[05:30] <jibel> morning
[06:02] <oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers!
[06:02] <duflu> Hi oSoMoN, jibel
[06:03] <jibel> hi duflu
[06:11] <oSoMoN> hey duflu, jibel
[06:15] <jibel> hi oSoMoN
[06:52] <didrocks> good morning
[08:00] <seb128> good morning desktopers!
[08:00] <didrocks> re seb128
[08:00] <seb128> re didrocks :-)
[08:00]  * didrocks doesn't feel lonely anymore here \o/
[08:01] <seb128> haha
[08:01] <flexiondotorg> Morning didrocks seb128 and the other desktopers
[08:01] <didrocks> hey flexiondotorg!
[08:01] <jamesh> morning
[08:01] <seb128> I'm trying to go back to start a bit earlier but still mostly failing
[08:01] <didrocks> morning jamesh ;) (sounds like people look at IRC on UK-o-clock :p)
[08:01] <seb128> evening jamesh
[08:01] <seb128> hey flexiondotorg
[08:01] <seb128> how is everybody doing?
[08:01] <willcooke> morning all
[08:01] <willcooke> ar'noon jamesh
[08:01] <didrocks> evening* even
[08:01] <didrocks> hey willcooke
[08:01] <seb128> hey willcooke, pre-hey Laney
[08:02] <willcooke> :))
[08:02] <willcooke> any....second.....now......
[08:02] <didrocks> tic tac tic tac
[08:02] <willcooke> koza, shall will skip bluetooth meeting today?
[08:04] <Laney> morning
[08:04] <willcooke> morning Laney
[08:04] <koza> willcooke, if you feel so; no meeting then seems so.
[08:08] <Laney> seb128: planted some Cosmos, was watering them in when the chimes went ;-)
[08:09] <Laney> how's it going?
[08:09] <seb128> hey Laney :-)
[08:09] <seb128> good! today shapes to be a nice day
[08:09] <seb128> sunny and still not too warm
[08:09] <seb128> had some good sleep
[08:09] <seb128> you?
[08:11] <seb128> bah, jbicha rebuilt bluez with new e-d-s just as it was ready to migrate and now it's blocked
[08:11] <Laney> :/
[08:11] <Laney> the old one would have been able to go in
[08:12] <Laney> yeah I'm good
[08:12] <Laney> didn't win the pub quiz last night but had some free beer
[08:16] <seb128> better this way!
[08:16] <seb128> it wouldn't be anything special to win it if you did that every second week
[08:17] <flexiondotorg> I knocked up a patch for indicator-session last night.
[08:17] <flexiondotorg> Please could one of you cast an eye over the merge proposal diff and let me know if it looks sane?
[08:17] <seb128> url?
[08:17] <flexiondotorg> https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-mate-dev/indicator-session/mate-integration/+merge/325600
[08:19] <flexiondotorg> Ubuntu MATE is going full on indicator support in 17.10. indicator-session was the last indicator missing some MATE integration.
[08:19] <seb128> so you use the indicator and plan to keep doing so?
[08:19] <seb128> nice
[08:19] <flexiondotorg> We've been using some indicator as an options for ages.
[08:19] <seb128> xnox, ^ see, indicators are still being used
[08:20] <flexiondotorg> But most of the panel layouts in Ubuntu MATE will only offer indicators now.
[08:20] <flexiondotorg> The Ubuntu MATE community asked for the initial indicator support and have been pressing that is it fully supported.
[08:25] <andyrock> morning
[08:26] <flexiondotorg> And the Mutiny layout started as a kind of joke, but it will be a fairly authentic Unity 7 interface in Ubuntu MATE 17.10 :O
[08:26] <flexiondotorg> andyrock o/
[08:26] <Laney> flexiondotorg: got a screenshot of that?
[08:26] <Laney> hey andyrock
[08:27] <muktupavels> flexiondotorg: XDG_CURRENT_DESKTOP can have multiple desktop names...
[08:28] <Laney> yeah you need to split it on : and compare each part
[08:28] <Laney> g_strspit and g_strv_contains are your friends
[08:28] <Laney> split
[08:29] <seb128> hey andyrock, how are you?
[08:29] <andyrock> hey seb128
[08:30] <andyrock> preparing coffee to start the day
[08:30] <andyrock> you?
[08:30] <Laney> what's the andyrock approved way to prepare coffee?
[08:31] <Laney> I imagine some science lab of equipment for some reason
[08:31] <seb128> andyrock, day is started for a bit but I could do with another coffee :-)
[08:31] <seb128> lol
[08:31] <seb128> I imagine the opposite :p
[08:31] <seb128> real italian, no complex machine, just old school pot or something
[08:32]  * Laney has one of these https://ineedcoffee.com/clever-coffee-dripper-review/
[08:35] <andyrock> https://usercontent.irccloud-cdn.com/file/png4sOb1/2017-06-14-103336.jpg
[08:35] <andyrock> seb128
[08:35] <andyrock> :D
[08:48] <seb128> andyrock, that's what I was expecting :-)
[09:14] <flexiondotorg> muktupavels Laney OK, I'll add a split for XDG_CURRENT_DESKTOP
[09:14] <flexiondotorg> Laney I grab a piccy a bit later.
[09:51] <willcooke> wow! http://www.surveykshan.gov.in/
[09:52] <willcooke> Laney, had the go-ahead from legal now.  Can you help me to test the changes to the maps?
[09:53] <didrocks> gnome-maps upstream contributor!
[09:55] <willcooke> alas, only libtimezonemap
[09:56] <didrocks> willcooke: you can turn this as library maintainer in C with glib! :)
[09:57] <Laney> willcooke: that website doesn't work for me
[09:57] <Laney> can you provide a screenshot on the bug report please?
[09:58] <willcooke> Laney, same.  That was the official source it was suggested to use, but it doesnt seem to have anything useful.  Spoke to Katherine and she's sent it over to the our lawyers in India for confirmation
[09:58] <willcooke> so perhaps just park this for now
[09:58] <willcooke> I'll screenshots now
[09:58] <Laney> ok
[09:58] <Laney> I'm scared of this bug
[10:01] <Laney> but thanks for taking it on :-)
[10:01] <willcooke> :) kinda wish I hadn't ;D
[10:04] <willcooke> seb128, OEM release for this is end of July: https://trello.com/c/TzygcVy7  I've put a "due date" of a week Monday, is that do-able?
[10:09] <seb128> willcooke, yes, it's on my list of things to look at for this week
[10:09] <willcooke> seb128, merci
[10:09] <seb128> de rien
[10:47] <flexiondotorg> Laney http://imgur.com/gallery/ub7ot
[10:47] <Laney> flexiondotorg: nice, that's not a bad likeness
[10:48] <flexiondotorg> Close enough.
[10:49] <flexiondotorg> Laney I've pushed splitting of XDG_CURRENT_DESKTOP to https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-mate-dev/indicator-session/mate-integration/+merge/325600
[10:52] <Trevinho> flexiondotorg: lovely :-D
[11:34] <willcooke> flexiondotorg, neat!
[14:08] <jbicha> seb128: sorry about delaying bluez' promotion, could you review evolution in NEW since you did e-d-s?
[14:10] <jbicha> seb128: Laney: last night slangasek did not want to accept evo because he didn't like the idea of bloating the Package lists with an installed-tests package
[14:11] <Laney> I saw that
[14:11] <Laney> I replied on #ubuntu-release
[14:11] <Laney> But there's nothing I can actually do
[14:12] <Laney> Get it through Debian and then it won't be the Ubuntu Archive Team's responsibility
[14:13] <jbicha> I'm not sure that slangasek is even hard-blocking it, he just doesn't want to approve it himself?
[14:14] <Laney> 'k, then maybe you can find another AA to do that
[14:17] <jbicha> Laney: I haven't heard from xnox yet about LP: #1695928
[14:17] <jbicha> would it be better for me to undo dropping e-d-s-online-accounts for now so that we can rebuild address-book-service to finish the Evolution transition?
[14:18] <jbicha> unity8 depends on a binary from address-book-service
[14:19] <Laney> what's the problem with rebuilding it?
[14:20] <xnox> jbicha, =)
[14:20] <xnox> i am happy to remove everything, but didn't review your list
[14:20] <jbicha> address-book-service build-depends on e-d-s-online-accounts
[14:22] <Laney> ok
[14:23] <Laney> I'm good with removing it I guess, but not an AA
[14:24] <jbicha> unless there's a differnet problem? (I didn't try with -proposed disabled) https://bicha.net/address-book-service-rebuild.txt
[14:25] <jbicha> I pinged you because you were involved in some of the unity8 removal discussions
[14:25] <jbicha> and slangasek was involved as the AA previously so I can ping him when we agree on a list?
[14:25] <Laney> I don't know that that can happen quickly
[14:26] <Laney> but if you can identify a subset that lets this move forward, maybe that can
[14:26] <Laney> looks like you woke xnox up, so over to you two if you don't mind
[14:26] <xnox> hahah
[14:27] <jbicha> xnox: it's a big long list of interconnected dependencies so I don't know if there's more data I could provide to make the list clearer?
[14:28] <jbicha> for normal removals, I'd probably paste the output of reverse-depends into the bug but that would be a lot of pasting here
[14:36] <willcooke> GNOME Shell -> Power Settings -> When I press the power button -> I can only suspend, not power off.  Anyone know if Is like that by design?
[14:43] <qengho> willcooke: Sounds like a bug for the reason that it's bewildering.
[14:43] <willcooke> qengho, :) I think that was hibernate vs suspend
[14:44] <willcooke> pressing the power button to turn the power off seems kinda normal to me :)
[14:44] <willcooke> also, HI! qengho
[14:44] <qengho> Howdy!
[14:44] <willcooke> qengho, are you at your new place yet?
[14:44] <qengho> Nope. Moving physically in about a week.
[14:45] <jbicha> willcooke: yes it is like that by design, there is or will be an option in Tweak Tool for that setting
[14:45] <willcooke> Exciting!  Good luck!  Will you be allowed on IRC still? ;)
[14:45] <willcooke> jbicha, thx!
[14:45] <mdeslaur> data loss is by design?
[14:46] <willcooke> mdeslaur, as in suspend for ages and the battery dies?
[14:46] <mdeslaur> yeah
[14:46] <jbicha> a direct Power Off action by pressing the Power Button (sometimes accidentally) is bad
[14:47] <willcooke> I can't remember, but I /think/ it uses hybrid suspend where it will save to disk and power off when the power gets too low.  But that probably only works on newer machines
[14:47] <jbicha> Tweak Tool's implementation will call it Power Off but it will be "interactive" where it gives you a 60-second countdown with an option to really Power Off right now (like the software Power button in GNOME Shell)
[14:47] <jbicha> GNOME does not support hybrid suspend yet
[14:48] <willcooke> I thought upowerd did that for you?
[14:49] <qengho> Hope this isn't offtopic, but I don't see why hybrid didn't always work. Write out the boot-recovery at lid close, and go to soft suspend, and if the soft suspend ever perishes from lack of electicity, then it has a way to boot to recover.
[14:50] <mdeslaur> I thought hybrid needed a swap partition?
[14:50] <qengho> Yes.
[14:50] <willcooke> ahh, that could be it
[14:50] <mdeslaur> and we just switched to swap files :P
[14:51] <qengho> Though swap files could have worked with a smart loader, and grub is smart enough. Lilo wasn't.
[14:51]  * jbicha blames xnox for everything again :)
[14:51] <didrocks> the issues are some graphics card which can't restate their state properly (weren't serialized) like, some nvidia cards AFAIK
[14:51] <ogra> mdeslaur, well, so we only support hybrid on laptops with separate HDD-battery ... easy ...
[14:53] <jbicha> gnome-control-center has a new maintainer so maybe it's possible to get Power Off added back to Settings>Power>Power button
[14:53] <jbicha> I'm trying to get the needed setting added back to gnome-settings-daemon first: https://bugzilla.gnome.org/781108
[14:54] <willcooke> Maybe it's not really a problem, I mean you can poweroff from the menu easy enough
[14:54] <jbicha> but it's also a GNOME Design decision so it may be stuck in Tweak Tool or a distro patch to gnome-control-center
[15:06] <seb128> jbicha, hey, sorry I'm busy in meeting, I have a look after that one is over
[15:07] <jbicha> np, thanks :)
[15:10] <seb128> jbicha, btw do you plan to work on the network-manager merge/update? that would be welcome if you want to do so
[15:10] <seb128> seems like everybody else is currently busy
[15:10] <seb128> I can try to help with that maybe next week but things tend to land on my todolist so it might get pushed back
[15:10] <jbicha> willcooke suggested that I maybe work with ochosi on that merge to give him more merging practice?
[15:13] <seb128> jbicha, he suggested oSoMoN, but Olivier is currently busy with chromium updates and then is going to look at libreoffice updates next week
[15:13] <seb128> so maybe for next round
[15:14]  * Laney is interested to try the captive portal stuff
[15:14] <jbicha> oops, wrong O name :(
[15:14] <Laney> was wondering if we want to put the required file on an ubuntu.com server somewhere
[15:15] <didrocks> is it possible to put it on people.canonical.com for now just for testing?
[15:15] <jbicha> Laney: the captive portal thing is blocked by a few things, we'd like to have an option in gnome-control-center (Privacy or Network) to disable it but enable it by default
[15:15] <Laney> it's just a URL in a config file AIUI
[15:15] <Laney> so yes
[15:15] <Laney> what things?
[15:16] <jbicha> https://rt.ubuntu.com/Ticket/Display.html?id=29600
[15:16] <didrocks> hum, I bet the config file isn't per user
[15:16] <jbicha> I think the proposed 204 response isn't supported by NM yet?
[15:17] <jbicha> the g-c-c bug is https://bugzilla.gnome.org/737362
[15:18] <Laney> I doubt it's been magically worked on
[15:18] <Laney> but the merge would bring Debian's implementation which is okay as an opt-in
[15:19] <seb128> we should update n-m in any case, even if that's without that feature in a first iteration
[15:19] <Laney> I am not proposing blocking on implementing it.
[15:20] <seb128> I didn't suggest you were
[15:20] <seb128> I was mostly saying that for jbicha
[15:20] <didrocks> I can ask my fedora friends if there is anything they did as a privacy feature. I would be surprised they didn't
[15:20] <jbicha> cyphermox: is there a problem with letting Debian exp's new nm-config-connectivity-debian pkg in to artful?
[15:21] <jbicha> https://anonscm.debian.org/git/pkg-utopia/network-manager.git/tree/debian/20-connectivity-debian.conf?h=experimental
[15:22] <jbicha> didrocks: Fedora's solution was to make the config snippet a separate package that privacy-sensitive users can uninstall (like Debian has now done)
[15:22] <jbicha> it works but a toggle switch in g-c-c would make it nicer
[15:22] <didrocks> hum, but it means multiple users (yeah I know, not trendy) can't select for themselves?
[15:22] <didrocks> g-c-c would need to be per-user, or global with a polkit
[15:22] <didrocks> switch*
[15:23] <jbicha> yes, the current implementation is system-wide, but isn't networking generally system-wide too?
[15:23] <didrocks> yeah, it just means it's not just a settings to implement, a little bit more is needed, but both can be handled
[15:23] <didrocks> just wanted to be sure we are all talking about the same thing :)
[15:25] <jbicha> oh, address-book-service fails to build at the same spot even without -proposed enabled :(
[15:26] <jbicha> I did test the evo transition first but that was back in April :(
[15:44] <jbicha> oh, vala
[15:45] <jbicha> ricotz: https://launchpadlibrarian.net/323996548/buildlog_ubuntu-artful-amd64.address-book-service_0.1.2+17.04.20161124.1-0ubuntu1~ubuntu17.10.1_BUILDING.txt.gz
[15:45] <jbicha> "incompatible get accessor type"
[15:48] <jbicha> https://bazaar.launchpad.net/~phablet-team/address-book-service/trunk/view/head:/3rd_party/folks/dummy/lib/dummy-persona-store.vala
[15:50] <seb128> jbicha, new evo binNEWed
[15:51] <Laney> yay
[15:52] <jbicha> thanks, now we just have to figure out vala
[16:00] <ricotz> jbicha, looking
[16:13] <ricotz> jbicha, pretty crude and minimal fix though https://paste.debian.net/plain/971468
[16:14] <ricotz> folks itself had a lot of those issues
[16:36] <Laney> argh
[16:36] <Laney> just CRASH already
[16:56] <jbicha> ricotz: thank you very much, your fix worked :)
[17:07] <Laney> seb128: bluez is green again now ;-)
[17:07] <Laney> jbicha: don't forget evolution-indicator
[17:07] <Laney> night all!
[17:08] <willcooke> see ya Laney
[17:09] <jbicha> Laney: thanks, have a good evening
[17:09] <jbicha> Laney: btw my wife doesn't like your definition of "nob"
[17:10] <jbicha> she cites https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/nob
[17:11] <Laney> jbicha: is your wife 300 years old?
[17:11] <Laney> I speak the language of the street yo
[17:11] <Laney> check yourself
[17:12] <jbicha> well she's writing like a clean sort-of-fantasy novel (without magic) and she wants to use the word for the aristocrats
[17:13] <jbicha> so how common is the street meaning?
[17:13] <Laney> very
[17:13] <Laney> if you went up to somebody and said 'nice nob'
[17:14] <Laney> they probably wouldn't be very pleased with you
[17:14] <jbicha> lol, ok
[17:14] <Laney> but in a historical context that other definition is ok
[17:14] <Laney> might get a smile :P
[17:14] <Laney> see you!
[17:54] <oSoMoN> Laney, isn’t the offending meaning originally supposed to be spelled with a "k" ?
[17:55] <oSoMoN> the 5th definition at https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=nob seems to suggest that
[18:02] <jbicha> https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/knob
[18:03] <oSoMoN> that seems to confirm it
[18:38] <willcooke> night all
[18:48] <ricotz> jbicha, any more vala-related failures?
[18:49] <jbicha> I'm sure there are, but that one was blocking the Evolution 3.24 transition
[18:49] <jbicha> I haven't done tried rebuilding the vala rdepends yet
[18:50] <ricotz> if a git.gnome.org based package is failing there is likely a commit upstream you can cherry-pick
[18:50] <jbicha> I'm asking the folks maintainer to do a new release
[18:50] <jbicha> you have some sort of ci for gnome vala packages now?
[18:51] <ricotz> oh, I see folks didn't get a release
[18:51] <ricotz> valabot ci isn
[18:51] <ricotz> valabot ci isn't new, but more known now ;)
[18:52] <ricotz> http://paldo.org:8010/builders
[18:52] <ricotz> of course gnome-continuous catches things too
[18:54] <jbicha> ricotz: did you want to try vala rdepends rebuilds in a PPA so we can see what needs to be fixed?
[18:55] <ricotz> jbicha, https://launchpad.net/~ricotz/+archive/ubuntu/red/+packages
[18:56] <jbicha> did you delete all the ones that passed?
[18:56] <ricotz> yes
[18:57] <jbicha> address-book-service, anjuta, gnome-builder, shotwell, valabind are good now
[19:01] <ricotz> bamf and zeitgeist too
[19:36] <gQuigs> is there a page/policy describing why the dev release doesn't get Firefox updates?  (I thought it didn't get chromium either, but it appears to get them)
[19:44] <jbicha> unless we ignored armhf and ppc64el, firefox would be stuck in -proposed anyway, maybe that's not a good reason and maybe we should just drop those binaries there
[19:48] <gQuigs> jbicha: seems those are being ignored anyway.. I only see latest builds for  amd64, arm64, i386 in -security.. (but there is an attempt to build them)
[20:03] <oSoMoN> night folks