/srv/irclogs.ubuntu.com/2017/08/09/#ubuntu-us-mi.txt

gamerchick02i was trying to be funny. didn't work. whoops01:15
greg-gdelayed humor is hard01:15
greg-gasync humor, I guess01:16
jrwrenbonsoir greg-g01:27
greg-gmy neighbor in petaluma, who spent a year or something in France in high school made fun of the french speaking canadians and their "american french" accent :)01:46
gamerchick02delayed humor is hard. i need to update. then i'm going to bed. see ya'll tomorrow night!01:56
jrwreni imagine the difference between canadian french adn french french is not like the diff between NE USA english and London english, but more like the difference between Louisiana English and northrn england english.   :)02:25
cmaloneygreg-g: French Canada gets no love02:53
Scary_Guybecause French Canadians loves no one06:52
cmaloneyGood morning11:08
rick_hMorning11:20
mrgoodcatmorning12:32
mrgoodcati think i am about to embark on my first kivy project this evening12:33
rick_hsounds like a party13:38
rick_hwasn't brousch all into kivy for a bit?13:38
brouschI was a core developer for a few years13:39
rick_hthere you go13:39
brouschLack of accessibility is really why I stopped. With Kivy, you don't get any of the platforms' built-in accessibility features13:42
brouschSo it's OK for specialty apps and games, but not good for more serious apps13:43
_stink__mrgoodcat: i just started one also13:47
mrgoodcatmine is going to be a pi monitored keggerator14:09
mrgoodcat:)14:09
rick_hhah, awesome14:15
jrwrennative apps all the way.14:16
jrwrenI made a little native app and showed it to a buddy and of course he had to show me his app. Mine started about 5X faster than his react native app.14:16
jrwrennon-native app frameworks are a joke. Just because you CAN do something doesn't mean you should do something.14:17
rick_hI think if it speeds up the dev time of a keggerator then by all means14:18
greg-gyeah, I'm not sure a keggerator app needs the best app store reviews ;)14:19
rick_hnot going to argue for main apps, if you're going after users in an ecosystem you have to buy into the ecosystem beliefs14:19
brouschmrgoodcat: I did a demo of kivy on rpi a few times14:20
brouschHow are you installing it?14:21
brouschI liked http://kivypie.mitako.eu/14:23
jrwrenoh yeah, for rpi stuff and personal stuff, use what works.14:43
cmaloney-exilehola14:44
jrwrenI was just astounded in this case because the startup time was noticable. Like, to the point that I'd think twice about launching the app because the startup time was slow.14:44
rick_hcmaloney-exile: exile?14:44
cmaloney-exileYeah, can't ssh into my remote machine14:45
rick_hcmaloney-exile: oic, doh14:45
cmaloney-exileI'm at Mid Michigan for an interview for JoDee14:45
cmaloney-exilehanging out in their library14:45
brouschcmaloney: Let JoDee know that we went to the Veen Observatory last night as part of George's Space Camp. His mind was blown at least 3 times.14:48
cmaloney-exileThat's awesome!14:48
cmaloney-exileLet me guess: Saturn's rings14:48
cmaloney-exileJupiter's red spot14:49
cmaloney-exileand the moon14:49
brouschclose14:49
cmaloney-exilemoons of jupiter?14:49
brouschSaturn's rings and titan, Jupiter and 4 moons (couldn't quite make out the red spot), and a ring nebula14:49
cmaloney-exileOh wow14:49
brouschThen ISS flyover14:49
cmaloney-exile<314:50
greg-gniiiice14:50
cmaloney-exileWill let her know14:50
brouschThey even let him rotate the dome14:51
cmaloney-exileThat's awesome!14:56
mrgoodcatbrousch: we aren't actually sure how it will work yet14:56
mrgoodcatwe just got the hardware in yesterday14:56
mrgoodcatso we're in the playing/planning phase right now14:56
mrgoodcatout of curiosity, what sorts of problems made you switch away from kivy and what did you switch to?14:57
brouschAccessibility was really the big one. I watched too many talks about how hard it is for disabled people to use inaccessible apps.14:58
mrgoodcatalso jrwren is there a native app framework you'd recommend? i've played with qt a bit but tbh i haven't done much ui work14:58
mrgoodcatwhat about kivy made accessibility hard?14:58
brouschFor mobile, I would go native for that platform. For a kegerrator used by you, kivy is great14:59
jrwrenmrgoodcat: there is only ios and its cocoatouch there. :p14:59
jrwrenQT is pretty terrible at accessibility too, from what I've heard. Maybe fine on win/mac, but terrible on linux14:59
mrgoodcatdoes kivy not work with screen readers or something?15:02
brouschIf it does, it just by chance15:06
jrwrenisn't kivy a layer on something else too?  SDL or something?15:06
mrgoodcatits a layer on top of many other things15:07
mrgoodcatit supposedly chooses the best thing depending on your environment15:08
mrgoodcatso you can launch it without x and it will write directly to the framebuffer if need be15:08
mrgoodcatif i understand correctly15:08
mrgoodcatwhich i likely don't :)15:08
mrgoodcatSDL is listed as a provider. along with pygame, pil, gstreamer, gles, glew, etc...15:09
jrwrenoh, its opengl.15:11
jrwrenthat is why no accessibility15:11
mrgoodcaton startup my hello world app claims to be using sdl2 for Text and Window objects, and img_tex, img_imageio, img_dds, img_sdl2, img_gif (img_pil, img_ffpyplayer ignored) for Image objects15:11
jrwrenGLES2 does run everywhere, so it makes for a nice abstraction layer.15:11
mrgoodcat[INFO   ] [GL          ] Using the "OpenGL ES 2" graphics system15:12
brouschYeah, it runs everywhere, but the widgets are all custom components15:22
notlikethesouphi mrgoodcat17:51
mrgoodcathi18:53
brouschfor cmaloney https://zachholman.com/posts/javacript-haters20:24

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