| === JoshStrobl is now known as JoshStrobl|AFK | ||
| willdeberry | any around around by chance? | 01:31 |
|---|---|---|
| willdeberry | anyone* | 01:31 |
| === JanC is now known as Guest55020 | ||
| === JanC_ is now known as JanC | ||
| mup | PR snapd#3806 opened: packaging/fedora: Merge changes from Fedora Dist-Git <Created by Conan-Kudo> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/3806> | 04:22 |
| === Justin` is now known as Justin`afk | ||
| mup | PR snapd#3693 closed: snapstate: improve the error message when classic confinement is not supported <Created by mvo5> <Merged by mvo5> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/3693> | 05:53 |
| mup | PR snapd#3806 closed: packaging/fedora: Merge changes from Fedora Dist-Git <Created by Conan-Kudo> <Merged by chipaca> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/3806> | 07:04 |
| pedronis | ++ dnf -q -y --refresh install 'pkgconfig(systemd)' | 07:11 |
| pedronis | Error: Failed to synchronize cache for repo 'updates' | 07:11 |
| zyga-suse | kyrofa: re | 07:33 |
| zyga-suse | kyrofa: not sure about bug tracking, I think keeping it all in snapd is easier though | 07:33 |
| zyga-suse | good morning everyone :-) | 07:33 |
| mvo | zyga-suse_: hey, I think I addressed your points in 3260, let me know. I will ponder a bit more over the cmd_userd_test.go in the meantime | 07:39 |
| zyga-suse_ | hey | 07:39 |
| zyga-suse_ | thank you, let me look | 07:40 |
| zyga-suse_ | I'm working on a blanket in the grass | 07:40 |
| zyga-suse_ | I wonder if people will wonder what I do here ^_^ | 07:40 |
| zyga-suse_ | mvo: poor network connection, are you reading this? | 07:49 |
| mvo | zyga-suse_: yes | 07:50 |
| zyga-suse_ | odd, I can chat on IRC but I cannot load any website | 08:01 |
| zyga-suse_ | loaded | 08:04 |
| zyga-suse_ | mvo: replied on the Ping comment | 08:09 |
| zyga-suse_ | mvo: that's the only part I really cared about | 08:09 |
| zyga-suse_ | let me read the diff | 08:09 |
| zyga-suse_ | mvo: reviewed | 08:13 |
| zyga-suse_ | mvo: I'm sorry about being strict about that ping method there, let me know if that works in the end | 08:15 |
| mvo | zyga-suse_: we are not implementing Ping() currently | 08:18 |
| mvo | zyga-suse_: we are not implementing the Dbus.Peer interface at all | 08:18 |
| zyga-suse_ | mvo: go dbus doesn't do it for free? | 08:18 |
| zyga-suse_ | it's typically implemented by libraries | 08:18 |
| mvo | zyga-suse_: unfortunately not | 08:18 |
| zyga-suse_ | aww, bummer | 08:18 |
| zyga-suse_ | that's not good | 08:18 |
| mvo | zyga-suse_: at least not as far as I can tell | 08:18 |
| mvo | zyga-suse_: d-feet is what i use | 08:18 |
| zyga-suse_ | does it show up in introspection? | 08:18 |
| zyga-suse_ | aha | 08:18 |
| mvo | zyga-suse_: yes, introspection shows up | 08:18 |
| zyga-suse_ | I mean, does Peer show up? | 08:19 |
| mvo | zyga-suse_: no, peer does not show up at all, it does show up for the old safe launcher though (because dbus-gio) | 08:19 |
| zyga-suse_ | right | 08:19 |
| Chipaca | good morning all! happy "all versions of go shipped in ubuntu are obsolete" day! | 08:20 |
| Chipaca | (1.9 is out) | 08:20 |
| zyga-suse_ | oh, nice | 08:20 |
| zyga-suse_ | anything shiny? | 08:20 |
| zyga-suse_ | are generics in yet? | 08:20 |
| Chipaca | zyga-suse_: type aliases are a thing | 08:21 |
| Chipaca | zyga-suse_: and monotonic time | 08:21 |
| zyga-suse_ | whee | 08:21 |
| zyga-suse_ | so 2001 of us | 08:21 |
| mvo | zyga-suse_: I look into it, maybe we are just holding^Wusing it wrong | 08:21 |
| zyga-suse_ | mvo: maybe we could just implement Peer | 08:22 |
| zyga-suse_ | it's no-op Ping | 08:22 |
| zyga-suse_ | and get machine id | 08:22 |
| Chipaca | zyga-suse_: the nicest change that would impact my work is that ./... no longer looks in vendor | 08:22 |
| zyga-suse_ | yes, I saw that one | 08:23 |
| zyga-suse_ | that's a nice change | 08:23 |
| Chipaca | so go test ./... would finally dtrt | 08:23 |
| mvo | zyga-suse_: yeah, otoh, if we can call OpenURL and get a reply like "cannot use ping-ping-ping:" we know the interface is up as well. but yeah, ping is nicer, I have a look | 08:23 |
| zyga-suse_ | Chipaca: I'm still holding out for generics | 08:24 |
| zyga-suse_ | mvo: agreed | 08:24 |
| zyga-suse_ | mvo: if you want +1, just move to libexecdir | 08:24 |
| zyga-suse_ | mvo: I may look at Ping over weekend | 08:24 |
| mvo | zyga-suse_: we are actually using the normal "snap" command for the userd subcommand, so it will be the regular bindir (unless I miss something) | 08:25 |
| zyga-suse_ | mvo: ahh, sorry | 08:25 |
| zyga-suse_ | I must have misread the diff | 08:25 |
| mvo | zyga-suse_: no worries | 08:25 |
| zyga-suse_ | I assumed it would be a new binary | 08:25 |
| zyga-suse_ | ok, I have two tests to fix | 08:25 |
| zyga-suse_ | and a lot of goodies will be ready | 08:26 |
| zyga-suse_ | but first | 08:26 |
| zyga-suse_ | coffee!!! | 08:26 |
| mvo | zyga-suse_: heh, fun! if I export the ping interface things work | 08:27 |
| mvo | zyga-suse_: oh well, I will update things | 08:27 |
| Chipaca | zyga-suse_: did you see the guy that had generics implemented via unicode and generators? | 08:30 |
| pedronis | mvo: there was no joy with the fedora tests btw, still failed in prepare in strange ways, are we tuning ip6 on fedora as well? | 08:34 |
| zyga-suse_ | mvo: things work? | 08:35 |
| zyga-suse_ | Chipaca: I think I don't actually want to know anymore :D | 08:35 |
| zyga-suse_ | pedronis: probably not, it's behind ubuntu spread test flag | 08:35 |
| pedronis | anyway something is off and makes those even more unstable than usual | 08:37 |
| Chipaca | zyga-suse_: bottom line: it looked like “type ImmutableTreeListᐸElementTᐳ struct {” | 08:37 |
| pedronis | or the fedora infra itself is flakier, no clue | 08:37 |
| mvo | pedronis: I have not looked at the details for fedora unfortunately | 08:37 |
| mvo | zyga-suse_: yeah, ping works once the interface is exported via xml, no code needed, I will update in a bit (working on tests right now) | 08:37 |
| zyga-suse_ | woot! | 08:38 |
| zyga-suse_ | nice :) | 08:38 |
| zyga-suse_ | ah | 08:38 |
| zyga-suse_ | right | 08:38 |
| zyga-suse_ | because introspection is how dfeet knows about it | 08:38 |
| zyga-suse_ | though odd that this is not done by gdbus itself | 08:38 |
| mup | PR snapd#2837 closed: interfaces/apparmor: allow reading from ecryptfs <Blocked> <Decaying> <Created by zyga> <Closed by chipaca> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/2837> | 08:40 |
| zyga-suse_ | thank you :'-( | 08:44 |
| zyga-suse_ | though we _may_ have a way to solve that with what I'm working on | 08:44 |
| mup | PR snapd#3346 closed: [WIP] allow access to nm-dispatcher scripts <Decaying> <Created by felicianotech> <Closed by chipaca> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/3346> | 08:45 |
| Chipaca | hmm, i've got to test stuff that involves rebooting. I'll be pestering you with in/out messages soon :-) | 08:50 |
| zyga-suse_ | Chipaca: VMs/ | 08:51 |
| Chipaca | zyga-suse_: i'm too close to my memory limit :-( | 08:52 |
| Chipaca | (this is a test that needs a full desktop) | 08:52 |
| Chipaca | brb | 08:52 |
| zyga-suse_ | aww | 08:53 |
| * zyga-suse_ has apparmor on opensuse :) | 08:53 | |
| zyga-suse_ | and we can now probably also enable reexec | 08:53 |
| zyga-suse_ | there's still a few things missing but I think it's very very closenow | 08:53 |
| zyga-suse_ | mvo: is the PR ban still in effect? | 08:54 |
| Chipaca | morphis_: zyga-suse_: so it looks like moving /etc/X11/Xsession.d/65snappy to e.g. /etc/profile.d/snappy.sh will DTRT in both X and Wayland (might need some tweaks, but basically it'll work) | 08:59 |
| Chipaca | morphis_: zyga-suse_: I know RH/fedora are slightly different wrt profile.d, but afaik it boils down to it getting loaded more, not less; can you confirm? | 09:00 |
| zyga-suse_ | Chipaca: if you test it, +1 | 09:00 |
| zyga-suse_ | Chipaca: I think we want to dedupe those files | 09:00 |
| Chipaca | this is me looking at snapd#3398 | 09:00 |
| mup | PR snapd#3398: env: set XDG_DATA_DIRS for wayland et.al <Created by sergiusens> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/3398> | 09:00 |
| zyga-suse_ | Chipaca: there's one in every distro packaging | 09:00 |
| zyga-suse_ | Chipaca: and then we want to call it sanely, say snapd.sh | 09:00 |
| zyga-suse_ | Chipaca: and keep it in data/ | 09:01 |
| Chipaca | zyga-suse_: i tested it on ubuntu, but as i said i don't have the space to test it on other things | 09:01 |
| zyga-suse_ | Chipaca: I see | 09:01 |
| Chipaca | bah. i might be able to get this fedora running | 09:01 |
| Chipaca | should work with 1G, right? | 09:01 |
| zyga-suse_ | Chipaca: I can test on all of them but I'd prefer to do that in the afternoon with less sharp mind | 09:01 |
| Chipaca | yeah no probs | 09:01 |
| zyga-suse_ | Chipaca: nah | 09:01 |
| zyga-suse_ | try 2G | 09:01 |
| Chipaca | sigh, ok | 09:01 |
| zyga-suse_ | how much ram do you have? | 09:01 |
| Chipaca | lots of swapping ahead for me :-) | 09:01 |
| zyga-suse_ | I have a _physical_ fedora box with 2GB and it's a pain | 09:01 |
| zyga-suse_ | I added 1GB stick to make it work | 09:02 |
| Chipaca | zyga-suse_: free right now? 1G | 09:02 |
| zyga-suse_ | OMG | 09:02 |
| zyga-suse_ | and in general? | 09:02 |
| Chipaca | zyga-suse_: 4G total | 09:02 |
| zyga-suse_ | darn | 09:02 |
| zyga-suse_ | no way to expand? | 09:02 |
| Chipaca | i had 8 but one of the sticks died | 09:02 |
| Chipaca | and the whole box is starting to die | 09:02 |
| Chipaca | so i'm just letting it | 09:02 |
| zyga-suse_ | aha | 09:02 |
| zyga-suse_ | thinkpad? | 09:02 |
| Chipaca | while saving up for its replacement | 09:02 |
| zyga-suse_ | man, buy t430 for the price of a good meal | 09:02 |
| Chipaca | zyga-suse_: latitude e series | 09:02 |
| zyga-suse_ | they are indestructible | 09:02 |
| zyga-suse_ | and cost peanuts | 09:03 |
| Chipaca | it's ~8 years old | 09:03 |
| Chipaca | if i were to buy the same thing, it'd cost peanuts too | 09:03 |
| zyga-suse_ | what are you saving for? | 09:03 |
| Chipaca | but these old cpus suck 45W when angry, i'll gladly pay to worry about that less | 09:03 |
| zyga-suse_ | so what if you can get a battery with 11hrs of life? | 09:03 |
| Chipaca | zyga-suse_: probably a latitude e series :-) | 09:04 |
| zyga-suse_ | and still buy three for the price of one new box | 09:04 |
| Chipaca | zyga-suse_: 15 | 09:04 |
| Chipaca | zyga-suse_: this box had 15 hours battery life when it and the batteries were new | 09:04 |
| * zyga-suse_ chooses not to buy new laptops again | 09:04 | |
| Chipaca | zyga-suse_: ah, it'd not be new, it'd be refurb | 09:04 |
| zyga-suse_ | ah | 09:04 |
| zyga-suse_ | +100 on that | 09:04 |
| zyga-suse_ | it's worse than with used cars | 09:04 |
| Chipaca | i can't in good conscience justify the price nor environmental cost of new | 09:05 |
| zyga-suse_ | you open the door and 30% is gone | 09:05 |
| zyga-suse_ | yep | 09:05 |
| zyga-suse_ | especially when new CPUs suck so badly lately | 09:05 |
| zyga-suse_ | with less and less reliablity and features | 09:05 |
| zyga-suse_ | I wonder when amd will show their mobile ryzen/threadripper units | 09:06 |
| * zyga-suse_ sees ants crawling over his keys | 09:08 | |
| zyga-suse_ | not ogod | 09:08 |
| ogra_ | they probably just want to help | 09:09 |
| * zyga-suse_ plays bug squashing | 09:10 | |
| zyga-suse_ | Chipaca: buy this and run !ubuntu distro on it http://www.ebay.es/itm/Lenovo-ThinkPad-T530-i5-3210M-2x2-5GHz-8GB-128GB-SSD-UMTS-NVS5400-Webcam-WIN10-/253112700548?hash=item3aeeb14e84:g:KsAAAOSw01dZnrBX | 09:11 |
| zyga-suse_ | Chipaca: and work on it 2/5 days a week | 09:11 |
| zyga-suse_ | snapd must feel great everywhere | 09:11 |
| ogra_ | well, if you want low-end, get a beaglebone :P | 09:12 |
| zyga-suse_ | ogra_: ahem | 09:12 |
| zyga-suse_ | ogra_: that's way more than sufficient for work | 09:12 |
| zyga-suse_ | ogra_: and it has twice the RAM that Chipaca has now | 09:12 |
| zyga-suse_ | it would be good if we had someone running centos | 09:13 |
| zyga-suse_ | or if feeling less bold, just run opensuse or fedora where there's very good support already | 09:13 |
| zyga-suse_ | ogra_: what are you using daily? | 09:13 |
| zyga-suse_ | (h/w wise) | 09:13 |
| ogra_ | well, depends where i sit | 09:14 |
| ogra_ | in my office i have a "Intel(R) Core(TM) i5-2500K CPU @ 3.30GHz" with 32G, 3TB raid, 500G SSD, triple head nvidia 970 | 09:15 |
| ogra_ | (+3x 22" LG HD monitors ) | 09:15 |
| ogra_ | in my living room my first gen XPS13 | 09:15 |
| ogra_ | (some early i7, i forgot which and 8GB) | 09:16 |
| Chipaca | zyga-suse_: http://www.morgancomputers.co.uk/c/512/IBM-Lenovo/ | 09:16 |
| zyga-suse_ | nice desktop setup! | 09:16 |
| Chipaca | OTOH i coould set up my bbb | 09:17 |
| Chipaca | i'd need bluetooth and wifi to be working on it though | 09:17 |
| zyga-suse_ | punch-card speed IO | 09:17 |
| ogra_ | hmm, then a pi3 rather ... | 09:17 |
| Chipaca | i thought io on the pi3 was slower than the bbb | 09:17 |
| ogra_ | (though thats pretty powerful for an arm board) | 09:17 |
| zyga-suse_ | no, nothing is slower than bbb | 09:18 |
| ogra_ | well, pi3 is quad core 1.2GHz ... | 09:18 |
| zyga-suse_ | Chipaca: pi3 when using HDD is very much usable | 09:18 |
| ogra_ | bbb is single 800MHz | 09:18 |
| zyga-suse_ | Chipaca: just get that fancy Pi drive and boot away | 09:18 |
| zyga-suse_ | no SD cards needed | 09:18 |
| ogra_ | as long as you dont use any other USB devices on it, yeah | 09:18 |
| zyga-suse_ | (or any HDD with a usb cable) | 09:18 |
| zyga-suse_ | it's good enough for coding IMO | 09:19 |
| ogra_ | wired anetwork and HDD at the same time can already get nasty | 09:19 |
| ogra_ | the USB hub gets saturated easily | 09:19 |
| zyga-suse_ | it's limited but for the price it's really good | 09:20 |
| ogra_ | well ... for the price, yeah | 09:21 |
| zyga-suse_ | mvo: trivia PR pre-reviewed by jdstrand https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/3807 | 09:32 |
| mup | PR snapd#3807: cmd/snap-confine,packaging: import snapd-generated policy <Created by zyga> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/3807> | 09:32 |
| zyga-suse_ | I stated doing internal reviews with jamie so that we can start with a +1 and land things faster | 09:32 |
| mup | PR snapd#3807 opened: cmd/snap-confine,packaging: import snapd-generated policy <Created by zyga> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/3807> | 09:33 |
| ogra_ | hmm ... | 09:33 |
| mup | PR snapd#3791 closed: cmd/snap-confine: allow using additional libraries required by openSUSE <Created by zyga> <Merged by zyga> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/3791> | 09:34 |
| mup | PR snapd#3792 closed: cmd/snap-confine: allow running snap-exec without confinement <Created by zyga> <Closed by zyga> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/3792> | 09:34 |
| ogra_ | why is my daily edge image installing core 2466 on first boot ? | 09:34 |
| zyga-suse_ | 2466 feels 1000 builds too old | 09:34 |
| ogra_ | yes | 09:34 |
| ogra_ | especially for an edge build | 09:35 |
| ogra_ | 2739 is the current core in armhf edge | 09:35 |
| ogra_ | this smells like firstboot didnt set up the system properly | 09:36 |
| ogra_ | :/ | 09:36 |
| zyga-suse_ | what's in /var/lib/snapd/snaps ? | 09:36 |
| ogra_ | ogra@pi2:~$ snap list | 09:38 |
| ogra_ | No snaps are installed yet. Try "snap install hello-world". | 09:38 |
| ogra_ | ogra@pi2:~$ | 09:38 |
| ogra_ | grmpf | 09:38 |
| ogra_ | ogra@pi2:~$ ls /var/lib/snapd/snaps/ | 09:38 |
| ogra_ | core_2466.snap core_2739.snap pi2-kernel_39.snap | 09:38 |
| ogra_ | ogra@pi2:~$ | 09:38 |
| ogra_ | no gadget | 09:38 |
| * ogra_ starts over with a fresh flash to capture the log of the first boto | 09:39 | |
| ogra_ | *boot | 09:39 |
| zyga-suse_ | Chipaca: did you see the new "dep" tool? | 09:41 |
| zyga-suse_ | ogra_: super odd | 09:41 |
| Chipaca | zyga-suse_: in go? | 09:41 |
| zyga-suse_ | ogra_: how did youget 2466? from ubuntu-image? | 09:41 |
| zyga-suse_ | Chipaca: yes | 09:41 |
| ogra_ | zyga-suse_, i didnt .. | 09:41 |
| ogra_ | zyga-suse_, core_2739.snap | 09:42 |
| zyga-suse_ | sure but 2466 is present there as well | 09:42 |
| ogra_ | u-image did the right thing ... but the initial setup failed ... i usually install avahi as first thing after setting the hostname when testing ... that pulled core from stable | 09:42 |
| zyga-suse_ | aha | 09:43 |
| ogra_ | and this time it takes actually longer to get to "please press enter" ... last round this casme up immediately which indicates the key generation didnt take place | 09:46 |
| ogra_ | ogra@localhost:~$ snap list | 09:47 |
| ogra_ | Name Version Rev Developer Notes | 09:47 |
| ogra_ | core 16-2.27.4+git331.b672daf 2739 canonical core | 09:47 |
| ogra_ | pi2 16.04-0.18 39 canonical gadget | 09:47 |
| ogra_ | pi2-kernel 4.4.0.1070.70 39 canonical kernel | 09:47 |
| ogra_ | ogra@localhost:~$ | 09:47 |
| ogra_ | hrm ... so there was a race in the first run ... which is gone now :/ | 09:47 |
| ogra_ | i'm always surprised how different the memory usage between the different arm boards is | 09:51 |
| ogra_ | on the nanopi-air htop shows 48.7MB used ... the pi2 with the same set of snaps installed and running uses 70.3MB | 09:52 |
| mup | PR snapd#3808 opened: apparmor,release: add better apparmor detection/mocking code <Created by zyga> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/3808> | 09:53 |
| zyga-suse_ | mvo: another small branch pre-approved with jdstrand | 09:53 |
| ogra_ | (both armhf, both using the same core ) | 09:53 |
| mvo | zyga-suse_: ok, looking | 09:53 |
| zyga-suse_ | mvo: I have a tiny branch on top that will let debian and suse to enable apparmor | 09:53 |
| zyga-suse_ | mvo: and that will let us enable reexec on suse :) | 09:53 |
| zyga-suse_ | mvo: the last holdout of reexec will be distro layout (fixed with layouts) and /snap location (not covered by layouts yet) | 09:54 |
| ogra_ | fgimenez, ppisati, any idea why all our stable kernels are like 6 revisions behind ? | 09:56 |
| * zyga-suse_ -> small break | 10:02 | |
| zyga-suse_ | everyone: please request my reviews on things you want me to look at | 10:02 |
| fgimenez | ogra_: nope, i don't know | 10:03 |
| pedronis | mvo: so the problem test seems a quirk of task without undo handlers, their change is ready "sooner", don't think it should block your branch, but I would like to explore not needed Overlord.Loop there | 10:26 |
| mvo | pedronis: aha, I see! I can add an undo handler for now as a workaround until we have time to explore further. thanks a lot for looking into this | 10:37 |
| Chipaca | mvo: if what's now /etc/profile.d/apps-bin-path.sh suddenly becomes /etc/profile.d/snapd.sh, does apt/dpkg/something freak out? | 10:49 |
| mup | PR snapd#3809 opened: tests: copy files with less verbosity <Created by zyga> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/3809> | 10:53 |
| zyga-suse_ | mvo: trivial for my modem woes ^ | 10:53 |
| zyga-suse_ | Chipaca: yes | 10:53 |
| zyga-suse_ | you need to rm conffile | 10:53 |
| zyga-suse_ | Chipaca: or in other words, you want to ship your computer to the arctic, move north and herd sheep | 10:58 |
| Chipaca | zyga-suse_: the name just strikes me as odd, especially now that it'll have XDG stuff in it :-) | 10:59 |
| Chipaca | but they are technically both paths | 10:59 |
| Chipaca | so ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ | 10:59 |
| zyga-suse_ | Chipaca: yeah, the name is bad | 10:59 |
| zyga-suse_ | Chipaca: I'd like to have just "snapd.sh", period | 10:59 |
| Chipaca | that's what i was proposing above | 10:59 |
| zyga-suse_ | Chipaca: new systemd (we cannot assume it though) has nicer way to do this | 10:59 |
| Chipaca | zyga-suse_: it does? | 11:00 |
| zyga-suse_ | one sec | 11:00 |
| Chipaca | anyway, time for me to go run | 11:00 |
| * Chipaca waits | 11:00 | |
| zyga-suse_ | let me pull the discussion with systemd devs | 11:00 |
| mup | PR snapd#3810 opened: interfaces/hooks: PlugData and SlotData wrappers <Created by stolowski> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/3810> | 11:00 |
| zyga-suse_ | from my blog ... | 11:00 |
| zyga-suse_ | https://new.zygoon.pl/post/case-study-snapd-on-centos/ | 11:01 |
| zyga-suse_ | Chipaca: have a look there | 11:01 |
| zyga-suse_ | there are links to a PR that has since landed in systemd: https://github.com/systemd/systemd/pull/5131 | 11:02 |
| mup | PR systemd/systemd#5131: Environment generators <pid1> <Created by keszybz> <Merged by poettering> <https://github.com/systemd/systemd/pull/5131> | 11:02 |
| zyga-suse_ | and while looking there, enjoy 102 open PRs for systemd | 11:03 |
| zyga-suse_ | (we are not doing bad) | 11:03 |
| ogra_ | well | 11:03 |
| zyga-suse_ | though 806 contributors is x10 more than we have | 11:03 |
| ogra_ | from our downstram POV thats not acgtually much different | 11:03 |
| ogra_ | (environment.d vs profile.d ... ) | 11:04 |
| ogra_ | you still need to ship the snippet that assembles the variable | 11:04 |
| ogra_ | just in another place | 11:04 |
| Son_Goku | environment.d happens earlier than profile.d | 11:04 |
| ogra_ | sure sure | 11:04 |
| Son_Goku | though I hate putting things in either, really | 11:04 |
| ogra_ | just saying that iit doesnt matter much regarding the naming of the fil ;) | 11:05 |
| ogra_ | *fiile | 11:05 |
| ogra_ | sigh ... | 11:05 |
| Son_Goku | that's okay, one day you'll get it :) | 11:05 |
| ogra_ | my laptop keyboard slowly gives up | 11:05 |
| Son_Goku | zyga-suse_, we'll probably not have anywhere close to that number of contributors | 11:06 |
| zyga-suse_ | Son_Goku: as I said, x10 less | 11:06 |
| zyga-suse_ | Son_Goku: good to see you | 11:06 |
| zyga-suse_ | Son_Goku: did you see my reply on the forum there? | 11:06 |
| Son_Goku | that would require rejiggering the project in a way that currently isn't possible :( | 11:06 |
| Son_Goku | the forum makes me angry, so I haven't looked since I posted yesterday | 11:07 |
| * zyga-suse_ hugs Son_Goku again | 11:07 | |
| * Son_Goku sighs | 11:08 | |
| mcphail | kyrofa: thanks for the 11.0.4 nextcloud update. Is 12.x on the roadmap? (I'm not complaing, btw. I don't even know what version 12 brings. Just curious!) | 11:20 |
| zyga-suse_ | ogra_: what does it take to add /var/lib/snapd/apparmor/snap-confine.d to the core snap? | 11:33 |
| ogra_ | two lines ? | 11:33 |
| ogra_ | (assuming you want it writable, else one line) | 11:33 |
| zyga-suse_ | yes, two lines | 11:33 |
| zyga-suse_ | er | 11:33 |
| zyga-suse_ | yes writable | 11:33 |
| zyga-suse_ | where? | 11:33 |
| ogra_ | heh | 11:33 |
| zyga-suse_ | note that it's under /var/lib/snapd/apparmor which was writable before | 11:34 |
| zyga-suse_ | does it need any work? | 11:34 |
| zyga-suse_ | or do I just need to fix CI prep to mkdir that too | 11:34 |
| ogra_ | zyga-suse_, https://github.com/snapcore/core/blob/master/live-build/hooks/20-extra-files.chroot for the mkdir -p ... | 11:34 |
| zyga-suse_ | why there's no /var/lib/snapd/apparmor there/ | 11:35 |
| ogra_ | zyga-suse_, https://github.com/snapcore/core-build/blob/master/config/etc/system-image/writable-paths to make it writable | 11:35 |
| zyga-suse_ | -> /var/lib/snapd auto persistent transition none | 11:35 |
| zyga-suse_ | that's already present, so I think I'm good | 11:35 |
| ogra_ | well, you want a mkdir somewhere ... if snap-confine creates it on startup or package install that should be sufficient | 11:36 |
| ogra_ | else you need it in some of the build scripts like above | 11:36 |
| zyga-suse_ | ogra_: the snapd package has that directory | 11:36 |
| ogra_ | ok | 11:37 |
| zyga-suse_ | ogra_: it's made and packaged in the deb | 11:37 |
| mup | PR snapd#3809 closed: tests: copy files with less verbosity <Created by zyga> <Merged by mvo5> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/3809> | 11:39 |
| zyga-suse_ | mvo: thank you | 11:40 |
| zyga-suse_ | mvo: please help me out with one thing | 11:40 |
| zyga-suse_ | mvo: when I want to add a new directory under /var/lib/snapd/ (specifically /var/lib/snapd/apparmor/snap-confine.d) should I do anything more than just update packaging? | 11:40 |
| zyga-suse_ | mvo: tests are failing and I assume it is because of this | 11:41 |
| zyga-suse_ | mvo: I have a patch that looks like : | 11:41 |
| zyga-suse_ | https://paste.gnome.org/pkhbjpoju | 11:41 |
| zyga-suse_ | mvo: but I'm unsure if that will really hide the problem until release | 11:42 |
| ogra_ | hmm | 11:43 |
| mvo | zyga-suse_: lets get to the bottom of this, the dir in the package should be enough, let me try to reproduce via spread | 11:43 |
| ogra_ | you might have a problem if you need it on non-new systems ... | 11:44 |
| ogra_ | since /var/lib/snapd is "transition" not synced | 11:44 |
| zyga-suse_ | can you explain? | 11:44 |
| ogra_ | transition only copies the dirs on the first run ... | 11:45 |
| ogra_ | from core to writable | 11:45 |
| zyga-suse_ | "transition"? | 11:45 |
| zyga-suse_ | aha | 11:45 |
| zyga-suse_ | I see | 11:45 |
| ogra_ | so an upgraded ubuntu-image install wont simply add it | 11:45 |
| zyga-suse_ | well | 11:45 |
| zyga-suse_ | suggestions? | 11:45 |
| ogra_ | systemd job ... or switch to "synced" but i'm not 100% sure about the latter | 11:46 |
| ogra_ | (have to check the code) | 11:46 |
| willdeberry | when making a change to an interface, is building snapd cmd sufficient to pick up the changes? `go build -o /tmp/snapd github.com/snapcore/snapd/cmd/snapd` | 11:46 |
| zyga-suse_ | ugh | 11:46 |
| zyga-suse_ | willdeberry: yes, you need to re-start it though | 11:46 |
| zyga-suse_ | willcooke: which backends are you changing | 11:46 |
| zyga-suse_ | willdeberry: some things are not refreshed on startup | 11:47 |
| zyga-suse_ | willcooke: (sorry, bad tab completion) | 11:47 |
| ogra_ | zyga-suse_, for refrence http://manpages.ubuntu.com/manpages/xenial/man5/writable-paths.5.html | 11:47 |
| zyga-suse_ | ogra_: I just need an empty directory | 11:48 |
| zyga-suse_ | but it _must_ be there | 11:48 |
| zyga-suse_ | ogra_: and it may need to be there very early | 11:48 |
| zyga-suse_ | ogra_: before apparmor profiles are loaded | 11:48 |
| zyga-suse_ | and I think those are done before regular systemd units start | 11:49 |
| ogra_ | well, given apparmor itself relies on writable-paths, that should be a given | 11:49 |
| ogra_ | the issue is transition vs synced | 11:49 |
| ogra_ | WARNING: This is a one-off operation which requires that the | 11:49 |
| ogra_ | source directory on the writable partition not exist | 11:49 |
| ogra_ | initially: if this condition is satisfied, the directory will | 11:49 |
| ogra_ | then be created and the data moved on first boot. Although | 11:49 |
| ogra_ | the mountpoint will be writable, note that subsequent boots | 11:49 |
| ogra_ | will ignore any new files appearing or disappearing in the | 11:49 |
| ogra_ | original read-only rootfs location unless you perform a | 11:49 |
| ogra_ | factory reset. | 11:49 |
| ogra_ | (thats "transition" ) | 11:49 |
| ogra_ | note that subsequent boots | 11:50 |
| ogra_ | will ignore any new files appearing | 11:50 |
| ogra_ | that one specifically | 11:50 |
| * zyga-suse_ feels like not wanting to fight this fight on friday | 11:51 | |
| willdeberry | zyga-suse_: still fighting on adding bluez interface to classic OS | 11:51 |
| zyga-suse_ | but this is something he needs :/ | 11:51 |
| zyga-suse_ | willdeberry: which backends are you using in that interface? | 11:51 |
| ogra_ | we might need to switch /var/lib/snapd to be "synced" to make your dir appear ... i'm just not sure what happens with existing files in the target dir | 11:51 |
| ogra_ | alternatively a systemd unit that runs mkdir ... | 11:52 |
| zyga-suse_ | yeah, I don't like that really :/ | 11:52 |
| ogra_ | which is surely the uglier option | 11:52 |
| willdeberry | zyga-suse_: i am not sure i am following. I am just needing to expose bluez as an interface on classic so my snap can connect to bluez as a plug | 11:52 |
| zyga-suse_ | willdeberry: the bluez interface won't work as-is on classic | 11:53 |
| zyga-suse_ | willdeberry: can you pastebin your diff from master please | 11:53 |
| willdeberry | https://github.com/willdeberry/snapd/commit/11001ff172e7ddc96f6109a0c8ff9b3e63595ad4 | 11:53 |
| ogra_ | zyga-suse_, why wouldnt bluez work as-iis on classic ? the files, devices and services it needs to access should be the same | 11:55 |
| zyga-suse_ | ogra_: look at the diff | 11:55 |
| zyga-suse_ | willdeberry: the diff look ok actually | 11:55 |
| zyga-suse_ | willdeberry: can you please test both variants in each backend, ensuring that we don't get unexpected things? | 11:56 |
| zyga-suse_ | ogra_: the confinement is very specific | 11:56 |
| ogra_ | zyga-suse_, yeah, i meant more the interface itself ... not the conditions that make it available | 11:56 |
| zyga-suse_ | ogra_: down to the point where peer is confined with a specific label | 11:56 |
| zyga-suse_ | ogra_: and on classic that would be "unconfined" | 11:56 |
| ogra_ | ah | 11:56 |
| zyga-suse_ | ogra_: but the patch handles that so it looks correct | 11:56 |
| ogra_ | yeah | 11:57 |
| willdeberry | zyga-suse_: right now, the bluez tests pass. the only tests i haven't fixed yet are the basedefinition tests which run when building the deb | 11:57 |
| zyga-suse_ | willdeberry: they are in ../policy | 11:57 |
| zyga-suse_ | just run them | 11:57 |
| willdeberry | k | 11:57 |
| zyga-suse_ | (and fix) | 11:57 |
| ogra_ | zyga-suse_, btw, do we have any mechanism for interfaces to check that the backend they allow access to is actually working/existing ? | 11:58 |
| zyga-suse_ | ogra_: yes, implicitly | 11:58 |
| ogra_ | imho bluez should be hidden on classic server installs that dont have BT installed/enabled | 11:58 |
| zyga-suse_ | ogra_: interface methods specific to a backend are not used if the backend is not loaded | 11:58 |
| ogra_ | ok | 11:59 |
| willdeberry | backend meaning the bluez service in regards to classic right? | 11:59 |
| zyga-suse_ | ogra_: we don't do that distinction yet, I think it falls under hotplug a little, we should do it but it's fine to just have it, even if unsupplied | 11:59 |
| zyga-suse_ | willdeberry: no, backend meaning one of the security backends in snapd | 11:59 |
| willdeberry | gotcha | 11:59 |
| ogra_ | yeah, i meant the service backend actually | 11:59 |
| willdeberry | trying to map terminiology in my brain :) | 11:59 |
| * zyga-suse_ feels grumpy now | 12:02 | |
| === zyga-suse_ is now known as zyga-suse | ||
| zyga-suse | pstolowski: review on 3810 | 12:13 |
| pstolowski | zyga-suse, thanks | 12:15 |
| zyga-suse | pstolowski: if you want we can discuss the design here | 12:15 |
| zyga-suse | pstolowski: (standup may be hard with my data) | 12:15 |
| pstolowski | zyga-suse, I'll answer to comments on the PR first | 12:16 |
| zyga-suse | sure, thank you | 12:18 |
| zyga-suse | jdstrand: reviewed https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/3805 | 12:25 |
| mup | PR snapd#3805: interfaces/default,account-control: don't hardcode uid and gid. Use username and group instead <Created by jdstrand> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/3805> | 12:25 |
| zyga-suse | er. make that 3804 | 12:26 |
| willdeberry | zyga-suse: just an fyi, this is what is currently failing and I will address before reach back out https://pastebin.com/8BdemMUD | 12:29 |
| zyga-suse | jdstrand: reviewed both now, I think we have a major problem to solve before this can land | 12:29 |
| zyga-suse | willdeberry: yeah, just adjust those tests | 12:30 |
| pstolowski | zyga-suse, replied. take a look at one of the interfaces in #3120 to see how this is used (best to look at an interface that uses some attributes) | 12:31 |
| pstolowski | zyga-suse, i'll be avail in ~10 minutes if you want to discuss in HO | 12:32 |
| zyga-suse | pstolowski: not sure if my data plan will allow it :) | 12:32 |
| zyga-suse | pstolowski: replied | 12:32 |
| zyga-suse | I'll brew some fresh coffee and I'll return to my woes | 12:32 |
| * genii 's ears perk up for a moment at the mention of coffee | 12:34 | |
| Chipaca | ogra_: do we support this guy? http://beagleboard.org/black-wireless | 12:34 |
| zyga-suse | mvo: interesting https://paste.gnome.org/pu8sxtwdg | 12:35 |
| mup | PR snapd#3761 closed: Disable reexec on debian <Created by mwhudson> <Closed by zyga> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/3761> | 12:35 |
| ogra_ | Chipaca, well, the bbb image should boot and run but no idea about the changed network bits | 12:36 |
| zyga-suse | saw that when 2017-08-25 11:51:20 Error executing autopkgtest:ubuntu-17.10-amd64:tests/main/config-versions : failed | 12:36 |
| zyga-suse | mwhudson: ^ maybe interested in this | 12:36 |
| zyga-suse | runtime: address space conflict: map(0xc420100000) = 0x7f377c677000 | 12:36 |
| zyga-suse | fatal error: runtime: address space conflict | 12:36 |
| jdstrand | zyga-suse: thanks, I've commented in both 3804 and 3805 | 12:37 |
| zyga-suse | jdstrand: thank you | 12:37 |
| zyga-suse | jdstrand: offtopic, the /var/lib/snapd/apparmor/snap-confine.d is harder than anticiapted | 12:37 |
| zyga-suse | jdstrand: is there a way for apparmor-parser to ignore missing directories somehow? | 12:37 |
| jdstrand | zyga-suse: not without code changes. I doubt they would be upstreamable | 12:38 |
| ogra_ | Chipaca, i see we have /boot/uboot/linux-generic-bbb*/dtbs/am335x-boneblack-wireless.dtb .... so might need an adjusted own gadget | 12:39 |
| ogra_ | so yes, we can easily support it :) | 12:39 |
| jdstrand | zyga-suse: why is it difficult? I saw something about core. we create directories in core all the time... | 12:39 |
| Chipaca | ogra_: maybe i should get one and use it as my laptop at the sprint | 12:39 |
| zyga-suse | jdstrand: replied | 12:39 |
| zyga-suse | jdstrand: apparently not all the time | 12:39 |
| zyga-suse | jdstrand: I need to think but merely adding the directory to snapd.deb is not enough | 12:40 |
| zyga-suse | jdstrand: (replied https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/3805#discussion_r135248529 in case you want to see) | 12:40 |
| mup | PR snapd#3805: interfaces/default,account-control: don't hardcode uid and gid. Use username and group instead <Created by jdstrand> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/3805> | 12:40 |
| jdstrand | zyga-suse: going back to 3805> in a strict or devmode snap on core, the shadow gid matches (fine). on classic, /etc is one of the directories we bind mount from the host into the mount namespace. *not* /etc from core. therefore, the /etc/shadow in the mount namespace is /etc/shadow from the host | 12:42 |
| jdstrand | zyga-suse: are you saying something changed in this regard? | 12:42 |
| zyga-suse | jdstrand: ah, you are right | 12:42 |
| zyga-suse | jdstrand: but files from core snap will be owned by 42, not by 15 | 12:42 |
| zyga-suse | jdstrand: this is a separate issue | 12:43 |
| jdstrand | zyga-suse: so? | 12:43 |
| zyga-suse | jdstrand: but still true | 12:43 |
| jdstrand | the snap never sees them | 12:43 |
| zyga-suse | jdstrand: shadow is maybe not the best example, I bet there are users/groups that _can_ be seen that don't match host's /etc/ | 12:43 |
| jdstrand | the snap with account-control plugged will only modify the host. it can't get to the core snap | 12:43 |
| jdstrand | zyga-suse: no | 12:43 |
| jdstrand | zyga-suse: the have the same databases | 12:44 |
| jdstrand | they* | 12:44 |
| jdstrand | because we intentionally bind mount so it is that way | 12:44 |
| zyga-suse | jdstrand: my point is that the core snap has hardcoded values for each file | 12:44 |
| zyga-suse | jdstrand: right in the squashfs | 12:44 |
| jdstrand | zyga-suse: again, so? | 12:44 |
| jdstrand | we bind mount over them | 12:44 |
| zyga-suse | jdstrand: and any disagreements with the host will be confusing | 12:44 |
| jdstrand | it doesn't matter | 12:44 |
| jdstrand | this is precisely why we bind mount | 12:45 |
| zyga-suse | jdstrand: are all non-root files in the core hidden? | 12:45 |
| jdstrand | so they are the same. no disagreements | 12:45 |
| jdstrand | zyga-suse: of course not, but that is a different issue | 12:45 |
| zyga-suse | ok | 12:45 |
| jdstrand | zyga-suse: we aren't expsoing those files to the classic snap | 12:45 |
| zyga-suse | I agree about your reasoning on snap-seccomp now | 12:46 |
| jdstrand | certainly not for chown | 12:46 |
| jdstrand | since those files are readonly anyway | 12:46 |
| ikey | snaps are swiftly becoming a pain in my ass, just wanted to share that. | 12:47 |
| ikey | https://dev.solus-project.com/T4390 | 12:48 |
| * zyga-suse looks | 12:48 | |
| jdstrand | zyga-suse: this functionality isn't about weird esoteric permissions in the core snap vs classic. this is about 2 users and groups that are defined by the LSB to exist everywhere (root and daemon (daemon in a followup PR)) and shadow, which in practice exists everywhere (but we could adjust as needed (if NonCompliantDistro ; use othershadow) | 12:48 |
| zyga-suse | ikey: more classic snaps :/ | 12:48 |
| jdstrand | zyga-suse: after that it is all about snapd-managed users | 12:49 |
| ikey | "Yay" | 12:49 |
| zyga-suse | ikey: we need a way to pester snap makers and improve snapcraft | 12:49 |
| jdstrand | I'll mention that in 3804 | 12:49 |
| ikey | ya because id been down this ABI path with Ubuntu before | 12:49 |
| ikey | it's called Steam. | 12:49 |
| ikey | and frankly it aint worth it | 12:49 |
| jdstrand | actually, there is the calling user too | 12:49 |
| zyga-suse | jdstrand: calling user? | 12:50 |
| jdstrand | sudo foo, we may want to allow dropping to 1000 | 12:50 |
| jdstrand | I need to think about that one | 12:51 |
| jdstrand | may not allow that. again, I'll think about it | 12:51 |
| jdstrand | that might be a straight snap-confine (not snap-seccomp) change | 12:52 |
| * zyga-suse really breaks now and goes to make that coffee | 12:52 | |
| jdstrand | oh, we don't need Lookup and LookupGroup for that anyway | 12:52 |
| * genii hears something about coffee again, goes and gets one | 12:53 | |
| ogra_ | ikey, "snap run --shell atom" ... then grep LD_LIBRARY_PATH from the env ... i bet it doesnt prefix it correctly with the in-snap lib paths | 12:56 |
| zyga-suse | ogra_: that's not sufficient to test | 12:58 |
| zyga-suse | ogra_: the wrapper may set that | 12:59 |
| zyga-suse | ogra_: and --shell will not run it | 12:59 |
| ogra_ | zyga-suse, and thats fine | 12:59 |
| ogra_ | oh | 12:59 |
| ogra_ | i didnt know that | 12:59 |
| zyga-suse | ogra_: it's still a bug in the snap | 12:59 |
| ogra_ | yes | 12:59 |
| ogra_ | well | 12:59 |
| ogra_ | https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/libraries-not-found-in-classic-snaps/1033 | 12:59 |
| ogra_ | zyga-suse, i consider is a snapd/snap-confine bug TBH | 13:00 |
| zyga-suse | ogra_: I don't | 13:00 |
| zyga-suse | ogra_: I gave my reasoning why this cannot be set in snap-confine | 13:00 |
| ogra_ | the env should be properly prefixed without needing a wrapper | 13:00 |
| ogra_ | ikey, so close that bug and make them complain to the snap creator ;) | 13:01 |
| ogra_ | flexiondotorg, /snap/atom/current/bin/electron-launch is missing paths for $SNAP/lib and $SNAP/lib/$TRIPLET ... | 13:07 |
| ogra_ | (iirc atom was your snap) | 13:07 |
| ogra_ | ikey, ^^^ | 13:07 |
| ogra_ | (it only defines $SNAP/usr/lib ... ) | 13:07 |
| jdstrand | zyga-suse: fyi, https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/3804#discussion_r135254236 | 13:10 |
| mup | PR snapd#3804: cmd/snap-seccomp: support parsing 'u:' and 'g:' for username and groups <Created by jdstrand> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/3804> | 13:10 |
| Son_Goku | zyga-suse, I think at some point we need a way to deal with the lack of extrausers outside of Ubuntu | 13:16 |
| zyga-suse | Son_Goku: aha, is that breaking in the field somehow? | 13:16 |
| zyga-suse | I thought that was used in the core only | 13:16 |
| jdstrand | mvo: regarding 'restore' in the wayland spread test, that is what I initially tried (see the comment in the test: "# If this is in 'restore', it hangs the test") | 13:17 |
| Son_Goku | well, weird things are happening already because snaps like docker snap don't work right without bounding back and forth | 13:17 |
| ogra_ | flexiondotorg, https://github.com/snapcrafters/atom/pull/3 for you | 13:17 |
| mup | PR snapcrafters/atom#3: add $SNAP/lib, $SNAP/lib/$TRIPLET to library path <Created by ogra1> <https://github.com/snapcrafters/atom/pull/3> | 13:17 |
| zyga-suse | snapcraft should offer easy-to-use knobs for snaps using classic confinement *and* binary packages and don't expect to run host programs | 13:19 |
| zyga-suse | and should set LD_LIBRARY_PATH | 13:19 |
| zyga-suse | sergiusens: ^^ | 13:19 |
| jdstrand | mvo: I think this has to do with backgrounding the daemon with '&'. execute would never return and the test would have to timeout before getting to restore | 13:19 |
| sergiusens | zyga-suse: no, the correct path is to compile | 13:19 |
| zyga-suse | I know | 13:19 |
| zyga-suse | but people shoot themselves in the foot repeatedly | 13:19 |
| zyga-suse | so let's add some aribags | 13:20 |
| sergiusens | if we set LD_LIBARARY_PATH we taint the environment by default | 13:20 |
| zyga-suse | *airbags | 13:20 |
| zyga-suse | I wouldn't set it by default | 13:20 |
| zyga-suse | but I would add a knob for classic confinement snaps | 13:20 |
| zyga-suse | and warn people if they didn't make any decision about it | 13:20 |
| sergiusens | if you do classic, you need to compile your runtime, period | 13:20 |
| jdstrand | mvo: now, I can try to use something like start-stop-daemon, but I didn't go that route because it isn't going to exist outside of Debian derived distros | 13:20 |
| jdstrand | mvo: granted, the test itself is only running on Ubuntu, but figured for futureproofing, did it this way | 13:20 |
| zyga-suse | sergiusens: should store reject snaps that dont? | 13:21 |
| jdstrand | mvo: but, what I could do is also have it in restore | 13:21 |
| sergiusens | zyga-suse: we shouldn't block people that know what they are doing | 13:21 |
| zyga-suse | sergiusens: yes but apparently people don't know | 13:21 |
| jdstrand | mvo: ok, let me do that | 13:21 |
| jdstrand | mvo: thanks for the chat :) | 13:21 |
| sergiusens | setting LD_LIBRARY_PATH is valid for some snaps that would never shell out | 13:21 |
| sergiusens | look at all the trouble I went through to get snapcraft to be classic. It is a lot more work, there are beneifts, but all these apps need to use a compiled electron and not the default build | 13:22 |
| zyga-suse | jdstrand: can you please look at and +1 https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/3808 (you looked at the patches already) | 13:25 |
| mup | PR snapd#3808: apparmor,release: add better apparmor detection/mocking code <Created by zyga> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/3808> | 13:25 |
| ogra_ | sergiusens, how does compiled vs non-compiled have any effect here ? | 13:26 |
| ogra_ | sergiusens, $SNAP/lib is simply not in LD_LIBRARY_PATH so shipped libs are not found ... that has nothing to do with the electron binary at all | 13:26 |
| mvo | jdstrand: hey, sorry, was in the standup | 13:27 |
| mvo | jdstrand: but it seems like you solved everything :) | 13:27 |
| sergiusens | ogra_: RPATH would be set for the binary | 13:28 |
| sergiusens | the whole concept of classic confined snaps is that you fix the linker and what libraries can load (and disabling LD_LIBRARY_PATH) | 13:29 |
| ogra_ | is it ? ... it doesnt compllain about missing $SNAP/usr/lib | 13:29 |
| ogra_ | (about files from there) | 13:29 |
| sergiusens | huh? | 13:29 |
| ogra_ | only about the lib path that is missig from the launch wrapper | 13:30 |
| * sergiusens needs more words to make sense of that sentence | 13:30 | |
| ogra_ | sergiusens, https://github.com/snapcrafters/atom/pull/3 | 13:30 |
| mup | PR snapcrafters/atom#3: add $SNAP/lib, $SNAP/lib/$TRIPLET to library path <Created by ogra1> <https://github.com/snapcrafters/atom/pull/3> | 13:30 |
| sergiusens | when we introduced classic we said it was supposed to be used by people who compile from source; we never made a promise about anything else | 13:31 |
| jdstrand | zyga-suse: sure | 13:31 |
| ogra_ | sergiusens, starting the snap on a non-16.04 system simply fails because it doesnt find libs from $SNAP/lib | 13:31 |
| sergiusens | because atom (through electron) is not compiled in snapcraft | 13:31 |
| ogra_ | sergiusens, nothing complains about any libs from $SNAP/usr/lib (which is inn LD_LIBRARY_PATH already | 13:31 |
| sergiusens | yes there are workarounds | 13:31 |
| ogra_ | right | 13:31 |
| sergiusens | like LD_LIBRARY_PATH | 13:31 |
| ogra_ | so we should have a "classic-wrapper" part ... | 13:31 |
| sergiusens | but, if you shell out, you get those libs picked first intead of those on the host | 13:31 |
| ogra_ | that simply ships such a wrapper | 13:32 |
| ogra_ | yes, thats what you want | 13:32 |
| sergiusens | no, no wrappers for classic was what we discussed in the forum months ago | 13:32 |
| ogra_ | you never want to ever use any libs from the host | 13:32 |
| sergiusens | yes you do! | 13:32 |
| sergiusens | e.g.; asciinema | 13:32 |
| ogra_ | then hell breaks loose | 13:32 |
| ogra_ | you want to be able to **fall back* to them | 13:32 |
| sergiusens | e.g.; integrated shell in vscode (you want to use the python and pip on the system) | 13:33 |
| ogra_ | but if you ship any lib in your snap you want that one to be used and preferred | 13:33 |
| sergiusens | test runner tools | 13:33 |
| sergiusens | anything useful, you want from the host | 13:33 |
| ogra_ | yes, you want to carefully pick what you ship inside | 13:33 |
| sergiusens | for the application, yes, but not for what you invoke outside of the system | 13:33 |
| ogra_ | but still | 13:33 |
| sergiusens | the only sane thing here is rpath | 13:33 |
| sergiusens | everything else is broken | 13:33 |
| ogra_ | *if* you ship it it needs to be the preferred lib | 13:33 |
| sergiusens | and you are on your own should you choose to go down that path | 13:34 |
| ogra_ | else classic will never function anywhere but 16.04 | 13:34 |
| sergiusens | ogra_: compile and it works | 13:34 |
| * sergiusens is not discussing this anymore, seems to come back every two months | 13:34 | |
| ogra_ | well, wrap and it works too :P | 13:35 |
| sergiusens | half works | 13:35 |
| sergiusens | just wrappers and it doesn't work on trusty, try the asciinema in the store there and try to run something python and subsequently upload the video ;-) | 13:35 |
| * sergiusens reboots | 13:36 | |
| ogra_ | Chipaca, " ps eww of the toplevel process" ... is that Xorg ? gdm/lightdm ? systemd --user ? or bash ? | 13:43 |
| * ogra_ bets on the latter | 13:43 | |
| * zyga-suse breaks for an hour | 13:55 | |
| mvo | does anyone know if there is a way to skip an entire suite with gopkg.in/check.v1 ? | 14:05 |
| mvo | I mean, in SetupSuite(c *C) skip everything if e.g. a required binary is not available | 14:05 |
| pedronis | mvo: I think c.Skip in the SetUpSuite does that | 14:06 |
| pedronis | we even use it already I think | 14:06 |
| pedronis | mvo: see for example asserts/gpgkeypairmgr_test.g | 14:06 |
| pedronis | o | 14:07 |
| mvo | pedronis: aha, it will still run teardownsuite, this is what confused me | 14:07 |
| mvo | pedronis: thanks! | 14:07 |
| Chipaca | ogra_: not bash | 14:08 |
| Chipaca | ogra_: ps fx, look for the topmost thing in the session (here it's upstart) | 14:08 |
| Chipaca | ogra_: for jwm it was jwm itself | 14:08 |
| jdstrand | mvo: ok, comments addressed in https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/3759 | 14:12 |
| mup | PR snapd#3759: add spread test for wayland <Created by jdstrand> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/3759> | 14:12 |
| Chipaca | ogra_: any ideas on how to find a case where it doesn't work? | 14:13 |
| ogra_ | Chipaca, to exec ps you need a shell ... and even /dash reads profile | 14:13 |
| Chipaca | ogra_: yes, but i'm looking at the environment of a different process | 14:14 |
| ogra_ | Chipaca, dunno if there is some gtk test app that prints the env ... i guess that'd be a question for the desktop team ... | 14:18 |
| mvo | jdstrand: thanks! approved, but one more nitpick/question related to the source of test-snapd-wayland | 14:20 |
| ogra_ | flexiondotorg, seems the build badge markdown in README.md for atom points to https://build.snapcraft.io/user/snapcrafters/discord ... i guess you want to fix that to point to https://build.snapcraft.io/user/snapcrafters/atom | 14:27 |
| flexiondotorg | ogra_ ty Mr. popey is on it. | 14:28 |
| ogra_ | heh, ok | 14:28 |
| ogra_ | bah, it is odd that a change to README.md causes a rebuild of the snap ... | 14:31 |
| ogra_ | we should have something like .snapbuild-ignore so that build.snapcraft.io doesnt pick up such changes | 14:31 |
| Chipaca | ogra_: well... if I were to build stuff using snapcraft in a repo, I'd use chunks of my README in the snap's description | 14:34 |
| ogra_ | Chipaca, yeah, if you do that you want README changes to be used ... | 14:36 |
| ogra_ | https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/build-snapcraft-io-should-not-always-rebuild/1850/1 ... | 14:36 |
| ogra_ | but a .snapignore file could make that flexible | 14:36 |
| Chipaca | man, my xbill snap doesn't have a .desktop file | 14:38 |
| ogra_ | heh | 14:38 |
| Chipaca | i need to fix this post haste | 14:38 |
| ogra_ | complain at microsoft :P | 14:38 |
| Chipaca | worse, i don't know where i built it | 14:39 |
| ogra_ | ikey, if you feel like you can tell your users to "snap refresh atom --edge" to test the fix ;) (and to show off how quick snaps can be fixed ;) ) | 14:41 |
| * ogra_ hugs ikey ... the IRC-> bugtracker bot :) | 14:43 | |
| ikey | lol | 14:43 |
| kyrofa | mcphail, oh definitely, v12 is quite simply not a good experience in the snap right now, which is why we haven't updated stable. Take a look at https://github.com/nextcloud/nextcloud-snap/pull/334 | 14:46 |
| mup | PR nextcloud/nextcloud-snap#334: nextcloud: update to v12.0.1 <Created by pachulo> <https://github.com/nextcloud/nextcloud-snap/pull/334> | 14:46 |
| ogra_ | pfft ... icons ... who needs them anyway :P | 14:48 |
| jdstrand | mvo: https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/3759#discussion_r135275936 | 14:53 |
| mup | PR snapd#3759: add spread test for wayland <Created by jdstrand> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/3759> | 14:53 |
| mcphail | kyrofa: thanks! | 14:59 |
| mvo | zyga-suse: some ideas for 3808, sorry that its a bit long, happy to discuss more if you want | 15:01 |
| kyrofa | zyga-suse, this is for you: https://bugs.launchpad.net/snapd/+bug/1712930 | 15:07 |
| mup | Bug #1712930: snap-confine: mounts happen in the wrong order <snapd:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1712930> | 15:07 |
| ogra_ | just hold it upside down | 15:08 |
| mvo | pstolowski: the error in 3642 looks real, there is a unit test failure in transaction_test.go:168 - could you please have a look? | 15:12 |
| niemeyer | o/ | 15:12 |
| pstolowski | mvo, sure | 15:13 |
| niemeyer | Will get a quick lunch and be here shortly | 15:13 |
| * Pharaoh_Atem sighs | 15:13 | |
| Chipaca | xbill-xaw now has a desktop file, and it works and is light enough i can ask people to test stuff with it :-D | 15:13 |
| * Chipaca tries in his fedora with wayland, first | 15:14 | |
| * Chipaca braces for thrashing | 15:14 | |
| zyga-suse | re | 15:17 |
| zyga-suse | mvo: thank you, will look at 3808 | 15:17 |
| mvo | jdstrand: 3759 looks ready, I will merge when tests are green | 15:18 |
| zyga-suse | kyrofa: looking, interesting from the title alone | 15:18 |
| Chipaca | ogra_: hah! dang, i just wasted some time. the rest of the world is _already_ doing this stuff from profile.d | 15:19 |
| === cachio is now known as cachio_lunch | ||
| jdstrand | mvo: thanks! :) | 15:21 |
| zyga-suse | mvo: nice, I'll iterate after dinner | 15:22 |
| zyga-suse | kyrofa: hey, have you tried 2.27? | 15:22 |
| zyga-suse | kyrofa: I'm pretty sure we handle / which isn't MS_SHARED up front | 15:22 |
| zyga-suse | kyrofa: reading the rest of the analysis now | 15:23 |
| kyrofa | zyga-suse, no, just latest stable. Happy to try though-- which channel? | 15:23 |
| zyga-suse | kyrofa: not sure if channels work now | 15:23 |
| zyga-suse | kyrofa: our release-breaks-edge process | 15:23 |
| zyga-suse | kyrofa: maybe proposed 2.27.4 would be nice | 15:24 |
| zyga-suse | but maybe not | 15:24 |
| zyga-suse | let me finish reading stgraber's analysis | 15:24 |
| zyga-suse | hmm, forum logged me out | 15:25 |
| zyga-suse | and ff doesn't know my password, what? | 15:25 |
| zyga-suse | ah | 15:25 |
| zyga-suse | this is not forum.snapcraft.io | 15:25 |
| ogra_ | Chipaca, well, debian and ubuntu arent unless that changed recently | 15:28 |
| Chipaca | ogra_: correct | 15:29 |
| Chipaca | ogra_: but, it works | 15:29 |
| ogra_ | well, good then :) | 15:29 |
| * ogra_ is afk for a bit | 15:29 | |
| mup | PR snapd#3372 opened: tests: add basic lxd test <Created by mvo5> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/3372> | 15:30 |
| * zyga-suse was a the sauna | 15:30 | |
| zyga-suse | I should have been doing that all this week | 15:30 |
| zyga-suse | sergiusens_: saunas are fun | 15:30 |
| mvo | fgimenez: do you happen to know if the "nightly" suite of snapd is run currently? if so, is that part of spread-cron? | 15:30 |
| fgimenez | mvo: yes, according to https://travis-ci.org/snapcore/spread-cron/branches it was executed last night (the branch is called "snapd-nightly-suite") | 15:34 |
| fgimenez | mvo: this is the job executed currently https://github.com/snapcore/spread-cron/blob/snapd-nightly-suite/run-checks | 15:34 |
| mvo | fgimenez: great, thank you! | 15:35 |
| * Chipaca ~> walk | 15:35 | |
| fgimenez | mvo: np :) i see that the unity test is still around, maybe better removing it completely and execute the whole nightly suite, that way it would be easier to add new tests there | 15:36 |
| Chipaca | jdstrand: we don't yet support running ia32 binaries on amd64, right? | 15:36 |
| mvo | pedronis: is the night extra-snap-assertions your baby? it looks its unhappy currently https://travis-ci.org/snapcore/spread-cron/builds/268207725#L715 | 15:36 |
| mvo | fgimenez: +1 for removing that | 15:36 |
| pedronis | mvo: I don't even know what it is | 15:36 |
| mvo | fgimenez: I'm mostly interessted in this because of lxd, docker which are a bit heavy for the normal runs | 15:37 |
| mvo | pedronis: no worries, I have a look | 15:37 |
| zyga-suse | Chipaca: we do | 15:37 |
| Chipaca | ah! good :-D | 15:37 |
| Chipaca | now yes, /me -> walk | 15:37 |
| pedronis | mvo: doesn't mean I wasn't involved but I don't remember | 15:37 |
| fgimenez | mvo: pedronis i added it, it checks for the feature of using extra-snaps with assertions to ubuntu-image | 15:38 |
| mvo | pedronis: your name does not come up in git blame, so I guess your memory is fine | 15:39 |
| === JoshStrobl|AFK is now known as JoshStrobl | ||
| pedronis | ConfigManager is weird, is not actually a StateManager :/ | 15:42 |
| zyga-suse | I think it's only that because it handled hooks | 15:50 |
| jdstrand | roadmr: I noticed r922 is live. thanks! | 15:58 |
| jdstrand | stgraber: fyi, feel free to use reload-command | 15:59 |
| roadmr | jdstrand: oh yay! true, there was a deploy this morning | 15:59 |
| === cachio_lunch is now known as cachio | ||
| stgraber | jdstrand: yay! | 16:00 |
| sergiusens | zyga-suse: they are indeed | 16:02 |
| zyga-suse | sergiusens: your mainline kernel will soon-ish work | 16:03 |
| jdstrand | Chipaca: ia32 on amd64, do you mean i386 on amd64/x86 on x86_64? if so, snapd supports this. snapcraft (I don't think yet) makes that easy | 16:14 |
| zyga-suse | kyrofa: interesting, I'll need to ponder on this some more | 16:14 |
| zyga-suse | jdstrand: interesting bug there btw, | 16:14 |
| * jdstrand wanted to make sure you weren't talking about x32 | 16:14 | |
| jdstrand | I phrased the snapcraft bit weird. I don't think snapcraft helps at all there | 16:15 |
| mup | PR snapd#3793 closed: cmd: "make hack" now also installs snap-update-ns <Created by chipaca> <Merged by zyga> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/3793> | 16:15 |
| jdstrand | but I did this work a long time ago (now) for popey's use case of wine on amd64 being able to run 32 bit binaries | 16:15 |
| niemeyer | Hellos | 16:16 |
| jdstrand | and all that carried forward into recent snap-seccomp, etc | 16:16 |
| jdstrand | hey niemeyer :) | 16:16 |
| niemeyer | How're things going today? Anything urgent to look after, or can I jump into the review board and reviews? | 16:16 |
| jdstrand | niemeyer: I've not seen anything scary in backscroll, but I'll defer to others | 16:23 |
| jdstrand | Chipaca: sudo snap install test-seccomp-compat --edge | 16:24 |
| jdstrand | Chipaca: test-seccomp-compat.true32 | 16:24 |
| jdstrand | Chipaca: test-seccomp-compat.true64 | 16:24 |
| jdstrand | Chipaca: oh, I forgot, cmd/snap-confine/spread-tests/main/test-seccomp-compat/task.yaml :) | 16:25 |
| zyga-suse | niemeyer: hey | 16:25 |
| zyga-suse | niemeyer: how are you doing? | 16:25 |
| zyga-suse | niemeyer: I think we're good | 16:25 |
| zyga-suse | jdstrand: nice snap!!! | 16:25 |
| niemeyer | jdstrand, zyga-suse: Sweet | 16:26 |
| jdstrand | zyga-suse: thanks :) | 16:26 |
| jdstrand | zyga-suse: the bug you mentioned earlier-- you meant snapcraft making it easy for compat archs? | 16:26 |
| zyga-suse | no, I mean the bug where snap-confine and / and MS_RSHARED and containers blow up | 16:26 |
| zyga-suse | https://bugs.launchpad.net/snapd/+bug/1712930 | 16:26 |
| mup | Bug #1712930: snap-confine: mounts happen in the wrong order <snapd:In Progress by zyga> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1712930> | 16:27 |
| zyga-suse | real stuff is on https://discuss.linuxcontainers.org/t/snapd-cant-remove-old-revisions-when-running-inside-lxd/452/3 | 16:27 |
| jdstrand | ah, I didn't see that one yet | 16:27 |
| * zyga-suse loves this moment of the day | 16:27 | |
| zyga-suse | sun is visible because it is below clouds | 16:27 |
| zyga-suse | and shines through moving trees | 16:27 |
| jdstrand | zyga-suse: sounds nice :) | 16:28 |
| jdstrand | we're looking forward to a bunch of thunderstorms this evening | 16:29 |
| zyga-suse | https://twitter.com/zygoon/status/901119350870036481 | 16:29 |
| mup | PR snapd#3811 opened: interfaces/i2c: adjust sysfs rule for alternate paths <Created by jdstrand> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/3811> | 16:49 |
| jdstrand | zyga-suse: pretty :) | 16:52 |
| mup | PR snapcraft#1507 opened: many: simplify plugin loading <Created by kyrofa> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapcraft/pull/1507> | 17:01 |
| niemeyer | mvo: snapd#3260 seems good to go for next week | 17:05 |
| mup | PR snapd#3260: cmd/snap: implement userd command as replacement for snapd-xdg-open <Created by morphis> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/3260> | 17:05 |
| willdeberry | finally got it showing! :) `:bluez` | 17:12 |
| willdeberry | thanks zyga-suse | 17:12 |
| Pharaoh_Atem | zyga-suse: I wish it was good day here | 17:15 |
| Pharaoh_Atem | I'm stuck inside an office working on backporting crap to old stuff :( | 17:15 |
| Pharaoh_Atem | I can't even see the sun from where I am :( | 17:15 |
| jdstrand | willdeberry: nice! | 17:37 |
| Chipaca | niemeyer: how can I edit somebody else's post in the forum? | 17:39 |
| Chipaca | wanting to indent a chunk of stuff so it'll be formatted properly | 17:40 |
| * Chipaca hugs Pharaoh_Atem | 17:43 | |
| Chipaca | Pharaoh_Atem: not long to go now | 17:43 |
| * Chipaca wonders why he's doing tech support in the forum | 17:45 | |
| * Chipaca realises the distance between "snapd doesn't work" and "my system doesn't work" is invisible to users \o/ | 17:46 | |
| Pharaoh_Atem | FINALLY | 17:50 |
| Pharaoh_Atem | we're going to have the xdg-open replacement? | 17:50 |
| willdeberry | jdstrand: :) . I will be cleaning up and then sending over a PR sometime today for it | 17:51 |
| willdeberry | i did have to resort to build the deb and installing. doesn't seem like building snapd was enough | 17:51 |
| niemeyer | Chipaca: Hm | 17:53 |
| niemeyer | Chipaca: Not sure if you can while being a moderator | 17:53 |
| Chipaca | eh, never mind | 17:54 |
| niemeyer | Chipaca: ? | 17:54 |
| Chipaca | niemeyer: if it was easy and obvious, sure, but it's not important | 17:54 |
| niemeyer | If moderators can, then it's easy and obvious to give you that flag | 17:55 |
| Chipaca | ah! | 17:55 |
| Chipaca | niemeyer: i misread your "not sure if you can while being a moderator" as "afaik being a moderator you can't" | 17:55 |
| niemeyer | Ah, sorry.. it was more like "AFAIK I have no idea" | 17:56 |
| niemeyer | Chipaca: See if you can now | 17:57 |
| Chipaca | I do have a pencil now | 17:57 |
| niemeyer | Bingo | 17:57 |
| niemeyer | Chipaca: Be careful when tagging now.. you won't be constrained to our standard targs | 17:57 |
| niemeyer | targs is great | 17:57 |
| niemeyer | Wow.. it's even nicer than I expected.. "Targ or TARG may refer to: The Anti-Gravity Room" | 17:58 |
| Chipaca | mbuahaha | 17:59 |
| * Chipaca tags all the things | 17:59 | |
| Chipaca | niemeyer: if you want you can bump me down again :-) | 17:59 |
| jdstrand | willdeberry: re building the deb-- that's definitely going to be more robust. glad that worked for you | 17:59 |
| niemeyer | Chipaca: Will keep you up.. hopefully you can actually help on the moderation :) | 18:00 |
| Chipaca | niemeyer: with great power come great tee shirts, right? | 18:00 |
| niemeyer | (unlike zyga, which after a few days had half a dozen random tags, posts painted yellow, etc /o\) | 18:00 |
| niemeyer | :P | 18:00 |
| niemeyer | jdstrand: Do you have a moment to quickly cover the desktop interface PR? | 18:02 |
| jdstrand | niemeyer: yeah | 18:03 |
| niemeyer | jdstrand: Ok.. so the thing I'm trying to figure after the extensive conversation we had there is whether we're still solving a problem worth solving for the price of the added complexity | 18:03 |
| niemeyer | jdstrand: I miss some technical pieces, so would like to talk live about it.. can we have a quick hangout? | 18:04 |
| jdstrand | ok | 18:04 |
| jdstrand | niemeyer: where? | 18:06 |
| Pharaoh_Atem | mvo: it feels weird to see mvo@ubuntu.com in the fedora changelogs: https://koji.fedoraproject.org/koji/buildinfo?buildID=956399 :D | 18:06 |
| niemeyer | jdstrand: hangouts.google.com/hangouts/_/canonical.com/desktop-interface?authuser=0 | 18:06 |
| Pharaoh_Atem | mvo: but it seems people appreciate the fuller changelogs, so we'll keep rolling with it | 18:07 |
| jdstrand | sigh, the camera stopped | 18:07 |
| jdstrand | gimma a sec | 18:07 |
| Dee__ | Hey all! Dee here, New to using Snaps | 19:03 |
| kyrofa | Hey Dee__, welcome | 19:10 |
| niemeyer | Bye Dee :) | 19:22 |
| genii | heh | 19:23 |
| kyrofa | I guess I wasn't the person to whom Dee wanted to talk | 19:30 |
| mvo | Pharaoh_Atem: heh, I can offer more addresses if you want :) | 20:18 |
| mvo | niemeyer: re 3260> yeah, I'm quite happy with it now after the last refactor and added tests | 20:19 |
| mvo | Pharaoh_Atem: I will also fix your point in 3260 | 20:20 |
| mvo | Pharaoh_Atem: I reverted the snapd.spec file changes as you requested, will check tomorrow if tests are still happy. thanks for the review! | 20:28 |
| willdeberry | one last thing i am still dealing with is the randomness of error: `/snap/bjarkan/52/usr/bin/python3: 1: /snap/bjarkan/52/usr/bin/python3: Syntax error: word unexpected (expecting ")")` | 21:13 |
| willdeberry | i can rebuild on snapcraft.io and the next build will not have any issues | 21:13 |
| willdeberry | not sure what is causing this | 21:13 |
| willdeberry | makes me wonder if there is a bug in the python plugin for building | 21:14 |
| kyrofa | Hey niemeyer, can we get your thoughts on this? https://bugs.launchpad.net/snapcraft/+bug/1712061 | 21:20 |
| mup | Bug #1712061: snapcraft restricts version field too much <Snapcraft:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1712061> | 21:20 |
| mup | PR snapcraft#1508 opened: schema: version should have a max length of 32 <Created by kyrofa> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapcraft/pull/1508> | 21:31 |
| niemeyer | kyrofa: Sure, will look in a moment | 21:49 |
| mup | PR snapcraft#1507 closed: many: simplify plugin loading <Created by kyrofa> <Merged by sergiusens> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapcraft/pull/1507> | 22:05 |
| mup | PR snapcraft#1509 opened: project_loader: process stage package grammar <Created by kyrofa> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapcraft/pull/1509> | 23:35 |
| niemeyer | kyrofa: Done | 23:47 |
| kyrofa | Thanks niemeyer. Why are you still here?! | 23:48 |
| niemeyer | kyrofa: My day started a bit late today.. kid was a bit under the weather last night and I went to sleep when I supposed to be waking up.. so it all shifted forward a bit | 23:49 |
| kyrofa | Ah, poor kid. We just finished a round of the stomach flu, I know how you feel | 23:49 |
| niemeyer | Yeah.. wonders of being in a school with other children | 23:50 |
| niemeyer | I guess that's how they improve their immune system | 23:50 |
| niemeyer | (and ours :P)_ | 23:50 |
| kyrofa | No kidding | 23:55 |
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