <Snappy:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1661590>
[12:37] <BadCodSmell> I run it against compressed archives (custom tar like internally)
[12:37] <BadCodSmell> still
[12:37] <BadCodSmell> it's not good to run it against archive (ie tar)
[12:37] <ogra_> simosx, hmm, works for me on core images ... snap refresh --<channel>  <snapname> ...
[12:38] <BadCodSmell> most efficient to make list of files removed, files new, and diffs for files changed, if it can't diff it effectively, then just treat the changed file as a new file
[12:38] <simosx> ogra_, tried it on ubuntu-core in LXD, did not work. The snaps in both channels have to be identical.
[12:38] <ogra_> in lxd ... hmm
[12:38] <BadCodSmell> small compressed things it will suck but for large things I think eventually with the blocking it will start again so one difference up front wont go down the whole stream
[12:39] <simosx> ogra_, and on Ubuntu 16.04 (desktop).
[12:39] <ogra_> simosx, i do it with the core snap all the time on my installs to test something in the edge channel and then go back to the stable install later
[12:39] <ogra_> and these are definitely never identical :)
[12:40] <mup> PR snapd#2785 opened: Provide a more interesting pitch for upstream developers using snaps <Created by evandandrea> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/2785>
[12:40] <simosx> ogra_, try it with 'snap info network-manager'. Switch between 'stable' and 'beta'.
[12:40] <BadCodSmell> if it rdiffs the whole squash fs, you have to keep both in memory or on disk at one time at some point unless you have a good dedupe fs under it
[12:40] <BadCodSmell> or unionfs :D
[12:40] <BadCodSmell> etc
[12:41] <ogra_> BadCodSmell, well, i didnt work on the implementation but not messing up the gpg signature and needing to work with compressed squashfs binary diffs was a requirement that rdiff seemed to not fulfill
[12:43] <BadCodSmell> weird
[12:43] <BadCodSmell> maybe one day I will look at it
[12:43] <ogra_> or at least didnt fulfill at tthe performance level that was desired
[12:43] <BadCodSmell> I have had to make a bunch of strange things
[12:44] <BadCodSmell> like a kind of rsync that creates jumbo patches and works in bulk rather than comparing differences between two machines (using versioning)
[12:44] <Son_Goku> sergiusens: does snapcraft only support merged source projects?
[12:45] <Son_Goku> (aka, debian style packaging)
[12:46] <ogra_> snapcraft supports anything you want :P
[12:46] <ogra_> limitless :)
[12:47] <ogra_> just a matter of how you use it ;)
[12:47] <ogra_> (read: i guess you have to give more context)
[12:47] <sergiusens> Son_Goku: sorry, I don't understand
[12:47] <Son_Goku> sorry, let me explain better
[12:48] <Son_Goku> one complaint I received recently about snapcraft is that it seemed to expect that the source tree is where the snapcraft packaging data is
[12:48] <sergiusens> Son_Goku: oh, you want out of tree snapcraft?
[12:48] <Son_Goku> yes
[12:48] <sergiusens> if so that works
[12:48] <Son_Goku> how?
[12:48] <Son_Goku> I couldn't figure it out via the docs
[12:48] <sergiusens> the `source` entries just need to point to the upstream you want to consume
[12:48] <ogra_> just use source:
[12:48] <ogra_> right
[12:48] <Son_Goku> also, when using source, is there a way to apply patches?
[12:49] <ogra_> or use the make plugin and have a git pull in your Makefile ... or ... or ...
[12:49] <ogra_> there are many ways
[12:50] <sergiusens> Son_Goku: you can now with `prepare`
[12:51] <Son_Goku> sweet
[12:51] <Son_Goku> so we do have an equivalent of the %prep stage
[12:51] <sergiusens> Son_Goku: it is just script in yaml to run whatever you want or need (not patch specific to not force anything on anyone)
[12:51]  * ogra_ also always just uses Makefules and calls patch from there ... works too
[12:51] <sergiusens> so if your patch is a `sed` so be it
[12:51] <Son_Goku> right
[12:51] <ogra_> *Makefiles
[12:51] <Son_Goku> I didn't know we had a prepare stage :)
[12:51] <ogra_> thats pretty new
[12:52] <sergiusens> Makufiles go well with Goku though :-P
[12:52] <ogra_> haha
[12:52] <Son_Goku> snapcraft.yml seems to become more like rpm-spec each day :)
[12:52] <sergiusens> Son_Goku: prepare, build and install
[12:52] <Son_Goku> that's... exactly how it works in rpm-spec
[12:52] <Son_Goku> %prep, %build, %install
[12:52] <sergiusens> Son_Goku: https://snapcraft.io/docs/build-snaps/scriptlets
[12:52] <Son_Goku> they're even called the same thing :)
[12:53] <Son_Goku> did you read some rpm docs before you implemented that :P
[12:53] <ogra_> just to make you feel at home ... we thought of you specifically ;)
[12:53] <BadCodSmell> versus debs
[12:53] <BadCodSmell> rpms are far far easier
[12:53] <sergiusens> build just might do something different than what you might expect ;-)
[12:53] <BadCodSmell> the deb format is tremendously bloated in comparison
[12:53] <Son_Goku> BadCodSmell: I totally agree
[12:53] <BadCodSmell> first time I downloaded the skeleton after rolling rpms for years I almost died
[12:53] <Son_Goku> which is why I now build my debs using rpmspec
[12:54] <Son_Goku> I despise debian source control packaging
[12:54] <BadCodSmell> there's the patch issue too, they have two systems of patching
[12:54] <sergiusens> Son_Goku: just alien-ate it :-P
[12:54] <ogra_> heh
[12:54] <Son_Goku> sergiusens: actually, I do something far worse (in debian folks' eyes)
[12:54] <sergiusens> anyways, need to go and drop off my son at daycare, bbiab
[12:54] <ogra_> is alien still a thing ?
[12:54] <Son_Goku> it is, but deadish
[12:54] <sergiusens> it is on slackware :-)
[12:54] <ogra_> yeah, upstream developmennt stalled years ago
[12:54] <Son_Goku> I generate native debian packages with rpmspec using debbuild: https://github.com/ascherer/debbuild
[12:55] <Son_Goku> I've even written macros that replace useful aspects of debhelper
[12:55] <ogra_> thats probably fine as long as you dont actually upload to an archive
[12:55] <ogra_> s/archive/official archive/
[12:56] <Son_Goku> nah, Debian people hate me anyway
[12:56] <Son_Goku> at least, that's what it was like the last time I tried to get involved there
[12:56] <ogra_> the big advantage of debs over rpms is not ease of packaging but strickt packaging policy ...
[12:56] <Son_Goku> the strict policy *does* exist in some distributions
[12:56] <Son_Goku> Mageia has always had Debian-like strictness in its policies
[12:56] <ogra_> its a hrd req. to upload something to an official archive
[12:57] <Son_Goku> well, likewise for Mageia
[12:57] <ogra_> and its a pain to learn the debian policy ... which is a req. to become a debian/ubuntu developer
[12:57] <Son_Goku> core, tainted, nonfree sections for Mageia mirror those of Debian (main, contrib, nonfree)
[12:58] <Son_Goku> ogra_, sadly, I know Debian Policy well, but it took years to figure it out
[12:58] <ogra_> but after all having upload rights gives you root access on all users boxes ... in both cases, rpm and deb
[12:58] <Son_Goku> right
[12:58] <ogra_> unlike snaps ;)
[12:58] <ogra_> thats the beauty about them :)
[12:59] <Son_Goku> that's why Mageia has a mentorship program to ensure people do things right: https://wiki.mageia.org/en/Becoming_a_Mageia_Packager and Debian has the whole Uploaders->Maintainers->Developers thing
[12:59] <Son_Goku> ogra_, well, there's a trade-off there
[12:59] <ogra_> yeah, same thing as debian or ubuntu have
[12:59] <Son_Goku> you pay a price for having confined applications
[12:59] <ogra_> indeed
[13:00] <ogra_> but its just a matter of getting used to
[13:00] <Son_Goku> yes
[13:00] <Son_Goku> though interestingly, it has come up before to have something like this in rpm itself, too
[13:00] <Son_Goku> it's just tricky because people *expect* systemwide access
[13:01] <Son_Goku> breaking that expectation is hard
[13:01] <ogra_> thats why we have interfaces now ...
[13:01] <ogra_> it wasnt always like that :)
[13:01] <ogra_> but you know that
[13:01] <Son_Goku> yep
[13:01] <Son_Goku> I was there for some of the planning sessions :)
[13:01] <ogra_> :)
[13:02] <Son_Goku> I suspect that the first distribution I'll manage to get snappy *fully* working on will be Mageia
[13:02] <BLu2> Can the libreoffice snap access my documents folder?
[13:02] <Son_Goku> because the community is already leaning towards AppArmor as a MAC (as it's better oriented for desktop user focus)
[13:03] <Son_Goku> but everything is on ice until multi-dist base/core snaps are possible
[13:03] <Son_Goku> and once sergiusens does the thing with the making the repo engine pluggable, I can add a DNF backend for RPM based distros (including Mageia)
[13:03] <Son_Goku> for snapcraft
[13:04] <ogra_> BLu2, afaik it should ... you might need to connect the home interface if it isnt connected though
[13:05] <BLu2> ogra_, I'm using symlink to another HDD for most Home folders
[13:05] <BLu2> would that still be an issue?
[13:05] <ogra_> ah, that might be a problem ... ask SweetShark in #ubuntu-desktop ...
[13:05] <ogra_> he maintains the snap
[13:05] <ogra_> (and is LibreOffice upstream)
[13:06] <BLu2> but it seems to be more of a snap "issue" in my case
[13:06] <ogra_> yes, he manages the snap ... he will know if there is a bug open for that etc
[13:47] <simosx> Just tried the stable Libreoffice snap and it appears that "Gtk-Message: Failed to load module "unity-gtk-module". The snap in the "edge" channel the other day was OK. Can someone do "snap install libreoffice", then run from the terminal "libreoffice.writer"? It should not complain about modules failing to load.
[13:55] <ogra_> simosx, there is Sweet5hark
[13:58] <willcooke> Sweet5hark, error is " "Gtk-Message: Failed to load module "unity-gtk-module"."  (via simosx)
[13:59] <willcooke> wasnt like that from edge the other day
[14:00] <Sweet5hark> Failed to load module "unity-gtk-module" -- is usually harmless, does libreoffice start then?
[14:01] <simosx> Sweet5hark, libreoffice does start, but it gets lots of issues with the menus. Some menu items are missing, etc.
[14:02] <simosx> I am running snap/snapd 2.12 (Ubuntu 16.04).
[14:02] <Sweet5hark> simosx: the message is unrelated. missing menus is unrelated to that, and not reproducable here. What host system are you on?
[14:03] <ogra_> 2.12 ?!??
[14:03] <simosx> Sorry, 2.21 version.
[14:03] <ogra_> ah :)
[14:03] <simosx> On Ubuntu 16.04 (all updates).
[14:04] <Sweet5hark> simosx: hmm, same host here. which menu are you missing exactly.
[14:05] <simosx> I did several installs and uninstalls of the snap earlier today while updating https://blog.simos.info/how-to-install-libreoffice-5-3-on-ubuntu-16-04-from-snap/ . I wonder whether I need to reboot.
[14:06] <simosx> Here are the startup errors, https://paste.ubuntu.com/23918221/
[14:07] <simosx> I'll reboot just to be on the safe side. brb.
[14:09] <Sweet5hark> simosx: All those messages are seen here too, but not critical, as I see no problem here. so likely unrelated.
[14:10] <ogra_> you should wait til he returns ;)
[14:12] <simosx> Sweet5hark, The issue still persists. I still get https://paste.ubuntu.com/23918221/
[14:12] <Sweet5hark> (15:09:58) Sweet5hark: simosx: All those messages are seen here too, but not critical, as I see no problem here. so likely unrelated.
[14:13] <Sweet5hark> simosx:  whichs menu are you missing exactly?
[14:13] <simosx> okay, will make screenshot of menus. when I move the mouse through the menu items, those menu items appear.
[14:19] <mup> PR snapcraft#1102 closed: cleanbuild: include snap directory in tarball <Created by kyrofa> <Merged by sergiusens> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapcraft/pull/1102>
[14:19] <simosx> Sweet5hark, hmm, something is wrong with my desktop. In the Ubuntu Settings, some textboxes are not showing.
[14:20] <simosx> Will need to make sure that no PPA leftovers are installed, then come back to you.
[14:21] <simosx> Sweet5hark, can you check the update at https://blog.simos.info/how-to-install-libreoffice-5-3-on-ubuntu-16-04-from-snap/ There are two usability issues, and those happen with snap/snapd 2.21 (Ubuntu 16.04 default snap version).
[14:22] <ogra_> simosx, what graphics card ?
[14:23] <simosx> ogra_, Intel(R) HD Graphics Haswell GT2 Desktop
[14:23] <ogra_> perhaps a driver issue ?
[14:25] <Sweet5hark> simosx: updates look good to me (not too much an expert on how the snap commands are supposed to be used, for that stuff Im just a user like everyone else ;) )
[14:29] <simosx> ogra_, I had the Intel drivers from 01.org and uninstalled recently per https://blog.simos.info/how-to-completely-remove-a-third-party-repository-from-ubuntu/ I noticed leftovers.
[14:30] <simosx> Sweet5hark, if you type "snap info libreoffice", do you get every time a different order for the commands? This probably affected Ubuntu Software, because if you click "Launch" in Ubuntu Software for LibreOffice, you get everytime a different LibreOffice programm starting up.
[14:32] <simosx> ogra_, the intel driver package from 01.org would install their own libcairo packages.
[14:33] <simosx> $ apt policy libcairo-gobject2
[14:33] <simosx> libcairo-gobject2:
[14:33] <simosx>   Installed: 1.15.2-0intel1
[14:33] <ogra_> lovely
[14:34] <mup> Bug #1661626 opened: GSettings/dconf reports incorrect values on setting change under confinement <Snappy:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1661626>
[14:44] <mup> PR snapd#2785 closed: Provide a more interesting pitch for upstream developers using snaps <Created by evandandrea> <Merged by mvo5> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/2785>
[14:51] <mup> PR snapd#2736 closed: Initial unity8 interface <Created by mikix> <Closed by mikix> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/2736>
[14:51] <mup> PR snapd#2786 opened: Initial unity8 interface <Created by mikix> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/2786>
[14:58] <mup> PR snapd#2787 opened: Add unity8 plug permissions <Created by mikix> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/2787>
[15:05] <simosx> I managed to narrow down the issue with menus I had earlier. It was not specific to snaps.
[15:05] <simosx> The offending package appears to be light-themes. I have this leftover version:
[15:05] <simosx> $ apt policy light-themes
[15:05] <simosx> light-themes:
[15:05] <simosx>   Installed: 16.10+16.04.20161205-0ubuntu1
[15:06] <simosx> It does not downgrade, because  unable to open '/usr/share/themes/Ambiance/gtk-3.0/assets/backdrop-button-toolbar.png.dpkg-new': No such file or directory
[15:06] <flexiondotorg> sergiusens Is there an ETA for snapcraft on 14.40?
[15:07] <flexiondotorg> I've got an ISV with their CI on 14.04 and snapcraft would help seal the deal :-)
[15:08] <simosx> From the three provided themes in Ubuntu 16.04, this weird version of light-themes affects Ambience and Radiance. A workaround was to enable "High contrast" for now.
[16:27] <mup> PR snapd#2788 opened: store,osutil: use new osutil.ExecutableExists(exe) check to only use deltas if xdelta3 is present <Created by chipaca> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/2788>
[16:32] <cjwatson> sergiusens: snap/snapcraft.yaml support deployed on Launchpad production now
[18:49] <mup> PR snapd#2789 opened: overlord/devicestate: backoff between retries if the server seems to have refused the serial-request <Created by pedronis> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/2789>
[19:16] <stokachu> cjwatson, \o/
[19:16] <stokachu> balloons, ^
[19:17] <balloons> stokachu, what's this?
 sergiusens: snap/snapcraft.yaml support deployed on Launchpad production now
[19:34] <mup> PR snapcraft#1079 closed: Add snapcraft plugin for Qt Build Suite (qbs) <Created by dpniel> <Merged by sergiusens> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapcraft/pull/1079>
[19:38] <balloons> do we know who might be able to change the owner of a snap in the store?
[19:38] <balloons> basically I want to move my snap to a different ubuntu one account
[19:46] <mup> PR snapcraft#1104 closed: repo: refactor into package <Created by kyrofa> <Closed by kyrofa> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapcraft/pull/1104>
[19:47] <Zap12344> Hello. What is the best place to ask help packaging an application? Here or the mailing list?
[19:47] <kyrofa> Zap12344, either works!
[19:53] <popey> if using shell snippets to do configure / make / make install, what would you set --prefix to, so that it doesn't try to write to / during make install?
[19:53] <popey> balloons: ness ita  can
[19:54] <balloons> popey, thank you. Not sure if nessita is around; if not I'll poke later
[19:54] <Zap12344> Ok so, since the new snapcraft allowed mixed architecture I tried to build a snap for pcsx2 (just for "fun").  The compilation is successful and all runtime dependencies seems satisfied, but it segfault.  log: https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B-kthB5RpM8kOFBsak5mU0NHRzg | snap: https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B-kthB5RpM8kNHZ3LU1JVTNxUFk  | snapcraft.yaml : https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B-kthB5RpM8kZk5wbzEyOEVRMFk/view?usp=shari
[19:56] <popey> Zap12344: might be easier to build in an i386 vm or in a real i386 builder in launchpad tbh
[19:58] <Zap12344> I tried in a i386 lxc container but then I'm not able to install it because it's not an x86_64 snap, anyway the compilation works just fine, but it's probably dangerous to compile it since it will mess up with a lot of libraries
[19:59] <kyrofa> Zap12344, you might be able to get away with specifying `architectures: [amd64, i386]` in the snapcraft.yaml
[20:04] <Zap12344> thanks kyrofa, I will try that. Anyway Pcsx2 supports a multiarch build, I managed to compile it as a snap, and now that is possible to specify the architecture of the stage-packages everything build nicely. But it seems there are problem finding the locale and libpangoxft segfault.
[20:05] <kyrofa> Yeah I got nothing on the segfault... would require some strace and gdb sessions, likely
[20:06] <popey> kyrofa: any idea about my question? :)
[20:07] <kyrofa> popey, I missed your question, so sorry!
[20:07] <popey> np
[20:07] <kyrofa> popey, you're referring to scriptlets?
[20:07] <popey> yes
[20:08] <kyrofa> popey, that depends. You can install with DESTDIR set to $SNAPCRAFT_PART_INSTALL
[20:08] <popey> ahh, of course
[20:08] <kyrofa> In that case, prefix is usually appended to it
[20:08] <kyrofa> So / is okay
[20:09] <kyrofa> Some build systems don't work quite that way though, and ignore DESTDIR (or similar variables)
[20:09] <popey> if i dont specify prefix in configure then it tries to install to the normal place /usr/share etc
[20:09] <kyrofa> popey, so in that case you can straight-up use $SNAPCRAFT_PART_INSTALL as the prefix and just `make install` with no DESTDIR
[20:09] <popey> I'll try setting DESTDIR
[20:09] <popey> ah okay
[20:09] <popey> thanks
[20:10] <kyrofa> popey, either of those options are good ones, perhaps try DESTDIR first, if that doesn't work, try the prefix
[20:10] <Zap12344> kyrofa, I thought so, I guess I'll try compiling it in a i386 vm first to see if something change.
[20:11] <kyrofa> popey, for example, PHP ignores DESTDIR, so it must be installed by prefix
[20:11] <kyrofa> popey, that's actually the whole story behind the autotools plugin supporting `install-via`
[20:22] <davmor2> popey: you having fun with snaps again?
[20:23] <popey> always
[20:23] <popey> kyrofa: that worked, thanks
[20:25] <kyrofa> popey, any time :)
[20:34] <mup> PR snapcraft#1100 closed: repo: remove symlinks to libc <Created by kyrofa> <Merged by sergiusens> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapcraft/pull/1100>
[21:38] <cory_fu> If I'm looking for where to file bugs or contribute to a particular snap in the store, how can I find that info?
[21:38] <kyrofa> cory_fu, great question
[21:39] <kyrofa> cory_fu, see https://bugs.launchpad.net/snappy/+bug/1624829
[21:39] <mup> Bug #1624829: There is no way to contact snap package developer <store> <Snapcraft:Confirmed> <Snappy:In Progress> <Software Center Agent:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1624829>
[21:41] <kyrofa> cory_fu, the only way I know of is to use uappexplorer, where it actually shows the store details
[21:41] <kyrofa> cory_fu, for example, you can see the support URL for nextcloud: https://uappexplorer.com/app/nextcloud.nextcloud
[21:43] <cory_fu> kyrofa: I'd also like to note that I can never find that site, because it doesn't show up when I search for "snap store" or similar
[21:43] <kyrofa> cory_fu, it's a third-party site, not official
[21:43] <cory_fu> Oh
[21:43] <cory_fu> Is there any official way to browse snaps on the web?
[21:44] <kyrofa> Not that I know of
[21:44] <cory_fu> Any particular reason for that?
[21:44] <kyrofa> No, no idea. Would sure be nice
[21:45] <cory_fu> Yeah it would
[21:45] <kyrofa> But in this case, I'd settle for `snap info` showing me some more info
[21:46] <cory_fu> kyrofa: So, I'm specifically trying to find the repo for the juju-act snap, but that doesn't come up for me on uapp explorer
[21:47] <kyrofa> cory_fu, is it in the stable channel?
[21:47] <cory_fu> kyrofa: Yeah.  But it is a classic snap
[21:47] <kyrofa> Oh, uappexplorer may not support that yet... no idea
[21:50] <cory_fu> kyrofa: How does that third-party site get access to the info that it displays?  Is there some way I can recreate the proper query?
[21:51] <kyrofa> cory_fu, using this I believe: http://search.apps.ubuntu.com/docs/
[21:51] <kyrofa> cory_fu, and yeah, you might have some luck with curl
[21:51] <cory_fu> kyrofa: Thanks
[22:02] <johanhenselmans> I tried the beaglebone black core image from http://people.canonical.com/~ogra/snappy/all-snaps/daily-stable/, got it running, added my (admittedly rather old 2001) DSA key to login.ubuntu and tried to login via SSH. The machine comes up with the message I should use that key, but it still refuses it. Anyone else that experience?
[23:00] <kyrofa> johanhenselmans, I seem to remember rsa only being supported
[23:04] <cory_fu> kyrofa: I'm having some trouble pushing my first snap to the store.  From the CLI, I get http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/23921229/ but I also set up a LP project for it and most of the builds failed: https://code.launchpad.net/~johnsca/+snap/juju-crashdump
[23:05] <kyrofa> cory_fu, if you login to the store, you can see the logs from the review tools
[23:06] <kyrofa> cory_fu, mind sharing the snapcraft.yaml? I might be able to spot issues
[23:06] <cory_fu> kyrofa: https://github.com/juju/juju-crashdump/blob/master/snapcraft.yaml
[23:07] <kyrofa> cory_fu, first of all, classic snaps currently don't build on LP. We're working on it
[23:07] <cory_fu> Ah, ok
[23:08] <cory_fu> kyrofa: It looks like the other error is just from it pending manual review.
[23:08] <kyrofa> Other than that, I don't see anything obviously wrong here, so you'll need to check the store for the output of the review tools
[23:08] <kyrofa> Oh. Does classic require manual review, then?
[23:09] <cory_fu> Apparently so.  And the first time I did a push, it told me that.  But the second push (with --release candidate) gave me an unhelpful error
[23:09] <cory_fu> Anyway, happy to wait on manual review.  It's quittin' time anyway.  :)