[02:54] <jlacroix> I am testing Artful in a VM and I have a few questions. First, I read several places that there will be a vanilla GNOME session offered that doesn't have the new ubuntu tweaks and addons. I cannot find this. Is this implemented yet?
[02:55] <lotuspsychje> jlacroix: what do you mean with tweaks & addons?
[02:56] <jlacroix> Basically, what I read is that 17.04 will have a vanilla GNOME session offered at the GDM screen, that for example, won't have the dock
[02:56] <jlacroix> I only see two options at the GDM screen, Ubuntu on Xorg and Ubuntu on Wayland
[02:56] <lotuspsychje> jlacroix: where did you read that?
[02:57] <lotuspsychje> jlacroix: its 17.10 by the way :p
[02:57] <jlacroix> Sorry I'm so accustomed to typing 17.04
[02:58] <jlacroix> Linux Unplugged mentioned this, as did Phoronix and a few others. It was also mentioned on an Ubuntu technical doc
[02:58] <lotuspsychje> jlacroix: last time i updated, didnt see such vanilla session myself
[02:58] <jlacroix> I installed it in a VM today and installed all updates and I didn't see the option either
[03:01] <lotuspsychje> jlacroix: cant find that news article you say
[03:01] <lotuspsychje> jlacroix: if you have an url perhaps?
[03:03] <jlacroix> One sec, looking
[03:12] <jlacroix> I can't find the link right now. But I think you just have to install the gnome-session package. I'm trying this now
[03:13] <jlacroix> Yup, that was it. Install gnome-session and the vanilla gnome session is an option
[03:13] <lotuspsychje> !info gnome-session
[03:14] <lotuspsychje> jlacroix: handy
[03:15] <lotuspsychje> !yay | jlacroix 
[03:15] <jlacroix> I am curious how Ubuntu will keep the dotfiles between the two sessions separated
[03:15] <lotuspsychje> jlacroix: you dont like the new dock?
[03:17] <jlacroix> I prefer to have no dock. But the thing is, you can turn the dock off without having to use the gnome-session package. However, I make tutorial videos, write blog articles, etc. So when this comes out I want to make sure I completely understand how it's designed so I give people the right information
[03:17] <lotuspsychje> ah ih see
[03:18] <lotuspsychje> jlacroix: there will be settings for the dock to disable or autohide at final
[03:18] <lotuspsychje> jlacroix: for now i tweaked it with dconf-editor
[03:18] <jlacroix> That's good to know, I was just about to ask that
[03:18] <jlacroix> Honestly, I just keep one application per workspace and I switch between them with CTRL+ALT+Up (or down)
[03:18] <jlacroix> I find that to be a lot easier to manage than a dock
[03:19] <lotuspsychje> jlacroix: can you check in screen settings right now, if nothings new?
[03:19] <lotuspsychje> jlacroix: i will love the fact that every user can choose how he/she likes
[03:20] <jlacroix> Yes, it's there (the autohide option)
[03:20] <lotuspsychje> nice
[03:20] <jlacroix> I am curious about the technical details about how the two sessions were designed. I also utilize Ansible to configure my desktop for me so I will probably need to dive into this so I understand it better before release
[03:21] <lotuspsychje> yeah interesting
[03:21] <lotuspsychje> jlacroix: im also curious how wayland will perform
[03:21] <jlacroix> I read that Canonical has fixed the bluetooth issues, which always bugged me in the past
[03:22] <jlacroix> On Fedora, Wayland was far superior in speed than Xorg
[03:22] <lotuspsychje> yeah alot of BT issues in the past for sure
[03:22] <jlacroix> I tested it out there for a short while
[03:22] <jlacroix> I wonder if the bluetooth fixes are patched into GNOME, or if they added an additional package that contains the fixes?
[03:23] <lotuspsychje> jlacroix: i think that might be in kernel fixes?
[03:23] <jlacroix> I doubt it
[03:24] <jlacroix> The issues seemed to be independent of the kernel, It seemed to be annoying issues like the GUI not selecting the bluetooth speaker by default, etc
[03:24] <jlacroix> !info gnome-bluetooth
[03:25] <jlacroix> I have a feeling that might be it
[03:25] <lotuspsychje> ah
[03:25] <lotuspsychje> that sounds logical
[03:26] <jlacroix> I'm very excited about this release. I am using it in a VM right now. I can't wait to upgrade
[03:26] <lotuspsychje> i have a testbox :p
[03:26] <lotuspsychje> http://imgur.com/a/q7Yem
[03:27] <jlacroix> Nice, what theme are you using?
[03:28] <lotuspsychje> dark
[03:28] <lotuspsychje> default installed
[03:28] <lotuspsychje> dragged dock to bottom with size with dconf
[03:29] <jlacroix> I'm using VimixDark theme, but sometimes Firefox progress bars don't show up right
[03:35] <jlacroix> Have you played steam games on 17.10 yet?
[03:37] <lotuspsychje> jlacroix: no didnt test, just tested an online shooter from repos
[11:30] <StrangeNoises> hm. some update in 17.10 today has partially broken hidpi support that was working yesterday. god knows which package...
[11:32] <StrangeNoises> mouse pointers, fonts in gnome top bar & indicators, and in non-gnome gtk and qt apps (eg: hexchat, nextcloud client) all back to scaling factor 1. 
[11:37] <ducasse> check the end of /var/log/apt/history.log to see which packages was updated last, might help you narrow it down
[11:40] <ducasse> StrangeNoises: ^^
[11:40] <StrangeNoises> bunch of xserver packages. also gnome-session and ubuntu-session packages. i mention the latter because it seems that org.gnome.desktop.interface scaling-factor now seems to be inoperable (changes nothing)
[11:40] <StrangeNoises> i wasn't ignoring you, but i had the window covered up for a bit while i was looking at gsettings
[11:40] <StrangeNoises> :-)
[11:42] <StrangeNoises> there's a com.ubuntu.user-interface scale-factor but its current value is... weird. "@a{si} {}" so i don't know what to try with that. don't know if corruption or meaningful
[11:44] <ducasse> thought you might have switched channels :) i don't use gnome at all nor do i use hidpi, so i can't help much...
[11:44] <StrangeNoises> i'd report a bug if could identify the package at fault
[11:45] <StrangeNoises> this machine's nvidia, can only use xorg. I also have a machine running it with wayland, so i guess it'll be informative to see if the same problem occurs there
[11:46] <ducasse> the package is not really that important if you can clearly describe the problem, the devs will just reassign it to the correct package.
[11:47] <ducasse> ...as they generally have a good idea what's changed :)
[11:48] <StrangeNoises> right, let's break the other machine and see if it affects wayland :-)
[11:49] <ducasse> :)
[11:50] <StrangeNoises> oh that's interesting, it's not getting the xserver updates. xorg is installed even if i'm not using it
[11:51] <ducasse> is it using the same mirror?
[11:52] <StrangeNoises> i believe so. it's got the same versions already of those packages. let's - before the upgrade - try logging in under xorg...
[11:52] <StrangeNoises> no error
[11:52] <StrangeNoises> ok, let's do the upgrade
[11:54] <StrangeNoises> which if it happens then, points the finger at one of the gnome-session / gnome-settings / ubuntu-session packages
[11:55] <StrangeNoises> yep, there we go
[11:56] <StrangeNoises> and in wayland too. right.
[11:57] <ducasse> hmmm... ok. are the old versions still in the package cache?
[11:58] <ducasse> if they're there or on the mirror, try downgrading one by one?
[11:59] <StrangeNoises> i suspect /usr/share/session-migration/scripts/unity-gnome-shell-migration.18.08.py  in ubuntu-session. although the date in the name implies it's older. anyway it resets a bunch of scaling factor stuff. nothing that looks desperately wrong but worth a look
[12:03] <StrangeNoises> let's report it to there anyway. its maintainers ought to know where better to send it as you say
[12:04] <ducasse> try that, yes.
[12:05] <ducasse> you might want to keep an eye on this channel to see if others report the same problem if this update was just released.
[12:46] <StrangeNoises> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-session/+bug/1713323 fwiw