[00:10] evening all [00:11] hello bluesabre [00:11] hi knome [00:11] how's it going? [00:11] not bad [00:11] playing openttd (surprise!) [00:13] :O [00:25] bedtime [00:25] nighty! [00:43] bluesabre! [01:47] Unit193! [07:11] woohoo here we go then ... locking appears to have changed [07:15] WFM! [07:15] what locking ? [07:16] Session locking, by default uses light-locker and lightdm. [07:16] ok, that locking [07:16] what changed ? [07:16] Beats me, I use xscreensaver. [07:17] old school. [07:19] it locks ok [07:19] just must lock differently now - cos music when locked :) [07:22] check the non-bastardised install later I guess ... [07:23] flocculant, the change you are talking about, comes from xfce upstream ? [07:24] nope [07:26] sorinello_: obviously I'm also not talking about 17.04,16.10 or 16.04 either ;) [07:26] anyway - bbl [07:27] I know. I was just wondering who made this change since it doesn't come from upstream [11:15] ahah [11:15] sussed that one then - so lock disables sound from pulseaudio [11:16] if you happen to play through alsa - it doesn't :) [11:16] wasn't using mpd and alsa last time I looked at locking ... [16:27] I'm installing daily on my laptop right now and I have an issue with step 3. (If on a 'laptop') Is plugged to a power source [16:28] I don't see that option during install preparation, only info about downloading updates and third-party software [16:33] oh wait... [16:38] yeah something is not right here, it doesn't detect my Windows installation either, I wanted to test "Install (auto-resize)" [16:40] so one question here - is it supposed to detect my Windows 7 installation (UEFI) when I booted USB with Legacy Boot option? [16:47] Spass: I don't do uefi or secure boot - but I would suspect that it's not supposed to - try booting in uefi mode perhaps? [17:00] flocculant: ok, installation booted when I activated my USB drive to be visible as an option with UEFI boot, but to procedure is somewhat different now [17:01] I don't get 'Try Xubuntu' and 'Install Xubuntu' on welcome screen, instead I had to choose it on Grub menu [17:02] I assume that test case was prepared strictly for non-UEFI installs [17:02] but now it detects my Windows installation at least [17:06] 1) https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B8qh4-wxxEZ7Zzl3aTdwemdwRm8 [17:06] 2) https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B8qh4-wxxEZ7QjBzclU1RjhBZDg [17:07] that empty welcome screen 2) doesn't look inviting [17:08] re grub - probably expected - can't be sure [17:08] re welcome screen - seems like no network recognised [17:11] in the next step I connected to my wifi and when I come back to that screen I see small text on top "You may wish to read the release notes." but it still feels pretty empty there [17:11] don't know what a different flavour sees when uefi/non uefi? [17:11] well what do you want it to say? [17:12] anyway - that's beyond our influence [17:13] nothing really, it just looks empty, and I know it's not important, sorry for "complaining" about small things [17:14] not a problem - sometimes it's something we can affect :) [17:14] biab [17:28] another question, I remember when I've installed Xubuntu some time ago I saw a screen with check marks about sufficient disk space, internet connection and plug-in to power [17:29] is this screen removed in the newer versions? [17:34] I'm asking because now I don't know where I should find an info about my laptop being plugged-in to power, according to 3. in this testcase http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/milestones/376/builds/147231/testcases/1301/results [17:38] "17. Click the Restart now button - GUI is shut down, a prompt to remove media and press Enter appears" [17:39] nope, after clicking restart I'm stuck on this screen https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B8qh4-wxxEZ7YUtLZmdQMGFpdDQ/view [17:49] https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B8qh4-wxxEZ7cnJ1TGFoLXJLUms - it would be nice to see Xubuntu instead of Ubuntu in the grub menu, but besides that everything works fine, both systems boot [18:10] Spass: that screen with checkmarks went a while ago I believe [18:13] ok, I submitted my results on the tracker [18:13] and not really sure about the power thing for laptops - don't have one [18:14] Passed, but with comments [18:14] maybe grab a different iso - Ubuntu or something and see what that does [18:14] could be they just show power in panel or indicator [18:14] which would then be a testcase bug [18:15] during installation process I saw two indicators on top panel, sound and network, no power [18:16] I will try with Ubuntu 16.04 for example [18:16] mmm - and with 17.04 - what did you see ? If you remember :) [18:18] I've upgraded my PC from 16.10, and when I lastly installed Xubuntu on my laptop I remember that screen with check marks, so it was probably 16.04 [18:39] and I think someone mentioned it already - double-tap functionality on my ALPS DualPoint TouchPad doesn't work out of the box, but it started working after I installed 'xserver-xorg-input-synaptics' package and rebooted [18:44] Ubuntu 16.04 installation shows I'm plugged-in on the top panel [18:45] PaulW2U edited libinput.conf iirc [18:46] plus many other things that I didn't saw on Xubuntu 17.10, like Bluetooth icon, accessibility, keyboard layout [18:47] I'll check Ubuntu 17.04 now [18:47] Spass: ok thanks - need to know if that's a regression [18:53] ehh, another ff crash :/ [18:53] ... [18:53] davmor2: on ubuntu 17.10 do you see power and bluetooth etc ? [18:59] knome: sigh - why won't our wiki let me reset password :| [19:03] flocculant, no idea... [19:03] it's standard dokuwiki though [19:03] pleia2, want to look if there's anything fishy in the sendmail/whatever conf? [19:04] ftr - it sends me temp password, which works, go to profile - enter new, confirm it and current (temp) and it clears all fields [19:05] worked the last time I forgot the password - before you two were doing whatever you were doing last week ;) [19:05] tsk, remember your password next time! [19:05] ;) [19:05] that was just a migration to https, shouldn't affect... [19:07] famous last words :D [19:07] unless there's hard coded http in dokuwiki for some reason, but that would be really awful [19:07] (maybe in a setting?) [19:07] i can look... [19:08] also it now forgets I was logged in ... [19:08] can't see anything that's realted [19:08] *related either [19:11] flocculant: I've just checked Ubuntu daily, I can see the all the icons during installation process [19:11] flocculant: I just reset my password via email with no problems, not sure what's going on for you :\ [19:12] changed password after I got a temp one [19:12] Spass: ok cheers [19:12] * pleia2 shrugs [19:12] pleia2: mmm [19:13] anyway, woo new password that hasn't been shared over http 400 times [19:13] ;) [19:13] (and I would recommend everyone update their wiki password now that we're using https) [19:13] plus this issue is present on Ubuntu AA too (when I try to 'shut down' from install) https://goo.gl/SYTIil [19:13] shut down on 16.04 worked fine, so I think this could be a regression [19:13] Spass: that comes and goes ... [19:14] oh, ok [19:14] there is a bug somewhere - check for one by davm or2 - he's a Canonical chappy [19:14] you can add that to the iso tracker [19:14] pleia2: I have - it's now something I have no chance of remembering - ever :| [19:15] frankly - just another reason for me to not use this wiki - don't like it at the best of times ... [19:16] flocculant only uses websites that don't require passwords [19:16] no - flocculant uses websites where he can change temp passwords ;) [19:17] i just changed my password as well [19:17] are you sure you don't press the "reset" button? [19:20] oh d'oh [19:22] was pressing the reset button ... not reading them - just assuming that muscle memory thing of yes being on the right [19:22] still don't like the wiki even if I can change the password :p [19:22] so... we're liking the wiki again? :P [19:22] no [19:23] still prefer the ubuntu one - don't much like the way bullets look to start with [19:23] don't like that I can't put colours on things [19:24] but heyho whatever [19:24] i like that i don't have to wait 15 minutes to log in and 5 minutes for a page load even if it means we can't have a plugin-bloated wiki [19:24] well yea - it does have at least 1 positive :D [19:25] flocculant: thank you for your patience, to summarise I had two small issues with Xubuntu AA install - only two indicators on the top panel (there are seven on Ubuntu) and Grub menu showing Ubuntu instead of Xubuntu after install [19:25] anyway back to fighting with Friday's trasncript [19:25] I assume I should go with this now? http://packages.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/milestones/377/builds/146768/testcases [19:27] Spass: ok so I would think missing power icon on aa is a problem < ochosi ? [19:27] Spass: package tracker is there - but none of the testcases have been checked against current applications [19:28] yeah I think so, there should be some info about how much juice is left on battery [19:28] never used that accessibility menu, but I think that could be useful for someone too? [19:28] Spass: if you wanted to do something awesomely helpful - you could run the mandatory testcases fro packages - and create bug reports for them ... that would be super helpful [19:28] awesomely super even [19:31] you mean that testcases I pasted? or something in other place? [19:31] you linked to the package tracker last [19:32] none of those have been looked at for 2 cycles at least properly [19:32] ok, I can do that tomorrow, np [19:32] this is what I see on Ubuntu AA install - https://goo.gl/DtCBf1 [19:32] Spass: no rush - there are loads of them :) [19:32] on Xubuntu - just sound and network [19:33] just syncing my iso's [19:35] flocculant: I should do a fresh install tomorrow or I can test that packages on current install? don't know how often 'daily' changes [19:35] you'll be fine testing on what you just installed :) [19:36] when you find issues - and you will - please https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-manual-tests/+filebug for each testcase [19:38] Spass: confirm the missing power plugin [19:39] ochosi bluesabre - missing plugin when you 'just' install - what to report that against? plugin? indicators? panel? [20:12] knome: have you 15 minutes between now and Thursday evening to read something? [20:20] yes, for example now [20:34] flocculant, are you using the DND feature with bugs? [20:34] on the tracker? [20:34] yep [20:34] I do yea [20:34] good :) [20:35] well [20:35] well? :D [20:35] when it's possible - sometimes you find that the bug's so far down the list it doesn't always work very well - dragging it all the way up and hoping the browser pages for you [20:35] flocculant: hm, thats odd, so the xfce4-power-manager panel plugin is missing? [20:36] flocculant, right, yeah [20:36] ochosi: ack - ONLY when you don't go to live desktop, so from the very first menu pick install or choose install from the try/install dialogue [20:37] oh [20:37] in that case that's expected and was always like tht [20:37] that's the ubiquity panel, it has no power manager support (or the other way round) [20:37] knome: also bear in mind the text is very very long already and I am not confident of getting done in one hour [20:37] ack [20:37] in theory we could have indicator-power displayed there, but i don't think it's really worth it [20:37] though if it's copy-paste... [20:37] ochosi: aah ok [20:37] flocculant, and feel free to drop stuff i add [20:38] knome: yea - but still time for people to discuss needed :) [20:38] i don't mind if people stay on the channel after the session :) [20:38] Spass: ^^ see ochosi's comments re power [20:38] knome: me neither - but it's tiring running these things ;) [20:41] yep [20:42] that's of course assuming more than 1 person pitches up :D [20:42] heh [20:42] yeah [20:43] less than two and I will just post the transcript on the mailing list :D [20:43] ochosi: IMHO it would be nice to see battery status during installation, especially since the screen with check marks (disk space, network connection and power) was removed [20:43] Spass: yeah, it's not that easily possible i suppose [20:45] ochosi: I've checked Ubuntu AA daily, it displays all (7) icons on the top panel https://goo.gl/DtCBf1 [20:46] yes, those are the indicators, because that's all the ubiquity panel supports [20:46] so indicator-power to be exact for the battery [20:46] but we don't really want that in the live session [20:46] and i'm not sure we can easily scope it to the ubiquity session alone [20:46] ok, I understand [20:46] tbh the ubiquity session is not *extremely* useful because the xubuntu live session isn't *that* heavy-weight in terms of resource consumption [20:47] [20:48] and to use xubuntu you'll need to have the resources anyway... [20:48] yeah, although when running the live session, things are a little slower usually [20:49] sure [20:49] ok, recommendation officially rejected then :) [20:50] if we can make indicator-power only appear in the ubiquity session and not after install, it could be okay [20:50] but imo it's questionable whether it's worth the effort [20:51] maybe previous Ubuntu/Xubuntu installations spoiled me, I always remember summary window with my 'status' (space, network, power) [20:52] but it's not a problem for me [20:53] yeah, not sure why they dropped the page [20:53] was maybe not altogether useless [20:53] if Ubuntu has that power icon regardless of whether on desktop or just ubiquity - then perhaps they didn't think about it affecting other flavours [20:53] ubuntu always uses indicator-power [20:54] so for them it's a clear and easy path [20:54] in theory we could make the xfce panel appear in the ubiquity session [20:54] then we'd have a fully fledged panel and could throw in whatever we want [20:55] but at the time when i considered that we decided to leave it as is for the resource savings [20:55] and because then there'd be zarrrro difference between the two sessions :D [20:57] :) [20:58] apart from the power thingymajig :p [20:59] leaving it as it is and adding just indicator-power is an option to consider in the future? as low priority of course [21:00] Spass: what we also have to bear in mind is that we don't know what Ubuntu will decide about indicators now they're moving to Gnome - that was something that was possibly up in the air a while back [21:01] at which point possibly ochosi will pull all his hair out :p [21:01] yeah, that's a good reminder [21:02] we should poke Laney or Trevinho [21:02] to buy glue? [21:02] aah that reminder :) [21:02] if any of you are around during the day, that'd be a great thing to do [21:02] generally not at the moment [21:02] or not for long at least [21:03] ochosi: I'll try tomorrow morning if I see trevinho [21:03] cool, thanks [21:03] I think they're online about the right time for me then [21:04] or at least were today ;) [21:04] ochosi: might be worth us working out the things that might possibly affect us so we have some list somewhere [21:05] I believe the lightdm convo went quiet [21:05] mhm [21:05] i hope at least that one will stick around [21:06] yea - I think Robert does too :) [21:06] if indicators go south, then we only have a problem with indicator-application, cause that helps with the integration of several apps [21:06] yup [21:06] but indicator-sound we could in theory replace [21:06] and indicator-messages we could possibly live without [21:06] I have had the xfce pa plugin here which works - but obviously doesn't list music apps [21:06] right [21:07] yeah, doesnt do that [21:07] s/have had/still have [21:07] losing the indicators would be no big deal [21:07] but at least it's ok sound control [21:07] yea [21:07] that works fine [21:07] (when I'm using pulse :D) [21:10] I was recently testing my 17.04 without indicators for a day or two, just to check if I need them as much as I think, and yeah - loosing them won't be a big deal, that said - I really like them [21:12] knome: finished? [21:12] soon... soon [21:12] coming from debian I never used them before so I just remove them anyway [21:13] knome: ok - well I'm off up the wooden hill now :) thanks for looking there, I'll go back there tomorrow evening [21:13] no worries [21:13] nighty! :) [21:14] I think the only indicator I use is the message one - and only to see if I'm bothered enough to read the mail yet [21:14] anyway - stairs for me :) [21:14] night all [21:33] -application isn't all that important since packages generally fallback to trayicon, -sound I'd say is a little more so, but -pa-plugin makes it not too bad.