[02:57] <TheMuso> robert_ancell: So, further to bug 1670933, seems that removing all code to manage at-spi manually from both unity-greeter and lightdm-gtk-greeter solves the problem, and systemd cleans up properly aftewards, and at-spi is able to remove AT_SPI_BUS from the root window. Going to work on merges for unity-greeter and the gtk greeter, and SRU these for 17.04.
[02:57] <ubot5`> bug 1670933 in Light Display Manager "Accessibility partly broken due to X root window being kept from login session." [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1670933
[03:14] <robert_ancell> TheMuso, do you think the code was required pre-systemd or was it just crap code?
[03:20] <TheMuso> robert_ancell: It was required pre-systemd.
[03:21] <robert_ancell> TheMuso, good to hear you found the issue!
[03:21] <TheMuso> Well, I didn't really, but this solves it.
[05:31] <oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers!
[05:43] <didrocks> good morning
[07:08] <flexiondotorg> Morning oSoMoN didrocks
[07:13] <didrocks> hey flexiondotorg
[07:47] <oSoMoN> hey flexiondotorg, didrocks
[07:53] <didrocks> hey oSoMoN ;)
[08:03] <lan3y> morning!
[08:03] <lan3y> WHY
[08:03] <willcooke> morning Laney
[08:03] <Laney> MORNING!
[08:05] <seb128> good morning distro
[08:05] <seb128> hey oSoMoN didrocks Laney willcooke
[08:05] <oSoMoN> hey seb128, willcooke, laney
[08:05] <willcooke> hey guys
[08:05] <willcooke> It's cloudy today - yay!
[08:05] <willcooke> It's only 24
[08:05] <seb128> lucky you
[08:06] <seb128> it went down a bit during the night
[08:06] <didrocks> waow, channel is suddenly busy :)
[08:06] <didrocks> hey Laney, willcooke, seb128!
[08:06] <seb128> it's only 24°C inside this morning
[08:06] <seb128> nice
[08:06] <seb128> not going to stay that way though :-/
[08:06] <didrocks> yeah, no sign of any clouds here
[08:06] <seb128> it was 31°C in my desk corner yesterday
[08:06] <Laney> hey seb128 hey didrocks hey willcooke hey oSoMoN!
[08:06] <Laney> what a team
[08:07] <seb128> hey Laney, wie gehts?
[08:07] <Laney> I just remembered about some seedlings I had in the greenhouse thing
[08:07] <Laney> forgot to water them over the weekend
[08:07] <Laney> ://///////////////////////////////////////////////
[08:07] <Laney> oh door brb
[08:07] <willcooke> :((
[08:07] <seb128> woot, didrocks uploaded session renames in the early morning
[08:07] <oSoMoN> looks like it will climb to 32°C here today, and it will reach 36°C on Friday
[08:07] <willcooke> oooooof
[08:07] <seb128> good luck with that
[08:07] <didrocks> seb128: yep, only when the weather is cold :)
[08:08] <didrocks> "à la fraiche"
[08:08] <oSoMoN> :)
[08:08] <seb128> k, brb, grabbing some coffee before an hangout
[08:08] <didrocks> seb128: speaking of which, when you get a chance, mind binNEWing unity-session from gnome-session?
[08:08] <seb128> didrocks, I can do that :-)
[08:08] <didrocks> so that it can transition and I can try again in the vm from release
[08:08] <didrocks> thanks!
[08:08] <didrocks> should be quick :)
[08:08] <didrocks> oSoMoN: similar to Lyon :(
[08:09] <didrocks> oSoMoN: do you have any fresh corner in your house?
[08:10] <seb128> didrocks, NEWed
[08:10] <seb128> I trust you on the versions, didn't check they were accurate
[08:10] <seb128> worth case we get upgrade bugs and fix the issue
[08:10] <flexiondotorg> Trevinho Thanks for the Compiz release!
[08:11] <andyrock> morning!
[08:11] <Trevinho> Morning all
[08:11] <Trevinho> flexiondotorg: no problem
[08:12] <didrocks> seb128: \o/ thanks
[08:12] <didrocks> seb128: yeah ;)
[08:12] <didrocks> should be good, I incremented in between
[08:12] <didrocks> the whole transition will work better once I reintroduce the ubuntu-session package
[08:12] <didrocks> (that's what I'm doing right now and checking/thinking of the various corner cases)
[08:13] <Trevinho>  willcooke, seb128: I posted the report http://blog.3v1n0.net/informatica/linux/gnome-fractional-and-multi-monitor-scaling-hackfest-the-report/
[08:14] <willcooke> Trevinho, read that this morning, great job!
[08:14] <oSoMoN> didrocks, not really, but I close all the windows and shutters in the morning when the sun starts pounding (around now), and the temperature inside remains bearable
[08:15] <oSoMoN> (and reopen everything at night)
[08:16] <didrocks> oSoMoN: what do you consider "bearable"? :)
[08:18] <Laney> new sessions, nice!
[08:18] <oSoMoN> that’s very subjective indeed :) as long as I’m not melting I’m ok
[08:32] <seb128> hey andyrock Trevinho!
[08:33] <seb128> Trevinho, I saw for the report, nice work
[08:34] <Trevinho> seb128: thanks... Now back to code, which I prefer ;-)
[08:34]  * didrocks still needs to add the wayland session now to ubuntu
[08:35] <seb128> Trevinho, so no scaling under GNOME/X?
[08:38] <jbicha_> didrocks: oh you have a unity-session but not an ubuntu-session in -proposed now?
[08:40] <didrocks> jbicha: yeah, that was the intermediate goal, I'm working on the ubuntu-session for the next upload
[08:40] <didrocks> jbicha: see the trello card you commented on :)
[08:41] <jbicha> didrocks: did we decide whether Wayland was going to be "Ubuntu" right now?
[08:45] <didrocks> jbicha: right now, I keep parity until we have a definitive answer, so ubuntu-session will present both as gnome did. Xorg is the default as swapping will be easy I guess
[08:45] <didrocks> I guess the rest needs testing before deciding one way or the other
[08:45] <didrocks> (checking the fallback mode and so on)
[08:46] <didrocks> kenvandine[m][m]: btw, jbicha is in favor of having ubuntu gnome user (so people who had "gnome" session selected) to transition to the "ubuntu" one. This should only be done once as then, people reselecting "gnome" did it in purpose to get upstream vanilla GNOME
[08:47] <didrocks> [m][m] is running matrix on matrix? :)
[08:49] <jbicha> ok, Debian will be flipping the default "GNOME" back to Wayland (like upstream since 3.22) probably whenever they upload gnome-session next
[08:50] <didrocks> interesting, I still got some vary feedbacks about that, but we'll be to tests once all the transitions are done
[08:50] <didrocks> (I get at least the animation on boxes/qemu + wayland, which I don't get on boxes/X)
[08:53] <jibel> didrocks, why would you transition users who were running vanilla gnome to ubuntu gnome? I mean if they were using unity then they're migrated to gnome, but if they were running a gnome session (that they installed manually and on purpose) they should stay on a gnome session not ubuntu? or am I missing something
[08:55] <didrocks> jibel: that's what jbicha suggested on the card (they were using ubuntu GNOME, not fully vanilla GNOME). I don't have strong opinion either ways, but you can comment on it
[08:55] <didrocks> if I find back jbicha's comment :)
[08:55] <jibel> didrocks, the only thing we need to migrate is the default ubuntu session, other sessions should remain unchanged IMHO
[08:56] <didrocks> ah, here we go: https://trello.com/c/KTYyAQlb/126-lightdm-gdm-migration
[08:56] <didrocks> jibel: ^
[08:56] <jbicha> jibel: Ubuntu GNOME is being upgraded to Ubuntu
[08:56] <Trevinho> seb128: no, no scaling under X. the problem is mainly related to the fact that there's no input redirection
[08:58] <Trevinho> seb128: what would be possible is to use Xrandr scaling for doing the same, it's not something has been done so far. Nor there was much interest. But... It might be done, as all the work done for wayland is still a prereq
[08:58] <jbicha> as of today, there's no difference between the Ubuntu session and the vanilla GNOME session so it's unclear yet what the diff will be
[09:01] <didrocks> jbicha: btw, agreed that this vanilla gnome session is just using the upstream files "gnome*"?
[09:01] <didrocks> (the ones you were using previously in ubuntu GNOME)
[09:03] <jbicha> didrocks: yes, that's fine
[09:04] <jibel> jbicha, makes sense in the context of the flavor Ubuntu Gnome
[09:05] <didrocks> jibel: the difference is people upgrading from Ubuntu GNOME will have this "upstream GNOME" session available on gdm (those on ubuntu would only have by default the "ubuntu" sessions)
[09:05] <didrocks> https://trello.com/c/TLheyL5G/152-rename-ubuntu-session-to-unity-session-and-add-a-new-ubuntu-session-being-gnome-shell
[09:05] <didrocks> (my latest comment)
[09:05] <didrocks> I guess we have a decent upgrade story with this
[09:06] <jibel> didrocks, right
[09:07] <seb128> Trevinho, k, that's a bit of a tricky choice what we are going to do, all users are not going to get wayland in the LTS and we don't even know if it's good enough to be default yet
[09:08]  * didrocks is surprised to not have missed any "exit 0" yet with bzr bd-do. We are getting older and more rigorous :)
[09:08] <seb128> :-)
[09:09] <seb128> missing the exit is fine
[09:09] <Trevinho> seb128: yeah i see... well, I can see what the efforts are to get something in X too once we've done the upper level things
[09:09] <jbicha> didrocks: it's possible for Ubuntu GNOME upgraders to be prompted to auto-remove whatever gnome-session package
[09:09] <seb128> what is not is re-entering the bzr bd-do then
[09:09] <seb128> Trevinho, yeah, we might know if we need it by then
[09:10] <seb128> Trevinho, but wayland/nvidia is not there yet, it's not clear that their drivers are going to support old cards and even when the driver works it looks like xwayland doesn't and it's tricky to provide a session without support for "legacy" applications
[09:10] <didrocks> seb128: yes ;)
[09:10] <seb128> and not even speaking about nvidia, wayland still has issues
[09:11] <didrocks> jbicha: Not directly if we want people to be able to reinstall it. The other way would be I guess to create a separate "gnome-vanilla-session" package. But I'm unsure we should do that
[09:12] <didrocks> jbicha: also, I think for Ubuntu GNOME users, it makes sense to leave an easy way to switch to a pure GNOME experience as it may be what they desired at first?
[09:12] <didrocks> sounds more like a good feature to have to me
[09:13] <jbicha> didrocks: there are 2 types of UG users: those who want Ubuntu running GNOME and those who want more of that pure GNOME experience
[09:13] <didrocks> yeah
[09:13] <didrocks> that's why they will have both after upgrade. Being default to "Ubuntu running GNOME"
[09:13] <didrocks> defaulted*
[09:13] <jbicha> I think we want to help the first group; the second group can easily install a separate package later
[09:14] <didrocks> not sure I was clear on the card, the experience should be:
[09:14] <didrocks> you ran Ubuntu GNOME, you are now defaulted to Ubuntu (but if you click that small gear, you have access to the pure GNOME experience)
[09:14] <didrocks> the first group would have nothing to do, basically, isn't that fine?
[09:14] <didrocks> (and yes, we need to patch GDM to do that "one time" transition)
[09:15] <jbicha> I would like upgrades of Ubuntu and Ubuntu GNOME to end up in as close to the same condition as possible
[09:15] <didrocks> that would mean introducing that new "vanilla" package I guess
[09:15] <jbicha> IMO I would prefer vanilla GNOME to be a separate install afterwards to make that happen
[09:17] <jbicha> I need to confirm with darkxst but I think I want ubuntu-gnome-desktop to be transitional to ubuntu-desktop and likely a new package created for more of a vanilla GNOME
[09:17] <didrocks> both are easily doable, (even without patch against upstream, but diverging more from Debian though)
[09:18] <didrocks> basically, under that configuration, that would end up "gnome-session" being an empty package
[09:18] <jbicha> I don't see why?
[09:18] <didrocks> gnome-session has the vanilla gnome session
[09:18] <jbicha> unity is not an empty package but it's marked as auto-removable now because it's not in main
[09:18] <didrocks> you basically want to be removed on upgrade, but still being installed
[09:19] <didrocks> needs testing
[09:19] <didrocks> so, demoting it can be enough
[09:19] <jbicha> yes, that's what I was thinking :)
[09:19] <darkxst> hey jbicha didrocks
[09:19] <didrocks> hey darkxst!
[09:19] <jbicha> good evening!
[09:20] <jbicha> I woke up too early today
[09:21] <darkxst> I would like to see a way to get back to vanilla GNOME session, depending on how many things Ubuntu messes with, however I don't think it needs to be installed by default
[09:21] <seb128> jbicha, you might want to go ahead and open MIR-style bugs for the things you suggested to add to the default installation, it feels like the discussions stalled on the list and that we have specific points to discuss/check for each of those
[09:21] <didrocks> darkxst: even for people upgrading from Ubuntu GNOME?
[09:21] <didrocks> darkxst: like, defaulting to ubuntu, but having the option listed in gdm by default to start a vanilla GNOME session?
[09:23] <darkxst> didrocks, it really depends on the scope of changes that end up landing
[09:23] <flexiondotorg> Laney jbicha I've updated the indicator-session merge proposal that add MATE support
[09:23] <flexiondotorg> https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-mate-dev/indicator-session/mate-integration/+merge/325600
[09:23] <flexiondotorg> jbicha I removed the Suggests: as requested.
[09:24] <flexiondotorg> Can you take another look please?
[09:24] <darkxst> obviously shipping a vanilla session is easy if required
[09:25] <didrocks> darkxst: not that easy with extensions activations and themes, but yeah, it's doable and we want to do it
[09:25] <didrocks> I guess the question is what happens for people upgrading from Ubuntu GNOME, we all agree it seems to default them to the Ubuntu session, but should they have this vanilla session available in GDM by default or should they have to install a package for it?
[09:28] <jbicha> I think users expect to get Ubuntu when they upgrade
[09:28] <jbicha> I'm fine with everything still in universe being marked as autoremovable (or however Ubuntu's normal upgrades work)
[09:32] <darkxst> It would be easier to say if we knew how many users use Ubuntu GNOME just for gnome-shell or how many for the vanilla GNOME experience.
[09:32] <didrocks> yeah, unsure how apart from a biased poll would guide us…
[09:33] <darkxst> but I would say default to ubuntu sessions, and perhaps install vanilla session for ubuntu GNOME upgrade
[09:33] <jbicha> I think those who went out of their way to install Ubuntu GNOME could easily go out of their way one more time to install the not-Canonical vanilla GNOME metapackage
[09:33] <didrocks> darkxst: I was coming to that conclusion as well
[09:33] <darkxst> didrocks, pretty sure a poll won't help much!
[09:33] <didrocks> yep :)
[09:34] <jbicha> but some of our users just preferred GNOME to Unity and don't mind some Ubuntu customizations
[09:34] <jbicha> those who hated Ubuntu customizations probably switched to another distro honestly :/
[09:34] <darkxst> Id probably be more inclined to monitor the reactions throughout betas
[09:35] <didrocks> good idea, let's promote this in the beta
[09:35] <didrocks> and see how people think about this?
[09:35] <darkxst> jbicha, true, I suspect many users will be fine with default ubuntu session
[09:36] <seb128> didrocks, I'm not sure I followed the details, promoting what?
[09:36] <didrocks> seb128: basically, I proposed that plan: https://trello.com/c/TLheyL5G/152-rename-ubuntu-session-to-unity-session-and-add-a-new-ubuntu-session-being-gnome-shell
[09:36] <didrocks> so one of my last comment
[09:37] <didrocks> the question is should we have the vanilla GNOME session available in GDM for people upgrade from Ubuntu GNOME?
[09:37] <jbicha> darkxst: yeah, right now, Ubuntu 17.10 is fine (I'd like more GNOME apps but those are easy to install and window buttons/theme are easy too)
[09:37] <didrocks> seems opinion diverge (but that's a minor detail anyway)
[09:38] <seb128> didrocks, yeah, what is in the card looks fine to me
[09:38] <seb128> having Ubuntu + GNOME sessions listed is fine imho
[09:39] <seb128> most users don't care/look at the sessions listed on the greeter anyway, they just log in
[09:39] <seb128> so as long as the default is good...
[09:40] <didrocks> seb128: just to be clear, the ubuntu desktop won't have the vanilla session available in GDM by default
[09:40] <didrocks> the only remaining question mark is people upgrading from Ubuntu GNOME
[09:40] <seb128> yes, that's good
[09:40] <seb128> right
[09:40] <seb128> what I wrote ^ was about Ubuntu GNOME upgraders
[09:40] <seb128> sorry for not being clear
[09:41] <didrocks> ok ;) I wasn't sure we were talking about the exact same thing
[09:41] <didrocks> thanks!
[09:41] <seb128> yeah, sorry
[09:41] <seb128> yw!
[09:41] <didrocks> is there any place gnome-shell is in a vcs btw? the debian one only have the debian branches?
[09:42] <jbicha> didrocks: https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/gnome-shell/ubuntu
[09:42] <didrocks> thanks jbicha
[09:42] <didrocks> was easy :)
[09:42] <didrocks> ah good, Robert just set Vcs-Bzr
[09:42] <didrocks> I looked at that first
[09:43] <jbicha> yeah, it wasn't in bzr until recently
[09:43] <didrocks> shouldn't GNOME shell brings ubuntu-session | gnome-session?
[09:43] <didrocks> (otherwise, you install the component without any session to start it)
[09:44] <seb128> jbicha, I removed a staled lock from the versions update job, hopefully next cron round works
[09:44] <jbicha> thanks
[09:44] <seb128> thanks for pointing the issue out
[09:45] <seb128> didrocks, that makes sense to me
[09:58] <jbicha> unity-session needs to be demoted to universe
[10:00] <seb128> if nothing keeps it in main it's going to show on component mismatch and being demoted, no need to worry about it
[10:03] <jbicha> it's on excuses
[10:04] <seb128> ?
[10:04] <seb128> ah, missing depends
[10:04] <seb128> well, it can be on excuses & component_mismatch
[10:04] <seb128> doesn't change what I wrote
[10:05] <jbicha> oh, I see it in http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/component-mismatches-proposed.html now
[10:09] <didrocks> demoted
[10:09] <seb128> ditto
[10:10] <didrocks> demotion race, :)
[10:10] <seb128> hope it's not one of those launchpad bugs where double change delete binaries
[10:10] <didrocks> yeah
[10:10] <didrocks> it was listing "main" for me, was it for you?
[10:10]  * didrocks rerun to see if it's only the published
[10:10] <seb128> yes
[10:11] <seb128> but I kept the confirm prompt open for a minute while I was checking if other binaries should be demoted as well from the component mismatch
[10:11] <seb128> you probably did the move in between
[10:11] <seb128> oh well, let's see
[10:11] <didrocks> could be, yeah
[10:11] <seb128> if the binary goes missing we just need a no change upload
[10:11] <didrocks> yep, let's look at https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-session/+publishinghistory + rmadison
[10:13] <Laney> I think you can do a copy to get it back
[10:13] <Laney> if tha thappens
[10:13] <didrocks> hum, would need to look for the exact options to revive it back
[10:13] <didrocks> we'll see
[10:13] <seb128> yeah
[10:13] <seb128> but I think we are fine, iirc the bug is when demoting and promoting again
[10:21] <jbicha> duflu: can you be more specific about LP: #1698795 ?
[10:22] <jbicha> or maybe I'll be more specific
[10:23] <jbicha> GNOME Shell would prefer to use a symbolic icon so for nautilus, it prefers
[10:23] <jbicha> /usr/share/icons/hicolor/symbolic/apps/org.gnome.Nautilus-symbolic.svg (since the regular Nautilus icon is named 'org.gnome.Nautilus')
[10:25] <duflu> jbicha: That is didrocks ... I was only guessing I could see what he meant
[10:26] <duflu> And good night
[10:26] <jbicha> oops, I got pinged when you tagged it, thanks
[10:30] <didrocks> jbicha: we need to ship ambiance/radiance symbolic icons I guess
[10:30] <jbicha> didrocks: why?
[10:30] <didrocks> or you have 2 different sets of icons represented
[10:30] <didrocks> the one in alt-tab/the dash and one on top which doesn't look similar at all
[10:31] <didrocks> not sure if it's just me, but looks really odd
[10:31] <jbicha> it probably is supposed to look different since the top bar icon is small and monocolor?
[10:32] <didrocks> yeah, but it can still be monocolor but looking as if it's coming from the same theme
[10:33] <didrocks> for instance, my wife wonders if she clicked on the right application when seeing another kind of icons appearing
[10:33] <didrocks> (like nautilus)
[10:35] <jbicha> didrocks: if you can get new icons, I'd really like the extra Ubuntu apps (like startup disk creator) to have high contrast icons
[10:35] <jbicha> that's been on my wishlist for years
[10:36] <jbicha> Turn on High Contrast in Settings>Universal Access
[10:36] <jbicha> pretty high contrast icons for GNOME stuff but not for Ubuntu apps :(
[10:37] <didrocks> yeah
[10:37] <didrocks> unsure, that's something that willcooke will be able to request ^
[10:37] <didrocks> (lunch time)
[10:37] <jbicha> Laney: I think I'm going to drop the evolution-tests package; it requires python3-behave which isn't packaged and the Evo maintainer says the tests are old anyway
[10:38] <willcooke> we wont get any news icons this cycle
[10:38] <willcooke> *new
[10:39] <didrocks> willcooke: any idea how we can change this bad looking icons? We can prevent symbolic ones maybe and just scale down ours (as firefox for instance, is colored)
[10:39] <Laney> jbicha: did you just have an argument about that?
[10:39] <jbicha> I think the whole ubuntu-mono-dark/light thing needs to be overhauled anyway since it pre-dates gtk symbolic icons
[10:40]  * didrocks really away now
[10:40] <jbicha> Laney: yes :(
[10:40] <Laney> :/
[10:41] <Laney> it's probably a good idea to test run them before uploading
[10:41] <Laney> https://objectstorage.prodstack4-5.canonical.com/v1/AUTH_77e2ada1e7a84929a74ba3b87153c0ac/autopkgtest-artful/artful/amd64/e/evolution/20170620_083231_13c20@/log.gz is not a good sign either
[10:42] <jbicha> I can't run autopkgtests from a PPA until the autopkgtests exist in Ubuntu for that package first
[10:42] <willcooke> didrocks, lets discuss in our next 1:1 (re: icons)
[10:42] <jbicha> but yes I should have run them locally
[10:42] <jbicha> that autopkgtest error was a typo: xvfb instead of xfvb
[10:42] <Laney> yes
[10:43] <Laney> I'm saying that test running it would have caught that
[10:43] <Laney> anyway, I won't argue with dropping a test that's only been around a few days and never passed
[10:43] <Laney> so as you wish
[10:44] <jbicha> ok to drop the evolution-tests package too?
[10:45] <Laney> I would do if it's not being used
[10:46] <Laney> what's up with these duplicate posts on the list?
[10:48] <seb128> jbicha, the versions page has been updated now
[10:49] <Laney> one of them has Newsgroups: local.ubuntu.desktop
[10:50] <willcooke> Laney, I tracked down the guy and emailed him last night, he said he's having issues with inews and he's looking at it
[10:50] <willcooke> sheesh, loads of lag today
[10:51] <willcooke> 14seconds here and same on Canonical
[10:51] <Laney> doh
[10:52]  * willcooke eyes his router
[10:52] <Laney> willcooke: can you block by header in mailman?
[10:52]  * willcooke looks
[10:52]  * Laney has passwords to other lists, will look too
[10:54] <Laney> privacy options -> spam filters -> header_filter_rules
[10:55] <willcooke> ta
[10:55] <willcooke> looking at the headers from that guy now
[10:55] <willcooke> Newsgroups: local.ubuntu.desktop
[10:55] <willcooke> could use that?
[10:55] <Laney> yeah
[10:55] <Laney> or even newsgroups: .*
[10:56] <Laney> not sure if it's ever legit to have that?
[10:56] <willcooke> I don't /think/ so
[10:56] <Laney> ubuntu-devel gets some weird spam
[10:56] <willcooke> or if it is, it shouldnt reach our mailing list
[10:56] <Laney> "packaging hotline"
[10:56] <Laney> wrong kind of packaging guys
[10:59] <willcooke> Laney, regex:  ^Newsgroups: local.ubuntu.desktop$
[10:59] <willcooke> that look ok?
[11:00] <willcooke> based on this excerpt:
[11:00] <Laney> technically you probably need to escape the .
[11:00] <willcooke> To: ubuntu-desktop@lists.ubuntu.com
[11:00] <willcooke> Path: news.cjsa2.com!not-for-mail
[11:00] <willcooke> From: Robert Ancell <robert.ancell@canonical.com>
[11:00] <willcooke> Newsgroups: local.ubuntu.desktop
[11:00] <willcooke> Subject: Testing GNOME Software 3.20.5 in Xenial
[11:00] <willcooke> Date: Sun, 18 Jun 2017 03:11:23 -0700
[11:00] <Laney> but it will still match
[11:01] <willcooke> and the colon
[11:02] <willcooke> >>> import re
[11:02] <willcooke> >>> re.escape("Newsgroups: local.ubuntu.desktop")
[11:02] <willcooke> 'Newsgroups\\:\\ local\\.ubuntu\\.desktop'
[11:02] <Laney> haha
[11:03] <Laney> whyyyyyyyyy
[11:05] <jamesh> maybe print re.escape(...
[11:05] <jamesh> so you don't see the repr of the string
[11:06] <willcooke> ah, I see
[11:07] <Laney> yay
[11:08] <willcooke> ok, I've saved that - lets see what happens
[11:08] <Laney> me fuchsias just came
[11:08] <willcooke> :) nice
[11:09] <Laney> https://otherfellow.co.uk/hardy-fuchsias-k-to-z/star-wars
[11:09] <Laney> looking forward to that one
[11:11] <jbicha> didrocks: btw, Fedora distro-patches Firefox to add a symbolic icon, no idea why that isn't upstream yet
[11:19] <didrocks> ack
[11:48] <Laney> looks like unity-session went to universe undamaged
[11:53] <didrocks> yeah ;)
[12:04] <Laney> oh god
[12:04] <Laney> my laptop crashed while dist-upgrading and now it's not coming back
[12:04] <Laney> ffsssssssss
[12:05] <Laney> failed to connect to lvmetad
[12:11] <Laney> it's too early even for init=/bin/sh
[12:11]  * Laney cries
[12:11] <Laney> USB key time
[12:47] <Laney> phew
[12:49] <didrocks> all good now?
[12:50] <Laney> who knows what happened
[12:51] <Laney> but I'm here!
[14:00] <xclaesse> Looks like Microsoft is disabling Skype 4.3 July 1st, wondering if Canonical will update the partners archive
[14:06] <seb128> xclaesse, hey, good question...
[14:06] <seb128> willcooke, ^ do you know?
[14:07] <didrocks> I'm quite unsure why unity-session doesn't pass with ubuntukylin-meta
[14:08] <didrocks> http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/proposed-migration/artful/update_output.txt
[14:08] <willcooke> seb128, xclaesse - I don't know, I'll find out.
[14:08] <seb128> thx
[14:09] <xclaesse> seb128, willcooke: thanks
[14:09] <didrocks> trying: unity-settings-daemon gnome-session ubuntukylin-meta
[14:09] <didrocks> this triplet is supposed to pass, but unsure about the     * s390x: ubuntukylin-desktop
[14:09] <xclaesse> only 10 days remaining for all your users to get disconnected... if an update can be made via the partners repo that would be nicer to users :)
[14:10] <xclaesse> depends on your contracts with MS...
[14:10] <seb128> didrocks, Laney usually knows how to read those, I guess the s390x issue needs at least to be resolved?
[14:10] <xclaesse> if canonical even still has any
[14:10] <didrocks> yeah
[14:10] <didrocks> as it's not part of the seed, I bet it's still depending on ubuntu-session
[14:11] <didrocks> unsure how this archi is handled for meta
[14:11] <didrocks> ah, one sec, I just apt-get source
[14:11] <didrocks> need dget on artful to double check
[14:11]  * kenvandine wonders why the desktop seeds even build on s390x
[14:11] <xnox> it is weird that kylin-meta is built for s390x
[14:11] <xnox> as that would not work =/
[14:11] <kenvandine> xnox, exactly
[14:12] <didrocks> yesh, there is no desktop-s390x
[14:12] <kenvandine> kylin is desktop right/
[14:12] <kenvandine> ?
[14:12] <didrocks> but there is a desktop-recommends-s390x :p
[14:12] <xnox> didrocks, i think we need infinity to do magic to fix s390x missmatches for ubuntukylin-desktop - or like stop building it on s390x.
[14:12] <xnox> cause we should not force any uninstallables into the archive.
[14:12] <kenvandine> i think just stop building it on s390x, it's pointless
[14:12] <xnox> after infinity fixed them all.
[14:12] <didrocks> yeah
[14:13] <xnox> kenvandine, even if we stop, it would still need AA magic to remove the stale binary.
[14:13] <kenvandine> indeed
[14:13] <xnox> so best to ask what AAs want us to do here =)
[14:13] <didrocks> infinity: mind giving a look at this? ^ (I don't think we are in a hurry, as nothing is seeded in official ubuntu flavor, no need to rush)
[14:13] <didrocks> xnox: well, seb128 and I are AAs :p
[14:13] <didrocks> so we can remove
[14:13] <didrocks> depends on how people want to deal with this, I think there is no rush AFAIK
[14:14] <didrocks> at worse, if nothing is fixed tomorrow, we can remove the binary temporary to ease the transition
[14:14] <xnox> didrocks, right =) *trustworthy* AAs =)))))) </joking>
[14:14] <didrocks> xnox: that's why you are not on the list ;)
[14:16] <didrocks> anyway, let's see once infinity is around how he prefers to get this fixed and let's see that tomorrow midday, if there isn't a resolution, there will be my new gnome-session with ubuntu-session binary (but I still think that kylin should deps on unity-session for now)
[14:34] <kenvandine> Laney, how hard would it be to snap gnome-software?  It would be cool if 16.04 users could get the latest gnome-software with snap support, etc
[14:36] <jbicha> xnox: hi, I'm pinging again about LP: #1695928
[14:36] <ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1695928 in gnome-control-center-signon (Ubuntu) "Please remove obsolete UOA packages" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1695928
[14:37] <xnox> jbicha, hi, so what do you extect me to do?
[14:37] <xnox> you should mark the bug as affecting all the packages you want to remove.
[14:37] <xnox> and mark it as trianged, then ~ubuntu-archive will look at it.
[14:37] <jbicha> xnox: you were involved in Unity8 removals before; are you no longer very interested?
[14:38] <xnox> i am.
[14:38] <xnox> jbicha, i'm not an AA so i cannot actually remove things.
[14:38] <jbicha> ok, so I'm looking for your approval then I was going to go to slangasek
[14:38] <xnox> only request removals, just like everybody else.
[14:38] <jbicha> I didn't want to bother him if we didn't agree on the list
[14:39] <xnox> the list looks sane.
[14:39] <jbicha> I don't think it's helpful to mark one bug as affecting 30+ pkgs
[14:39] <xnox> as long as desktop does want to drop ubuntu-system-settings
[14:39] <xnox> right?
[14:39] <xnox> it's the process that AAs use.
[14:39] <Laney> kenvandine: it would conflict with the system one
[14:39] <Laney> kenvandine: the version in xenial does have snap support; robert worked on that
[14:40] <jbicha> does anyone object to Unity8 being removed from artful?
[14:40] <Laney> seb128: lemme see
[14:40] <kenvandine> Laney, ah... great :)
[14:40] <Laney> it's just not in a separate package there
[14:40] <kenvandine> jorge made it sound like it didn't
[14:40] <kenvandine> but i shouldn't always listen to jorge :)
[14:40] <Laney> it's in the main one
[14:45] <Laney> seb128: ubuntukylin-desktop requires unity, ubuntu-session breaks old unity, new unity isn't ready to migrate yet
[14:45] <Laney> no didrocks so I can't tell him too
[14:46] <Laney> not sure what you're talking about with s390x
[14:46] <Laney> maybe I'm not looking at the same place
[14:47] <jbicha> kenvandine: I split gnome-software's plugins out so we wouldn't need to MIR flatpak (support was added in 3.22)
[14:48] <Laney> seb128: http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/proposed-migration/artful/update_output_notest.txt says that they will go in once unity is ready
[14:52] <seb128> Laney, ok, great, thanks
[14:53] <seb128> kenvandine, unsure how a snapped gnome-software would interact with packagekit or aptdaemon, it would non trivial to have it confined at least
[15:30] <jbicha> o/
[15:30] <seb128> lol
[15:30] <willcooke> ahoy
[15:30] <willcooke> #startmeeting Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2017-06-20
[15:30] <meetingology> Meeting started Tue Jun 20 15:30:42 2017 UTC.  The chair is willcooke. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
[15:30] <meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
[15:30] <oSoMoN> 🙋
[15:31] <willcooke> Roll call: andyrock, dgadomski, didrocks, duflu (out), jbicha, jamesh (out), jibel, heber(out), kenvandine, laney, oSoMoN, seb128, tkamppeter, trevinho, robert_ancell (out)
[15:31] <jbicha> ugh, Current topi
[15:31] <kenvandine> o/
[15:31] <andyrock> hey
[15:31] <jibel> hi o/
[15:32] <Laney> hi
[15:32] <willcooke> jibel, good spot - I'll change the topic before I start next week, and change it back again when I'm done
[15:32] <willcooke> s/jibel/jbicha
[15:32] <Laney> it happened last week too
[15:32] <Laney> just shrink it a bit after the meeting
[15:32] <willcooke> kk
[15:33] <oSoMoN> URL-shortening the link to trello should do the trick
[15:33] <willcooke> door, sec
[15:34] <willcooke> back
[15:34] <willcooke> not Amazon
[15:34] <willcooke> :(
[15:34] <willcooke> right, let's go
[15:34] <willcooke> #topic andyrock
[15:34] <andyrock> # Lost some time trying to understand how to port snapd-glib to trusty (Rober alread did that, next time I'll make sure to ask before)
[15:35]  * willcooke makes a note that andyrock can be a snapd glib maintainer 
[15:35] <andyrock> # Working on adding livepatch status gui to update-manager (so list of CVEs + description)
[15:35] <andyrock> # eow
[15:36] <willcooke> thanks andyrock
[15:36] <willcooke> #topic dgadomski
[15:36] <dgadomski> hey
[15:36] <dgadomski> Trying to find a way to disable WiFi Direct for iwlwifi devices. Looks like some enterprise AP hardware blocks them for security and most probably there's no way of doing that.
[15:36] <dgadomski> eof
[15:36] <willcooke> thanks dgadomski
[15:36] <dgadomski> thanks
[15:37] <willcooke> #topic didrocks
[15:37] <willcooke> * Migrate unity session from ubuntu-session to a new unity-session package and all related changes in other packages due to systemd session.
[15:37] <willcooke> * Snapcraft desktop helper time tracing for possible optimizations. Found that we can shove off 2 or 3s at first start if we rewrite it in Golang, but can't do way more (the longest time is waiting for update-mime-database to proceed which is a multiple seconds process)
[15:37] <willcooke> * Worked on theme snaps (HO with seb). Draft some examples on github and wrote a google doc with needed changes and blockers on our existing snapd interface mechanism.
[15:37] <willcooke> * some AA work for KDE packages.
[15:37] <willcooke> * Merged some ubuntu make contributor PR.
[15:37] <willcooke> * Prepared Stuttgart nearby travel for client doing snap demos and workshops.
[15:37] <willcooke> * Finish a suite of blog posts to be published really (on ubuntu make vs classic snap experience).
[15:37] <willcooke> * Answered on some desktop related questions on the snapcraft forum.
[15:37] <willcooke> #topic duflu
[15:37] <willcooke> * PulseAudio:
[15:37] <willcooke>   - SRU of A2DP Bluetooth audio fixes to xenial:
[15:37] <willcooke>     . Still waiting (4 weeks) to enter proposed (am I missing something?):
[15:37] <willcooke> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/xenial/+queue?queue_state=1&queue_text=pulseaudio
[15:37] <willcooke>     . The primary SRU bug (out of three) is here: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/bluez/+bug/1582213
[15:37] <ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1582213 in pulseaudio (Ubuntu Xenial) "[xenial] Bluetooth device doesn't play any sound in A2DP mode unless set to HSP/HFP first" [High,In progress]
[15:37] <willcooke> * BlueZ:
[15:38] <willcooke>   - Release 5.45 to artful completed. Quicker than expected.
[15:38] <willcooke>   - Investigated the #1 hottest bluez bug for desktop. Thought I had a fix but came to a surprising conclusion; it's actually invalid: https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1490349
[15:38] <ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1490349 in bluez (Ubuntu) "15:10 and 16.04: bluetoothd "Failed to start discovery: org.bluez.Error.NotReady" after bluetoothd restarted" [High,Invalid]
[15:38] <willcooke> * Video acceleration:
[15:38] <willcooke>   - Got blocked in efforts to use Intel MSDK. Proprietary build dependencies and users having to rebuild their own video players are a roadblock. But hopeful that Intel fix this in future (they say they will).
[15:38] <willcooke>   - Succeeded elsewhere using a different plan: GStreamer has a VA-API decoder:
[15:38] <willcooke>     Result: 3% CPU to play 4K 60 FPS video on a Haswell desktop.
[15:38] <willcooke>   - Even better: 4K H.265 HEVC video is now playable (requires Sky Lake, or Kaby Lake for 10-bit). Until now even modern machines haven't been able to play those properly (software decoding).
[15:38] <willcooke>   - Documented instructions and future plans: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IntelQuickSyncVideo
[15:38] <willcooke> * Libinput:
[15:38] <willcooke>   - Spent time trying to find workarounds for non-responsive touchpads under Wayland/libinput. No success yet but did notice artful is using an old libinput release. We should update.
[15:38] <willcooke> * Other Audio:
[15:38] <willcooke>   - Testing fixes for XPS 13 audio: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/alsa-driver/+bug/1654448
[15:38] <willcooke> * Daily bug maintenance across gnome-shell, bluez, pulseaudio.
[15:38] <willcooke>   - In particular gnome-shell performance is becoming a common topic:
[15:38] <ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1654448 in linux (Ubuntu) "XPS 13 9360 and 9350, Realtek ALC3246, Headphone audio hiss" [Medium,In progress]
[15:38] <willcooke> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-shell/+bugs?field.tag=performance
[15:39] <willcooke> #topic jbicha
[15:39] <jbicha> • Completed Evolution 3.24.3 transition
[15:39] <jbicha> • Fixed several FTBFS resulting from vala 0.36 (although ricotz did most of the prep work, thanks!)
[15:39] <jbicha> • Merged NetworkManager and nm-applet 1.8 from Debian unstable (nplan autopkgtest failures keeping it in -proposed)
[15:39] <jbicha> • Merged dbus 1.10.10 from Debian stretch
[15:39] <jbicha> • Released Tweak Tool 3.25.3
[15:39] <jbicha> • Blogged about WebKit for Debian 9 release and new Tweak Tool release
[15:39] <jbicha> eof
[15:39] <willcooke> thanks jbicha
[15:40] <willcooke> #topic jamesh
[15:40] <willcooke> * produced a working proof of concept of a strict confined snap
[15:40] <willcooke> talking to xdg-desktop-portal and wrote about how others could test it
[15:40] <willcooke> on the Snapcraft forum.  No replies so far.  I also tried to restart
[15:40] <willcooke> the discussion about per-user mounts, which is also waiting.
[15:40] <willcooke> * started the process of upstreaming the snap plugin for
[15:40] <willcooke> gnome-builder.  The maintainer is receptive to accepting it, but would
[15:40] <willcooke> like some changes to how things are done (let the IDE directly call
[15:40] <willcooke> configure/make to enable incremental builds).
[15:40] <willcooke> * Started on gnome-software bug #1690280 (allow installation of
[15:40] <ubot5`> bug 1690280 in gnome-software (Ubuntu) "Classic confined snaps don't install" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1690280
[15:40] <willcooke> classic snaps).  Using Robert's initial patch, and working on the UI
[15:40] <willcooke> side.
[15:40] <willcooke> #topic jibel
[15:40] <jibel> * Continued work on desktop test plan and completed the part for gnome software
[15:40] <jibel> * Investigating introspectability issues of gnome-software.
[15:40] <jibel> * Merged job definition for running desktop tests on HW using testflinger.
[15:40] <jibel> * Created document with highlights and definitions to start automating desktop tests.
[15:40] <jibel> * Started implementing the foundations to run end user tests on gnome shell.
[15:40] <jibel> eof
[15:40] <willcooke> thanks jibel
[15:40] <jibel> yw
[15:40] <willcooke> #topic kenvandine
[15:40] <kenvandine> * Finished snapping gedit using the gnome-3-24 platform snap, getting it into the store now
[15:40] <kenvandine> * Created a topic on the snapcraft forum to discuss which snaps should be maintained by canonical vs community: https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/which-snaps-should-be-supported-by-canonical/1064
[15:40] <kenvandine> * Found some issues with using the gnome-3-24 snap when an app (like gedit) needed stage-packages that aren't in the gnome-3-24 snap but also depend on libs in the gnome-3-24.  Those libs would still get duplicated.  I have a workaround to strip out all of those files in the gedit snap, but it's not pretty.  I started a discussion on the snapcraft forum about this.
[15:41] <kenvandine> * Continued to followup with security on the gdm MIR, no progress yet but I'll keep nagging them from time to time
[15:41] <kenvandine> * Getting started on the LightDM -> GDM transition
[15:41]  * kenvandine OUT
[15:41] <willcooke> thanks kenvandine
[15:41] <jbicha> lol
[15:42] <willcooke> #topic Laney
[15:42] <Laney> sec
[15:42] <Laney> NO MORE SEC
[15:42] <Laney> • gnome-software/asgen:
[15:42] <Laney> ∘ Some prep packaging for 3.25. I said this would be uploaded 'this week' last week, but it hasn't happened yet, sry - still need to poke at a crash I saw
[15:42] <Laney> ∘ proposed a MP to asgen to generate type=codec data for gstreamer packages so they show up nicely in gnome-software
[15:42] <Laney> ∘ this work should all be good to go now once it's reviewed
[15:43] <Laney> • poking at / testing a fix for a glib testsuite problem
[15:43] <Laney> • much time discussing libtimezonemap change wrt India and reading about borders and stuff
[15:43] <Laney> • some babysitting of autopkgtest runners
[15:43] <Laney> • some upstream (GNOME) patch reviews
[15:43] <Laney> 🛀
[15:43] <willcooke> Is that... is that a bath tub?
[15:43] <Laney> STEAMY!
[15:43] <willcooke> lol
[15:43] <kenvandine> lol
[15:43] <Laney> actually it's not warm today
[15:43] <willcooke> thanks for you help with libtimezonemap laney
[15:43] <Laney> heh
[15:44] <Laney> "n" "p"
[15:44] <willcooke> #topic oSoMoN
[15:44] <oSoMoN> • fixed bug #1697496
[15:44] <ubot5`> bug 1697496 in chromium-browser (Ubuntu) "chromium 59.0.3071.86 crashes at startup on x86" [Critical,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1697496
[15:44] <oSoMoN> • bisecting to find the upstream revision that caused bug #1696965, getting really close
[15:44] <ubot5`> bug 1696965 in chromium-browser (Ubuntu) "First renderer process doesn't render page for chromium 59.0.3071.86 in KVM" [Critical,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1696965
[15:44] <oSoMoN> • updated chromium beta to 60.0.3112.32, dev to 61.0.3128.3
[15:44] <oSoMoN> • working on libreoffice 5.3.3 snap, switched to classic confinement to resolve a number of open issues (triaged all snap-specific bugs), should have something ready for wider testing by tomorrow
[15:44] <oSoMoN> ⒺⓄⒻ
[15:45] <willcooke> thanks oSoMoN
[15:45] <seb128> oSoMoN, is there a tag or something to list the snap specific issues?
[15:46] <willcooke> (sorry folks, another meeting going on)
[15:46] <oSoMoN> seb128, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libreoffice/+bugs?field.tag=snap
[15:46] <seb128> great
[15:46] <willcooke> #topic seb128
[15:46] <seb128> • tried some co-working spaces, pondering subscribing to one of those
[15:46] <seb128> • worked with Didier on detailing how snap themes could work, including writing examples
[15:46] <seb128> • replied to a snapcraft-forum discussion about themes with details of what is working today
[15:46] <seb128> • demoted a stack of unity components to universe
[15:46] <seb128> • talked to the mir team about gtk-mir in artful
[15:46] <seb128> • some binNEW reviews
[15:46] <seb128> • usual bugs triaging, participated in list discussions, etc

[15:47] <willcooke> thanks seb128
[15:47] <willcooke> #topic tkamppeter
[15:47] <tkamppeter> - cups-filters: Several crash fixes and stability improvements in cups-browsed.
[15:47] <tkamppeter> - CUPS: Crash bug got fixed upstream and feature to identify temporary CUPS queues got added upstream, so requirements to make cups-browsed work together with new CUPS are fulfilled.
[15:47] <tkamppeter> - Packaging: Debian opened unstable after the last release, so several printing packages got uploaded there. Synced CUPS, cups-filters, ippusbxd, HPLIP, Gutenprint, and foo2zjs to Ubuntu.
[15:47] <tkamppeter> - Google Summer of Code 2017: Student project coordination and mentoring.
[15:47] <tkamppeter> - Bugs.
[15:48] <willcooke> thanks tkamppeter
[15:48] <willcooke> #topic Trevinho
[15:48] <Trevinho> · Continued work in mutter and gnome-control-center
[15:48] <Trevinho> · Review and landing of ubuntu-themes and compiz branches
[15:48] <Trevinho> · Experimenting lighter Headerbar theme
[15:48] <Trevinho> · Wrote a fractional scaling hackfest report (http://go.3v1n0.net/GNOME-Fractional-Report)
[15:48] <Trevinho>   - Got some user feedback, and updating Scaling wiki accordingly
[15:48] <Trevinho> · Reviews of some Trello cards
[15:48] <Trevinho> · Some improvements to my work environment (wrote some gnome snippets, more automated build environment...)
[15:48] <Trevinho> --
[15:49] <willcooke> thanks Trevinho
[15:49] <willcooke> #topic robert_ancell
[15:49] <willcooke> - Rebased xenial gnome-software on 3.20.5
[15:49] <willcooke> - SRU snapd-glib 1.13 to zesty, xenial
[15:49] <willcooke> - SRU snapd-glib 1.12 to trusty. Required a big patch to support glib 2.40
[15:49] <willcooke> - Fix up and resubmit zesty gnome-software SRU
[15:49] <willcooke> - Disable LightDM guest session in artful to match security fixes in stable releases (not likely to be fixed soon).
[15:49] <seb128> Trevinho, feel free to share the work environment improvement tips :-)
[15:49] <willcooke> - Sponsored fixes to dee, hud, unity-greeter
[15:49] <willcooke> #topic AOB
[15:50] <willcooke> 32 bit images.... I said I would get some indication of number of downloads - haven't got that yet
[15:50] <seb128> I didn't find any info about apps which would stop 32 bit support and when
[15:51] <gQuigs> I did some 32 bit image data from torrents a while ago.. I can look that up
[15:51] <willcooke> Shall we punt it to next week again?
[15:51] <seb128> +1
[15:51] <willcooke> gQuigs, oh! that would be super useful, thanks
[15:53] <willcooke> oki, if no objections I will move it to next week.
[15:53] <willcooke> Anyone got any other business?
[15:53]  * oSoMoN keeps his slang to himself
[15:54] <jbicha> jackpot51 tole me he wanted to discuss the encrypted-home thing again, but maybe he stepped out
[15:54] <jbicha> he's got patches for review at LP: #1699216
[15:54] <ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1699216 in gnome-initial-setup (Ubuntu) "Encrypted home support" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1699216
[15:54] <jackpot51> I am here
[15:55] <jackpot51> It is ready for testing - gnome-control-center and gnome-initial-setup have patches using a new accountsservice - look at the bug for details
[15:55] <jackpot51> It means that the user creation in gnome-initial-setup and gnome-control-center allow you to select encrypted home folder
[15:56] <Laney> jackpot51: the change to accountsservice is an API break, right?
[15:56] <jackpot51> Yes, it is
[15:56] <seb128> jackpot51, hey, what did you think about discussing those changes and gnome-initial-setup on ubuntu-devel@ as I suggested yesterday?
[15:56] <jackpot51> A little bit
[15:56] <Laney> I don't think we can do that
[15:56] <Laney> what about making it a separate method?
[15:57] <jackpot51> That is possible, I could make it a seperate function.
[15:57] <jackpot51> The old function could become a stub that calls the new function with FALSE for the encrypt_home parameter
[15:57] <jackpot51> This is meant to go along with another change - removing OEM mode from ubiquity and using gnome-initial-setup instead
[15:58] <Laney> something like that
[15:58] <jackpot51> I can probably complete that in an hour. I just need help to merge upstream, which is very important to me
[15:59] <seb128> jackpot51, upstream bugs are on https://bugs.freedesktop.org that would be the first step, opening a bug describing what you need there
[16:00] <Laney> indeed, having it upstream would be best
[16:00] <Laney> the only problem is the --encrypt-home thing is Ubuntu specific?
[16:00] <jackpot51> Yes, it appears to be. At the very least, having it upstream in Ubuntu is good
[16:01] <jackpot51> Right now I am holding it in a PPA
[16:01] <jbicha> that ext4 replacement might be really attractive to other distros when it's ready
[16:01] <jackpot51> I agree. And at that point the patch can be offered to the most upstream place
[16:01] <seb128> ext4 replacement?
[16:02] <jackpot51> So - we are in agreement that such a patch, with the API compatability fixed, would go into upstream ubuntu easily?
[16:02] <jackpot51> And may go further upstream if encrypt-home gets more wide support?
[16:04] <jbicha> seb128: tyhicks said yesterday he'd like to switch to native ext4 instead of ecryptfs for encrypted home directories, but that's still an early WIP
[16:05] <Trevinho> Laney: can you please add your sizes for https://wiki.gnome.org/Projects/GnomeShell/ScaleFactorTests as I'm not sure I wrongly typed it at the office
[16:05] <jackpot51> He said the same --encrypt-home flag I am using would be used, right?
[16:05] <Trevinho> for the XPS 13 we had
[16:05] <jackpot51> Well, I will update my patches on that bug for whomever is interested
[16:05] <tyhicks> jackpot51: yes, same adduser flag will continue to work
[16:05] <jackpot51> cool
[16:06] <seb128> jackpot51, you keep ignoring my hint about discussing it on the list btw so I'm going to stop mentioning it but I'm personally not interested to work on changes that haven't been discussed with the project
[16:06] <jackpot51> Which list?
[16:07] <seb128> the ones  I mentioned to you yesterday and earlier
[16:07] <seb128> devel/desktop
[16:08] <willcooke> https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-devel
[16:08] <willcooke> https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-desktop
[16:09] <Laney> Trevinho: I have to get a ruler and measure my screen?
[16:10] <Trevinho> Laney: yep :-)
[16:10] <Trevinho> Laney: but actually I'm mostly interested on what mutter / xrandr outputs
[16:11] <Laney> Trevinho: k, what are the commands please?
[16:11] <jackpot51> I subscribed seb128, I will wait for confirmation...
[16:12] <seb128> jackpot51, great
[16:12] <willcooke> kk, anymore for any more?
[16:12] <seb128> not me
[16:12] <Trevinho> Laney: xrandr --verbose (or without flag)
[16:13] <willcooke> oki, I need to get on another meeting, so please carry on if needed
[16:13] <willcooke> #endmeeting
[16:13] <meetingology> Meeting ended Tue Jun 20 16:13:09 2017 UTC.
[16:13] <meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-desktop/2017/ubuntu-desktop.2017-06-20-15.30.moin.txt
[16:13] <Laney> https://paste.ubuntu.com/24909161/
[16:13] <Trevinho> As per mutter... Not sure there one, when in Wayland you need to use dbus, let me check
[16:13] <gQuigs> willcooke: the torrent data is all public:  http://torrent.ubuntu.com:6969/  (don't use it for historical 12.04 vs 14.04.. I believe the records get reset when the server restarts)
[16:13] <gQuigs> this data IMHO will give you the highest 32-but numbers of any data we have as 32 or 64 bit is an even choice on the releases.ubuntu.com site where you need to go to get torrents
[16:14] <gQuigs> seb128: what kind of apps 32 retiring decisions are you looking for?
[16:14] <gQuigs> 32-bit
[16:16] <seb128> firefox
[16:16] <seb128> chromium
[16:16] <Trevinho> Laney: gdbus call --session --dest org.gnome.Mutter.DisplayConfig --object-path /org/gnome/Mutter/DisplayConfig --method org.gnome.Mutter.DisplayConfig.GetResources
[16:16] <seb128> chrome
[16:16] <Trevinho> (in wayland though)
[16:17] <Laney> meh, I'd have to restart
[16:17] <Trevinho> Laney: no it's fine...
[16:18] <Trevinho> Laney: no worries, the real ones then :-D
[16:18] <Trevinho> ruler handy is it too much? :)
[16:18] <Trevinho> and your's is a 9360 or previous revision?
[16:18] <Laney> second
[16:18] <Laney> I just pastebinned the xrandr ^
[16:19] <gQuigs> seb128: Chrome ended support back in 2015 - https://groups.google.com/a/chromium.org/forum/#!topic/chromium-dev/FoE6sL-p6oU
[16:19] <gQuigs> err.. I mean 2016
[16:19] <seb128> gQuigs, did it actually do? we are still getting updates building for it
[16:19] <oSoMoN> seb128, chrome discontinued 32 bit support, but chromium still builds fine
[16:20] <gQuigs> ^^
[16:20] <gQuigs> seb128: you can't download a 32-bit version of Google Chrome
[16:20] <seb128> right, that I know in fact :p
[16:20] <seb128> do you know about firefox?
[16:20] <oSoMoN> chrisccoulson would know
[16:20] <Laney> Trevinho: 9343
[16:21] <Trevinho> Laney: yeah, I read that thanks...
[16:25] <Laney> Trevinho: 29.3cm x 16.5cm
[16:26] <gQuigs> seb128: haven't seen any plans to remove 32-bit linux builds..   On windows side they just dropped support for XP/Vista for their regular release (they have a LOT of 32-bit users still I think)
[16:26] <seb128> gQuigs, k, thanks for the info
[16:26] <gQuigs> seb128: there was this: "Ended Firefox Linux support for processors older than Pentium 4 and AMD Opteron" in Firefox 53 release notes..
[16:27] <Trevinho> Laney: ok, thanks... your values are almost then...
[16:27] <Trevinho> wondering why aren't in the new model I tested, while a reddit guy had the right ones
[16:27] <Laney> could be 29.4 which is what it says
[16:28] <Trevinho> yeah, still...
[16:28] <jbicha> jackpot51: please also start an ubuntu-devel list discussion about GNOME Initial Setup / ubiquity oem-mode
[16:29] <jbicha> ubuntu-devel is limited to https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-dev so your posts will be moderated, but you can ping in #ubuntu-devel to get them through :|
[16:32] <willcooke> thanks for the link gQuigs
[16:36] <ryanleesipes> Hi folks!
[16:37] <ryanleesipes> seb128: I've heard I need to talk to you or didrocks about theme support in Snaps
[16:43] <willcooke> ryanleesipes, those guys are end-of-day now- but ask away and someone will get back to you
[16:43] <willcooke> also: https://insights.ubuntu.com/2016/07/06/ubuntu-app-developer-blog-announcing-new-snap-desktop-launchers/
[16:43] <willcooke> see if that helps ^
[16:43] <seb128> ryanleesipes, hey, sorry i'm a bit busy away from the computer atm but I read backlog and reply later (or come a bit earlier tomorrow on the channel)
[17:01] <Laney> good night
[18:04] <willcooke> night all
[19:01] <immu> lol