=== JanC_ is now known as JanC [06:01] good morning desktoppers! [06:05] Hi oSoMoN [06:10] hey jamesh [06:19] good morning [06:19] salut didrocks === maclin1 is now known as maclin [06:29] morning [06:32] hey oSoMoN, salut jibel [06:41] salut didrocks, ça va? [06:55] ça va bien, et toi ? (catchup de pas mal d'emails) [06:58] didrocks, ça va. quiet week end, I drove the kids to their grand parents place. 1 mo and half of holidays for me \o/ ;) [07:00] ahah, enjoy and celebrate :-) [07:01] we are at my parent's house for a couple of weeks to retrieve fresh air [07:01] first time ever the baby sleeps for 12h in a row [07:01] it's always fresh here. 15°c and raining this morning [07:06] not the same story in Lyon (but it seems better this week) :) [07:16] Heh, it's winter and warmer here :) [07:17] Morning didrocks, jibel [07:17] and morning oSoMoN [07:18] hey duflu! ;) [07:29] hi duflu [08:02] how do I work this thing??????????????????? === maclin1 is now known as maclin [08:04] welcome back Laney! How were your holidays? [08:04] enough to forget how to type on IRC it seems :p [08:05] (so, sounds like excellent holidays!) [08:08] hey didrocks! [08:09] yes, they were great thanks! [08:09] walking, beach, swimming in the sea, cake, restaurants, pub [08:09] & sun [08:10] got a little bit pink in some areas on wednesday :-) [08:10] great weather thus I guess? [08:10] was pretty good [08:10] probably 25 max [08:11] ahoy [08:11] winter compared to what we had here :p [08:11] so not too hot but still sunny enough to go swim in the sea [08:11] hey Laney, had good holidays? [08:11] hey willcooke [08:11] yeah ;) [08:11] hey willcooke [08:11] didrocks: how was your week/weekends? [08:11] hey seb128 hey willcooke! [08:11] welcome back Laney [08:11] wb Laney [08:11] seb128: yeah, not too many pings on IRC but I just saw that I have 47 emails in the work inbox [08:11] * Laney screams [08:11] how are you? [08:12] willcooke: you good? [08:12] Laney: really good! Got some nice progress in work in our dismantling strategy. However, quite warm/hot during the whole week (35-38°C), was hard [08:12] I'm good thanks, had a mostly relaxing w.e and a good night [08:12] hey oSoMoN, thanks, how's it going over there? [08:12] good morning chrisccoulson, have you followed bug #1702407 ? there are updated packages for trusty/xenial/yakkety in https://launchpad.net/~canonical-chromium-builds/+archive/ubuntu/stage/+packages, I’d need you to promote them asap [08:12] bug 1702407 in chromium-browser (Ubuntu) "Startup crash after upgrading to 59.0.3071.109 on trusty/xenial/yakkety" [Critical,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1702407 [08:13] yeah that sucks :/ [08:13] go get a place in the forest [08:13] Laney, good, been busy moving houses over the week-end (not quite done yet), and getting ready for holidays next week [08:13] that's what we did :) [08:14] oSoMoN: ah, good luck with the move [08:14] * Laney hates moving [08:14] meh, I expired from backporters over the last week [08:14] it’s amazing how much cr^Wstuff one can pile up in a relatively small flat [08:15] launchpad isn't very holiday friendly [08:15] why? [08:15] 5 day warning -> gone [08:15] ah [08:15] you got kicked from some teams? [08:15] oSoMoN: you sending stuff to the charity shop? [08:15] yeah [08:15] I found as well the period to be really short [08:16] hey oSoMoN [08:16] salut seb128 [08:16] some old school names on the admin list https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-backporters/+members#active [08:16] waow, indeed [08:16] oSoMoN, congrats on the new house :-) [08:17] Laney, some to charity, some to trash [08:17] thanks seb128 :) [08:17] oSoMoN: the important question is: do you have the Internet in your new house already? :) [08:19] didrocks, I wish… I signed up for it last week, and they were supposed to call me to set it up within 48hrs, but that never happened [08:19] Spain. [08:19] /o\ [08:19] well, ISP providers + Spain, what could happen? :) [08:20] I'm also going to be downgraded from fiber to ADSL, going to take a hit :/ [08:20] but the new house is worth it :) [08:20] ;) [08:21] * Laney imagines that every house in Spain comes with its own pool [08:21] oSoMoN, is it in the country side? [08:21] eth45 slot in the pool? (aka the Trevinh_o way) [08:23] no pool, but on the edge of a forest, it doesn't really qualify as country side as it's a 5min drive from densely populated areas but it manages to be very quiet [08:30] just got a call from the phone company, they’re coming to set up my internet now \o/ [08:33] nice [08:47] Anyone know anything about themeing gdm? [08:47] I'd like to have a play with it [08:47] maybe next week while I'm sprinting I can spend a few hours tinkering [08:48] what sort of changes do you want to do? [08:48] I'm not sure you can theme much atm :-/ [08:49] In other news: I tried building the help videos from "getting-started-docs". I started the rendering on Friday afternoon and by Sunday afternoon it was still going with no obvious end in sight. I'll kick something off on a canonistack instance and just leave it running [08:49] seb128, I was thinking of changing a few colours etc. [08:49] changing background and themes color are like any gnome session (for the gdm users) [08:49] unsure you can move widgets and do more though without rewriting a greeter [08:49] I had a very quick look over the weekend, and there seem to be a few downloadable themes, so I'll start with those [08:50] k [09:04] On upgrade I got asked what display manager I wanted, but it defaulted to lightdm. For the switch to GNOME, shouldn't the default have been gdm3? [09:10] * oSoMoN is now connected to the intertubes from his new house [09:18] didrocks, see rbasak's comment ^ [09:19] rbasak: yeah, that's the goal and kenvandine[m][m] did some work there/tested it on a vm [09:19] rbasak: so apparently, not all cases are covered. I guess having your upgrade logs would help [09:19] normally, you get a new ubuntu-session package setting a lag [09:19] flag* [09:20] didrocks, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gsettings-desktop-schemas/+bug/1703326 [09:20] Ubuntu bug 1703326 in gsettings-desktop-schemas (Ubuntu) "Lock screen wallpaper is a plain blue screen" [High,Confirmed] [09:20] so, knowing the order things got unpack/configured would help [09:20] willcooke: thanks! [09:24] rbasak, http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ken-vandine/gnome-session/ubuntu_lightdm_gdm3_transition/revision/403/debian/ubuntu-session.postinst [09:25] I really wonder if packages are configured in the correct order. Not the first time I see complains on this since Friday [09:25] rbasak, maybe you can file a bug and see what is going wrong in that snippet for you? [09:26] didrocks, that postinst shouldn't be impacted by the order? [09:26] add your apt logs including that upgrade [09:26] it just greps accountsservice files [09:26] seb128: does having it by default prevent the debconf prompt still? [09:27] seb128: or could we have gdm3 configured because that ubuntu-session postinst is trigger? [09:27] I think having default should prevent the question [09:27] but yeah, you may be right, could not be an ordering issue but just something with the script [09:28] I might be wrong, I didn't try to debug much [09:28] in any case you are right, apt log is useful [09:28] I would still like to have apt logs to ensure that one those users ubuntu-session was configured first [09:28] rbasak, ^ can you file a bug with your upgrade log and maybe the result of the grep command from that postinst snippet? [09:29] * didrocks wonders why grep -q wasn't used instead of storing it in a variable [09:29] oh [09:29] RET=`grep 'XSession=ubuntu' /var/lib/AccountsService/users/*` [09:29] 13TRANSITION=$? [09:29] it's wrong [09:29] the script is set -e [09:29] so, if you don't have ubuntu session set as a default anyway, the upgrade script fails [09:30] (independently of the current reported issue) [09:30] well the intend is to set default if you have "ubuntu" as a session before upgrade no? [09:30] or what do you mean? [09:30] you don't have ubuntu set as default [09:31] the grep fails (exit != 0) [09:31] the script stops [09:31] the upgrade stops on postinst failure [09:32] it also misses #DEBHELPER# [09:32] and I would only do any of this stuff on upgrade from an old version [09:33] yeah, it will reoccur on any upgrade [09:34] so if you set back lightdm as default [09:34] it will reforce you with gdm on next upgrade [09:34] ah well [09:34] that's what alphas are for! [09:35] I can fix it after lunch, unsure that's what rbasak got though [09:35] the question was also about the default being lightdm not gdm3, maybe that's something to fix too in any case [09:36] * Laney isn't sure [09:36] Laney: wdym in "the default being lightdm"? [09:36] ah [09:36] adding that check [09:36] we should really have peer reviews for landing such changes [09:36] yeah [09:36] (and yes) [09:36] or at least pointing to the commit before uploading [09:37] I suppose it's preferring to show you the one you have chosen already [09:37] that's probably fine [09:39] oh, the MIR got approved [09:39] nice [09:39] yeah, it's the default, a lot of cleanswap happened (but still more to do :)) [09:39] did the indicators drop off like we hoped? [09:40] almost all [09:40] still 2 left [09:40] I did demote ~70 binary packages from main last week [09:40] \o/ [09:41] hum, seb128, the commit you pointed at isn't the last revision [09:41] oh sorry [09:41] awesome bar fail [09:41] it's still wrong though :p [09:41] RET=`grep -c gdm3 $DEFAULT_DISPLAY_MANAGER_FILE || true` [09:41] if [ $RET -gt 0 ]; then [09:41] # Nothing to do [09:41] exit 0; [09:41] fi [09:41] will always exit 0 [09:41] so nothing to do :p [09:41] so no transition [09:41] * didrocks wonders how that worked on a vm [09:42] http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ken-vandine/gnome-session/ubuntu_lightdm_gdm3_transition/view/head:/debian/ubuntu-session.postinst [09:42] if grep -qs ... ;then [09:42] that's my usual invocation [09:42] yep [09:43] * Laney has a VM in clean pre-swap state [09:43] * Laney tests it [09:43] (the archive state) [09:44] yeah, better to test [09:44] but anyway, as you told, it should be conditioned by: lightdm as the default (our previous default) + version to only happen once [09:46] yeah I got prompted [09:48] Laney: was ubuntu-session configured before gdm? [09:48] wait [09:48] (just to confirm at least it's not order related) [09:48] but really that unconditional exit 0 [09:48] hmm this is worse than I thought [09:48] ah? [09:48] the question is asked when apt does "Preconfiguring packages" [09:49] that is before any maintainer scripts have run [09:49] do-release-upgrade or just apt? [09:49] apt [09:49] * Laney doesn't know how that works actually [09:49] something to do with debconf I guess [09:50] I thought we only downloaded the debconf prompts on release upgrade via our tools [09:50] that's maybe hooked into apt itself now… [09:50] but ken got it working [09:50] maybe better to wait for him on this to not reash the whole thing thus? [09:53] I think it's basically that the gdm3.config file is run in a first pass after the debs are downloaded [09:54] yep, probably [09:54] actually, we did the switch the other way around in 2010 [09:55] would be interesting to just look up at how we did this at the time [09:55] * didrocks doesn't remember that far :p [09:57] yeah let's wait for ken [10:22] didrocks, sorry for the rubbish screenshot, but: http://imgur.com/a/24qv7 [10:22] stupid reflective screens [10:23] willcooke: nice tee-shirt! :) [10:23] :D [10:23] liking the theming as well [10:23] maybe the selector box should be orange instead of blue? [10:23] (or aubergine) [10:24] It seems you have to embed the wallpaper inside the gdm compiled resource, a full path to a wallpaper on disk was not enough [10:24] yeah, I'll tweak the colours and fonts etc if I can [10:24] yeah, it's a gresource, so compiled [10:24] that was just to see if it's even possible [10:24] but shipping a theme for the gdm user makes sense [10:24] now I know what to do I will play with it some more next week [10:25] (maybe not patch the default one, just shipping another one) [10:25] heh :) [10:25] travel-duties [10:25] yeah, shipping a new one probably makes most sense [10:25] * willcooke finally gets that cup of tea [10:25] we can thus let people revert to "default experience" [10:25] waow [10:25] should be really cold now [10:25] I'll start over again :) [10:29] didrocks, seems the default is still to use xorg - is that right? [10:29] on this newly installed machine ubuntu is the default, ubuntu on wayland is available [10:29] intel machine [10:31] willcooke: right now yeah, we default to xorg until we take a decision [10:31] but remember that we discovered that ubiquity isn't wayland's compatible [10:32] ya [10:32] and jibel reported a few issues with wayland. My gut feeling is that wayland isnt ready yet. But lets do some more playing [10:33] yeah [10:33] still good in any case to provide the other session type [10:33] +1 [10:33] willcooke, agreed, on a live session at least apport and ubiquity are crashing on wayland [10:33] seems like core components to me :) [10:33] :) [10:34] depends, if you switch to wayland, as apport doesn't work, no automated crash report from ubiquity [10:34] sounds like a win :-) === carlolo is now known as clobranox [10:37] * duflu fades into the night === clobranox is now known as clobrano [10:42] found a missing icon in the bluetooth speaker test dialog - where should I log that? [10:46] good morning [10:47] hey jbicha [10:47] I think the problem with Wayland is that if you want it to be default in 18.04 LTS, we ought to make it default in 17.10 too, right? [10:49] depends, if we have enough feedback from the pre-testing + optional sessions, it's still doable, but yeah, if the decision is to switch it on by default on 18.04 LTS, I guess switching it one session earlier would make all of us more confortable [10:55] yeah, obviously it's not a hard requirement since we have made major changes in the LTS dev cycle before without doing them in LTS-1 first [10:56] jbicha, hey [10:57] jbicha, that's sort of true, but I don't think we replied to the question on whether we want it default in 18.04 yet [10:59] we sort of told people months ago that we were going to do Wayland by default in 18.04… [10:59] seb128: hey, did you see my ucc branches? [10:59] Trevinho, hey, no [10:59] seb128: https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/2855 [10:59] jbicha, where did we say that? [11:00] seb128: i forgot to push these commits in my previous branch -_- [11:00] Trevinho, that's a bileto not a branch? [11:00] I'm not opposed to us making the right decision with Wayland, but maybe we need to be more cautious before making announcements like that in the future [11:00] jbicha, I don't think we commited anywhere at making wayland default for the LTS [11:01] https://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2017/04/18/%23ubuntu-desktop.html#t17:11 [11:01] and based on that happening during a somewhat-well-advertised meeting, the media reported it as confirmed too [11:02] typical example of medias not doing their job correctly [11:02] you can't pick up an IRC line from a discuss and make it look like it's a formal announce or commitement [11:03] I really don't think the media is to blame here when the Desktop Lead makes a pretty plain statement when asked at an event where third parties are invited [11:03] it was like a press conference [11:03] lol [11:03] we don't have the same view from what IRC is [11:03] that wasn't a normal weekly meeting [11:03] I didn't speak about meeting [11:04] but about IRC [11:04] that was the 2nd meeting that we invited others to attend [11:04] IRC has never been a platform where we do any kind of announcement [11:04] it's one were we have discussions [11:04] and state intends [11:05] that line should read as "we are working on making wayland default" [11:05] which isn't a commitement but an intend [11:05] if we think it's not working out for some reasons we keep the option to go with plan B [11:06] the media is not at fault here [11:06] http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2017/04/ubuntu-will-run-wayland-default [11:06] let's agree to disagree [11:06] https://twitter.com/8none1/status/854413979766181889 [11:07] you just said that the media should have confirmed the news before reporting it; that was actually done here [11:07] no, I'm saying that they should know better than making news from IRC discussions [11:07] we have proper lists and website were we do announcements [11:07] or twitter? [11:08] does Ubuntu has a twitter? [11:08] https://twitter.com/8none1/status/854413979766181889 [11:08] and even if twitter, from the Ubuntu account [11:08] that's a personal account [11:08] not a project one [11:08] willcooke: pinging you since we're talking about your statements… [11:08] jbicha, o/ [11:08] * willcooke reads [11:09] well, that was a long time ago [11:09] It looked like we were going to use it, but based on the data we now have, we can change that [11:09] jbicha, what I'm saying is that there is more consideration and carefulness done in making official announce than there is in having people stating something on their private account [11:10] 17.10 would have to be Wayland if we are planning to ship wayland only in 18.04 [11:10] jbicha, I don't think anyone would consider making a commitement before evaluating the technologie and starting using it [11:11] I'll repeat what I said at the beginning: I'm ok with us making the right decision regardless of previous decisions, but let's try to be more careful [11:12] I don't think we ever had a *decision* [11:12] about these kinds of statements in the future before we're certain [11:12] we stated an intend [11:13] but yes, I agree with you than more can be read in those statement that it should be [11:13] and that it would be better to be less direct/let the door open for changes next time [11:13] the statements were not worded as goals or intents or "we'd like to" or "we'll try to" [11:13] right, they should have been [11:13] ok [11:13] but it's IRC, it's not a media were you carefully craft your messages [11:14] it's one where you type as people comment [11:14] which is why I say it's not a proper media for announce [11:14] Once we *know* I'll do an insights post [11:14] moving on, I think... [11:15] +1 [11:15] seb128, u-o-a on X... I can't even click "add" to try and add a u1 account [11:15] seb128: do you know what's up with LP: #1703010 ? https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/artful/+source/gnome-shell/+pots/gnome-shell [11:15] Launchpad bug 1703010 in gnome-shell (Ubuntu) "gnome-shell is not translated into Hebrew in Artful" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1703010 [11:15] maybe I broke something [11:15] willcooke, u1 isn't working I think [11:15] Hebrew should be about 86% translated https://l10n.gnome.org/module/gnome-shell/ [11:15] jbicha, let me have a look [11:16] seb128, ahhh - so your comment on the trello card was that online accounts itself is used in those places, not u1. Gotay [11:16] *gotya [11:16] willcooke, yeah, my usecase is, as written in the bug, to add a google account to UOA and have my events listed in the indicator and my calendar in gnome-calendar [11:16] seb128, nod. thx [11:16] yw [11:17] sorry if that was not clear [11:17] the framework was used on the phone as well [11:17] and I think the u1 plugin was only working on touch [11:17] seb128, nw. So are you +1 on removing u-o-a from Artful? [11:17] yes [11:17] and allow U7 session people to add the account manually [11:17] seb128: yeah, branches are linked [11:17] Trevinho, k, let me look [11:18] willcooke, it's less good than it was but it's part of that game, we lower maintainance cost but the session is degrading in result [11:18] willcooke: it's already half done; UOA has been dropped from Empathy, Shotwell, e-d-s and the Unity lens and there's already a removal bug for UOA stuff [11:19] jbicha, ack, thx. Just making sure I understand the complete story ;) [11:19] (for a change ;P ) [11:20] the Unity story for Online Accounts is a bit rough like Seb pointed out on his last comment to the Trello card [11:21] Unity itself doesn't need Online Accounts but it would be nice if they had some way of setting up Online Accounts for GNOME apps they might use [11:22] On the topic of settings - do we need to add software sources in to gnome settings? [11:22] no :) [11:23] oh [11:23] I found it [11:23] in Software [11:23] humm [11:24] right [11:24] thought is: all the existing docs in the world will point users to settings. But also, this is a new world, and so those docs can be considered out of date. So... dunno what's best here [11:24] just throwing it out there [11:26] update-manager also links to "Software & Updates" [11:26] I think it's easy enough to find, you can open it from the dash or from update-manager or from gnome-software [11:27] oki, thx [11:27] if someone wanted to integrate that into gnome-control-center, I think that would be nice but I don't like it as a 3rd-party non-modal popup like it is in u-c-c [11:27] willcooke, I would vote for not changing g-c-c for that one, it's not something users need as a basic need, it's sort of advanced users and it has enough entry points [11:27] nod [11:29] LP: #1690964 is the tracking bug if someone did want to integrate it [11:29] Launchpad bug 1690964 in gnome-control-center (Ubuntu) "All Settings in Gnome Shell is missing 'Software & Updates' icon" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1690964 [11:35] thx jbicha [11:37] Trevinho, reviewed, thanks for the changes [11:37] seb128: thank you [11:37] yw [11:42] seb128: there was other reported artful translations issue LP: #1702759 I didn't look into that one [11:42] Launchpad bug 1702759 in evolution (Ubuntu) "Evolution is not translated" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1702759 [11:42] *one other issue* [11:42] jbicha, thanks [11:42] are artful language packs going to be updated weekly now or is that still manual? [11:44] still manual but I'm going to set up regular cron updates this week [11:44] bah, I hate evolution [11:45] jbicha, evolution is the usual "upstream pot name includes the version" and you uploaded a new serie in artful [11:46] I'm adding to my list of things to fix [11:46] that's annoying, I don't remember why we didn't patch that out of upstream to just use "evolution" as domain name [11:46] we should [11:47] hum [11:47] that's not enough [11:47] they moved to cmake as a bonus [11:47] need to look at that [11:48] which reminds me of that bug you opened on dh_translations not handling GNOME direct use of gettext [11:48] which is also on my list [11:48] jbicha, I'm going to sort those out, thanks for reporting [11:49] yeah, the cmake conversion was a pain, it took a lot more work to do the 3.24 updates than normal :( [11:53] jibel, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-shell/+bug/1703010/comments/2 [11:53] Ubuntu bug 1703010 in gnome-shell (Ubuntu) "gnome-shell is not translated into Hebrew in Artful" [Undecided,New] [11:53] jibel, sorry was for jbicha [11:54] jbicha, ^ looks like an upstream bug and not fixed yet in git [11:55] jbicha, same issue with the es.po file, added a comment about that [11:55] ok, I can fix those upstream in git [11:56] thanks [11:56] Spanish has been broken a lot, I told the translator and he said that it was a bug in his software, hopefully that bug was fixed! [11:56] do you know what software he uses? [11:58] gtranslator [11:59] it just adds the current year to the end and if the line is too long, I guess it gets wrapped which breaks things [11:59] https://git.gnome.org/browse/gtranslator/tree/src/gtr-header.c#n682 [12:02] right [12:03] grep 'XSession=ubuntu' /var/lib/AccountsService/users/* # exits 0 (finds a match) [12:03] Incidentally, I'd use -q in the postinst [12:03] I'll file a bug for upgrade logs. [12:03] thanks [12:04] rbasak, the url I gave was incorrect, code changed since, it's http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ken-vandine/gnome-session/ubuntu_lightdm_gdm3_transition/view/head:/debian/ubuntu-session.postinst now ... but yeah can/should be improved [12:05] jbicha, https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=771765 [12:05] Gnome bug 771765 in Parse engine "Problem with 80 character lines and header comments" [Major,New] [12:07] thanks [12:12] yw [12:15] seb128, didrocks, willcooke: bug 1703358 [12:15] bug 1703358 in gnome-session (Ubuntu) "Display manager defaults to lightdm on upgrade" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1703358 [12:16] rbasak, thanks [12:17] jbicha, es.po is having the same issue in gnome-software gnome-session tracker ligdata [12:17] you should tell that guy to check for those errors [12:18] jbicha, https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/artful/+imports?field.filter_status=FAILED [12:18]